This week’s guest is Maz Alexander, social worker, mental wellbeing coach, comedian and passionate entrepreneur.

Maz started out working as a social worker in adult social care. A thread you’ll hear in here story, and one to keep in mind as you listen, is that she listened to the advice of others when it made sense to and listened to herself as well when she decided on what work to pursue.

Before her time in social work, Maz got a degree in performance arts and gave acting a go. Coming out of that, she was always passionate about drama therapy and using performing arts to help people in recovery which has served her in social work and serves her in what she does today.

In 2018, she qualified in Transformational Coaching and she is a coach today while she also works part time in social work. We chat the difference between what a coach and a therapist can give you. Oh, and the time she had to refer a client not to a therapist but to a priest!

For those considering therapy or coaching, you may also be interested in what Maz says about how to choose the right provider for you. It starts with a consultation.

Outside of work, Maz is a stand up comic and a podcaster. In fact, there is a link below the the episode of her podcast “Kintsugi Queens” that the host of this podcast was a guest on! As a stand up comedian, Maz jokes about her life (which she says is a joke in itself). We cover all of this and more in this episode.

Note from Rabiah (Host): 

On the comedy circuit, I get to meet a lot of wonderful characters. There are gigs I look forward to because of who I’ll get to hang out with as we wait to take the stage. Maz is one of the people I always look forward to connecting with and I’m so glad we got to learn about each other more as we guested on each other’s respective podcasts. Enjoy the listen!

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Find Maz

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/maz-alexander-318851a9/ 

Google “Maz transformational coaching”

Website: https://maztransformationalcoaching.com/coaching/ 

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Mentioned in this episode:

Whoopi Goldberg

Myron Golden

Rabiah on Kintsugi Queens podcast: https://open.spotify.com/episode/5zC7NK36kBF9ABKrz6QFBk?si=70f7105f99cf42ad

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More than Work Facebook, Instagram, Twitter: @morethanworkpod Please review and follow anywhere you get podcasts. Thank you for listening. Have feedback? Email morethanworkpod(at)gmail.com!

This is More Than Work, the podcast reminding you that your self-worth

is made up of more than your job title.

Each week I'll talk to a guest about how they discovered that for themselves.

You'll hear about what they did, what they're doing, and who they are.

I'm your host, Rabiah.

I work in IT, perform standup comedy, write, volunteer, and of course, podcast.

Thank you for listening.

Here we go.

Hey everyone, welcome back to More Than Work this week.

I am really excited.

I have Maz Alexander.

She is a social worker, mental wellbeing coach, comedian, you can

guess how we met already, and all around multi-passionate entrepreneur.

So, how are you doing?

Fine.

I'm excited to be here and to talk to you, Rabiah.

Yeah, me too.

You interviewed me um, recently.

I'll be on your podcast and you're going to, you're gonna be on mine

now, so it's really, really awesome.

So where am I chatting to you from today?

Well, I'm all the way in sunny South London.

And forgive me if you hear the police sirens, cuz like I said,

we're in, we're in South London, so the police are always on patrol.

I know.

I know I'm in Camden and we have a similar presence, I would say sometimes.

And it's sunny up here in North London too, so we'll see the day this comes

out if it's sunny, but at least we, we are proving that there is sun

here sometimes in the winter, right?

We have quite a bit to delve into today.

So like, first of all, we met doing standup comedy, and, I think both enjoyed

each other's humor and then just kind of realized we got along as people too,

which isn't always the case in comedy.

So just wanna say that like, that's been a pleasure for me, for sure.

but your career background is well outside of comedy, and so I'd like to

just start with your time as a social worker and how you got into that.

Yeah, sure.

I mean, they're, they're not , they're not that dissimilar.

Some, some people would, would call my job a joke.

So, and my whole life.

But yeah, I've, I've been qualified as an adult social worker for 15 years.

So I primarily worked with adults in the mental health sector.

And I, I always knew that I wanted to help people in some capacity.

At the time when I studied, I did a master's in, in social work and I didn't

even know you could do that at the time.

I just had my daughter and I was going to one of those mother and baby groups

and this lovely Irish lady said, oh, well you, you've got a degree and why

don't you use your skills for this?

And probably I wouldn't have thought about it if she hadn't

suggested it, but I come from...

my family is in a care background, so my mother was a psychiatric nurse and

I remember thinking when I was small, I said, one day I'm gonna free all of them.

Cause it was the days when they used to have asylums and they'd put

everyone, you know, even if you were unwed mother, you'd be in there with

every, everybody who was a deviant.

And I quite like the idea of just freeing them.

So, yeah, that, that was a long time in the making.

But I always loved the therapeutic aspect of it.

And using things like drama therapy, although I didn't wanna

train and do the extra training.

