Hallie and I both just returned from vacation, so the topic is top of mind for us this week. In this episode, we share about my recent trip to a dude ranch in Wyoming and Hallie’s week on the beach in Maine, and explore how our personal experiences have shaped the way we view time off, travel, and how our energy affects our personal experiences no matter where we are.

We also touch on the balance between hard work and setting boundaries, the evolution of motivations and ego in building a business, and the importance of finding joy in everyday moments.

Takeaways:

• The potential of Elon Musk’s Neuralink to enhance human capabilities
• The impact of energy/perspective on our experiences in different environments
• Hard work and boundaries are important, but be aware of your motivations and ego
• Small actions have a ripple effect
• Being present and finding joy in everyday moments is crucial for personal growth and fulfillment

View full show notes here:

[00:00] Elon Musk and Neuralink

[05:03] The Importance of Breaks and Vacations

[10:20] My Experience at a Dude Ranch in Wyoming

[18:28] The Impact of Energy on Experiences

[19:34] Finding Yourself and Making Life Decisions

[25:13] Balancing Hard Work and Setting Boundaries

[28:41] The Ripple Effect of Small Actions

[30:21] Being Present and Finding Joy in Everyday Moments

Welcome to the 200 % Life Podcast, your weekly insights to spiritual growth in business success with Adam Hergenrother and Hallie Warner.

Did you see that Lex Fridman interviewed Elon Musk?

He can be very hit or miss for me, like a lot of podcasts probably for lot of people that depends on the guests. But he did like a, it was really interesting listening to Elon talk about like politics and you know, obviously he's the largest donator for donations for the Republican candidate. He's only like $45 million a month for the next three months or something along those lines. is there. And what he did ask, you know, it really interesting. You should go listen to him paraphrasing a little bit. We did ask him a little bit about like,

why are you voting for Trump and what is this whole thing? And you were against him before and he said, well, you have two choices basically. And he said, every candidate, including every human is flawed in many ways. said, then you have to look at it from, what do you think is, and he just kind of went into his rationale for it. it was actually, like Elon, you would expect, it was actually well thought out and said in terms of what it would be. It's just kind of interesting for, but, and then he gets into the,

which is really where I was going with that, which is really fascinating. Like they just put it successfully into the second human. And they're getting to a point now where they should be able to, in the next couple of years, have Neuralink in there, because every single thing in your body is electrical, right? It's like talking to your electrical system to like have to really help with blindness or hearing or paraplegics or... Does it help with dementia?

I don't know if that does at all. heard that he didn't bring that up. more of like with the dementia is like a cause of lack of electrical signals in the brain. So I'm assuming at some point it could probably help with that, different pieces. It was actually fascinating. He also said, and then I'll jump in, but like he said, like they're talking about data rates in terms of like supercomputers and what they do versus like what a...

human comprehend information. They said neural link would be able to comprehend like a conversation a hundred times faster than what you do. So you put it in your head, you would also have that information a hundred times faster than you do now or a thousand times faster than you do now. He said it's like 10 to 15 years away. Yeah, basically. And it's like, then it would be like, well, why wouldn't everyone? Anyways, she just well, like, do that. Then we'd all be like, superhuman. listened to that on,

a run when I was in Wyoming for vacation. But what were you saying before that? was just gonna say that. You know, we talk about death. We actually haven't since we've started doing the podcast again. I don't think we've talked about death. But I don't really fear, you know some people fear death. I don't really necessarily fear death. Dementia and Alzheimer's on the other hand. I definitely, I don't wanna get old.

You're gonna get old. know I mean I like I want to get old but I don't want to feel old You're gonna feel you at some point. You're probably gonna feel old at some point. Yeah, I was just like can the nerling help with that? I'm sure at some point that well dementia is one of the little scary things because what it happens is the personal mind or your self -concept it no longer is able to Really live through you well, because it shuts down your

your body that can't function anymore. for a lot of things. My parents do, I don't know if told you this, but my parents are hospice volunteers, so they spend a lot of time with patients who have dementia and things like that, the stories are.

Yeah, are quickly it happens. Yeah. Anyway, well, I mean, it's just the fragility of the body I mean if you haven't noticed in the mind, we all are going to die. Yeah, even just in a short period This is like whenever I get like you and I were talking offline about different things life and general and stuff but like even when you start to get to a point where like you think like

man, it's gonna be like tough. I always use that opportunity, which is why we've talked about this podcast for a long time, but like just step back and just take a breath. Call it you want. Like maybe people don't take a breath, but just take a step back and get a larger view.

going to be or what projects I want to work on next. I'm just like, man, life is so, so short. And I'm like worrying about all of these things that haven't even happened yet. And I just really need to be a little bit more in the moment, a little bit more present.

