This podcast episode dives deep into the complexities of the music industry, exploring the challenges artists face and the importance of building genuine relationships. The discussion highlights the significance of platforms like Real Life Street Stars, which provide crucial exposure for local creators in Texas. The speakers reflect on their journeys, touching on themes of perseverance, the impact of past collaborations, and the evolving dynamics of the music scene. They also address the phenomenon of con artists within the industry, sharing personal experiences and insights into how to navigate these treacherous waters. Listeners will gain valuable perspectives on the intersection of artistry and authenticity, as well as the power of community in fostering success.

Chapters:

• 00:12 - The Contrast of Reality
• 03:06 - The Evolution of Relationships in Music
• 13:05 - The Impact of Bad Management on Artists
• 27:46 - The Story of Geppetto Jackson
• 31:41 - The Con Man's Scheme Unfolds
• 43:28 - The Consequences of Deceit
• 54:22 - The Rise of Scammers and Personal Stories
• 01:10:11 - The Influence of Texas Culture and Music
• 01:15:33 - The Boogie Movement: A Cultural Journey

Real life.

It ain't real life.

Real life.

Street stall.

You know what time it is?

Everybody start clapping right now.

Got Bone in the building.

What's going on, brother?

Hey, what it do?

What it do?

How we living?

How we living?

Hey, man, we back, we back, we back.

Congratulations, y'all superstars now.

You know I'm talking about.

Y'all made it to the.

We ain't got no hits.

You got the.

You the one with the hits.

Y'all are the hit.

It's totally different when you are the hit opposed to making a hit.

You know what I mean?

Yeah, man.

Bone been rocking with us, man, since the North Dallas days, man.

Back in the sweaty warehouse, man.

Tell us about.

From your, you know, your standpoint.

Just seeing the real life street star.

Platform, you know, I think it's dope.

I think it's dope that creators from this area get the opportunity to get the shine.

I don't think that it's a lot of opportunities for artists in this area, just in Texas alone, so for y'all to have a platform that.

Where artists can come, they can promote their, you know, their music, whatever they got coming up and, you know, just put everything.

I mean, I think it's dope.

I think it's.

It's.

It's perfect.

Like, I mean, it's a blessing for everybody.

I'm glad it's y'all, man.

You know what I mean?

It could be not for real, because, you know, it could have been, you know, you know, somebody else, and then, you know, it would have been something totally different.

But, yeah, and, you know, it's crazy.

Like, it made me realize, you know how they say relationships are worth more than money?

It made me realize that whole thing.

Because when you're.

When you're doing it, you're trying to build these relationships, and then some people, you know, might elevate and then still.

Keep it real with you, definitely.

And, I mean, that's what you hope for.

You know what I mean?

That's what you hope for, right?

So you back on the couch, man, you know, again, you got one of my favorite songs of all time, to be quite honest with you, you know?

So I'll just be singing this for no reason.

Hey, man, I don't know what it is.

If you woke up and you felt like that today, then this, you know, I mean, that's how you woke up.

You feel like.

I respect it.

Yeah.

So, I mean, when you see a big boogie, remix it and, like.

Like, they keep keeping the song current, man.

And it's dope, you know what I mean?

And, you know, like, I think it's happening for everybody.

Like, it happened for Charlie Boy, happened for Superstar, you know what I mean?

So I just think it's dope that everybody, you know, keeps getting a second life, keeps getting, you know, a third life in this.

And, you know, everybody keeps working, keep getting money.

It's dope.

Now that you see, like, all the.

The influence that the boogie movement really had, like, when all these songs are coming out now, people are redoing them.

How does it make you feel that.

You was a part of that dope?

Dope, though, I think it's.

Man, I can't.

I can't.

I'm grateful.

Like, I went through a lot of different stages in this whole process, you know, depression, this, this.

But now I'm at my grateful stage.

So I'm just grateful for everything.

Just even think about, like, this isn't like a career field for, you know, to where you work 30 years and retire.

Ain't no 401k in it.

None of that.

So for me to be actually doing it 15 years, I'm grateful.

Now you kinda gotta.

You gotta give me a little bit of a sneak peek of that era, right?

