In this powerful episode of DunnWise Perspectives, Doris sits down with Tremale Delano to explore a story of resilience, identity, and the unexpected paths that shape who we become.

Tremale shares his journey from being passed through the foster care system in Los Angeles to building a successful career in construction and real estate management. Raised by a remarkable foster mother who believed deeply in the potential of every child, he was taught early on that his circumstances did not define his future.

But what makes this story truly unforgettable is the belief that drove him for years—that his biological father was a successful attorney who wanted nothing to do with him. That belief fueled his ambition, his work ethic, and his desire to prove something bigger.

Until he discovered… it wasn’t true.

In this conversation, Tremale opens up about:

• Growing up in foster care and the impact of unconditional belief
• The role of forgiveness in shaping his mindset
• How a powerful—but inaccurate—story drove his success
• What happened when that story unraveled
• Why life isn’t black and white—and how perspective changes everything
• The mindset shift from “one path” to discovering new doors

This episode is a reminder that even the stories we question—or outgrow—can still serve a purpose. And sometimes, the path we didn’t plan leads exactly where we’re meant to go.

Key Takeaway

• Your beginnings don’t determine your destination
• Beliefs—true or not—can shape your trajectory
• Mindset isn’t about avoiding setbacks, but reframing them
• When one door closes, another may already be open—you just have to look
• Life is less about certainty and more about perspective

About Tremale Delano

Tremale Delano is a storyteller who takes his audiences on a riveting journey of discovery, using cinematic storytelling and honest reflections to foster transformative thinking. His signature style has been shaped, in part, by competing in the annual Toastmasters International Speech Contest, where he most recently advanced as a semifinalist in the 2024 World Championship of Public Speaking. With a degree in architecture and nearly two decades of experience in commercial construction management, Tremale uses his unique builder’s mindset to bring conceptual ideas to life.

Connect with Tremale

• Email: tremalespeaks@gmail.com
• LinkedIn: Tremale Delano, LEED AP | LinkedIn
• YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/user/PoignantEnigma/videos

Connect with Doris

• Email: doris@dunnwise.com
• Website: www.dunnwise.com
• LinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/doris-dunn
• Schedule a Discovery Call: https://calendly.com/dunnwise-consulting/30min_discovery_call

Want to Be a Guest?

Have a story of resilience, reinvention, or overcoming a challenge? I’d love to hear from you.

👉 Submit your story here: https://forms.gle/gJWpVcsZ5wTwfAgSA

Welcome to Dun Wise Perspectives,

a podcast about stories of

2

resilience and shifting mindsets.

3

I'm your host, Doris Dunn.

4

My guests are leaders, entrepreneurs,

and everyday people who've navigated

5

change, faced uncertainty, and

discovered new ways of thinking when

6

life didn't go according to plan.

7

If you're navigating a season of

change, feeling stuck or simply

8

curious about how small mindset

shifts can lead to meaningful

9

progress, you're in the right place.

10

Let's get started.

11

I.

12

Doris: Welcome everybody to

another episode of DunnWise

13

Perspectives, and today we have a

very special guest, Tramale Delano

14

that I met through Toastmasters.

15

And if you know anything about me,

I'm a huge fan of Toastmasters.

16

I am the founder of the Franklin

Toastmasters in Franklin, Tennessee

17

that began in the late 1990s.

18

And I did leave the Franklin Toastmasters

and joined one in California, and then

19

when I came back to Tennessee a few years

ago, I rejoined Franklin Toastmaster,

20

and I've had the pleasure of hearing

Tramalel speak a number of times,

21

and Tramalel is a fantastic speaker.

22

And last year he competed in

the international speech contest

23

and went quite a long way and

24

And I have a pretty sneaky suspicion.

25

I don't have a crystal ball, but I think

he's gonna go really far again this year.

26

And he is again, an excellent speaker and.

27

He not only is an excellent speaker,

but his stories are impactful.

28

They draw you in.

29

The rest of the world goes away

when Tramalel tells a story.

30

And the last speech that he gave, which

is, the international speech contest,

31

he's gonna go a long way with that speech.

32

But when he shared that speech and.

33

His background, I thought I

need to have him on the podcast.

34

He has an incredible story and

incredible shift in mindset from

35

the very, from very early age.

