It’s me, Mark Stone, and in this episode of the Backseat Driver Podcast, I speak with Katarina Kyvalova, a remarkable talent whose rise in motorsport has been as rapid as it has been impressive.

Katarina talks about where her passion for cars began, shaped by early influences and a deep appreciation for classic machinery, despite having no direct family background in motorsport. We focus on her love for the iconic Austin-Healey and the bold decision to race such a demanding car, a moment that defined her commitment and resilience as a driver.

I explore with Katarina her move from classic competition into modern racing, where the contrasts in performance, driving style, and expectations have pushed her to adapt and grow at speed. She shares the challenges that come with that transition, along with the excitement of testing herself in new environments.

This episode is a story of perseverance, passion, and ambition, capturing the mindset required to succeed in competitive motorsport and the determination to keep moving forward.

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I'd like to introduce the backseat driver, a lady rally driver, racing driver, who in, I suppose you could say a relatively short period of time, has become a racing phenomena with the rapid progress of her career.

She's also on the backseat driver in many ways, courtesy of the European correspondent Marie Katharine Linney.

So, without further ado, I would like to introduce Katerina Kialova to the backseat driver.

Welcome, Katarina.

Yes, hello.

Thank you for inviting me.

Hi.

Now, before we get into your virtual meteoric career, where does the passion for classic cars and motor racing come from?

Is it a family thing or are you the first?

Well, it's very difficult to say.

I don't have any family story, the usual story from father or from brother, that it just jumps, jumped on me.

I always say the cars found me.

My brother's 13 years older than me.

Yeah.

So I think, I guess that I played with his small cars when, when I was a child.

I, I, I guess maybe, maybe there was an influence from his side.

But I really very early to sort of developed relationships to everything what was moving, you know, with four wheels.

I, I rather was, you know, on a small car than played with doll.

Really think that is coming from very early age.

So no story what's whatsoever.

So it's, it's purely passion, which I discovered for myself.

And very clearly there was not like slowly development into anything.

It was my first driving classic car and I knew, like, blame me.

I mean, this is, this is, this is, this is great.

I love this.

So from the cool driver's seat, there's a friend.

I moved to driver's seat by accidentally, pretty much.

And here you go.

I knew.

That's it.

That's me.

That's me done with hobbies now.

I know I read somewhere about you.

Your first classic was an Austin Healey and you still own it.

Correct.

Correct.

That's my, it's my baby.

It's a, it's a big Healey.

The classic combination.

And yeah, I just drove this car everywhere I could literally, like around the corner to pop and drove from Hamburg all the way to Goodfoot for many years for festival speed and revival.

It's a long way, trust me, with a ferry.

And so I spent really many miles in this car and, and obviously it's just made my, you know, relationship to cars in general even stronger.

And I love it.

I still have it and it's, it's in Germany with me in my garage and stroke it from time to time and driving around the City.

Yeah.

I mean they were a phenomenal rally car.

I mean Pat Moss etc drove them to great success and in England of course they're known as the big banger heel is because of the engine.

I mean they are a big heavy car to drive, aren't aren't they?

Yes, well, they definitely are.

And, and it's a funny thing.

I fell entirely in love with Austin Healeys because I had this, you know, first car as we all, we, as we all do.

We love our first car, don't we?

And when I decided to go racing and then the whole, on the whole story about that, I thought I know Austin Healey pretty well so I could actually have my first race car.

Austin Healey again.

Yeah.

So what was the.

Partly a slight big mistake because you usually don't start with a big engines like 3 liter, you know, happy tail car.

And all my friends said, oh my goodness, you're crazy.

This is a grown up car.

You are just not starting racing and mainly in the UK in the rain in a big Healey.

But yeah, somehow I got over the period.

But I can definitely confirm it's a great car and as you said, at most and many others just did great, great rallies and admire them because these cars are not easy to handle.

Not always.

I mean they're also a car perfect for the big rallies like Liege, Rome.

Liege, the big heavy duty long distance rallies and they performed incredibly well on them.

So.

And once again it's, it's like you said, it's not a car you would really associate as a first classic.

Don't take this the wrong way, it's not a car you would associate as a woman's first classic.

Well, here you go.

You said Pen Moss, so I could argue this one, but no, they are, it's, it's, it's a gorgeous car.

Yeah.

So I always, you know, I think it's a female approach to cars and I always, you know, catch myself that I still have this female approach means the car, the car should look nice and beautiful.

I should have a nice shape.

So I definitely did.

The reason why I went for Stahli river to begin on was because it just looks so gorgeous.

It's a lovely car.

Yeah.

But here you go.

It's a wolf and a sheepskin, so it drives.

You can really have one hell of fun at this bird everywhere on the rallies and racing.

So I remember when I did my first track day after I got in the Race car.

