Success in leadership and business. What does it actually look like? And what’s the key to achieving it? 

As leaders or entrepreneurs, we’re constantly seeking strategies to enhance our productivity, innovation and satisfaction, both in our personal and professional lives. We commonly believe that working ourselves into the ground and forging ahead no matter what hits us will get us there.

But what if there was a better, more holistic way to not only achieve success, but define it? I had the pleasure of exploring this idea with Repa Patel, a leadership expert who blends neuroscience, positive psychology and mindfulness to create impactful change.

In our conversation, Repa reveals why starting with purpose or even starting with your ‘why’ isn't enough to drive true success. Together, we explore the deeper framework for unlocking joy and fulfillment - one that combines purpose, prosperity, pleasure and freedom. 

Repa also challenges the myth of resilience, showing why trying to be the rock in tough times can actually hold you back, and how becoming the river helps you adapt and thrive. She shares a powerful exercise to reflect more deeply on how we move through the world, to unlock meaningful change in our lives and our leadership. 

As we strive to lead with intention, Repa’s wisdom provides a roadmap not just for achieving success, but for crafting a meaningful life rich with impact.

This conversation is a must-listen for anyone looking to lead with intention and create lasting impact and legacy. 

Submit your Question: Spotify - click the button below. All other platforms - send me a DM on Instagram or email: support@janinegarner.com.au 

Connect with Repa: 

Website: https://leadingmindfully.com.au/

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/repapatel 

Connect with Janine:



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She blends neuroscience positive psychology and mindfulness. And I've watched her work. I've seen the impact she creates with leaders and with teams. And that's why I wanted to get her on the podcast to share some of her insights with you. In this episode, Repa reveals why starting with purpose or even starting with why.

isn't enough to drive true success. Together, we explore the deeper framework for unlocking joy and fulfillment. One that combines purpose, prosperity, pleasure, and freedom. Reba also challenges the myth of resilience, showing why trying to be the rock in tough times can actually hold you back and how becoming the river helps you adapt and thrive.

This conversation is a must listen for anyone looking to lead with intention and anyone who wants to create lasting impact and legacy. Let's dive in.

Hello, Repa. Welcome to my podcast unleashing brilliance. How are you?

Repa: I'm very well, Janine, very well. So excited to have this conversation with you?

so thank you so much for inviting me.

Okay.

Janine: Oh, my absolute pleasure. I always love our conversations. what I love about the time we spend together at Repa is we get very commercial, very strategic, but we also have some bigger picture, future thinking conversations, and this is why I wanted to invite you to the podcast. Cause I have no doubt that there are many people listening in right now that they're equally thinking.

You spend the majority of your time working with, high level C suite executives around the world. you talk about working in this intersection of neuroscience, Positive psychology and mindfulness to really essentially change the paradigm of leadership, and what the world needs in leadership. but before we get into that, you know, you've just returned, you were sharing with me recently, you've just returned from doing a research trip.

Repa: Yeah, fantastic question because there are two levels of the trends. If you like, there's the more practical, pragmatic, you know, things like, um, Working from home, getting people back into the office, which is common across, from London with Asia in between and, And Australia and not for the reasons that we, that we think. in Australia, at least the press has, has taken this to be, about productivity, but in fact, the clients I'm talking to who are the senior leaders are saying it's all about productivity for us. I know my people deliver. that's not in question. What's not happening is the innovation. and yes, we have zoom and we can force that, but what's not happening is that connection that creates the, innovation. So there's the kind of pragmatic things, like that cost of living and things like that, that, that are impacting leaders. Then there's the [00:05:00] strategic, the wider perspective, things like, globalization changing and, countries becoming more countries around the world becoming more, insular and more self sufficient or, or aiming to be more self sufficient and what that means for leadership, which is fascinating because that impacts not just organizations that operate globally. But it actually also impacts organizations that operate nationally. So I'm delving into with my national clients here in Australia as well, not just the international clients, but with the national clients in particular, I'm asking them, what does this mean for you in terms of your leadership? What does it mean in terms of your business?

Before we get into that, the one thing I've always loved is when I've heard you introduce yourself. can you do that? Can you share, share with our audience, you know, who is Repa?

Repa: So India gave me its heritage. Africa gave birth to me, the UK raised me and Australia adopted me almost. 30 years ago, which is probably showing my age. And the only inhabitable continent that I haven't touched is America. my professional career started off as a lawyer and my last legal role was head of legal for the institutional bank.

Janine: So before we start going into that, that's beautiful, experience of your life so far in terms of where you were born, who raised you, et cetera, et cetera. what do you think that has gifted you as an individual?

I think that's that there were many things, obviously it's given me, but, but I think that's the biggest thing. biggest strength I've gained, which gives me perspective beyond my own view. So, I have my own views, obviously, about things, but I'm also really curious about finding out and learning about the opposite view, even if I disagree with it.

And I think the biggest strength it's given me.

Janine: So you left a legal career. And now you work in this intersection, integration of that neuroscience, positive psychology, mindfulness. Tell me more about that. Tell me more about why this is your work and your passion piece right now.

