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How Can I be a Better Podcast Guest?: Coaching with Sarah Atlee, Improvisational Quilter
Episode 27 • 24th January 2023 • Ongoing Mastery: Presenting & Speaking • Kirsten Rourke
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In this week's episode of Ongoing Mastery: Presenting & Speaking, Kirsten gives Sarah Atlee tips for a smoother experience as a podcast guest. Once your lighting is all set and you’re making eye contact with the camera, think about what might go wrong and be prepared with alternatives, just in case. They also discover that they’re both fans of online role-playing games!

Key take-aways:

  • Have a genuine conversation, don’t just deliver your planned talking points
  • Know how your material intersects with the podcast’s audience
  • Consider having a QR code for your website, etc, rather than sharing a long web address

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Read a transcript of this episode: https://share.descript.com/view/cxTaYGFXw7v

For the video version of this episode: https://youtu.be/qNx9i8SctHU

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Need a speaking coach or looking for speaking courses? Here's our affiliate link for Kirsten's speaking coach, Tim David: https://bit.ly/3eCUFPy


Transcripts

Kirsten:

Hello, everybody.

Welcome to Ongoing Mastery:

Presenting & Speaking, the podcast, and the

Welcome to Ongoing Mastery:

coaching session, and the conversation.

Welcome to Ongoing Mastery:

And today, we're with our friend Sarah, Sarah Atlee, who is a quilter and an

Welcome to Ongoing Mastery:

artist, and an all around amazing person.

Welcome to Ongoing Mastery:

And we're gonna do a mini-coaching session, and kind of brainstorm

Welcome to Ongoing Mastery:

some things, and talk about her art.

Welcome to Ongoing Mastery:

How are you today?

Sarah:

Oh, I am thrilled to be here, and I am just excited about what I'm

Sarah:

gonna learn, and what anything that I might be able to share with your

Sarah:

listeners, and I'm just really thrilled.

Sarah:

Thank you.

Kirsten:

Fantastic.

Kirsten:

So let's talk about what, you wanna go on podcasts, and you

Kirsten:

wanna kind of share your work.

Kirsten:

What's your experience been?

Kirsten:

Have you done it before?

Kirsten:

Have you not?

Kirsten:

What has been your previous history with that?

Sarah:

Yeah, I have done several podcasts.

Sarah:

I've found it a really enjoyable experience, and I would

Sarah:

like to do that a lot more.

Sarah:

Some of them have involved video, some have been audio only, and

Sarah:

really, they're, they've just kind of been all over the map.

Sarah:

For the most part, people have found me who have podcasts and invited me to

Sarah:

be on, which is great, but I am also trying to be proactive about offering

Sarah:

myself to podcasters and saying, "Hey, I might be a good fit for your

Sarah:

audience and would you like to do this?"

Sarah:

So, I've had a little bit of experience so far.

Kirsten:

Great.

Kirsten:

So, what we were gonna talk about today was kind of the way to best

Kirsten:

position yourself to be a podcast guest.

Kirsten:

And I'm just gonna give you, from my experience of having done this podcast

Kirsten:

and a previous one, and also working with friends who do it, as to what

Kirsten:

strategically I think would be great.

Kirsten:

So, the first thing is, whose audiences do you wanna get in front of?

Sarah:

You're asking me this?

Kirsten:

Yeah, so I'm asking you that.

Kirsten:

So that's my question.

Sarah:

Okay.

Sarah:

That's, yeah, that's a great question.

Sarah:

And my answer is gonna be pretty broad because, like you said, I'm an artist, I'm

Sarah:

a quilter, quilting is my medium, and that is a fairly universal human experience.

Kirsten:

Yes

Sarah:

So, I could be talking to anybody from, like, healers,

Sarah:

entrepreneurs, other fellow artists.

Sarah:

I don't have one specific niche that I'm shooting for, unless you wanna

Sarah:

count, like, human beings as a niche.

Kirsten:

Okay.

Kirsten:

So then, let's go for the differentiator that you have over other people

Kirsten:

that I know that have done quilting.

Sarah:

Okay

Kirsten:

Because when I spoke with you about your art, you actually described it

Kirsten:

to me in a way that, the people I know who do quilting, they're sort of assembling a

Kirsten:

collage, but you're going way beyond that.