But yeah, always loved to combine the two, using some kind of performance

arts to help people with their recovery.

So yeah, here we are.

So when you saw too that, that growing up, I'm sure you

saw kind of the plus side of helping people, but also the difficulty in that.

And so were you able to kind of process your emotions and just how it was

dealing with difficult situations with people you cared about as patients

partly in seeing your mom go through that and maybe others in your family.

Yeah, most definitely.

I just wanted to make a difference.

They say many of us who work in the caring professions are

what you call wounded soldiers.

We essentially have been through, through some stuff.

Who hasn't?

And we wanna make a change because we, we, we have observed, and I certainly did

back in the day, that the system wasn't really supportive of people's recovery.

And I thought we have to do something about that.

The power dynamics I didn't like where people were being forced to take

medication and being restrained and all these really intrusive, invasive

kind of treatments that they had.

So I thought, no, I don't like that.

And I wouldn't like it if it was me.

So let's see what we can do.

So, yeah, that was my, my motivation.

Yeah.

And it is it's just interesting going back to what you said about

they would just loop everyone in...

everyone who was quote unquote deviant into a psychiatric ward of, and treat

all people in a way badly, but the same.

And I think I actually took a class in college.

It just reminded me when you used the word deviant.

I took a class on social deviance and we studied things like homosexuality in

there, which was really, I mean, it's so bizarre to me now thinking about how.

that kind of thing was just considered deviance or how you

said unwed mothers or something.

And so you've, I'm sure in your career then, seen kind of those labels change a

little bit, although socially, depending on who you talk to, they maybe haven't.

But do you feel like in your time you've seen change and, and

were you able to bring any of the change that you wanted to just in?

Yeah, there, there, there definitely has been changes, you

know, because our understanding around human behavior changes all the time.

So certainly well in the 15 years, but even, even before then the

labels that we ascribe to people...

so for example, you know, language changes.

We, we don't say that people are m anic depressive.

They have bipolar disorder.

You know, people are no longer, you know, senile.

We don't call anybody senile or, you know, looking back on the historical

notes, even when I first qualified, doctors would write things about

people and say, oh, this fellow is a rather odd gentlemen, very eccentric

and make all kinds of value judgments about how someone was presenting.

Now hopefully we're a bit more accepting.

There's more work to do, but we, we try not to judge , although

we, we inevitably do.

But yeah, the whole language has changed.

Things like personality disorders for example.

You, you would not come under a community mental health team because it was not

deemed to be a mental health disorder.

And like you say, there are cultural components, all kinds of things because

perhaps when some people, for example, come to the West, we, we give them

labels, but in their countries of origin that, that, you know, the way they're

presenting is perfectly acceptable.

So I, I bear that in mind.

And, you know, everything is person-centered and you try

and give people what they need without adding to the stigma.

You know, cuz people got enough to deal with.

Without all the judgment that society will will place on them, so...

Thanks for listening so far, and I'm just going to

interrupt the podcast for about a minute and a half or so to tell you

about a podcast that I really love.

It's called Art Heals All Wounds, and it's by Pam Uzzell.

She works in documentary films and basically she's super easy

to listen to and has great guests, kind of like me, right?

I know that's what you're thinking.

One of my favorite episodes was when she had the directors

and creators of Crip Camp.

This Oscar nominated film, documentary film on her podcast.

I learned so much from them and was really entertained.

But basically all her guests have a story to tell.

They're healed through art, and art is how they express themselves.

The art could be what you think of as art, meaning something like

painting, or it could be writing or filmmaking or anything else.

So Pam's gonna tell you a little bit more about our podcast and then

we'll resume with this episode.

Thank you.

Do you want to change the world?

So do I.

On this podcast, we meet artists whose work is doing just that.

Welcome to Art Heals All Wounds.

I'm your host, Pam Uzzell.

Each week I interview an artist and talk about their work as creative thinkers.

Artists present us with some of the most compelling visions of ways that our

world could work better for everyone.

Art around environmental, social, and racial justice, gender equity,

ways to build community and bridge divisions, and solace for grieving.

If we can see solutions to the things that prevent us from thriving as

individuals and societies, we can imagine implementing those solutions.

Once we imagine that we can become the people we want to be belonging

to communities that nurture everyone and living in societies based on

equity and justice, how do we change the world, one artist at a time.

Do you think in just raising a child yourself and just

in knowing what you've dealt with in, in your life, do you think that

your work as a social worker kind of changed the way you approached

things in your own personal life?

Just seeing how maybe certain things impacted other people?

definitely.

And also my, my coaching which I know we're gonna talk

about in a moment, but yeah.

So in terms of, you know, things like diversity and what have you, I, I tried to

teach my, my daughter, you know, even when she was small, you know, when we look at

difference and, and even questions like, mommy, why is that man dressed in a dress?