Right.

I race tractors in British racing green.

Also gorgeous.

And it's been raining cuts docks and, and I was in Goodwood on the circuit doing my, my first laps and I really asked myself like what the hell doing here?

Why.

Well this is normal goals don't do this.

And obviously I regret it for a couple of lives that I got this car because I simply wasn't used to, to, to.

To the power and in the rain and, and how the car was moving around and was very impressed.

What's this car is actually capable or capable of.

And years years later, Jeremy Welch this particular car again.

Oh yeah, members meeting again.

And I watched him, we shared my car and I watched him how he handles this car.

Watched on board footage and very impressive.

And yes, Austi Healey is a perfect car.

Now after so many years when I see it and I've grown into that more, I can say yes, it's maybe not the perfect beginner's car, but definitely a keeper for rallies and racing.

So yeah, I love it.

I'll tell you what it is.

I can remember that during my racing career I used to sit on a grid and think no sane person does this.

You soon forget that when you, when you set off.

But no, at times you do wonder why you do it because it's probably not, as a friend of mine said, it's not something the same person goes and do.

Goes to do.

But as somebody also once said, racing drivers are incorrectly wired.

Yeah, I could definitely underline that.

That's, that's, that's correct.

There's something wrong with this.

Now you started out doing long distance road rallies, didn't you?

Like the, the historic road rallies and navigation runs.

Yeah, it's, it's a funny thing because I didn't really entirely started it.

I maybe went back into rallies because my old, all my passion for cars started, you know, just driving around the city.

Then I joined the Classic Car Club, local classic car club in Germany, did some drives around and, and then later on a couple of years later I started to do classic car rallies in the uk.

Yeah, so like Flying Scotsman Thousand, my trial, the pre war rallies because I really love pre war cars.

This is where my love to cars is coming from.

So I used to do little bit of these, you know, local, local rallies and only then I went to racing and you know, didn't do any reading at all.

So now after so many years, I would say like so many years, 10 years when I'm racing, I, you know, I don't want to Say like I got bored.

That would be really like not the right expression.

But there are so many ways how you can, how you can do cars, right?

Yeah.

So if it's racing, if it's rallying or driving around, I really sort of had a feeling I would love to do cars in a different way again.

Yeah.

So he.

And that was it.

And obviously it was on my bucket list.

Beijing to Paris for so, so many years.

I think everyone who loves cars knows this trip, knows this challenge and I thought like this is just the right time to do it.

You mentioned the peaking to Paris and you partnered with a former guest of mine, Patrick Watts, who is a very, very forceful characterist.

Patrick, how did that come about?

Yeah, yeah.

How did that come about?

Yeah.

Well, here you go.

Patrick and Beijing to Paris.

I mean he's a great touring car driver, isn't he?

I mean he really knows what is he doing out there.

But the tricky thing on the Beijing to Paris is it's five weeks pure driving off road.

It's not what we do usually on the racetracks, is it like it's not like 20 minutes or one hour in 24 hour race.

That's totally different gig out there.

And I think we all learned this lesson, included Patrick.

Yeah.

And yeah, we had highs and lows.

I would say Patrick spent lots of time fixing the car.

I remember that I think almost at some point he was laughing and saying wolf didn't break on our car.

So he is the most funniest stories.

And yeah, we had one with Patrick which is quite fun.

They lost the spare tire from the car from the back.

Yeah.

You know you off roading quite a lot and it's very rough and the tire just fel of the car and we found it and we knew there and ahead of us.

So spare tire is a quite essential, you know, spare part.

So we thought, okay, we tried to take it with us and we were in a Mustang and a four Mustang.

So I literally squeezed the tire into the cockpit inside and I was sitting with this car with this tire on my lap for next 40km on an off road, you know, jumping and gravel or everything.

And it was Patrick's tire and and I have to.

When we arrived, they absolute, absolutely couldn't believe what we've done.

And you know, free beer for the rest of the day because this is what you do and this is what we obviously don't do in the touring car races or other, other ac.

Another pad rp.

When do you do it?

So yeah, many, many good stories and we all finished and we all had a great fun and definitely it was experience for whole life, I would say.

Yeah, for sure.

Now after you'd done one of the big UK rallies, historic rallies, somebody kindly suggested that you may take up racing.

And from there came the Bentley Bells and straight into even with no you got a license straight into a 24 hour race.

I mean that is not a normal progress, is it?

Yeah.

Well this is what we had the topic before, isn't it Mark is I started with Big Healey as on my first race car.

What is also not the usual where you start.

So it was sort of.

It was a team with me doing.

Doing it from the wrong.

Wrong end.

Yeah, yeah, that's, that's pretty right.

You know, my friends, my British friends with baddie Betty influence I always say are responsible for.

For this.