Kirsten:

Can you tell people about what your process is and

Kirsten:

what the goals are behind it?

Sarah:

Yeah, absolutely.

Sarah:

So, I'm an improvisational quilter, and I was doing this before I

Sarah:

learned that there was a name for it.

Sarah:

And it was really funny when I found out, like, "Oh,

Sarah:

improvisational quilting is a thing."

Sarah:

It's sort of like, for you cat people out there, if you have a box and you

Sarah:

put it on the floor and, like, the cat just has to get in it, they're

Sarah:

compelled because, like, the box is so cozy and it fits just right.

Sarah:

So, improv quilting is not something that I invented.

Sarah:

It's not brand new.

Sarah:

Quilting has existed in human society for millennia, but it's a little

Sarah:

bit different from what we typically see in American quilting culture.

Sarah:

And just to give you an example, what you and I might think of as a quote unquote,

Sarah:

"traditional quilt" is likely to be something that is made of blocks that are

Sarah:

all alike, and then put together in a grid formation that is basically symmetrical.

Sarah:

And there might be some play with the different colors of the

Sarah:

fabrics and everything, but it's probably planned out ahead of time.

Sarah:

Now what I do, is I take a collection of fabrics probably in a bunch of colors

Sarah:

that I like how they go together, and I don't know what the quilt is gonna

Sarah:

look like or how big it's gonna be, but I just sort of start in the middle with

Sarah:

cutting and sewing pieces together, and the composition evolves as I go along.

Kirsten:

So, when you're making a quilt for someone, what is it that

Kirsten:

informs you as an artist about, what is it that you take from your

Kirsten:

client and put into the quilt?

Sarah:

Well, what I like to tell people is quilts are a messenger.

Sarah:

They're a vehicle for human emotion, and they're storytellers.

Sarah:

So, everybody has a story to tell, and this might be a story of a personal

Sarah:

life experience that you have had, or it might be a story about how you

Sarah:

love somebody, a friend or a family member, and you wanna wish them

Sarah:

well, or mark a big life milestone like birth, marriage, graduation,

Sarah:

first new home, things like that.

Sarah:

And you have a story to tell, and I am gonna help you be the storyteller.

Sarah:

So, I have a conversation

Kirsten:

Okay

Sarah:

With clients about what is the quilt for?

Sarah:

How is this meaningful for you?

Sarah:

Is it gonna be for another person?

Sarah:

Describe your relationship with that person.

Sarah:

What do you love about them?

Sarah:

What do you think is most interesting about their life?

Sarah:

And then, I kind of start with colors and textures and go from there.

Kirsten:

Okay, so you just said, I actually had it, and I should have

Kirsten:

written it down the second you said it, which is right before you said,

Kirsten:

"Who is this, what is this quilt for?"

Kirsten:

which is the storytelling, so you're

Sarah:

That's right.

Kirsten:

You're storytelling using a physical medium.

Sarah:

That's right.

Sarah:

Exactly.

Kirsten:

So, what I would do, if I were in your shoes, and certainly as a podcast

Kirsten:

host, what I would welcome, is if, say you decided you wanted to be on my podcast,

Kirsten:

and someone else's podcast, and someone else's, and you looked at our audiences

Kirsten:

and what our themes are and so on, and said, "Oh, I think that would be great."

Kirsten:

If you reached out to me and said, "Here's your theme.

Kirsten:

Here's how I tie to it.

Kirsten:

Here is how I'm unique, and here is one value your audience can get

Kirsten:

from me," bang, bang, bang, like, a bulleted list, that would right off

Kirsten:

the bat make my life so much easier.

Sarah:

Okay.

Sarah:

I love that.

Sarah:

That is so concise, and descriptive, and to the point.

Sarah:

I appreciate that very much.

Kirsten:

And, have you had people on webinars or, or done podcasts yourself?

Sarah:

No, I have never been the creator of webinars or podcasts.

Kirsten:

Okay.

Kirsten:

So, I would say that another thing that would be, make you like the ideal

Kirsten:

guest is, I happen to have Kellie.

Kirsten:

Most podcasts don't have a Kellie, as a producer.

Sarah:

Mm-hmm

Kirsten:

Most of them are doing it themselves.

