Amy Gutierrez & Celeste Gehring: Hosts of the "Girl, How'd You Get That Gig?" Podcast

Artwork for podcast Sports Business Conversations

Episode 53 • 13th August 2024 • Sports Business Conversations • ADC Partners

02:22

Dave Almy

I just wanted to know, to start, how the heck did you guys meet in the first place? I mean, was there, like, instant chemistry? Like, oh, that's my people? Or did you guys, like, stand across the room for each other and go like, ooh, I don't know about her? How did it all come together? How'd you guys do that?

02:42

Amy Gutierrez

So we met on a dating app.

02:44

Dave Almy

And which service?

02:46

Amy Gutierrez

barely cell phones. We met in: 2001

03:08

Dave Almy

Sorry, it's only an audio only for.

03:10

Amy Gutierrez

I know, but they're gonna have to feel the love.

03:13

Dave Almy

Feel the hearts.

03:14

Amy Gutierrez

Yeah. And I walked in. I had gotten hired by my husband's former boss, Rick Jaffe. Shout out to Rick Jaffe. And he was at the LA Times and left newspapers to go into television. I had just gotten married to Paul. We were gonna live in LA, had left my job in San Francisco, then Cron, and the NBC affiliate wasn't anymore. Anyway, long story short, I start my first day. I am so scared walking into this building. It was la. Like, it was big time.

03:44

Dave Almy

Right now you've hit the big time catalouuma stars in your eyes.

03:48

Amy Gutierrez

Yeah. And I met Celeste my first day, and I don't know what Celeste's recollection is of me, but I remember how tall she was. First of all, she's six one.

04:01

Dave Almy

Okay. And a formidable presence.

04:03

Amy Gutierrez

Formidable. And she was getting it done. Like, she. It was like three or four women amongst a sea of men. And here I come. I like a deer in headlights. And I really didn't know what I was gonna do. I was hired to be a features producer, and that all went by the wayside a week later because 911 happened in all seriousness. Right. So, like, what I was hired to do, I actually never ended up doing. But what I got out of it was this amazing connection, work, relationship, and friendship with Celeste. And I think it took us a little while to really connect and start hanging out socially, but immediately, I respected her work ethic.

04:41

Dave Almy

Celeste, did you look at her and you say, oh, my gosh, this poor country girl. What is this?

04:50

Celeste Gehring

I grew up in Idaho in a town with one stop light, so l. A. Was just.

04:55

Dave Almy

But you had been there for a while.

04:56

Celeste Gehring

Yeah, I'd been there for a while, but, no, I mean, Amy's tall, too, so I just thought, oh, she's one of my people, right?

05:02

Dave Almy

She's a tall girl.

05:03

Celeste Gehring

She's a tribe. We are.

05:05

Amy Gutierrez

We have a tribe.

05:06

Dave Almy

How tall are you, Amy?

05:08

Amy Gutierrez

Five'ten.

05:08

Dave Almy

All right, you're five'ten. So six'one. You guys walk into a meeting and everybody's like, oh, my gosh. It's a little humbling. Right, sorry. So. So you see each other, like, to your point, Amy, you're working in this industry. That's quite literally, it's you, a couple of women, and a sea of men. Was there a certain amount of. At that point in each of your careers, I need to find these other women in this industry, and hold on to them tightly.

05:37

Amy Gutierrez

Yeah.

05:37

Celeste Gehring

Because, you know, when we got in, Dave, there weren't very many women that were role models that were, you know, at the level we wanted to be at. Really. I wanted to be a VP or an SVP. Right. Working my way to the c suite, and there were no women there. And so anytime you found a woman that was one you not only respected for their work, but you actually liked them as well, you know, when those women came along, you just connect like you did.

06:03

Dave Almy

Hold on tightly.

06:04

Amy Gutierrez

Yeah.

06:05

Celeste Gehring

You needed a support system because no one else could tell you what you were going through or you couldn't share that with anybody else.

06:11

Dave Almy

And so people who aren't familiar with your roles right now. Can you give a. Just a quick. We'll start with you and Amy. We'll flip it back to you. Can you give a quick 30,000 foot view of the path that you took very quickly into what you're doing right now just to give people some context for the conversation that we're about to have?

06:30

Celeste Gehring

Sure. I started as a production assistant.

06:32

Dave Almy

Yeah.

06:33

Celeste Gehring

I started logging highlights at CNN Sports Illustrated. I moved to Fox Sports for a cute boy, but it worked out. I ended up marrying him. So that was good story.

06:42

Dave Almy

That did work out.

06:43

Celeste Gehring

Yes. But I started as a production assistant and just continued to work my way up. Associate producer, became a manager of a feed service, and then eventually became a vp of productions and operations. I've done, like, a lot of logistics, a lot of the stages for Super bowl, all star games, Olympics, and that kind of thing. And currently what I'm doing now is I work for bally sports, working on video on demand, because everything's kind of switching, as we know in our industry, like crazy. So my ops job is totally morphing into more of video on demand and kind of dealing with the consumers and what they want.

07:18

Dave Almy

That's a whole separate podcast. Okay, Amy Gutierrez, same question. Back to you. Just a quick path overview.

07:24

Amy Gutierrez

So I actually started in hard news. I went to Davis and majored in communications and didn't land my first job in news until I was 25. I took a very long path to begin my career, and that job was a morning part time associate producer, and I had to be at work at 230 in the morning.