Why is that, why is that person not able to walk?

Why?

So I've always.

Try to, and not just her other family members that might be ignorant to it.

And even the cultural aspect, cuz you know, my family from the Caribbean and

when I tell them what I do, it's like, oh, you work with those mad people?

And it's like, I, I tell my , it's their understanding is quite funny.

I, I tell my clients because I, I can be quite eccentric and they say, they say to

me, which one of us needs the medication?

You or me?

Cuz you are off your head.

And I say, I know.

Because, you know, really we're all on the spectrum somewhere.

It's true.

And I'm like, the only difference between me and you is that

they haven't caught me yet.

I said, they caught you, but they haven't caught me yet.

So you.

And it's true because at any given time it, it could just take one, one

traumatic event, one, one issue to that, that could label us mentally ill,

that requires psychiatric detention.

So yeah, I'm just trying to let them know I'm no different.

It's just that yeah, I'm privileged to be in the job.

I'm trying to help.

And yeah, that, that's the conversation that we have.

And I love, cuz I do workshops and I raise awareness.

I do lots of talks around this in terms of raising mental health awareness.

Cuz although we talk about it, we see Prince Harry, we see all the advocates.

You, you won't believe Rabiah how, how ignorant to it people still are.

So.

Oh yeah.

I mean, I was on a call at work the other day and this guy says well, I'm gonna

go get a rope, and then he goes, . "Oh, I hope no one knows what I meant by that."

And I'm like, well, we do.

And I said, just leave a note, I guess like I kind of got back at him

on it cuz he's like, oh, you know, he's one of those you can't say

anything about offending people, guys.

And I'm like, you can, but it's like what?

I mean, think about what you're saying on a work call like that

you're gonna what hang yourself?

Like, okay, but is that funny?

Probably not.

Like at some point, you know, like when you stop and I think when people

stop and say, "oh, I can't say anything anymore", and then they say the thing,

they've already had the thought process that makes them know they shouldn't

say it, and then they still say it.

I'm like, yeah, buddy, you know, maybe don't, because maybe people have dealt

with things on this call that you, you know, you're not at a comedy club, like

we're at comedy clubs, we can say what we want on stage, I feel like, but like when

you're working in a corporate environment, like chill out, you know what I mean?

And maybe have an understanding of what other people are going through.

I don't know.

It's kind of weird.

Yeah, I agree.

And they say that they put, they put that disclaimer out there because like

they know that actually what you're saying is potentially offensive.

And, and you, you know, like you said, they've had the thought process.

But you think that by saying that as a disclaimer, that that

covers you and, and it doesn't.

So, like you say, think about what you're saying.

Why, why would you say that to someone?

You know?

Yeah.

And it was like over that like.

Maybe get help if you're that upset over something silly, you know, . But but

yeah, I think that there's different understandings that people have of

things and I think, yeah, people like you speaking about it and educating

helps the people who are suffering from different mental illness, but also maybe

makes people aware in a positive way.

Cuz my reaction was definitely not positive.

It was just like, well, I'm gonna hit you back, you know?

So looking at your work now, and you know, you mentioned you're a coach.

So first of all, how did you decide to move out of social work?

I am still registered and still practice as a social worker

at times, but it's, it's for the long term, you know, like you Rav, you know,

sometimes you have these epiphanies and you, you think, you know, one day,

cuz effectively some of our social workers are glorified secretaries.

We, we don't get to do the empowering stuff like back

in the day like we want to.

So sometimes we're, we're, cause of all that red tape we're filling

in so many assessments reports and, and lots of administrative things,

which is fine, but, but that's not really what we're, we're here do.

So, you know, sitting on a rainy Monday morning looking out the window, and I

thought, and not in a conceited way, but I thought, no, I'm not built for this.

There's more to me than filling out these forms.

I'm far too creative to be doing that.

So I went on a course and I had coaching myself, and it, it really...

the transformative nature of it really spoke to me.

So I thought, lemme, and someone, again, it's always, you know, how life

brings you people and some, some might call it divine intervention, whatever

you wanna call it, but I meet these people who, who see things in me.

They'll suggest them.

And then I'll do them.

So another lady came up to me and said, oh, you'd be a really good coach.

And I didn't even know.

I was like, what the hell is a coach?

What?

What you mean?

Coach athletes?

What?

What's that?

So I did this course and I qualified in 2018 in transformational coaching.

And I use those skills cuz there's a lot of transferrable skills.

And I just really loved it.

And I do believe in the power of coaching, you know, which is

based on the premise that we all are the experts of our own lives.

You don't need anyone Rabiah to tell you what to do.

Ultimately, you know what to do.