Kirsten:

And when I was, you know, I was a co-host back in the day, I was in

Kirsten:

Kellie's shoes, and I did not do a great job of getting the guests, and,

Kirsten:

and figuring it out and tracking it.

Kirsten:

So, there was lots of balls in the air.

Kirsten:

So, if you can be extra on top of over-communicating,

Kirsten:

like, "Okay, it's this day.

Kirsten:

Great.

Kirsten:

What time?

Kirsten:

Okay.

Kirsten:

Is it on camera?

Kirsten:

Off camera?

Kirsten:

Do you need me to have, are there questions you would like to ask?"

Kirsten:

You know, like, lead with that if they don't give it to you, because

Sarah:

Mm-hmm

Kirsten:

For the people who are kind of chasing squirrels, that will

Kirsten:

really help, because it means that basically, you're coming and they can

Kirsten:

just kind of hand it to you instead

Sarah:

Sounds great.

Kirsten:

Of it being, you know, instead of it being like, "Okay,

Kirsten:

we're gonna have this moment."

Kirsten:

Because when I bring people on, it's a chemistry moment.

Kirsten:

But if I, if I have not talked to them before, I'm not sure

Kirsten:

how that chemistry's gonna go.

Sarah:

Yeah

Kirsten:

And so it might be great, but in the previous life, I had events where

Kirsten:

I had people come on for interviews and they were all mostly great.

Kirsten:

And there were one or two that just died, and these were live.

Sarah:

Mm-hmm

Kirsten:

And I don't do live anymore for just this reason, because

Kirsten:

live on a camera going, "Okay.

Kirsten:

Um, Alrighty then."

Kirsten:

So, my next piece of advice will be you might be the person who

Kirsten:

has to ask yourself the questions.

Kirsten:

It might be that your host, usually the host is an outgoing person

Kirsten:

like me, and usually they're like, "Oh, I wanna talk, let's go."

Kirsten:

But sometimes, there's things going on.

Sarah:

Mm-hmm

Kirsten:

And if there's that moment of, "uh," then, if you could queue up,

Kirsten:

"Hey, by the way, your listeners do X.

Kirsten:

Here's one of the things I think they might wanna know."

Sarah:

Okay

Kirsten:

You've just saved that person's bacon, on air.

Kirsten:

That is,

Sarah:

That's brilliant.

Kirsten:

You know, like

Sarah:

I, yeah

Kirsten:

So gold.

Sarah:

I love that because, like, that, not only is that a way for me to be

Sarah:

proactive and be a good guest, but, it's a way for, like you were saying

Sarah:

earlier in the pitch part, where I say, like, "This is your audience.

Sarah:

Here's what I do, here's how I'm different, and here's what I can offer,"

Sarah:

then, like, I'm actually bringing that to the table during the recording.

Kirsten:

Yes.

Kirsten:

Yeah.

Kirsten:

And if you have visuals, I would plan for the visuals going wrong.

Sarah:

I think I might

Kirsten:

Like, like, I would build that in, like, automatically,

Kirsten:

like, have the visuals, but if, let's say just not loading.

Kirsten:

Then it's like, "That's fine, no problem.

Kirsten:

We'll talk without it."

Kirsten:

Or, have a link that you can drop in the chat to bring to your website and

Sarah:

Okay

Kirsten:

Direct them there.

Kirsten:

Like, have a backup plan and

Sarah:

Mmm-hmm

Kirsten:

We're on the podcast, and my dog is helping.

Kirsten:

Thank you, Angel.

Kirsten:

So, that kind of thing would be really, really good.

Kirsten:

One thing I've started doing in my presentations at events

Kirsten:

that I'm actually gonna start doing online more, is QR codes.

Sarah:

Oh

Kirsten:

So, one thing you could do, is if you have a slide deck and you

Kirsten:

wanna bring people to a very specific page, and let's say the URL is a little

Kirsten:

longer, well giving out the URL and being like, "Okay, it's Sarah Atlee, forward

Kirsten:

slash da, da, da," it's like, "eh."

Kirsten:

But instead, you could put up a slide with a picture of one of your quilts

Kirsten:

and a QR code and say, "Okay, point your cell phone at this, your camera,

Kirsten:

that'll take you right to the website.

Kirsten:

It'll take you right to that page.

