Your podcast is followed by lots of people who don't listen.
Speaker:So is mine.
Speaker:So is everyone's.
Speaker:Is that a problem to be solved?
Speaker:Or just a reflection of the complex relationship people
Speaker:have with on-demand content?
Speaker:Hello, and welcome to another Podcast Pontifications with me, Evo Terra.
Speaker:I wonder how many of your subscribers or followers you have for a
Speaker:podcast that have buyer's remorse?
Speaker:Or, in this world, followers remorse?
Speaker:And, of course, by your followers and subscribers, I mean, my
Speaker:followers and subscribers as well.
Speaker:In case my meaning isn't clear, I'm talking about someone who took the time
Speaker:to add your podcast to their listening app and now they kind of wish they hadn't.
Speaker:For whatever reason, it's no longer for them.
Speaker:Here's what you and I would do in that situation - if a show in our
Speaker:subscription or follow list was no longer for us, we'd unsubscribe
Speaker:or unfollow that show with haste.
Speaker:Or would we?
Speaker:If I just described what you do every single time, then kudos to you.
Speaker:But that's not most people's behavior.
Speaker:Most people, especially people who are more casual podcasting
Speaker:listeners, tend not to unsubscribe.
Speaker:I know, anathema, right?
Speaker:But you probably don't unsubscribe or unfollow as often as you think
Speaker:you do, even for shows that don't pan out the way you had hoped.
Speaker:My problem here is this is thinking about a problem in a binary way and you
Speaker:know how much I despise binary thinking.
Speaker:See, we think that people either subscribe or follow because they want to listen
Speaker:and then when they don't want to listen they unfollow, they unsubscribe, right?
Speaker:But the data we can all see, comparing our download numbers to the listen
Speaker:metrics from the apps, clearly demonstrate that thinking is wrong.
Speaker:Reality oftentimes is it's more complicated.
Speaker:Human behavior, as it turns out, is rather messy.
Speaker:We podcasters need to embrace the reality of the middle listener.
Speaker:Or the middle follower or subscriber I should technically say since
Speaker:it's not a listening issue here because this middle person only
Speaker:listens to some of our episodes.
Speaker:Now, a quick caveat here, creators of serial content, fiction podcasts,
Speaker:docu-series, or other multi-part contiguous content see very different
Speaker:behavior than what I'm describing.
Speaker:They're not immune from this, it's just different.
Speaker:This middle person actually represents a lot of different behaviors.
Speaker:Some of the people who are middle listeners had every intention of
Speaker:listening to every episode that you put out, but they just don't.
Speaker:Perhaps they started out eagerly consuming your content, but then
Speaker:stopped for whatever reason.
Speaker:Maybe they got everything they needed from you and your podcast with a couple
Speaker:of episodes and just left it there.
Speaker:Maybe their interest in your content or the topic that your
Speaker:podcast covers waned eventually.
Speaker:Maybe they discovered and prioritized a different podcast
Speaker:or a different set of podcasts.
Speaker:Maybe they're very good at triaging their podcast listening app,
Speaker:deliberately choosing which episodes to listen to with their own decision
Speaker:tree and sorting methodologies.
Speaker:Maybe they subscribe or follow in a show of solidarity or in support of that
Speaker:show, either with you or with others who have your show in their lives.
Speaker:Maybe that was important for them to have that badge that I'm a subscriber.
Speaker:But I'm not really a listener.
Speaker:Or maybe they just view your feed updates as transactional and
Speaker:they're happy just knowing that you're still producing content.
Speaker:That's good enough because maybe someday they'll listen.
Speaker:And finally, it's not that easy to unsubscribe or unfollow a
Speaker:podcast, at least not while you're actively listening to that podcast.
Speaker:Here's the deal, if I subscribe or perhaps someone subscribes me to an
Speaker:email list that I don't really want to be in, there's an unsubscribe
Speaker:button right there in the email.
Speaker:Where is that in podcasting?
Speaker:We don't have it, not at the episode level.
Speaker:There is no easy way to bounce back up to the show level because there's not
Speaker:some obvious unsubscribe button, at least not like the ones mandated by various
Speaker:trade commissions that are for email.
Speaker:Sometimes, yeah, it is a simple swipe to delete, but oftentimes, listeners
Speaker:have to go into the configuration or to the settings of their program,
Speaker:their app to actually do the work.
Speaker:That's not very easy, is it?
Speaker:So do we really care about these middle followers, if you will, who don't
Speaker:want to, or at least don't want to go through the hassle to unsubscribe
Speaker:or unfollow, but they also don't want to listen to every single episode?
Speaker:Should we try to clear them out to keep a cleaner feed?
Speaker:I'm not so sure there's a solid reason of why to do that.
Speaker:It costs them virtually nothing to keep updated about your new episodes.
Speaker:Perhaps you're even sending them episodes they don't listen to and
Speaker:that's okay because you never know why they don't listen and they might
Speaker:actually start listening again.
Speaker:Should we try to convert as many of these middle followers to dedicated
Speaker:listeners as we possibly can?
Speaker:Well, yeah, of course, but that's something that's probably not very much
Speaker:in our control because we don't know why someone became a middle follower.
Speaker:We don't know what to change to make them into a dedicated listener.
Speaker:We just don't know.
Speaker:But that also doesn't mean we should stop trying.
Speaker:I'll have more thoughts on this concept of middle followers as the season progresses.
Speaker:But for now, I shall be back tomorrow with yet another Podcast Pontifications.
Speaker:Cheers!
Speaker:Podcast Pontifications is written and narrated by Evo Terra.
Speaker:He's on a mission to make podcasting better.
Speaker:Links to everything mentioned in today's episode are in the notes
Speaker:section of your podcast listening app.
Speaker:A written-to-be-read article based on today's episode is available at
Speaker:podcastpontifications.com where you'll also find a video version and a corrected
Speaker:transcript, both created by Allie Press.
Speaker:Podcast Pontifications is a production of Simpler Media.