In this episode, we hear Jodi Smith talk about the financial issues and lack of diversity in the entertainment industry and the challenges she had to overcome throughout her career.

For the full show notes, head on over to:

https://www.salaryfinance.com/us/podcast/Jodi-Smith-Financial-Insecurity-in-Entertainment

Anita Ward 0:00

Welcome to Working On Wellbeing, where we share stories of purpose-driven people doing good in the world. We'll meet changed agents, entrepreneurs, students, teachers, and big thinkers to learn about their wow moment and how it got them to where they are today. This show is brought to you by Salary Finance. And I'm your host, Anita Ward, cultural anthropologist, and Chief Development Officer at Salary Finance.

Hey, welcome, everybody. Today, our show is live from Hollywood. I've been dying to say that we're live from Hollywood with one of the smartest people I know, Miss Jodi Smith, and one of the only people I know, who operates equally from both sides of her brain. So this is going to be fun. And it's also going to be I'll give you a little hint, it'll be a little bit of behind-the-scenes conversation today. So hello, Jodi, welcome to the show.

Jodi Smith 1:06

Hi, thank you. This is gonna be fun.

Anita Ward 1:10

So everybody, Jodi and I have worked together for more than 20 years, in many different iterations of our careers. I think we were first co-workers at Chase. Then management and technology consultants and professional services, and then next was in nonprofit leaders whose were purpose to drive change in underserved communities. Then we were also mentors to women entrepreneurs. It's been a fun, crazy roller coaster. We have been like sisters side by side through all of this. It's great fun. But you're so much more interesting than me because you're this crazy, kind of cool conundrum if you will. I know you won't tell everybody. So I'm going to brag for two minutes about you. So, everyone, Jodi's got an MBA, but she's also a creative director. She's a television and movie executive producer. She's a screenwriter, she's an Emmy nominated. Let me emphasize that again, she's Emmy nominated, she created a cartoon. She's a technology leader. She's a business mentor and overall a good human being. But most importantly, she lives in LA, and she saw my nephew Trey perform in Hamilton. Welcome to the show. I thank you so much for doing this. But how was Hamilton? Should we give a shout-out to Lin-Manuel and the LA cast?

Jodi Smith 2:55

Listen, there are some people in this world that deserve to be rich. Lin-Manuel is one of those people. I heard about Hamilton. I've always love Broadway musicals but I prefer plays more since I was a kid.

Anita Ward 3:22

It's (inaudible)

Jodi Smith 3:23

I couldn't miss Trey performing in Hamilton since I've known him since he was a little baby. And knowing he's going to be Hamilton so I have to go. It's amazing! I walked out of the theater and I couldn't wait to see it again for the second time.

Anita Ward 3:44

You did again? You have to, right?

Jodi Smith 3:47

Yes. The levels of creativity of Lin-Manuel are just mind-blowing. He was able to turn a sort of dry story into a really fascinating one. The themes that were going on at the start of the show and the number of People of Color from the cast were really inspiring. I remember when I watched it, it was packed with an audience and there was no social distancing but everybody was vaccinated and wearing masks. Also, I wanted to say a shout-out to the first angel investor.

Anita Ward 5:13

I love how you describe Lin-Manuel. We are talking about theatre, which is why I'm so excited to have you on this show. Because that's just how your brain operates. We're gonna start at the beginning. I have to start this show with personal stories. So I thought that we could start with your early childhood and I also want to know the lessons that helped shape you and your purpose. So, where did you grow up? And what was it like in your early years?

Jodi Smith 5:51

Yes, I was born and raised in the Bronx. My parents are actually immigrants from Jamaica, and they came over in the late 60s. And my mom was a nurse and my dad ended up working on Wall Street by happenstance. He is a trained agricultural person and then genetics of plants and stuff so that was the least. He can actually splice two plants together and make a new plant. Just like looking at a painting and recreating it or hearing a piece of music afterward playing it. That is the kind of a person my Dad is. While my mom was a nurse who was giving 100% all day. She was loved by patients and co-workers. Education is important in our household. It was influenced by the West Indie culture wherein education means freedom and being a doctor, a nurse, or a lawyer is acceptable and anything outside of that scope is already considered ridiculous of some sort. But it kind of didn't stop us as kids. Since my brother always wanted to be a pilot and

Anita Ward 8:18

I remember that.

