CLOC Talk continues its Clockwise: Year in Review & What’s Next series with a spotlight on Europe—highlighting 2025 as a year of intentional investment, partnerships, and community-building across the region. Host Oyango Snell is joined by Sean Houston, Head of Legal Operations at Heineken and a key leader in CLOC’s European strategy, to discuss the growth of legal ops across the Benelux and beyond, and why Europe’s community culture—open knowledge-sharing, practical takeaways, and “rising tide lifts all ships”—has become a powerful engine for progress.

The episode looks ahead to an ambitious 2026, including the CLOC Europe Summit on February 5, 2026 in London, the launch of the Germany chapter, and the continued expansion of member-driven formats like CLOC Around the Table dinners. Sean also previews new regional programming such as CLOC Connect in the Netherlands—bringing together in-house teams, law firms, vendors, and ALSPs/consultants to tackle real operational challenges like outside counsel management—reinforcing CLOC’s focus on practical learning, local relevance, and whole-ecosystem collaboration.

The Clock Europe Summit is

an interactive one day event

2

designed for active participation

and real world problem solving.

3

It brings together legal ops professionals

from across the entire ecosystem

4

who are ready to exchange ideas

and work through shared challenges.

5

Make sure you register for the Clock

Europe Summit event taking place

6

on February 5th, 2026 in London.

7

Welcome to Clock Talk, the

official podcast of the Corporate

8

Legal Operations Consortium.

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I'm Olgo Snell, and today we're continuing

our Clockwise the year in review.

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And what's next series?

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This time with a spotlight on Europe.

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Europe has been a major growth engine

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intentional investment partnership and

community building across the region.

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I'm joined today by my

friend Sean Houston.

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Who has been deeply involved in shaping

clock's European strategy and execution?

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Sean, welcome to Clock Talk.

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Thank you very much, Yengo.

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Great to be here.

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Great to see you as always.

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So for people who don't know you, Sean,

give us a little bit about yourself.

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Tell us where are you, what are

you, who are you, when are you?

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Give us all of the things.

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Sure.

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So yeah, I'm the head of legal

operations here at Heineken, based in

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Amsterdam at our global headquarters.

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I've been with Heineken for

about four and a half years now.

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Before this, I worked at a few different

software companies, most recently

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at one in the legal tech space, and

that is where I was really introduced

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to legal operations and became very

interested in, yeah, this impact and

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this true transformation that I saw

it having at the companies that I was

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fortunate enough to work with when I

was helping to lead customer success.

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At that company and yeah, I

became fascinated with it.

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I think like a lot of people in 2020

when, uh, COVID hit started to do some

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soul searching and seeing what I wanted

to do for the rest of my life, so to

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speak, and decided I was gonna pivot into

legal ops because I had, yeah, again, saw

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firsthand really how impactful it was.

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And there was this brand new thing.

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Yeah, I was really fascinated

by it, so made that leap.

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And yeah, having looked back, it's been

a wonderful experience so far here at

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Heineken, and I think having my background

went to school for journalism and

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communications, was a sports broadcaster

for a few years, then pivoted into

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technology and now into legal operations.

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Might not seem like a very

traditional, let's say, background,

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but I think having those.

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Communication skills, having that

technology implementation and adoption

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expertise, that's really helped

tremendously here with my role at

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Heineken and I'm also part of the advisory

committee for Europe for Clock, as

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you mentioned, and head up the Benelux

Regional Group for clock here within the

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Benelux region, which has been a very

good experience and a growing community,

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which I'm excited and proud about.

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A couple of things there.

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One is there is no traditional

approach to entering into legal ops.

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That's one of the things that's

so fascinating about the industry,

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that people come from all different.

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Disciplines and bring various expertise

and experience to legal ops, which I

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think makes it shine and stand out.

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And another thing there, you pronounced

it not the way that I grew up pronouncing

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it, Heineken, I think you give it the

real Dutch pronunciation of the word than

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what we grew up on the south side cottage.

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Yeah, I've adopted it a little bit.

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Yeah, yeah, yeah.

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I've adopted it a little bit.

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I'm not from the Netherlands, I'm

originally from the us but yeah.

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Officially, it's not Heineken.

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It's Heineken.

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Yeah, it's a bit of a softer end to it.

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I try my best.

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Any Dutch person listening to

this is probably, I'm not saying

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it a hundred percent, but yes.

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Look, Sean, when you look back at

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clock's progress in Europe, especially

in the region that you're in.

