Shownotes
We toss around "mind over matter" like a slogan. But underneath it is something more honest: our inner state quietly shapes our body, our choices, and the life we end up building.
Serial entrepreneur and author DR Rawson shares how refusing to accept his circumstances carried him from homelessness to remarkable success, and why the mind is meant to be the body's companion, not its opponent.
About the Guest:
DR Rawson is a serial entrepreneur credited with starting or leading more than 27 businesses, an Air Force veteran, and the author of UnLikely. He created the Character, Integrity, Credibility (CIC) framework.
Key Takeaways:
- "Mind over matter" isn't magic; your inner state shapes real outcomes.
- You don't have to accept the circumstances you were handed.
- Potential only opens up when your mind is fully on board.
- Focus on what you can do, not the wall of problems in front of you.
- Define the goal, know the why, then commit to the how.
Connect With the Guest:
Website: drrawson.com
Book: UnLikely (on Amazon)
Free CIC score: mycicscore.com
Episode Chapters:
[00:00] More Than a Slogan — Sayan opens on the mind shaping the matter of life
[03:00] Born Curious — A lifelong drive to understand the world
[07:00] Refusing the Circumstance — From homelessness to a plan to get out
[13:00] Understanding Potential — Why the mind has to be on board to grow
[18:00] Problems or Possibilities — Choosing what you can do over what you can't
[22:00] The Setback Is the Point — Back surgery at 79 and forging ahead
[26:00] Goal, Why, and How — Building the life you decide on (timestamps approx.)
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Transcripts
00:00:08 Sayan: We use the phrase mind over matter casually, like it's a slogan or a sentence. But underneath that phrase, I think is something far more honest. Uh, in a state shapes our body, definitely our choices and our relationships, not in some weird, magical way, but in a very ordinary way. So today we invite you to look at how the mind is quietly shaping the matter of a life. Welcome back to Mind Over Matter. I'm your host, cyan. As most of you would know. And today my guest is Dr. Rosen, who is here to talk about how the mind is quietly shaping the matter of your life. So they are working with the show. It's and thank.
00:00:46 DR Rawson: You very much. Thanks for having me. I appreciate it.
00:00:49 Sayan: Thank you so much. So before we get in, folks, a little disclaimer for all of you.
00:01:32 Sayan: So. Dr.. Before we go in any further, uh, could you tell us what is something small that you do in your day that keeps your mind from running the show without you, uh, knowing that.
00:01:46 DR Rawson: You know, that's an interesting question. And I don't think I've ever been asked that before, but I think my mind works all the time because I'm so darn curious about so many things, um, locally, nationally and globally. Um, I'm one of those few people who've been fortunate enough to travel around the world more than twenty five times, been to your country many times. And, uh, I just have this natural curiosity, whether it's about a culture or about a product or even a structure of a word sentence, why is it structured that way? And I just, yeah, I just think about those things all the time. That's why I guess I get only three to four hours of sleep at night.
00:02:36 Sayan: Yeah, that's, I think that's a great answer. And I relate to that because, uh, you know, I think curiosity is my default setting as well. So I could relate that on another level perhaps. But, um, let me ask you this, perhaps let's take a step back. So do you think curiosity is something that is, um, people are born with, or is it something that can be built over time? Because I think that's more of a practical, um, problem that we need to look at and, uh, maybe go about that.
00:03:07 DR Rawson: I actually think I was born with this, uh, I've been this way my whole life. Just, just to give you a little insight, uh, my parents took one vacation in my entire life with my parents, and I was only with them until I was about, uh, eight and a half. And, uh, the one vacation we took, uh, everybody else decided to go to sleep. All my siblings I had, I had a brother and two sisters and they went to sleep. And, um, I didn't, I stayed awake, I watched what was going on. I listened to my parents, I saw the countryside, I saw things change. and I was curious about it and why it was happening. I was asking a lot of questions, and I remember my dad said, you know, doctor, you're asking the right questions, but you sure ask a lot of them.