I actually pretty much responsible for my racing because out of fun, out of fun idea, out of you know, my idea to just do it just out of you know, reason I want to do it, I want to prove it to myself to everyone else and I, I can do it.

Yeah.

I committed to these 24 hours in Portima which is.

Is you know, very demanding on technical circuit.

I never raised in my entire life.

I never even walked on a race circuit in my life.

I didn't know what is an apex and nothing.

So I was just this visitor in Goodwood for years.

Yeah.

Sitting on the grandstands and found it amazing and always wanted to do it one day myself.

This is what I knew but not really in a Pre or Bentley and not to start in a 24 hours in Portimao.

That wasn't my plan.

Yeah.

But here you go.

Yes.

After in the end of this rally we, we had a couple of drinks as opinion but the best ideas, there's always some, some wine or whatever whiskeys involved.

And this is how it all happened.

I said yeah, I, I do it, I do it and I don't do it only myself.

I do only because that's the only thing you.

You had to find what you might call three more willing victims to form the Bentley Bells.

I mean no, nobody had any idea of this.

How did you go about finding the other ladies to suddenly join in with this?

Yeah, well that's my.

You know, I knew a couple of people from the rallies but I was looking for ladies And I didn't meet any who was driving or racing.

Not that.

No, not at that particular time.

Yeah.

So yeah it was actually doing the BSCC club.

Oh yeah.

Which was Patrick Blackney Edwards.

He said okay, do you know I send them, I sent a message, I sent an email and let's see maybe there are some girls might be interested and also other friends just ask around and and the whole message was like look there is one crazy girl living in Germany and she wants to do this and she never raised before is someone out there would do it.

So it sounded like okay, no one is going to even call ever because you know just the information itself was crazy enough.

But here you go.

You know I met my three girls and they were up to this challeng.

This is why I love you guys, you know in the UK because you are up to all kind of fun and we never met, they never driven a pre war Bentley.

So I was just going to say if you don't mind me busting in you.

You were asking them not only to drive in a 24 hour race on a very difficult circuit but it's a case of by the way, you'll be driving one of the heaviest vintage cars ever built.

Yeah, yeah that's as you, as you do a go.

Right.

We were the lightest drivers and the heaviest car was easy to do obviously and yet all of them had some experience, none of them in a Bentley.

And as you surely know the gearbox in the Bentley, it's a kind of thing.

It's not that easy.

It's not that easy to get out and change gears.

They poor girls had no idea what they just sign up to and we had pretty much no time to meet.

Not really.

Yeah, we met literally in Portimao and we were practicing in the backyard, you know and trying, you know I tried to show them how to do it you know with other friends like you know if you change gear like this.

And yeah when Google struggled a little bit me to me included, I wasn't also you know that that experience by then yet.

And we decided that we're going to change the gear from first to fourth straight away.

We missed these two gears in between.

Yeah.

Because that's the easiest way.

We just saved the gearbox, we saved the car and it really, you know, it was just our helping tool but in the end of the day it helps us because we really indeed saved the car and finished 24 hours without any kind of technical issues.

So yeah, that how we go through.

I mean it's always a well Known saying if you can't hear the gear change on a Bentley, you've either A, got it right or B, destroyed the gearbox.

Yeah, well, that's, that's an interesting one.

I think when you destroy the gearbox, you're not moving at all.

That stops.

So, yeah, we had some crunches along the way.

But look, it was, it was just, it was just the whole thing like all the endurance races and rallies you want to finish and we were so well prepared with our strategies.

We have a fielding strategy and timings and I think we nailed it on that side and you know, this sort of minor thing, we're changing gears at that time.

We're like, ah, we get to get her out with it.

So, you know, here you go.

And we loved it.

We loved it.

And all of us, we did more rallies and racing afterwards and you know, and that was my absolutely begin and kick off for racing because I felt entirely in love here.

Do the Bentley Bells still exist?

We, of course, we all exist, but life is funny.

So one of our Bentley bells became mother.

But it's wonderful.

But it's not easy as a mother, you know, find time and, you know, ditch family and go and race somewhere.

So to manage sort of the right timing, the way all of us, we can do something is quite tricky.

But yes, we did good with revival together.

We do sometimes, like two of us only.

Right.

Because this, there are not so many races.

Yeah.

Not so many events where we, all of us can drive.

That's the biggest issue on that.

So we did with it and just recent, that we did Spa, obviously we did back in time, we did Askari, we did some rallies together.

So yeah, we did millimeter ones together, all of us.

Yeah.

And so, yeah, when the opportunity is there, we always somehow get together.

But it's, it's became a trick.

I'm not gonna lie.

Here we go.

No, no, we are, we are there.

And, and there are many other young girls asking if they can join or try.