36

That is something that everyone

needs to hear and so I am so excited

37

to have Tramalel on the show today.

38

Welcome, Tramalel.

39

Can you share a little

bit about who you are?

40

Just tell us a little bit about you.

41

Tremale: Sure.

42

Thanks Doris.

43

It's a pleasure to be here.

44

Thank you so much for having me.

45

I spent most of my life,

in Los Angeles, California.

46

I was born and raised in California

47

my background professionally by

trade, I was in architectural

48

design and construction management.

49

I went to school in Washington, DC

and then hiked, tilted back to la.

50

Avoid the snow, so to speak.

51

But yeah, that's still a

large part of what I do.

52

Construction, real estate management.

53

But, i've developed a passion for

storytelling in public speaking because

54

it has gone hand in hand as I've had

a lot more time now being an adult

55

to reflect on my life experiences.

56

it's been a very useful tool

to be able to share my story

57

with clarity and conviction.

58

And so it's been very helpful

and that's why Toastmasters has

59

been helpful for me as well.

60

Doris: I hear architectural design

and if someone says, yes, I'm an

61

architectural design, the first thought

is I'm sure that your mother or a father

62

must have been an excellent architect.

63

And that is probably where you got your

desire and you were following in your

64

parents footsteps in architectural design.

65

And that couldn't be

further from the truth.

66

tell us a little bit about your

early childhood and some of the

67

struggles that you had from early on.

68

Tremale: Sure.

69

Yeah.

70

there there's one fact

about me that always.

71

Reminds me of my experience and that

is that no picture of me prior to two

72

years old, as far as I'm aware, exists.

73

The earliest memories that I have that

are photographed right now are all two

74

years and above, because between my

birth and the age of two, I was being

75

passed around through the foster care

system around in Los Angeles County.

76

So my birth mother unfortunately

and this is something that.

77

Still isn't in the headlines today

with, opioid crisis and drugs.

78

But unfortunately my mother got caught

up in that in the eighties and had

79

a challenge with drug addiction.

80

And so I was born during

her struggle with that.

81

And so after six months

of caring for me she.

82

basically relinquished her

parental rights to my aunt.

83

And then again, my aunt relinquished

her parental rights six months later.

84

So there was just this period of

every six months, it felt like my

85

caretaker or my mom was, returning

me back to the store, so to speak.

86

Doris: tell me, how could a six

month old be so much trouble?

87

Tremale: I can only imagine.

88

But look looking at some of the reports

that I have that give me a little bit of

89

glimpse into the history apparently I.

90

Had effects from my mom's

usage when I was in the womb.

91

I believe the reports noted that I

had fecal fetal alcohol syndrome,

92

and apparently the, I think the

chief characteristic was I was

93

described as an insolvable kid.

94

So apparently I would cry for three

to four hours at a time and there was

95

nothing that could be done to console me.

96

Some doctors,

97

Doris: you were probably

going through withdrawals.

98

Tremale: Some doctors had speculated

that was exactly as you mentioned

99

going through withdrawals from

alcohol that was put placed in my

100

bottle to calm me when I was younger.

101

But yeah it's hard to make sense of it,

especially now that I have two kids.

102

And so I had this crazy experience when

I held my daughter for the first time

103

when she was two years old, because it

was the first time that I saw an image.

104

Of what I must have looked like.

105

'cause she looked fairly similar to me.

106

And I remember holding her one day and

looking at her and thinking, who in the

107

world could let this little angel go?

108

Yeah.

109

And so I had that moment Just

trying to make sense of it.

110

But I've made peace with it.

111

I understand it and I understand it

through the perspective of how it's

112

helped me become the person I am

today, which has been a long journey.

113

But it's been a worthwhile one.

114

Doris: Wow.

115

And you shared with me before we hit

record that you, you have had an on and

116

off relationship with your mom and she

has tried to come back in your life.

117

Tell me a little bit about

the forgiveness or the.

118

The inability to forgive her, the ability

to forgive or how did your mind wrap

119

itself around the fact that she left,

then she came back, she left again.

120

How do you manage through that?

121

Tremale: Sure.

122

So my foster mother, Ruth tha

Holbert, that was her name, the woman

123

who not only took me in, but five

other foster kids, high risk foster

124

kids that no one really wanted.