07:45

Dave Almy

Oh, yeah, it's the morning show.

07:46

Amy Gutierrez

It was fun. I made $8 an hour, and then I moved up. But all the glamour, but so glitzy. Yeah, it was so great. I was, like, stepping over people who had gotten out of the bar and were falling asleep while I was going to work. And then I moved up at that station to the night news. Then I moved to San Francisco, where I produced a show called Contact Four for Pran. We were at the NBC affiliate at that time. Then we all got laid off because NBC left San Francisco and went to San Jose, which is where it is now, got married to Paul and landed the job@Foxsports.net. As a features producer. But as I mentioned, a week after I got hired, the world changed dramatically, drastically, horrifically. And Fox Sportsnet was very affected.

08:35

Amy Gutierrez

been a contractor ever since: 2004

09:15

Dave Almy

We are breaking news here on this podcast right now. We are pulling back the curtain on this entire operation.

09:22

Amy Gutierrez

And today I have about 25 jobs, and we don't have any.

09:28

Dave Almy

Not that you just listed 25 is that you have 25 right now.

09:32

Amy Gutierrez

We have 25 currently. But I've just tried to take advantage of where the world is going with social media. I do a lot of influencing. I've joined the River Cats broadcast as a color analyst, which is huge for me just to continue to move forward in my reporting career. And we launched our podcast, obviously. And then I signed on as an ambassador for Sonoma county wine growers, where I get to do my storytelling and journalistic work. And then I still work for the Giants part time as a host and ambassador.

10:02

Dave Almy

What I think is fascinating to hear from both of you as you describe the journey, is that precisely that it's journey, right? There's a lot of ladder climbing. There's a lot of jungle gym ing, you know, sideways up a little bit, back, so forth and so on. But what's really interesting, as you charted your path, you both were coming up in a time, I think, when it's safe to say, as we talked about earlier, is a heavily male dominated industry. And I'm interested in. You're both competitive Devon athletes, right? You come from a very competitive background. What did you have to learn individually and then maybe collectively together in order to succeed in that environment, I think.

10:47

Celeste Gehring

For me personally, it's all about just not talking the talk and being able.

10:50

Amy Gutierrez

To walk the walk.

10:52

Celeste Gehring

I think there were so many people who I felt like could have been my teachers or I could have learned from, and I knew that I knew more than they did. Right. And I just thought, oh, because they have this title, they know more than I do. And so I've really been one of those people that I want to learn, and then I'll turn around and teach it. And I love to teach. I like for people to grow and to learn. And so for me personally, it was a lot about mindset as a d one athlete, right, being the best. But I also felt like if I was going to help women progress in the industry, I had to be able to do it, too. I couldn't just say, oh, yes, you're going to get to be a vp one day.

11:29

Celeste Gehring

Oh, yes, you're going to get to do this. Like, I had to do it to know what the highs and lows were so I could help people through it.

11:35

Dave Almy

Celeste, did you feel that was something, like, integral to you about. It was like, I've had that I did work to get this job and these roles as a woman, and now, like, I want to make sure that's part of who I am going forward. Was that really something you felt closely early on?

11:51

Celeste Gehring

e, Idaho, and one stop light,: 3000

12:21

Dave Almy

Women should have been celebrated as an eight year old.

12:23

Celeste Gehring

Mm. Yeah. So that's what I always wanted to do, is just really show what women were capable of. You know, I grew up in a male dominated industry and farming as well, right? So I had males around me all the time. And I. I remember one time when I was a kid, I told my dad, I was like, hey, I can figure out how these trucks can go in better and do all this and he was looking at me like, yeah, right. And I said, well, watch me. I'll go show you. And I did it. And from then on, every season, I was out there because I did it the best, you know? So I think, yeah, there's this part of me that's always wanted to prove myself, but also just as the best human I can be.

12:59

Dave Almy

It's kind of interesting that you got such positive feedback from it at such a young age to kind of set the tone for you. Right. You needed to learn to advocate for yourself. Like, I know how to do this better and make that heard. But most of all, find the person who is going to listen to you to execute on that, to give you that opportunity to showcase the skillset.

13:17

Celeste Gehring

Yeah, my parents were very supportive. You know, sometimes I fought with my dad on this, but I would.

13:24

Dave Almy

I have three kids. I don't know anything about fighting with fathers at all. Amy G. How about you? I mean, I hear that from Celeste. What about.

13:30

Amy Gutierrez

e whatever the. You know, the: 06:00

14:22

Amy Gutierrez

And again, very similar situation with my father. I had great. A great male presence in my life with my father and my brother, who were like, you want to play? Get in here. He coached little league. He used me. I. You know, if you do the pickle drills where you're doing a rundown, I was the one being chased. Right. Like he always is. Great.

14:43

Dave Almy

Amy, get out of here. We need someone to run.

14:45

Amy Gutierrez

It was like survival skills at, you know, the earliest age. And also with my older brother, like, you know, I've told celeste this story because she was collegiate basketball player. I was a collegiate volleyball player. And just. I want to just make a quick clarification. When I played volleyball, it was d two, because I feel.

14:59

Celeste Gehring

Yeah.

14:59

Amy Gutierrez

Like, I don't want to take that claim that I played d one, but davis. Davis was d two when I played.

15:03

Dave Almy

I appreciate the need for the hard news honesty here, but, you know, this is a podcast, and the only person who listens is my mom, so she.

