In this episode of Money Talk With Tiff, Tiffany Grant invites Christoph Heuermann from Denationalize Me to discuss the fascinating concept of denationalization. Christoph explains what it means to denationalize oneself, the benefits and potential downsides, and how varying aspects like flag theory, tax optimization, and lifestyle choices come into play.

Whether you're a location-independent freelancer, an entrepreneur, or someone curious about diversifying globally, this episode provides insightful perspectives on living and operating beyond traditional national boundaries.

Check out the full show notes: https://moneytalkwitht.com/podcast-show-notes/flag-theory-denationalize/

Takeaways

• Denationalizing allows individuals to optimize their responsibilities and assets across multiple countries for greater freedom.
• Flag theory is a strategic approach to optimize business, banking, and residency locations worldwide.
• The concept of denationalizing can benefit location-independent freelancers and entrepreneurs the most.
• There are various pros and cons to denationalizing, including potential tax benefits and loss of social security.
• Individuals need to consider their legal obligations when relocating or shifting assets internationally.
• Christoph offers holistic consulting that covers everything from taxes to residency and citizenship issues.

Connect with Christoph Heuermann

• Website: https://denationalize.me
• Instagram: @denationalize.me

Connect with Tiffany Grant

• Website: Money Talk With Tiff
• Instagram: Money Talk With Tiff
• Twitter: @MoneyTalkWithT
• Facebook: Money Talk With Tiff

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You know what it is? That's right. It's time to talk money with your money nerd and financial coach. Now tighten those purse strings and open those ears.

It's the Money Talk with Tiff podcast.

Hey, everyone. I am so excited because I have Christophe here from Denationalize me, and he's here to talk to us about what denationalizing yourself even means. So.

Hey, Christoph, how are you?

Tiffany. Nice to meet you.

Nice to meet you as well. So thank you so much for taking the time to come on. So let's kick it off by just explaining. What do you mean by Denationalizing?

Yeah, it basically means that you reduce, like, your responsibilities in a certain country and shift it to other countries. Yeah. So, like, paradoxically, you will, like, shift aspects of your life to other countries to become more free.

For example, people living in a certain country having everything in their country, the company, the bank account, the insurance, can relocate those aspects to other countries where they are treated better. So you can optimize your taxes, have your wealth in a safer country, get more returns on your investments in other countries.

So basically, denationalizing means we reduce our impact in one country and, like, use the benefits of many other countries.

Oh, interesting.

So what I'm hearing is, like, you can live somewhere, but have a business somewhere else, but have your bank account somewhere else and so on and so forth.

Yes, it's basically a strategy called flag theory. Yeah, we use this flag theory in our consulting to determine the best lifestyle concept for certain people.

So, for example, I have a residency in Panama, but my company is in the US While my bank account is in Europe, because that gives me the ideal business solution for my clients.

Very interesting. Very interesting. And so with that, I'm sure there's pros and cons, or there's things like it might not be good for everyone.

So who would this be good for?

I mean, the. This concept factory. The strategy can be used by everyone. I would say.

Yeah, but of course, the more mobile and flexible people are, the more beneficial it can be to them.

So generally, it's for location, independent freelancers and entrepreneurs or people living off their assets of capital gains or rental income or something like that. They have the most options to implement this into their lifestyles and really profit from it.

Gotcha. Okay. And I heard you say something about taxes. As a pro. Are there any other pros to doing this?

What do you mean, taxes?

Yeah, so you said to optimize tax purposes and things like that. Are there any other reasons someone would consider Doing this.

Yes, of course. I mean, there's positive and negative motivations for doing this.

And some people just want to escape the bad weather in the country where they're living and just live in a more tropical, sunny climate. And of course, it can be many things they're just unhappy with, like the political or economic situation of their country.

But also they might see new opportunities, better business opportunities and so on in other countries. For many entrepreneurs, it's a taxes, but it can also be bureaucracy or certain regulations.

It can be just like that a country is insecure or getting insecure, and you just have more security for your children and yourself if you relocate somewhere else. I mean, it's a very multi. Yeah, it's a very broad topic. Yeah. It doesn't only apply to your business or your personal life.

Can be applied to almost everything.

Yeah, gotcha. And so with everything, there's always cons. So what are some negatives or cons that could come along with this?

Of course, there's always a compromise. In order to get out of a certain country, you have to keep to certain legal things. Yeah.