125

She was a very, principled person, a very

spiritual person, a very religious person.

126

And so very early on when I was

younger, the concepts of forgiveness

127

and acceptance were embedded within me.

128

She didn't take the route of

trying to hide that I was hers.

129

I don't know when I found out that I

was a foster kid, but as far back as

130

I can remember, as a kid I've known.

131

So sh it was very important for her.

132

To let us know as early as it was

practical given our developmental

133

state where we came from, but intercept

that and also say, by the way.

134

I still expect greatness out

of you, just so you know.

135

Doris: Yeah.

136

Tremale: So it's almost as if she reached

forward and tried to take away the

137

possibility of us finding out that later

in, in that sense of worthlessness, that

138

you feel where that people who brought you

into this world and want you, it's almost

139

like she wanted to get that outta the way.

140

So she could do the heavy lifting, which

is getting us to believe in the idea.

141

That we could become more so she helped

to instill those ideas and my, my

142

birth mother was forbidden by court

order, ever having any contact with me.

143

When I was very young.

144

There was a hearing but I believe I was

around in the 11th grade where my mom

145

Ruth, then Hobert, my foster mom, let me

know that she had received a voicemail.

146

She had explained to me like, Hey,

by the way, she's not allowed,

147

but I'm gonna leave it up to you.

148

It is your choice.

149

Do you want to call her back or do you

want to email back, or what have you?

150

And on the basis she

raised me forgiveness.

151

I was like, sure.

152

And so I remember writing her this email.

153

She later described it brought tears to

her eyes because I came right out with it.

154

I forgive you, and this is

without me even knowing the story.

155

I forgive you, God always has a

plan, 'cause again, raised with

156

that line of thinking when I was

younger and that opened the door.

157

But, we're all human.

158

And ultimately after the adrenaline

rush of of a new experience, you

159

start to get to know people and you

have to make a decision on, what is

160

gonna best support your future growth.

161

And so that's been something I've had

to wrestle with as my mom continues

162

to wrestle with, the struggles of her

past, which continue to be ongoing.

163

Doris: Yeah.

164

Tremale: So it's a work

in progress, shall we say.

165

Doris: So I wanna talk

about Ruth Ann for a minute.

166

you said she took in five foster children

and it sounds like she six, including

167

Tremale: me.

168

Doris: Six.

169

So five other fosters.

170

So she was raising six

between the ages of what?

171

Two to four ish?

172

Tremale: As young as him.

173

Infant Six months.

174

Doris: Yeah, six months.

175

Tremale: Younger.

176

Younger.

177

Doris: So really young kids.

178

And she instilled in you this,

I expect greatness out of you.

179

Do you think that she saw greatness

in each one of you, or she didn't

180

really care what your background was?

181

She just knew that there was

potential in every single child

182

that was living under her roof.

183

Tremale: it was the latter.

184

My mom just believed in, in the

idea that everyone has potential.

185

I don't care where you come from.

186

If you were to look at our rap sheets,

but, and if, and if you even look at

187

our life experiences, early on it, none

of it suggested that we would at all.

188

Follow a trajectory because we came

with some pretty heavy baggage,

189

but she just had this belief.

190

She loved kids.

191

She had daycare and, before us there

were many other foster kids that

192

she had temporarily, for years.

193

she's probably from a span of her life,

had 10, 12, 15 kids directly in her care.

194

And then she had daycare, so she just had

this firm belief around what can happen

195

when you instill love and care within a

kid that it can allow, someone to nourish.

196

And she certainly tried to instill

that within us to the best she could.

197

Doris: Where do you

think she got that from?

198

Where did she learn that,

or, what made her so special?

199

'cause you hear terrible things about.

200

the foster system and foster

parents and some people doing it

201

just for the money and obviously

this, that she did it differently.

202

What made her so different and what

were other success stories besides you?

203

Tremale: Sure.

204

Yeah.

205

It, I think it comes from her

deeply rooted spirituality.

206

She saw this as her calling.

207

To take the kids that no one thought

had a chance, and almost to show the

208

world Hey, don't give up on these kids.

209

And Hey, just so we're clear, I'm

gonna show you, I'm gonna give

210

you the roadmap, so I'm gonna

take the kids nobody wants, right?

