Full show notes for this episode can be found at https://jakehower.com/big-business-marketing-on-a-small-business-budget-with-tim-reid/

Welcome back . I'm Jake Hauer, your host, and you're listening

to the Multimedia Marketing Show.

I'm glad you've come back to tune in.

We've got Tim Reid from the Small Business Big Marketing Podcast, which is

Australia's number one marketing podcast.

He's been a podcasting since 2009.

I'll let him tell you a little bit more about his story

and and how he's going now.

This is quite an actionable episode.

We speak a little bit about why it should be podcasting and also how you

can go about getting some advertising.

Tim, how are you?

G'day Jake and hello listeners.

Yeah.

Now this

is very unusual for me, Tim.

I've been a a big listener of your show since since mid-July,

or it was mid mid-year 2009.

It's very strange for me to now be on the the other end of the

call and actually interviewing

you.

Thank you, because it's those people, those early adopters, Jake, that get you,

give you that kick along, and I really appreciate, listening for that long.

You've been one of the, you were one of the first listeners and you've

stuck around, so that's great.

No, I think that's an, of course, that's testament

to the quality of your show.

So I really appreciate that.

All right.

What do we love to do here, Tim?

So our listeners are content marketers or budding content

marketers in terms of multimedia.

And one of the most important forms is podcasting.

Now you are obviously an expert in this field.

So I thought it would be fantastic to get you on the show.

And get some get some information that we can give to our listeners about how

they can go about podcasting as well.

Bring it on.

Excellent.

Just for those listeners who don't know too much about you, Tim would you mind

giving us a little a brief history of you what you were doing before you started

podcasting and then the reasoning behind

starting?

Okay.

All right.

I am a marketing guy through and through.

So went to uni, did marketing, worked in the corporate end of

marketing, large advertising agency was the marketing manager at flight

center was just everything I've done has been around marketing.

Then about seven years ago, I, decided you know what?

I actually really every time in my corporate life when a small business

person would ask me a marketing question, they were very thankful for my answer and

responsive and they would act on it, and that was different to the corporate world

where meetings need to needed to occur.

And, minutes needed to be taken, Jake.

And it was like, yeah.

I love small business and I reckon the knowledge that I have around marketing

is going to really help small businesses grow if they choose to listen to it.

And so I was okay, so I went and started a business that was just me

consulting to small businesses and about.

About four years into that, so three years ago, I started a podcast called

Small Business Big Marketing, which was my way at the time, and I had a co

host at the time, Luke, it was our way of giving back to the small business

community, it was podcasts are free.

And I just couldn't believe it because I'd been listening to podcasts for

about, at that time, about four years.

And I was like, I can't believe that a small business can have their own show.

Like that just, even today, it spins me out, the fact that we can complete,

compete on a level playing field with some big guys, I get the biggest giggle,

Jake, when I look at the iTunes rankings and see my podcast, small business, big

marketing competing against, Seth Godin or the Australian stock exchange or Harvard

business school, I think that's hilarious.

It

certainly isn't given.

The fact that the even the production level or the production qualities

is as good, if not better than these these big guys with big budgets.

So that's really incredible.

It is.

So it's exciting time.

You say podcasting is a key component of content marketing.

I'll, you and I think it is because we're podcasters.

Content marketing is a lot broader, but the, there's so much beauty to podcasting.

The fact that you and I can have this, what I call them fireside

conversations because, they are, done well for certainly for my show.

That's what I like to think they are.

It's I just just sent a note off to a guest that I'm interviewing this

afternoon and said to her, look forward to seeing you around the campfire,

and cause that's how I view them.

They're personal.

You get the opportunity to interview people.

You would never have thought you'd have the opportunity to interview,

like I interviewed the guy yesterday from will it blend, that great

video viral marketing series.

Yes.

And it's like I tapped him on the shoulder, not literally,

but just I sent him an email.

I can't even think how I might've just been through the

website, got to his PR guy.

