In this episode of the Charge Forward Coaching Podcast, host James Blasco sits down with veteran sports journalist Ken Willis, whose decades-long career includes writing for USA Today, Yahoo Sports, Golfweek, and the Daytona Beach News-Journal. With a front-row seat to some of the most intense moments in sports, Ken offers a rare perspective on mental toughness—not just from the athletes who live it, but from the journalists who chronicle it.

Together, James and Ken explore how resilience, focus, and emotional control show up in high-pressure environments, and how the media’s lens can shape public perception of athletes. Whether you're a parent, coach, or competitor, this episode offers powerful insights into the mindset behind the headlines.

Key Timestamps:

(00:00) Introduction to Mental Toughness

(05:55) The Role of Genetics in Mental Toughness

(09:44) Understanding Athlete Interviews

(13:55) The Pressure of Performance in Sports

(20:02) The Impact of Social Media on Young Athletes

(23:43) The Joy of Being Around Athletes

(27:49) The Most Mentally Tough Athletes

(33:54) Conclusion and Final Thoughts

Key Takeaways:

Ken Willis’s journey from a young sports enthusiast to a nationally respected journalist.

The role of mental toughness in both sports and journalism.

Behind-the-scenes stories of athletes navigating pressure, performance, and public scrutiny.

The evolving impact of social media on young athletes’ mental health and identity.

How storytelling can elevate or challenge an athlete’s legacy.

The intersection of journalism, truth, and empathy in covering sports.

Resources & Links:   

Take the MTQ Plus Mental Toughness Assessment: https://chargeforwardcoaching.com/mtq-assessments    

Learn more or book a free discovery call: www.chargeforwardcoaching.com

Follow on Instagram: @chargeforwardcoaching     

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/chargeforwardcoaching/    

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/ChargeForwardCoaching/   

Subscribe on YouTube, Spotify,

Apple Podcasts, and all major podcast platforms

YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@ChargeForwardCoaching    

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Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/ChargeForwardCoaching

Host Bio:

James Blasco is the founder of Charge Forward Coaching and a certified mental toughness coach and a certified neuroscience coach. He specializes in helping athletes and high performers sharpen their focus, build confidence, and stay composed under pressure. With clients ranging from youth athletes to seasoned pros, James is passionate about helping people show up strong—no matter the arena.

Guest Bio:

Ken Willis is a veteran sports journalist whose career spans more than three decades covering everything from local high school standouts to national championship moments. Based in Florida, Ken has written for major outlets including USA Today, Yahoo Sports, Golfweek, and the Daytona Beach News-Journal, where he built a reputation for insightful storytelling, sharp analysis, and a deep understanding of the athlete’s journey.

Known for his ability to capture the emotional and mental layers of competition, Ken has chronicled the triumphs and challenges of athletes across sports—from golf and motorsports to football and baseball. His work reflects not just the stats and scores, but the mindset, grit, and resilience that define elite performance.

Ken brings a rare perspective to the conversation around mental toughness—one shaped by decades of observing athletes under pressure and telling their stories with empathy and precision.

#MentalToughness, #SportsJournalism, #KenWillis, #ChargeForwardCoaching, #AthleteMindset, #YouthSports, #Golfweek, #USATodaySports, #YahooSports, #JamesBlasco #MentalPerformance, #MentalToughness, #SportsJournalism, #KenWillis, #ChargeForwardCoaching, #AthleteMindset, #YouthSports, #MindsetMatters, #ResilientAthletes, #PeakPerformance, #MentalGame, #ConfidenceUnderPressure, #PerformancePsychology, #SportsMedia, #StorytellingInSports, #BehindTheScenesSports, #VeteranSportsWriter, #SportsReporting, #InsideTheGame, #SportsInsights #AthleteStories #ChargeForwardPodcast,#ChargeForwardMindset, #JamesBlascoPodcast, #CoachingConversations, #LeadershipThroughSport, #MindsetCoaching, #ChargeForwardCommunity #YouthAthleteDevelopment #CoachingYouthSports #AthleteLeadership #NextGenAthletes #HighSchoolSports #CollegeAthletes #AthleteSupport #GolfJournalism #GolfweekInsider #GolfMindset #YahooSportsCoverage #SportsAcrossAmerica #OrmondBeachPodcast #VolusiaCountySports #FloridaSportsMedia

