Shownotes
Pauline Bosma, founder of the Rainbow Support Groups of Massachusetts, and Oscar Hughes, then a Boston University doctoral candidate, share how they worked with others to create a resource guide for understanding the lives of people with intellectual and developmental disabilities who are also part of the LGBTQ+ community.
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Transcripts
00;00;00;00 - 00;00;48;04
Janet Stewart
Welcome to Impact the Conversation, a podcast of the University of Minnesota's Institute on Community Integration. It brings you strategies and stories advancing the inclusion of people with disabilities. Our guests are the authors of impact, our long running magazine that bridges the research to practice gap with professional and personal reflections on what matters most in disability equity today. I'm your host, Janet Stewart.
00;00;48;06 - 00;01;16;13
Janet Stewart
Welcome, everybody. Today we're talking with Pauline Bosma and Oscar Hughes, two of the creators of our lives. Our choices, Our Rights, an online guidebook from the Rainbow Support Group that is by and for people with intellectual and or developmental disabilities who are also in the LGBTQ plus community. Pauline, can you get us started here and tell us a little bit about how, how and why you founded the support group?
00;01;16;13 - 00;01;26;01
Janet Stewart
And then we'll ask a couple of other questions. But how in the take us all the way back, how did you first get the idea to even start the Rainbow Support Group?
00;01;26;05 - 00;01;59;05
Pauline Bosma
Well, I thank you. I came on as trans a long time ago, and I wanted a, a safe environment for people with disabilities to go and talk about their issues. Because when you when you go to a regular, LGBT group or anything like that and anybody that knows is in the regular LGBT community, the gays are in one corner and the lesbians or in another corner of the trans people or another corner, and the, you know, you know, they're just not together.
00;01;59;05 - 00;02;28;13
Pauline Bosma
And I kind of like that. Hey, I want to like, get together and talk about the issues that we all, we all, we all are having the same issues in our own same way. But now I have a support groups, and I have groups in other states, you know, like like New York, you know, New Hampshire or Ireland, Vermont, you know, Connecticut, Colorado, California, Portland, Oregon, Canada.
00;02;28;14 - 00;02;34;11
Pauline Bosma
And I even got a group in Australia. So we're we're connecting the world gradually, little by little.
00;02;34;12 - 00;02;52;07
Janet Stewart
That's, that's amazing. And I also want to bring in your colleague Oscar Hughes. Oscar, actually, just I believe, completed his, doctoral work in special education at Boston University's Wheelock College of Education and Human Development in Boston. Welcome, Oscar.
00;02;52;10 - 00;02;53;22
Pete McCauley
Yes. Hi. Thank you.
00;02;53;23 - 00;03;01;09
Janet Stewart
It's so great to have you here. And is that right? Did you I think you just completed your your studies. Is that correct?
00;03;01;11 - 00;03;14;10
Pete McCauley
I did, yes, Pauline and I actually did a research study together. That study was the basis of the rainbow guidebook we're going to talk to you about and then I also defended my dissertation, just two weeks ago.
00;03;14;13 - 00;03;25;06
Janet Stewart
How did this guidebook really get started? Oscar, you said that it was part of your your dissertation work. What what was the conversation early on?
00;03;25;08 - 00;03;26;06
Pauline Bosma
Do you want me to one?
00;03;26;10 - 00;03;27;27
Janet Stewart
Yeah. You start us off.
00;03;28;00 - 00;04;09;22
Pauline Bosma
So, I always want to say the biggest thing for me is overall education in general. You know, just like I wanted to have something that, people can learn something about LGBT idea, but also learn about other things about sexuality and nurture healthy relationships, stuff like that. And, you know, while Oscar was doing the study, you know, the research study that that like that, we kind of like, you know, heard these stories and I, I asked very, one question like the question was, how can we help who, you know, and what.
00;04;09;28 - 00;04;15;07
Janet Stewart
Do you mean by that? When you how can we help? What what was behind that question? What did you mean by that?
00;04;15;07 - 00;04;44;24
Pauline Bosma
It was just the way the, the, the, the, the that when Oscar would read some of the stories that he got from the, from the research because he, he research, I think was like 20 to 25 people give or take across the country. And and he asked some different questions, you know, like what kind of hypothetically what kind of of what would you like to get if you couldn't get support for being LGBT and idea what, what what do you wish you had?
00;04;44;24 - 00;05;08;02
Pauline Bosma
What do you want? Well, what would you like to do better? And with like that. And those are some of the questions that we want to like more education, more support. And we wanted to learn something more in school and stuff like that. And we wanted support from our family and our friends and stuff like that. So that's where the words like, how can we help?