Next thing you know, you're interviewing him.

Yeah, it's exciting times, mate, and and podcasting certainly right up there in

my kind of content marketing strategy.

Yeah, it

certainly is.

Now why don't why don't we get a little bit about the format of the show?

So as you said, you were, you did have a co host.

So explain maybe to our listeners about the initial format of the show and

how you've changed that slightly now.

Initially, the first 80 episodes of Small Business Big

Marketing was done with a co host and a really good mate of mine, Luke.

And it worked beautifully.

It was like I think the co host strategy for podcasting works when you're actually

good mates and you can have conversations off air that, it can be brutal, when you

can get cross at each other and you can tell each other, I thought you did that

well, or, you could have done that better.

I wish you'd shut up then.

And Luke and I could have those conversations, which were great.

And so the format of that show was literally like every episode of small

business, big marketing, we interview the criteria is that we interview a small

business owner somewhere in the world that is doing crackingly good marketing.

Of some sort, right?

They're just cranking some aspect of their marketing and as a

result, have a successful business.

Basically the format is now and it hasn't really changed except it's just me

jabbering to myself before the interview.

I don't, I haven't replaced the co host.

So I come on, Sounds interesting.

I share some marketing stuff that's on my mind from a marketing point of view that

I think will help small business owners.

I then launch into the interview.

I then come out of that interview, make a comment and say goodbye.

Always mentioned my sponsor in net registry and some aspect of what

they're doing for small business.

And then I and that's it.

Generally they go for about.

I don't know, they reckon they average 40 minutes, but it's

that's the kind of format.

I haven't played with it too much.

I am going to do a few things differently in the new year, but

I'm in planning stage right now.

Yeah, and I guess the big thing is if something's working,

there's no point changing it up.

Correct.

Correct.

All right.

I think that's a good segue.

You just mentioned net registry up.

So this is potentially a good segue into how you've gone about

monetizing the podcast and we'll get behind the scenes now and really

dig into the gold for our audience.

You started in 2009.

Did you have a plan at that early stage to monetize?

How did you think to monetize and how has that changed over the last three years?

I had this grand plan from day one, which then fizzled out

into podcasting being a hobby for the first kind of 12 to 18 months.

The grand plan was, huh, I've got a show now.

We'll make money from it.

It was like it was just this straight line.

Obviously, we'll make money from it.

And that absolutely wasn't the case.

And in fact I had a great chat to a mate of mine who I worked with in

advertising, whose opinion I really respected and talked to him about it.

And he said, the smart marketer, which I thought I was he said, what you should do

is you just got to build your audience.

You got to invest the time.

And the money and the resources and build an audience because if you are

certainly if you're planning to make money off the back of advertising

and or sponsorship, then they're just going to want to see numbers.

And they're going to want to see either some certainly numbers or

some kind of qualitative kind of reference that you are doing okay.

I'm more a qualitative guy than I am a quantitative guy.

Fortunately my show pretty consistently ranks, not always, but

consistently holds a spot, always holds a spot in the top 10 on iTunes

and consistently ranks number one.

So that was just good proof to a potential sponsor.

So it was gee, I reckon it was like two and a bit years into it that

I then put together a sponsorship proposal and started knocking on doors.

And is that the main form of monetization?

Yeah, absolutely.

It is.

Yeah, it's every now and then I will interview someone who has a service or a

product that I believe my listeners will really benefit from and occasionally that

will have an affiliate attached to it.

And if that's the case, then I'll put that affiliate in the show notes and

send it around to my list via email.

And and do it that way.

But certainly NetRegistry sponsorship is now starting to is starting

to fund what I'm doing properly.

And it's, it's interesting because, your costs go up to, as you become

more popular, your hosting costs, get a bit out of control and the time you

spend, you'd never want to factor in your hourly rate, Jake, on a podcast,

because that has started to make the numbers look a bit senseless.

