Have you ever wondered what it takes to become a US Navy SEAL? Success is far more than physical strength and pedigree; It’s a mindset. JJ Parma presents "the Parma Theory”. Listen to discover this philosophy of winning at life.

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Host

You're listening to the No Gray Areas podcast with Patrick McCullough. We welcome back JJ Palmer, a 21 year U.S. Navy SEAL veteran. By sharing his stories, JJ explains what it takes to be a U.S. Navy SEAL. Let's dove in.

Patrick McCalla

JJ Parma, welcome back. So you were one of the first guests on our No Gray Areas podcast. And by popular demand, you're back. It was one of the most listen to podcasts that we've had so far. But let me let's just catch the audience up, because some of them may not know whether they maybe didn't watch that

Patrick McCalla

. I think it was episode three and four that you were on. But you grew up where?

JJ Parma

Inner city kid.

Patrick McCalla

You're an inner city kid in Massachusetts.

JJ Parma

Okay. City, which is where we covered that.

Patrick McCalla

Yeah. Yeah. And you played hockey because you went on and played hockey in college, right?

JJ Parma

I would hardly call it played dressed, walked on and then left. And so but ended up playing at a Division three college and now is a Division one college. Yeah. All that stuff. Yeah.

Patrick McCalla

But after that, then you graduate and then you decide you want to become a Navy SEAL, which is where you spent the next 21 years as a Navy SEAL. Right. So what what was it? Review that really quickly.

Patrick McCalla

What was it that made you want to be a Navy SEAL? Because you you weren't some some boys grow up and they hear about this and like that's what they wanted to be their whole life. You didn't even know what a Navy SEAL was up until you saw some poster.

JJ Parma

To back it. You know, back then. All myth, lore, rumor. Yeah. I mean, there was no there's no internet, right? Netscape was the browser. Netscape, like, I remember going on a computer and not being able to that the screen wouldn't even load.

JJ Parma

Remember typing in my junior college or whatever Navy SEALs and getting like half a picture and then the 56 K would you you just leave that library right in one of the two computers that are there. But the story goes back to my, my youth and I can remember whether we discussed this last year.

JJ Parma

I'm sure we did because pretty significant point. My my father was a Vietnam vet, passed away last year, but he was he was did two tours in Vietnam and first air Cav Army.

Patrick McCalla

And did he talk much about this?

JJ Parma

We didn't talk about it. Okay. In the more he didn't talk about it, the more fascinated I became. Yeah. Yeah. I had every book as a kid from the Vietnam War. I had every story, every collection, every Time magazine book that was produced with the photos and the V.C. and the Americans.

JJ Parma

And just. I was fascinated with the whole thing. Yeah. And as a kid that played, you know, I was the Army guy, I went to the surplus store, bought all the stuff. I had all the jackets. Yeah, like the stuff my some of my relatives had served, my grandfather served, my uncle served.

JJ Parma

And I would collect all, all that gear and we'd play as kids hours on end, you know.

Patrick McCalla

So you were as a child, you were fascinated with the whole military thing?

JJ Parma

Yeah, fascinated.

Patrick McCalla

Wanted to see a lot of it because your dad served and he wouldn't talk about it.

JJ Parma

Right. I think that's where a lot of that generated and a comes from.

Patrick McCalla

So then what what connected with the Navy SEALs for you then.

JJ Parma

So that's that story goes this goes into the into the future so the hockey pieces is significant sports piece is significant. I played football in college, but as I got older, I got pretty proficient at the sport of hockey.

JJ Parma

I loved it. It was it was a good distraction for me. My that military calling, so to speak, kind of. Took a back seat for a long time, and I'd even realized that it just kind of went on ice for a little while.

Patrick McCalla

Yeah, right. Because you were so focused on.

JJ Parma

Focused.

Patrick McCalla

Like how you were.

JJ Parma

Pretty good.

Patrick McCalla

You went on ice. That was.

JJ Parma

Yeah, that was. No pun intended. Pun intended. Yeah. Really. But as I put that dormant for a little while, unintentionally got it pretty decent and ended up going to private high school with the BCI or my BCI Patriots.

JJ Parma

I listen to this. We hear the story. I guess you can hear them in the background. Oh, yeah. We had a pretty good hockey team, Catholic Conference, one of the most competitive hockey leagues at the time, and it still is in the Northeast.

JJ Parma

And so, you know, you had a pretty significant chance of going somewhere to play some hockey. Yeah, right. All over all of the northeast, Canada, wherever. The funny, funny story. I don't know if I told you I was recruited by West Point.

JJ Parma

They only there's only two Division one hockey teams in the academy and Air Force and you.

Patrick McCalla

Almost ended up being an Army guy.

JJ Parma

How funny. With that story I often think about like you think God doesn't, doesn't play a hand in these things. Yeah. Often think about one little, one little change along the route.

Patrick McCalla

Would have changed the whole trajectory of your life.

JJ Parma

Everybody can sit back and figure it out for sure. How many times? Yeah, if you put it.

Patrick McCalla

It's a whole nother podcast right there.

JJ Parma

If you drew a line, I like draw a pictogram. Yeah. In every time there was a major decision how different your life would have been. It's interesting. I get fascinated with that. Yeah, I really do. No, that's true.