Because when they were putting together the Together Land Fest, right, It was the first time everybody always talked and I think we even mentioned our platform.

There should be a Boogie tour with just that whole wave, right?

And we actually got to see it on stage at Togetherland Fest.

Now, I noticed you weren't there, you know what I mean?

And I get, you know, it's Dallas Fort Worth or whatever, but you had that Charlie Boy was in the mix.

I would have loved to see you on there because it was just like back.

It just.

It brought me back to that era.

Well, see, they probably didn't bring me because it was a guy with Charlie Boy that.

On his legal team that used to be my manager, who's a.

And they probably knew I was gonna do some crazy.

I was gonna ruin the whole situation.

And this is why you don't invite East Texas to the situation.

This was.

Dad shouldn't have been there.

No way.

So, you know, Charlie Boy, older, he come.

He just came to single league shit that I be still having chips on my shoulder.

I be like, you know what?

This be a good time to get this nigga, you know what I mean?

And then, you know, don't tell me.

That new additions you, bro, like, ain't no telling.

You know what I mean?

I mean, but I get that Everywhere.

So I don't even be tripping.

Is that why your name is Bone?

Cause you got a bone to pick with me?

I mean.

No, I mean I got.

I keep.

I don't know.

I got a lot of anger issues.

I can be messy.

But like what did the lawyer.

I'm just curious.

Like he was my manager when I first got my deal.

So he was a.

To be.

To be honest.

And you know, we thought.

But this was at an era where you thought people had to be.

You know what I mean?

So you.

Yeah.

So you didn't kind.

You kind of just overlook it.

But he used to give us so much, just everything.

Even the day we made home, girl, he made us stand out.

Cuz the studio was in his house.

He made us stand and wait outside his house at least 30, 40 minutes to come open the door.

It don't take that long to come open the door.

He's just being a.

And just.

You know what I mean?

Just not.

So we just sitting out there, just waiting 30 minutes, 40 minutes.

Then he comes and opens the door.

Okay.

Pool.

We go in there and then we don't even record in the.

His big studio where he didn't.

He didn't stole my digio 3, you know what I mean?

Or borrowed it, you know what I'm saying?

And then gave him a DGO too, you know what I'm saying.

Back in the Digio days, he.

He had us in the closet recording on the DGO2 in the.

In his other.

You know, in the other room.

Everything was in like he had like a three bedroom.

So he just turned bedrooms in studios.

It wasn't like official studio, it was some in his house.

It was nice, but it was some in his house.

It was no to where a could be that bougie about.

But had us recording in the closet.

That's.

And we made homegirl in the closet.

And then after, after we made it, the nigga told me, I don't think I.

I don't think you came hard enough.

I know it feel good that shitting on all that shit he was talking about though, man.

But I kept him around.

That's what makes me so, you know what I mean?

Like, because for me I was thinking we was doing some together shit, you know what I mean?

So I was trying to keep everybody together.

It was like four or five of us, you know what I mean?

I was the first one.

So you know, I'm thinking the managers, you know, just the old school thinking of shit, you know.

The manager supposed to keep Everybody together.

We.

We been recording over here, trying to build a team.

Yeah, you know, that shit didn't work.

But that is tough.

Like, especially when you getting it out the mud, though.

But this is where he's a dickhead because.

Okay, I go to New York, sign the deal, and I signed the deal that day.

I didn't.

I later learned from my Nigga Sounds shout out to my Nigga Sounds.

He tells me I could have signed a letter of intent, which means that it just said that I'm not gonna go shot myself at another label some.

I'm just gonna take this back to my lawyer, let me read it.

And then we just come back and have, you know, finish the negotiation.

But I'm definitely down to do.

Do the deal.

I didn't have to sign that contract, but the dickhead let me sit there and sign the deal because he's giddy, happy to be here.

You know, I ain't never did shit in his life.

Got got us convinced.

Oh, man, this is the funniest shit since we on real life.

I can.

I can do my Jaguar.

Jaguar, right?

Shit, right?

Yeah, yeah.

So we in.

I had already been signed.

I met Red Zone with Tricky Stewart in the dream, right?

Yeah.

And so he had been telling us this whole time that he knew dream and that dream was, you know, this up person or whatever, you know, and dreams and Dream brother Vaughn.