Jodi Smith 8:19

My brother was the kid who was waiting patiently in his seat until the right time. Then every flight, he was up there talking to them and asking millions of questions. Education was everything that was engraved on our heads. We were taught that as long as we have an educational base, we can do anything and have anything that we want.

Anita Ward 8:50

So I was just browsing on your LinkedIn account since I told myself that I should prepare for you. I saw there that you attended the High School of Science in the Bronx.

Jodi Smith 9:01

Yes.

Anita Ward 9:02

So now this is starting to paint a much fuller picture in terms of science and art and caregiving. Was it because you are influenced culturally? Or were your parents strictly told you to go to science school and be a doctor Jodi, which was it?

Jodi Smith 9:49

No, that was pretty much it. My parents were like you either pass the exam or you figure out your own way in life. I know that they were serious about it since my brother had gone there before me. Luckily, I managed to pass the test, or else I didn't know what I'm going to do if I didn't. The funny part was when I went to that school, there wasn't much focus on arts. It's just hardcore Science, Mathematics and English. They are actually preparing you right to go out into the world to go to college which was the entire point. They had an art club and you have to take an art class because it's required. But we also had mechanical drawings so you can learn how to draw architectural diagrams. Which was ridiculous.

Instead of home economics, we had a science technical laboratory. Where you have to build something by the end of the semester. So it was very much that.

We're gonna have to translate Home Economics for the young listeners.

Right. But it's coming back, though. That's the funny part. It's coming back.

Celebrity chefs, right. Bobby Flay can make Home Economics look good.

Exactly.

So the art side comes from within me, I mean, my mom, I will credit her.

She always took me because my brother wasn't into it, and we would always take me to Broadway plays and musicals. She also likes ballet, philharmonic, and all that stuff you have to do. It was because she wanted me to be cultured, but not necessarily to choose it as a beginner. There's a saying that, "Act as you've been somewhere." It was that, know your etiquette and also understand how the world work. Somehow I found out what a producer does. Which was the person that puts it all together, and from there I knew that's what I want to do.

Also just figuring out problems because we'll get to that, but that's really what a producer does. A lot of the time you have to smooth out stuff. Though in West Indie culture if you want to be in movies. That's pretty silly, right? So I went to college and said I'm going to be a lawyer.

Where did you go to college, Jodi?

I went to American University in DC, and the perfect place for it and I realized I hated the political classes. They bored me to tears.

That explains your reaction.

Right, if nothing else, I am consistent. And I was working full time actually in college, which I do not recommend to anybody if you can avoid it. I had to switch majors because I was tired all the time. Just trying to struggle through and it turned out my finance classes were actually the easiest classes for me. Growing up I had been exposed to that because I would go to my father's job. He worked at a couple of different firms on Wall Street that eventually lead him to be the lead financial analyst for the city of New York. So he was the one who invested all of the pension funds and everything like that into fixed income. So you have a pension right when you retire. So I've grown up, looking at Bloomberg Terminal, and I've been able to read those since I was a teenager. Those stories, which I mentioned earlier, led me to complete my finance degree and decide to return to New York to start a career.

But how did a New Yorker end up in Texas? Because I was aware that you were in Texas for school.

I went to work for an investment bank with the intention of becoming a Research Analyst for the entertainment industry. And it happened at the investment bank where I worked, where Hal Vogel was the lead investment analyst for the entertainment industry. I worked my way up to the investment banking division, and I went right up to Hal Vogel's office and said, "I want your job one day; what do I need to do?" He was a really nice guy. And he said, "You're fantastic. I can't help you unless you have an MBA." And I was like, "All right, done, I'll go get what?"