Sarah:

Wow.

Sarah:

That is so clever.

Sarah:

That is so clever.

Sarah:

I love it.

Kirsten:

So, anything that makes it easier, but any of that stuff you do,

Kirsten:

please always plan for it not to work and what you're gonna do when it doesn't.

Sarah:

Mm-hmm

Kirsten:

Because that's what happens.

Sarah:

Mm-hmm

Kirsten:

I will say, if it's a mission critical, like if it's a live event,

Kirsten:

you might want to see if you can also log in on your phone as a guest, so that

Sarah:

Okay

Kirsten:

On the off chance that your wifi goes down on your

Kirsten:

machine, you're still online.

Sarah:

Nice, yeah

Kirsten:

And you're still with them and you can actually text them, or at least,

Kirsten:

have their phone number, so that you can chat, text them back channel on the

Kirsten:

off chance, like, your power goes out.

Sarah:

Mm-hmmm

Kirsten:

Like, somebody hits a pole outside,

Sarah:

Right

Kirsten:

And boom, you go dark.

Kirsten:

You wanna be able to get the message out right away and not

Kirsten:

have it be, "What happened?"

Kirsten:

So, just think in terms of all of the ways in which things can go wrong and

Kirsten:

then try to plan for a few of those.

Kirsten:

And that's kind of my biggest advice.

Kirsten:

And then my second biggest advice is, if you can have fun, which you

Kirsten:

will, and relax, and kind of just be in the moment, then that will be so

Kirsten:

much nicer, no matter what happens.

Sarah:

Mm-hmm

Kirsten:

Because, I don't know about you, but the thing that I'm finding

Kirsten:

challenging when I see other things is, I was watching a podcast recently, and

Kirsten:

everything went wrong technologically, but I was sitting there going, "Yes.

Kirsten:

" because they handled it.

Kirsten:

They were like, "Oh, that's not working.

Kirsten:

All right, we're gonna try this.

Kirsten:

That's not working.

Kirsten:

Damn.

Kirsten:

Okay," and they just, they didn't get the, "Oh my God, I wanna die,"

Kirsten:

which is what you're feeling inside, but you can't do that on camera

Sarah:

Mmm-hmm

Kirsten:

Because it makes the audience feel bad for you.

Kirsten:

And as soon as they feel bad for you, you kind of killed it.

Sarah:

Yeah.

Sarah:

And I wanna keep that, that living, that spontaneous energy present in

Kirsten:

Mmm-hmm

Sarah:

In anytime I appear in a podcast or a webinar, anything like that,

Sarah:

because, like you, I've listened to a lot of podcasts, I've watched a lot of

Sarah:

webinars, and I've seen things go wrong.

Sarah:

And I've seen it when the guest who comes on is just there to

Sarah:

deliver their talking points

Kirsten:

Mmm-hmm

Sarah:

Rather than actually, like, genuinely have a conversation in the

Sarah:

moment, like you were talking about.

Kirsten:

That's an excellent point.

Kirsten:

I know you don't do that, because you and I have talked a bunch, but

Kirsten:

certainly advice for anybody that's listening, the most important part

Kirsten:

of any presentation is whoever your audience is, not your message.

Kirsten:

And if you, message is more important than your audience, make a video.

Kirsten:

Like, seriously,

Sarah:

Great, great point, yeah

Kirsten:

Just make a video, because then you get your message congealed.

Kirsten:

You can deliver it the way you want it, but you're not missing the fact that there

Kirsten:

should be people responding to you, yeah.

Sarah:

Mm-hmm

Kirsten:

So, what kind of things do you wanna get from a podcast?

Kirsten:

Do you wanna get clients?

Kirsten:

Do you wanna get exposure?

Kirsten:

Do you wanna get all of it?

Kirsten:

Would you like to get a gig at an event?

Sarah:

Rather than a gig at an event, at this point in my career, I'm looking

Sarah:

less at career paths that require me to be in a specific place and time,

Sarah:

and I'm looking more at things that I can do more from my home studio.

Sarah:

That's, and this is not just since the pandemic, but it's also due to other

Sarah:

factors in my life that, is working from home is just much, much easier for me.

Sarah:

So, I would love to get connected with potential clients.

Sarah:

That's, that really is the ideal outcome.