Allow life to unfold as it's supposed to. It's funny because so I went, we were, today's talk we're gonna talk a little bit about like workation, right, staycation, vacation. And just the mindset of that because somebody, I wanna put a pin in this after I mention it and then we'll come back to it, but talked about how like, know.

We went to Wyoming to a dude ranch, which we'll kind of talk a little bit about what that is, but it was more about what is your philosophy around vacation? And people were asking, I really needed this. And actually, even Jenna, I'm sure she mind saying this, kind of shared the importance of breaks and she really needed it. And I'm like, then I went into the conversation of, well, you can be proactive so that you don't need as much break. When I saw people at the dude ranch, it took days to just kind of unwind a little bit. And then they're like, man, I need to do more of this outside.

which got me thinking like that's exactly right. And so then people would see me up early and like after a couple days like, why are you up early for? And I was like, well, this is the routine I do. And I noticed you've been running every day. Nobody else is exercising. I said, well, that's all part of the routine so that you don't have this, this drastic difference between like your work period and your non -work period, whatever that looks like for you. And we've talked about this over the years of just kind of my original mindset when I was, you know,

working was just like working between vacations, right? Let's put a pin in that, because I'm going to come back to that. Yeah, because I don't even know if I...

believe that so much anymore. I probably did when I was like in it and working like crazy hours and whatever. But when I was on it, so I went to Maine for a whole week, which was amazing. But it was amazing because I literally did almost the exact same thing I do at home, except I was on the beach. But honestly, wasn't that similar to I guess it wasn't that different. But we were starting to think of I want to go on this big 40th birthday trip. And Bill and I are like, what are going to do? Because we obviously got a planet. I'm like, do I want to go to Greece? Do I want to go to

Mexico, like what do I want to do? But when we were on vacation, I literally was just like, I don't think I want to even do anything big. Like I don't feel in this space I'm in my life right now where I need all of these vacations. I'm working for myself. I've got a lot of freedom. I'm doing what I want to do. I'm working on the projects I want to work on. I don't feel this desire to like...

Go away for two weeks because I need this huge break now if it was something like experiential like I really wanted to do fine But what we concluded was we just want to go see my sister and like go hang out with people that we love and people that we care about We're gonna go like for a day up to hunting camp because now he's part of a hunting camp and I'm like that is more of Everyday kind of thing, but I did have to ask him because for me I'm like doing what I want to do and how he is Got a crazy crazy schedule. He just went back on nights

and

I'm like, what about you? Do you need, cause in his line of work, he might actually need like a week or two of complete disconnection. So we're still kind of working through that, but I guess I don't need a vacation, but he might. But he also might just be disconnected and do his is a little bit more - No, what I'm saying is like when he goes on like just to go see your sister or go see honey, that it's still, it's almost like it doesn't matter where, I don't know, I'm just speaking for him, but like it doesn't matter like where he's going as long as he actually truly is actually disconnected from any of that.

can be like if he chooses to sometimes he still answer calls or sometimes they'll still call him even though they're not supposed to be calling him but but yes he can disconnect a little more he's not like sitting there well he does sometimes but he's because he just yeah

this kind of person is. You this goes back to, know, I've never, there was a period of time, but when we started really doing a lot of this deep work, most of, and if almost all the vacations that I went on, I didn't feel any different. Now the experiences were different. Sure. And there's certain things they turn on. There's also worst moments on vacation too, because it was like, whether your plane's delayed or you just, you, you're waiting at a restaurant and you're sick of eating, whatever it is, right? There's always the dichotomy of both those things going on, which is always like the root of this work, which is

like how do I get myself to a place inside so that I don't need that energy to turn me out? What most people do with vacations is a major distraction from their current energy that they're in. Most people when they wake up they have a monotonous or even if they're enjoying what they're doing, they still have this energy that's essentially basically depressed. And I'm not saying they're depressed, their energy to a certain level is in there like and when they think about a vacation, their energy turns on. That's why when you go to the mine, you start thinking about going to the Bahamas or to a ski trip, whatever it is,

you want and makes you feel good and you go well then that experience will make me feel good but all you're really doing is using the mind to play a mental movie that then opens yourself up. I always go back to why don't we open ourselves up and then just take ourselves anywhere we want to go and enjoy the experience of travel enjoy the experience of you know whatever it is or at least appreciate it. We went to this so it's interesting for us we went to a dude ranch the first ranch that we went

dude ranch we've gone to and it was in Wyoming, which I love Wyoming. It's at least the most populated state in the lower 48s. And it's actually the area that we went to was the Less populated than Vermont? Yes. wow. Yes. Surprised. least populated state, yeah, in the lower 48. And what's really interesting too is that, yeah, Vermont's number two. okay. Yeah, just to Wyoming. So it's pretty little.