So I applied, and I was awarded a fellowship at the University of Texas at Austin. I mean, there were a couple of places I could have gone and I was like, but that's free and also warm. Aside from that, they're a top of 15 schools. Those are the cases. That was the fake. So I go to UT Austin and tell them that you have to do a summer internship between your first and second years. And then I go to Chase for my internship. And the first is that you must complete two rounds of interviews with different departments during your summer internship. Let's start with my first department, franchise and trademark finance. If someone wants to buy 15 Burger Kings, they go to this department at the bank, and the bank arranges a loan for you to buy 15 Burger Kings. That's really interesting because I didn't know anything about that world at all. It was great learning about that. And then I realized I was thinking about what my second area was going to be. And they had put me in real estate. And as I'm in franchise and trademark finances, I gotta get serious about my life and I realized I hate sitting in front of spreadsheets all day, I despise it. And I realized that I can't be a research analyst. If I hate ...

But I said to myself, what did I like about being a research analyst? Let me break this job down. One side is the financial modeling but the other side was going into companies and talking to them. Hearing their plans for the future and how they're improving, and then deciding whether or not that will work. Is that a reasonable expectation? Will you be able to meet your revenue targets with this strategy? Is this company's management capable of leading it into the future? I like that part of it. That's exactly what I intended to do. So I was doing some research on Chase on the internet. I found out that there's a management consulting department on Chase. That's where I knew that you are the head of the management, so I started calling you and leaving messages. But I got no response and I was also talking to your assistant.

And then I finally asked, "Well, what time do you guys get in in the morning?" and they replied, "Oh, 7:30." Great, I said. And I put on my best suit and cufflinks and sat in, you have a reception area with a couch, and I was sitting in the reception area when you walk in with your coffee. And you're like, "Hello, who are you?" I introduced myself and explained that I had been calling and leaving messages for you. So I decided to pay you a visit since I hadn't heard from you in a while.

Awesome.

Right. You realize it's 7:30 a.m. and you've been completely ambushed. There are no excuses. I'll set up this meeting with you. You also changed my internship. And I came to work for you, and the rest is history, as they say because that's what I wanted to do.

It's so crazy because I think back on you're just your background in terms of being a consultant. And you said earlier, being a producer is so much problem solving, right?

Yes

So, whether we were doing it in banking or for a client later in our careers, that consulting experience is producing the business. So it's masterminding in many ways, how the business operates, what needs to change, what its financial infrastructure is. I happen to know a few great stories about you as a consultant, and I'm thinking we could share a couple. But let's do one that's a little crazy. Let's talk about your experience as a consultant in Japan, and maybe we'll do the one where it's sort of Jodi - Jerry Maguire moment so we can interest them. I believe they will help to set the tone for what happens in the consulting world and also how do you deal with these kinds of issues. Plus they're great fun stories to talk about. This is incredible timing. We're about to acknowledge 9/11 which happened in 2001. Why don't you tell everybody? How did you end up in Japan? And what was the construct? And why was it crazy?

It was such a fantastic experience. For anybody who hasn't been to Japan, I highly suggest putting it on your bucket list because it is an amazing country. I was working as a consultant, I just rolled off of a project and I had six weeks of vacation saved up. I was supposed to take part of the summer off and travel and do stuff. We had already started sort of the seals, sowing the seeds of an entertainment practice within the consulting firm. And so I really wanted to come out to LA and kind of scout out, what's going on out here, can we generate business for Chicago. There was a company and who was going to buy the consulting firm I worked for, and they wanted to start replicating the services we delivered in the States to Japan. As a result, they required someone to go and lead the project while also delivering the business strategy side of the offerings. Now they go through the whole company and come to me. But I declined their offer since I'm burnt out and I need to take some time off. So they go around the company, at the same level as I am, then they came back and said that no one else can do it aside from me. They also said that the project has to start next week and I'm going to be there for a week and a half. Later that time, they talked to me to say that I need to extend my time in Japan as a client partner. They tasked me to deliver the business strategy and lead a minimal team together.

Do you speak Japanese?

That's the problem.

You couldn't even read the signs on the streets?