Kirsten:

Mm-hmm

Sarah:

But even aside from that, I would love to be able to talk to new

Sarah:

audiences about contemporary quilting, about how quilting might not be the,

Sarah:

what you thought it was, how there are other kinds of quilting, and

Sarah:

how quilting is just an art form.

Sarah:

It's just a form of human expression.

Sarah:

So, all of that stuff would make me happy.

Kirsten:

Nice, nice.

Kirsten:

Then I would, yeah, I would lead with "fabric art," rather

Kirsten:

than the word "quilting."

Kirsten:

I would lead with human connection, communication, fabric art, artist,

Kirsten:

that kind of stuff, and then say, "Oh, by the way, my medium's quilting.

Kirsten:

Are you surprised?"

Kirsten:

Because as soon as you say "quilting," I almost, it's almost

Kirsten:

like a box forms in my head

Sarah:

Mmm-hmm, yeah

Kirsten:

Of, of what I expect.

Kirsten:

And then when I talked to you before, and you were explaining your process, I was

Kirsten:

like, "Oh, I don't have this down at all."

Kirsten:

So, I would really love to see, like, you kind of surprise people with, "I'm

Kirsten:

an artist that works in a fabric medium.

Kirsten:

I work in a physical medium to create physical experiences of

Kirsten:

an emotional state for people."

Sarah:

Mm-hmm

Kirsten:

"So, let's talk about how that works.

Kirsten:

And, by the way, did you know that this is called quilting?"

Kirsten:

You know, kind of like a

Sarah:

Kirsten:

More than your grandma's, kind of thing, and

Sarah:

Yeah

Kirsten:

I think

Sarah:

That's a very good point.

Kirsten:

Would be a lot of fun.

Kirsten:

One thing that would be fun is, do you have any videos of you going

Kirsten:

through the stages of creating a piece?

Sarah:

Mm, not, not specifically, no.

Sarah:

I have a lot of photos of process that could potentially be turned

Sarah:

into a video, but I don't have any recent video of my process.

Kirsten:

Because, are you on Instagram?

Sarah:

Yes

Kirsten:

Okay.

Kirsten:

Do you have videos up on Instagram?

Sarah:

Yes, mm-hmm

Kirsten:

Okay

Sarah:

And I also do, this is something we haven't talked about yet, I also do

Sarah:

live streaming from my studio on Twitch.

Kirsten:

Oh, okay.

Kirsten:

All right.

Kirsten:

So, when you live stream, what is it that you're doing?

Sarah:

I'm sewing.

Sarah:

So, I have a camera at my sewing machine.

Sarah:

I have a camera at my cutting table where I cut pieces of fabric,

Sarah:

and I have a camera, I just got another one for my ironing board.

Sarah:

I'm, like, going maybe a little cuckoo with this, but I love it.

Sarah:

And then I'm also using the camera that you're seeing me on right

Sarah:

now, which is my desktop computer.

Kirsten:

Okay.

Kirsten:

And are you talking through what you're thinking?

Kirsten:

Or are you telling them how you're assembling?

Kirsten:

Or both?

Sarah:

Both of those things.

Sarah:

I'm talking through the process, and sometimes I answer technical

Sarah:

questions from other quilters or other people who work with fabric,

Sarah:

which I'm always happy to do.

Sarah:

But I'm also talking through my thought process, like, "Hmm, I like this.

Sarah:

I don't like that.

Sarah:

This doesn't really have the energy I was going for, so I'm gonna do that instead."

Kirsten:

Oh, see, that's exactly what, that's what I was thinking

Sarah:

Okay

Kirsten:

Is, that's wonderful, because that's exactly the, "Hey, do you know

Kirsten:

what this experience would be like?

Kirsten:

Here's a 30 second intro, and if you like it, you watch the next video in

Kirsten:

line," and kind of pull them in that way.

Sarah:

Yeah

Kirsten:

Because especially if that 30 second video is, like, one of

Kirsten:

the ones in the middle, and then you pull them to the series on YouTube,

Sarah:

Mmm mm-hmm

Kirsten:

Then it's like, "Look, does this feel right for you?

Kirsten:

If it does, let me come tell you this story."