JJ Parma

Anyway, so. Yeah, good talk. You know, when did my thing and split my time between two different universities? Graduated with a business degree. And had a job in New York City. The bank ready to go. Suit and tie.

Patrick McCalla

So there wasn't any thought except there.

JJ Parma

Wasn't ready to.

Patrick McCalla

Go. What a perfect place to use my business degree. The Navy SEAL. Yeah, I'm seeing the connection.

JJ Parma

I'm seeing the connection. I'm telling you that that dormant piece of I just call it hidden patriotism or dormant patriotism flooded back. In May of 90 souls.

Patrick McCalla

All those years growing up when you were playing Army just flooded back.

JJ Parma

The thought of going into the civilian world, just going into an office every day. I had a breakdown in a way like, let me explore this a little more. So I walked into a recruiter's office. I literally was a recruiter, like, oh, great.

JJ Parma

Yeah, had a degree, didn't really care. It didn't really do any any background history on Oh, how do you become an officer? Oh, how do you do that? Nope. I walked into recruiters office in Connecticut. Two guys are sitting there, this little guy said, and there was a poster on the wall and said, U.S. Navy SEALs.

JJ Parma

Well, I literally it just one of those recruiting days. Yeah. And I said I want to be one of those guys. True story. It's significant because these two guys ended up coming to my buddy's graduation in. Did they really?

JJ Parma

Connecticut? Yeah. Long story. Yeah. Posters on the wall. I said, I want to do that. They said, You're crazy, okay? But you should be an officer because you just graduated college and you qualify on your scores for nuke and pilot.

JJ Parma

And I said, and everything was just toned out.

Patrick McCalla

I said, I'm going to have an opportunity to go right into like officer training.

JJ Parma

Well, that's the thing. That's their pitch. I didn't even hear that. I didn't even get a pitch. Yeah, of course.

Patrick McCalla

Because of a poster on a wall.

JJ Parma

Poster on the wall.

Patrick McCalla

Once again, the trajectory of your life could be so much different, right?

JJ Parma

The team guys, it was if every team guys was going to love this story because it was all like it was all rumor. Yeah, lore fiction. You can't separate fact. Nobody knew anything about the program. There was no Internet.

JJ Parma

We couldn't. I couldn't go get the scores. You know what it takes for Pete? There were printouts somewhere. The guys at the recruiting office had one. Here's the minimum requirements to be a SEAL. Here's the Navy's requirements. Here's some requirements.

JJ Parma

I remember talking to people after I made the decision, Before you go on, you go on delayed entry programs called DEP. I tell you, I actually went in then in May and after I graduated and wasn't going to go deploy, get go to boot camp.

JJ Parma

So August of that year. So I had the summer and they call it delayed entry program. So during that summer the stuff that stories I here's here's one. Yeah it's always somebody that knew I know a guy who knows a guy whose cousin was like that.

JJ Parma

It was always like six removed. I'm like, Oh yeah. Then you listen as a, as a kid not knowing anything from.

Patrick McCalla

Trying to learn what.

JJ Parma

You trying to learn was like, what does that guy say? Like, like he knows, right? 18 removed from the seal. He was a cook. It's always a cook. Yeah. He goes, I know a guy I went to, went to Bud's in in Coronado.

JJ Parma

And he goes, on day one, you get a puppy when you check in. I said, Well, now, now I'm intrigued as saying, okay, so you a puppy? He goes, Yeah. And I go, What do you do? You have to all six months of Bud's, you got to raise that puppy, he goes.

JJ Parma

But in order to graduate. In order to graduate. You have to shoot the puppy. Hmm. And I just. I just, you know, I remember looking at the individual and just going, yeah, okay. I mean, yeah, really? And then there's that.

JJ Parma

There's no way to verify. There's no way to.

Patrick McCalla

That's the kind of stories you were hearing the whole time.

JJ Parma

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Helicopter take off. Day one about. Helicopter goes out to the Atlantic, drops you off, you go swim. You got to fall. Yeah. So way to the East Coast and then that's the test. So the stories were just like.

Patrick McCalla

So what was your biggest shock that once you start, once the training starts, like what was one of your biggest shocks? Like one of your greatest physical challenges when.

JJ Parma

I went through.

Patrick McCalla

Yeah. Were mental challenges.

JJ Parma

Showing up at the command. I mean, you coming from boot camp, which is easy day, right? You passed that met the requirements, the minimum requirements. You were rostered to go to a class long as you medically passed everything there and then they'd hold you until your body class came up.

JJ Parma

Then you should be able to. And that's how it went. Yeah. When I sure. I just. I'll never forget you showed up to dress whites. You're proud. Navy is a proud. Think about going to boot camp and then becoming a member of the United States Navy.

JJ Parma

And you show up and these sealed shirts come out. They're fit and they're just, you know, as smug as you could possibly like me now. Smug son of a gun. First thing he did, I had my medical records I all stuff you know you try to look professionally the demeanor on.

JJ Parma

Go get wet, go to the surf you come through the door at. And I was running. I was running through the compound. Right to the beach. Right into the water. What. Whites and all they just guys we got laughing and that yeah that was it then the the megaphones came out on Monday morning like all hell breaks

JJ Parma

loose and.