211

And I'm gonna keep 'em even when they

break my heart over and over again.

212

I'm gonna show them the power

of love and the power of

213

commitment and consistency and.

214

It wasn't just me, so my brother

Johnelle even in high school, he was

215

considered a world renowned pianist.

216

He was doing music concerts

all over the place, competed in

217

international music competitions.

218

In high school, but that was my mom.

219

she put all of us in music lessons.

220

Some took to things so that some of

the girls were in ballet piano lessons.

221

So the arts were a big part of,

what she felt was important because

222

it was a form of expression.

223

My other sister went on to

college and nursing school.

224

So a lot of us have had success

that kind of belie the standard

225

trajectory of our peers.

226

And I think it, a lot of it has to do

with the manner in which she raised us.

227

And

228

Doris: yeah,

229

Tremale: I don't mean to understate

the difficulty with which it took

230

for us to get to where we were but.

231

It certainly stands out as a

differentiator when you reflect back

232

Doris: Yeah.

233

Tremale: The values that she instilled.

234

Doris: I wanna talk about one of those

values, 'cause you shared earlier with

235

me what happened when you and your

brother would get into a fight and

236

the punishment that she instilled.

237

And I love this story and I'd love for

you to share what your punishment was.

238

Tremale: Yeah, so my mom is what I

would call an innovative punisher.

239

She had some very unique methods

One of her go-tos was, some parents

240

will have you write standards.

241

She would often make me go write

pages and pages out of a dictionary.

242

She'd make me find words and write

the definition of them on paper

243

as an alternate form of standards.

244

Make me go take the Bible and write

out pages and pages of Bible verses and

245

come back and let's go talk about it.

246

I don't want you to, I want you to

keep writing until your hand feels like

247

it's gonna fall off, but the biggest

one is I remember one time me and my

248

brother got into a pretty bad fight

and as punishment, she made us figure.

249

out What bus we needed to take

to get to a library 30 minutes

250

away in a whole other city.

251

And we had to go together.

252

We had to go find a book, read it,

write a book report, and we could not

253

come back home until we had it in hand.

254

And I remember that moment specifically

because we got lost so many times W e

255

literally had to put our differences

aside and work as a team to try to

256

figure out how to get back home, and

know In her grand wisdom of things.

257

Yeah, I didn't just get a

book report out of that.

258

I I got some way finding

navigational skills out of it too,

259

Doris: oh, absolutely.

260

Oh my goodness.

261

So I wanted, so to call it

your architectural designer.

262

And what inspired that?

263

How did you go from, the foster care

system, you graduated from high school.

264

you found yourself in college,

in Washington, dc What

265

inspired architectural design?

266

Tremale: I grew up in

South Central Los Angeles.

267

A lot of the residents there often would

do their own home additions often, and

268

so I happened to live next door to a

gentleman who was also a carpenter.

269

And so there was something about.

270

Buildings had always boggled my mind.

271

It felt like magic.

272

How can one day there be nothing there?

273

And then all of a sudden there's

this structure standing there

274

and the wind for the most part,

Los Angeles can't knock it down.

275

It keeps you out of the weather.

276

And it's a place called home.

277

So it buildings were like a marble to me.

278

And I remember one day, I was

watching him build something 'cause

279

I would just ride my bike around the

neighborhood and just watch people build

280

things for hours and get lost in it.

281

One day I had the courage to go up

to him and I said, you know what?

282

I had to be, I had to have been

in the seventh grade, sixth grade.

283

I said, I want to be just like you

when I grew up, and he was a carpenter,

284

and he came over to my house and

he sat on the porch next to me.

285

he laughed and he said I'm very flattered,

but you don't want to be like me.

286

Trust me.

287

Let me tell you what you should do.

288

What you should do is go be an architect.

289

And what they do is they build

things, but on paper and.

290

It'll be great for you.

291

And the secret is when you turn

40, your knees will still work.

292

So every, ever since I was there that

age, I decided that's what I wanted to do.

293

So from literally around the sixth

grade, I knew what I wanted to do and,

294

got it, got accepted into the School of

Architecture at Catholic University in

295

Washington dc successful internships.

296

But then just through all the

professional experience, I decided

297

to take a intermediate track.

298

And so instead of.