So, yeah, a little bit play with the thought, you know, if, if we are inspiration for the others, how to, how to, you know, views or what to do with the Bentley Bell's story to inspire others.

Yeah, yeah, maybe that could be something.

Now, from there, from the Bentleys, I mean, I conclude you still own it.

I mean, I've seen you on television, etc at the circuits and you seem to drive a healthy selection of classic sports cars like that Jaguar.

I've seen you driving quite a Lot of things.

What else do you drive besides the Bentley and the Jaguar?

Yes, that's, that's right.

I, I moved two sports cars.

What was obvious step from pre Wolf.

You know once you do racing you want to do something more sporty.

And and as.

As I said before Goodwood was my big aim, big goal.

So I was, I was really looking for car which is eligible for Goodwood.

I'm getting that was really.

There was idea behind it.

And then I came across this Cooper Jaguar which has been recommended to me as a look.

There's a car which did good watch nine hours spending time.

Yeah.

So what is like perfect.

So this is how I actually got this car.

But and that The Cooper Jaguar T33 is a grown up race car.

And I really have to admit I'm embracing for so many years I'm still growing into that car.

It's really, it's.

It's a car you really have to know what are you doing out there.

Yeah and it's, it's.

It's a fast sports racer and I'm okay with it.

I'm good.

But I remember my first years especially in wet.

It's a.

It's a very happy car and you know there's a strong engine in the front like that back.

Wow.

You know I was really thinking maybe I shouldn't have bought this power but I love it now and I get on and I had many good races in it.

So that is.

That was indeed my, my.

My start in the sports cars.

I raised category e type.

Yeah.

365 in you know different, different series and yeah then I'll be sharing from time to time with friends pre 63e types.

I do love E types quite a lot.

And then race my Healey or be my big Healey as we discussed.

And then I moved a little bit to GT4 to modern cars and did endurance racing for a couple of years.

24 hour races.

So it was just you know logic sort of move.

You know you start somewhere pre war eagle sports cars and you go a little bit modern.

Everything everything seems to be so interesting.

You know once, once one is in cars I wanted to try everything.

You know I raced radicals a little bit in in the US and so everything what is moving and racing I wanted to have a go and try.

So yeah that's, that's what I actually did so far.

But yeah I still have my Bentley and love it and drive it, race it and that's the same sports car as the Cooper and then the E type.

So yeah, let's do the one model.

So my main cars are my driving and it's enough, I have to say.

What made you want to switch?

I mean you drove also a Mercedes Benz AMG GT4 in the 24 hour of Dubai.

I mean how did that come about?

How, how did the move into modern GT racing come about?

Yeah, they're back, back to France with bad influence, right?

At France with bad influence.

It was that and thank God, you know, they influenced me because in the historic racing there are many, there are many guys, many friends who do also modern racing, right?

Yeah, so all used to do.

So I have, you know, in my team there were a couple of guys, they used to do British GT or you know what different, different racing.

You know, Michael driver, Phil Keane for example, he, you know, he races all sorts of stuff.

So I was listening, I was watching them, you know, the weekend, watching their races and yeah sure.

I, I thought like wow, that, that looks like serious, that looks like real racing.

I would love too.

So the step was again there, the idea was there and it was very easy to you know, to be born then by them like okay, have a go try and so yeah, I did a track day, absolutely loved it and said yeah, why not?

I, I have a goal.

So ended up with this GT4 Mercedes AMG and back to, back to beauty.

I, I'm, you know, I was like this is a great car.

The sound is the best you know in the pad org I have to have it and because I love endurance, right.

In endurance racing it's also, I straigh sort of aimed the 24 hour races.

So yeah, two races in Dubai and Portimao.

Back to Portimao after so many years and it was a sort of feeling, it's a funny feeling.

I was very happy and, and I told it.

Wow.

This, this is a great moment, you know, to see the sunrise and the same track of a little bit more serious, little bit more serious car and everything.

So yeah, here we go.

That, that, that's the story behind the modern racing and I still love it.

Every time I get hands on something more modern it's, it's, that's a different thing and it's great fun.

Yeah, I mean modern drive racing, a modern car and a 24 hour race.

It's a whole different mindset to racing vintage cars and classic cars.

I mean at Goodwood and places like that, it's as much a social event as it is a racing event.

Racing a modern car in 24 for 24 hours, it isn't a social event anymore, is it?

It's a very, very serious thing.

So how did you find this transition from shall we say, enjoying yourself at Goodwood to being in a, basically a professional team in a modern car at a 24 hour race?

Yeah, that's a very good question.

It is absolutely different world as you described before.

It's something you can hardly compare classical racing to modern racing.

The teams are more serious.

Everyone is focused on themselves.

You're focused on yourself as a driver.

I felt immense pressure, pressure on myself because I didn't want to let down the team.