The area, the town that we are in is actually the furthest away in any state in the United States.

from like a major highway or anything like that. we're, so it's, you know, I live, we live even in Vermont in a pretty quiet area and I live in Stowe, which is even quieter. And like, we still got there and like your ears were ringing a little bit because it was so quiet. Like seriously, Sarah's like, there's nothing wrong with my ears. I'm like, no, it's like that quiet. And I'm pretty already wound down in general. Like I don't feel like I needed, again, like you like a break, but when I went there, like I even.

rested even further, like it was like even further, like I took it and I was like, man, I still didn't realize I was still wrapped up in, into energy or stress or whatever it is that was there. And I was like, when you get like three days in there, you really, cause all of you have no service, right? There's a little wifi that you could get to here and there, but I just kept my phone in airplane mode. And you you, fly fish, you ride horses, you, bomb fires. There's an itinerary that you shoot guns. Like it's literally like, and it's just the kids have their own freedom and different things. I'd highly recommend it.

and asked them if they made them cook and take care of the horses and they were like, no. But they did it for fun though. Yes, they did as a way of learning that whole thing. What's really interesting too is people that go and work in these dude ranches used to be just like Wranglers who used to do there, but now they're becoming so popular that there's a whole job market for it. So now all of a sudden there's people from all over the country going to these and it was like, we got to know one guy that was there and he went there, he goes to college in Connecticut

and he's one of the top runners in America. And he's literally training for the next Olympics. And he's that good. He's one of those different things. so he, with dude ranch, we stayed at a 7 ,200 elevation. So he literally went to go work at a dude ranch so he could run at elevation. And train. That's so interesting. And so he literally, he doesn't know how to ride a horse, but he worked in the kitchen and the wait staff and he was great. He was awesome. But he also then trained two to three hours a day. And he's been training at altitude. of course, I love fitness and stuff. So we talked a lot about it.

kept asking questions and it was really interesting to hear his thing he has ran a four minute

Four -minute mile. Four -minute mile, Anyways, his times are ridiculous. he a cross -country runner or a track? Shorter run. did, showed me the last day he was there, he ran at 70 or 7 ,500 feet elevation, which is a lot. He ran at a pretty high pace, seven miles at 530. At that elevation, just like in the normal world. This is ridiculous. for what that is, but there was all these different just

contracted back to work for it for a couple years, but he wanted to do something else. And the criteria was that he wanted to work for himself and he wanted something where his kids could work with them and then eventually take that over if they wanted to. So he didn't know anything about horses. So he sold some other company and bought the ranch. not for like a tremendous amount of money, but like, and like, so he still was working and he's like, we didn't have, like, it wasn't like a multimillion dollar sale, but anyways, he knew he wanted to get out of that and he exited out of it and got enough money. And then this just happened to come up for sale and they'd never,

back or right. I'm sure he's maybe been on a horse before, he's like, had no idea from like a horse hooves to its head. Yeah. And then he bought a ranch. That's all they do is that. And so they've been there for 13 years now and they're like right at the top 10, top 15, like family ranches in America. They only, it's called Lazy L &B.

L and B ranch. Yeah, because I've looked at all I wanted to go to one. Yeah. And so I've been actually looked at that one. Yeah. And so they only allow like 30 to 35 people a week and they keep it like a tight kind of environment. It was really fascinating. I know you agree with this. You really kind of find out about the ranch from like

employees after you get to know them a little bit. So we were actually chatting with some of the guy that took us fly fishing or some of the wranglers who had been at five other ranches. And they were like, he was like, this is the only ranch I come back to. And I was like, well, why is that? And he's like, well, the people, he's like, way they You find out the good things. Did they tell you anything negative? You know, they didn't. But you know what? I've been Good employee then. Hold on. But I've also been to other places like either like -

outfitting company that like you'll get with the guy and after a couple they're like yeah it's great here and then after a couple days they'll then start telling you not so great about it or like what's wrong with this whole thing or how they don't pay them enough for all these different things and everybody like unbeknownst would just

was forthright with their ability to say that. So it was very real. I'm sure there's some issues there, but it was very real in terms of them wanting to, this would be the only place they'd come back, and it was always awesome experience for all of us. Well, at the very least, they're loyal employees for not saying anything horrible, even if it's Exactly, but the other thing is they only stay there for five months anyway, so it's not like have anything to lose. Right, right. That's what it is. I did write a poem there. You did? my god, yes. You have to read it. I know it is. So every, it was hilarious. So every Friday,