299

Becoming a professional architect

and becoming a licensed architect, I

300

pivoted into commercial construction

management, and so I became part

301

of the teams that helped build the

buildings and manage the buildings,

302

but not necessarily with my hands.

303

Yeah,

304

Doris: it's

305

Tremale: the scheduling, the

budgeting the logistics of it all.

306

I discovered that I had

a great passion in the.

307

The dynamic nature of that experience.

308

And that's what I have spent the last

20 years of my life primarily doing is

309

bringing commercial projects to life.

310

Doris: I love it.

311

You said something earlier

that kind of stuck with me.

312

You said something about

the building being a home.

313

I wonder if there's some symbolism there

where you had a wonderful home and a

314

wonderful foster mom that took care of

you, but I'm sure in the back of your

315

mind there was a little bit of niggling

about, this is a wonderful home, but.

316

I wanna build my own home, I

wanna build a home with a family.

317

do you think that there's some

symbolism in this architectural design

318

and this, looking at your neighbor

and seeing him build something and

319

saying there's something magical about

it and the building becomes a home

320

and the home is where the family is.

321

And I just wonder if that somehow ties

together from a symbolism perspective

322

and where you wound up making the

decision to, to start your career.

323

Tremale: That's a great thought

for some additional reflection.

324

I've actually never ever considered that.

325

But there, there could be some

credits there, credence there to that.

326

I, I was allowed to wonder, when I was a

kid, I was allowed to be a kid in, in a

327

lot of different ways, and I think that.

328

Letting that curiosity kind of

roam, starting with just playing

329

with Legos and taking things apart.

330

I got into so much trouble taking things

apart and trying to put 'em back together.

331

Vacuum cleaners.

332

One day I got it in my mind that I

was gonna take the motor out a vacuum

333

cleaner and putting in my wagon,

and I was gonna make a go-kart.

334

I want you to imagine how that

went ruined their vacuum cleaner.

335

But I,

336

Doris: it sounds like that sounds

like something my husband would do.

337

Tremale: Yeah.

338

Yeah.

339

So I think that it was certainly

influenced by the environment

340

that my foster mom created that

allowed me to just explore.

341

And who knows, maybe the roots do lead

back to, at the end of the day, everyone

342

wants a shelter, a place called home.

343

And maybe that's probably a, a deeper,

concept that sort of resided within me,

344

Doris: so tell me about the

speech that you're writing now.

345

I, we, I know we spent a little bit

of time talking about your mom and

346

the speech that I had the pleasure

of just listening to, talked a

347

little bit about your dad and Okay.

348

Spoiler alert.

349

We, I know from the

speech that you thought.

350

This one person was your father

and it inspired a lot of who you

351

became, and later you discovered

that someone else was your father.

352

Can you share a little bit about that?

353

What inspired you knew you were

gonna be this one person because

354

your dad was an attorney, right?

355

And then when you were discovered

your dad was someone else what

356

process happened in your mind?

357

And then how did you keep your

original dad as part of who you are?

358

Tremale: Sure.

359

So growing up we talked a

little bit about my mom.

360

So the flip side is that my dad,

at least the man at the time that's

361

named on my birth certificate he

was married to another woman at

362

the time that, I was conceived.

363

And so the story that was told to me

very young is that while my foster mom.

364

And a lot of people around me

were aware of who my dad was.

365

He had legal advertisements

that played on tv.

366

His family was known personal injury,

I believe some type of in that

367

legal sense, and that legal sphere.

368

But it was made clear to me that they

didn't wanna have anything to do with me.

369

Forbidden fruit, I don't

fit in the profile.

370

And so from a very young age,

I knew about him, but there was

371

almost this deep resistance.

372

So when I found out that, my dad

was this brilliant attorney that

373

kind of stuck with me and my mom

went off and tell me, Hey, just so

374

you know, you come from brilliance.

375

Don't forget that, she'd remind me

in a bunch of different contexts and.

376

It almost became a rally cry for

me if they don't want me, I'm

377

gonna become so big one day that

they're gonna come looking for me.

378

there was this like dichotomy of I'm

gonna take your superpower, right?

379

Your brilliance that I inherited

you, didn't give it to me.

380

I have it, but I'm gonna use it to

become bigger than what you ever

381

thought, and so it was this thing where.