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I mean, tell us a little bit

more about the region as well.

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I think a lot of people don't know.

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Yeah, so the Benelux region, I mean,

I'm here in Amsterdam, but Netherlands

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specifically, we've seen a lot of

growth over the last several years.

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It's a big, big region where a lot of

companies have large either headquarters

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or field offices across Europe.

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And yeah, there's a lot of very good

talent, great university systems,

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and it's an attractive place to live.

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So a lot of people wanna live here.

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And as a result, there's been a lot

of explosion, let's say, of this type

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of a role here in Amsterdam and in

the Netherlands and across the region.

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And so we've seen, yeah.

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Every few months I'm seeing more

and more and meeting more and more

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people with legal operations roles and

legal operations titles, and seeing

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companies hiring for the first time,

or expanding their teams as we've done,

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you know, I was the very first one in

this role at Heineken, for example.

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So we're seeing a tremendous amount

of growth and obviously, hopefully

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everyone's seeing a lot of impact.

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I'm sure they are from

that growth as well.

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And yeah, across Europe.

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I think like a lot of things, sometimes

these changes begin in the US and

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then they make their way over to the

UK and then to mainland Europe, and

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I definitely think that's happened

and that it's not coming any longer.

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It's here and it has a foothold and

there's a lot of people doing a lot of

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very impressive things in this space.

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All across Europe.

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But I think the Netherlands, at least

from my experience and what I've

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gathered and speaking to others, is

definitely one of the leaders in terms

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of countries and regions across Europe,

which is exciting and I'm very happy to

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be playing a small part in that and to

be proud of the big growing community.

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We had a very nice holiday social

right before the holidays this

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year had close to 30 people arrive

on relatively short notice, so.

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It's a big growing community.

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I'd say everyone is very open,

very happy to share ideas, and

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really excited to be part of it.

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The few times I've been there, I've

felt and seen that energy, that

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passion, that commitment to legal

operations, but also the community

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there and just support for each other.

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I know you felt it as well, and they've

been part of helping to build it.

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Absolutely.

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Yeah.

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I think that is one thing that I've

definitely seen and can attest firsthand.

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I don't feel any sort

of competition at all.

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It's really like everyone wants to share

ideas and everyone very much has a kind of

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rising tide lifts all ships mentality, and

it's been very fun to be part of and had

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some really very interesting conversations

and lots of events and dinners and things.

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Sharing of ideas and learning,

taking away quite a bit.

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I think that you're spot on

in your analysis, and it's

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not just on the in-house side.

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There's a lot going on in terms of

technology and startups and things,

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doing a lot of great things across the

region as well as on the law firm side.

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A lot of the Dutch law firms and

the also the big international

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firms with offices here.

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Doing a lot in that space as

well as of course on the A LSP

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and on the consultant side.

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Lots going on.

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So yeah, it's not just

on the in-house side.

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It's really the entire community really.

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It's a good place to be.

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Good time and good place.

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And that's a good point to raise

just on how legal ops is Wow.

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In-house.

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The in-house legal team was the crux was

the foundation of how clock began, right?

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It's leaders that created clock came

from those areas, but in law firms,

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even in the vendor community, in

the technology area, in that space.

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It's this comprehensive component at those

dinner conversations that you mentioned.

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That's where you get a chance to

kinda learn about other people's woes.

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So it's good to kind of hit on those.

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Last year, we really emphasized

intentionally and really

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sought after establishing key

partnerships, particularly in Europe.

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We've admitted it.

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I don't run from it.

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Clock was had one singular

event in and out of Europe.

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On an annual basis for long period of

time, but over this past year, we tried

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to change that dynamic by strengthening

our presence to support our members and

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folks throughout the legal ecosystem,

but also strengthening our partnerships

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to even bring together more resources,

partners like RSGI, partners like lpo.

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At their conference, you were there,

you spoke, you were on the panel at.

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Amsterdam conference with lpo.

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What are you seeing, or what do you

believe has helped to increase legal

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ops in, or at least the idea or thought

process of legal operations through

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these partnerships, and how has that

kind of unlocked legal ops in Europe

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as it continues to grow and escalate?

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I think a few things.

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One, there are.

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An ever increasing number of

events going on all of the time.

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And a lot of them are in London.

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And then for all the ones that are

not in London that are based on the

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mainland Europe, a lot of those have

recently been held in Amsterdam.