Like you can either write a poem or do a skit or something along those lines for what it is Do they make you do this? was it? don't have to. This was optional. Wow. I got it was like Wednesday I sat down and like we had I just gotten we just got back from like a long ride and I did a run and There was a big river that's right there. So grabbed a glass of wine, which is always a great way to kind of go I sat with this river and wrote this poem. Okay, which actually pretty cool So I'll read it but it was was fun to actually write it for what it's called dusk till dawn. Okay, Ellie

From dusk till dawn the water sings, the rocks providing the bearings. The trees sway and lean, keeping us all in the green. From jumping horses to coyote canyon, the howls of the wolf ever so daring. Grizzlies make their way up high to fresh air that is beyond the sky. Give me a horse to cover and some stars to drift off under. The birds chirp and the grasshoppers zap, all part of God's country's tap. Your ears will ring from uncovering nature's bling.

No one knows what comes next except for the ones that find themselves fully blessed. Fires crackle and pop with light so bright there's no longer a fight. Airplane mode becomes the norm and new life is born. You may think you're a fool but only rivers provide the true pool. Flies are great but only if they are used as bait. Runs are flat and the winds are strong allowing you to uncover nature's bond.

You arrive as single ones only to realize that we are all one. From dusk till dawn is where you find your rest. So take these words and hold them close to your chest. I feel like It's right there, right? Yes. It was fun. That's awesome. Yeah, it was fun. Did you perform this? I did. At like the campfire or whatever? exactly. my god, that's awesome. thing, it was pretty cool. Yeah. That's so Anyways, was just, was, and there was honest, there was some other really.

poems that people kind of down and wrote and like people like I've never written a poem. Yeah, I'm like wonder like the creativity. Yeah, that's what it is. That's was just fun to do that. What you at one point in the personal like the Eagles like me you should be a poem writer. What is going on here? Like I'm like I'm not listening. am not listening to you anymore. Yeah, exactly. But it was great. And it it was again. I think it's a lot of the nature. Like would you have felt the same way if you spent a week?

in New York City.

It would have a different experience, I'm sure I could have found You probably would have felt the same. I would have. Hold think your environment can certainly have a different experience that you take in. But again, this is where I always go back to the only thing that anybody ever cares about in their life, right? Is how they feel inside. Now they don't say it like that. And really what that means is how is my energy doing today? Because if your energy is full and it's blissful and you feel uplifting, you could be in the city and be the best thing ever. And if your energy is

And it's blissful you may find yourself in nature and go I really prefer like this is wonderful like I want to be here But it's not like you're negative if you go to the city So it's not like being a doormat like you run over or not making decisions This is where I would get hung up though is because I agree with you and yet I there's the people's nature absolutely different exactly so

then why are some people, really do thrive. I would not thrive in the city, but yet we're saying, but I would, your energy would still feel good, you'd still be positive, but I don't know if I would. I don't thrive in that sort of environment. think what would happen is that, either, the way I always look at this is like,

If you find yourself in the city of having to move there for whatever reason, you're gonna do those different things, then why not have a good time doing it? That's the only thing I'm saying. Versus being like, man, every day I wish I was in nature, I wish I was back there, I wish I was doing these things. So I'll give you an example. We found a guy, he's actually, I could tell he was very intelligent, but his dad owned a very large...

attorney firm, a law firm, right outside of Westchester, inside of Westchester, and then moved out there, and he was supposed to be a lawyer, and he took a gap year and moved out to Wyoming and became a wrangler and never left. And he was working in construction. He actually taught himself how to sing, so he goes to these ranches now, and he sings and performs. He does poetry, and he sings, and I actually video, he's really Is he the one who told you you should be a poet? No, he didn't. My mind told me that. Nobody else told me that. So anyways, I had to talk to him for like an hour,

And he was really fascinating. He's actually moving back to New York. And he bought a house here on scene and he's like, you know, I love here. don't want to do that, but my parents are getting older and it's just the thing that I need to do. And so therefore, and he's like getting it. So he just, found himself and he's like, I never thought I would leave, but now all of a I find myself in situation where I need to go take my parents are in their seventies and I'm going to go take there. And he's like, they've got an upstate farm. I'm going to live near there. I'm going to take all the horses. And he's like, if I had my choice, I'd stay here. But he's like, I'm finding myself. And so I thought that was just a

a great way of like the surrender experiment of like just finding yourself. Cause there's so many people we were having this conversation offline though that just they're looking for either a career move or something different. It's like in really COVID when people settle down, I think it gave them a lot of reflection of their life. And I don't mean like, I'm gonna get a divorce, I'm gonna have kids, like in any of that, I think it just gave people space. And that's really what caused these, these kind of like what I wanna do with my life.