382

I found belief that I could become

something because of my background, my

383

history, who the people, I thought the man

who I thought was my dad, but also being

384

driven by this desire to prove them wrong.

385

And so there was this healthy, there

was like this partial acceptance of

386

what they gave me, but this rejection.

387

Of ever being, with them.

388

I imagined these moments where, I designed

this big skyscraper and my name is on it,

389

and they come to the grand opening and

they wanna shake my hand and I say, no.

390

I'm rejecting you now.

391

There's just those kind of kid fantasies.

392

And so I, that, that drove a lot, a large

part of my identity when I was younger.

393

And I certainly needed something

to drive me because I had a whole

394

bunch of educational challenges.

395

Dyslexic was placed in

special education classes.

396

To the point that, I was pretty

significantly behind in school and so

397

things clicked and life started to come

together through, a huge part of my

398

foster member supporting my development.

399

And my life was playing out just as.

400

I landed, I graduated, I found success.

401

I was building high rises,

not high rises that I owned,

402

but I was building high rises.

403

I got to a point where I was

building my own buildings mid-rise

404

buildings that were, that was

gonna put my daughter's name on.

405

So that fantasy that I have is a kid

was starting to come true until my wife.

406

Did something that kind of just blew

up my whole world and she told me that,

407

Hey, just so you know, I've been like

looking into your dad's family and I

408

know you don't want to, and I know I

ask you, but I saw an article about

409

like how your dad died and so that set

us off on this whole thing and then.

410

When she got pregnant with our first kid,

that made me completely start to rethink

411

my relationship with my past and my dad.

412

And, my wife's perspective was always,

maybe the story you told wasn't true.

413

Maybe they've evolved, maybe there's

younger cousins and brothers and sisters.

414

You never know.

415

I want our kid to, experience that.

416

Because I grew up on family.

417

My wife did.

418

Family was very important for her and

she didn't want me to be robbed of

419

that, and she wanted our future kid to

be robbed of that experience either.

420

And so COVID, COVID times, and it

did not take very long for me to.

421

Pierce through and find them.

422

It wasn't very hard with all the modern

technology and it turns out that I

423

found them and just as my wife had

explained or hoped they were accepting

424

and they wanted me to be a part of it.

425

And we did a DNA test on the same day

and it turned out that it wasn't true.

426

And so I had my whole life.

427

And it wasn't just this idea that

my dad's brilliance came from me.

428

It was this whole drive

of proving them wrong.

429

I didn't have anyone to prove wrong

anymore 'cause it wasn't true.

430

But my wife being the eternal

optimist that she is, she's Tramell,

431

do you know what this means?

432

No, it means your dad

might still be alive.

433

And I'm like, whoa.

434

She went on this journey for about

a year trying to figure it out.

435

And she found my real dad.

436

She did over the course of a year.

437

And it helped me resolve

some things about myself.

438

And I think the biggest thing that

this experience showed me is that Wow.

439

Okay, so I have to process this.

440

A lot of my advancement in life,

I attribute to the fact that my

441

dad gave me, gifted me certain

abilities and was driven by this

442

idea that my family didn't want me.

443

So I had this extra drive, but

it turned out to not be true.

444

And so I was trying to reconcile that

and at the end of the day, where I

445

landed at, was just an appreciation

that I am where I am today.

446

No matter how I got here, there

was this deep appreciation for a

447

moment that, wow, it's crazy that I

would not be here if not for those

448

misunderstandings and lies, right?

449

That I believed and it

completely changed my mindset.

450

To really start to look into this

concept that life is not black and white.

451

It's gray, it's messy.

452

It doesn't fit on neat little posters.

453

It, it's pages and pages of

contradictory information that

454

you have to take in as a whole.

455

But if you do that,

you'll be given a gift.

456

And that gift is a gift of

perspective and realizing that.

457

All of it came together

to make you who you are.

458

And so that's been a huge mind shift for

me mindset shift for me as I've grown.

459

Yeah.

460

Doris: the thing that's so interesting

about that story and that I think I

461

want our listeners to understand is

that the mind is incredibly powerful

462

and you can, especially if you.

463

Instill something in your children or

your foster children like you had in

464

your case, and everyone believed it.

465

They believed it so much

that you made it true.