Patrick McCalla

Now you know you sometimes you hear that phrase like, man, this just got real. What was the moment.

JJ Parma

Where, you know, this just created?

Patrick McCalla

Yeah, in training.

JJ Parma

So everybody has a everybody has their crucible. Everybody is different. For a lot of guys, it's hell week. I had no issue for them for whatever reason.

Patrick McCalla

That's that's the famous one.

JJ Parma

Everybody talks about how it's a famous.

Patrick McCalla

Lot of.

JJ Parma

People you know, pre hell week and then during the first 48 hours a whole week is when we tried a lot of students in second phase, maybe week two of the eight week, seven week phase. You're you're doing this thing called pool competency where you're with the tank so that you can YouTube.

JJ Parma

I mean, you could go look at Class 234 or whatever and you're on the bottom of the pool and you've got two tanks, mask, fins. You're down there for about 20 minutes or so. Right. Feels like an eternity when you're down there, but you're getting in.

JJ Parma

You're basically you've got instructors above you and then you're getting surf. It's all about comfort in the water without the gear in the gear on. Right. So you're you've got these tanks and everything's about getting these tanks and then just screwing them up, putting knot in the air hose, exhalation, hose, simple hits complex.

JJ Parma

It's all builds.

Patrick McCalla

Of a kind of things that could happen if you're out. Yeah.

JJ Parma

All builds up, making you pretty much hypoxic during things. You're never really getting back into the flow. And that's the point, right? You get more uncomfortable, more uncomfortable, and all of a sudden, bam, at the there's a big, big test at the end.

JJ Parma

I won't spoil it for those of us that are trying to go through training at home. But there's a big test at the end. Yeah. And if you pass or fail, it's all based on your comfort and procedure.

JJ Parma

Everything is attention to detail under pressure. So test one, go down there. I'm down there for about I don't know guessing 13 minutes felt like I a half. And I thought I had I was at the Crucible, went down there, went to Tug a little bit too hard on the manifold, pulled my hoses straight off.

JJ Parma

So now you've got a free flowing oxygen tank. Mm hmm. And I remember holding my breath. The instructor looked at me. I looked at him. I just took the manifold and sat in the bottom socket. It's like, no, no, no, no, no.

JJ Parma

Up above fail. You can four tries. I forget what happened on the second try. I don't know if I thought it was, you know, as the end of the test. Again, I didn't do the procedure right. Fail. But at number three, I go, Oh.

JJ Parma

Everything was like, how am I going to roll my gun?

Patrick McCalla

Is this all on the same day?

JJ Parma

Like this is all the same, like a over two day test. But yeah, okay. Tries three or four I think four day to the end. So that made even worse because now you're going to sleep like oh god now is half the class is sitting over there and then the rest of the, you know, the, the misfits

JJ Parma

, right. Yeah. We've got to test out. So I made it on the third try, but it was like that constantly. You're like, Oh, God, right up until Bud's graduation. I mean, they keep the pressure on.

Patrick McCalla

So that moment at the bottom of the pool was really where you're feeling like this. This always got real.

JJ Parma

Like, this is was actually when it's when you get out of the pool, you climb over the side of the water and you're sitting there and you do t shorts and you're soaking wet and cold and you're like, Oh God, I gotta do it again.

JJ Parma

Think of the mental mind prep that goes in. I mean, at least for me, I was that way. I worked myself up to ever have a little more now. God, yeah, I'm going to pass evolution. Like, what do I need to do?

JJ Parma

And then you're sleeping at night, mentally preparing, and what it takes to just keep doing that proceed. Because when I tell you that's procedural, I mean, to the point where if you if your strap goes in the wrong way, not left to right, right to left fail.

Patrick McCalla

Yeah. When was the moment then when you actually you get out of training now you're an official Navy SEAL. When was the moment? Where you going? This just got real. We're not in training anymore because I know you had a lot of situations.

Patrick McCalla

You were all over the world. You shared some of that with me before. But what do you remember that moment where you're like, This isn't training anymore. This is real?

JJ Parma

Yeah, I remember. I remember vividly. And it actually was it was not the first my first experience exposure to combat was really 99. It was pretty.

Patrick McCalla

It wasn't your first one, was it?

JJ Parma

My first one really wasn't my first one. So we went in, you know, with everybody forgets that war, Bosnia-Herzegovina, the Kosovo conflict and all that stuff under the Clinton administration. So the moment that you speak of was 911.

JJ Parma

So we were everybody remembers where they were. Now it's no brainer. I was in Kill House can't make this up. We were Fort Pickett was the name of the place as a training venue. And I remember doing Run after Runner.

JJ Parma

It's Summer, it's hot in Virginia Beach. And I remember coming out, taking a water break. We're all sweating and. The instructors. I won't name their names. I'm pretty sure they're retired by now, but they were, you know, came over and got everybody all fired up like, oh, bin Laden.

JJ Parma

He said, this can't mix. Bin Laden just laid it to play before anybody. News. Bin Laden right before that was.

Patrick McCalla

Yeah, it wasn't even public.