Yeah, you know, I was thinking this is, this was the biggest difference for me in sense of right.

If we do something wrong in the classic car racing, one, one race, one driver race, okay, it's my fault.

I, it is my responsibility.

But here is the whole effort.

Going abroad and have a four drivers, 24 hours.

I really felt this pressure as a rookie.

I was like oh gosh, that would be disaster.

But that's a little bit why I didn't even got there and even got into racing because this is my personal thing.

I always put pressure on myself so I can't, I can't pull back.

I have to stay with, you know, with the goal which you put in front of me and this is how I move forward.

And I thought, well I'm not going to die in these 24 hours.

Somehow I will get over it.

But I have to admit that I really prepared quite a lot at the first 24 hour race.

Took so seriously.

I was like, you could Compare it to 24 hours lemon or something.

You know, I've really had sort of, I prepared physically, you know, my co. And, and everything, you know, training obviously no alcohol for buns and whatsoever and.

Watched just putting in.

That's the difference.

And good Goodwood, you can hop out and have a glass of champagne and commiserate.

Sadly, this is why we love it.

You can't do that in a modern 24 hour race.

No, you can't.

You can't really, you could but maybe it's not very what I would recommend to be fair.

But obviously no, no, it's, it's, it's very different.

But on the other hand it's, it's great and I love it.

You know this telemetric data, your whole head is into that and that's.

That's fantastic.

That's great.

I mean we know classic cars, we just have fun.

Yeah.

Of course we try to do our best but compared to the modern racing, you can't really cheat in sense of they all.

They know exactly in.

In your team knows exactly what are you doing out there?

Right.

All the data they get led by lab.

There are no excuses.

There's no book.

No.

A huge book of excuses.

Right.

So and, and this is, this is a good.

Because we have to work.

I had to work on myself and, and I knew like okay, well I can't hide this one.

That was clearly, you know, me being blonde or fee.

Well, it wasn't good and I have to do better next level.

So I love that.

Yeah.

As a challenge, I really, really enjoyed it.

Enjoyed the level of, you know, professional racing and yeah, here you go.

But everybody helped me.

I have to say without the team, without my co drivers who gave me the guidance, it's through these years, it's through these races, I wouldn't be there.

I wouldn't have done that.

So yeah, big, big deal.

So to me that's the other thing.

You're.

You're racing a vintage Bentley and if you've a problem with the car then you want a better term drive around it.

You just car best as you can in a modern GT car, a modern endurance car.

You are constantly adjusting them, resetting things, checking telemetry and altering things as you drive around.

I mean how did you teach yourself to be able to do all this?

I mean you would have had lessons but I mean driving a modern racing car, you're not just sat behind the wheel steering it, are you?

There's a lot to be doing whilst you're in it.

Yeah, that's, that's right.

And I had at that point I had no idea what, what I am supposed to do.

Right.

So it was, it was a learning process.

Learning, but doing quite a lot.

So only while testing I realized exactly all these buttons in the car.

Right.

I have look at my etab.

Okay.

Is maybe they awesome.

But, but the Bentley, right.

There are some switches or whatsoever but they are not using anything.

So it is, is.

It is indeed like going in the rocky rocket ship compared to the prevail cars.

Yeah.

Go to modern car.

On the other hand you say that on the other hand you do less in the modern car.

Yes, the car does so much for you.

So I had the issues rather with using My steering quite a lot.

Right?

Yeah.

So used from classic cars correcting everything.

Right.

So I had to more learn even be more steady.

Right.

Don't steer too much.

Don't, don't, don't, don't steer the car.

For example, second thing which was a huge thing breaking the braking points.

Right.

I was braking slowly because you do, can't you, you do.

And, and once I did a millimillion right after millimillion of lose poor recar for two days testing in the GT4.

And it was very funny because everybody like saying you just drove the bendy, right.

We can literally tell you're like breaking think 40 meters earlier.

Like it's a, it's your head, it's to mind and that to find my own mind.

I think that was the biggest, it was the biggest deal and you know, slowly I got into that.

I'm sure you do.

And it's just the confidence to trust yourself and the confidence and get over the, the level like okay, I, I, I trust the car with the, we get around the corner with this picture speed.

So that, that is it.

I mean it's interesting you mentioned that.

I mean I drive my everyday car and then I, it's like yesterday afternoon I went out in the sports car and all of a sudden you're breaking.

Okay.

You're on public roads, a fast public road and you're breaking for a corner where you would normally break in your everyday car.

And you think I don't need to break till another 40 yards before I.

In the sports car.

That's it.

That's it.

You know exactly what I'm talking about.

Exactly.

It's so difficult, isn't it?

It's so difficult to tell your head no.

It's, you can break, I don't know, 20 meters later.

Yeah.

And it takes a couple of laps together.