Kirsten:

Because

Sarah:

Yeah

Kirsten:

I just love the idea of the fact that you're doing storytelling, but

Kirsten:

you're doing a physical medium for it.

Sarah:

Mm-hmm

Kirsten:

And I just, I love that so much, so I'm trying to think of all the

Kirsten:

ways in which you can kind of showcase that with folks and certainly on a

Kirsten:

podcast, I know that we always have a smaller window in podcasts, but what

Kirsten:

I'm doing with you, sort of bringing on and doing a, just a live coaching

Kirsten:

brainstorming session, maybe you'd wanna do one of those, is have a session where

Kirsten:

you could, you know, somebody, once you know them and you've been on their

Kirsten:

podcast andm like, it's an established

Sarah:

Mmm-hmm

Kirsten:

Person you're comfortable with, you could say, "Hey, offer one of your

Kirsten:

listeners, that we can go through and I can, I can ask them some questions

Kirsten:

and I can kind of create on the air."

Sarah:

Yes.

Sarah:

Oh, I love that.

Sarah:

And that is something that I have kind of been looking for clients who

Sarah:

will, who feel comfortable with me sharing the process in a public way

Kirsten:

Mmm-hmm

Sarah:

So that that can tell other people, "Here's what the process is.

Sarah:

Here's how you would be involved.

Sarah:

Here are the kind of questions that I would be asking you.

Sarah:

And here, and here's the results."

Kirsten:

Exactly, exactly.

Kirsten:

Because that's why I'm doing this, is to show people kind of the

Kirsten:

conversation I'm having with you, what it's like for us to converse, what

Kirsten:

it would be like for me to converse with them, and I think your process,

Kirsten:

I would love to see that in action.

Kirsten:

I would happily go on YouTube and watch you walking somebody

Kirsten:

through, "All right, let me ask you some questions about your mom.

Kirsten:

Okay, so, okay, all right, so these colors, da, da, da," and kind of

Kirsten:

the energy of that and the, and the, "Okay, these fabrics and how

Kirsten:

does that communicate and Oh,"

Sarah:

Mmm-hmm

Kirsten:

"Really, what about this?

Kirsten:

So, these shapes," and whatever it is that you're bringing to that,

Sarah:

Mm-hmm

Kirsten:

But just having their emotional storytelling experience

Kirsten:

physically manifest, I just, I could not love that more.

Kirsten:

I just think that's wonderful.

Sarah:

I love this idea and that, that is very, very, I think that's

Sarah:

a great direction and, knowing that, you know, you, who have not actually

Sarah:

seen my process before, and you've been interested in seeing the process.

Sarah:

I love that, and that is something really good that I could follow up on.

Kirsten:

Great, great.

Kirsten:

So, I hope this was helpful.

Sarah:

Very

Kirsten:

Good, good, because I really, you know, I like when we talked

Kirsten:

originally, it was like, "Oh, you don't really need any public speaking stuff.

Kirsten:

Nope.

Kirsten:

You're good," you know.

Sarah:

Well, I appreciate that too .

Kirsten:

Yeah, but, like, when we talked, it's like, you've

Kirsten:

already got camera presence.

Kirsten:

You're already talking to the camera, which is, that's a huge thing.

Kirsten:

That's a huge thing.

Sarah:

Okay

Kirsten:

Usually people are doing this, and for the people on audio, I'm looking

Kirsten:

off to the side, because they're talking to their notes, they're not talking

Sarah:

Right

Kirsten:

To the person.

Kirsten:

And it's hard to make eye contact when you're not making eye contact.

Sarah:

Yes, yeah

Kirsten:

Like, that's a little weird, is to mentally know that

Kirsten:

you're connecting to people through your camera is an odd experience,

Kirsten:

but you've already got all of that.

Sarah:

Okay

Kirsten:

So that's why, when we were talking, I was like, "Hmm, I'm trying to

Kirsten:

think of a different way in," because, you know, you've, you've already got the

Kirsten:

communicating with people in this medium down, and that's one of the first hurdles,

Sarah:

Okay

Kirsten:

Is being able to do this, as opposed to the face-to-face because,

Kirsten:

the transition, how long have you been doing the virtual work with people?

Sarah:

Let's see.

Sarah:

Like most other folks, I started getting used to Zoom calls during the pandemic.