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So there is a lot going on.

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So I think the decision to partner

with lpo, which was a established,

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had been running for several years,

conference that a lot of people already

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knew about, made a lot of sense.

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I don't know that.

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Right now, or you know, last year

would've been an easy accomplishment for

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quack to come up with yet another full

or multi-day conference with all of the

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time and energy that goes into that when

there already is a great event like lpo.

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That we could partner with.

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And yeah, I really enjoyed the commerce.

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I thought it was a very good

one and I took away quite a bit

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from many of the panels and the

speakers who are participating,

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so I think that was a no brainer.

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And the RSGI partnership?

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Yeah.

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RSGI is a well established organization

across Europe, and I think having

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them and that partnership and their

expertise and attracting speakers

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and supporting with the marketing.

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Those sorts of things.

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Yeah.

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Super helpful and super powerful to help

with getting the type of conference in

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place that you want and making it as

attractive for attendees as possible,

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because at the end of the day, the only

reason we would do these conferences is

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to make it something people wanna go to,

that they're gonna take something away

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from to further enrich the community.

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And so if we're not gonna do

that, then don't have an event

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or don't have a conference.

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I think it's been very effective.

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I'm so glad you said that, Sean,

because some people have a misnomer

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about conferences and summits and

different things, like it's a day

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off work to go meet your colleagues,

have a cocktail, and have a little

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sausage sandwich and call it a day.

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Right.

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It's so much more than that.

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Rather, it's the clock around the

table dinners, which you won't.

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Being on the European committee helped

plan for Barcelona, Madrid, London, and

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the one in Amsterdam that you mentioned.

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Whether it was the clock of Spana

Summit, which was the first ever Spanish

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speaking or non-English speaking event

that we had, with the exception of yours

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truly, and our dear friend Tom Rice, who

only speak enough Spanish to be very,

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very dangerous, and our London social.

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So we have all these events

and had this intentional.

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Sort of outlook on being present to

support the community there this year,

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unlike any other year prior to 2025.

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But I think at the end of the day,

what you just said is what stands

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out to me to be the most pivotal and

important that we do these events

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so that people can learn and grow.

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Take real practical solutions back

to their offices, to their teams,

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and help bring about that strategic,

monumental change at an enterprise

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level as well as a legal team level.

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Exactly.

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Yeah.

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Honestly, if I'm.

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Going to take time out of my day

and let's be frank, set myself

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back on my KPIs and email chain,

my to-do list things I need done.

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Exactly.

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Yeah.

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If I'm gonna do that, I only

wanna do that if it's really gonna

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help me and to help Heineken.

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So that to me is really

the number one factor.

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And if the answer to that is maybe,

or no, I'm not going, and I'm also

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a busy father of two young kids and.

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My wife has a demanding career.

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So yeah, it's also asking for time

off from home is also not easy.

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And yeah, I really try to keep

in mind like every day I'm

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not working in the office.

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I need to be doing something that

is helping to move things forward.

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So that's at least the way I look at it.

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And I also try to hold myself

a bit accountable to kind of.

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Documenting and memorializing.

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It maybe is a bit of a strong term, but

really making clear the takeaways that

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I have and then what I'm gonna try to

do to those with those after I attend

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a conference, for example, that clock

around the table dinner series that

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you mentioned, that was one I remember.

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Mentioning to you shortly after

you started in the role that I

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had attended, a few similar types

of those things over the last few

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years, and I got a lot out of those.

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And it's a relatively

minimal time commitment.

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You're talking about a couple of hours.

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The intimate settings with other kind

of like-minded, similar and position

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type people can be really powerful.

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So it's not always about a 300

or a thousand person conference.

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It can be eight or 10 people.

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Around the dinner table and you can get

just as much if not more out of those.

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So it's also about the real, I'd say

intentionality, so to speak, that

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goes into those events and making

sure that when you attend those,

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that you're present and you're really

trying to get the most out of it.

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'cause if you're gonna go to a conference

and sit there and answer emails for

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half of the time and have to step out

of every session to take phone calls.

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I would say don't go to the conference.

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Really try to be as invested as you can.

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Maybe be getting a bit long-winded

here, iono, but a Spana Summit.

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I was not able to attend myself, but I

think that's a wonderful example of how

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Clock can empower local communities.

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Under that kind of clock umbrella

and with all of the great things that

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Clock can provide to have their own

unique regional event for that region.