15:11

Amy Gutierrez

Doesn'T understand the difference anyway, just in case she researches it when I was there. But, you know, my brother taking me out and. And playing basketball with me to teach me the sport because I. It wasn't offered to me as a little girl. We were offered softball and soccer. And I decided to try out in high school, and he took me out and threw me around, and, you know, he had no problem treating me like an equal while I was on the court. And I believe it put me in a position. When we did meet at Fox Sports, one of the first things I did, and Celeste was there. We were on the softball team together.

15:48

Amy Gutierrez

We were on a Fox sports softball team, and it was an area where you could show your athletic ability and earn respect of your male colleagues by how you played on the field. That translated back to the office. And I always put my sports on my resume. It was a talking point. I'm such a big proponent and believer in playing sports. And if you're not an athlete or they're not your thing, like, get involved in something that you can throw on your resume that goes beyond the workplace, that you can socialize in a way with your male counterparts and get to know them as people, and then that definitely translates to an equity in the workplace.

16:33

Amy Gutierrez

And so that was one of the first things I did, and I remember having a few moments where it was clutch, and we won the championship, we had the trophy.

16:43

Dave Almy

Our team was so good bragging on it already. It's interesting to hear, Amy, you start to talk about that. You start to slip in some of the, hey, you know, make sure you have sports in your resume, and you're already, both of you, dropping tidbits of information that are useful for people who are considering a career path towards this. Right. You know, make sure you do this, and, you know, this is the kinds of things that you should do. And that's a perfect segue to what you both are doing now with the girl. How'd you get that gig? Podcast. You're interviewing prominent women throughout sports business about their career paths, and I'm interested in what was the germination of the idea between the two of you. Where did you sit down and go, this is something that's missing, or, oh, my gosh, Covid's boring.

17:33

Dave Almy

Or what was the spark that led you to want to do this.

17:40

Amy Gutierrez

It's interesting. I want to hear sluss feedback on this, because this is what I remember. So, remember, we've got.

17:45

Dave Almy

It's a dark and stormy night.

17:47

Amy Gutierrez

Yeah. It was a dark and stormy night. Last was on the east coast, and I was on the west coast.

17:52

Dave Almy

I poured myself a glass of merlot.

17:54

Amy Gutierrez

Yes. Scotch. Scotch.

17:57

Dave Almy

That's a good point.

17:58

Amy Gutierrez

Yeah. So, we stayed friends, even though we worked together for a pretty short amount of time. It was two years, and then I moved to northern California, and fairly soon after I moved, I got pregnant with our first, and Celeste and I were staying in touch through all of it. And it's so funny, my son, who's now 19, still has the stuffed animal that Celeste sent with a bath towel as a baby gift. So our friendship continued even though weren't working together, and it became a really important relationship. I can speak personally for me in having a sounding board outside of where I was working, where I could trust her. I could tell her what was going on, what I needed help with, because I was really challenged my first few years with the giants job. And I remember having conversations with Celeste about.

18:51

Amy Gutierrez

gnant with my second child in: 2007

19:30

Dave Almy

You were looking for something.

19:32

Amy Gutierrez

I wish I was working with you.

19:33

Dave Almy

Yeah.

19:34

Amy Gutierrez

And Covid did hit, and we started saying, you know, we gotta do a podcast. Like, everybody's doing a podcast. Like, this is what we.

19:44

Dave Almy

I have no idea what you're talking about.

19:45

Amy Gutierrez

Yeah, right. But ours would be so good.

19:48

Dave Almy

I like this hot garbage.

19:51

Amy Gutierrez

Ours would change the world thing by Dave Hellamy.

19:55

Dave Almy

We could do better than that.

19:56

Amy Gutierrez

But when we would have these conversations, it was like, we should be publicizing these conversations to a degree. Right? I mean, minus the smack talk, whoever were talking crap about. But were. It was good information being exchanged between two accomplished women in sports.

20:15

Dave Almy

Yeah. All the time. And that's how you remember it, Celeste?

20:18

Celeste Gehring

Mm. Absolutely like that. Love it. Huh. Yeah. Well, Amy's one of those people where I feel, you know, it's just when you get back together, it's like time just. You know, I can't even.

20:31

Dave Almy

No time is past right now.

20:32

Celeste Gehring

Yes. No time has passed. Right. Like, you just pick up where you started. And she has been a constant in my life that will tell me the truth, right. Of what? I want to hear it or not hear it, but always supportive, too, of, like, hey, here's how you can get better, or, here's how you can do this, or have you thought about this? And she makes me think in a different way, and I just. It makes me so happy I have someone like her in my life who makes me think differently, because I think everyone needs someone like that in their life and to know that they're totally supported. So when we had talked, I had just moved out to the Bay Area again from LA, and I was just like, now's the time.

21:06

Celeste Gehring

And we had always said we would work together, and we kind of both knew we always would. And it's just been a really great partnership because we both come from different perspectives, but at the same time, like, our core values are always the same, and we both teach. So I teach at University of San Francisco. She teaches at Sonoma State. So we both have that teacher in us, Dave, where it's like, we want people to be seen and heard, and we want to make that impact. Right. It's so much in our hearts and who we are. And we said before we started, we're like, we're only going to work with badasses who have big hearts. And we truly believe every woman we've interviewed. We just got done with Emily Cole, co owner of the Savannah Bananas.

21:44

Dave Almy

Oh, awesome.

21:46

Celeste Gehring

Oh, she was amazing. Right? And everyone we've met, we want to invite ourselves to go and hang out.