So in that situation, I experienced a lot of stress. and that was, My thing, because I, I didn't know how to deal with pressures of an executive career or an executive life. We're not taught that, right? We're not taught how to lead people. We're not taught how to lead ourselves. We're taught how to be great lawyers. You know, we're taught how to be great bankers. but not how to lead ourselves. And so I started delving into this intersection, which I've created, because I love neuroscience. I love, evidence based, techniques. I loved positive psychology and I have a deep practice of yoga philosophy and yoga, psychology. Uh, and I, I, I, Thought what would happen if I applied some of these tools and techniques [00:10:00] into my practice as an executive? So I did, and what started happening, for example, is, we'd have a project meeting. And then 1 time, a person came up to me and said, don't know what happened. I feel like you did something different. not quite sure what, but can you tell me what it was? Because. It changed the entire meeting. And that's when I realized that this is needed for executives. So the intersection is my passion, but it's about bringing, evidence based techniques that are proven to work. around personal and team transformation, into a practical way that the people can implement.

I'm curious what that means for you and how do you bring that into your work?

Repa: Yeah. So Dharma is the reason I do what I do. Dharma is the reason why I left, the corporate world. the bank was the best employer I'd ever had. So it wasn't about the bank. It was about me. so Dharma is, I think wrongly interpreted as purpose. in the West. and then purpose has all these other connotations, you know, follow your bliss, um, that kind of stuff.

So I like to think of Dharma as your work in this world without attachment to results. And that's a, ancient yogic definition. So it's about your work, not anybody else's. And it is about work?

Um, our work. us working on purpose will hold the integrity of the universal energy.

Janine: So if I was listening in, I'd be going, Yeah, I get that. That, that makes absolute sense. But how on earth do I find that? I, what do I need to do? So whether, you know, you're thinking about making a change, whether you're trying to determine the next five years, how do you get started with trying to work that stuff out?

Most people do. And so when I'm working with clients, I, take them through a strengths exercise because that's, the easiest way to recognize it. if you don't have that readily available, look at what people say about you, Oh, you're really good at X. Can you come and do Y? What have you, you know, ask your siblings when you were growing up. What are you known for in your family? You know, organizing events, whatever it is, other people see us differently. Other people [00:15:00] recognize our strengths before we do. from a team perspective, we can do that in a number of ways. We can do the strengths, exercise. There's, another facilitated process that I use. with a team. And what I do is do individual strengths and then collective strengths. And that's important in a team because when we start looking at what's the plan, we want to make sure that people are in flow and doing their best work. We want to put the people with their, with strengths that are aligned to that work, you know, working on those projects. So that's where I would suggest people start.

love your angle around, you know, what is your work, trying to find the work, your work in this world without attachment to results. but if we go through those other three, pleasure, prosperity, and freedom, I'm curious as to how they help shape up that understanding of Dharma.

Repa: at, All

four. So when I'm working with an individual executive or with a team, I look at all four and I should have added with the purpose for the team. It's also about defining that. So why does this team exist? beyond KPIs, because you're experts, you can deliver those KPIs yourself. But as a team, why, why do you exist? and then defining what that purpose is and what are the behaviors that we expect to see. So then the others come into play. and if we look at prosperity, Most people that I work with focus on this, right, So if we're going to be successful in life, we focus on how much money do I need to make?

So don't think people need much guidance on, on how to do that. from a pleasure perspective, this is about. Enjoying your life more broadly. And so the definition of Dharma that I spoke about is doing your work, the stuff that you love to do so that moment to moment you're experiencing that flow, which is pleasure.

So this is a tricky one because what do I mean freedom from what? It's about self, realization and self actualization. So big words, but what it means is the reflective piece. what do I need to change? How do I need to be differently? So not what do I need to do differently, but how do I need to be differently in order to, you know, make the other areas integrate into my life. So if I'm living my Dharma, then chances are, you need to change a few things around. So how do I gain that freedom to be able to live my Dharma? that requires a, change in me from a leadership team perspective. It's about, Building in that time for reflection, even, even for actually an individual executive, it's about building in that time, regularly to reflect because, um, wisdom, uh, and I wish I had a whiteboard because I [00:19:00] draw this up. I would draw up, knowledge plus experience, and I'd put a bracket around those two things. multiplied by reflection equals wisdom. So without reflection, you can't have wisdom. It's not knowledge and experience. That's not, wisdom at all because you don't have that self, actualization, aim around that. You need reflection to be able to say, okay, how do we need to be differently as a team? How do I need to be differently as a person in order to achieve the change that I'm looking for?

Repa: They're not doing the reflection piece, the reflective piece. Right? So we are going gangbusters, all of us, you know, we've got a plan, we've got a strategy, whether we're business owners or executives, individual executives or teams. We've got a plan and we're working so hard. We know where we want to get to.

that once you have the intention and you build it in, right? As a team, it's a lot harder unless you put it in your business calendar. So, you know, we're about to start a new year. So fantastic time to say, what is our leadership team calendar? Most leadership teams have this mapped out, right? And you need to build in at least twice a year, a reflective period. And the clients I work with that, that do this, what do they get? They're able to respond to the market a lot more quickly because they can see what's happening already, um, without it having impacted the business and they can see how they need to change as [00:22:00] a leadership team,

and how the organization needs to change before the change actually lands.