But, it's fun to,

No, it is.

And I think that's a big thing that I've found out of it in my early

podcasting career to date is that as you mentioned earlier on, it's just

the networking and people you've got get access to is is incredible.

Isn't it

unreal?

Like I talk about the Dobermans and the Dobermans are those people in generally

in business that stand between you and someone that you want to speak to.

And I'm not just talking about getting an interview.

I'm just talking about.

Geez, I'd like to talk to such and such and then you make the phone call and

you get the receptionist or you get the personal assistant or you get someone else

in the business and they are immediately cagey about what are you selling?

What do you got to sell?

Whereas if you can, if you ring up and say, Hey, listen, I want to

interview such and such bang, it's yep.

Put you through

it's almost like you go from that, or the thing is here's

what I'm selling you to, Hey, come and sell me and my audience.

Complete

change of dynamic.

Yeah, it's really interesting.

All I think one other thing I think potentially.

Maybe he's driving your business a little bit.

The perception from my end here is that potentially their podcasting has built

your authority in the market and it's potentially could has driven today.

Your consulting side of your your business, would that be the case?

I'll give you a great story, Jake.

It has, rightly or wrongly, it's as a marketing guy, if

you've got small business owners listening to this, speaking is a

great marketing strategy, right?

That it's just, it just is.

As soon as you walk up on a stage or as soon as you turn on a microphone or

you sit in front of a camera, you run a webinar, I don't know, you cross this

invisible line and that invisible line on the other side says, You're an authority.

Now, whether that's right or wrong, whether you are or you aren't, I don't

know, but it is a great strategy and podcasting is obviously a form of

speaking and it has been a great way for me to build my personal brand and

it's a great way for anyone to build their personal brand and we should

be because people buy from people.

That's just that's simple.

People don't buy from companies.

You buy from people.

We buy Apple 'cause of what Steve Jobs did, to an extreme example.

Although you don't, Jake, and we'll get you across the line at some point

. Jake Hower: Yeah, and

And that's the way you certainly should be looking at it.

The email address that you're collecting on your site isn't

actually an email address.

J do@gmail.com is actually John, he's got a name and he's a person,

so he is absolutely.

So look The story I was going to tell you was so one of the things that

podcasting and with my business going into the new year is I am absolutely

I've been doing a lot of keynote speaking this year, and I really love it.

I love sharing knowledge.

I love teaching marketing, and I love connecting with people at

that kind of from the stage level.

And so I've been doing a lot of that now.

I've just come off a nine event roadshow for an insurance company, and it was

the biggest job I did all year from both a revenue point of view, from

just an energy and resources and time point of view, and it was fantastic.

Guess how they found me.

They didn't find me through the podcast directly.

They found me because every search they did.

On Google, around small business marketing, I kept on popping up.

So the marketing manager at this insurance company rings a speakers bureau who

she's connected with and says, I don't know who this Timbo Reid guy is, but

every search I'm doing around small business marketing, he keeps popping up.

Find him.

And the reason I kept popping up is because I kept creating podcast episodes.

Yeah, it's a classic, it's a classic content marketing

case study.

It's a classic one, and...

As a result, and then obviously she started listening to the show.

And then she started asking around what was great was that

in her office and I get a laugh.

My show is called small business, big marketing, and I'm too,

we're talking here about someone from a large insurance company.

Then she walks around her office and she goes, does anyone listen to this show?

Small business, big marketing.

And sure enough, two people my show.

And I'm like,

That is ace, and that's I was really chuffed when I heard that because it's

not as if I'm, I've got a national radio show, but what I have got is a

global podcast because it has, it was downloaded in 94 countries last month,

including Kazakhstan, by the way.

And, it's so that's very cool.

And I'm a one man show and, it's just, it's exciting times, man.

Yeah,

absolutely.

Absolutely.

All right, let's move on.

Let's move on to the actionable.

Part of the interview for our listeners.