They all seem to have this otherworldly physical gifts. They can do things physically that you just, if you wouldn't do it, if you started training for it at two years old, you would never be able to do it. Most of us, nearly all of us. So all of them have that. So I guess what separates the best is all, know, it's got to be in here, you know, it's got to be a willingness and an ability to learn. Welcome to Charge Forward Coaching.

The podcast for committed athletes and individuals who want to achieve more on and off the field. Hosted by James Blasko, certified mental toughness and resilience coach. You'll gain insights and inspiration from elite athletes, coaches and others who know what it takes to excel. Are you ready to go to the next level? Then tune in, get inspired and let's charge forward. Now here's your host, James Blasco.

Hello and welcome to the Charge Forward Coaching Podcast. I'm your host, James Velasco. Thanks for joining in. Well, today we have a super interesting guest and a super interesting topic to cover. I'm all about mental toughness here. But you could already hear Ken Willis. Now, Ken has been a sports journalist for over 40 years. You've probably read his work everywhere.

I always like to point out, that I literally started as a teenager. So that helps my cause a little bit. That's right. When you're in grade school. Yeah. Ken has he works for the Daytona Beach News Journal, part of USA Today. So you see his work in USA Today, Golf Week, Yahoo Sports. He's been doing this for a long time. The thing with Ken is he has a great sense of humor, which you're about to find out. So, Ken, welcome to the podcast officially.

Thanks for the pressure, James. Good Lord. Yeah. that. No pressure. So we're going to talk a little bit about mental toughness and the perspective that you have as a journalist. But first, why don't you give us a little bit of your history and how you got started in the sports journalism world. It's a good question. It just happened. seems like I found a scrapbook that I did recently. found it when, you know,

Coincidentally happened to live down the street from Jack Billingham, who was a pitcher on those big red machine teams in the seventies, a great pitcher, all star pitcher, national league All-Star. And so I took it down. I took it down there to show him. And I said, you know, and he looked at me and said, you did this when you were how old? told him, and we both thought of the same thing. It's like you were going to do what you do and you knew it somehow just, you know, those like a one track and, I, and I've not physically.

I'm of manual labor. I'm physically capable. I'm not emotionally capable for physical labor. Thank God. Because honestly, I don't know that I've worked an honest day in my life. There's been no heavy lifting, nothing heavier than a laptop bag.

So that's it. That allows me to save energy to do some yard work and literally mend a fence out in the backyard every now and then. uh, so yeah, thank goodness for that. Cause, uh, I don't know. I've just always been steered to do what I was going to do. Never. And I started, I've started paper when I was a teenager, it worked part-time through four years of college. Back then we had, I don't know, it might still be the case. You had to have a four year degree.

to be hired, they had changed that in the last decade or so before I came along. And so the only reason I really went to school was to get the four year degree. So I made it as easy as possible. two years at the junior college here in Daytona, two years at UCF, largely commuting, but stayed a couple of nights a week. And I did it on the cheap and as quick as I could do it so I could start working full time instead of part time. though this is not thought to be a condemnation of higher education.

But I learned nothing about my job in college. Everything I learned about doing this job, I learned working there from the age of 18 or 19 on. So it was on the job training just like an 18-year-old would get if he went into the HVAC service or if he became a plumber or something, you learn as an apprentice, basically, even though we didn't have a formal apprenticeship. But that's it. And my family's from here. I've got a lot of family here. And I married locally twice.