I've never met Dreams Brother Vaughn, but I've seen at that time he was a rapper.

He had put out some video.

He showed it to us.

But I never met Vaugh.

So I don't know nothing about him, but I know Dream Dream Dream is a great guy.

Like, I remember one time he was just in the studio recording some before the his third album had dropped.

Me and my homie jb, he just let us sit in the studio and just hear all the he was working on.

He was working on.

You wouldn't even believe he was working on for a.

We was just sitting in there like, we didn't even want to ask to hop on that.

We was just sitting there like.

Like, you hear that?

That's like, man.

So we was just in awe and.

And he didn't kick us out.

Even when he did the remix for me on Homegirl, I was passing by and walking by, I was like, hey, you gonna put a verse on Homegirl for me?

He was like, tell him to send it over to me in the studio.

Did that shit in 15 minutes.

Damn.

Literally 15 minutes.

Not a fake.

Not how nigga say?

Oh, I wrote that in 15.

No, he went in there 15 minutes, it was done.

He said it's done.

Tell me what you think about it.

Hey, I ain't gonna lie, bro.

When you.

Cause I've been in the studio with Sugar.

I've been in the studio with Coco Jones and seen her write something for somebody, right?

So when you.

When you see that and you know, and you acknowledge I'm in here with a great writer, what is.

What are you trying to gain or learn from that writer when you're in the system?

For me, I was just.

It was a.

It was a happy to be there moment.

And then you just want to try to just take that and be like, see, hopefully I can recreate Be.

Be that great too.

You know what I mean?

Just find something in myself, you know, find my story, my songs, whatever.

I'm trying to tell at that point.

Yeah, but he told us he knew Dream, so the first time we was ever in the studio, we went to red zone.

The very first time I ever went to red zone.

And we went dream.

Didn't know who the fuck he was.

And that's when you start figuring out, swear to God.

I'm talking about.

He, like, he went up to him, he's like, hey, what's going on, man?

You know what I'm saying?

I'm dream, you know what I mean?

Introducing himself and shit.

And you know, and he just shook his head back.

He didn't say nothing.

He just walked off.

And I was like, why the.

He didn't Right.

Say something to the nigga.

Like, what the something.

He must have been a husband.

Yeah, yeah.

My life was a different dream, yo.

Okay.

Yeah, yeah.

He went to dream a dream.

Every motherfucker he went to dreams in North Dallas.

Nah, but you know, you know.

Yeah, but you know how it be.

Like, he knew.

He knew some.

He knew a.

He was in the military, so he probably knew a nigga that made a beat for Dream's brother Vaughn, right?

And then, you know, he conjured this whole fucking story up to us little kids.

Cause he never thinking we gonna.

The last thinking he ever thinking we gonna do is run into the dream after he done told all these lies.

Man, we ran.

I'm talking about that day.

We all ran the dream.

I knew then I was like this full of.

I gotta get rid of this.

How much.

How much of the industry cap did you like?

Just give us like, three examples of just the cap that be going on.

I don't think it's no cap.

Like, what you mean, cap like like.

You say, like a telling you, hey, know somebody when they.

Now, see, see, it's a.

Okay, it's different levels.

See, we talking about the people that are wannabes, you know, and those people that are in the.

You know, in the way as niggas, you know what I mean?

The people that be like, oh, I can do this for you.

I can get you here.

And really, they be a cousin of a nigga that knew that know a nigga, you know what I mean?

And they might can be able to get you in a situation, get you in a room with him.

But even if you get in the room, it'll be a room like.

Like fucking in Shreveport.

Hey, yeah, we finna go to Shreveport, and we gonna be right there by 50, you know what I mean?

Niggas took pictures with 50, you know what I mean, like, 50 ain't got time.

Hear your idea, no motherfucking pitch about no shit you doing.

Not y'all, maybe because y'all.

But y'all ain't even got shit to pitch.

Y'all went there to have fun on some shit, you know, we getting there, get some cuz, have fun.

We don't need 50.

50, gotta call me type shit.

But it's niggas that really went with some niggas.

Like, hey, man, you know, I got.

Got your meeting with 50, you know what I'm saying?

Meeting with Yayo, you know what I'm saying?