I also think it's a female male.

You guys, you guys, you, you just go for it quite quickly.

Yeah.

I have to trust it.

I think it's also girly.

Not sure.

Let me, let me find out.

So now, I mean that's one thing your comments on Formula W, Formula Woman.

I mean I've interviewed a lot of lady racing drivers and not very many of them approve of Formula W. And I've always said, and they've always said racing is a great leveler.

It doesn't matter whether you're male, female.

I'll probably get into trouble for that.

That.

But on a circuit you are a driver in a car and you set off on an equal Footing.

And I've always said when I'm driving, when I was racing, okay, you'd.

You'd recognize a car and think, oh, that's such a body driving that.

But a lot of the time you weren't bothered who was driving it.

You wanted in that corner before them and they wanted into that corner before you, and it made no difference what gender you were.

I mean, what's your view on lady racing drivers?

I've always found lady racing drivers at times to be far more aggressive than men.

Yeah.

Yeah, I, I couldn't agree more.

I couldn't agree more.

I'm a little bit.

Maybe on the other side of this whole, I would call the movement.

Right.

We see this movement with female drivers and I, on the positive note, I find it good where there is a platform for girls, where can they show their abilities.

Right.

Yeah.

So.

Right.

I mean, that I would say is good to have all these.

All female serious or whatsoever.

But the car, the car doesn't absolutely care what gender you are.

No, absolutely no.

And I don't want that other care what gender I am out there.

I want to be taken as a dress, as a competitor.

I'm your competitor.

Right.

And if I'm, if I'm male, G or female, it shouldn't matter at all.

And, and I don't want to be in all female races actually, because it's just, it's great.

Okay.

It's for fun.

But the right measure of abilities you can only do when you go out together.

Yeah.

And it's exactly what you said.

I mean, obviously big heroine is a Michel Mouton.

And when I look at it those days, there was no female whatever movement.

It was nothing like that.

And she would just went out there, she, she went for it.

Very aggressive, as you said.

No one was judging anything and she just did her thing.

And nobody was talking about it much.

Was it in sense of okay, female, male.

And I think we should go back to the basics and just look at it from the racist perspective and not from the gender perspective.

And yeah, I absolutely agree.

And if you have the skill, you'll be fine.

You'll be good.

You'll be good.

As I said, it's like they keep saying we need more women in motor racing.

Yes, no problem.

I mean, you've got to admit this yourself.

The one thing that holds everybody back in motorsport at times is funding and lack of it.

I mean, it's an expensive thing to do is racing.

And that is what stops a lot of people racing.

Yep, that's absolutely the case as we know, if you fail, if you have a talent, the skills and everything, you can still fail.

Exactly.

On, on these particular things.

Unfortunately there are so many talents out there and there were so many talents in the past and never made it into, into the serious or serious racing because of lack of funding as you said.

And I think it's back, back to it.

If you, if you're male or female, there is no difference.

Right.

Is as challenging outside the race car to finding sponsors, to finding funding for everyone, for all of us.

Yeah, of course at the beginning of this female movement, sure it is a little bit of advantage, I'm not gonna lie to be a female because we're still so few girls out there, aren't we?

So it gels a little bit, sells better if I, if I can say so.

Yeah.

So I mean the sponsors like it more that because it's rare and it's more.

Right.

Isn't better to show?

Well, in the end of the day you have, in the end of the day you have to have your skills, you have to be committed and dedicated to what you do and you have to convince with results.

When you're convinced with results, you're going to convince your sponsors and, and that's for all of us.

And this is matters of male and females and this is my view on that.

I know it's maybe not, not very popular but this is how I see it.

I mean the other week I interviewed a young lady racer, young girl racer called Ashley Gregory.

I described her as one of the most committed, dedicated, focused and talented racing drivers I had ever met, irrespective of male or female and her attitude towards racing.

And it's like she said, it's not all being behind a wheel.

She said as a racing driver it's a 24 hour a day job working on the car, working for sponsors, sorting everything out.

And I dare say you'll agree racing isn't just being behind the wheel of a racing car.

No, it's not.

And it became like that.

It became even more and more the commitments drivers, especially in the professional racing.

When you look at it, to have a full calendar, schedules of media and sponsors and the customers from the sponsors, you have to spend time with them and the events and all sorts of stuff.

And this wasn't like this before, not as much, not to this extent.

And it became a full job.

I absolutely agree.

It's something keeps you busy and distracts you a little bit from the main thing and that's racing.

But you have to do you have to just get on with it and you have to be equally as good in that because there are couple of examples.

They're very good drivers and super talented and everything skilled but they just can or don't won't play the other part, the other side of racing.

You are not going to be very successful then because you have to these days do that as well.

You have to play the game on the other side because racing has to be funded, it's very expensive and it belongs to it.