And again, I kind of walk through the process. Whenever that happens to me is like, for one, this is just an example. You could be like, well, I want to go build a business. that's what your mind's telling you to do. Or it's like, I want to sell my business and not do anything and go live on a farm because buying a dude ranch sounds awesome, right? Either one of those is still mind generated. And so for me, the process that I always like to do is like, the minute the question comes up or like the...

preference or choice you're going to make on this. Like again, it has to come up with first going what is not

what does the mind want? It's more of like, okay, the mind doesn't know the answer to this question. So if it doesn't know the answer to this question, because it's only going to give you the answer based on the experiences that you've had. That's the only thing that's going to do. And what you do is you go, you know, if I could have to take a job in Hawaii or New York and you go, well, Hawaii's got all this different things, it'd be really fun over there. And you start imagining what it would be like to live in one of these different scenarios. And you, it's almost like a movie rehearsal of how does that make you feel inside? Going back to the original point, the only people, the only things people really care about

is how their energy is doing inside. And then we just go and try to go to vacations or move to a place or do different things that turn that energy on more, which is natural for people to do that, by the way. And that's why it's not a natural process. That's also why people get so buried in work. It doesn't mean that they're not doing it for other reasons too, but most of them do it because they know they can turn themselves on when they get through work or do different stuff or not work, right? It's like, okay, now I don't work and I can turn myself on a bit.

You and I both know that either one of those, if you go lose yourself in work to the point where you're getting recognized and everyone's clapping, you get in their room, or you go completely away from that, they still have hollowness to them. Both of them. Yeah. I have so many thoughts of what you just said, but the first one is, you know what's really funny is how quickly people forget. absolutely. Meaning like, you can go and do all these really great things and be in the room and be the one up on stage speaking, but then like,

within a couple of weeks if you're not doing it, people just move on. That's where the fear comes in with most people. That's what drives so many people who doing it because they're so afraid to lose that and be forgotten or not relevant or significant anymore. This is what I always jump in and go the original conversation and take a step back and go, doesn't it matter?

It only matters to the next year anyways, or even next 50 years. Cause in a hundred years, anything, any project that you or I work on is not going to matter. I know that's, and again, and I don't mean that in like a negative way. I'm saying it for myself. Anything that we do, it's not really going to matter. I remember a podcast I listened to about like something, they said something about like, stop taking yourself so seriously. And I always think about that because I'm like, what am I doing that is so important? Nothing. Nothing I'm doing is so important except for to me is like how I am with my

husband or how I am with my family or friends or what I you know what I'm with myself yeah that's actually what's important all the other stuff is it's just not yeah

But we do take it so seriously. Because it feels like it's And I guess if you are doing good things in the world, like yes, is important. Well, hold on. Everything we do is important. Like you holding the door for a stranger, the difference of somebody having an amazing day that then allows them to say yes to someone. All these things kind of Yeah, I was listening again, listening to something or reading something, but they said about, like you really don't know what other people are going through. It reminded me so much of that door holding thing.

just being kind to other people, you don't know if that...

can sway their, it's a ripple effect. Everything you do really is a ripple effect. just see it so clearly that it's like you drop down here for a tiny period of time and it's like, go find something fun to do. Like that could be living in the woods. That's why it's like to me going out there and building a thousand person company is really no different than going out there or in like coaching or being a school teacher. wouldn't always use that. A bus driver or, or a writer that just only writes. I'm thinking about being a librarian. Any of these things. And then again, but the thing is that you get the point. like,

It's only the human mind that has put people that have more like influence, whatever it is, has more value. But the problem is that doesn't work. Right. And how quickly does it come and go? And it's just that you got to keep it, you got to do these different things, you got to fight with it. It's like Elon Musk said when we were talking about him earlier, he was like, nobody wants to be me. He's like, it's basically miserable inside.