So, so everybody's here. So there was never really a reason to live, leave. And so I didn't. And so I've, you know, and the Lord knows I haven't gone hungry. I won't say I haven't gone wanting at times, but I haven't gone hungry. So here we are and time flies. And before you know it, I'm sitting here all these years later doing a podcast of all things. Who would have sunk it? Yeah. I mean, well, your writing is on, I mean, somebody reads, you know, what you've put on

paper or online and there's always just a little bit of joy with it. Paper. There's still newspapers out there. are. They're out there. So I so our podcast is is all about mental toughness and a lot of people are probably wondering why would you have a sports journal? It's on. Here's here's why. Some good questions. Yeah, it is a good question. But outside of coaches and teammates and trainers and the next set of people that are closest to these athletes.

Our journalists, you guys are around them every day. When I worked media relations for the Denver Broncos every day, the beat writers who were there, they knew the players inside and out, both professionally and personally. So from a mental toughness perspective, you guys kind of take what they do on the field, on the course, and then you kind of translate it into your writings that explain everything to the rest of us out there, the sports fans. And what I'm interested in, and we'll start with this.

You've been around so many different athletes. Is there a common thread between those athletes that you would say are mentally tough versus athletes that you would say aren't mentally tough? Is there anything that you could say that, yeah, that's kind of a, you know, a distinctive element to that person? The longer I live, the more I'm convinced that it's more genetic than learned. Some guys are wired a certain way.

And some are. We've been watching recently the wide receiver documentary on Netflix, I believe it is. It might be HBO. It's saying people that do the hard knock stuff and whatever. They did the one on quarterbacks. It's Peyton Manning produced it. And with Mahomes and a couple of other guys. And we were watching one of the episodes last night on the wide receivers and they show these guys getting in the cold tub, you know, doing different exercises. And I looked at my wife and I said,

I am a human being. He is a human being. How can we look so different with our shirts off? It doesn't even look human. I mean, it is beyond washboard. I mean, I look at the apps, I'm the same species and you would never believe it. So, and all of them, you see all of them, they're all like that. At least the wide receivers. Now the interior linemen, look, instead of a wash. Maybe not a wash. Yeah, they're like me. It's not a washboard stomach, it's a wash tub stomach.

They, but they all seem to have this other wordly physical gifts. They can do things physically that you just, you wouldn't do it if you started training for it at two years old, you would never be able to do it. Most of us, nearly all of us. So all of them have that. So I guess what separates the best is all, know, it's gotta be in here, you know, it's gotta be a willingness and an ability to learn.

Cause they all got to study playbooks and every sport you got to study something about yourself, about your opponents, be it on a tablet, be in a book form or whatever. So they got to have that ability, but they also all, got to have, they always talk about short memories. You got to have the ability to put a failure behind you. And that's why you see the guy who, I can remember watching Larry Bird of all people miss five or six shots in a row.

But guess what? When he's open and has a chance on the seventh time, guess what he's going to do is shoot. Cause he knows, he knows the laws of averages and they got to have that ability to, to put failure behind them. And it stands to reason that a lot of them don't. And they don't, we don't usually see or read a lot of stories about those who don't. We've celebrate those who do and become big stars, but rarely do you go back and at least not that I've seen find a guy who had the potential, but didn't quite work out.

That'd be a great thing to really get insight on and say, you know, if he was able to really open up and be honest, you wonder just what was it that you didn't have because you had all the physical tools of this guy. What was it that you were lacking that didn't allow you to stay in the league for more than a couple of years or, or, or be better than you were to, you know, not, to underperform by your standards. That's interesting. And I think it all, I think it's, it's obviously all between all between the

ears here and my earbuds want to keep popping out. But, uh, and I think it's intellectual. think it's emotional. I think it's just, you know, the ability to the confidence. There's word, I think I was looking for confidence to keep going and keep digging when, know, you might've hit a water pipe yesterday. Yeah. I'm shy, but no, by God, you're going to keep digging because you know how to dig and you know that eventually it's going to work out.