No, I couldn't. That will come into play later. Moving on, the two people on the team that they sent with me, hate each other. Basically, it's managing that human drama going on behind the scenes, and teaching them. Though I have to say, the people they gave us - their English was incredible. We go about our work from delivering the services, handling different situations, and creating presentations. Then our support staff was all the way in New York City. So we were up all night collaborating with them on the things that we need in Japan. A few months later, I was called to a dinner that was important in Japanese business culture. It turns out it was a test case because there was some debate within the Japanese company. I didn't realize it right away, but they grilled me with questions such as "If you were in our place, would you buy? Why?", and, "What do you think the firm has to offer?" Fast forward to where they decided on the investment and they want me to commit to staying there for a year. But I was like, not only can I not understand what people are saying in meetings but I have to rely on translators in our working group. There were a few signs with Roman letters or numerals so I have to know where I am going before I left the hotel. There was one time that solidified my thinking - I was on the train and we were all sitting there. All of a sudden an announcement from the speaker comes up and everybody got up and walks out of the train, except for me. That is when it really hit home like I am in a different country. I don't speak their language, there could have been a bomb on the train and I would have no idea. But my firm won't pay for language lessons so I said I'll be going home instead and make somebody else come and replace me because I don't want to commit to a year. My supervisor wrote me an email and said that he can't protect me if I want to come home. That's when you have to sit down and you're like ...

What is my purpose? What am I thinking? How will this change my life? Right?

Will this alter the overall trajectory? And am I okay with devoting my entire life to this job? Because it's not like you're going out and meeting people while working 16 hours a day, right? So I said no, that I'd rather take my chances. I'm on my way home. And they sent two people to replace me, which I found amusing. He comes to me one night, he's only been there for a week and a couple of days a week maybe, and he's like, I don't know how you've done this. And he says, "I don't know if I'm going to make it for a year." I said to him that he will make it once he get used to it. I came home right after Labour Day. My sleep schedule is still messed up from the time change, and I believe we had an early conference call that day. So I'm up early working in Chicago, and the Today show is playing in the background, and I'm just working away when I notice that a plane has crashed into the World Trade Center. And I'm working and watching, and then there's another plane. I was actually watching TV when the second plane took off. It was just that you were aware of what was going on and lived in downtown Chicago. I'm currently on the 36th floor. And I'm opening all the windows because I'm looking at the Sears Tower and the John Hancock Tower.

My office at Chase was 55 wall. But Jodi, before we do your Jerry Maguire thing, let's jump over a bit, I know that you left, you finally did sort of hit your purpose. I know you came home and I think the first one that really drove your purpose was when you joined the Discovery Channel. I think that was your first nomination for a Daytime Emmy. But I would love to know, some of the magic that happens when you're making a series for the Discovery Channel because in many ways this starts to solidify your purpose. And I'm just fascinated with the entertainment and movie industry. But could you share a bit about what you were doing? And what was it like to make a series there? And congrats on the nomination.

Thanks. It was interesting because I actually didn't create the show. There were two people who had created the show already. They had this vision for an updated Barney for kids, something that was cooler and that sort of thing. And brought in this hip-hop culture just gave this infusion to kids live-action TV, because everything before them was Barney and Teletubby and Blue's Clues. What happens if you blow up that entire sensibility, and you meet the kids where they are, the kids are listening to it by right? They're dancing to the videos they're doing? What if you bring it to that, so they had created this show? A friend of mine actually heard that they were looking for writers. That's how I got to the show, and they suggested that I should submit something. That was the first full-length TV script I ever wrote. They have a screenwriting software final draft that everybody has a final draft, and I didn't have time to get it. So I looked up, what are the different margin sizes for the different elements and, and I recreated a script on Microsoft Word. And they called me in, they offered me the supervising producer position. They said that I have what it takes. So that's kind of how I got, I got to the show. Working with Discovery was great because they were pretty good about leaving us alone. In terms of when you work with a network, they have notes on everything, everything from the casting to the scripts to the props, sometimes the set everything and because it's a kids show, everybody's looking at it harder. And so given that the number of notes that kind of came back from Discovery was really manageable. I was actually pretty proud of that myself because as a supervising producer, all the scripts have to go through me. So I write some scripts, but other writers do as well. I sometimes have to rework an outline before handing it over to a writer and telling them, "Here, just write this and send it back." Or saying, "This isn't going to work." So everything goes through your hands, and then it gets to the network, and they don't have much to say.