It's a part of the whole, as a part of the whole game.

And yeah it's just became with media what we have these days and, and sponsors is absolutely essential to be good at that as well.

Now I can remember when I race I used to be told the car will be appearing at such and such a place or the cars will be there and you, you will be there.

I mean you have some may be surprised to hear you have a proper full time job.

How do you, you navigate the racing round it all.

Yes, well, thank God.

I, I, oh thank God.

Unfortunately however, I'm not a professional race car driver in sense of that.

You know, I don't get paid for racing, I still have to pay for my racing.

There's a huge difference.

So if there are some commitments and senses around that I can choose, I can choose which races I want to do.

Yeah.

Or which races I can do and which not.

And so I don't have a, I don't have a team, I don't have a manager behind me who tells me what to do and what not to do.

What is it?

What is a great thing on one hand because you have the freedom to just design your whole actually year and your, your season how you want.

But you can only do it if you are much a driver as I am.

Right.

I'm very dedicated and I spend all my time and, and pretty much all my money on racing car.

But there are many, you know, there are many races and many were saying no, that's not going to happen.

I can't have everything, I can't do it.

So and it's compromises, it's compromises.

And also now when I you know find again the passion for a little bit endurance rallying or trips, you know, with cars abroad, right Then I can't do as much racing.

It's something in between.

I have to find the compromise.

So everyone, everyone has to just find the right way for themselves or if you have a professional drivers the team and the manager is going to tell you what's what has to be done.

Unfortunately.

We'Re heading into 20.

26.

What.

What races and what events have you got in the diary already?

Yeah, 26.

What is it?

Well, that's a.

It's a Monaco Historics.

So it's always every second year.

So hopefully I will and can race there.

It's something special.

Morocco is just.

Is a pinnacle in many ways.

So looking forward to that.

I'm joining the ice in some orange.

That's my first car event.

It's a little bit of driving on a frozen lake and I will have my Bentley there.

So looking forward to that.

What I always love and always did is ice driving in.

In Sweden or in Lapland.

Yeah.

So on a big frozen lakes just do some laps.

That's not an event but it's something you do cars.

You do cars again?

Yeah, it's a different shade of doing cars and in terms of event.

Yeah, I, I hope I will do some races with Patrick.

Peter or Peter Auto.

Yeah.

Classic car racing.

Maybe Barcelona in April, March I think.

And Spa.

You can't miss Spa, can you?

Yeah, hopefully good with revival and in the.

In November later on I'm doing end to endurance.

What do you call it, Andrew?

Yeah, sure.

Three weeks trip through Indochina with a car.

So it's.

It's a rally through Cambodia, Laos, Vietnam And I'm really looking forward to that one because it's just you discovering countries, people you see stuff and at the same time you do cars in rally.

Rally.

So that will be.

That will be sort of maybe icing on the keg in the end of the year and maybe Modern Accento or before.

Yeah, that's the rough plan.

Let's see what I can do from that.

Would you ever consider or would you ever like to get to the stage where you could compete in what everybody considers the ultimate race, the 24 Hour of Lamar All.

Of course, yes.

I mean always sort of wanted it.

Had it on my mind when I started my own racing.

But it's.

It's a.

It's a way, it's.

It's a way to Le Mans and I spent a lot of time in Leron for different reasons and saw it also from the organizer side.

So a little bit work with.

With the organizers.

Saw it from the other, other side.

I spent a lot of time with teams there so had experience.

How is it with the team and always wanted to do it and if you really want to do Le Mans properly, I say in a way you should do it then.

There is a long way to Le Mans, the prep.

You should do lots of racing before preparing yourself.

The races where you have a.

The P cars, the LMP cars around you to get used to that and all sorts of stuff.

I don't want to do it in a way to buy my seat and do lemon.

I know you could sort of do.

It, but I'm not being funny.

You are.

With your racing experience, etc, you are more than qualified to do it.

It's very lovely saying it, but I think everybody, you know, should judge their own skills.

And I think there should be lots ahead of that.

I didn't put it off the list yet.

It's sort of there and thinking if I want to do it, they should hurry up.

But, yeah, of course, I would love to do.

Who wouldn't?

I mean, I have raced there, but not in the 24, because, as you know, the circuit is used for a variety of other things.

And it is an incredible circuit.

My only complaint is they put chicanes on Mulsanne.

I can remember driving Mulsanne with no chicanes.

And it remains is.

It's an incredible experience when you realize you're driving a fast car and it won't go any faster.

Oh, that's a dream.

Right?

Those were the days.

Those were the days.

It's the same with Spa and different circuits where you think, oh, yeah, that old good circuit.

Yeah.

Le Mans.

Come on.

Le Mans is just.

It stays only one circuit.