21:52

Amy Gutierrez

With them, because we do.

21:54

Dave Almy

We don't. We haven't actually been taken up on it yet.

21:58

Amy Gutierrez

We have not been taken up on it, but we're.

22:00

Celeste Gehring

I think we're.

22:02

Amy Gutierrez

We just. We feel like we're just meeting, just.

22:04

Dave Almy

Waiting for the right one.

22:05

Amy Gutierrez

Best friends. Yeah. But I will just add to something Celeste said that I think is so important, and. And were both experiencing this. When you leave a job and people change, you know, people that you were really close with or you connected with, then all of a sudden, especially in television and even more so in sports television, egos happen and jobs change, and people get on air, and all of a sudden, they don't have time for you. And I was this person who had gone on air, and I remember Celeste saying, you haven't changed, you know, because were seeing people who had been production assistants and interns go on air and never talk to us again as were running into them at different events. And I was like, what happened to her? Like, she has no time, you know, that kind of thing.

22:52

Amy Gutierrez

And it was really important to me to never, you know, let that affect who I was at the core. And I believe, because I was producer before, I didn't really care about being on air. But I specifically remember Celeste being surprised because my career went to camera, that I didn't change and that we could pick up, as old friends should.

23:13

Dave Almy

But it also sounds like that's the one of the premiums that you put on your friendship slash partnership. You said about truth, saying, like, you knew that you could go to Celeste and be like, am I? Have I changed? And you knew you were gonna get the straight no, like, she wasn't gonna be like, no, you're the same, sweetie. You know, like, that kind of thing. She was gonna let you know if you were going sideways.

23:34

Amy Gutierrez

Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, absolutely. But I think that's one of my favorite things about Celeste, is you get not only can you count on her, she just doesn't. She doesn't change. She's not affected. When she's your friend. She's your friend. And that is hard to find in this industry. And something that we really try and express in our podcast is being genuine, and being authentic is. Leads to longevity. You know, when you try and be something you're not, or you're trying to fit into a box by wearing something that you're not comfortable with or, you know, doing something you're not comfortable with because you think this is what it takes to get the job, it's the wrong job. It's not right for you.

24:13

Dave Almy

You're trying to fit into something that maybe you shouldn't have tried to fit in the first place. I'm interested in the podcast experience, because, clearly, I'm trying to do that here myself. You both come from a media background. You're both mostly televised media, video media. I'm wondering what you're enjoying the most about this. You know, where you're primarily in audio, obviously, it's the video clips and all that kind of stuff that you do, too. Like, what are you enjoying the most, and where do you feel like you both can grow? Celeste, start with you. What's. What's the good, the bad, and the ugly about doing the. Doing a sports related podcast.

24:50

Celeste Gehring

I love it because I learn all the time Amy's so good at what she does, and even though I've produced on her talent or coach on her talent is totally different. Obviously, being in that seat, and you have to do the reps, and so there's times when Amy's saving my booty, and I know she's doing it. I don't even know if you know that I know, but I definitely know she's doing it in that moment. And I think to myself, oh, I could have said it better this way, or I should have slowed down. And so it's really helping me to stop and, like, listen to the conversation. And we teach this all the time, right? Everybody who's in media, like, make sure you're listening to conversation. But I.

25:27

Celeste Gehring

When you're sitting in that seat, you're like, it's hard to listen to the conversation, because what am I going to ask next? And what I'm, you know, like, is my hair okay? And, like, what's happening here? So I've had a lot of fun just learning and meeting all the new people and hearing the stories.

25:41

Dave Almy

Yeah. How about you, Amy?

25:43

Amy Gutierrez

For sure, an agreement with what Celeste is saying. I mean, the people that we're talking to are so inspiring. The best part of all of this is, I look forward to every single interview, and I can't say that about a lot of other gigs. And as I mentioned, I've got a lot of gigs, right? So there's stuff I love about the gigs, and then there's stuff I don't like. But when we're getting ready for a podcast, I'm like, oh, this is going to be awesome. I mean, and then we get to plug who's next and, like, thinking about who we could get, and then they say, yes, and you're like, really? Okay.

26:17

Celeste Gehring

No.

26:18

Amy Gutierrez

You feel that, like, sally field moment. Like, you like me.

26:21

Celeste Gehring

You really like me.

26:23

Amy Gutierrez

And it's just invaluable what they're sharing. And I think it's so needed because women, for some reason, get very territorial and don't discuss the specifics, the journey, the salary, the hours, the balance you're trying to find for those of us who have children and marriages and families that we're trying to take care of. And then on top of it, you know, Celeste talks about what I'm teaching her, but here she is. She. She's the backbone of all of it. Like, you know, we kind of came up with this idea, and then she made it happen, and she creates the graphics, and if there's nothing she can't figure out, I tell her all the time, go slow. Like. And that is a skill set of mine, is I can listen, right?

27:15

Amy Gutierrez

But I've learned that over the years, and Celeste is just now getting into broadcasting because she's calling games that you uop for basketball and for softball. So she's. This is all, like, kind of the right time for her to be doing on camera stuff, but for me, it's the technical side of things. You know how she puts these canva PowerPoints together and switches out the graphics, and we need a color scheme, and I'm like, what? Oh, my God. Just give me a tease to write. Like, I know what my skill set is, and it is fascinating to watch.