466

It turned that, like you said,

if you didn't have that belief,

467

who knows where you'd be today?

468

Who knows what you would've believed?

469

I still strongly believe that your

foster mom would've still said,

470

you're destined for greatness.

471

She wouldn't have cared what your

history was because she had so much.

472

Belief in you, but there was still

a part of that story that made you

473

want to strive, made you want to

move forward, made you want to prove

474

something to the family that you

thought was your real family and.

475

That the mind is, oh, so incredibly

powerful that it can achieve things that

476

maybe other people think we can't achieve

or parts of us think we can't achieve.

477

And at the end of the

day, we can achieve it.

478

And I don't know if maybe you wanna speak

to that a little bit and you we spend a

479

little bit of time on mindset, but given

how you are today and the person that you

480

are today, how has mindset maybe shifted?

481

What your future could look like or

what you think, how you think about

482

mindset in the decisions that you make

today or how you raise your children.

483

Tremale: Sure.

484

Absolutely.

485

It's actually a little annoying

because I, it's almost like I've become

486

depression resistant, shall I say?

487

If that's a word.

488

Sure.

489

Doris: We'll, just we'll say it's a word.

490

Tremale: Yeah.

491

If it's a word, yeah.

492

even when I have moments of

extreme disappointment and

493

of things, disappointment

494

Doris: in yourself, or disappointment.

495

Tremale: Disappointment

in life in general, right?

496

I wanted this certain result.

497

I wanted to have this done by the

end of the year, or this really

498

bad thing just happened to me

in life, and it feels so unfair.

499

Why me?

500

Why me?

501

After the, the initial moments of that.

502

There is always this place that

comes to me that says, okay,

503

Tramale these doors have closed.

504

Where's the hidden door that just opened?

505

You gotta find it, right?

506

Doris: Yeah.

507

Tremale: And so my, I don't see the world

in this duality where it's either you made

508

it or you didn't, you won or you lost.

509

It's hey.

510

This door just slammed shut.

511

Look for the other door.

512

There's gotta be another door somewhere.

513

Doris: There's always another door.

514

Yes.

515

Tremale: That journey of where is it?

516

Where is it?

517

Is it, there's it there?

518

Is it in the ceiling?

519

Do I need to teleport outta here?

520

Can I teleport?

521

You, when you accept this idea that not

it's, I don't have the belief necessarily

522

that all things happen for a reason.

523

But I do think, I do

believe in cause and effect.

524

I believe that when one thing happens,

it causes something else to happen.

525

And your mindset is what allows you

to keep the story going and I, yeah,

526

Doris: the butter, the

butterfly effect, right?

527

Tremale: Sure.

528

Yeah.

529

So that's really been the biggest change

is that it's made me super curious to

530

make sure that I didn't miss anything.

531

Hey, am I looking at this the wrong way?

532

I know this is, this might be what I want,

or, like last year I really wanted to

533

speak to a bunch of different audiences,

but the speech that I wanted to give.

534

Here I am a year later, and I realize that

there's so much more depth to explore.

535

There's a better, bigger

story to tell, right?

536

You have that perspective.

537

You start to understand the life as

always, this work in progress and if you

538

can find a way to just enjoy that period

of improvement and your hopes are up,

539

your hopes are down, and then new hope.

540

You'll always be moving

forward in some way.

541

So that's probably been

the biggest shift for me.

542

Doris: I love that.

543

Tremale: And I didn't grow up like that.

544

I it was hard for me to not see

it that way 'cause it was very

545

kind of single track minded.

546

And this is my go.

547

I have to hit it.

548

Failure's not an option, I have to hit it.

549

So if I gotta run a hundred times, I'm

gonna run a hundred times and I'm gonna

550

hit my goal, now it's more like, all

right, I keep running into the wall.

551

Maybe I should look the

other way to see if,

552

Doris: yeah,

553

Tremale: this is where I should be going.

554

Doris: Kinda, yeah.

555

I love that,

556

a

557

Tremale: different type of commitment.

558

Doris: But I agree.

559

Everything has a cause and

effect, and I do the same thing.

560

I think about my past and did I

make wrong decisions in some ways.

561

And I realize, you know

what, every decision was made

562

for a reason, whether it.