However, because you're so busy and we often live life on autopilot, you

haven't had the chance to have that, that process, a guided, facilitated talk about

your, what you wanna do with your life.

How many times have people ask you, what do you really want in your life?

So, yeah, that's, what I love about it.

It, it spoke to me because it aligned with my own values and I just wanted

to give others the same experience.

So I am specifically a mental wellbeing coach and I, I work with

all mainly women cuz you know, men don't tend to come to me.

And that's what I love to do because it's more empowering than the social

work aspect because of, you know, you're working for the state and you have to

follow certain guidelines and you, you don't have the freedom to explore with

the patients what their lives could be, how to reach your potential, you

know, in, especially in mental health, it's a case of, you know, have you had

your medication, have you done that?

You know, you're ticking boxes.

You have to meet target I, I wanna really sit and explore with somebody how they

can live their lives authentically, because that's what's important to me.

That makes a lot of sense.

And the parallels are, are pretty clear the way you've laid them

out and you're still doing some of the social work part-time.

But yeah, if you're not able, it's kind of like you have to be well and you have to

be doing something that motivates you in order to fully give to other people too.

There's a big aspect of that that I think care carers and people who provide

services like this, they, they don't always get to recognize in themselves.

Yeah.

So one thing that, just the thread and you pointed it out, but I want to go

back to it for a moment because you had people point out to you things that you

might be good at and you pursued them, and that's a certain quality not everyone has.

Cuz I think you have to be ready to do that in some way or ready for that

feedback and I think someone else listening, and I've certainly been

in that situation before and a lot of my jobs, professional jobs, have

been because I said yes to something I wasn't necessarily sure about

or didn't even realize I could do.

And then in my personal pursuits, different opportunities

have come that way too.

But what do you think it is maybe about you that made you take the advice

take that guidance and move forward with it rather than push it off.

And did you come across times where you realized you didn't take the advice or

take the encouragement to do something and see that later maybe you should have

Well, it's simply because I'm a star, Rabiah or no No.

You know what, I don't take every bit of advice, but, cause you know, I believe

not everyone should speak into your life.

Not everybody is qualified to do that.

But along the way when you, no, you know, when you, you don't feel like you have

a sense of purpose and you're not quite sure you have an idea what you're good

at and you, and you try and pursue those things, but cuz these people have been

strangers often that have said, oh, and I, yeah, part of me must have believe.

I had the ability in the first place, but I'd never received the encouragement,

so therefore, I was curious and yeah, I mean, I could have just ignored it.

People have said all sorts of things.

I've been told, you're in the wrong profession.

You, you, you know, you need to be doing something else.

You should be a lawyer.

You should be yeah, it, I suppose it depends who I'm receiving that, that from.

If I, if I thought they had my best interests at heart.

But I was curious and I thought, well, let me see about this.

If it doesn't work out.

I'm always curious.

And, and, and, you know, I always like to know.

I always like to know.

So.

I, I believed I must have partially believed it, Rabiah in the first place.

Otherwise, if I thought I could never do it, I would've dismissed what they said.

Yeah, and I guess it's that what you had said too about like

you're the expert on your life, so there must have been something that

you knew about yourself already.

That's a good,

Yeah, I, I just wanted to explore it because when people, you

know, you see signs, life gives you signs.

People, even from when I was a little girl, people would often burden me

sometimes with their issue, adults with when I was a little girl.

But still, it happens to them.

I'm thinking, why is that?

People come to me, tell you, don't know me.

You're telling me your whole life story.

Even on the, on, on the tube.

You know, in London, people don't talk to each other.

My friends growing up.

They, they even, even now say, you attract all the weirdos, . Why

do you attract all the weirdos?

I could be on holiday.

I was in where was, I was on a Greek island somewhere and

this elderly lady for an hour.

Now you might think, why did you give her an hour of your time?

But I, I quite enjoyed it.

They just come to me and tell me and look for, not that I have the

solutions, but they just, obviously I must make them feel at ease.

So that's what people do.

So I thought there's something in this.

Well, yeah.

I mean, even think about it, just when we've been at gigs together, we have

real conversations that aren't the same as like some of the ones where it's

like, oh, where you've been gigging, oh, I hate bringers, blah, blah, blah.

That's it.

And we've.

You know, so yeah, I can see that happening to you.

And it happens to me and it's, it's a weird thing, you know?

It is.

And actually, yeah, my, I was home recently and I

had probably mentioned on another episode, just cuz it was so recent,

but I was talking to people, like at the grocery store and stuff.

Oh, I was talking to Rich Wilson, the comedian, rich Wilson.

But yeah, my mom was like, oh God, she's talking to someone again, you know?

And I'm like,

Yeah.

You can't help it.

But, it happens.