00;05;08;02 - 00;05;17;16
Pauline Bosma
What can we do? And I guess when, you know, like, you know, kind of like it was spitballing from my head that we should do some kind of guidebook or something.
00;05;17;23 - 00;05;41;09
Janet Stewart
That's awesome. And so in your first, when you first had some of these ideas that you were talking about, did you were you envisioning then something that was talking to the idea community, the people with disabilities directly about their lives, or was it more about, how you can help others to understand you better?
00;05;41;13 - 00;06;07;19
Pauline Bosma
I think it was a little bit of both. I just want, you know, the main thing is I want to give people a chance to understand that, you know, like being LGBT and being needy is hard enough. And we're trying to go through it. And we, you know, we have different problems. We go through, you know, like, I never learned how to read or write, so I can't read or I can't write too bad.
00;06;07;24 - 00;06;29;15
Pauline Bosma
But that doesn't stop me from where my brain, you know, the you know, the role. Definitely where I can think of ideas and think of things that is normally a bit differently. And that's what I did, is I learned a different format, you know, so, you know, but I understand that, you know,
00;06;29;17 - 00;06;38;16
Janet Stewart
That's awesome. That's awesome. Oscar, can you take us through your research with the with the group and then how that developed into the guidebook there?
00;06;38;16 - 00;06;57;15
Pete McCauley
Yeah, it started with the question Pauline mentioned she was asking, how can we help? How can we support this community? And I happen to be I was working as her assistant and I was also a PhD student. And I just said, let's do a research study about that. So we agreed that we would gather some more people on the team.
00;06;57;15 - 00;07;23;09
Pete McCauley
And I conducted some interviews, and then we met as a research team. We looked at the themes from the interviews. What were people struggling with? What were the supports that people were looking for? And we just started brainstorming, well, what can we do about this? So trying to answer Pauline's original question, what would be helpful? And, Pauline always had this idea of wanting to create this guidebook for supporters.
00;07;23;11 - 00;07;50;20
Pete McCauley
And the team was on board with that. And a lot of the findings from our interviews, people said there needs to be more visibility, more understanding, more education about their community. And so, we started just writing a guidebook chapter by chapter. We would meet on zoom and go through the findings and the quotes and, put together the information that we had gathered into something we thought supporters and self-advocates would, would want to read.
00;07;50;22 - 00;08;15;06
Janet Stewart
You know, there's a lot of talk in the field right now about participatory research, how important it is. Nothing about us without us and, and all of that. And, you know, there are a lot of researchers there trying to bring meaningful voices of people with disabilities into their work here in this particular project, it seems like that is even more crucial.
00;08;15;06 - 00;08;33;00
Janet Stewart
Right. What how do you feel about this whole trend in research? And and were you thinking as you went into this project, you don't want to just give that lip service? You really you really want to be meaningful about those participatory influences?
00;08;33;02 - 00;09;00;26
Pete McCauley
Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I've I've the reason I entered this field special education and also disability advocacy is because I believe that people with disabilities are experts on their own lives and they should be the ones who, have the most input, the most power when it comes to research and decision making around disability and education. So I always wanted to do an inclusive research project.
00;09;00;29 - 00;09;27;14
Pete McCauley
And Pauline's actually been on many different inclusive research projects and done lots of research. So when she asked this question, it just seemed like a great opportunity to work together on something and especially, I think, around gender, sexuality, the LGBTQ plus community. Right. There's this interaction of multiple identities. There's a lot of opportunity for researchers to get it wrong and not really understand what people's lives are really like.
00;09;27;17 - 00;09;32;05
Pete McCauley
So we need experts who have a lived experience to guide that research.
00;09;32;07 - 00;10;01;23
Janet Stewart
And that's a perfect, entry into my next question for Pauline. You, in your article, you wrote that the group, as you were working, you know, in the group on this project, you heard a lot of stories from people with disabilities who have been really rejected by their families when they started to express their sexuality and their gender, and I know that you've had some of your own personal experiences, with this.
00;10;01;25 - 00;10;03;23
Janet Stewart
What was that like for you?
00;10;03;26 - 00;10;25;17
Pauline Bosma
For me? Personally, it was, it was a bit, room was a bit, you know, reminded, like when, when my mother found out and it was one that she kind of like, you know, this was early on, and she kind of final, and she looked at me and she said, you will make an ugly looking woman, you know?