So often people have to give up their house or something like that. They might rent it out, but they cannot keep it for their own use, otherwise they will keep tax resident in the country where they are.

Or they have to take their wife or husbands or kids with them. They cannot stay. And of course you might lose access to Social Security, you might lose access to getting loans or something like that.

So there's always advantages in getting more free. But of course that depending on what you do can have certain disadvantages as well. However, most challenges for this lifestyle can be solved.

So there's always a good alternatives on the way.

Gotcha. Gotcha. Now someone like. So I just moved to Jamaica myself, so I'm actually, you know, I call it geographic arbitrage.

Where I live somewhere that's a little cheaper while still making the same money, you know, where I work was. However, I never thought about, you know, opening accounts and things in other countries.

So like, I opened an account here in Jamaica, but I never thought about, let's say, for instance, Panama, just opening an account in Panama or what have you.

And so when you're helping your clients or people through this process, what are some things that you all are considering that, you know, people should consider?

Yeah, I mean, certain countries are specialized on certain things and I guess Jamaica has a very good lifestyle and it's not that bad for taxes either.

But it might not be the most recognized country, so it might be Wise to have your company in another country and maybe the bank account somewhere where it's a bit more stable. And that really depends on the country you're living in. Yeah. So often people go to have multiple residencies or even multiple citizenships. Yeah.

I mean generally with an American audience, we have the problem that Americans are text everywhere in the world regardless where they live. Because they're American. Yeah, because it's bound to the citizenship.

And that's not a big issue for most other nationalities because they don't have this issue.

Yeah, that is very true. I still have to pay taxes in the US even though I live here. So yeah, I completely agree with that. Now if people are thinking about this.

So let's say someone's listening and they're like, this sounds really interesting. I am geographic independent, I can live anywhere and still do what I do. How would they be able to start the process or get in contact with you all?

Yeah, I mean the main thing, what we do is you can say we are kind of a family office for people who cannot afford a family office. Yeah. So we offer like a holistic guidance, holistic consulting.

Not only about taxes like a tax advisor could do, but over all these other topics of the factory, for example, the citizenship, the residency, bank accounts, investments, insurance, up to more. Yeah. Controversial topics like where to marry or where to have your children born or having employees and things like that.

And the other important thing is we are doing this worldwide. Yeah. We are not in like Dubai or in Cyprus and want to sell our solution there. We look at all the world.

I personally travel to every country in the world and yeah, just try to find the best solution for the individual situation of any client. And we offer different consulting packages for that. Both. Yeah. Calls also pair, voice message and so on and so on.

So yeah, people can just come to denationalize me and find all our offerings there.

Gotcha. And so you all travel everywhere and try out this stuff and you know, see what works, see what doesn't before you even tell people about it.

Yes, I mean of course I started this business already 10 years ago, so I'm doing this quite a while. I'm more prominent for this in the German market. I have a big German blog and I'm very known in the German speaking market.

But as I said, we do that worldwide and we can help many other nationalities and residencies as well. And obviously, yes, I've been to basically all the countries I talk about.

So it's always helpful that you have been there, that you have certain Local contacts to brokers, to lawyers, to tax advisors who can actually implement all those solutions.

So we don't only do the consulting, obviously, we can also help implementing starting a company, getting a residency, getting a citizenship and so on.

That is awesome. You take thinking global to a whole nother level. But thank you so much, Christophe, for coming on the show today.

I will make sure I have all your links and everything in the show notes. Is there any way that people can find you on social media? Are you on social media or anything like that?

Yes, they can find me generally with the name Christoph Today. This is my Instagram, my personal travel Instagram. And there's also a travel blog actually called Christoph Today.

So you can find many stories about all the adventurous countries all around the world, just in English and otherwise. We have other channels, but they're mostly in German. But generally Christoph Today is the. Is the way to search me on social media.

Okay, perfect. And I'll make sure I have that in the show notes as well.

So if you all are listening and you're interested in denationalizing, then make sure you reach out to Christophe. Thank you so much for coming on the show today.

Yeah, thank you.

Bye.

Thank you for listening, joining and being a part of the Money Talk with Tiff podcast this week.

You can check Tiff out every Thursday for a new Money Talk podcast, but if you just can't wait until next week, you can listen to previous podcast episodes@moneytalkwitht.com or follow TIFF on all social media platforms at Money Talk with T. Until next time. Spend wise by spending less than you make. A word to the money wise is always sufficient.