That's literally what he said. mean, it was like, it's like this point where he's willing to take to make those sacrifices. Like I personally would not be. No, he's just, he's willing to basically for him, for whatever reason, that drive and vision, forget about him because he's just an anomaly. Like he's a very unique individual that eight billion people that are here, but just generally when we wake up, it's like, okay. Then it's like people get in this thing. It's like, do it.

The only thing that matters is that you're enjoying your experience here. This is what my point I was trying to say is it doesn't matter what you're actually doing. The thing that actually matters is you literally enjoying your experience, which can be, again, can be you enjoying your experience, which is building a massive company or like Michael Singer that time when I was hanging out with him, he was just like, that was, that was there and gone. I'm no longer doing any of that. And it's like, it's very clear. And he's like, I've been out in the woods and now people come and I ensure I teach a couple of days,

He was teaching three days a week for 50 years when there was only six people there or three people there. Right now there's people from all over the country. because he, like even the whole business thing for him, we'll use him as an example, is it because he's like been there, like he's bored with it, he's like I've been there, done that and I need new experience or is it because he fundamentally changed and therefore what he did does everyday changes? What he said to me was when we first started having a conversation, it was more of like he's like,

I know you're in business, Adam. I don't really want to talk about business. I've been there and done that. I'm like, well, what does that mean? He's like, well, surrendering to my life, he wrote about it in the Surrender Experiment, brought me these wonderful kind of experiences that I had building these companies. He's like, I had no idea what even a board of directors was. had to look it up when people told me they were doing this. And then all of sudden, they just, he's like, found ourselves just selling the company because people came in there. And it's like, sure, I could have like gone out there and been, he was incredibly smart, right? So he could have gone out there and build another company or done anything else. But he's like, it was so clear to

to me that this chapter was done. It wasn't, and that's what it all meant. Like he was just like, it's all he said about it was just like, it was so clear to me that that was no longer part of my life, like being in business. And then he didn't, and then he wrote his books.

And now he's become an author, which again, know, he teacher and different things that are there, which he was always teaching and writing during that time. Just now he had more time to focus on it. But like I said, because at that time I was, I was struggling with my own kind of like choices. And I asked him, he just said, look, he said, it's just, said, when you get out of your own personal mind, life will just do its dance for you. And that's those are the words he used. And that's kind of like what I always say is like, and get out of it. Don't ask your mind for the answer. Cause it doesn't know. And that's the one thing he kept drilling into me is like, your mind does not know the answer.

It only knows the answers based on the experiences you had. And the only experiences you had are a fraction of what's actually out there. That's why when people go to a farm for the first time and they never had that experience, go, I would love to do this. I could have seen myself, by the way Well, conversely, they say, my God, I cannot be here. exactly, yeah. Or one of the either one does that mean you have, like even back, would you hear examples of like Hawaii and wherever, whatever, New York.

So I get that it's really because we're thinking about moving in a couple of years. So we're like, well, where are going to move? And it's very doing research and what are the tax laws in different states and, you know, all of that. And yet on our way back from Maine, we actually stopped because we're thinking about moving to New Hampshire. So we stopped at a couple of towns on the way, the towns that we thought were going to be like the ones that we wanted to live in from a research perspective. But then immediately one of them we were it was feeling. But is this is that like the inner knowing or whatever?

but we were like, this is, we couldn't even really articulate what was wrong with it. We were just like, this is definitely not where we're supposed to be. But did we have to experience that in order to make that decision? Or do we just? all the experience is making it wiser. I think the key is you don't allow the experience to. Because otherwise, how do you decide when move? you don't want the experience to have a direct influence on the personal mind.

And all that really means is that the personal mind will only make decisions on what experience that has had. Right. We've covered that. But think about how many experiences it hasn't had. So you could be missing. You could you're now making a slight decision. And again, then your mind will jump in and go, well, of course, I have to make decisions based on that. So just be careful not to listen to it again, because it'll say that the way that this is why Michael Singer, just as an example, wrote the entire surrender experiment was because he basically just would surrender not to.

being a doormat and letting everything run over him, but you're starting to the personal mind trying to make the personal decisions for you. That's all that surrender means, it's why people get it wrong. This is why like, as you use that example, and I've used this many times in my own life, which is like, when I go, when I am facing a tough decision, even right now, I'm like kind of facing a tough decision and I'm like, the mind goes.