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Because I think it's important

to realize like what you do in

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California or New York is not exactly

the way that that would be done.

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Amsterdam or Spain or Eastern

Europe or the Nordics, right?

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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There's nuance and there's

differences across the globe.

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And so yeah, it's not a one size fits

all approach, and that's why you need

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those local leaders who understand

the local ecosystem and kind of the

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way things work to execute that.

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So yeah, hopefully

we'll see more of those.

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And we have some fun things we're

gonna try and do here in our

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region starting this year as well.

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But yeah, I wanted to make sure

I had a chance to mention that.

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Fortunately I wasn't able to attend.

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But speaking to you and others

who did, it sounded like a perfect

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blend of kind of clock with the

local system, if you'll Yeah.

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Yeah.

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And they're ready to run it back, man.

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We're gonna be talking about that with

them over the next couple of weeks.

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I can't wait to get into it.

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Just the way you express the importance

of community and having things have

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more of a local touch, not necessarily.

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Ignore the advancements and things that

have sparked in the US as it relates

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to legal ops, but understand that it's

different in various other markets outside

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the US and think taking a beat back.

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I think that was one of the things that.

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Helped Clark kind of achieve a little

bit of momentum and success this

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year by focusing less on what we

from the US can bring to the various

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regions and focusing more on what the

regions can produce from their own

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communities as it relates to legal ops.

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And the European committee has

been pretty central to that.

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For those that don't know.

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About the Europe committee maybe?

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Sure.

291

Just a little bit about that.

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To make up the role and what you've gotten

out of it and how it continues to thrive

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and help us plan and market and create

these types of experiences for members

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and folks throughout the ecosystem.

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In the Europe area, there is a committee

that we started a couple of years

296

ago now with regional group leaders.

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Who are from in-house legal teams,

as well as people from law firms,

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and a LSPs and tech vendors.

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So we get that kind of full ecosystem

viewpoints covered, if you will.

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Basically, we've tried over the last

couple of years to improve upon the

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clock London Summit, which has been

running for several years now, now

302

referred to as the clock European summit.

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And then also do things like what we just

described starting this clock around the

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table series, creating the Espania summit.

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There's a new regional group

coming in Germany, I know

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that's launching very soon.

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Then the next couple weeks, I don't

know when this will be published,

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but this year, yeah, really meeting

people where they are, I guess

309

is the best way to put it, and.

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Being part of that committee

has been very interesting.

311

Yeah.

312

A lot of times I just sit back and do a

lot of listening because there's some very

313

smart people who have been doing this for

certainly longer than I have and have a

314

lot more experience in this than I do.

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And then, yeah, I'm happy to provide my

input when it comes to my region here,

316

which again, is a big and a growing one.

317

But it's very interesting.

318

Sometimes I'll think something and then

someone from Switzerland or from Spain

319

or from the UK might have a totally

different viewpoint on it, right?

320

And so it's important to not stay

in our little silos and to kind of

321

hear from what others are saying.

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But I think the one commonality o

Yengo is that everyone wants to have

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some people that they can kind of meet

with and talk about these things with.

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Everyone needs that sense of

community, and it's really just kind

325

of finding the right recipe, so to

speak, for each of those regions.

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And I think we've tried our best.

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I'm certainly not, I wouldn't say we've

done everything perfectly, but we've

328

made strides, I think 2025, again,

objectively a successful year with.

329

Things like the SPANA Summit, partnering

with lpo, RSGI, et cetera, and yeah,

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I'm very optimistic about what we'll

331

Again, really making sure that we are

getting the entire ecosystem involved

332

as well, not only in the planning, but

the execution of the events because.

333

I don't do what I do in Heineken

without some very important technology

334

vendors and law firms, and a LSPs and

consultants, and similarly, they don't do

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what they do without customers like us.

336

So it's a real ecosystem.

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I use that word.

338

I kind of cringe sometimes

when I use that word.

339

I too.

340

It's kind like, it's like that's real.

341

I dunno how else to describe it.

342

I dunno how else to say it either.

343

Right?

344

Every time my brain is telling my,

or I don't know if your, I think

345

your brain controls your mouth.

346

It should boy more than your

mouth controlling your brain.

347

But every time I get ready to say

it, there's kinda like this pause

348

in my head, like, do I use that?

349

Is there another word?

350

Should I say community?

351

Should I say ecosystem?

352

And I just said, you know what?

