Conflict is uncomfortable, especially when it's with someone we work with or care about or otherwise depend on. So unsurprisingly, many people go to great lengths to avoid conflict. But in this Emotional Push-Up, Dr. Emily and her guest and fellow podcast host Lindsey Metselaar, (We Met At Acme) agree that conflict is as important to a relationship as exercise is to a muscle and what actually matters is focusing on how you repair after a conflict arises. Tune in now to hear how to move past conflicts in a healthy way. 

Thank you for listening! Staying emotionally fit takes work and repetition. That's why the Emotionally Fit podcast with psychologist Dr. Emily Anhalt delivers short, actionable Emotional Push-Ups every Tuesday and Thursday to help you build a better practice of mental health. Join us to kickstart your emotional fitness. Let's flex those feels and do some reps together!

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The Emotionally Fit podcast is produced by Coa, your gym for mental health. Katie Sunku Wood is the show’s producer from StudioPod Media with additional editing and sound design by nodalab, and featuring music by Milano. Special thanks to the entire Coa crew!

Ready to break an emotional sweat? Welcome to Emotionally Fit with me, Dr. Emily Anhalt. As a therapist, I know that staying mentally healthy takes work and repetition. That's why I'll share Emotional Push-Ups, short, actionable exercises to help you strengthen your mental fitness. From improving your friendships to managing stress, let's flex those feels and do some reps together!

Hey there, fit fans! I am here today with Lindsey Metselaar, host of the amazing podcast We Met At Acme. Lindsey, it's so good to have you today.

I'm so happy to be here and be talking to you.

Absolutely. I'm curious, Lindsey, how do you feel in general about conflict in your relationships?

I feel that conflict is necessary to bring us closer.

You're so right. I couldn't agree more, although I think a lot of people are really uncomfortable with conflict. And for anyone who isn't a big fan, people who maybe go to great lengths to avoid conflict, you're definitely not alone because conflict is uncomfortable. Of course it is, especially when it's with someone we love or care about or depend on. And most of us didn't have healthy and thoughtful examples of conflict modeled to us growing up. Some people had parents who never fought in front of them, even when it was clear that things were off. Some people might have witnessed a ton of conflict growing up, but not a lot of repair. For all kinds of reasons, our relationship to conflict might be complicated. But in any relationship, whether it's romantic, or friendship, or family, or at work, I think that conflict to a relationship is like exercise to a muscle.

So if you think about what exercise is, exercise essentially creates little micro tears in muscle. When you lift weights, you're actually doing a little bit of damage to your muscles. And if all you did was exercise the same muscle over and over again and never rested, you'd hurt it. But if you repair after the exercise by resting, drinking water, eating protein, getting enough sleep, then the muscle heals stronger than it was before and it actually adapts to better handle the stress of exercise. So, over time, not only will you be able to lift more weight than you could before, but you'll be able to handle other kinds of stress to your body better.

So this is how I think about conflict in a relationship. The key is repair. When we work through conflict thoughtfully, the relationship is going to be stronger and better able to handle stress than it was before. And in fact, there's a certain type of strength and closeness that a relationship can only have on the other side of conflict. So think of a relationship of yours where you've gone through something tough together and you came out the other side closer than you were before.

My sister-in-law actually is an amazing psychologist in LA. And she once told me that conflict is how friends have sex. Meaning that we need to bump up against each other sometimes to feel each other's presence. So my recommendation to anyone in any kind of relationship is don't avoid conflict, just make sure you prioritize emotional repair and healing afterwards. So, Lindsey, what do you think about this whole idea?

I could not agree more. It perplexes me when I find a couple who never fights. I think that that is such a red flag. And I think that beyond that, it just feels like people are stuffing down what they really want to say and what they really feel for what they think is the greater good of the relationship. When, in reality, the greater good is having that conversation, that difficult conversation and understanding each other better as a result.

You're so right. I really think people avoid conflict because they think they're doing everyone a favor, and actually, it's not doing the relationship of service. So I agree with you. And today's pushup focuses on the repair part of conflict, which is what makes it worth doing. So, Lindsey, step one of this pushup is to think of a small conflict you've had recently. This could be a little tiff that you had with your partner or a disagreement with a colleague, maybe a friend said something that hurt your feelings recently and you just decided to move past it. So for those listening in, you can press pause while you think of your example or listen on to hear what Lindsey shares.

Lindsey, tell me about the conflict you thought of for this pushup.

The conflict I thought of was, a few months ago, my husband and I were attending a wedding in Colorado and it was a wedding for his friends, but it was tasked to me to book the hotel because I insisted on a specific hotel that I wanted to stay at. And so, he was like, "If you want to stay there, book the hotel." So I did. And we got to Colorado and I had booked the hotel from Thursday to Sunday, but we were there from Friday to Monday.

Oh, no.

So I messed up. And I knew I messed up the second we got there, but I was so annoyed too that I just didn't want to admit that it was my fault. I wanted to blame every other thing. I wanted to blame the hotel. I wanted to blame him because, why would he have me book this if it's his friend's wedding? I wanted to blame everyone involved except own the fact that I messed up.