00;10;25;17 - 00;10;46;22
Pauline Bosma
But then, my mother's, when she was dying, you know, she looked at me and she said, I love you for who you are, regardless. So that made me feel better. Not only that, my mother loved me for me. And and with that and my my siblings. You know, I'm the youngest of five of my siblings. After my mother died, this disowned me.
00;10;46;22 - 00;11;10;06
Pauline Bosma
And it was like that, so I didn't really I haven't talked to my siblings in about 19, 18 years, 19, 18 years like that. But I got a lot of chosen family, you know, like Oscar and I got my wonderful support agency that supports me. And that was by that. And they've been a big ally for me. And with all of that.
00;11;10;06 - 00;11;32;20
Pauline Bosma
So I got a lot of support, people that love me and with my and that's what keeps me going is that I have this family that I had and that I chose and I chose them so and that I didn't know, you know, like, well, I hear the stories about people. And I was like, that makes my heart go out.
00;11;32;23 - 00;11;53;10
Pauline Bosma
And it makes me want to, you know, like, you know, help them more and educate them more and, you know, don't you know, don't worry, I'm not going through this alone. You're going you might be going through a different format, but you're not going through it alone. We're all we're all here to support each other.
00;11;53;13 - 00;12;16;11
Janet Stewart
That's fabulous. And you were actually getting ready for the show. You were telling me some stories of some of that work you've done going to different conferences and different, opportunities to kind of tell this story. And you shared with me, you know, one, one anecdote. I remember when you were setting up for a show or you had someone kind of come by the table and, and ask a question, can you share that story with me?
00;12;16;14 - 00;12;17;25
Pauline Bosma
I'm trying to think of what the question.
00;12;17;25 - 00;12;24;03
Janet Stewart
It was the one when, someone came up to a table and. And you had a condom on the table.
00;12;24;05 - 00;12;47;13
Pauline Bosma
Oh, yeah. Yeah, yeah, I was, I was, so there was a group, and I was like, how, kind of all kind of not so rapidly conference, so that everyone came up to me and asked me, you know, what's just. And I said, that's a condom to have safe sex with. And when I had, when I said that, the on the people around my table went dead silence.
00;12;47;15 - 00;13;06;15
Pauline Bosma
And then the guy said, well, I don't know how to use what. And I said, that would be a really good workshop. And then I went even more deadly silence, and I got the stares from everybody with in the room that I was in, because I was at my table and I'm just, just staring me down like I said, the wrong thing.
00;13;06;17 - 00;13;33;29
Pauline Bosma
So I mean, and that made me realize that the, you know, when you're when you're working on something, you, you you got to realize that there are some things you can do that the audience was ready for. And then the other thing you got to hold back a little bit and gradually bringing in. But you can't bring it in once because people are going to be overwhelmed.
00;13;33;29 - 00;13;52;24
Pauline Bosma
And I've been gradually bringing in the word, you know, gender or sexuality and stuff like that. But I hadn't really of like pushed around that more, saying like, hey, you know that? I'm saying, like, if we're going to do this gradually, a little bit at a time, a little bit learning a little bit, you know,
00;13;52;26 - 00;14;16;02
Janet Stewart
And there you've really hit on an issue that crosses in, in and out of disability. Right. Because who as Americans, we have kind of a rap of being a little, I don't know, old fashioned or a little reserved about all of these topics, whether it's intersects with disability or not. Oscar, is that a challenge in doing some of this work?
00;14;16;09 - 00;14;17;24
Janet Stewart
From your perspective?
00;14;17;26 - 00;14;48;05
Pete McCauley
I think it's changing. It's improving. We have people like Pauline who are, getting these conversations started and keeping them going. I certainly found when I was a special education teacher that sexuality education was really limited. Students. I had students with disabilities whose gender sexual identity was outside of the expectations or the heterosexual norms. And that was really difficult for parents and teachers to wrap their head around that.
00;14;48;05 - 00;15;12;06
Pete McCauley
Students with disabilities could be LGBTQ plus as well. And fortunately, in this research, we're here in Massachusetts, and, Pauline has her rainbow groups, which have a lot of support. So it's been really positive to connect with a community of folks who are also interested in this work and willing to have these conversations, but we still need to expand that.
00;15;12;06 - 00;15;17;26
Pete McCauley
And, provide more support and more education on gender and sexuality, for sure.