So you've given us a bit of background, our listeners should now, if they don't

already, they should know that podcasting is something they should look at.

So let's let's get into, for the rest of the interview we'll

focus on a couple of points.

First I want to get maybe your opinion on The format that's working for you,

which we just touched on and some forms of monetization where you've discussed

one, there's another one we'll probably look at as well, then how I think the

most important part is the format that our listeners should look to create.

So looking at whether or not they should be interviewing people bringing

in co hosts, et cetera, et cetera.

All right.

So let's start off with what would you say is working for you right

now?

Yeah, it's a good question.

There's a few things.

What works is getting a great guest, for me identifying a guest that is just

going to be a giving, really like I, I did an interview yesterday, Jake, and I

can put it to air because there was just no, dynamic between me and the guest.

It was I just chose the wrong person, right?

He wasn't an authority in his field.

Like I thought he was.

He didn't share his knowledge in a great way.

Whereas the will it blend guy.

Who the episode I put up yesterday, he was just unreal.

Like he just had this energy and he knew that he was there to share

his knowledge and to get people excited about blenders and video

marketing and all that type of stuff.

So that was great.

So I think it's really incumbent upon any podcast to have some kind

of criteria, some kind of filter.

That determines whether that person would be good on the show, because

just because someone knows a whole lot about something doesn't actually

necessarily make them a good guest.

So that's working for me right now.

The other thing that works for me, I just think you got to put

stuff out on a consistent basis.

You got to set an expectation with your listeners and put something out regularly.

So I put a show out every Tuesday.

Of small business, big marketing.

And I'm going to up that in the new year.

As I get even more excited about about just interviewing people because it is a

lot of fun, what else is working for me?

I reckon they're the two major ones, and having a sponsor in net registry.

That's worked really well because it's just made my life a lot easier.

And when you start and sponsorships, getting sponsorship.

isn't for everyone.

But it does, knowing that there's that regular income coming in does allow you

to focus on actually creating the content.

Sure.

Okay.

Let's the two points you've brought up there, I want to

go in a little bit deeper.

You talk about getting in giving guests, how do you go about

ensuring that the people you're interviewing are going to meet?

What I didn't do with the guy that I interviewed

yesterday was check him out.

I didn't look at, I didn't YouTube him.

I didn't Google him.

I didn't find other interviews that he'd done.

I took it on someone else's word that he was good.

Shouldn't have done that.

So what I do is I just find other interviews that these people

have done, again, the Will It Blend guy, that wasn't hard.

He's on, he's got 150 very funny videos out there, so he's a bit of a character.

And it proved, that proved to be right.

I'm interviewing I don't always interview celebrity type people, but I happen to

be interviewing Mia Friedman today from Mummy, Mamma Mia the mummy blogger.

Of, glow of national fame so I know what she's like, she's

got a national radio show.

Yeah, just checking them out online is the best thing to do.

Yeah, that, that makes a lot of sense and it doesn't take

a lot of time to do that either.

I know I I usually put in a bit of research, whether it's an

hour or so per episode usually just before I, I come on air.

And that will involve either listening to a podcast or just doing a bit

of a Google search, making sure I've checked out their websites.

So I'd agree with that.

That's a fantastic way to, to make sure you're primed

for the particular interview.

Correct.

Now, the second part is the the advertising.

Now you talked about earlier about putting together essentially a

portfolio or an advertising proposal.

How do you go about doing that in terms of like, how do you work at how

much you're worth to your advertisers?

And what do advertisers want to see?

Yeah.

So the whole process of getting a sponsor it wasn't easy because as much as you'd

love to think podcasting is now front and center, it's not, but it's a lot better

than it was three, four, five years ago.

When you walk out on the street now or whenever I give a keynote, I

always, obviously I get introduced as a guy with the number one

marketing podcast in Australia.

And one of the questions I put to the audience is who listens to podcasts.

And what I'm seeing now is a few more hands go up this year than I

did last year and the year before.