Yeah. And I don't know how to, I guess that's a long way to go to say, I don't know how to explain it, but that's, I think it's all, you know, there's a mental toughness involved in all of it. And I'm sure I'm not the first person who's said that to you about this. Yeah, no. Well, you actually hit on several, several elements of what I talk about all the time. And that's the four C's of mental toughness, commitment, challenge, confidence, and control. And confidence, like you just brought up is massive. Might be the most important one out of those.

And we'll talk a little bit about emotional control in a second. You know, lots of times when fans finally get to hear from the athletes, it's after a performance and it's somebody like you asking them questions. And I'm always fascinated by their responses. If something worked out well, how they handled it. And if their day wasn't so great, how they're handling that conversation. How do you approach that after, you know, a game or a match or a race?

How do you approach those folks, especially those who maybe it wasn't a great day for them? It's hard because they're in a situation where they want to get our time with them. They want to get it over with because they've got other things to do. They got other people to meet, family, friends, whatever, maybe a shower to take, get dressed, go on to the next circus. So they, that's why so many of the interviews that you see on TV and the stuff you read in online and in print.

That's why it all reads largely the same. You rarely get really good in depth stuff and that's the stuff that you're not going to get, I don't think immediately after an event. You got to get that the days between maybe when there's not a crowd of eight or 10 or 12 other reporters around. Then you can get into the thoughts of, go beyond just what pitch did you hit?

What was the route that you ran? What was the call on that play? Was that play designed to be that way or was to get beyond that and then to get deeper? You can't do it. I don't think right after game because everything, you know, the there's still some adrenaline flowing, I think. And and it's it's cliche to the point that they, you know, it's there are endless jokes and people who imitate and make fun of the.

the stock answers that are given after, after events, you know, so I got to thank my teammates. Yeah. I couldn't do without my teammates. yeah, I was just one day at a time, one play at a time, one shot at a time. And I think a lot of it's defensive. don't think they want to look vulnerable in any way. I don't think you're going to really be good to get a golfer to almost hypnotize a, a, a Scotty Scheffler even, or Rory and hypnotize him and get them to totally be honest about what they were feeling.

I mean, even the very best in the world, what we were feeling when they were looking at this difficult shot, the element of fear because there's water on the left or a big bunker behind the green or it slopes from back to front. So you don't want to go long. You don't want to go left because there's water. They focus on deposit where they're going to hit the ball. They talk where they're caddy, where they're going to hit the ball and they don't bring in the negatives, but it's impossible to keep it. I mean, they're lurking and they're somewhere. that's what it's.

fun at times, if ever given the opportunity when that rare opportunity comes to talk to them about how do you, you know, that's going to pop up. The wonder is going to pop up in your brain. You see it. How do you suppress it? How do you put it away? And I think that's part of it too, specifically with golf in the sense that the very best ones are able to, they know what's there. I mean, you can't ignore it, but they're able to focus on where they want the ball to go instead of where the

They don't want the ball to go. And at the highest levels, guys just succumb to that. always, I'm going to roll on here. I want to keep rambling. Yeah. But when I talked to younger people who were, came up during the tiger woods era, and then now you got the guys who were in the Scotty Sheffield era. I said, you know, Scotty's more like Nicholas than tiger was. Tiger was more explosive and just overwhelmed everybody. When they went to major championships, I always compared it with Jack.

from watching him when I was a kid and then reading about him, reading about part of his career that happened before I was old enough to pay attention. And I liken it to like a log roller. You know, he would go to these major championships and he's on a log with, you know, a hundred other guys, whatever. And he's just rolling on that log and half a dozen fall off, half a dozen over here, it doesn't fall off. And by the end of when Sunday rolls around, it's just him and a few other guys still on their log rolling.

And then eventually over the course of the day, one by one, they fall off and he's the last guy up because he knew the patience and he obviously had the skill and he was a great athlete. A lot of people forget about how good of a natural athlete he was when he was young. But he had the mental toughness to stay the course, so to speak, and just let the others. He always said that, you know, when you went to a major championship, a third of the field is already done.