There are a lot of like conditions around what you can and can't do in the social

work, cuz it's very formal with, you know, being regulated in a very specific way but

do you see any similarities between the work you're doing there and in coaching

or is it for you just like a completely different approach at this point.

they're, they're similar and that's why they're

similar, but yeah, different.

That's why the transition was easier for me because this, you know,

in your caring capacity, you are.

You, you with, with your patients or your clients?

You, you, you have to assess them.

I'm constantly assessing.

Listen, even when I go on a first date Rabiah, I'm constantly assessing people.

I'm like, Hmm, are you gonna get through to the next round?

But yeah, no, you assess them.

You, you are gathering information.

You're listening to them and then prescribing a course of treatment

or, or suggesting some lifestyle choice or whatever you're doing.

So it's similar.

I remember drawing on my, my social work degree.

You know, they taught us counseling skills because we're not counselors,

no, but we use counseling skills.

All of those things that require empathy, that require you to actively listen,

which I thought everybody had, but uh, actually it's a skill because it yeah.

It's, it's not, it's not easy.

And that's why some people cannot talk to their family.

I've had coaching, I've had therapy, and you know, our families do not

listen in the same way because they know you, that they, and

they can't be impartial sometimes.

So that is why you will go and see a coach or a therapist or a mentor

because you need help with a specific thing, and they have been through that

thing or they have the credentials.

So yeah, there, there is a lot of transferrable skills within it.

I just find coaching more empowering and more liberating and it can produce

those results more quickly than, than we would in other types of methods.

That's great.

And as far as, like you've said, you've seen a therapist and you've

seen coaches, so you've done both.

What do you think is the difference and when a person is thinking about seeing a

coach or seeing a therapist, when should they choose a therapist versus a coach.

And, and I've had clients like this who, who I've had to refer.

I'm like, nah.

And some people, I'm like, no, you need to, you need to see a priest.

I had one woman come to me, Rabiah for an exorcism.

I'm like, what do I do?

I look like you think I'm a priest?

Yeah.

She's like, yeah, but you can heal me.

no, you're

Right.

You know

the Demon.

I was like, no, I don't, I'm, I'm not a

healer in, in that capacity.

No love.

So, the difference that I found in having been on both sides of the

table, coaching is future focused.

And that's what I love about it.

If you need to delve into, you've got some childhood trauma, you've got

all of that and it's preventing you from moving, then you, yeah, you need

to see your therapist most likely.

Or a, a psychotherapist specifically.

Depends on the nature of your, your trauma and what's going on for you.

If you, for example, there are different types of coaches.

I, I had a business coach, I had life coaches, health co...,

depending on what the thing is.

But if you want results like you've got some goals and you need some

help just to move from A to B, then you would most likely see a coach.

And there's nothing wrong.

You might have both.

It might be that your, your trauma that you're experiencing and gives

you all those limiting beliefs so you wanna work with a coach for that.

But you have to know the difference.

So clearly, if you have an acute mental illness, if you are still trying to get

over some, you know, you, for example, you've been a, a veteran in the war,

then yeah, you, you wouldn't necessarily see a coach cause you need to address

the root cause of whatever it is.

And you can have both.

I've had both sometimes.

So again, it's, it's a bit compartmentalized, but

depending on what the issue is.

So, like I said, I had a business coach.

I had a life coach.

I wanted to improve my relationships.

But I also had some trauma from the past that I knew the coach was not

necessarily equipped to deal with.

And just another thing that I'll point out is that, some people

assume, you know, some therapists can be coaches as well and vice versa.

So this thing about, we're not just one thing, cuz often people

are like, oh, but how do you know?

They'll say to me.

And, and they'll assume that, that I, I haven't got the background.

I've worked in mental health for 15 years.

I've, I've qualified, yes, I've got, I've got two degrees, I've got various, but

they assume that because these days a lot of people just call themselves coaches.

And I get that there are a lot of people, it's like, you tomorrow, Rabiah could

say, well, I'm gonna help someone.

You could call yourself a coach.

But I would say to anybody who's not sure and your choosing, that's why

you have a consultation with them.

It's like dating.

You've gotta be able to choose, does this person really understand what I'm saying?

Are they, do they know what they're talking about?

You'll, you'll be able to see that.

And then you choose them because you, you're choosing them based on the.

That they can get for you?

What are they offering?

You know, it's like, it's like a salesman.

You, you only buy, don't you?

If they, if they can meet the need.

So that, that's how, how you would choose and, and do your research.

Do your research.

Cuz it, like I say, it comes back to dating.

Not you, you don't like marry the first guy you see, do you?

You know, you, you might go on few dates, you, you check them out,

do a bit of research, , and then you think, okay, this one's right

for me because yeah, they, they.

Or whatever.

Yeah, and that's a good point.

