Why Beating the Market Is Hard and How Advisors Add Value

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Go!

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Ryan Nauman Market Strategist Zephyr:

Welcome everyone to Zephyr's Adjusted

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for Risk podcast from the shores of

Lake Tahoe I am Ryan Nauman the market

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strategist here at Zephyr Markets are

as e as efficient as ever which makes

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it hard to consistently beat the market

my next guest is an industry expert who

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has a very interesting investment thesis

in regards to beating the market which

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includes an asset class that can be

somewhat polarizing But first this episode

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is sponsored by the award-winning Zephyr

which helps investment professionals

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make more informed investment decisions

on behalf of their clients All right

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enough from me Let's go ahead and move

on to the star of the show I'd like to

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give a very warm welcome to Mike Willis

Mike is the CEO and co-founder of Cyber

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Hornet ETFs Mike thank you so much for

coming on the show It's an honor to

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have you I'm really excited about this

conversation and I think our audience is

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gonna learn a lot It's gonna be a good

one Where can you please tell us a little

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bit more about yourself in Cyber Hornet

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Mike Willis CEO & Co-Founder Cyber Hornet ETFs:

Sure.

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Thanks Ryan for letting me be here.

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I started out trading my way through

grad school, got my MBA in finance

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out at Cal Poly in California.

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Went to work initially for Smith Barney

Pain, Weber, UBS as a senior Vice

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President of investments at UBS before

I went independent, started my own RIA

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and then eventually my own Rick, which

is a registered investment company

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to enable mutual fund creation and.

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You know, along the way the goal

was always to beat the s and p 500.

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It was, you know, and, and

before that it was, you know, to

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find the holy grail of trading.

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I've been trading for 30 years and.

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I like to say I've been in Trad five

for 30 years in Defi for seven years.

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I became a Bitcoin seven years

ago, and I think it's a fun blend

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to have and, and that of course is

the the origin of the ETF company.

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But walking back a little bit, we.

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We set out to beat the market

and realized along the way that

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the market was already winning.

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And there are other ways that advisors

can create value for their, their

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clients that we think is even better

than just trading their portfolios.

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But the asset allocations obviously

play a big role in the performance.

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The quarterly reviews, the keeping

their, their clients on track with their.

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Their investment plans because

really that's, I think that's really

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the, the best thing you can do.

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Put the math in their favor with the, the

different asset allocations you're using,

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and then let compounding of interest and

just your, your discipline in keeping

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them focused on their, their investment

plan and not, not deviating from it,

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is I think how an advisor can bring

the most value to their, their clients.

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Ryan: Mike you're exactly correct We

focus here at Zephyr a lot about that

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Ryan Nauman Market Strategist Zephyr:

asset allocation and how important

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is studies show that 90 or 95 of the

variation in a portfolio's return

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depends on the asset allocation

right So it's very important

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Ryan: I love that you brought that

up Also let's go back to you your you

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and the creation of Cyber Hornet ETFs

What at what point when you had your

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own were you like All right let's

go ahead and I'm gonna create my own

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Rick now all right My own platform

for investment management and create

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Mike Willis: Yeah, that

was a fun evolution.

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What happened?

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I had my account minimum

was a million dollars.

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After I left the wirehouses, I only

took 37 clients with me so that you

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know, I could focus on them and.

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I, you know, I, I work in a, a white

collar world, but really live in a, in

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a blue collar world, my friends are blue

collar and they'd come up and say, Hey, I

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have 25,000, or I have $50,000 to invest.

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You know, what should I do?

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Can you help me?

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And it was kind of difficult, you know,

telling 'em they didn't meet my minimum

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and, and so I couldn't work with them.

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And so, as I.

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As I progressed, I realized it just

wasn't, my answers weren't setting

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well with me, and so I decided I really

wanted what I was doing to be available.

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The, the asset management I was doing

to be available to, you know, anyone

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on, on down to a thousand dollars.

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So.

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That was the, the origin of

going down the mutual fund path.

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And actually from a compliance

standpoint, there were some benefits

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because advisors know how much

compliance is now required to, to

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go from one mutual fund to the next.

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And there were some efficiencies for

being in a, in a, in a mutual fund.

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Where you could trade on the inside and,

and if you can get around the barriers

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of entry of prospectuses and SEC filings

and, you know, all the other things.

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It, it made it, it made, it made

it, we were able to offer our

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strategies to anyone, and that

was, that was initially the.

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The catalyst for going in that direction.