I would go to the mind and the mind would then go, of course you're gonna, you're gonna do this. And this is why it's gonna be there. And then five seconds later, literally it's like taking the complete opposite approach to this and going, well, you could use, why would you do that? Stupid, why do you do this? And I'm like, you don't, and the literal, is the, my inner conversation, I go, you don't know, dude. And I go, I appreciate the fact that you're trying to help move the decision. You actually don't know. And then, and this, so then from there, then it goes, okay, now I'm gonna look for.

life unfolding. You want to call that a clue, you want to whatever it is. Sign. Sign, whatever it is you want to call it, it doesn't matter. Life does unfold. So that's when you go and you say, show me something. Like, let's see what goes out there. And every time I've done that, I've shared these personal ones with you before, but every time I've done that, it's been clear. It's been very clear. But, and yes, I agree with that. And, but I also feel like you need, you can't.

Just like literally sit back passively and wait for a sign personally I think you do need to and that's why I'm like, okay We'll try this we'll try this or we'll try this. Take some sort of action. Do I like this workout class? Do I like this workout class? Do I know it's not about being lazy? That's no I don't it's lazy but for me lazy and passive run the same thing. but being like just saying okay universe So show me a sign. I'm just gonna sit here and wait to me It's like you've got to keep you got to keep taking action because otherwise you got to experience well as an example as an example of this right like

I've sold many of my personal houses and it's always been a question of mine like do I keep it? I sell it? I like joy building a lot and some of those things right so if you go well you know you probably should sell it it's like okay well I'm just gonna see if anybody randomly shows up at my house and offers to buy my home right like to me that's being very passive whereas the other way of doing is being like you know what I'm gonna go and I should be proactive I'm gonna put it on the market I'm gonna get it out there and then if nobody buys it then like you then you either

the price or you sell it differently from what it is or you get 10 offers exactly and then you go now see that we're on to this next thing but i actually even think that okay you got 10 offers and then it's then then sometimes you need that to say okay great i'm going to take one or you're like whoa actually i don't really want to sure either one of those yeah but

I don't even know what that really means other than like, I do think that, yeah, you just need to like be trying things and taking action. to like spiritual, outer, personal growth, decisions is the hardest thing for anybody to understand. And this is why even when we started this conversation on vacation, that's why I using that kind of an example, that guy, know, he found himself in a business by the way that he had no idea he was going to a dude ranch.

He owned a very engineering type business and like he never that was never been on the radar and then all of sudden he was like what the story was it was like you know they're sitting there for two years trying to figure it out so like they're basically looking for a sign and they happen to be driving in the area they happen to saw the sign drove right by it they pulled it up the agent actually happened to call them so they went looked at the same day all lined up for these different things they gave them the stuff they met with the owners they enjoyed like it was just boom boom boom boom right but you know but yeah and I just think of course you can only connect

the dots moving backwards, can't do it forward.

It does make me think like when I was little, did I think I wanted to be a chief of staff or do a podcast? I didn't even know what a podcast was. No, no. And but then I'm actually wondering for you, like, I know you kind of knew you wanted to be in business, but like, you when you were you like, I'm going to be a real estate agent and I'm going to grow a huge real estate company. No, you had no clue. In fact, if you would have asked me like even during college, it was nothing to do with real estate. Yeah, I mean, it had everything to do with being actually I would have convinced everybody that I've been on Wall Street. Right.

where I wanted And I was going to be in New York City working at Cosmo Magazine. Same thing for Wall Street. Could you imagine? And that was just all ego. Even building a business, I've been very open about this many times, but building a business was all ego for me in the beginning. It was all ego. It was all about money. It was all about getting that.

And again, it made me successful, right? It got me a lot of money and it got me a lot of people in order to ride and all that stuff. I feel it's almost like I've walked in the rooms and a thousand people clap. It's also hard to then look, cause I see this a lot. I actually love your perspective on this because I'm seeing this a lot recently where a lot of like successful people or coaches are saying, okay, just work four days a week. Make sure you have really great work life balance while you're building your business and what are all these things.

And for me, or even in your career, like make sure you put really strict boundaries around your career. And I'm like, well, I wouldn't have been able to take off a year and do nothing if I hadn't worked my ass off for 10 years. And similarly, like...