I think that it's okay to meet the person and decide they're not the

right person for you to talk to, whether it's a therapist or a coach.

And I think with therapy too, people are in a vulnerable state a lot of the time.

They, a lot of the time, give a therapy, not when they're in their high, but

they're, they go when they're in their low or when they're just a time of difficulty

that's very vulnerable, but it's like, don't, you don't need to make it worse

by then talking to someone about it who's not the right person, whether that's a

friend or a partner, or a therapist, or a

Exactly, exactly.

Choosing the right support is vital because, and again, the credentials don't

really mean anything because, just because someone, when, when I had I've had some

awful therapists and so, and I'm thinking, and they lacked empathy and I'm thinking,

Okay, you've been in this for, for 30 years, but you, you're like a robot.

How can you be so cold?

or they, they just didn't understand or they didn't specialize in

the specific trauma that I had.

So they were very generic in their approach and I didn't

feel heard or understood.

And, and of course, as you know, you know, if, if, if you, if a person doesn't have.

Assurance that they are being heard and understood it, it delays the

recovery process and further affirms those negative beliefs that you

might have about yourself that, oh my gosh, I'm just not good enough.

Nobody understands and oh my God, you know, all of that.

So you need to feel safe.

You need to, you need to be in that safe space and, and just not everyone gets it.

You know, just like some doctors, some gps will have an awful bedside manner.

They're great.

They might be great in other aspects, but they dunno how to deal with people.

So, yeah.

Yeah, a hundred percent.

So then looking at that, I mean the, the career path you've chosen of service can

lead to a lot of emotional, like tax on you and stuff, but then you, you're also

doing comedy, which is a different kind of emotional tax I'd say, but is comedy

the first outlet you've had to get like move out of just doing the social work and

the coaching, or were you doing some kind of art form before you got into comedy?

Comedy is only recent in the last five years, Rabiah, but m y first

degree was in performance arts, actually.

And I used to think I was gonna be in FAME , I'd go with my leotard, my leg warmers.

I thought, yes, I'm waiting to be discovered.

And you know, the reality hit.

I had one professional job and then the agency didn't call me anymore.

And so I had to get, you know, had bills to pay and all that had to retrain.

But yeah, the out in terms of outlet, I always loved to be on the

stage no matter what I was doing.

Love to be on the stage.

And I had, I put that dream to bed, but it never really died.

So yeah, it's through different mediums.

So, you know, I, I like the karaoke.

I, I like to sing.

So if anybody asks me to do something, I'm the first one there.

And comedy provided that.

In fact, comedy's therapy to me.

I do believe laughter is one of the best medicines so it allowed me to laugh at

myself and I, and I don't take myself too seriously, so I, I took it and I, I put

it out there and people laugh at my life.

So there you go.

Yeah.

And it is your life.

I mean, you talk about personal experiences a bit and has doing

comedy kind of changed the way you reflect on things, the way you process

things, versus maybe before when you didn't have that as an outlet?

Yeah, in a, in a way, it has I'm, because, you know, life

will give you the, the material.

The content that you use for your comedy, even for, even within

my coaching, even in business.

So, It's yeah, obviously when you're going through some

stuff it's, it's not pleasant.

But looking at the absurdity of life sometimes helps, you know,

when you're reflecting, you're thinking, ah, that was crazy at

the time, but , how crazy was that?

And, and, you know, you can, you can glean some, some humor in the absolute

grotesque thing that you went through.

But, but I think it's important to do that from a place of, of your, your

scars, you know, rather than your wounds.

Cause you know, if you're still going through some stuff, it might not be

helpful to further injure yourself by, by talking about something or, you know,

joking about something that is not...

it just depends.

But for me, yeah, so I, I'm, when I'm joking about myself, it's from a place

of my scars and yeah, that happened then.

It was awful, but hahaha.

Look, look at me now that, that's, that's funny.

It's funny to me, some people will be like, oh my gosh, you

shouldn't joke about that.

That's, that's a private thing or, But I'm like, no, no.

I don't mind being vulnerable, although I am a private person.

And, and also it, it could help somebody else who's going through the same thing.

Yeah, that's the interesting thing, and I like how you

phrased it, that it has to be a scar, not the wound, because I don't know if

you've done that, but I've definitely said something on stage too soon and

I just didn't feel good saying it.

So I just kind of left it for a year and then come back

and then, oh, now it's funny.

Or other things were funny and then something happens and I'm

like, oh, that doesn't feel good anymore, so I have to wait.

You know?

So it's, it's true.

You have to kind of know when you're ready and, and the audience can can

Yeah.

I think.

Yeah, you, you, you don't wanna be that person up

there and they're looking at you like, oh my gosh, she's so damaged.

. Oh gosh.

Somebody call the therapist Like, yeah.