27:50

Dave Almy

Her work, but it also sounds like you guys are crossing over into each other's not spaces, but you're both kind of beginning to learn to do the things that the other maybe had been doing previously. And I suppose that's an inevitability associated with a partnership.

28:06

Amy Gutierrez

It's been like, it's been really helpful. I mean, as you go and get all these different jobs now, keynote speaking is becoming something I'm doing, and I'll go to sluss and be like, can you help me with a PowerPoint? Cause I don't do that. She's like, yeah, totally. I'm so like, this is nothing. And I'm like, so any help or guidance that I'm able to give her, it's just as rewarding to see her put it into action and vice versa. And learning that the second you think you don't have something to learn, you should stop what you're doing. And we're both hungry always to learn. That's why we teach. I don't think there's anything more rewarding than seeing a student put something into action that you critiqued them on or helped them with. And the same goes for our podcast.

28:56

Amy Gutierrez

I mean, each one we do, we feel, gets better and better, and now we just need to get paid for it, Dave, that's all.

29:06

Dave Almy

That's one of the objectives here today. Figure that out.

29:13

Amy Gutierrez

That's been the ugly part. If, you know, you're saying the good, the bad and ugly, that's the toughest part, is you're finding your passion, but you do need to make a living at it. And so that's where we're focusing on now.

29:24

Dave Almy

It's not like you don't invest time and energy into this. Right. It is something that does require a lot of sit down, find the guests, research the guests, figure out the questions you want to ask the guests, do the edit and everything like that. And there is a part that is the passion part. You're doing something because you feel like it's important that you want. It's the teacher in you that you're going and you're exercising that. But you do have to allocate for your time.

29:49

Amy Gutierrez

You do.

29:49

Dave Almy

You do have to associate with that. And that's the end goal. This is to make this something that is sustainable going forward for you both.

29:56

Amy Gutierrez

Thanks, Dave. We appreciate that.

30:01

Dave Almy

Everything I can do. But it's funny, I do want touch upon something you said earlier that I think is a really important point. That is, you said something. You said something about women in territoriality previous. And I think it's like when you both got started and there were fewer women in the industry, and this is sort of a trope that women got a little protective of their space as they climbed the ladder, and it was hard for them to get there. So, by God, I'm not gonna let anybody else pass me by kind of thing. That's fair. It was hard, particularly when there weren't as many women in sports business. That's my broad assumption. My other broad assumption I'm going to make is that it's gotten a little bit easier with more women in the business now.

30:44

Dave Almy

So has it gotten easier, or have the pressures just changed to something else?

30:51

Celeste Gehring

Well, I'll start off with a story. I never forgot the story. So a woman that I worked with, she was another vp, and she said, celeste, why do you teach your staff all the stuff you know? Because you're going to be out of a job. And I said, well, if I'm out of a job, then it's time for me to move on, right? Like, if I have learned everything I need to know, I've taught my team everything they need to know, and the brass thinks I'm out, then I'm out. And what's interesting is she has been laid off and has been out of work for a very long time. And meanwhile, because I have really helped people grow and learn, those people have always connected me to another job, or they've helped me out in some way, shape or form.

31:30

Celeste Gehring

I don't think it's necessarily gotten easier for women. I think there are a lot more doors open for women. Like, they've been doing a lot of studies on this during the pandemic, a lot of people of color have now come through the doors of television and social and everywhere, but they're staying stagnant in entry level positions and middle management. And I think that's what happened today with the Me Too movement, is there were so many women that were coming in through the doors, and they've kind of stayed stuck still in those positions. We're starting now to see women grow, because a lot of women are using their voice just like we are, right. To be seen and heard, to be understood, and to also help open those doors for other women.

32:09

Celeste Gehring

So we had a guest on Cosmina Shulman, who I think Amy said it best, where she's like, you know, if you're in that room with a bunch of men, are you advocating for a woman who's not in the room? And it just, like, hit the nail on the head, I think, with where women need to go is we still need to advocate for women that are in the room because they're still not in the room. There may be one or two. And like you said in the past, a lot of those women were extremely territorial because they had worked extremely hard to get into that spot, and they felt like they were gonna lose that spot if they helped other women get in there. And they also wanted to be special. Right. And show that they belonged in that room.

32:44

Celeste Gehring

But as we know, like, there's so many people that belong in that room and so many people that work hard. So I think, for me, personally, it's been a lot about. It has been, in some regards, easier for women to get in through the door because other women are pushing it open, but I still think that climb is just as hard.

33:01

Amy Gutierrez

Yeah, I definitely agree that. I don't know if it's so much easier, as we're just more prevalent now. You know, when I first started covering the giants, I was one of a handful of women in the clubhouse, and then it's growing. And so what happens is some of the pressures are alleviated because of numbers. So there is power in number, and I think that's great. In my particular role, it was so territorial, and, you know, it was like the other team's in game reporter wouldn't give me information on her players or, you know, it was like, yeah, I don't know. I don't know where he is or, you know, that kind of. And then. And then I'd find somebody who was helpful, and I. And I will give her a shout out because she's one of my best friends in the business.

33:47

Amy Gutierrez

Alana Rizzo was one of the first female in game reporters that came up to me from her team. She was covering the Rockies, and I had the Giants. Hey, what do you need? Who can I help you with? And I took that as a template to be that way for reporters coming into my home park.

34:04

Dave Almy

Yeah. Once you've been on the receiving end of that, you really feel the power of it.