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But I can tell you that also in

2013, we, we were beating, we

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beat the s and p for seven years,

and then in 2013 we got buried.

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The s and p was up over 30%.

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We were up about half that for

our clients and really recognize

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that here, you know, we had.

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I'd invested, you know, thousands of

hours into our portfolios and here, you

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know, the cheap, one of the cheapest

products in the market beat us handily

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and then the next year as well.

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So we, we shifted at that point and

realized that we wanted to use the

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s and p 500 as the backbone and add

value to our clients in other areas,

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because that was where we could make

the most significant impact for them.

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And we went out, we found, we got the.

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Index ticker symbol, which

hadn't been picked up yet.

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We got the s and p 500 license so that we

could offer that to the public and then.

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The rest is kind of history.

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When crypto hit the market and we realized

that Wall Street was in transition to

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tokenization and, and decentralization and

blockchain and being a new asset class,

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we got excited about that and wanted

to incorporate that incorporated into

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the, you know, the champion of Tradify,

which we consider the s and p 500 index.

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We just felt like it needed a

crypto kicker to it to kind of

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bring it into the 21st century.

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And so we, we added that

25% kicker of crypto.

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But also on the flip side, we think

it's crazy to jump in a hundred

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percent into crypto because most people

can't handle that kind of volatility.

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Investors we found can handle about

30, down 30%, but, but south of that,

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they start really getting nervous and

burning up the advisor's phone calls.

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And, and down 50 it's, they're probably

out and down 60 might be a lawsuit.

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So we, we, we came up with the 75 25

blended strategy to give advisors a way

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to kind of buffer that volatility of the

new asset class and keep their, their

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clients in this crypto space for the

long term, which we think we're still

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early and there's a lot of upside left.

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Ryan: Yeah that's fantastic Mike And

we're gonna touch on a lot of that here

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shortly but you're exactly right Mark like

you said in 2013 for it's really hard to

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beat the markets whether especially now

with it being so highly concentrated if

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you're underweight those know for a while

to make seven names or mega tech or AI

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you're gonna underperform then you have

technology technologies making markets

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more efficient So it's really hard to

beat the market like you said even back

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then probably harder now So why do you

feel you just mentioned that one of

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your strategies was to add a kicker to

the S&P 500 being crypto being Bitcoin

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Why do you feel adding crypto to the

S&P 500 index gives investors the best

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opportunity to beat the market number

one And number two how surprised were you

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that the index ticker was still available

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Mike Willis: Yeah, I.

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I wanna hit that one first.

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So when I phoned, I phoned in and,

and asked the NASDAQ for INDE.

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And of course, all all

mutual funds end in X.

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And so I asked if it was

available and they said yes.

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And I said, okay, I'd like to reserve it.

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And I, I think I, I think I.

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I, I think I, I led on that it was, I

was amazed that it was still available

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and the person at the other end was

like, you know, what does it even mean?

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Why would this be important?

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And you know, we only have $10

trillion in the index fund space

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and spend the hottest, you know,

the fastest growing space on Wall

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Street for probably 25 years.

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So, of course it was exciting to be to

have that ticker symbol still there.

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And, you know, the, the, the

tradify companies of, you know,

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Vanguard wanted their tickets to

start with V and, and on and on.

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Infidelity F of course.

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So they kind of got caught up in

that, I think, and they didn't

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realize, you know, like an ETF.

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I think those companies realized early

on that ticker symbols were important,

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but from a mutual fund standpoint, I

think they just didn't think it was.

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And I think that's where the, the

opportunity was for us to jump on it.

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And at some point here.

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The rest of our products are ETFs,

but the one, our index s and p

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500 portfolio is a mutual fund.

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And when, at some point in the future

when there's five letter tickers

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available in the ETF space, we'll, we,

we might consider converting that at that

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point, but, so we were super excited.

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I remember telling my dad at

the time, I said, Hey, we just

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made a million dollars today.

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And he goes, what happened?

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Tell me what happened.

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Oh, no, he was in my car.

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I actually came outta, I

FedExed it to the nasdaq.

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Our payment for it.

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And I got back in the car and I go,

well, that FedEx worth a million dollars.

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And he goes, what was it?

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And so I told him, and so yeah, I think,

and, and to, to a vanguard, I mean,

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it's worth a hundred million dollars.

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I mean, just think if they slapped

that ticker on their total stock

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market index fund that has $1.7

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trillion in its V-F-I-A-I-X or some,

some ticker, nobody's gonna remember.