JJ Parma

It was your public. I we did we just thought it was a motivational speech. The largest letter, two planes of the into the World Trade Center. And now we're going to get in there. So we're just drinking water.

JJ Parma

Like, I got to hydrate. I'm sweating. And I thought, he's going to give us a rah recipe. You know, it got people fired up and went and did two more runs. Mm hmm. Not knowing that 911 actually happened like this actually happened.

JJ Parma

One of our new guys was in the van out there just putting the air conditioner on because was so hot that day. I remember him firing up, turn the radio went over to either reload, do something. Came to the house.

JJ Parma

And there it is. It's all I said. Turn radio turns radio up. It was all in the air that the second plane they're just talking about, the second plane already hit. And then everybody the entire platoon was around the the van.

JJ Parma

And I just remember just being in shock. Yeah. At that moment that everybody realizes that he was telling a real story. And we went in and did more live runs at that moment. The cadre, the instructor cadre. I said, pack it up, boys.

JJ Parma

We've got to get it. We're going back to the beach. That's when I got my talk about getting real. That's when it got real. Yeah. We're going back to the beach. We did. We made it off because they shut down the bases after, like, bases went to threat on Delta or whatever.

JJ Parma

Patrick McCalla

Different from that moment.

JJ Parma

Never, never went back to being the paradigm shift that happened that day. Yeah. Surreal. Like everything was in motion. The balls were in motion. And I quickly stuff.

Patrick McCalla

I can't even imagine that because, again, anybody listening who was alive at that time, we can we can go. This is where I was. This is when I heard it. This is the moment. This is how I felt.

Patrick McCalla

Right. But for your team that was sitting there that day, you have all those emotions plus. Okay, we're going over there, right? We're at this. This is this just got real. Right. All right. Let's back up a little bit, because this is we've talked about this a little bit before, just in our meetings together and why some

Patrick McCalla

people make it through there. Not because I suppose that everybody that comes into Bud's program there, this has been their dream. This has been their passion. Yeah, maybe it was. Maybe it was later in life. Some of them, maybe their whole life.

Patrick McCalla

They thought about it. They don't go in there expecting like I'm an I'm not going to make it. I think most of them are going I'm going to make it. I'm gonna be a seal, but most don't.

JJ Parma

Right.

Patrick McCalla

Why do you think that is? What? What's the difference between the people who make it and don't make it?

JJ Parma

Perspective. Expectation. I can tell you I tell you the Gallop story, the naval special warfare, paid gallop, umpteen hundreds of thousands of dollars. Or, who knows, to do a study to target. Areas in the United States for sale, recruiting, how it's never been focused, I don't think.

Patrick McCalla

Trying to figure out trying.

JJ Parma

To figure out, hey, where can we where can we spend the preponderance of our time to get in there and make make sense make it make sense to find seals. Long story short. That study turned out to be inconclusive.

JJ Parma

They went around, they looked at they found little pockets, one in Pennsylvania, a northeast, one in northern California, a couple in the Midwest. Really, it was inconclusive. What kind of sports they play? Well, wrestlers and swimmers, individual sports seem to it well.

JJ Parma

Then there's also there was a bunch of football players and then there was a bunch of non team sport that didn't play team sports at all, city.

Patrick McCalla

Boys or farm boys and then.

JJ Parma

All backgrounds all. It really didn't really. If you read the results, there was a lot of classified and unclassified production, I believe, and years since I've seen it, but, you know.

Patrick McCalla

Inconclusive for you really saying it was a total waste of money.

JJ Parma

As a government.

Patrick McCalla

I want to let you in on that one. Sorry.

JJ Parma

Yeah. What do you want to know? No, because I. I had many colleagues take take place. You had high hopes for this. Okay. What are they going to find? And finally did this week, we're finally well known enough and then, you know, desire enough to to go do this.

JJ Parma

And, yeah, it's it's kind of a letdown, but that's how good the program is, like the program it's selecting. Yeah, I don't know it like I don't know what the psychology behind that was, but you still can't after being at that command for three years as opposed to two years, you know, deface.

JJ Parma

And haven't seen and talked to hundreds of students who have gone through. It's impossible to tell who's going to be it. And believe me, all the instructors. So with day one.

Patrick McCalla

So you. So here's right here. You're saying you were in 21 years. If you sat there with a clipboard and you saw these guys getting off the bus that first day, when they send you out there, that that even you after 21 years would have a really hard time going.

Patrick McCalla

He's going to make it almost in bookmaking.

JJ Parma

If I was to bet money on it, which is why I don't gamble. Yeah, yeah. I lose my shirt. You could look at a guy physically. I mean, we've had all types. You go way back, we've had collegiate football players, professional triathletes, professional endurance runners, and those guys will wash out nine out of ten times.

JJ Parma

Oh yeah, they've got the physical attributes, but it's the mental piece that really comes in. It really takes over. At some point you can be physically in shape and do well in the evolution of earbuds. But if your mindset is wrong, if that mental mindset is wrong, forget it.

Patrick McCalla

So what is the right mental mindset? I.

JJ Parma

So my theory. Yeah. This is what you were getting, I think. Yeah, it really is. And again, after multiple interviews with students, 18 year old kids, their dream, some of them wash out, some of them don't. You have to have it.