You know, you're, you're there drinking.

I, I have done, I have done it.

And that's how I know yeah.

Yeah, you have to be, ready.

I've, I've done it and I, you know, where you think, oh my

gosh, I shouldn't have said that.

And yeah, there's been times where I've gone to a gig and I've been, and,

and then I've had to come home and I, you know, be crying myself to sleep.

Like, oh my gosh, what were you thinking?

But you have to know yourself and, and there's, there's some safe material.

My go-to material that I, I can use in, in that.

But even talking about things like mental health, you know, when we're joking about

things like that, you, you have to be careful and what you say, your experience

might even be triggering to someone else.

But I don't think anyone could take that away from you if it's,

if it's your personal experience.

You know, as long as you're not too offensive with it, then

Yeah.

I feel like there's a big difference between talking about your experience

with something and talking about it just about people in general.

And so if, if like I'm whatever, I don't need to talk too much about

what I am or I'm not, but like say I just talk about depression,

I don't mind talking about that.

It's mine.

I can talk about it.

But if I start saying, oh, depressed people, like look at what they do,

they're blah, blah, blah, versus like, when I'm depressed, this

is the ridiculous thing I did.

There's

Yeah, quite right.

right.

Yeah, so I'm definitely, Maz, looking forward to like gigging together again

cause I think it's always fun when we get to see what each other's working on

and and just, I don't know, hear those parts of our lives in a different way.

But one thing I do like to ask everyone is, do you have any advice or mantra that

you'd like to share with the audience?

Oh, we'd be here all day.

Rabiah . I don't, I don't like to advise people per se, but it's, it comes back

actually to what I, I said before.

It's the one that I live by is, it is better to know than to wonder.

And I use that and encourage others to use that in regards to if you're

trying something new, you're not sure, you know, it's just like you, when

when you, when you were moving from the States to the UK, you, you didn't

know what life was gonna be like.

But now you do . Now you know, it's, it's grim and it's it's

like, what was you thinking?

But no.

With whatever we do yeah.

I just think whenever we're transitioning into a new chapter of our lives,

just the fear will always be there.

But I, I think just, just know, don't have that regret of thinking,

oh, if only I would've done this, or I wonder what I could have become.

No, you can find out.

You, you can find out.

Even if you don't have the means, take the first step and the rest will follow.

That's what I've found anyway.

So try it.

Try it.

If it doesn't, if it doesn't work out, then you'll know, won't you?

But you've tried so.

Oh, that's great.

All right.

And now I have the Fun Five.

It's just the last set of questions that I ask.

So what is the oldest T-shirt you have

Oh gosh,

wear?

Now I had a few.

Do you know, I just recently had a, a clear out and I gave some things to

charity, but it's an old NHS, don't tell them I didn't steal it, but it's

a, it's a orange t-shirt and it was the 2012, was it roundabout the Olympics?

Something happened in 2012 where we were singing it, and

it's an old orange T-shirt.

It's faded.

And it has a NHS logo, and I remember I wore it for a festival

to promote the NHS and all of that.

And I don't work for that particular trust anymore, so I just, I sleep in it.

I just, it's a, it's a nighty for me now.

Nice.

That's cool.

All right, so if everybody.

A Groundhogs Day like people felt during the pandemic.

Earlier I we're still in the pandemic really, I guess, but like in the

part where we were locked down, it felt like every day was the same.

What song would you have your alarm clock set to play every morning?

Oh well, probably it would be, Optimistic by the Sounds of Blackness.

Just simply because that is, I am, I am still play it now to work out.

It's uplifting.

It's uplifting.

The lyrics, speak to my soul.

And so I wouldn't mind listening to that if I had to every, every day, you know?

Awesome.

That's good.

That's a good, it's good to get the motivating one.

Sometimes people pick a sad song and I'm like, oh so , so coffee or tea or neither.

Yeah, neither.

I, I don't actually, well, I, I drink mint tea, but tea in the sense that

you mean, and that just is because of, probabaly years of indoctrination . I,

I, I was never a Mormon but a family member used to take me to the Mormon

church and, you know, it was forbidden.

So it's funny how things still stay with you.

Yeah, I'm, I'm not a Mormon by any means.

Listen, I, I, I do all kinds, I put all kind of toxins in my body, but

for some reason the coffee , yeah, the coffee and the tea are just, you know,

you get used to not having something.

So for years I've just not drank tea or coffee.

Yeah, I mean if you don't need the caffeine, don't,

don't make yourself need it.

That's for sure.

. Yeah.

So can, can you think of something that makes you like just crack up

or something, like a time where you laughed so hard, you cried, and just

what, what that was that you can share?

Oh, that I can share.

My life.

When I reflect on my, the whole thing's a joke.