00:04:05 Sayan: Wow. That's that's a great, uh, quality, I would say. Right. because I think curiosity is something that ultimately becomes a greater part, uh, for, for one, success. I mean, uh, it's something that I think pushes you to learn more about no matter what, what is it? Even if you are not familiar or you don't have a familiar ground with the topic, let's say, or I mean, whatever is that? Maybe it's, it's in work or maybe it's, uh, you know, from a relationship point of view as well. I think it also, it is something, uh, from relationship point of view, just to make it more relatable for the listeners. I think, uh, you know, we often tend to think that we really know our partners very well, but I think, uh, some degree of curiosity there as well in order to know that person even more beyond what you already know. I think that that is something that I was talking about. But I want to start with how the phrase mind over matter has been flattened in the culture. So, um, from your experience, what do you think is the biggest misconception about mind over matter and what is actually happening when someone learns to work with their mind instead of against. Um, you know, their body.
00:05:12 DR Rawson: Well, uh, that's a good question. And, and I guess the only real answer I have is the fact that, uh, when I was, uh, nine and a half, I was homeless. And so, uh, I was homeless, but I was also five foot seven, so people thought I was a young adult. And I wasn't, of course, but I supported my mother, my brother and two sisters. And I used to take meals home to them that I received out of trash cans. Now, what's that have to do with anything? Well, what it has to do with is that, uh, a lot of people told me that I would just be poor white trash. I would just be nothing. And I would never amount to anything. And it was unthinkable that I, I would even accomplish anything in my life because I was poor. I was less than poor. As I had a chance to travel around the world, I found out that I was quite rich compared to some countries, including your own. Um, but that's, that's neither here nor there. But my, my mind over matter pieces of is the fact that I, I would tell myself I do not have to accept this circumstance. I do not have to accept the fact that we're poor, the fact that we're homeless. And when we went from being homeless to poor, it was a big step up, but it was still poor. And, uh, there was a lot of opportunity to get into trouble, and a lot of things that I could have done differently and a lot of people wanted me to, but I had my own mind, and my mind was way over the matter that that everybody else was thinking at the time. And what mattered to them was being in gangs and, and doing this and, um, just horrible things. And, uh, everybody wanted me because I was the big kid. And, uh, in my mind, it was just not something I was going to do. I had a plan, uh, to, to be something and to get out of that circumstance. And so I just kept working towards that. I didn't care what my circumstance was around me. I just kept working towards it. And then, uh, even to the point where when I graduated from high school, I had several scholarships to Major League, uh, to Ivy League schools. And, uh, I ultimately decided to go into the Air Force and, and go to Vietnam. And I remember guys thinking over there, well, it's, you know, we're probably dead. It's just we're not going to get back home. And they were just all consumed by this. And I'm saying to myself, look, guys, this is an experience. Take it that way. Learn what you can from it and move on. Don't dwell on this as being something negative. And so many people do. So my mind over matter was saying, this is something I've got to do for a short period of time, and then I'm going to be on to something else that I want to do. And it worked out quite well. I fortunately came home from Vietnam alive. And when I came home I found both my parents had passed. And so I had to take care of my brother and my youngest sister. And that was a complete mind change as well. And, uh, I, I didn't know how I was going to do it. And my grandfather stepped forward and said, I'm going to teach you principles and you can use those principles to make decisions. Okay, great. We did that for twenty five years. And that made made a big difference in who I am and how my mind works.
00:09:25 Sayan: Wow. I think that really changes everything about how we approach this phrase and also approach our own, uh, wellness as well. I think there's something in what you just said, uh, that I want to emphasize for a bit, uh, that idea about the mind being a partner to the body. Um, right. I think that is, that is what, um, I would like to carry forth in this conversation. So, uh, if, if you want to go a little beneath the surface, uh, because I think, um, most of the unhelpful mental patterns that people do carry, um, we're not really ever chosen by them. Right. Uh, they were really built by themselves or maybe even circumstances or the society often very young. So what are the deeper patterns underneath that shape, uh, which shapes someone's inner mental life? And why do they become so, so much more like so much more loud as life gets harder? So what do you really have to say?