JJ Parma

There's some adversity in their background. You start peeling back the layers of that onion and really get an in-depth conversation eye to eye with some of these kids. And I did, because I'm so humbling to to tell these guys, you you can't continue in training or this program wasn't for you.

JJ Parma

You start peeling back that onion, you start to, oh, oh, you you came from a divorced family. Oh, you were abused as a child to that overcome. Oh, yeah. Oh, you had a chip on your shoulder because your father withheld inheritance from me.

JJ Parma

Whether you were wealthy, poor, middle class didn't matter. There was something in the background I 100% guarantee. Yeah. I came from a divorce family. Young kid. Was that the who knows? That's adversity, though. Mm hmm. According to the way we're supposed to, the norms of society.

JJ Parma

That's adversity for sure. And I had to work for everything I got right from day one.

Patrick McCalla

So the Palmer theory, the Palmer theory is that the ones who make it have in their past, they've had to deal with adversity, they've had to overcome.

JJ Parma

I honestly believe that there's something there and it may not be blatantly obvious. They one like you may have to peel back then and if you did, you'll find it. Guarantee you'll find out all the guys I know you have to be misfit.

JJ Parma

You basically have to be misfit. Yeah, we could talk. We could talk about recently there was a, uh, a friend of mine. You know, I often get referrals. Hey, can you talk to this guy? He's out. The program is coming to Coronado.

JJ Parma

Okay. Yeah, no problem. Happy to do it. Happy to give guidance that I never got. I got zero going through. So which sometimes is better. It's better to go in not knowing. I think that's why I. Yeah yeah.

JJ Parma

Because then you mental mind it, you know it's like you'll over you'll overthink it for sure. But anyway I'll talk to I'll talk to an individual. Yeah. Hey have meet me for coffee at the compound or whatever. And recently I had a kid from, from Connecticut, a really good friend of mine called me, said, Hey, I got

JJ Parma

this kid. I'm sorry you're awake. You talk to him? Yeah, absolutely. Hundred percent shut down on coffee. Squared away, kid gives background. Hey, what's your background? Some curious straight-A student. Comes from world family. Went to all the best schools.

JJ Parma

All the best colleges. Came out. Athletics. Athletic. Yes. Yeah. Really smart, well-mannered kid. But I'm talking to him like you're perfect on paper. You are just perfect. And I, I'm looking at him. He's probably doesn't understand the stare that I'm because I'm waiting for it.

JJ Parma

Like, what is. Okay. Give me something. Give me. You robbed a candy store. That is what I would like. You give me something. It's got to come up. Didn't come out. He quits, he quits. Inhale it.

Patrick McCalla

Twice. Hidden, dealt with adversity prior to that. That you're.

JJ Parma

Calm again. Yeah, there's no here.

Patrick McCalla

We're going to make that Fritz famous right here today. Karma theory.

JJ Parma

I'm just telling. There's no adversity there.

Patrick McCalla

And if you ever write a book that needs to be one of the chapter titles.

JJ Parma

Okay, 100% say so. But you know, it's happened countless times with guys that I mean, we talked before this about the suicide story, right? This kid was type-A personality, UCLA grad, all the he met all the metrics. All the metrics and then.

JJ Parma

You know, they show up at BUDS and some of them some of them it's a it's like, okay, this is just the next chat. Like, I've been so perfect in my life that I would of course, I can do like and then they don't.

JJ Parma

In that particular case, the kid took it so hard that he drove across the bridge and committed suicide.

Patrick McCalla

You know what's really interesting about this, though, JJ, is that I was a teacher and a coach for ten years. And so I look back on the students that I taught. And as you're talking about this right now, I go and it was the same thing that I saw, not just, you know, none of them became CEOs

Patrick McCalla

, but just in life, the ones that sometimes on paper they were the misfits. They didn't fit in really. They didn't look like they they didn't you know, they weren't the valedictorians or whatever some of them are. Many of them went on and they've done incredible things.

Patrick McCalla

I just met with one last week and it's unbelievable.

JJ Parma

You learn and you learn so much from adverse events. Yeah, I just there's there's no. You can't pay enough for education like that. Mm hmm. You can do go through all the top things in the world. If you've never have an issue, it's the same thing.

JJ Parma

Is. Is you've got to fail to succeed. Yeah. It's the same mentality. Yeah. And unintentionally, when you have some adversity in your life, you can't be shielded from. From life. And I worry about that today.

Patrick McCalla

Well, and that's why almost every time you and I talk together, we come back to this this concept of embracing discomfort. Right? Right. And that's something that's near and dear to your heart. You're passionate about that.

JJ Parma

I'll stand on stage until you got to get out of your comfort zone.

Patrick McCalla

Yeah. Why? Why? I mean, I know different for.

JJ Parma

All the reasons we just talked about and then some. So if you're living in a world of comfort and you're you're okay with where things are and okay because you're not here, trust me, if you're in a comfort zone, you're not feeling fantastic about it.

JJ Parma

You're not advancing. You're not growing mentally. You're not growing physically. If you're if you sit inside this comfort bubble, in most people, it's at a point, right? People climb, and then they just suddenly stop. And anybody that's lost this podcast person, they're going gonna think I'm there now.