00;15;17;28 - 00;15;47;22
Janet Stewart
Well, and that's just it. You know, the The Rainbow, guidebook is fantastic that we had in the magazine. A few, other examples of, of programs that are doing a lot of work in this area. And so, you know, the one thing we don't want to do is create this impression that there's just a ton of resources out there because, as you point out, you know, a lot of states are curtailing of sexual sexuality education in general, not just LGBTQ or for people with disabilities.
00;15;47;22 - 00;15;51;13
Janet Stewart
And so there is a dearth of this, correct?
00;15;51;15 - 00;16;16;04
Pete McCauley
Yes. For sure. It's a it's, it's still a taboo topic, unfortunately. And I think we're just seeing now more and more people who are willing to even consider what does it mean to support gender and sexual expression. We were just at a conference last week, and there were a few sessions and a few people who are really passionate about this topic and trying to do this work, but I think it's really new.
00;16;16;04 - 00;16;20;06
Pete McCauley
And, definitely there's a lot more to do.
00;16;20;09 - 00;16;31;06
Janet Stewart
And Pauline was actually mentioning, I think you're talking about the conference. Is that right? And Pauline, what what is the Tash conference and how did it intersect with some of the work that you've done?
00;16;31;08 - 00;16;42;06
Pauline Bosma
People that are, you know, like self advocates and they have a disability that are other, but it's mainly a lot more confessionals. I mean, ask her in more detail about that.
00;16;42;06 - 00;16;50;09
Janet Stewart
I can and did you did you have a booth at the conference or did you talk to people about the the guidebook there?
00;16;50;11 - 00;17;01;09
Pauline Bosma
We we did both. We talked about the guidebook and we also had a table. And then we did a workshop. What was our first workshop on? I forgot again.
00;17;01;11 - 00;17;31;07
Pete McCauley
Yeah. Pauline and I and Nora, the third author on the article, had two sessions. The first one was about, scenarios on how to support gender and sexual self-determination. So Pauline and Nora had examples of real life scenarios where people with disabilities were denied their gender or sexual self-expression. And we asked the audience, you know, what are some ways that we we could better promote people to express who they are and support them to express who they are?
00;17;31;08 - 00;17;36;00
Pete McCauley
We took a lot of notes on people's ideas about that. That had a great turnout.
00;17;36;01 - 00;17;44;18
Janet Stewart
Can you give me can you give me a for instance on that? What were some of the examples of of how their self-determination had been impacted?
00;17;44;21 - 00;18;04;18
Pete McCauley
Sure. Yeah. I think one of the scenarios that was, a person and this is based on a true story of someone we heard from. They lived at a group home and they wanted to wear dresses, but their staff said, oh, you're a man, so you have to wear men's clothes. And we'd just go to the men's section and buy the men's clothes.
00;18;04;20 - 00;18;28;24
Pete McCauley
And so we asked, well, how could this person be supported to wear what they want to wear and express who they are? People shared a lot of examples. One was just arguing that people should be able to choose what they wear, and to pick out the clothes that they wear. Some people felt that this person should have new staff, staff who are more supportive and understanding.
00;18;28;26 - 00;18;42;21
Pete McCauley
But, Pauline talked about, you know, if there was a human rights officer, you could report this as a violation of your human rights. So just thinking through when these situations come up, how can we advocate for people to be who they are?
00;18;42;23 - 00;19;12;12
Janet Stewart
Pauline, in your own experience, I know you had some negative feedback from your immediate family, but as you started to more fully express who you were as a woman, were there were there other critical moments, key times when people either, you know, either denied support to you or gave you support that that helped you in making that decision to, to, evolve more fully into who you really were?
00;19;12;14 - 00;19;35;18
Pauline Bosma
Well, I mean, when I first in the state of Michigan, as we have, we have a state agency that's called the Department of Environmental Service, which services all the people with disability in the state of Massachusetts. And, my local office and my that I told them what I was and I was like, I mean, they've known me for a long time.
00;19;35;20 - 00;20;05;04
Pauline Bosma
I told them when I was and with my that in the and that and that the, the, the area director and the boss of my that and my so my what support person so I said said well we we want to know about it but we don't want to know about it. So the reason they're saying like keep it in the closet but don't open the door yet.
00;20;05;04 - 00;20;11;22
Pauline Bosma
And I think that is that doors are already open longer, but I know it.
00;20;11;25 - 00;20;26;02
Janet Stewart
So that was your first response to that. You by that point, you had enough, wherewithal or enough of, of your own confidence to sort of laugh at that and, and, and realize that that wasn't something that was going to hold you back.