They've convinced themselves they can't play this golf course. They're out of the pitch. You don't have to worry about them. The other third aren't going to be playing well enough to survive. And then you get the third of the field that you got to kind of worry about. And then, you know, you just keep rolling that log and they'll fall off eventually. He had times where Trevino Watson, mainly Trevino Watson were the guys that would get in from time to time. They were good enough.

But by and large, nobody's ever been able to stay on that log as long and as often as he was. So, I don't know if that makes any sense whatsoever, but I was rolling and cut the saw. No, no, I take you're right on it. And so for me, you know, one of the questions when I was waiting to have this conversation with you was, you, after all the years being around all these athletes in different situations and

those types of things are. Do you get a sense of when an athlete is truly confident, truly mentally tough and when it's just kind of a facade? I think we can all spot the facade. We can all spot that as clearing. You can see when a guy's. It seems obvious at times that he's trying to pump himself up, and I think they're trying to convince themselves that, you know, they're, you know, they're capable of doing this.

Or they're just doing it because they saw all the other guys doing it as come to thing to do. But Steph Curry can go up and down the court 15 times, 20 times over the course of the third and fourth quarter. And really doesn't look any different. And then, you know, you get late in fourth quarter and the game's on the line. It does seem to be, it's hard to explain what it is, but you do sort of, you don't necessarily see a difference in his persona or not just him, but other guys like him, but you know, it's feeling, you know, and it's just, there are a lot of cliches that describe it.

but I don't know if there's any purely accurate, really good way to describe it, but it's one of them things that you know it when you see it, you know? And you know it when you feel it. In this case, you can see these guys and they just seem to take charge. They seem to all of a sudden take over the moment. And I just like to watch some great relief pitchers, closers that have come in. know, Mariano Rivera, when he came in, I think he, it's almost like he knew.

And the batter knew and he knew that the batter knew, yeah, that this was a mismatch. You and you weren't going to, you weren't going to get the barrel of the bat on the ball. And, uh, and he just seemed to own the moment. And I don't know if that's because of something he was doing or because he was so good for so long that when he came in, we projected this onto him and guys like him that they're in charge. They're on the mound. They're in charge or he's under center. He's back in a shotgun position.

As late in the game, Mahomes is back there. They need a touchdown. You know what's going to happen. And you, don't think they're doing anything different than they were doing in the first quarter in the first inning, but we project onto them that they are, they have suddenly growed physically grown in stature and have taken on an air of importance and know that this is the time to get it done. And frankly, I think it's projection from us more so than it is anything they're doing, but you know, I don't know. haven't.

I haven't looked at it with a magnifying glass in a long time. Yeah, I think that's that's really true because you could experience the game match, whatever, with your own eyes. But then you're always the next day, whether it's the news journal USA Today or ESPN, whatever you're reading about it. And there might be a slightly different twist on what you saw. know, so to that point, have you ever written something and.

Maybe you called out a couple of athletes and they called you out afterwards saying, no, no, no, that's, that's not how I was handling that situation. Probably, but that's jumping to mind right now. what used to happen a lot was you would say, let's say you covered a, the Florida Georgia football game, for instance, in late October in Jacksonville and all the, columnists from all the Florida newspapers would be there covering. Cause that was a big event of that weekend or that Saturday anyway.

And you would do what you think afterwards. You would find an angle and you would write a column that you said, all right, this is, this is worthy of this event, this, this rivalry. And I summed it up pretty well. And I found an angle that I think is unique, you know? And, and then after the internet came around, you could scour around the next day and see what all the other guys, know, what this guy wrote in Teahupo, St. Pete, what the guy from Miami or, and, you'd see what they did and you go, man, I like that angle too.

I almost wish I'd done that. Oh, I didn't think about that. And then you got to put your money. Okay. Maybe they're looking up what I wrote, wishing they thought of the angle I came up with, but I don't know if they ever have. But that's about as far as that goes. But the only thing that always jumps out of my mind was when Matt Kenseth was going to, he was ahead and the old Winston cup championship and NASCAR halfway through the season, they come back to Daytona and he's got a comfortable points lead.