It's probably now Maybe 3 in 10 people no, I reckon about 4, 4 and

a half in 10 people have heard of a podcast and another, and half of those

would regularly listen to a podcast.

So the bar is low, which I think is really exciting, big opportunity.

So first of all, I had to get through, and I was knocking on the doors of

sponsors that first I knew would have a relevance to my listeners.

There's no use being sponsored by an energy drink company.

Oh, I suppose you could energy drink company could work actually, cause every

small business owners tired, I needed a sponsor that had relevance to my audience.

So that was the first thing.

Second thing they needed to be they needed to have enough dough

to allocate money into podcasting as a marketing channel for them.

So they already needed to be out there on TV or radio, press,

print, doing expos, et cetera.

I then put together a proposal and the proposal was quite,

it was quite a big document.

I'm not actually into long documents, but the reason it was big is because

I started off by grabbing about 120.

Testimonials that people had written on iTunes.

And the whole premise of my sponsorship proposal was that people love my show.

And I use the word love because they do, and I could prove it because of the

written reviews I was getting on iTunes.

The word love was used often, and love is a really powerful word in marketing.

And, the whole idea of building a brand is about building emotional.

Emotional engagement and so I use the word love and I said people love my show

and then there were just pages and pages of written testimonials that I'd taken

off iTunes and my LinkedIn profile.

After that, a sponsorship proposal is broken up into two things.

What have you got?

And what do they want?

So I sorry what do you got and what do you want?

So what I, what have I got?

I detailed what I had, which was a podcast.

And now these were the opportunities to immerse your brand into the podcast.

And this is what I want.

And what I wanted was.

was money.

It was contra.

If the contra worked, it was the opportunity to be shared

on that brand social networks.

If they had a big enough list and Facebook and Twitter and all that type of stuff.

And I just got lots of not knockbacks.

Jake don't know how many, I should actually look back because

it was quite a few and probably form the basis of a good story.

But in the end, I found net registry at an expo in Melbourne.

And they looked really professional and had a great set up.

And they were all about helping small businesses get

their online marketing sorted.

So it was a match made in heaven.

And that took about six months.

Okay.

And did you, was it more of a consultative process in terms of setting, setting on?

The rates or et cetera, et cetera, about with NetRegistry or did you go to them

with a, with a rate card or something?

I went with a monthly fee, a monthly investment on their behalf

that, that would make, would allow me to, really just focus on putting the

content, putting the shows together.

And they took it and they bought that.

And then that was about a three month contract.

And then we renegotiated for another six months where we negotiated

a split between cash and contra.

And it still works to this day.

And it's been fantastic.

And they're great people now and the relationships evolve, like I

get a lot of listener questions.

So sometimes I answer them on the show.

Sometimes I put a whole episode together of listener questions.

And now what NetRegistry are doing is if there are any online marketing questions

specifically, then I forward it to them.

They write a blog post and they become guest bloggers on the blog, which

appears on smallbusinessbigmarketing.

com.

So it's a kind of, it is just the relationship has just found new ways

of helping it work for both parties.

Oh,

that's fantastic.

You're it's a big vote of confidence that you've got to,

you've got a second contract.

So you're obviously over delivering.

Correct.

You had this fee.

I really do want to get into how you come across this fee.

Was there a formula you used to decide how much a show worth?

Or are you just pulling a number out of thin air to, that would be appealing to...

There was no formula and it wasn't thin air.

So it was like, you know what, I know...

What advertising costs.

I know that, 30 second radio spots, TV spots.

I know what costs of print advertising is.

And it's just it's bloody high.

What I've got is the opportunity to embed yourself in a show that has some

flexibility and personality beyond just placing an ad like net registry.

Don't place ads in my show.

I do live reads and I mentioned net registry in the context

of what I'm talking about.

There's value in that.

And as a result, I arrived at a fee, which I can't share with you

that worked for both parties and it's certainly it's value for money.