JJ Parma

Right. There's a I bet the preponderance of people say I'm there now. I'm comfortable. You got to get out of it. Right. How do you get out of the comfort zone? You have to do something that's challenging. You have to challenge.

JJ Parma

You have to push yourself. And I'm not talking about as a Navy. Like, you don't have to go drop into the Atlantic Ocean across Russia with a passport and ten bucks. You need to mentally open up and say, okay, I've been doing this for a long time.

JJ Parma

Maybe it's a job. Maybe it's your work up a minute, your eating regiment, right? All this stuff matters. It's the pillars of, you know, success and how to be a full person. Maybe you're just stuck in one of these areas relationship.

JJ Parma

You've got to break out and you've got to do. You've got to challenge. And you've got to do something outside the norm. So that you can you can fulfill every single time you're going to be so glad when you step.

JJ Parma

It's the hardest thing to do. Changing a profession, the hardest thing to do. I work in the finance world now. What? What the hell's a seal doing in finance? Yeah, that's the question I use. I don't know. I go, I don't know because I'm an idiot.

Patrick McCalla

So the first time I met you, that was I'm like, did.

JJ Parma

You go from just the office? You just made the pressures face to face that I get. It blows me even like shocks me. I go, I have no it. Like I just took the step and all the junk.

Patrick McCalla

It wasn't very.

JJ Parma

Very uncomfortable. Yeah. To leave the military was uncomfortable. Yeah. Yeah. A lot of guys get stuck in that trap, too. They get stuck into that. You know, Daddy sugar's paying those bills, and they're good. They're good skills. They're good soldiers, they're good everything.

Patrick McCalla

They've been doing this maybe.

JJ Parma

Decades, two decades. You know, and I know a lot of them are unhappy. Some of them really do love it. And they have a different goal. You know, maybe they want to achieve that pyramid, but very few of them ever get up there and a lot of them just stay and they're halfway in, halfway out, straddling that

JJ Parma

line with two feet. Now they're afraid to put that foot over. And I want to be the example, like, get out there and look, I may I may fall on my face next week. I've gotten so used to being able to go, I'm okay with that.

Patrick McCalla

Yeah.

JJ Parma

That you can't that there's a saying about that which does not kill me, only makes me stronger. So on the walls used to be they tore down the compound and hopefully they put it back up in the new the new compound on the easy day was yesterday talked about that last.

JJ Parma

Those things are up there and they're up there for a reason. They if you actually take them to heart, they wish they were more than just a picture on the wall.

Patrick McCalla

Just about being a Navy SEAL. I know it's a good life.

JJ Parma

Those those are applicable to everything that we do. Yeah, everything. That's when you start achieving, then you're in full cycle and you start leaving.

Patrick McCalla

Don't you think that sometimes as as we go further into life and we become more of an expert, I don't think there's any such thing as an accident. Maybe further along on the learning curve, that danger even becomes more so doesn't to become comfortable, because when all of a sudden you're sitting in the room and you're the

Patrick McCalla

expert on whatever this is or that person further like a learning curve, you're comfortable now, and that's where you start to get lazy, right?

JJ Parma

Right.

Patrick McCalla

So you're you're suggesting anybody listening? You're suggesting to me sitting here, whatever you do, you have to look at your life right now, take an assessment and go, what? How are you comfortable every day? And how do you get yourself every day?

JJ Parma

Every day you wake up every single day I try like I'm telling you what is. Where in my life have I become too comfortable? Yeah. What isn't working? Yeah. Challenge it. Change it. Yeah, it's hard. It sounds so easy to do, but it's hard.

Patrick McCalla

You know what's interesting is I just was asking this question of numerous people for the last few weeks from a spiritual perspective. I asked them the question, Where in your life did you feel the closest to God? Like, where did you feel this connection to God?

Patrick McCalla

And you know what? Every single one of them answered when I was going through a difficult time or the most difficult times in my life. That's where they were uncomfortable, right? It was in those uncomfortable, disorienting times in their lives where I felt that connection to God.

Patrick McCalla

So, I mean, you're saying it's physical, social, spiritual, every part of.

JJ Parma

Emotional, every facet of your life. Yeah. Has you have to look at all of them constantly. This whole thing of the continuum of time people. You get in this rut and they just keep working and they just want to work all day, work every day.

JJ Parma

And then they work their way through their working their way through life is what I call it. And they're never stopping.

Patrick McCalla

They're not really living life.

JJ Parma

They're not living life at all. It again, it sounds so easy to do, and I know it's difficult, but it's got to be if you want your life to change, you have to you have to take control. Right.

Patrick McCalla

These people people see that again, because that's such a simple phrase. But not to say that it is.

JJ Parma

If you want your life to change, you have to take control. You have to take that, you know, ship steering wheel and. Right. Correct your ship. And there's a.

Patrick McCalla

Lot of people that probably don't they don't even know where it happened. But somewhere they gave that steering.

JJ Parma

Wheel over 100% and then they got stuck in a rut. And they're working they're working their way through life.

Patrick McCalla

It doesn't really matter, though, right now at this point to figure out where it happened. Just grab that.