And I wrote about the fact that, you know, he would be in so many words that he would be the least exciting champion they've had in God knows how many years. And we referred to him from then on as mild Matt. And he always remembered that anytime that we were in a press conference situation together, he would bring up a few of the snarky lines that I used in that column. But that had nothing to do with his, what he did on the field. You know, that was just a personality thing that he

took mild to sense it. But no, I can't think of anything. But I'm sure that as soon as we're done here, I'll think of a few things. Yeah, just shoot me an email. We'll incorporate it in somehow. So we're talking a lot about professional athletes here. How about when it comes to high school, even college athletes, those young athletes that are in the limelight, so to speak?

They're in the newspaper, they're on TV now, things like that. I interviewed Jonathan Anderson, head coach of the Little League World Series team last year, and they're back in the World Series this year, which is awesome. But I asked him, I said, how did you get these kids, 12-year-old kids, playing in front of thousands of people in person and maybe millions on TV during the big games, how did you get them to just relax and play baseball? And he pointed out a few things, and one was making sure they were having fun out there.

What do you say to young athletes who might get some bad press or something doesn't go their way and it gets called out publicly and now they have to deal with it mentally? I don't know how often it gets called out publicly. There's always been a sort of a tradition in media that the younger the athlete or the lower on the run of some, you know, little league level to junior high school, college up to pro ranks.

The lower they are on that level, the more slack you cut them. don't go overboard with the mistakes. You might mention, so-and-so fumbled at the 12 yard line. That's probably about as far as you would go. I don't know. These days, these days in the anti-social media world, high school football player might have a bad game or he might fumble in a bad situation.

And he might not want to look at his phone for a while because there's probably going to be some people out there giving him a hard time. And that is probably much worse than anything that would encounter any kind of professional media standpoint. used to be, know, that's pro ranks, clubs are off. You you're getting paid to do this job and you failed to do this job. And, you know, we can point out that you have one hit in your last 38 at bats or, you know, three interceptions in last two weeks.

It's an old adage, but I guess it's true. They're paid to deal with that. That comes with the territory. And I guess these days, the college athletes at the bigger colleges. I going right there. was going to how does that change? Yeah, they got to perform now. Because now, everybody in that stadium knows that, know, so-and-so might have gotten 300 grand from the collective to side or to transfer here from Clemson or Virginia Tech or wherever.

And you you're making $300,000. You got to go out there and put forth a little more effort than you're putting or you got to, you got to be better if it's possible. If it's possible, just be better. Um, you can coach effort. It's almost hard to coach, you know, everything going well. Uh, so I don't know. don't know how that landscape has changed and I'm sure it's changed dramatically with, uh, not just what's happening in college athletes with the pay for play now, but at the lower levels, I'm sure social media is.

You know, I'm sure Monday at a local high school during football season, there are people walking around and say, Hey, did you? Yeah. I had probably goes both ways. I imagine the athletes themselves, probably get on their social media, anti-social media and spout off some things. And while upset from a poor performance or a loss, they probably get on there. Hey, there's probably been quite a few.

tweets deleted over on Saturday mornings after Friday night high school football games, I assume. And a lot that aren't deleted. I'm sure I couldn't, I couldn't imagine growing up and playing sports in the social media environment the way it is now. It would definitely be challenging. How about, what would you say is the best part of being around athletes, you know, almost every day and not just writing about them, but just, just.

being at the races and being at the game. What do you enjoy most about all those experiences? Well, I mentioned earlier, there's no heavy lifting. So that's a plus. You just want to be where there's action, you know, you want to be where there's a lot of people or either they're buying tickets or watching on TV and they care about it. You know, it's something they care about. And hopefully you can do something to add to that experience in some small way, you know.