Janine: you think from your research that you've been doing that in this current period of time that we are in, that this reflection piece is becoming more important than ever to be able to determine the right strategies moving forward or to navigate the right path? The period of time that we're going through, because my sense right now in the busyness is it's the first thing that goes, you know, with so many of my clients, That time to sit and reflect is almost seen as a cost to the business versus an investment in the business.

So busy looking forward. That we actually forget to reflect not only what we've done, but also what we've learned through that process. and I'm curious from your work, because obviously I see it from a, from my lens, I'm, I'm curious from your work, are you, are you sensing that there isn't enough of this reflection going on right now?

Repa: 100 percent for a number of reasons. the first is we've now got crisis upon crisis upon crisis upon crisis upon crisis. So you know, we used to have a crisis And

Janine: that are in business, running businesses, whatever it is that we're doing.

we base a lot of our decisions on the knowledge that we've gained to now, or the knowledge that we have and the experience that we've gained to now. And yet what you're suggesting is the opportunity to innovate, to find the gap, to move quicker, comes in that period of reflection of, you know, Just because you've done it before doesn't mean it's the way forward.

so it's such a, a beautiful thing it with that equation. From your experience, when people do take that reflective moment, how does it make them better leaders? How does it make them better decision makers? How does it enable them to move out of the crisis, the firefighting into actually getting into that place of flow and enjoying the [00:27:00] process?

Janine: [00:29:00] there and so many amazing experts in their own space around elements of, Mindfulness or elements of well being. but if we take it to the extreme, and again, you know, there's many executives, business owners under the pump right now.

there's this wonderful term going around right now, toxic resilience, that they're working really, really hard. Actually, I'm curious. What's your view on that, concept, toxic resilience of someone in your space? How would you explain to our listeners what toxic resilience means in your world?

Repa: Toxic resilience is just pushing through, you know, doesn't matter. Just push through, soldier on. Doesn't matter what hits you. You got to stand firm. You just got to keep pushing.

You know, the, the Rocky Bilboa quote, and I'll probably quote it completely wrongly, but, when he says to his son, you know, it ain't about how hard you get hit.

It's about how hard you get hit keep moving forward and keep. And to some extent, yes, but that to me epitomizes toxic resilience.

When we get so fixated on trying to fix them without actually thinking about that's the resilience piece. I'm just going to push through. I don't care how hard this rock is. I'm just going to push through. You can't, you have to accept it sometimes. Silence.

And what I've seen, where I've seen you work your magic is you don't go all woohoo, but you go very simple as a first step of Ownership around self, which I've seen you do, you're like sleep, get your sleep sorted. or it could be diet or it could be downtime. So, but all of it is contributing to this ability to slow down, to ultimately be able to reflect so that you can make the right decisions for yourself, for your career, for your business, for the people around you.

Repa: No. And again, it comes back to freedom, right? Your freedom to make decisions without any other attachment, you know, to emotion, to, depletion, to exhaustion, to, anything. So to have self agency. Absolutely.

is the first part of self actualization. You've, you've got to say, look, what do I control and how do I need to change? and start small because it is overwhelming. it's like a skill, right? it's like strength training. you have to start small. Once you nail that weight, You then go up in weight, or you change the exercise that you do. It's the same thing with, you know, the whole adaptability piece. Sleep is the foundation of everything. if your sleep isn't right, it doesn't matter what else you do. So, so start small, and then once you've got that down pat, you then go up. build on that foundation.

so particularly that reflection piece that you're saying is one of the critical, parts that people need to invest in, what would you. So ideally, if you were their fairy godmother right now, here's some ideas and some thoughts to just go away and either do experiment with, play with, so that they can get closer to that part of the equation around the reflection piece to make, help them become better versions of themselves.

Janine: [00:36:00] What an awesome exercise to leave people with. Okay, so I've got one more question. Why is this work so important right now? why is it important that we do this work?

that I've done with my clients, it, hasn't changed the external circumstances, but it has changed the way they approach it. And what it's done is then change the relationships that they're having. and for leadership teams, it's the same because they've got to demonstrate to their teams below them that the constant thing that we control in all of this is us and how we respond. And so we need that reflective period and we, we need to think about, you know, how are we going to respond? How, how are we becoming?

Building your own business, as you've so beautifully concluded there, the only thing we can control is us. And that is where that ripple effect of change happens. And the result of that is the people around you, but also your own prosperity, your own freedom, your own sense of actually doing the work that you're supposed to do in the world.

without any attachment to the results.

Thank you so much for the work that you do. And I think, you know. When we look at what's ahead of us over the next few years, every one of us needs to take ownership for our, for the work that we're doing and the impact that we're having in the world. And, um, yeah, you do great work. And thank you for sharing all that today.

Repa: Oh, thank you so much for having me, Janine.

Janine: My absolute pleasure.

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