Yep, absolutely.

And yeah, as I said, the fact that you've renegotiated a second

contract is proof in the pudding.

Correct.

Okay let's let's move on from there.

Let's go into the final part of the the episode.

How do our listeners go about starting their podcasts?

Forget the technical side of it.

Let's focus on the different types of formats they can use, how they come

across topics for each episode, how often you think they should publish.

And yeah, I think you've probably got a bit of information you

can share with the listeners on

that.

There's a lot of questions there, Jake.

Yes, there is.

Let's break it up.

Okay.

Break it up.

Format of the show.

So you've got an interview format.

What other formats could our our listeners use?

Obviously there's a co host.

So if you have got a colleague, let's just go back a step because before

you worry about format, it's like, what are you going to do a show about?

And it's so important that you identify the spine of your show and

let's get the terminology right.

You produce a show.

And that is like the small business, big marketing show.

In my case, you then that show is made up of episodes and each

episode is about a different topic.

That's related to your show.

Okay.

I just, sometimes I hear people getting the terminology wrong and it bugs me.

So there you go.

I've just, that was my rant.

Second part is every show, your show should have a spine and that

spine is the theme, is the ongoing overarching theme of your show.

So that when it comes time to identify a guest or something to

talk about, it's always on theme.

So for my show, it's all about small business marketing.

That's the theme.

So when someone comes to me and they did the other day saying, I am the

owner of this amazing new online portal that helps small business owners take

control of their finances, I go, well done, but it doesn't fit into my show.

Yep.

So be really clear on the spine of your show and honor it.

Honor it.

I'm talking to an architect guy at the moment about putting

together a show for him.

He is an architect that specializes in difficult blocks.

Right?

Awkward blocks that are hard to get planning permits for, that are

awkward shapes because, and therefore makes it hard to put a design on it.

He wants to do, he wants to do a podcast about architecture, but I'm saying to him

there's too many podcasts on architecture, you, your show your show has to be about

architecture for difficult blocks, right?

You're niching it down, you're narrowing it down, and everything he does around

that show needs to be around difficult blocks because that's what he's good at.

Identify.

Your spine, then if you're ready, if you've done that, then

your structure, your format co host, I think is a great format.

If you have someone that you get along with and you can have honest

conversations with if you like just ranting to the microphone by yourself,

if you're an opinionated type person and you feel as though you've got something

to say with just by yourself, great.

And then of course I added to the co host format.

All the just you to microphone format interview people

because that's really easy.

No, it's not really easy.

It's fun.

And if you do enjoy it, it is really easy.

You can't just go and interview people.

You do need to have a set of questions.

You said you're doing hours research.

You have some key themes that you want to.

Get out of it.

You put your listener hat on.

You ask what they would want to get out of it.

You go onto your Facebook and your Twitter and your list and you ask them,

Hey, I'm interviewing such and such.

What do you want me to ask them?

You think about the questions that they probably always get asked and

avoid them and ask the ones that people would really love to ask.

And I think if you're going to go down the interviewing path,

the big word is curiosity.

Just be curious.

And that will then lead to a wonderful interview.

I hope that was of help.

Awesome.

Podcasting gold.

All right, so you've shared so much in this in this short episode.

There's so much that our listeners can get out and implement.

So thank you very much for coming on.

I have a curious question for, from my own perspective and

hopefully you're happy to reveal it.

But I've, I don't think I've ever heard you talk about

listener numbers with your show.

Would you be happy to

reveal that?

I'm pretty hopeless with numbers, Jake.

I'm actually...

A real qualitative guy, I need to be better with my numbers.

So if I'm not going to reveal any, because if I do, they're not going to be accurate.

Suffice to say that I have a listener base in the tens of thousands, and I was

downloaded in 94 countries last month and that 70% of my audience is in Australia.

20% is in the U.

S.

and then the rest is scattered between the UK, Canada, New Zealand and Kazakhstan.