That's great.

Yes, it was great. It was a proud moment, because that script I wrote for 50 bucks, they actually ended up using it, they actually ended up producing it and it was on my Microsoft Word.

So I love to hear your story. I love the $50 piece. But now I'm looking at an industry that, in my opinion, has issues with Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion. When I look at the data, and particularly in the animation world, People of Color, they end across the entire special effects, post-production, cinematography, editing, all of that it's less than 50% representation. And then I say, what about just basic film without animation, because maybe that's technology, and there's a barrier or something. But isn't it true that film directors account for 27.6 percent of all film directors, 15 percent of all writers, and 13 or 14 percent of all writers? When you look at the overall representation, people of color account for only about 30% of the total industry. And then as women, break down who's running these companies. It's 91% white males driving this industry all the way down to unit heads. I think to myself, here's this really exciting stuff you were doing 20 years ago, and it appears to me like there's this huge opportunity for change, but I'm looking at it from a high-level data perspective, and I have a child in entertainment and a nephew in entertainment, and they're both children of color. But is this the time you're seeing on the ground? Is there a chance for change? Did 2020 have an impact, or did it make things worse in some ways? So, based on what you see on a daily basis, what can we do to promote inclusion?

I think it's gotten exponentially better since I started in entertainment, just the number of faces you see on the screen has exploded, which is great. I know you'll hear grumblings from people who say there aren't enough people of color being cast, which I find hilarious. But you have to point out that most people of color aren't being cast as leads, so they're filling in all those second, third, fourth, and fifth positions, whereas the entire cast would be right and I think you see the improvement because so many more people that I'm in contact with are working and they're working just a lot more and where it used to be. I think what used to frustrate me and what I'd like to see more of is that if there was a show with black people on it, it was always about drugs or some kind of poverty story, or "poverty porn," as they call it. I'm encouraged to see so many more diverse stories coming to the screen. I believe that projects like Moonlight, which was so different, would not have been seen by you 20 years ago. And things like Black Panther, the studio is seen as taking a risk on this thing that ends up earning billions of dollars. It is the projects that, when done correctly, and you spend the proper money on it, and you take the time, yes, this project will make you billions of dollars, so seeing a lot of improvements in that regard, it can still be a challenge to get the project off the ground. But there are a lot more avenues, and a lot more people are willing to meet and entertain the idea of a black creator and or a project that has a black lead in it, so you're not being shut down like we don't make black films, which is what I used to hear 20 years ago, we don't make black films, sorry, but nothing against the black. We just don't make them, so it's getting better. Let's see how long this goes on. Hollywood, like Wall Street, is dominated by the color green. So, if you continue to see these projects make money and draw in viewers that streaming services will keep their subscriber numbers high. If we continue to see projects involving people of color. As a result, we'll keep making them.

So, if you look at the other side of the equation, and look at the individual, I see so many entertainers who struggle with finances as well. As a result, they rely on fame and fortune to ensure financial success. And so, and I know there is no longer traditional artist development, but shouldn't the studios, and perhaps at some level, the producers, be concerned with the financial health of these people as well? So I think about the actors and writers, and I'm thankful that I didn't grow up in a wealthy family or be exposed to anything related to financial literacy. But I'm taking the time with Tommy to tell him, here's what you need to do differently. But, if you really want to make this shift, shouldn't the studios recognize that many of the actors and writers who are coming to the table have never been exposed to any level of security, whether it's physical health, nutritional health, mental health, or financial health? So, how do you create this responsible, long-term environment? To your point, let's see how long it lasts. So, what should we do now? I read in some of our research that if you're under financial stress, which many entertainers are, you're more likely to suffer from anxiety and depression. So now I'm thinking that a lot of what we're seeing in terms of anxiety and depression in the industry itself may be due to a lack of basic financial understanding. For instance, did I just receive my first large check and spend it on an airplane? Right? And I'm not your brother, and I'm not a pilot. So, I'm curious, you've spent your entire career in financial services, and you're talking about angel investors? Isn't there supposed to be some kind of angel investor who comes in and says, "Hey, let me invest in you as an individual?" Allow me to assist you. What is the responsibility of providing basic financial literacy and conversations in the absence of an a&r arm? What causes this to happen? I feel like there's somewhere, or maybe it's like mentors, like you, who come along and say, "All right, let me help you."