They would point out something that happened and they read about it later online or in the paper or whatever. And then they read about it. I didn't, I didn't realize this. I didn't know that this happened. yeah, you just try to find a unique angle that others might not have. And, and you want to be, and you just want to be where the action is. went to Augusta 30 something years, sort of masters and the Thursday, the opening round of the masters area.

I just would almost have to pinch myself because I there's no place on earth I'd rather be right now. And not even as a working person, as a golf stand and to be, you know, been in a game seven of a world series and you're just watching another baseball game. This one happens. I have a full house. And then you realize that, you're in an auxiliary press box because main press box is full and the other two auxiliary press boxes are over there. You got this one and you you look around, there's just, you know, there's 500 people covering the game and you

You know, the day, the morning, the hours leading up to the start of the Daytona 500. And I've been to a couple of Indy 500s that that hour to leading up to the green flag is just, oh, it's just great. And of course it's all weather driven. If the weather's good, it's that much better. But yeah, you just, don't know. still, I've gotten jaded in certain respects, but thankfully I have it in a lot of respects. I still enjoy being where a lot of people.

And I enjoy being where big events are and sometimes smaller events. If there's you know, it could be a small time golf tournament around here, but there's a small pocket of people who are really invested in it and really, really interested in the outcome. You want to be around at events that people care about, you know, and and thank thank God there's still enough of them that I can keep chugging along. So speaking of Indy and Daytona and Augusta when I.

had a chance to speak to Mario Andretti. He said he broke 100 at Augusta. So I said that was probably one of your biggest achievements of all time, right? Breaking 100 at I got to play it years and years ago. When I first started covering it, the Masters, my first one was 86 and you know, year Jack Nicklaus won his sixth. So that was quite a thrill. I should have probably quit not ever covered anything again after that. But I realized

And my second or third year there that on the Monday after the tournament, they have like on Saturday, they have a lottery drawing. You put your name in a hat and they draw 20 print media and 20 broadcast media. And those 40 guys get to play the course on Monday with a bunch of other VIPs and whatnot. lot of CBS people and muckety mucks. And wow. So about fourth year I went, I took my clubs, entered the lottery and got picked. There's like 300 people in there and I was one of the 20 that got picked.

So I to play it and I shot 100 on the nose. And at that time I was, I don't think I had an established handicap at that time. I was playing a couple of days a week here in Teld and I was, if I had to guess, I was probably around an 11 or 12 handicap and I shot a hundred and would not have done that if I played well enough to shoot mid eighties at the local mutie that day. Just feeling the way I was hitting the ball.

And nothing great, but not bad. It would not have shot a hundred if we had not moved to send the tournament tees to the member tees on the back nine. That would not have happened. it was a little 54, 46 that had had 42, 42 putts, 42 putts, including a couple of four putts. So the greens are what really gets you there. So if Mario shot a hundred, I'm guessing he did it from the member tees.

But I didn't ask him. He just said I on during that. I don't know how much golf he has played and how good of a golfer he is. I've never thought about it, but never even knew he played golf until you told me. Yeah, don't think he does. From hearing him, all he did most of his life is race a car. Yes. Any kind of car. Anywhere all the time. did. That's what he did. So I'll get you out of here. One last question. Kind of a tough question, but I'm going to throw it at you anyway. Out of all the athletes you've been around, who

is the most mentally tough athlete you've ever been around. Now this includes watching them on television. Yes. I'm prone to stick with golfers because I just love... I've become more of a tennis fan in recent years. My wife likes to watch the majors and so I got into where, you know, watching those because three or two of them, the French and Wimbledon, are on early morning when you wake up. So you got two weeks of early morning and you can kind of watch it as you're

blending into your day and watching guys like Nadal and nowadays Center and of course Djokovic watching the mental toughness these guys when they get down a set or two and it's hot and they've got to come all the way back and tennis is one of them sports, know, Alcaraz of course. You see that, you can see the physical change, you can see the body language change. I've gotten away from golf here, I realize that.