JJ Parma

So I do these I do these social experiments, right? Yeah. Just for fun. Yeah, it California is so I, you know, I spent my time California. Texas. My kids are California. I do these experiments now where I go for these long runs.

JJ Parma

This is fairly new because I think particularly in California, you've been regional before. This isn't this isn't a political things is a red blue. This is just California. People are uptight. People are uptight. And I think there's a reason for it.

JJ Parma

I think it's the socioeconomic situation. There's some political turmoil there. There it's expensive. Right. And you've got people just struggling to get by. And I think that plays into it a little bit. Some of that West Coast cultural old, old school stuff plays into it, but they're not very friendly.

JJ Parma

You go around that you go the East Coast and we may be a holes I oh yeah yeah.

Patrick McCalla

That's the traffic fumes that.

JJ Parma

But the people are still to me a little friendly. Okay. You can agree or disagree. Yeah. Go to Texas. God bless Texas. Like you love Texas. I'm in love like I'm in love with Texas. I totally am in love with it.

JJ Parma

I'm so happy to be a Texan. Greatest day on the planet. The people. I mean, I was like a little child. I get like butterflies when I first when I first started frequenting and and became a resident, driving my truck down, people walking hand in hand.

JJ Parma

The old couples. Yeah. You'll go by on some country road and they're there. They're going to hand. It took me five days and I go, they were having it with me. Yeah, I'm doing something wrong. And so California fight right.

Patrick McCalla

They were.

JJ Parma

Even to me and they were and I got so the joy that that there's something so simple.

Patrick McCalla

About all the Texans whether it's human.

JJ Parma

Being individual connecting with you from a wave. Yeah that all.

Patrick McCalla

The Texans right now are telling you to shut up because they're like, yeah, you don't want anybody moving to our state anymore.

JJ Parma

So sorry, Texas. So your promise to keep the secret?

Patrick McCalla

What? Your social experiment. You're out.

JJ Parma

Right? So I do. So now that now that I've totally had exposure to Bill and I go back and forth, back and forth, I go to California now and. I it is part a part of it is is me being the religious kid that, you know, diehard Catholic kid.

JJ Parma

Everything's personal for me, private that I wear. Blessed cross that my friend Jo gave me. Still wear it. I wear it every day. My daughter made me this blue. So my newest thing lately is I want to do something.

JJ Parma

I got to do one good deed every day. Mm hmm. I wake up thinking that. Yeah, sometimes it doesn't get done. I get mad now and make.

Patrick McCalla

This work by.

JJ Parma

A coffee. By a coffee shop. Last week, I bought a lady's gross like she couldn't afford. We're in Imperial Beach, California. Can afford. She had ground beef and sauce and she was about to walk away, didn't speak English.

JJ Parma

And I stopped and I said, no, you know. Good. I like the feeling that that that I get. It's like the people waving hate, the connection, the lady. You know what to do. I just left. Yeah. And she was overjoyed.

JJ Parma

Like you could just you could feel. Yeah. So in California now, I on my runs, I said, okay, I'm going to change I'm going to change the world one person at a time. One person attacked by a wave or.

JJ Parma

Good morning. The shock. So now I'll be running. I go for an hour run and most of it's meditation or I'll do you know I'll be biking usually on the trail it's when you see the people, they just doing their thing, they're in their lane and they're cowboy.

JJ Parma

And I'll just out of the blue, out loud. Hey, good morning. How are you shut most people in it that you get this look and I look and I just blow by.

Patrick McCalla

Almost become a cultural thing there is yeah.

JJ Parma

It's almost ingrained into that yeah society and I you know it's the great and they kind of pause and you can just feel the whole mood changes. Right. So all these people today not talking nobody. I mean, you can hear it on every podcast.

JJ Parma

Everybody's talking about the nobody's nobody's doing anything about it. Yeah. How do you change it? Well, we can sit here and say that nobody wants to talk. You know, we're politically divided. And whether you would go all those walls can come down, you never really.

Patrick McCalla

Know, get uncomfortable and do so.

JJ Parma

We're all here together. We all have to live. And it's not there's not less people today. There's more. It's more. And and as much as I, you know, like to be in my little bubble every once about. But we're all we all have to live on.

Patrick McCalla

This whole thing of being the change. Yeah, well, hey, let me read you some, some quotes, and I just want you to comment on these, okay? So these are quotes that deal with something that you and I talk about often embracing.

JJ Parma

Don't test, you know, who said the quote?

Patrick McCalla

Oh, I won't. I won't. Well, some of these are actually I just I just sometimes will read and I'll I'll write down some thoughts or something. So, I don't know, some of these might be mine. Some of these might be some from a book I read.

Patrick McCalla

But here's one of them. You will not find strength in comfortable situations. Strength is found in the grind, in the wilderness, in tough moments. You agree with that?

JJ Parma

So that's we just thought. Yeah, that's the comfort zone. Yeah, 100%. Yeah, 100%. Yeah. You don't, you don't find anything comfortable, but yeah.

Patrick McCalla

You don't think you don't need strength, you don't need courage.

JJ Parma

You're not changing anything. You're not using other senses. You're not on edge. You're not causing your brain to challenge yourself, to think, How do I get out of the situation? What can I do to better myself? Right. That's.