You want to race, really, when you win your race, there's only one circuit.

You will one race.

You want to do it.

Yeah, isn't it?

And it's.

It's spectacular even if you're there as a spectator, isn't it?

Oh, I mean, this.

The atmosphere is.

I've always said the two circuits that have the greatest atmosphere even when there's nothing happening, is Le Mans and Monza.

They are just.

The atmosphere, even when there's nothing going on is incredible.

Yeah, that's.

I absolutely agree.

Even walk around, it just gives you.

Gives you sort of goosebumps because, you know, what is it?

Is it a holy tarmac?

Yeah, absolutely.

Yeah.

Well, look, I mean, Le Mans Classics, I've done it a couple of times.

It is.

It is a shade of Le Mans 24 hours, obviously it's not the same, but to race in the night, even at Lemon.

Le Mans Classics in the night, it just.

It has got to feel right.

And because racing at night in Le Mans.

Wow.

Yes.

That's.

That's.

That's.

Feels like almost a real deal.

Yeah.

And I raised The Bentley regularly there.

Mainly the Bentley.

And, and I just think back, you know, Bentley boys, when they really started in Le Mans.

Right.

Yeah.

And think how they did it on an automatic roads, you know, gravel.

And I. I'm so impressed.

Right.

So.

Yeah, yeah.

They never lost the magic.

No will.

And.

And F Racers is the ultimate, ultimate track.

You want, you know, you want to be there.

Great.

Now, would you ever consider say, competing in the Monte Carlo Rally Historique and possibly the great.

Well, it's now called the RAC again, the Roger Albert Clark proper stage rally.

Would you ever consider doing anything like that?

I know you probably have to.

To leave the Bentleys and the Mercedes and go for a Ford escort or a 911.

Would you ever consider doing them?

Yes.

Yeah.

Yes.

It's.

It's one of them is on my list already.

So that's happening.

So yeah, work.

Sort of working on that.

Which one?

The Monty.

Yes.

Well, well, would love to start with Rally Monte Carlo Historic.

It has to be done.

No, I mean it has to be done.

I think there is no talking around.

It's a different kind of event, but it's just so legendary and always wanted to do it and now a little bit.

Got a touch of rallying again.

Really love it back into that.

I would obviously I would try to attend in the next years, so.

Need to have the right car and practice with it a little bit and just.

It has to be done.

Yeah.

What about the rac?

That is grassroots.

You'll be walking around in mud in old rally cars.

But the people who do it absolutely love doing it.

Maybe just to do it once.

Will that appeal to you?

Or by the time you finish, you get out the car and say, that's it, never again, again.

Oh, no, I don't think there's any car even.

I would say that.

I mean, I, I can.

I can assure you there's hardly anyone.

I would say.

Yes, I would be absolutely up to that.

Up to everything of this kind.

And, and.

And like stages.

You know, I did now.

I did now of the years, the modern Accento aura last year, this year.

And these are different stages.

Right.

But you do have your stages to two stages a day, one race a day.

And I have almost forgotten how great stages actually are.

The proper stages, like right.

Hill climbs and so on.

Yeah.

So I really got to hang out of it right now.

And so, yeah, I would love to do that.

Just the car.

I need the right car for it and spend some time in this car, do some driving and just get into the whole rally feeling.

And once, once that's done, I would say I am there in a flat crash.

Yes, I would be up to it.

I wouldn't mind to sort of, you know, go through period where you, you know, struggle and learning by doing or whatsoever.

But I've been there, I, I've done the same with racing with no one, you know, sort of you took me seriously or no one really told what the hell am I doing there.

I would do the, the same procedure again in rolling as well.

So.

Yeah, absolutely.

I think to have, I think to have finished the 24 hour of Dubai would definitely silence any detractors you might have.

I mean, to finish a 24 hour race is an achievement even though you may not be the first across the finish line.

To finish a 24 hour is a serious achievement in my opinion.

Yeah, thank you.

Yeah, that's Indeed to finish 24 hours, wherever you finish, it feels like a wind.

Yeah.

And when you win it feels even better.

Yeah.

No, no, I agree.

Any, any kind of achievement when you, when you set a goal for yourself and, and you are able to achieve it and, and all part of it and you mainly you prove it to yourself.

I don't know how other other racers or drivers doing it, but mainly sort of prove it to myself.

Yes, yes, I, I, I, I've done it.

I, I, I wasn't sure along the way but yeah, here I am, I'm finished.

So it's a very good feeling.

It's a good feeling, yeah.

Love it.

Katerina Kivalova, it's been an absolute pleasure chatting to you and thank you for giving up your very valuable time because I know you're always extremely busy.

But once again, thank you very much for inviting me.

I enjoy our chat.

Absolutely.

Thank you once again, Katerina Kivalova, thank you very much indeed.