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They put I-N-D-E-X on that and they

start, they, they brand it as, you know,

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index, having being a household name,

you know, you're now available in one,

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easy to remember, ticker introducing

index, your favorite index fund in one.

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Easy to remember particular.

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So I, I mean, I, to us we're

small, so it's not, of course

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not worth that much yet.

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But I can tell you this,

when advisors find out.

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That we have the index ticker symbol.

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They always go crazy.

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And we have, you know, index hats that

we give out to, to certain advisors

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and, and they just, they love 'em.

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So,

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Ryan: I

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Mike Willis: what was

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the, the the second question, or it

was, your first question was what?

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Ryan: No and that's perfect Mike because

I have a lot of guests on ETF providers

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on that are And they talk about how

hard it is to create a ticker And they

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realize like how important it is So it

just when I heard that's a ticker for

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your mutual fund it's that's fantastic

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Mike Willis: so important.

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It's, I mean, I've been a collector

all my life of art and different

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things, and so ticker symbols

are kind of just right up there.

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You know, if you go out to Dubai

and, and Bahrain they, ticker symbols

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are really important out there.

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In fact, like licenses on.

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Cars the one, one sold for, you

know, millions of dollars just

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because they, they really value the,

you know, the license plate and,

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and, and essentially what's on it.

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And of course, it's like ai.com

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just sold for $70 million.

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There's.

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There's literally tickers going, I call

them tickers, but they're just, you

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know, letters on license plates selling

for millions of dollars in Dubai, and

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I see it no different on Wall Street.

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You know, sticky tickers make

a difference in marketing.

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And one of the things we were able to get

with our 75 25 platform, we got triple B.

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For Bitcoin, triple E for Ethereum,

triple S for Solana and Triple X for XRP.

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So it's really easy to remember.

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And and they're all 75 25,

so they're built on a 75%

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foundation in the s and p 500.

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And then we have that crypto component

at 25% that we rebalance monthly.

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Ryan: Yeah Awesome Mike We should

probably I should probably should get

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us back on track talking about your the

strategy and beating the market but I

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love just these stories about creating

a company the tickers and what goes into

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it It's a lot of fun So going back to the

first question you just mentioned that

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at first it was very hard to beat the

market 2013 2014 you struggled beating

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the market harder now maybe than ever

to beat the market You realize that

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adding crypto and in your case 25 to

the S&P 500 gives you that kicker that

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extra juice to potentially beating the

market So why do you feel adding crypto

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to the S&P 500 500 gives investors that

best opportunity to beat the market

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versus maybe using options to produce

income or other vehicles why crypto

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Mike Willis: Yeah, I think there's a

lot of different ways you can a lot of

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different strategies you can implement

that are creative and and smart In our

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world, what we're looking at here is.

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We don't like to use leverage.

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We like to just own the position outright.

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So that, that eliminates

derivatives from our pool.

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So we're looking at, okay, what,

what, what's the grand champion of all

222

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indexes on, on the trad five world?

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Well, we think that's the s and p 500.

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Then from a crypto standpoint.

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There's, there's hundreds of thousands of

tokens actually out there on the market,

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so we only start paying attention to them

when the public has, when the investors

227

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have pushed them up into the top 10.

228

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And that's when we start to pay attention

to the crypto positions that we think.

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Our shareholders should

also pay attention to.

230

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And right at the top, of course, the grand

champion in the digital space is Bitcoin.

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And then you have Ethereum, Solana,

XRP, sers, and there's some others.

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So what we, we think blockchain

is here to stay, and we think that

233

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was proven over what we think.

234

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We call the the three waves of Bitcoin,

and the first wave into Bitcoin was

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that unregulated wave that was paved

by the pioneers and early adopters.

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And they went out and kicked, scratched,

and fought their way into the most

237

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crazy different, you know, digital

wallets with public and private keys

238

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on unregulated exchanges opening these

accounts, having nobody to call if they

239

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accidentally send it to the wrong place.

240

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But these were the pioneers

that that got Bitcoin early on.

241

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And then your second about a trillion

dollars came in over a 15 year period.

242

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Then two years ago, the SEC.

243

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Made Bitcoin legal in a

regulated exchange in your, your

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brokerage account through ETFs.

245

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And so that we, we call that the

second wave of, of into Bitcoin.

246

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And that, you know, set all records

with, with new asset classes for ETFs.

247

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And then the third wave is what

we're in now, and we think that's

248

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the, the institutional wave.