You can see their body language. When a guy all of a sudden has all the momentum, can see that almost the instant that momentum changes and you see a little hop in the step on the guy who's now got it going in his favor and you can feel, you can sense it. You can see it. I love watching that. It's amazing. And plus, you know, there's nowhere to hide. You're out there. It's like golf. There's nowhere to hide. You can't pass it to a teammate. So, uh, there's been some guys, you know, I'm going to state the obvious from Jack the tiger and now Scotty.

It was the closest thing I've seen to Jack in terms of how he gets the job done. The mental toughness it takes to stand there neck and basically with nobody again, nobody to pass the ball to. All you have is your caddy to shoulder. Mike, it cried on might not. You might be able to blame the caddy too. If you think you picked the wrong club, but, but there have also been others. mean, I remember watching as a kid.

Watch a Raymond Floyd and Lanny Watkins boy when they when they got the bit in their mouth late on Sunday I mean they tensed up and they had a good way I mean they they were they were tense and coiled but in a good way so I'm prone to Lean toward the golfers because you can see them for one thing. They're not behind a helmet They're not running around you can really they often stand still like tennis players who stand still between boys So can look at their face and you can see

In golf, you can almost see a guy that's not one of the champs. He's one to be. And you can almost see him trying to find some moisture in his mouth. He's spitting cotton balls and just wondering what happened to all the oxygen. Where did all the oxygen go? And you can see it. mean, you can almost see them. You don't see the blood draining if you know what to look for. And it's really fun to watch guys in that situation and how they hurry up their routine. Their normal routine, they hurry up.

They go to the towel more to wipe off the grip of the club. They, you know, it's just tennis players, you know, if they're on the clay, you'll see they start banging their shoes more with the racket to get the clay off. Just nervous energy that they got to work off. And it's fun to look for that. I am not a practitioner, but I am fascinated by the human nature of watching uncontrolled and involuntary actions that people have when they're put in certain situations, just to watch how they react to it.

And I am for my mind golf. There's there's nothing better than golf because you don't have you can't you're not playing defense. A batter reacts to what the pitcher is going to throw. The pitcher is kind of reacting to what he thinks the batter wants. Football, they're reacting. You're reacting to the defense or the man you're playing against. Hockey, of course. But, you know, golf is strictly, strictly on your own and tennis is you and that other guy.

And the only thing that really comes close is in basketball with the guys at the foul line. You know, he's standing there pretty naked and he's got to make them. So that's about the closest thing I think you get in the team sports. But I'm just fascinated by watching, watching body language and watching people's faces when you can see their faces when the pressure is on. That happened a lot. mean, you you can go a couple of weeks without seeing an event that has that situation. I'm always I love watching it.

Yeah, I was always going to make a joke about bowling is similar to golf and that it's just you and the pins, you know, and you got to be better in your opponent. But I don't want to want this to devolve into a long string of bowling jokes. That's OK. But you're right. mean, you know, pressure is everywhere, but especially, you know, in golf and when you're out there, no sports, even bowling where you're by yourself. mean, that's that's all what mental toughness is about.

So hey, Ken, thank you so much for joining the podcast today. It's always a blast. Hopefully we can get back out on the course again sometime soon when we're not working and have some fun. Well, if you call that fun, I got the yip several years ago. if I can't look at a three foot pile without sweating bullets, that sucked a lot of the fun out of it. But anyway, if you're willing to give me every three footer.

We're on. Absolutely. Just bring your belly putter and we'll play in the grips. All right. right. All right. Well, for the rest of you out there, hey, remember, if you want to learn more about mental toughness, go to chargeforwardcoaching.com. You're welcome to set up a free discovery call with me. We could talk about all the things you want to discuss about mental toughness, questions that you have, happy to answer those. And most of all, don't forget to like and share, subscribe and keep charging forward.

Thanks for tuning in to this episode of Charge Forward Coaching. Remember, the journey to greatness is built on mental toughness and consistent effort. So head on over to ChargeForwardCoaching.com and book a free discovery call to take the next step in your journey. Until next time, stay focused, stay determined, and keep charging forward.