Right. Well, here's the thing: it's so complicated because the studio, say, let's put the studio on the top level, right? So the studio can be separated from the project, because they'll say, well, we'll give you the money, or we'll distribute your project, and you finish it and return it to us. And we'll see to it that it gets into theaters, right? So they're so removed from the artist that they can't feel any responsibility, right, until the artist becomes so well-known that their name, right, takes the studio out of the equation, and then the producers hire the artists for projects. So, as much as they care about that person, they also care about their performance, right? So perhaps that person's mental and financial health is critical while working on this project. But you can work for a producer and make the greatest movie of all time, and then never work with them again or speak to them again. As a result, the artists are left to their own devices. And that's why it's part of the reason, isn't it? You hear all of these sad horror stories about people going bankrupt. The other thing is that because of Hollywood's economics when you're first starting out when you're maybe a day player, you're making maybe $100 a day. And the rent is high here. And so there are all these other costs that people don't realize, especially if you're a woman and you're getting your hair done or colored, and you're getting facials and nails and all of that stuff because you have to look a certain way when you go to audition. People don't realize how much it costs, do they? And then there's the fact that I can make a movie today and then not work for six months. People aren't taught to deal with that kind of financial insecurity right there. They're engrossed in the process. And I'm on the other side, so I'm very much on the business side of things. So, what exactly is this? And, to your point, I've talked to better actors, musicians, and other people who say, "Look, how are you investing for your future?" Do you even understand the stock market? Let me give you some tips or introduce you to trading so that when you're not working, you can be trading in the market in a very simple rudimentary way that will help you build up a larger base of savings, rather than just putting it in the bank and then waiting for it to be drained when you're not working. Because you'll be seeing a lot during that cycle.

This has the potential to become my passion project. And in a moment, I'd like to discuss yours. But I think the idea of bringing together fintech in a studio and possibly the Manage manager infrastructure or the lawyer infrastructure, or basic financial literacy, When my son Tommy first started, he was 18 years old. They also forced me to open a trust account. I can't remember what it was called. It's known as a Coogan account. And, while there may be an adult equivalent, we work with the Motley Fool, Salary Finance, and Chase, among others. And we figure out what Coogan accounts for when it comes to adults. And maybe I could get very passionate about it because it's very close to me, how do you create an ESG framework for the entertainment industry, because we're going to burn through people with financial stress, and it's not fair. And you, Jodi, are an exceptional case. Do you realize how much I adore you? However, most artists are unaware of the other side of their brain. They will tell you that they do not want to know. So, to return to your Japan example, they must trust a manager. Finance has its own language and set of symbols, and if you don't understand it, you're in big trouble.

If we're looking at the Bloomberg terminal that will look like complete nonsense. It will look like the matrix with the numbers going.

So you're expecting someone who just got off the set of Black Panther to suddenly realize you should buy Ethereum? That is not how it works.

What is even Ethereum?

What exactly is a digital currency? And so I'm thinking maybe I'll ask you not to let this part go. Because I'm in Atlanta, which is now a major entertainment capital, you're in Los Angeles, and we both come from the financial services industry. And these days, I work for a really cool nimble tech company that might be able to meet some of these needs. But if we lined it up with the studio and Motley Fool, or people who care, there might be a way to bring a collaboration to actually support the industry.

And don't forget about the gills. Listen, the Actors Guild, those are the places where you'll feel the pulse of Hollywood. Right? Those are the people who care about the artists who care about the creators. And I think it's a great idea because people come out here so young, right? They come out here at the age of 18, 21, and say, "This is great, eating peanut butter and jelly and sleeping on someone's couch for my art is noble, but at 35, that's not noble." It's sleeping on someone's couch.