249

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And specifically to this call, the,

the 300,000 plus financial advisors

250

00:16:31,362 --> 00:16:35,532

who are gatekeepers to $30 trillion

in assets really haven't started.

251

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Recommending crypto yet.

252

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So when people say we miss Bitcoin,

we're late, we, we disagree,

253

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we think we're still early.

254

00:16:43,112 --> 00:16:46,952

Most advisors have no idea what the

difference between Bitcoin, Ethereum,

255

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Solana, XRPR, and those are the top

four cryptocurrencies on the market.

256

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So, you know, we're not late,

you know, we're way early here.

257

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And so our goal is to, we don't think

advisors need to become experts in crypto

258

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to incorporate it in their portfolios.

259

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The, the statistics are showing

20 to 30% of their clients

260

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are buying crypto around them.

261

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So this gives them a way to satisfy

that crypto demand, keep the assets

262

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in-house, and protect your, your

fiduciary risk by buffering it

263

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with a 75% s and p 500 foundation.

264

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Ryan: Yeah Mike that's fantastic A couple

of things that I was late to get into

265

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crypto I did I had a bunch of guests on

talking about Bitcoin really for the first

266

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few years I didn't really understand it

I'm not gonna invest in something I didn't

267

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understand Then I kept doing more research

It was like the impacts at Bitcoin and

268

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I specifically just used Bitcoin has on

the efficient frontier on the efficient

269

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frontier every one of those portfolios

100 portfolios had some slice of Bitcoin

270

00:17:55,074 --> 00:18:01,044

in it whether it's the most conservative

to the most aggressive it just opened my

271

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eyes yeah there's more benefits to it than

just price appreciation When you put it

272

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into a client portfolio or an investment

portfolio diversification increases that

273

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diversification which is so important

too going back to asset allocation that

274

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we talked about earlier So there's that

part And then now let's talk a little bit

275

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about the performance my crypto winners

upon us Bitcoin's down what as we're

276

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talking now 13 this year down nearly

40 from its high What's been the cause

277

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of this crypto winter and this pullback

278

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Mike Willis: Yeah, I would go, the

first thing I would say is this.

279

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I started tracking Bitcoin was at a buck.

280

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I had three screens up.

281

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I've always been at stock traders,

so it, I was curious about this new

282

00:18:51,166 --> 00:18:53,806

cryptocurrency and so I watched it.

283

00:18:53,806 --> 00:18:56,176

I, I watched it go from

one to a hundred back down.

284

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I watched it go up to 300 and back

down up to a thousand and back down.

285

00:18:59,976 --> 00:19:04,206

And when it finally hit about 7,000,

I decided to do some my due diligence

286

00:19:04,206 --> 00:19:08,196

on it, because up until then, when my

clients ask about it, I said, well.

287

00:19:08,661 --> 00:19:11,901

If a coder can create it, then

another coder can counterfeit it.

288

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So I'm just not interested.

289

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And that kept me away.

290

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But once I did the deep dive and I had

committed a hundred hours to that deep

291

00:19:20,331 --> 00:19:25,881

dive, and I was only, I probably 15 hours

in, and I, I, I was just, I couldn't

292

00:19:25,881 --> 00:19:27,681

believe, I didn't look at it sooner.

293

00:19:27,681 --> 00:19:31,221

Because once you understand the

cryptography and some of the

294

00:19:31,221 --> 00:19:35,301

core principles of it, it, it's

mind blowing and you'll see why.

295

00:19:35,706 --> 00:19:39,906

Why crypto heads get so excited about

it and why, you know, it even gets

296

00:19:39,906 --> 00:19:41,796

religious to a lot of those guys.

297

00:19:42,096 --> 00:19:47,496

But I will say this, the new the new

wave of people coming into Bitcoin

298

00:19:47,496 --> 00:19:50,526

really don't understand the, the

original core principles of it.

299

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The scarce digital asset.

300

00:19:52,386 --> 00:19:53,736

It's a, it's a bear asset.

301

00:19:53,736 --> 00:19:56,586

You can own no trusted third parties.

302

00:19:57,096 --> 00:19:58,176

It's peer to peer.

303

00:19:58,176 --> 00:20:01,626

I can, I can actually send you a thousand

dollars without it touching a bank.

304

00:20:01,956 --> 00:20:02,406

So.

305

00:20:03,171 --> 00:20:05,361

And there's many more of

these, these principles.