Wow. I love that you picked an example of your own blender because often when I ask this of people, they talk about something that felt like was done to them. So love this for us. So then step two of this push of, Lindsey, is to practice what a repair conversation with your partner would look like. So you don't actually have to reach out to them yet first, get comfortable with the language that you might use. The goal isn't to fix the issue, obviously. This isn't about, how do I switch the hotel reservation? It's after the fact of taking responsibility for our part in conflict and trying to find some repair.

So as a template, it can be something like, "Hey, so the other day when you said X and I said Y, I felt embarrassed, frustrated, whatever," you might feel. So for you maybe, "I felt embarrassed that I had made the wrong reservation. I felt annoyed with you for giving me this responsibility. And I felt upset that we were fighting about it." And then you might say, "But I've realized that us getting through these things together is really important to me. And so, I just wanted to circle back and share how I felt about it and get a sense of how you felt about it so that the next time we might navigate the situation better."

So you could practice this with a friend or a partner or a therapist. The goal is just to see, how does it feel to imagine taking the time to repair? Because I can imagine, Lindsey, for people who've gone through something like this, which by the way, I totally have, I'm sure a lot of people have, the temptation can be like, okay, well that was, it's over. We're fine. We don't need to repair. We fixed the hotel reservation. Now we can move on. But what do you think it would feel like to go back to your husband and say, "Hey, when that whole thing happened, here's what was going on for me. What was going on for you?"

I think it would be great. I'm such a communicator, which we talked about on my podcast. I, of course, had to hammer down everything that I felt in that moment after. So we had a similar conversation already. I definitely didn't use the language that you just said, which I wish, of course, in hindsight, that I had. But getting to the root of that argument, I realize that I don't say sorry enough to my partner. And so, I think, instead of looking for external sources to blame, I could've just immediately owned that mistake and said, "Hey, I'm sorry."

Totally. And I can imagine if you had said, "Oh, man, I totally fucked up. I'm so sorry," he probably would've been like, "All right, well, no big deal."

Exactly. But instead, I was like, "Well, you shouldn't have asked me to do anything and it's your fault because we're here for your friend's wedding and blah, blah, blah."

But that's so human, and that's what the repair part is for. The actual conflict is not usually over something that's the real problem. It's a little perfect conduit for all the other things that we really need to confront. So to go back and say with that wedding thing, it doesn't sound like you messing up the dates is the thing that needs repair. It sounds like it's the way you reacted that needs the repair.

Exactly.

Yeah. So, step three then, for those feeling ready is to reach out to this person with this language. So maybe sending a quick text or having the conversation in person. It sounds like, Lindsey, you already did this somewhat, so maybe you can tell us, how did it go when you circled back and took responsibility?

Yeah, it went well. I think it took us a lot of sifting through to get to the truth, which is that this is just what he needed, was for me to acknowledge it and apologize for it. I'm not going to lie, there was an escalation before it got to that point. And there were things that we were just saying to get on each other's nerves, as many married couples will do. And then it was like a, wait a second, take a step back. What is really the reason that you were so upset about this? And it was like, oh, I needed an apology and I feel like I don't often get one. And then it was like, oh, that now makes me realize that I should be sensitive to the fact that that's what you needed in that moment. And instead, I blew it up in a different way.

Do you feel like you can build shock absorbers around the tendency not to apologize? Could you go to your partner and say, "I've realized about myself that in the moment I feel like I need to protect myself and I don't apologize"? In those moments, can I recruit your support by saying, "Hey, can we slow down a second? I think what I really need from you is an apology. Are you willing to give that to me and that will cue me to let down my drawbridge a little bit"? Do you think that you could say that to him and it would work well?

Yes. I need to say that to him now. I think that I need that bringing me back to Earth moment of him saying like, "Wait, it's just simple sorry," and then we're good.

Totally. Because when we're upset, we don't tend to be our best and healthiest selves. And so, I believe in recruiting support from our loved ones to get there more quickly.

Yeah, I love that idea.

Well, for those of you who picked a conflict where maybe you were upset with the other person, if they get defensive, then what I might say is, "I totally hear you that you didn't intend anything negative here. I'm just sharing this so you know the impact your words had on me. It would mean a lot for me if you just acknowledged my feelings." And if they're able to do that, then you can thank them for hearing you. And hopefully, their acknowledgement will help you move forward without resentment.

So that's our pushup for today. Lindsey, thank you so much for flexing your feels and breaking an emotional sweat with me. It has been an absolute pleasure.

Loved it. Thank you.

Thanks for listening to Emotionally Fit hosted by me, Dr. Emily Anhalt. New Push-Ups drop every Tuesday and Thursday. Did you do today's Push-Up alongside me and my guest? Tweet your experience with the hashtag #EmotionallyFit and follow me at @DrEmilyAnhalt. Please rate, review, follow and share the show wherever you listen to podcasts. This podcast is produced by Coa, your gym for mental health, where you can take live, therapist-led classes online. From group sessions to therapist matchmaking, Coa will help you build your emotional fitness routine. Head to joincoa.com, that's join-c-o-a.com, to learn more. And follow us on Twitter and Instagram at @joinCoa. From StudioPod Media in San Francisco, our producer is Katie Sunku Wood. Music is by Milano. Special thanks to the entire Coa crew!