I laugh till I cry and I'm like, oh, you're so sad.

No, I mean, Do you know what I think I'm very, I, yeah, might need to talk

to my therapist about this, but I very, it takes a lot to excite me.

It takes a lot, even when I'm watching comedy, you know, you laugh and

you're like, oh, that was funny.

But barely laughing.

It's been a while.

I guess it might be if I watch some something like a Richard

Pryor or something, some, some kind of some kind of film.

You know, I used to like watching like Whoopi Goldberg and she's, you know,

she was quite funny back in the day.

But oh, I, I can't look.

But any, any, any watching anything with humor in it.

Well, I shouldn't say anything because not everything makes me a laugh.

But if it resonates with me, if I go out to watch a comedy show,

for example, or I see something on the TV, even if it's really sick.

I shouldn't say that, but I'm like, oh, that's so sick that it's, it's funny.

It's like that, that's wrong, but that's, that's funny in the,

in the context that you said it.

So Yeah.

It, it might even be something silly like, you know, my, my, my daughter

shouldn't even let her watch it, but, you know, even like things like.

The Simpsons or The Family Guy, you know, they're that kinda, yeah it's silly.

It's that that sometimes I'm like, oh my gosh, and sometimes I catch myself.

I'm Why you laughing at that?

That's not right, but

yeah,

Yeah.

But that's fun.

I think it's fun when it kind of shocks you and you just laugh and

you're like, oh, I did not expect, if I saw that on paper, that

would not have been my reaction.

But I did

laugh and I surprised myself by that.

Yeah.

Cool.

And the last one, who inspires you right now?

Oh, what you mean other than you?

Oh, come on,

this is a tricky one because there, there is a culmination of,

like I say there isn't one person, I mean, obviously you'd like to be able to say,

you know, all the, the greats, you know, like, well, no, actually, mother Teresa

and those kind of people, they don't.

But more recently I've been, you know, I'm, I'm not a fan of influencers

or anything per se, but I have been li listened to more uplifting stuff.

So, podcasts and YouTube and various things.

And there's a few people that, that perhaps nobody would know them, but

they've been inspirational in the fact that they've caused me to take action.

So you've got people like on YouTube who talk a lot about finances

Myron Golden and people like that.

They're not motivational speakers, but they, what they say resonates

and they present the information in a new way that I haven't heard before.

So it's a culmination, I must say Rabiah of, I listened to several

people I probably listened to maybe, and it's on my, it's part of my goals

in terms of improving my own mindset.

So I listened to maybe four or five different people, unknown.

They're not, you know, they're not like Tony Robbins or these kind of people.

These are just people just living their dream and doing what they do.

And it, it really inspires me and I know it does because it, it takes a lot for

you to, for me to, to get my attention.

Because I have a very fast brain.

And so if you could hold my attention for an hour, you're doing well.

And I just apply those things.

Yeah.

I'm not, I wasn't a reader, but I've, I've been reading more, I've been doing

so much in terms of self-improvement.

So yeah, those are the people that do what they say they're gonna do,

that they're about their business.

And they've come from humble beginnings like me and they're just

doing their thing and I'm like, yeah, there's hope for us all.

So, yeah.

Yeah, that's great.

Yeah, and I mean, there is a lot of content out there, and then it's

a matter of finding what resonates with you, so that's perfect.

. So if people wanna find you, wanna know about you, maybe they wanna connect with

you for coaching or they just want to know about your comedy or whatever, where

do you want people to go to find you?

Well, there, there are various places, but I'm so LinkedIn you

can find me as Maz Alexander on there.

There on Instagram, if you, if you, even if you just type into Google "Maz

transformational coaching", you're gonna find me on Instagram and on other sites.

But, but feel, feel free to connect with me even if you just put

my name in, I'll, I'll come up.

There's lots of, lots of things and forms where I appear, so yes.

Awesome.

Well, this has been a lot of fun.

I'm really glad we got to connect this way.

So thank you so much for being on More Than

Work.

Thank you for having me.

I really appreciate you know, you having me here and, and having the

voice heard, cuz that's the thing.

I believe everybody has a voice and we should all be heard so, thank you.

Thanks for listening.

You can learn more about the guest and what was talked about in the show notes.

Joe Maffia created the music you're listening to.

You can find him on Spotify at Joe M A F F I A.

Rob Metke does all the design for which I'm so grateful.

You can find him online by searching Rob M E T K E.

Please leave a review if you like the show and get in touch if you

have feedback or guest ideas.

The pod is on all the social channels at at More Than Work pod

(@morethanworkpod) or at Rabiah Comedy (@rabiahcomedy) on TikTok.

And the website is more than work pod dot com (morethanworkpod.com).

While being kind to others, don't forget to be kind to yourself.