00;20;26;04 - 00;20;52;25
Pauline Bosma
No. Because I mean it I mean, it's it's, to me, it's just, it's just a it's just a little thing that I did, just really like when I said my brain, it's like, it's like there was, there was like a story where I was working for a they were small agency, and I was there, and I was and I was in my I was in my little, you know, because I was a, I was a custodian.
00;20;52;25 - 00;21;15;22
Pauline Bosma
So I've seen all the officers, everything like that. So I was, I was in my little, you know, closet. Right. And and my supervisor comes in and Negro and he goes and he goes and he goes, he goes, can you, can you can you can you get out of the closet? And I looked at him and I jokingly said, I'm already out of the closet.
00;21;15;24 - 00;21;33;28
Pauline Bosma
And he just looked at me and he just said, okay, I'm walking away. I'm not saying nothing. You know, you got the job, but I'm going like, oh shit, by stealing. But he got the job because he was telling me to get out of the closet. I said, well, nobody out of the closet, man, hypothetically. And I'm like, well, I gotta make a joke out of it, because you know what I mean?
00;21;34;03 - 00;21;39;26
Pauline Bosma
It was funny to me because I'll just say like, oh, well, you know, the you really can't stop, you know.
00;21;39;26 - 00;21;50;10
Janet Stewart
There you go. That's that's awesome. And so you were sharing a little earlier. You were sharing, some numbers about the, the guidebook. Can you tell me a little about that?
00;21;50;12 - 00;22;18;01
Pauline Bosma
Yeah. Where, you know, we launched the guide with seven months ago, and right now we're, we're aware there are 30,000 people that I looked at the guide blog and, you know, and, you know, and we have some like, covered colleges using other college courses. We have a group. And I was like, I think, do we have a do we have a school like an elementary school or middle school or something?
00;22;18;01 - 00;22;19;16
Pauline Bosma
And I think.
00;22;19;19 - 00;22;40;07
Pete McCauley
Yeah, we've started getting some messages from people sharing how they've used it. One of them, Reese, the most recent one is, a school psychologist, I think at a high school in New York who said she has some students she works with who have disabilities, who are LGBTQ. And they sat down and looked at the guidebook together and talked about student goals and identity.
00;22;40;07 - 00;22;42;27
Pete McCauley
And it's cool to hear how people are using it.
00;22;43;04 - 00;23;00;17
Janet Stewart
That's a really critical, because several articles in the issue talked about how how few resources really are available in schools. So how did you crack that market, Oscar? What did you have a dissemination plan? What how did you do that?
00;23;00;19 - 00;23;37;17
Pete McCauley
Well, we're certainly still trying to get it out there. That's one of the reasons we wrote this magazine article and came on this podcast. But, we just started by sharing it with some list servs I happen to be on as a PhD student. We posted it on a website for the rainbow support groups. We've shared it on social media as best we could, so, we're still trying to figure out how best to get it out there, but, I think a few, state agencies and, service providers have shared it with their staff.
00;23;37;17 - 00;23;51;03
Pete McCauley
That's a big way that it's gotten out there. The state of Rhode Island, California, a couple different state, developmental disability services agencies have shared it with their staff or on their website. Things like that.
00;23;51;06 - 00;24;03;11
Janet Stewart
And I want to ask each of you before we close, is there one moment that really stands out for you in this, in this work that wow, that's the the take home for you?
00;24;03;14 - 00;24;21;00
Pete McCauley
In terms of the research project, there was a moment on the team where we were talking about some struggles that people were going through and the hardships of the participants, and it was really kind of bringing us down. And so we switched and looked at how, what did people say they were proud of and what made them happy.
00;24;21;00 - 00;24;41;17
Pete McCauley
And we ended up putting a lot of that data in the guidebook. Why are people happy to be LGBTQ? Plus, what do they like about themselves? Where do they find their joy? And I think we really need that right now. There's so much negative news and people do struggle, but people can also be happy and proud and live a wonderful LGBTQ plus life.
00;24;41;17 - 00;24;50;10
Pete McCauley
Even when it's hard, it can be wonderful. So I think sharing those stories of joy is really powerful, and I'm really glad that we were able to do that.
00;24;50;13 - 00;25;24;04
Janet Stewart
What a great thought. Because certainly it's so important to bring out discrimination. And, you know, the things that we have to call attention to. But but part of that is the joy, right? Pauline, how about for you? Was there a moment as you were going through all of this with your colleagues? That was an moment about, oh, yeah, this part of it is going to be the most useful to people with disabilities or this is going to really resonate with people who are supporting people with disabilities.