306

00:20:05,361 --> 00:20:10,091

You know, it's, it's the monetary

policy is regulated by code, not

307

00:20:10,091 --> 00:20:13,421

by people, you know, changing their

minds or the fed, which we have

308

00:20:13,421 --> 00:20:15,371

no idea who they actually are.

309

00:20:15,821 --> 00:20:20,641

And so there's, there's great reasons

to own crypto in your portfolio.

310

00:20:20,641 --> 00:20:23,491

I think however, the

newbies coming in are.

311

00:20:23,591 --> 00:20:27,281

They don't understand the core

principles, but they understand it

312

00:20:27,281 --> 00:20:30,311

more as a new technology and they're

treating it like a tech stock.

313

00:20:30,311 --> 00:20:35,441

So it does trade the, the new the

new volume coming into Bitcoin

314

00:20:35,441 --> 00:20:36,911

over the last several years.

315

00:20:37,091 --> 00:20:42,971

Very different from the first wave

of Bitcoin in terms of behavior

316

00:20:42,971 --> 00:20:44,351

and reasons for coming in.

317

00:20:44,921 --> 00:20:46,901

With that said, I'll,

I'll tell you a story.

318

00:20:46,901 --> 00:20:48,971

We were hiring people recently.

319

00:20:49,811 --> 00:20:54,551

One of the people we hired bought

Bitcoin actually at a penny, and

320

00:20:54,611 --> 00:20:59,321

they sold it at a dollar because they

thought the US government would shut

321

00:20:59,321 --> 00:21:02,771

it down when it got to a dollar 'cause

it would compete with the US dollar.

322

00:21:03,131 --> 00:21:04,571

So obviously that didn't happen.

323

00:21:04,691 --> 00:21:08,771

We have another person in the

office, our CTO bought it at a buck.

324

00:21:09,791 --> 00:21:11,261

Sold it at a hundred dollars.

325

00:21:11,261 --> 00:21:13,721

'cause that was a nice, you know,

they went, that's pretty good.

326

00:21:13,721 --> 00:21:14,801

That's a good return.

327

00:21:15,191 --> 00:21:19,781

So I think when Bitcoin hit a

hundred thousand dollars here.

328

00:21:20,336 --> 00:21:22,256

I think that's another

one of those numbers.

329

00:21:22,256 --> 00:21:25,916

And when it didn't hold, I mean it went

up to 1 26 and then it came back down and

330

00:21:25,916 --> 00:21:30,296

I think people got scared when it, and

when it breached under a hundred thousand

331

00:21:30,296 --> 00:21:31,316

and they were like, you know what?

332

00:21:31,676 --> 00:21:33,446

We've had a nice little run here.

333

00:21:33,656 --> 00:21:36,046

It looks like you know, this might be it.

334

00:21:36,616 --> 00:21:42,596

And so they sold out of it, but what's

also happening at the same time here.

335

00:21:43,346 --> 00:21:46,436

The technicals I think,

are important to bring up.

336

00:21:46,466 --> 00:21:51,386

And if you look at the crypto winter of

2022, and I was gonna pull up a chart for

337

00:21:51,386 --> 00:21:55,316

you, but we just didn't we just didn't

get it together for you in time, but.

338

00:21:56,186 --> 00:22:01,406

The, the head and shoulders pattern is

almost identical to the crypto winter that

339

00:22:01,406 --> 00:22:04,116

we had a couple years ago, four years ago.

340

00:22:04,116 --> 00:22:07,596

And so we're tracking it almost verbatim.

341

00:22:07,596 --> 00:22:10,836

And so from a technical standpoint,

we could churn for a while here.

342

00:22:10,836 --> 00:22:13,766

But what's coming when I

say for a while, you know.

343

00:22:14,461 --> 00:22:15,601

Three to nine months.

344

00:22:15,971 --> 00:22:19,311

But it is a sharper version of 2022.

345

00:22:19,311 --> 00:22:22,941

So it's very possible we're gonna get

a V recovery since it's been more of a

346

00:22:22,941 --> 00:22:25,801

V-shape and not a U-shape crypto winter.

347

00:22:26,071 --> 00:22:27,571

So we'll just have to wait and see.

348

00:22:27,961 --> 00:22:31,051

But I will say this, so technically

we could go down, breach the

349

00:22:31,051 --> 00:22:35,761

$50,000 level, even though we're

up about 30% off the bottom here.

350

00:22:36,181 --> 00:22:38,461

The recent bottom, the.

351

00:22:39,166 --> 00:22:45,076

The possibility of going back, taking

out the 50,000 stops and then, and

352

00:22:45,076 --> 00:22:48,676

then resuming the rally is very

possible from a technical standpoint.