And it's growing the hosting costs continue to get a bit out of control.

It's a bit like, if you're paying tax, it means you're earning a lot

of, the more tax you pay, the more money you're earning, kind of thing.

The more hosting fees I'm paying, the more people are listening.

But that, that's about as close as I can get to being accurate around that.

And then just ranking really well, both on Google and in iTunes, are a couple

of good scoreboards that I look to.

Yeah, absolutely.

All right.

Thank you very much, Tim.

As I said, that's a fantastic episode.

I'm so glad you could come on.

Where can our listeners find out a little bit more about you?

Before I do that, Jake, well done to you, mate for doing

what you're doing with this.

I've always had you in my mind as the travel agent and I love the fact that

you've been able, you said to me off the air a few weeks ago when we were

setting up the interview, you've got your team in place now and structures

and systems, which I really admire.

On your behalf to, to allow you to do this and to enter another field.

Well done, mate.

I think it's great.

Thank you.

I do say this is a bit of a pet project.

I really enjoy it, but just getting access to people like you

is very enjoyable for me, getting on the line and chatting for 30

minutes.

Love it.

From my point of view, listeners your listeners can go to

smallbusinessbigmarketing.

com.

That's the home of Australia's number one marketing show.

And if you register there, then you are going to be the first to know not

only when new episodes come out, but I'll be deferring to you as to, maybe

asking questions about, who should I interview or I'm interviewing such and

such, what do you want to ask them?

Become part of the small business big marketing tribe that way.

Thank you.

If there are listeners out there that are small business owners and really

want to take their marketing to the next level in a, not in one on one,

but on a small mastermind group, then I run a mastermind called the Deep Dive

Mastermind every Tuesday via webinar.

And in any one group, there's 10 motivated small business owners

sitting around the virtual table via webinar, hosted by me, and everyone

asks marketing questions of me.

And then I answer them and the rest of the group contributes as well.

You can go to deepdivemastermind.

com and and check that out.

But that's a big plan of mine for the coming 12 months.

Cause it's just, I just love that bringing people together and helping

them improve their marketing.

So there's a couple of ways, Jake.

Fantastic, Tim.

Rightio, final question.

Are you ready?

Here we

go.

Drum

roll.

Drum roll, insert drum

roll.

Who is the most famous person you've ever met?

I reckon you're stirring by asking that question because that's the

question I ask at the end of my show.

The most famous person I've ever met, do you know what?

I never actually got to meet them, but when I was studying marketing at uni,

I did a study tour over in America and I was an 18 year old kid and

everyone was saying, Oh, you'll go to America and you'll meet famous people.

And I go, yeah, sure.

Like America is a big country as if.

But I landed in San Francisco, got out of the plane, checked into the hotel, went

for a walk, saw a limo at the front of a hotel and said to the guy on the door, the

concierge on the door, who's in the limo?

And he said, that is Rob Lowe and Tom Cruise's car.

And they're in there having a drink, but I never got to

meet them.

Oh, that's fantastic.

And you're right.

So that is certainly your signature, but I've never heard you answer it.

So I needed to know.

I didn't really answer it because I wasn't ready for it, but that

that's as close to, big time fame that one, one famous person that was a family

friend is a guy, and many listeners won't remember this guy, but I was so

chuffed to have him as a family friend.

He was a bit of a mentor in my early days, maybe of positioning myself as

wanting to get into advertising and kind of media and maybe even podcasting.

And he was a newsreader on channel nine.

He's a guy called Brian Naylor and he he was actually killed

in the Ash Wednesday bushfires.

Not the Ash Wednesday, those, the Black Friday bushfires a few years ago now.

But yeah, it was great.

I love the fact that I knew a newsreader.

Oh, that's fantastic.

Tim, again I thank you very much for taking the time to come on today.

Listeners thank you very much for tuning in and we hope to

speak to you again very soon.