00;25;24;12 - 00;25;30;26
Janet Stewart
Was there one part of it that just really you thought, this is this is good stuff?
00;25;30;28 - 00;25;57;10
Pauline Bosma
Well, I mean, when we, when we, when we got it all done there. No, no no that was a really good moment with, with that and another really good moment for me was when Oscar for the in his, in his, dissertation to get a doctoral degree. And I was glad that, you know, I made a link.
00;25;57;12 - 00;26;36;13
Pauline Bosma
I like to put things in and in respect of real. I was one of that. And, you know, and I and I and I said, you know, I said, you know, my, you know, when I started my, my rainbow support group and 19 years ago next year will be my 20th anniversary, you know, with my that I said I started at nine, 19 years ago and I, and I looked, you know, and where I'm sitting now, talking to other people and the chair, I said, you know, my my baby is off to college, and now my baby, he's got a doctor's degree and going out in the world because she's literally like,
00;26;36;16 - 00;27;12;19
Pauline Bosma
living with in the system. And I and it just, you know, brought a tear to my eye knowing that, you know, like, like, when I leave or Earth, there's, is a part of me that's going to be left behind for a long, long time. For many people use. And that is just so happy for me to have that and to be like that there, that's just like, really proud of me is like, I'm really happy for everything that's that's been coming true and been happy with that.
00;27;12;19 - 00;27;33;13
Janet Stewart
So wow, that's that's amazing. And I just love that you shared that with us because the you know, that's one of the things we talked early on about is, you know, the whole nothing about us without us. And and how do you really get at the research that's meaningful. And boy, you can't do any better than what you just said.
00;27;33;13 - 00;27;49;12
Janet Stewart
Right. And if anything, I haven't asked about, recollections from the experience either of writing the article, for the magazine or and putting the guidebook together or anything we haven't touched on, Oscar from you. And then we'll finish with Pauline.
00;27;49;19 - 00;28;14;20
Pete McCauley
Just add that if you're doing research or any kind of project or programing that's trying to support or to serve people with disabilities, people with disabilities have to be on the team, collecting the data, asking the questions, planning the programing, whatever it is, we need their insight. If we're going to try to do the right thing and do it well, we need their insight.
00;28;14;23 - 00;28;21;07
Janet Stewart
Awesome. And how about for you, Pauline, anything that we haven't talked about that has been on your mind with all of this?
00;28;21;10 - 00;28;43;00
Pauline Bosma
I think I'm just looking forward to the, you know, the future is here once. What's going to happen with and, you know, things that are kind of but also where, you know, like, you know, us are going to be starting our own training company sometime next year. And I that's all that should be really interesting to see how that's going to go.
00;28;43;00 - 00;28;52;06
Pauline Bosma
And that's, you know, is it a sort of a, you know, when I hopefully when I add some new things to the guidebook that as we go.
00;28;52;06 - 00;29;07;03
Janet Stewart
Along, that's really that's really exciting. And I can't wait to see where you take this, effort because it's going to be, really exciting to see, you know, how this evolves and and really where it goes from here. All right. Thanks again. Take care.
00;29;07;04 - 00;29;08;06
Pete McCauley
Bye. Thank you.
00;29;08;08 - 00;29;13;24
Janet Stewart
Bye bye.
00;29;13;27 - 00;29;24;08
Janet Stewart
Thanks for joining the conversation. If you'd like to reproduce all or part of this podcast, please email Aisi Pub at n.edu.
00;29;24;11 - 00;29;28;24
Pete McCauley
Our show is co-produced at the University of Minnesota's Institute on Community Integration.
00;29;29;01 - 00;29;29;10
Pete McCauley
By.
00;29;29;10 - 00;29;31;26
Pete McCauley
Impact managing editor Janet Stewart.
00;29;31;29 - 00;29;39;03
Pete McCauley
And AISI media producer Pete McCauley. Skyler Mihajlov is our editor. Graphic designers are Connie Burkhart.
00;29;39;03 - 00;29;39;16
Pete McCauley
And.
00;29;39;16 - 00;29;40;19
Pete McCauley
Sarah Curtner.
00;29;40;21 - 00;29;42;25
Pete McCauley
For more information on the Institute and all.
00;29;42;25 - 00;29;44;06
Pete McCauley
Of our products and projects.
00;29;44;12 - 00;29;44;23
Pete McCauley
Please.
00;29;44;23 - 00;30;00;17
Pete McCauley
Visit ICI. N.edu.