563

It felt, or it feels today like what

if I had done something different?

564

I, I might not be here

speaking with you today.

565

If I had gone in any different

direction, again, that butterfly

566

effect, that tiny little flap of a

butterfly's wing can impact things

567

that we don't even know or understand.

568

And I think that we can try to

move forward in a positive way,

569

but I think that's a great analogy.

570

If you keep hitting the wall that

maybe that 90th time is realized that

571

maybe I do need to take another path.

572

Maybe the path that I thought

was really clear in front of me.

573

Isn't as clear and I need to

go find even that third door.

574

I know there is, and I don't remember who

said it, I read it in, in a book, but it

575

was by a, a Kathy Heller book, but she

was quoting someone else who talks about

576

the third door, where the first door

is where everyone standing in line and

577

you're waiting just imagined, trying to

get into a popular nightclub and you're at

578

the back of the line and you're watching

VIPs go in front of you and you're just.

579

Standing back there waiting and

hoping that you can get in the door

580

that you may never even get in.

581

And then there's a second door that

is a little less popular, but it's

582

still, you can get through that

door, but you people forget about the

583

third door that's hidden that maybe

you don't even realize is there.

584

And I think what you just talked about,

the analogy of finding a different door.

585

And don't try so hard towards something

that you think is the right path.

586

Maybe it is, maybe you do need to

just keep trying and plugging away,

587

but if you keep hitting a wall, maybe

try a different door or try a window.

588

Tremale: Absolutely.

589

I liken it to.

590

I'm a big, I love sweets, right?

591

So I love ice cream and I love

cookies, And the way I think

592

someone really explained it to me

is I you love ice cream, right?

593

Tramale?

594

Yes.

595

I love it.

596

I love chocolate ice cream.

597

But, have you ever had chocolate ice

cream with all these different toppings

598

and all these different flavors?

599

So it's really, you have in your

head what you think you like

600

until you see something that is.

601

More nuanced, more more ingrained

something more grand and it shifts you.

602

And then you start to think and

question yourself of do I want

603

this because it's what I'm destined

or do I want this because it's

604

the only thing I know right now.

605

And really giving yourself the grace to.

606

To acknowledge that maybe you don't

know everything there is about you.

607

Yeah.

608

And, finding out the rest is a journey.

609

So that, that's been a helpful

perspective for me to have as well.

610

Doris: Yeah, and obviously

we're all on a journey.

611

It doesn't matter how old or

how young we are, we're all on a

612

journey, this journey called life.

613

And I just, I wanna thank you so much,

Jamel, for sharing your story with me.

614

I think it's so powerful

and I am so happy.

615

That you are not one of the statistics.

616

I know we talked earlier about the

statistics of foster care children

617

and I wish we could wave a magic wand.

618

I wish we could do something to,

I wish we could have a thousand

619

Ruth Ann Halberts, and that's who

takes care of all the foster kids.

620

Is all the Ruth Anns out there.

621

And because we know that if a million

Ruth Anns took care of foster kids,

622

we wouldn't, it wouldn't be that

trail of foster care to prison and

623

some of the other paths that go on.

624

And I'm just so happy that

you had the mother, the foster

625

care mother, that you did that.

626

Told you couldn't fail.

627

You're destined for greatness.

628

And she was 100% right that you

were destined for greatness.

629

You hit greatness.

630

You continue to find greatness

and I am glad that I am able to

631

call you friend and I look forward

to hearing many more speeches.

632

'cause I know there's a lot more

creative juices flowing in speeches

633

that you're gonna give in the future.

634

And I I can't wait to see

you on a big stage one day.

635

Tremale: I appreciate that.

636

And it's just been a true honor and

privilege to count you as a friend.

637

So thank you so much for

everything and for having me today.

638

It's been great.

639

Doris: Thank you, Tramell.

640

Thank you for listening

or watching this episode.

641

If something from today's conversation

resonated with you, I'd love for you

642

to share this episode with someone

who might need it or take a moment

643

to reflect on what stood out for you.

644

You can find show notes wherever

you get your podcasts, and if you

645

enjoy the podcast, subscribing

or leaving a review helps more

646

people find these conversations.

647

Until next time, keep learning.

648

Stay curious and remember,

sometimes a small shift in

649

perspective can change everything.