Just go in there, just tell him, you know, I mean, you're gonna have five minutes.

Like, who the.

You know what I mean?

That type.

It be those type of that charge, and they'll charge 4,000, $5,000 for.

For that.

And then, you know, a feels slighted, man.

Be like, man, I went way out there, thought I was gonna do this.

This.

You know what I mean?

So.

So it don't even matter.

But as far as industry cap go, you'll run into a million niggas like that.

But honestly, there's stepping stones.

But it's easier these days because you got the Internet, so you don't have to assume somebody's somebody.

I still get amazed.

Nigga hit me up today.

One of my homies was like, do you know this guy from Epic Records?

And he sent me a phone number, and I was like, how you meet him?

He just randomly called me nigga.

That ain't how it work.

So don't.

That ain't how it works.

A scam.

You know what I mean?

It's a scam.

Bro, that ain't how it work, bro.

But I'm saying.

Cause, okay, I had a guy from Jive call me one time.

It was after I lost my deal with Def Jam.

I'm randomly sitting there at Chili's, and N called me, and he's like, what's good?

I'm from Jive.

He was like.

He was like, tricky gave me your number.

He said, you a real hard worker.

And when he said that, that's why I know Tricky told him about me.

He was like, yeah, send me some music.

You know, nothing became.

Cause I had no new music at the time.

I was depressed, going.

I was at school, whole bunch of this shit.

But, you know.

But that's how I knew it was a real call.

Because that's.

Or that's how you'll know.

And so I asked him.

I said, who, you know that work at Jive?

He was like, nobody.

But that was the.

And the reason why I got a call, because that was the time when LA had.

He had left Def Jam and he had moved to Jive, and he had hired all his old people at Jive.

So, you know, he was reaching me out to see if I had some motion going then, you know, I probably could have got picked up, but I ain't had shit going.

Now you keep talking about this depression.

What was the cause of that?

What was the root cause of that?

That nigga, he was the cause of it.

He was the.

I've centered this cause, you know, I go to therapy, so you have to talk these things out.

And I've centered my blame.

My blame goes solely on him.

And I put it solely on him.

Because before him, it was a collective, like I said, it was me, the producer, his cousin, my cousin.

We had a mutual cousin, another dude, and then our partner, you know, Gully.

You know, it was.

You know, it was a clique.

You know how shit go when you rap.

It was a whole clique of rappers.

So we doing our thing.

We loved it.

We used to go do shit.

We did a show at the White House in Fort Worth with Funky town Eminem, rp, my nigga.

You know what I'm saying?

We didn't know who he was.

We was just.

And we paid.

We sat out in the hot sun in fucking lawn chairs just to fucking perform.

Just to perform as a group.

This is before I made Homegirl, then after Homegirl.

All of a sudden, he's telling us this.

He's telling us this.

He even did some fuck shit.

Like the producer, he.

Jb, he registered His.

His publisher under one of our partners.

Publisher who was under ascap?

Nick Pratt.

He had Nick Pratt Publishing, so he registered as publishers.

Okay, so when the money come, it go to the publisher.

Well, he done got cool with Nick Pratt.

Told Nick Pratt to send him JB money.

You know what I mean?

Like, yeah, just send me the money.

And so.

And that n did it.

And believe it or not, and these niggas hate me.

Can you believe that?

Like, I stole some money from them these n.

He didn't convince them that I'm the.

And he.

He literally told this nigga to send him another nigga money.

I ain't never told nobody to send me none of their money ever, Ever.

I ain't never say, hey, yo, send me JB portion.

Him give me that.

I made sure that we got the same percentage on the breakdown, everywhere I went.

One time I tricky invited me to the opening of the Braves game where Craig Hayward was a rookie year.

We hit a home run his.

His first game.

Rookie, rookie year, he invited me to the box, but he didn't invite jb.

I didn't go because he didn't invite jb.

That's how real I was in the situation.

But I.

But I'm a fuck nigga.

You know what I'm saying?

But.

Because.

But that's what manipulation does when you got somebody like the fuck nigga, the con nigga telling you, oh, he's doing this.

I'm on the road with him.

He's saying this.

He's saying this.

He doesn't want y'all.