We began the conversation by discussing Lin-Manuel Miranda. I'll tell you that Hamilton's cast leaned in, and all of 2020, I'm not sure how much I'm allowed to reveal, but basically helped financially even though they weren't working now. There are very few other people I'm aware of who have done this, but that man leaned in and said, "We're a family." This is how families look after one another. So, even so, these young people, who are 22 and 23, are out looking for other jobs to supplement their income because they live in Los Angeles. Now I'm going to go while we've been gone for a long time because I'm so excited. I enjoy speaking with you. But let's end with a quick description. We've talked about my passion project, and I'm hoping to find out what yours is because I think it's awesome.

Yes, when I first came home from college. Benita Pierce, a woman who worked on Wall Street, was one of my mentors. And she and my father were friends, and they did trades and stuff together. However, she was the first black woman to work in institutional trading on Wall Street in 1974. And she ended up having her own firm in fixed income securities and bonds and all kinds of corporate bonds and things like that, and I've said ever since I've known her story, and especially since I started down the Hollywood writing, producing path, that this has to get out there. This is one of those stories that people should know about people because, while there are black people on Wall Street, there aren't many of them. But, to go back and be a woman to chase, I remember how many years later, even when I went to work at Chase, I was being stopped, I was being looked at askance because I was wearing a pantsuit. And someone took it upon themselves to say, "Hey, look, when I first started here, we couldn't wear pants on the trading floor,"

I got a dress code when I first started in banking, and I posted it on my desk because I wrote up the elevator with the head of HR, and he wasn't pleased with what I was wearing. It was the longest 60-story flight or, whatever you want to call it, the elevator ride of my life. So no one can know, and today's young women would ask, "Are you crazy?" You've got stories, don't you? But I recall that the dress code was dropped on my desk within an hour.

Yes. And so can you imagine? This is 1974.

Can you imagine what went through on that? On the trading floor? Did she have a seat?

She did not have a seat on the first day they went because there were two other women and a couple of guys in this internship program, despite the fact that she already had her MBA from NYU. And she was literally like, "I'm sitting down" by the second through the second day. So she took a seat, took the phones, and figured out how it all worked. And just says she had this really storied career really interesting career where she ended up again, owning her own firm and actually having a seat on the NASDAQ stock exchange's board of directors. And it's just one of those stories, being not only a woman in her 70s in the highest levels of finance but also being black. Her story talking about, what's instilled in her and all that stuff. She's a fascinating person to talk to you, if you ever get a chance, I'll definitely have to you guys up. Where does her sense of self come from after hearing her backstory growing up in Massachusetts? When you're definitely one of the few black people on Cape Cod in the 1950s and 1960s? Where does that self-assurance come from? Where does that sense of self come from that says, "I'm walking onto the trading floor and chasing and it's home, and nothing is going to stop me from doing whatever I want?"So that's really my passion project, to get stories like that on the screen because women were present at the age of 74. Right? In the 1970s, there were black people present. And it is something that should be recognized and celebrated. There are many who call it a diaspora, but within the diaspora, there is a diaspora of stories, and it's my passion to bring that one to the screen in some form or fashion.

That's fantastic. So, Jodi, we have some big shoes to fill here, but let's get that movie made. Benita raised the bar for us in so many ways. So I'd like to talk to her, and I enjoy your stories. So, thank you so much for sharing your story and your story, and thank you for being so passionate, driving with purpose, being my friend, and everything else you do. I've had a great time talking with you today.

Yes, this has been fantastic. I'll tell you about Jerry Maguire some other time.

I believe I can do a series of episodes just on Jodi stories. We'll invite guests, so it'll just be us, Benita, and Burger King. We'll save that for later. So, I hope you enjoyed today's show from Hollywood with Jodi Smith. Thank you for joining us today, everyone. And until next time, keep working on your well-being. Thanks.

Thanks for joining us for today's episode of Working On Wellbeing brought to you by Salary Finance. I'm Anita Ward. At Salary Finance, our mission is to improve the financial health of working Americans by providing access to socially responsible financial products in the workplace. You can learn more about how you can partner with us to help improve your employee's financial well-being at [salaryfinance.com](http://salaryfinance.com/). Don't forget to subscribe or follow so you don't miss an episode.