34:08

Amy Gutierrez

You should do that. You should do that. And you know what? How am I hurt by her reporting on the team I cover? Right. You know, so it's letting go a little bit of. Of ego and the fear that we have. What if somebody takes my job? Listen, if it's going to happen. And I would say while we're seeing more women in this spotlight in general, and Celeste is dead on, they're in a lot of entry level positions. And so then, for those of us who have been around for a long time, where it's getting harder is to stay and to stay at a salary level that's fair, that we've earned, because, and I'll tell you straight up, I was told multiple times in contract negotiations, there is someone younger and cheaper.

35:01

Amy Gutierrez

And I had to find my voice and come back and say, okay, does she have the relationships that I have? Has she put the time in that I have?

35:08

Dave Almy

Does she have any skill whatsoever and.

35:10

Amy Gutierrez

The skill that you have to learn and yet. So you don't want to, like, hurt your own, and yet you're like, you gotta pay your dues to a certain degree. And so we're still. I think there's been a ton of improvement, and now you're seeing women's sports really explode, which is fascinating and so deserved and so overdue, but it's finding that balance between really getting what you've earned and continuing to be respected. And I go back always to what Celeste is saying, like, I'll teach you what I know. There's room for all of us. There really is. And I would rather, if I lost the job, be the one that people liked working with, because I'm going to land somewhere else than the one who didn't share anything.

35:52

Dave Almy

It's just not that big an industry. I mean, it seems really big because it's high profile, but, I mean, you're two degrees of separation from just about anybody in this industry. So that long view of where can this eventually lead? That, I don't know. I can't even see now, because it might be so out, is absolutely the way that success is found, I think, in this industry versus I'm not telling you the day of the week, you know, because, you know, that'll give you an advantage over me. Seems so short sighted to me, but unfortunately, prevalent. It's certainly not just sports, right? I mean, that's goes on in every industry around the world, but it's certainly one. Just given the competitiveness here and reputation.

36:34

Amy Gutierrez

To me personally, is everything, you know, how. How is somebody talking about me when I'm not in the room? And I really pride myself on being somebody who says, oh, yeah, no, she totally helped out. She's great to work with. She's easy to work with. You know, she's professional. Those are the things that matter at the end of the day. And then really being able to diversify your skill sets and. And be willing to learn new things and try new things. That's how you stay.

37:01

Dave Almy

Hence having 25 jobs. Celeste, can you talk about the response you guys have gotten to the podcast? Have you got any feedback? And have you heard anybody. Have you heard things that made you say, God, I'm so glad we did.

37:10

Celeste Gehring

This all the time?

37:12

Dave Almy

Yeah.

37:12

Celeste Gehring

Just all, you know, and our podcast is for men and women because, you know that we have female leadership across the board, and a lot of men come to us all the time, too, and ask us for help or, you know, information. And I think one of the best comments I've gotten is, like, why has this never been done right? Like, I think we get that actually a lot. But people are like, this was so needed. Even Emily Cole said that, you know, she's like, this is so needed. I can't wait to watch you grow. I can't wait for you to fill this space.

37:43

Celeste Gehring

And it's amazing to us that no one has really highlighted women in the sports industry, because there, you know, as we've gone through, there are so many of them, right, that we're finding left and right that are, you know, behind the scenes. And that was kind of like the premise, too, for our podcast. Cause Amy, you know, could have gone with another, you know, talent or another host or another reporter, and we kept talking about the importance of having people that were behind the camera because Amy had that background, right? She is a news hound. She is one of the best producers I've ever seen. So just taking that premise and saying, okay, we have people behind the scenes. We have people. We have a groundskeeper that we're going to be interviewing tomorrow for our podcast.

38:21

Celeste Gehring

And we're fascinated by that because no one, you know, no one talks about that. And having a woman actually do that job is fascinating to us.

38:29

Dave Almy

You guys are on about episode number 20 of the girl. How'd you get that gig? Podcast.

38:33

Amy Gutierrez

We're going to record.

38:36

Dave Almy

Yeah, I have to get with my fact checkers. I'm interested, like, what themes have started to present themselves to you now that you've got this sort of body of work. Amy, what. What rises to the surface?

38:52

Amy Gutierrez

A couple come to mind immediately, which.

38:54

Dave Almy

Is say, because, again, this is an audio only format, but I know I raised my hand.

38:58

Amy Gutierrez

I'm like, so many of the women have said the same thing of say yes to everything. Just say yes. And if you find out it's not what you want to do, more power to you. That is equally valuable.

39:13

Celeste Gehring

Power.

39:14

Amy Gutierrez

It's equally valuable. And, oh, my gosh, there's been so many things. A lot about education. A lot about education. And while it's super important, getting this experience, getting dirty, getting in there, and trying these jobs is just as beneficial. A lot of the women we've interviewed have gone on to get their masters or their doctorate, and looking back, didn't know if they needed to do that. Glad that they did it. But it's just so. It's so broadening to think you don't have to go a, B, C, D. You can kind of create your own path here. Yeah. And it's all about, though, like, really being passionate. And they've all said, you gotta love what you're doing. You gotta love it, and. Cause you gotta commit to it. You know, we interviewed from the Houston Rockets.

40:08

Amy Gutierrez

She was the VP of partnerships, and she was in a really honest, which is so, you know, it doesn't sound like that should be refreshing, but it is. Yeah. And she's like, listen, I am at the arena more than I am at my house, and you don't get holidays off. This is the NBA. We play on Christmas, you know? And so being able to have that kind of openness and vulnerability so that people listening is not a surprise. For some of us who got into sports, this was a big surprise. Like, what? I got to work on a Sunday.

