Value is never simply discovered by markets — it's decided, together, by what a society chooses to fund, protect, and imagine into being. And too often, culture is treated as decoration rather than infrastructure.
In this episode, we travel to Whitechapel Gallery in London to speak with Mariana Mazzucato, Whitechapel Economist in Residence and Professor at University College London; Alvaro Barrington, Artist; and Darren Isom, Partner at The Bridgespan Group, in conversation chaired by Gilane Tawadros, Director at Whitechapel Gallery, as part of the gallery's Art Futures series on the value of culture.
Together, they explore why culture has been pushed to the periphery of economic and political life, and what it might mean to place it back at the center. Mariana opens with a provocation on rethinking value itself, before the conversation turns to public funding, philanthropy, imagination, and what institutions owe the communities they serve.
Jump straight into:
04:50 Mariana Mazzucato argues culture belongs at the center of economic thinking, not its edges.
08:48 Rethinking the common good means designing economies with people, not simply for them.
12:50 Public Practice shows how public institutions once relied on in-house creative and design expertise.
16:55 Static metrics like ticket sales miss the deeper value that institutions create.
21:49 Darren Isom reflects on imagination as central to strategy, not ornamental to it.
25:40 Alvaro Barrington challenges the room to reconsider what government and art owe each other.
30:08 Public investment quietly built today's AI industry, a history rarely part of the conversation.
36:05 Darren traces his optimism to generations who learned to find light in darkness.
39:31 Good philanthropy acts as a force of permanence, not a replacement for government.
Resources
Organizations and Institutions Referenced
Whitechapel Gallery — the London gallery hosting the Art Futures series, marking its 125th anniversary in 2026.
Art Futures: The Value of Culture — the Whitechapel Gallery talks series exploring the role of public art institutions.
UCL Institute for Innovation and Public Purpose (IIPP) — Mariana Mazzucato's institute at University College London.
Public Practice — a UK nonprofit placing architects and designers within local government.
V&A East — the Victoria and Albert Museum's East London site, referenced in the discussion on public value.
The Bridgespan Group — the philanthropic advisory firm where Darren Isom is a partner.
Other Resources
The Common Good Economy: A New Compass — Mariana Mazzucato's book (Penguin, 2026), the foundation for her provocation in this episode.
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