353

00:22:49,006 --> 00:22:53,416

Fundamentally speaking though,

this, there's only 21 million coins.

354

00:22:53,446 --> 00:22:55,456

We've already mined 20 million of 'em.

355

00:22:55,456 --> 00:22:59,446

That threshold was hit about a month

ago, so there's like a million coins left

356

00:22:59,866 --> 00:23:04,146

and at some point when the music stops,

we all know how musical chairs works.

357

00:23:04,731 --> 00:23:07,001

And there's only so many chairs.

358

00:23:07,421 --> 00:23:12,551

So that's why investors who really

understand crypto and realize,

359

00:23:12,551 --> 00:23:16,421

look, this is not only a scarce,

this is, this is digital gold.

360

00:23:16,901 --> 00:23:18,461

It's a scarce digital asset.

361

00:23:18,461 --> 00:23:21,551

It, you can trans, I mean,

I've carried gold and silver.

362

00:23:21,551 --> 00:23:23,171

I've been a gold bug and a silver bug.

363

00:23:23,171 --> 00:23:25,751

And I can tell you it's difficult

to move around the world.

364

00:23:26,351 --> 00:23:29,891

And it's much easier to move a

Bitcoin than it is a bar of gold.

365

00:23:30,011 --> 00:23:31,241

I can tell you that much.

366

00:23:32,688 --> 00:23:38,098

Ryan: Yeah The the carry cost is a

lot cheaper for Bitcoin right so it's

367

00:23:38,098 --> 00:23:42,388

interesting that you brought up more

of the technical point of it cyclo like

368

00:23:42,388 --> 00:23:47,638

you said broke 100,000 120 and a very

good point that you made that maybe

369

00:23:47,638 --> 00:23:52,108

people are like All right let's take

some profits off the table and who knows

370

00:23:52,108 --> 00:23:56,878

what's next great point Mike So what

will take it to end do you think You

371

00:23:56,878 --> 00:24:03,238

said maybe it could breach 50 would that

be a point on the technical side or is

372

00:24:03,238 --> 00:24:08,476

there something more fundamental that

you think could end this crypto winner

373

00:24:09,426 --> 00:24:12,006

Mike Willis: Well, I think just

in the last month you've seen

374

00:24:12,006 --> 00:24:13,896

a lot of AI hacks in crypto.

375

00:24:13,896 --> 00:24:16,966

And so I think that stalled things

with Bitcoin jumped off the,

376

00:24:17,206 --> 00:24:19,246

the, the, the recent bottom here.

377

00:24:19,706 --> 00:24:23,936

It looks like it's off and running and it

very well could be 'cause the fundamentals

378

00:24:23,966 --> 00:24:27,656

are only getting stronger and stronger

when you have a scarce digital asset

379

00:24:27,656 --> 00:24:29,846

where you can't print more of them.

380

00:24:30,476 --> 00:24:34,916

You know, there's a reason, one of the

big reasons that, that Bitcoiners came

381

00:24:34,916 --> 00:24:37,106

about is they felt like the US dollar.

382

00:24:37,616 --> 00:24:42,476

Was because there is no limit to

how many dollars can be produced and

383

00:24:42,476 --> 00:24:44,066

they're no longer backed by gold.

384

00:24:44,726 --> 00:24:50,966

What we saw happen during COVID with

$10 trillion being printed, you know,

385

00:24:50,966 --> 00:24:53,216

burgers went from eight bucks to 20 bucks.

386

00:24:53,276 --> 00:24:58,016

And that's a problem because if you

saved, saved up your whole life and

387

00:24:58,016 --> 00:24:59,666

you had a million dollars in the bank.

388

00:25:00,266 --> 00:25:05,756

It's now 75, you know,

$750,000, you lost 25% minimum.

389

00:25:06,206 --> 00:25:10,226

And some people would say you lost a

lot more than that in purchasing power.

390

00:25:10,526 --> 00:25:15,506

So, Bitcoiners, the, the

neat thing about Bitcoin is.

391

00:25:16,211 --> 00:25:21,431

At the minimum, it's a competition to the,

the monopoly on money the, the governments

392

00:25:21,431 --> 00:25:24,081

have had for at least recent memory.

393

00:25:24,471 --> 00:25:29,931

And so at a minimum, it should help

create a more efficient and competitive

394

00:25:29,931 --> 00:25:36,991

monetary system at a maximum if all

fiat currencies throughout history

395

00:25:37,021 --> 00:25:38,701

have always, once they've gone off.