Patrick McCalla

Yeah. How about this one? Comforts have the danger of subduing us with a slow, deceptive sleep. We become completely oblivious that we have lost our edge or fighting spirit.

JJ Parma

So this. This is the perfect, right? This is this is exactly what is taught to you as a special operator, right? Especially as a seal. Complacency will kill you. Complacent will kill you. You can never be complacent, no matter how many days you're sitting on that mount up or how long you're watching this target not you can

JJ Parma

never lull yourself into this false sense of security where you get complacent. The minute that happens, you're dead. Yeah. Like it's over. Yeah. That applied to now. So people are out there now. How do I apply that to my level?

JJ Parma

Same thing. I mean, really, the minute you work yourself to death every single day, you've already died, right? You're being poisoned.

Patrick McCalla

The difference might be that it's a it's a long, drawn out, slow death.

JJ Parma

Long, drawn out. Yeah, right. Yeah. And then at the end of the day, like I said, nobody reflects on time. Every day. Every day. You should reflect on time. I'm here. Okay. You know, like people meditate. Yeah, I try to do I'm terrible at it, but I try to do 15 minutes of meditation every day because I

JJ Parma

think it's so healthy. Yeah, but that's at that point when I actually do block off that time, which I suck at. Yeah, when I do block, that's when I think of these things and I go, okay.

Patrick McCalla

You're treasuring the start up days growing time in.

JJ Parma

My kids keep me grounded like they really do keep me super grounded. They keep me thinking about that 100% because when you have something to live for, that's when things matter, right? So I think about that and I go, okay, stop.

JJ Parma

How was how was today? Is your head so far in the sand today that you are realizing that it is true? You become hopeful. You become a better person as you get older and smarter and wiser. And I hopefully I hope that that what.

Patrick McCalla

That doesn't automatically happen.

JJ Parma

It doesn't automatically mean you have to just want I mean, I'm forced we do it every day. But now that I'm forcefully doing that every day, you start to see like it's like a butterfly coming out. It's coming out of the cocoon.

JJ Parma

It's the best analogy I could have. Yeah. So soft seal, right? Yeah. Butterfly. Yeah, it's not.

Patrick McCalla

Yeah, that's the analogy I was.

JJ Parma

Thinking, but I mean. But it's true. Yeah.

Patrick McCalla

How about this one? Every person and organization will naturally drift toward complacency. You don't grow accidentally, right?

JJ Parma

Same thing. So when I do the public speaking that I do and I get up there, I said, Well, look, in this this start of the Navy, you're in one job. Have you thought about going to do the counting down the hall with Alice or going up to production with Steve or even going to see the CEO's

JJ Parma

office for a day and say, Hey, can I sit next to you and see what you do stepping out of that comfort zone? Because the companies get complacent and they do rotate positions. That's like the first thing you can do.

JJ Parma

And trust me, every company will. They'll open arms. If they're not, then there's something wrong. I think it's brilliant. I think most bosses that I've talked to, CEOs think it's brilliant, right? Cross Train.

Patrick McCalla

Which is one of the things that SEAL Team.

JJ Parma

100%. Right. You got a 60 guy in medic, you're carrying bullets, you're doing radios like you're doing it all. You know, everybody's job and you know how difficult and then you appreciate, right. What it does. Yeah. And then maybe, oh, I would like to do that one day and you can you realize that you can, right.

JJ Parma

That's out of the comfort zone. When you realize you can, that's not that difficult because most people can and they just never will. Yeah. And so yeah, I really get.

Patrick McCalla

That emotional about yeah. And well then that's what I do every time I talk with you. This somehow comes out in our conversation just because you your passion about it, which is why I'm going to tell you right now publicly on this podcast, you need to write a book about that.

Patrick McCalla

You do. You do. It's I think it's I think the topic.

JJ Parma

It is.

Patrick McCalla

It is. And we need to hear it because again, it's those quotes. I mean, is what we've been talking about this whole time, complacency. It's we just we we end up complacent. We don't even realize how we got there.

Patrick McCalla

Right. It happened so slowly. Right. So it's a great message. I think you do need to write a book on it. So. Right. It's a deal.

JJ Parma

You can do it only if you write it with me about that and make a deal. Yeah, I.

Patrick McCalla

Would love that. Hey, JJ, thanks so much. Really appreciate it. Always learn a lot from you. Leave us with one more. I mean, I think your the piece that you said earlier, you said tangibly, do something today that will make you uncomfortable.

Patrick McCalla

Is that what you want to leave us with or is there something else you want to to tell us to do?

JJ Parma

I think I think leaving. What? Leaving with this. Just stop today. After you listen. Stop. Think, sit down. Quiet room, quiet place. And say. Where. Where am I to comfortable? How can I change my life for the better?

JJ Parma

It may be as simple as changing. Changing your eating habits. Tomorrow, tomorrow. Like, don't wait. Once you make that decision, do it. Yeah. Jump into it both feet. Because if you wait, you're just being complacent. It's good.

Patrick McCalla

Good advice now. Thanks, JJ, thanks for your service. Pleasure. Thanks for.

JJ Parma

All. A pleasure. Yeah. Appreciate you. Thanks.

Host

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