Sarah:

During that time, I also had the experience of playing Dungeons and

Sarah:

Dragons online with a group of friends,

Kirsten:

Cool!

Sarah:

And we were using video as part of that, so that

Sarah:

that was like a crash course.

Kirsten:

Awesome

Sarah:

And I, yeah, and I had been also watching people live streaming on Twitch,

Sarah:

and so I started to think, "Oh, this could be something that I could do there too."

Kirsten:

Nice

Sarah:

So, over the last, like, three years or so, I've, I've

Sarah:

gotten acquainted with this medium.

Kirsten:

Yeah, no, you're definitely, you've, you've got a stage presence,

Kirsten:

you're natural, you've got the energy, you've already got all that.

Kirsten:

Like, that's good.

Kirsten:

Your lighting is decent.

Kirsten:

You're not massively backlit and looking like some hostage video, which

Kirsten:

is about a third of the people I see.

Sarah:

Ooh, I, I don't want, that's not the vibe I'm going for.

Kirsten:

Oh, no, no.

Kirsten:

I mean, it's really, because it's one of those, that's like, "Okay,

Kirsten:

the first thing is, you've gotta be lit from the front and the sides.

Kirsten:

Like, you can't be lit from the back."

Sarah:

Yeah

Kirsten:

But I love that you said the D&D thing, because I'm

Kirsten:

actually on Discord playing, my husband's written some RPGs and we

Sarah:

Oh cool!

Kirsten:

Play test them on Discord and

Sarah:

Fantastic

Kirsten:

And it's just a hell of a lot of fun, because they're actually

Kirsten:

based on the Amber series of books.

Sarah:

I'm not, I'm not familiar with that.

Sarah:

Oh okay.

Kirsten:

So, they're fantasy books of essentially God-like family

Kirsten:

that can go and warp into different dimensions more on will, and they can

Kirsten:

kind of shift worlds and all of that.

Kirsten:

And so you're one of these people that has this bloodline, and so you can change into

Kirsten:

different dimensions, which means there's a lot of storytelling in the playing.

Sarah:

Yeah

Kirsten:

And it's fun, because you're doing something and then you're like,

Kirsten:

"Okay, well how do you warp out of it?"

Kirsten:

It's like, "Well, I'm moving into a place where," and then you have

Kirsten:

to kind of mentally figure out, "What is it that I'm creating here?"

Kirsten:

And you're creating it live in the moment and it's fun.

Sarah:

Mm-hmm.

Sarah:

And again, there's that, there's that storytelling element like, like

Kirsten:

Mm-hmm

Sarah:

You mentioned, there's that, "How do I use my words and my voice

Sarah:

to create an image in your mind that you can't see with your eyes?"

Sarah:

yeah.

Kirsten:

Exactly, exactly

Sarah:

That's fascinating, love it.

Sarah:

I, I just wanted to thank you for giving me advice that I really need right now

Sarah:

because I'm at a place in my career where I'm really trying to level up, really

Sarah:

trying to expand my audience, and kind of trying to get to that next level.

Sarah:

And you've given me some great ideas that I can work with,

Sarah:

and I appreciate that so much.

Kirsten:

Thank you.

Kirsten:

So, if, I really appreciate that, and how do people find you?

Kirsten:

Like, where are you on the internets?

Kirsten:

All the places.

Sarah:

Well, I'm easy to find.

Sarah:

You can Google me and my website is my name, sarahatlee.com.

Sarah:

I am also on Facebook, Instagram, like I mentioned, you can find me on Twitch.

Sarah:

And you can get links to all of those places from my website,

Kirsten:

Okay

Sarah:

sarahatlee.com.

Kirsten:

A t l e e?

Sarah:

Correct

Kirsten:

Okay, fantastic.

Kirsten:

Well, thank you so much for coming on.

Kirsten:

I really appreciate it, and

Sarah:

I appreciate you.

Sarah:

Thank you.

Kirsten:

I, I look forward to when you have one of these, send me the link and

Kirsten:

I'll share it with everybody and, and then you can come back on and we can

Kirsten:

look at what your final creation was.

Sarah:

Fantastic

Kirsten:

It'll be fantastic.

Kirsten:

All right.

Kirsten:

Fantastic.

Kirsten:

Thank you so much.

Sarah:

All right.

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