In this episode of the Coconut Thinking podcast, I speak with Santiago Rincón-Gallardo, Chief Research Officer of Michael Fullan's team. As an educational change leader, consultant and scholar, Santiago's work looks at liberating learning and its power to change lives and the world. Through his work he seeks to understand how and under what conditions powerful learning can spread widely across entire educational systems. We discuss among other things:

• The difference between learning to be taught and learning to learn;
• How social movements are interconnected and education's role in creating change; and
• The role of play as an essential part of learning.

We have rebranded! The Meaningful Learning podcast is now the Coconut Thinking podcast—keeping things simple. We look forward to your comments and thoughts on our site coconut-thinking.design, where you'll also find our articles and other goodies.