396

00:25:39,061 --> 00:25:41,281

The gold standard or

whatever was backing them.

397

00:25:41,431 --> 00:25:42,931

They've all gone to zero at some point.

398

00:25:43,261 --> 00:25:46,771

So we all talk about the great

reset, what does that look like?

399

00:25:47,061 --> 00:25:50,961

And so Bitcoin is a hedge against the

financial, current financial system

400

00:25:50,961 --> 00:25:55,531

failing, even though now it trades

like a, a tech stock at some point.

401

00:25:55,921 --> 00:26:01,051

When the core principles are understood

by the masses, it will bifurcate and

402

00:26:01,051 --> 00:26:05,721

it will not trade in, in correlation

with the stock markets, in my opinion.

403

00:26:05,871 --> 00:26:10,251

But the reason it is now is you just have

such a huge wave of people that own it.

404

00:26:10,911 --> 00:26:14,061

For other reasons, you know, not,

not for the original core reasons.

405

00:26:14,241 --> 00:26:15,951

So what would cause it to rebound?

406

00:26:16,371 --> 00:26:19,911

I think clarity in the,

the regulatory environment.

407

00:26:20,031 --> 00:26:23,721

You know, there's some, there's some

bills on Capitol Hill that could bring

408

00:26:23,721 --> 00:26:27,371

clarity that would allow institutions.

409

00:26:27,791 --> 00:26:32,831

And compliance, the compliance within

these institutions to allow people

410

00:26:32,901 --> 00:26:37,401

within the organization to, to bring

it into certain portfolios that

411

00:26:37,401 --> 00:26:38,931

right now it can't be allowed in.

412

00:26:39,411 --> 00:26:42,621

And that's happening on a, a

weekly, monthly basis every month.

413

00:26:43,331 --> 00:26:47,111

There's somebody, some new announcement

about a new bank or a new brokerage

414

00:26:47,111 --> 00:26:51,461

house that is allowing their, their

brokers or clients to own crypto.

415

00:26:51,731 --> 00:26:54,071

So the fundamentals keep getting better.

416

00:26:54,161 --> 00:26:56,621

The technicals are what they are.

417

00:26:56,621 --> 00:27:01,061

You know, this is part of a new

technology Every four years, crypto goes

418

00:27:01,061 --> 00:27:05,841

through these at least up until now,

these massive crypto, crypto winters.

419

00:27:06,171 --> 00:27:11,311

But when you go back over the last,

you know, two since inception.

420

00:27:11,506 --> 00:27:15,766

And certainly the last 10 years

crypto at least Bitcoin's been

421

00:27:15,766 --> 00:27:19,936

the, the best performing asset

class, I think across all markets.

422

00:27:21,628 --> 00:27:21,898

Ryan: Yeah

423

00:27:22,366 --> 00:27:23,686

Mike Willis: Yeah, very

good stuff there, Mike.

424

00:27:23,776 --> 00:27:28,186

So you mentioned earlier

about the adoption.

425

00:27:28,976 --> 00:27:29,126

And,

426

00:27:29,126 --> 00:27:29,486

you know

427

00:27:29,546 --> 00:27:34,736

retail, investor institutions,

retail financial advisors, investors.

428

00:27:35,396 --> 00:27:40,826

Do you feel that financial advisors in the

retail investor space has fully adopted

429

00:27:40,826 --> 00:27:43,646

or accepted crypto as an asset class?

430

00:27:43,796 --> 00:27:44,996

Came an asset class

431

00:27:45,098 --> 00:27:46,148

Over a year ago.

432

00:27:46,268 --> 00:27:48,608

Do you think they fully

accepting crypto yet or no?

433

00:27:49,658 --> 00:27:51,188

Retail, yes.

434

00:27:52,163 --> 00:27:54,293

Advisors, definitely not.

435

00:27:54,293 --> 00:27:59,573

We're finding maybe 5% of advisors are

incorporating into their portfolio so far.

436

00:27:59,573 --> 00:28:01,583

So 95% are not.

437

00:28:02,273 --> 00:28:06,523

And that's exciting to us because,

you know, advisors are gatekeepers

438

00:28:06,523 --> 00:28:08,053

to 30 trillion in assets.

439

00:28:08,053 --> 00:28:12,283

So that's gonna unlock at

some point because, you know.