40:43

Dave Almy

What's a double header? Yeah.

40:45

Amy Gutierrez

What? Yeah. But the biggest thing that comes across, the first thing that jumped into my head was so many people say, you gotta say yes to things. You gotta be willing. Yeah.

40:54

Dave Almy

How about you, Celeste?

40:55

Celeste Gehring

I think a lot of what has surprised me is a lot of women didn't have it figured out right. They didn't know exactly what they wanted to do, and so they took a bunch of different jobs to figure it out. And it came. It was different because I think half of our guests have known, right. Like, they wanted to be in some area of that field, like myself, and then other people were just like, I just fell in. Like, I didn't even know that this was a thing, and I just kind of fell into it. And that's what I'm doing now. So that's been really inspiring to see that, because you're going to end up on your path no matter what, right. Like, you're going to get there.

41:27

Dave Almy

It kind of goes back to the say yes kind of quality to the whole thing. Right. It's along the lines of, if you don't open yourself up to opportunities, you may find yourself in a place where you didn't expect to be and you don't like, or you may have never discovered the thing that actually becomes your passion. I mean, one of my favorite examples of that is, I have a friend whose son got a job working up for the wine country baseball league up in Napa, and he was in the mascot costume between innings, and then would take the head off and run up and announce the lineups for the whole thing. Like, they just said, can you do this?

42:02

Amy Gutierrez

Do it all?

42:03

Dave Almy

Do it all? And, you know, he's fallen into announcing because he just loved it so much. So it's. It's a. It's a great example. It's a great piece of advice. Male, female, starting out, long time experience that when a. When a door of opportunity throws itself open to you, don't think that it's not for you, or even worse, that it's beneath you, because in this industry, there is no such thing.

42:27

Amy Gutierrez

Well, the other one that comes to mind, I just have to say this just because I'm so in agreement with the entitlement side of things of our younger generation, and I say that because.

42:36

Dave Almy

I have two of them that are listening from the other side of this.

42:40

Amy Gutierrez

Wall, came from my body, you know? And it's about being a little more thorough. We talk to a lot of people who hire people, and when you have grammatical mistakes on your resume, you haven't used spell check. You didn't capitalize somebody's name, think it through. Take the time to be thoughtful and efficient. And it goes so far with people, because the second some of these women who are, you know, Celeste is one of them. Like, if you have a grammatical error on your resume, not the door gone.

43:16

Dave Almy

You'Re giving people a reason to say no.

43:18

Amy Gutierrez

It makes her job very easy to not interview you. So it's little things like that are being repeated in each episode that you hope the younger generation really starts to say, yeah, I need to read this out loud before I send it and have somebody look at it and, you know, take. Take a beat. Everybody's in such a hurry, right? This whole generation, it's about immediacy, and they can get anything they need tomorrow from Amazon. I get it. But you can't get your career tomorrow. It is a build and it is a journey, and you have to be patient and put the time into it to make it worth it.

43:59

Dave Almy

Celeste, as you think about the podcast, what's been successful to this point? How do you see it, or how do you hope it's going to evolve from where you see it now? What is your. Amy, you're not helping. I'm trying to. I'm trying to have such gravitas right now, you know, trying to be. Trying to be professional.

44:25

Amy Gutierrez

I'm comic relief.

44:28

Celeste Gehring

Yes.

44:29

Dave Almy

In addition to finding some financial sources and financial streams that go onto this, what are some of the things that you're hoping for that come out of.

44:37

Celeste Gehring

This just to really make a difference and an impact? The women that are sharing their stories, you know, I'll go back to Emily Cole because I just was so inspired by her. They have a bananas foster organization that helps foster kids, and how she was talking about what they do for foster children is so badly needed for the world at this time. Right? And so just knowing that our podcast can make an impact where someone says, oh, my gosh, I heard that podcast. I heard Emily Cole, I really want to be a foster parent. How do I make that happen? I'm going to try to get a hold of her. And just all the people we've interviewed are doing something amazing, and they're really trying to reach their full potential.

45:18

Celeste Gehring

And I think the great thing, too, is as women that have been in the industry for a long time, we see a lot of women get pushed out because of their age, and we see that all the time, left and right. And my hope is with this podcast, a lot of times I see with the Good Boys club is if an older man gets pushed out, his buddy over here is going to help him get a job with this next network or with this next group. And, you know, it's like, let's take care of the women. And I think what we're seeing is women are deciding, you know what? I'm not going to put my eggs in your basket and try to make that happen. I'm going to go out and do my own thing.

45:54

Celeste Gehring

And so there's women of all ages that are starting their own business, that are starting to do their own podcast, and it's like that ball will continue where women are making, you know, more money or, you know, getting sold to a network or something like that. Again, where we're making a difference for women.

46:10

Dave Almy

How about you, Amy?

46:11

Amy Gutierrez

Complete agreement with Celeste on it. I mean, you know, finding out about Emily's, you know, advocacy efforts through the platform of sports. Right. And almost every single person we interview has some type of community service that they want to talk about. And at the end of the day, Dave, that is really what it's about, is, are you. Are you helping people move forward? Are you making people aware? And from the smallest detail, you know, we interviewed a gal who was in human resources at Nessen, and she discussed how to ask for a raise. You know, I mean, that's huge. And it's free advice, you know, so it's a big deal for anyone.