00:10:33 DR Rawson: Well, the mind can be a tricky thing. It can it can run you down a path that you never expected. It can be. It can pick up something that you hadn't thought of in a long time and make it a dominant thing in your mind. And it's not. There's all kinds of things that mind tricks. I call them that, that your mind can do. But I think that how you train your mind, uh, you can overcome a lot of things. Um, I give you a small example. When I first started playing football, uh, I didn't know anything about the sport, but I was big. I was, uh, five foot eleven and two hundred and twenty five pounds at the ripe old age of twelve. And, uh, so the coach kept telling me, you can do this, you can do this. My body kept saying, no, you can't. You can't run around the track. You can't do this and you can't do that. And finally the coach said to me, he said, do you understand what potential is? I said, no, I don't really understand what it was, but what it is. And he said potential is what you could become if you want to become. But that means your mind has to be totally on board with what you want to accomplish. I said, that's interesting. I said, well, I want to be a better football player. And he said, then you need to pay attention more and you need to focus on that as opposed to being tired, uh, not wanting to practice, not wanting to run. You need to focus on actually playing the game. That made a lot of sense to me.
00:12:38 Sayan: Yeah. And I think, you know, it really boils down to how bad badly you want to achieve something, right? Um, because I, I think, I think, uh, most of the people who do big in life is because they really, really wanted to achieve that, uh, because there should be a certain drive apart from those kind of instant motivation that should really, uh, I mean, be the factor that even takes you far in life for, uh, for, uh, for listening to this and have stuck with us till this point here. Um, I want to ask you one question. So someone builds a healthier relationship with their mind, um, has a few months and then a stressful season hits and the looping thoughts again, uh, that come back after some time. So what do you say to that person so that they do not interpret it as proof that the work was, I mean, whatever the work that was done was a lie.
00:13:37 DR Rawson: Yeah. Okay. Well, I think it's kind of like the coach did for me. Uh, I have six children, and I have nineteen grandchildren and nine soon to be eleven great grandchildren. And, uh, I, I tell these children that you can be anything you want to be. And I often get pushback. That can't be, grandpa. That can't be. Because I don't know anything about this. And I, I don't know, and I can't do that. And I, the there's this problem and that problem and this problem and that problem. Um, if you allow yourself to see nothing but the problems, then you'll never grow. It's that simple. Yep. If, however, you look at things and say, well, what are the things that I can do and what are the things that I need to do. And you follow that course. Now, I can give you a real life example with me right now. In November of twenty four, I had my back operated on all the way from L2 to S1. They opened me up two inches wide. They fused all of my vertebrae and, uh, and essentially my back is as straight as an arrow, but they cut through all the muscles and everything. And so I spent, and I'm still spending right, right to this moment that we're talking, I'm still spending time trying to reteach myself to walk and to, uh, and to, uh, stand for a period of time, like ten minutes in the same spot. Uh, it's a challenge. It's a real challenge because they cut through all those muscles. But my mind says you have two opportunities, doctor. You can just fold. I mean, you're seventy nine, so nobody's going to say, gee, that's you know, you should just keep fighting or you can do what you think is best. And what I think is best is to get back to a state where I can contribute in my family. My wife doesn't have to spend all our time taking care of me, as she has for quite a while. She's not doing it now, but she was doing it up until just a few months ago. So. I have said to myself, this is my standard. This is what I want. And I'm. I'm just for forging ahead to that. And that gets me to where I want to go. So it it's mind over matter. And the matter is that I I've had dramatic surgery on my back and the, the mind portion is I don't care. I want to go back to what I was doing. And the only way I can do that is to keep forging ahead, not let it bother me. And so sometimes it hurts like crazy, but sometimes it doesn't. And I'll take the good with the bad and I just keep moving, moving forward. Now, let me give you a business reality of this. So I started an insurance company from scratch. We started with two people. It was a casualty insurance company and we were selling to other insurance companies, and we put a lot of money into that. But over five million dollars into getting the company started. And in fifteen months, we were profitable. In twenty months, we had taken the company past the billion dollar mark. And I was at a convention. And because we were the newest insurance company, we were giving fifteen minutes of fame to talk to the press. And so I got up and spoke to the press and I said, I just want to put the industry on, on notice that we've just crossed the billion dollar line. Thank you very much. Sit down. Well, all the all the major news outlets followed me around all day long. How could you possibly do that? These are impossible odds. Nobody starts an insurance company and and grows it that quick. That fast. Nobody does that. How did you do it? How did you do it? Well, we did it because literally everybody in the company, regardless of who they were, regardless of anything, we were focused on the goal of becoming not only profitable but successful. And that meant that we had to achieve something that was way north of a billion dollars. And we did. And I left the company and after, uh, time and, and, uh, a couple of months after I left, they sold the company. It's been sold ten times since. But we were all focused, laser focused on achieving the objective that we set for ourselves. It didn't matter that our bodies hurt, didn't matter that we had been up fourteen hours that day, worked seven days a week. Whatever it was, we were focused on accomplishment of that goal. That is the very, very definition of mind over matter.