440

00:28:12,838 --> 00:28:18,558

BlackRock was against Bitcoin for,

you know, over 10 years before and,

441

00:28:18,558 --> 00:28:22,818

and, and adamantly and so were some

of the other large institutions.

442

00:28:22,998 --> 00:28:24,378

I think Goldman Sachs.

443

00:28:24,783 --> 00:28:28,293

You know, called it Tulip Mania, you

know, and now they just announced a

444

00:28:28,293 --> 00:28:31,983

month ago that they're, they're coming

out with their own Bitcoin, ETF.

445

00:28:32,283 --> 00:28:36,903

So we're going through that, that

normal cycle that new technologies go

446

00:28:36,903 --> 00:28:41,403

through, where you throw mud at them

to begin with, or fud or say, you know,

447

00:28:41,403 --> 00:28:44,733

if you remember what the internet,

oh, that's just for pornography

448

00:28:44,733 --> 00:28:45,903

and you know, all this other stuff.

449

00:28:45,903 --> 00:28:48,843

And then we found out there

was a lot, a lot of cool things

450

00:28:48,843 --> 00:28:49,923

you could do with the internet.

451

00:28:49,923 --> 00:28:51,633

And it wasn't just criminal activities.

452

00:28:51,813 --> 00:28:53,043

Same thing with, with.

453

00:28:53,328 --> 00:28:57,378

Cryptocurrencies that, you know, initially

they just said it's criminal activities,

454

00:28:57,798 --> 00:29:01,608

but turns out there's a lot of cool

things you can do with cryptocurrency

455

00:29:01,608 --> 00:29:04,138

that goes way beyond some of that stuff.

456

00:29:04,258 --> 00:29:07,198

And now that the institutions are

adopting it, the advisors have

457

00:29:07,198 --> 00:29:11,008

to look at it and they all, they

will in our opinion, because when

458

00:29:11,008 --> 00:29:15,148

BlackRock says it's an asset class,

fidelity says it's an AC asset class.

459

00:29:15,148 --> 00:29:16,678

Goldman says it's an asset class.

460

00:29:16,678 --> 00:29:20,128

Morgan Stanley just announced they're

coming out with their own Bitcoin, ETF.

461

00:29:20,638 --> 00:29:21,358

These are.

462

00:29:21,553 --> 00:29:22,483

This is it.

463

00:29:22,483 --> 00:29:28,723

It will, it will permeate into the advisor

space and that $30 trillion will unlock.

464

00:29:28,723 --> 00:29:30,853

And that's another reason

we think we're still early.

465

00:29:32,490 --> 00:29:37,680

Ryan: Awesome Mike Fantastic Thank you

so much for coming on It's an honor to

466

00:29:37,680 --> 00:29:42,600

have you on really fun conversation I

learned a lot a lot of stuff to unpack

467

00:29:42,600 --> 00:29:46,670

here I'm probably gonna go back and watch

this a couple different times to fully

468

00:29:46,670 --> 00:29:51,500

get it all So thank you so much Mike

for coming on the show and sharing such

469

00:29:51,500 --> 00:29:57,509

great insight Where can our audience get

more information about CyberHornet ETFs

470

00:29:58,003 --> 00:29:59,713

Mike Willis: Cyber Hornet etfs.com

471

00:29:59,713 --> 00:30:00,613

is our website.

472

00:30:00,613 --> 00:30:01,003

Ryan: Awesome

473

00:30:01,006 --> 00:30:02,246

Mike Willis: Mike, thank you so much.

474

00:30:02,263 --> 00:30:05,443

Ryan: much I'll include those

links in the show notes as well

475

00:30:05,621 --> 00:30:06,761

Mike Willis: So everyone can,

476

00:30:06,913 --> 00:30:07,153

Ryan: get

477

00:30:07,211 --> 00:30:08,081

Mike Willis: access to those.

478

00:30:08,083 --> 00:30:08,953

Ryan: resources

479

00:30:09,521 --> 00:30:10,256

Mike Willis: Thank you everyone.

480

00:30:10,393 --> 00:30:14,743

Ryan: listening to this episode of

Zephyr's Adjusted for Risk Podcast You

481

00:30:14,743 --> 00:30:19,423

can watch all of our other podcasts

on the Zephyr YouTube channel as well

482

00:30:19,423 --> 00:30:24,223

as on Spotify and wherever else you

get your podcasts Thank you very much

483

00:30:24,223 --> 00:30:25,693

and have a great rest of your week

484

00:30:25,986 --> 00:30:26,556

Mike Willis: Thank you, Ryan.

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