353

It's the legal ecosystem because

that's what it is, and I'm leaning

354

into it and if somebody doesn't

like it or they cringe, so be it.

355

We'll deal with it.

356

I wanna pivot to some of

the pieces that you actually

357

talked about, and that is 2026.

358

We spent most of this time talking

about where we've been, what we've

359

done, how things have kind of played

360

setting the foundation for what

361

What are you most looking forward to?

362

I mean, we got a lot of things

on the calendar, things happening

363

in Amsterdam, things happening in

London, things happening in Chicago.

364

Where do you want to start, man?

365

Pick your poison.

366

Throw a dart at it.

367

Yeah, the February 5th, London

or summit occurring in London.

368

I'm really looking forward to that.

369

Yeah.

370

Yeah, the New York summit, it's

been a little bit since we've

371

had the clock event there, so I'm

really looking forward to that.

372

I think that will be a really good way

to kick off the year, at least for me.

373

It'll be the first conference

I attend this year.

374

And yeah, looking at the agenda and

knowing the effort that we've put into

375

the planning on the content, I think

it's gonna be a really wonderful event.

376

So I'd encourage anyone

who can attend to do so.

377

I personally really like the clock

around the table series, so I'm

378

looking forward to having that

become a kind of regular occurrence.

379

Not just in the cities that you mentioned

that we did last year, but potentially

380

new ones this year, maybe multiple.

381

Again, in true legal ops, fashion

testing things out and seeing how,

382

what works and what doesn't, right.

383

And iterating from there.

384

So personally, I really like that.

385

And then also the change for the global

summit from Las Vegas to Chicago.

386

I'm interested to see how that goes.

387

I think a lot of people who've been

attending for many years are excited

388

to get to go to Chicago this year.

389

And for Europe it's one time zone closer

or two time zones closer actually.

390

And it's a little bit shorter of

a flight, so it won't be quite as

391

bad as 11 hour flight, nine hour

time difference from Amsterdam.

392

It's not quite as severe for Chicago.

393

So yeah, those are a few things

I'm really looking forward to.

394

I have to also add, we're planning

a series of three events this year

395

here in the Netherlands, where we're

calling it Clock Connect, where

396

we're gonna try and focus on some

of the legal operations impact that

397

we're seeing across the region.

398

And we're basically looking at it from

those four pillars that I kind of briefly

399

discussed a few minutes ago, but the

in-house legal operations, the law firms.

400

Technology vendors and then

a LSP slash consultants.

401

And we're trying to get two

participants or two voices from

402

each of those four pillars.

403

So eight people in total from

differing organizations and

404

differing viewpoints, so to speak.

405

To speak to one dedicated subject

for each of these sessions.

406

And we're gonna try and

make this a regular thing.

407

Every few months we bring

people together in the.

408

The first one's happening in March

and it's gonna be focused on outside

409

council management, which is a

subject that's relevant for everyone.

410

And so I'm really excited

to see how this goes.

411

Yeah, we're busy in the kind

of final planning sessions now.

412

We should have everything kind

of fingers crossed, wrapped up in

413

the next couple of weeks and the

invites will be going out soon.

414

So I'm excited to see how that goes.

415

It is a lot of work, and I

must admit, young go, I'm not.

416

Very skilled in event planning

per se, so I'm getting to

417

learn a new skill here in 2026.

418

I think knowing the effort that we're

putting into that and the intentionality

419

that we're trying to tackle that with, I

think it'll be a very interesting event

420

for a couple of hours to bring people

together on a very important subject.

421

Importantly.

422

From there we'll learn and

see what we can do better.

423

For the next one, we'll identify what

crowdsource from the group, what the next

424

topic should be, and then hopefully that's

something we can replicate not only across

425

Europe, but across the globe within clock,

to do something similar and figure out a

426

way to make that kind of truly go global.

427

But I'm very interested to see,

you know, bringing together those

428

four very different viewpoints to

talk about one specific subject.

429

I think it'll be an

interesting way to tackle it.

430

So we'll see.

431

But those are a few things

that stand out to me.

432

I feel like you broke news, man.

433

I feel like we need that little bar that

rolls around breaking news, the clock

434

connect launches in the Netherlands.

435

That sounds exactly So wonderful, man.

436

From the European summit and London

that's kicking off February 5th.

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And you had mentioned the launch

in Germany, which I believe the

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date is February 11th, where

they're going to officially launch

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the programming and the regional.

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Grouping there, which

I'm so excited about.