47:00

Dave Almy

Amy Gutierrez and Celeste Gehrig. They're the hosts of the girl. How'd you get that gig? Podcast. Found on all major podcast platforms. Definitely check it out. There are, as we've been talking about through the course of this entire conversation, so many gems that we just touched on in this conversation that are going to be not only for people who are thinking about if they want to work in sports, but people who've been in the industry for a long time. There's a lot of good, refreshing things to consider that you're going to hear that are going to charge your thinking about how you approach this industry, getting into it, or maintaining a great track record in it. So, both of you, thanks so much for joining me today. But before I let you go, we're going to have to put you into the lightning round.

47:45

Dave Almy

This is a series of unexpected questions. I just. You know, I love that it can get dangerous. So, you know, I'm horrible at trivia. Did you sign the waivers?

47:55

Celeste Gehring

No.

47:56

Dave Almy

Okay, well, even better. Even better. So these are not hard. These are not hard. This is not true. This is not trivia.

48:04

Amy Gutierrez

Listen, we tell our guests this, too, because we have a little game that we always say. We're always like, it's not hard. And then they're like, you said it wasn't hard.

48:09

Dave Almy

All right, well, okay, well, we'll be the judge. All right. We'll see how this goes. We're gonna start with you, Celeste. If you could be any one athlete for 24 hours, who would it be? Oh, not you, Amy.

48:24

Celeste Gehring

Back when they're prime.

48:25

Dave Almy

Or right now, back in their prime.

48:28

Celeste Gehring

Michael Jordan.

48:29

Dave Almy

You want to be Michael Jordan for 24 hours just to see. All right, all right, Amy, I wasn't going to ask you that one, but given the fact that you're about to explode all over the camera.

48:37

Amy Gutierrez

Mary Lou Rutten.

48:38

Dave Almy

Mary Lou Rutten.

48:39

Celeste Gehring

Your story.

48:40

Dave Almy

Very good.

48:41

Amy Gutierrez

Okay, I do have a story about.

48:42

Dave Almy

Well, it's not. It's a lightning round. This is quick. We gotta go quick. A whole different thing.

48:46

Amy Gutierrez

It's a good one.

48:46

Dave Almy

We'll save that one for later. Volume two. All right, Amy, what's a hidden talent that Celeste might not know about? I know.

48:55

Amy Gutierrez

A lightning round. I'm not going fast at all. That Celeste wouldn't know about. I don't know. Just let's know that I play piano.

49:00

Celeste Gehring

No.

49:01

Amy Gutierrez

There you go.

49:02

Dave Almy

See? We've learned something. I just made that up under pressure.

49:09

Amy Gutierrez

I didn't. I swear.

49:11

Dave Almy

All right, Celeste, you were once a senior remote operations manager for the New England sports network. How would you describe driving in Boston?

49:22

Celeste Gehring

Like hell on wheels.

49:23

Dave Almy

Yeah.

49:23

Celeste Gehring

I mean, you know, I had to replace four tires.

49:26

Dave Almy

Yeah.

49:26

Celeste Gehring

And we had. We had to haul our mobile stage to Fenway every day for 10 miles. The guy before me, the stage truck, actually fell on another car before I had that job. So every time I was going out there, they're like, you better not flip the truck.

49:42

Dave Almy

Don't flip the truck. It seems like a simple request. Don't flip the truck.

49:46

Amy Gutierrez

I feel like until you drive in Boston.

49:47

Dave Almy

Yeah, let's drive in Boston. At least you didn't get stuck on Storo Drive. Amy, your bio says you spent some time as a wine consultant. What would be the perfect pairing for this podcast recording?

50:00

Amy Gutierrez

Oh, well, it's a little hot today, so I'm going to go with a crisp blanc from Sonoma County. Dave and Sonoma county grapes?

50:10

Dave Almy

I don't think we can both say enough about Sonoma county having not only Sonoma county, but we're both from Petaluma, which makes us both Petaluma so funny.

50:18

Amy Gutierrez

He's actually right. He's sitting next to me right now.

50:22

Dave Almy

We're going to start with you, Celeste, you're both division one athletes. Division two? Celeste, you played basketball for LSU. And, Amy, you played volleyball for UC Davis. What sport are you going to play? Head to head for bragging rights?

50:40

Amy Gutierrez

Is Celeste first on this?

50:41

Dave Almy

It doesn't matter. Whoever can throw it out. It's the lightning round. There are no rules.

50:44

Amy Gutierrez

We're playing right now at 50 years old. Let me just right now.

50:48

Dave Almy

Like, if you're going outside right now, I mean, it could be inside. You can play video games.

50:51

Celeste Gehring

I don't know.

50:52

Amy Gutierrez

Well, I will take Celeste on in pickleball all day long.

50:56

Celeste Gehring

I was going to say that.

50:57

Dave Almy

Oh, I think we just go ball.

50:59

Celeste Gehring

It's on.

50:59

Dave Almy

It is on like Donkey Kong is what it is.

51:02

Amy Gutierrez

The best part is we rotate Celeste so then we will be partners at one point. But if you're going against me, watch out.

51:08

Celeste Gehring

Okay.

51:08

Dave Almy

I think I want. I could sell tickets for this. Celeste Amy Gutierrez, thanks so much for spending the time today.

51:15

Celeste Gehring

Thanks, Dave.

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