I would feel like it would be so disingenuous for me to say like, make sure as an EA or a chief of staff, you have really great boundaries and you make sure you tell your executive no all the time. I mean, yes, I there's a benefit of telling them no, but you know what I'm saying? Like, like, no, you really have like, I believe in hard work and like putting in the time and the energy. I don't know how what your philosophy on that is, but I do see that a lot in the business world. It's like, well, I would build your business differently than I did. like, but would you be sitting here being able to say that if you didn't put in what

you put in. You know, I share a similar philosophy. Let's give a different perspective on this. I actually don't think it has anything to do with the amount of hours that you work. I agree. It's not that it's not the hours or the boundaries or any of these things. don't think intensity. mean, it's all a little bit of it. Hold on. First of all, if you're building a business, it's going to be freaking hard. It's going to be the hardest. It's going to be long hours. That's the point. you're starting with unless you want to take 40 years to build it, even then, like it's just like there's a time and.

space thing that if you don't get stuff to the market and don't get it right or don't keep up with those different things. I've said this on every almost every podcast I've been asked a question or live interview and people like in the beginning I was working seven days a week, 10 hour days right and I actually but the thing is I enjoyed it. I really enjoyed it like there was not it never thought about work to me. In fact I think about this now every now and then I just I just chuckle about this. you know like I would travel once or twice a month for years I was doing this right and I loved it by the And I would go with you a

I also loved it. Now it's like getting on a plane now I want to like do anything but except for one with my family But like it's like besides that like I literally don't want to travel for those things Yeah, and it's just it's it's a really it's just it's for me. It just happened to be you know again I go back to those days was it like that was all part of the the season of life that I was in and I'm gonna say from season from two different perspectives one from like building a business and money also from an egoic standpoint to is also the season of the ego for me, which was like

I like when I show up and there's 300 people in a room and they're all telling you how freaking wonderful you are and taking photos with you. There's an element that feels really amazing. Here we go for all those different things. And for me, and I know you've, you watch this, it got to a point where I actually stopped enjoying that. I actually stopped getting the applause. I didn't want it. I didn't want the pictures. didn't want - I wonder if when it, did it ever, when it started feeling, cause you said it didn't used to feel like work. Did it, when it started to feel like work, did you enjoy it, start enjoying it less? You know, I felt more like a fraud.

than anything, it felt more like I had so much personal work to do. This is where I started really using different language in business, like when it started about all personal growth, all spiritual growth for me, because it felt like I could started seeing how, like before I think I was oblivious to how egoic I was, even during those times, like how much I wanted things for other reasons. And then when I started getting deeper and uncovering more and more and becoming more and.

tune if you want to will or more spiritual if you will every moment is releasing more I got glimpses of seeing how that ego is actually making me act and I was like holy shit and it's like well I'm teaching everybody about this is almost like I can't teach it anymore because like I I know what I need to work on and I'm go work on that and then it's more than it's like well I can still be open like this and say I'm far from there but here are the things that I'm working on because there's always somebody that's ahead of you and there's somebody that's trying to learn from where you are

And so that's why I think it's important to kind of narrate these things because I think there's a lot of people in this question. That's why I always come back to it as just take a step back. Is nothing wrong with doing anything that you're doing, right?

Speaking right it's just now you look at and go how do I now start and this is the single question I always ask myself every day which is how do I just enjoy whatever I'm doing and I'm the thing the simple things like actually like getting up and making cup of coffee or driving my kids to School like I really enjoy those things. No what Instagram calls that? Romanticizing your life. Yeah, that's why I guess But it's all those things already like walking to the bathroom like the other day I was yesterday I got done a bike ride and I was

I felt hurried to do all those things and I went to go jump into the river because my back was hurting so I wanted to ice that and I remember just like walking I'm like just enjoy, I was just reminding myself just your one step I feel the rocks crumble and people hear that in their busy environment they go yeah it must be nice it's like no you can do that in any project you're doing in any city bus and any plane anywhere you can do you can walk to the bathroom and you know what helps when you're not on your phone yes exactly and I was and

Because half the time when we're walking down the street, what are we doing? We're staring at our phone. And it is very hard to, I'm not saying not being on your phone solves all problems, but it does solve a lot of them. And that's why I always come back to, which is why for me personally, I'm just not on any social media. Just because I have, though I have, I enjoy Substack now.

because it's more, it's not really social media, it's more of like newslettery. It's articles like a medium slash newsletter. You know, it's, it's so that I can, can cure, you can curate your input. Yeah. That's what I call them. But anyway, so for, for staycations vacations, I think in general, just watch your, the message that I would just take home with people is just watch like, you really using a vacation to distract yourself from yourself, which is what, which is fine if that's what you're going to do, but then try to go back.

into your life and do that work so you don't need to do it. That way if you take vacation, it's just you enjoy it. You enjoy wherever you're going, whether it's just going to see family or you're going to Greece or wherever it is that you're going. just bring it back to relax, release, and then act. Relax, release, and act in each thing that you're doing to allow a little bit more inner peace in all the things you get to do.