00:19:50 Sayan: Love it. And, you know, it just shows that once you can identify what your goal is, and that's definitely step number one, like the what part of it and understanding the why part of it is also, I think, uh, enormously important. But, uh, I think it all comes down to the how part of it. The third and the last part of it. And that's where most of the people get stuck. But once you can get your head around the how part of it, that is when the actual magic starts to come in. So I think that was, uh, a real example. Like I, I loved it, uh, but I think that was also an honest note to wrap it up on as well. So folks, uh, for all of you who have stuck with us till this point, um, I would just like to say that I think, I think the hijack is not a failure of the work, right? It is, it is the moment. The work was always first. So I, I want you to take that with yourselves as we wrap this up. But, uh, for the people who actually resonated with what we just talked about, so what's the best place for them to find you and follow your work?
00:21:05 DR Rawson: Um, well, you're asking how people can find me if they want to know that some of the stories that, that built my resolve. Um, you can find a book on Amazon called unlikely. It's titled that because people said it was unlikely that I would ever accomplish anything. And so oops, they were kind of wrong Anyway.
00:21:27 Speaker 4: I wrote a book called.
00:21:29 DR Rawson: Unlikely and you can find that on Amazon. Um, you can go to a website called my c I c score dot com and get your own score on how much character, integrity and credibility you have and see if there's something you need to do with your mind to get past where you are. And that's a great opportunity to do that. We have a book coming out that's called C I, C, and, uh, it'll be out probably the end of June, and you can find more information on that on a website called CIC book and any of those or my personal website, which is my full name, Dr. Rawson dot com. You can go to that site as well. So I think that, uh, when it comes to mind over matter, you have to understand who's in control. And if you're in control of who you are and not just accepting other people's word, accepting other people's advice without your own thought input, if you can get yourself to a point where it's your thinking and you're taking input from others to think even better, you'll be in good shape. But that requires some thought, and you need to sit down and think about yourself. You know, let me tell you about an exercise I did one time. Um, I had, I had a severe life change and, uh, I spent twenty four hours by myself asking myself questions like, where do I want to live? What do I want to do for for a job? Uh, what? What kind of person do I want to be? What kind of person do I want to be to my children? What kind of person do I want to be to my soon to be ex-wife? Um, what? What kind of person do I want to be? And I made a lot of decisions that night. And the next morning I got up and just started to pursue them. I didn't let anything deter me. I just started to pursue them and became, again, very, very successful in what I was doing.
00:24:07 Sayan: Wow. That's, that's another really motivating, uh, Ross and thanks for sharing. Um, I would say the ultimate guidance to how you can make it as well. But, uh, that, that phrase, uh, mind over matter and how you interpret it perhaps would remain valuable for me and for the listeners who have stuck with us till this point. So I'll link the book, your personal website and your website in the show notes that they can reach out to. And, uh, the guide that you build for the listeners, I think that would really be helpful to understand, uh, where they might be and what would the roadmap next be? So, uh, Doctor Olson, I want to thank you for joining with me today on this podcast because I think, uh, one thing that we would be sitting with for, uh, a few minutes after this conversation would be that I think the hijack is the moment the work was always for, right? So I, I want to thank you for bringing such clarity and honesty into, into this conversation. So to everyone listening, folks, your mind is meant to be a companion and not a captor. So that's all, that's all from our end. While we see you on the next