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I had a chance to talk with the

leaders over there then leading

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to the Clock Connect in March.

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That's going to be fascinating as you

guys kick things off to talk about issues

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that outside council is facing as well as.

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In-house legal teams are facing

with outside counsel and how they

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can be better partners, right?

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So I can't wait to participate in that

and hear what's happening in March.

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Leading us up to CGI in Chicago

in May the 11th, through the 14th.

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It's going to be a fascinating

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We look at 2026, we can do all of the

crystal ball predictions and different

451

things like that, but give us something

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what do you wanna see clock doing in

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emphasizing something that we did discuss?

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I would say for 2025, I'm very proud of.

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The real like attention that we gave

for this upcoming European summit

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and the fact that we did not try to

rush and host an event in October

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just to host an event in October.

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And I'm hopeful and optimistic that

everyone will see that when they

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show up in February that it will

be a really powerful event with

460

some great content and it will be

a, I believe, a wonderful event.

461

Again, a, a nice way to kick

off the year, so to speak.

462

So that's one thing for 22 5, even though

463

planning of course took place last year.

464

And then for 2026, I would say the new

community in Germany is gonna be great.

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That's wonderful.

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I can't take any credit for that, but I

love that this concept is continuing to

467

grow and to expand, so that's wonderful.

468

And then as far as what

Clock can do, I think.

469

The more that we can bring everyone from

legal operations, quote unquote, together,

470

and not just on the in-house legal side.

471

To me, that is kind of the shining star

because it is not just an in-house thing.

472

There are, as we've talked about several

times on this, there are some really very

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impressive things going on on the law

firm side at a lot of these law firms.

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Or they're innovating and doing things

that not only impact their firm,

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and not only even their customers,

but really the entire industry.

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These law firms can be very competitive.

477

So when one firm is able to do

something that impacts another.

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So I think the pace of change and impact

we'll see on that side is going to be,

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I think, very groundbreaking and very.

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Transformational here in 2026.

481

So the more that clock can keep all of

the whole community together and the

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whole, as we talked about ecosystem,

that is wonderful because I really do

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learn a lot from conversations, and I

don't wanna speak too much on this weo,

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but if you think about it from my side.

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I work at one company, so I see the

way that one company handles these

486

things, but a law firm sees hundreds

or thousands of companies and how

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they handle very similar scenarios.

488

So they have a lot of different

experiences and insights

489

that they can provide.

490

And from a technology side,

I have that in my background.

491

As I said, I saw a lot of

companies doing things very well.

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I saw a lot of companies not doing things

very well, and everywhere in between.

493

So it's very good to understand not

only what's working well, but what's not

494

working well and what does a law firm,

for example, like for their customers

495

to do and not what helps them to be the

best partner for Heineken, for example.

496

So really trying to get that full

viewpoint and all of the bases covered.

497

I think for me, the more that we

can try to do that through clock, I

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think that will only help everyone.

499

Beautifully said, man.

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As an association executive,

we have this saying.

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When you work for one association,

you've seen one association.

502

Yeah.

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There are thousands of associations out

there, but they all do things different.

504

And what you just iterated reiterated

there for me is when you work at one

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legal ops or have a legal ops o operation

at one company, you've seen the way

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that one company handles and actually

executes as it relates to legal apps.

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But there are other practices,

other disciplines, other ways.

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To enhance and increase because

others are doing it different, to

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be even more efficient, to be even

more effective, and help bring about

510

this change in the legal ecosystem.

511

I love having these conversations because

as the leader of Clock, I get a chance

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to humbly to humble myself rather, and

listen to our members and listen to our

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leaders who are out there during the work.

514

Sean, my friend, thank you for sharing

these insights and for your leadership.

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You've brought so much to clock

to, not only just in Europe, but.

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Globally, period.

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Just your insights and just how you've

shared some of the things that you've

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shared, and I can't wait to see what

happens in March and to even get you

519

even more and more involved to the extent

that you can and are willing at higher

520

leadership levels in the years to come.

521

It's clear that 2025 was a foundational

522

Bigger to our listeners.

523

Thank you for tuning in to Clock Talk.

524

If you're a clock member in Europe

or you're thinking about getting

525

involved, now is the time to engage,

connect, and help shape what's next.

526

We are designing the future of

legal ops and it starts with you.

527

All of us together can

truly make a difference.

528

I'm Ol Yel Snell, and we'll see

you next time on Clock Talk.