There ain't no telling what he was probably feeding him.

I never.

They'll never tell me the truth.

So, you know, it's just how the game work.

But it be people like him that ruin good situations.

That's why I'm happy for X that they doing they thing the way they doing it.

They type, they clicked up, right?

And you know, it ain't no manager telling you no fuck shit, trying to separate everybody on no bullshit, stupid shit like that.

So is that one of the things that you feel like kills a lot of the.

Because I feel like a lot of people from the era have kind of similar stories where they was on top of the world and then bad management.

Bad management.

When get those opportunities, bro, back then, you're supposed to take opportunity.

You supposed to have a manager reaching out to Coca Cola, Pepsi, Fox, everything.

You never know what might land.

You know what I mean?

Like, something land.

Bam.

That's another.

You know what I mean?

You know, Instead, he's worried about how he can get.

He was trying to start a group with everybody else, which is cool, you know what I mean?

I.

I had no problems with that.

But he told me he didn't want me to record no music with them.

So they were.

They did a whole album, and the hottest in Texas ain't on the project.

That's like Rosama doing a whole album and no X Records.

Like, nah, I'm gonna do this by myself.

Makes no fucking sense.

Told me he didn't want me to go to the club.

I got the hottest record in the club.

Why am I not in the club?

This makes no sense.

Like, all the advice and shit he was telling me to do was just the wrong shit.

I'm talking about the wrong shit.

The wrong shit.

And.

But you just kind of go with it because you thinking about the old guard in a way.

I need a manager.

I need a manager.

I need a manager.

Should have went and hired Mike Moose Wing.

I really had that opportunity, did this shit, you know what I'm saying?

Mike Moose went way smarter than that nigga, but mistakes were made, you know what I mean?

You just kind of jump over this shit.

So in hindsight, what are some of the characteristics that you should say an artist should look out for when they're dealing with.

If they're dealing with somebody that's in management or trying to be a manager, that they should stay away from a.

Nigga with no connections.

If a nigga has no connections, he's the same thing as you.

For sure.

He is the same thing as you.

Y'all both dreamers.

Y'all both dreamers, y'all.

He's just said that he's not a manager.

He'll want to.

He wants to be a manager the same way you want to be a rapper.

So if the nigga can't get nothing for you, done.

Has a.

Has a nigga ever hit you with this?

Like, yeah, yeah, we good.

We gonna get over here to the spot.

We're gonna be good.

We're gonna walk right in.

You get there.

Yeah, I had 30 minutes.

He just walked.

He calling on the phone.

You just looking around like, are we really just standing outside?

Yeah, several times.

I did that several times.

And a couple times I didn't even.

I've even been that, so I know how I feel like I'm calling, like, what's the deal, man?

What's the deal?

What's the deal?

You know what I mean?

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

You know what I mean?

A couple times I hadn't even been that nigga.

So I know that mutual feeling of being bullshitted and being a bullshitter.

So I, I, you know, I try to tell artists all the time when I come across because A asked me to manage them all the time, or A asked me, won't you sign them?

I'd be like, bro, I don't even do that.

Cause first of all, artists don't listen.

I'm an artist.

Artists don't listen.

They don't believe in the you telling them.

And then once you give them a little bit of game, they take that little bit of game, run with it, far as they can run with it.

And they'd be like, hey, man, you know, man, what you were telling me, man, well, what you think about this, man?

You know what I'm saying?

Like, well, you know, that's consultation.

You know what I mean?

Charge for that.

You know what I mean?

I'm a real.

So I'm not gonna charge you, but you're not gonna call me every time I tell you, just run into a wall saying, and I'm telling you, bro, you was gonna run into that wall.

You're gonna run into that wall.

Oh, no, no, no.

Okay.

Six months later, what happened, man?

You know, I had to get my bread back up, man.

You know what I'm saying?

You know, I was with.

Oh, okay.

So.

So why.

Let me ask you this.

So why haven't the artists themselves, right, taken it upon themselves to just create the boogie toward themselves?

Well, hold on.

Before you answer that, I had caught a clip of Can I Vent?

And Fat Pimp said, okay.

Fat Pimp.

Said, and I do owe him money.

No, no, but that's.

I do owe him money.

But the thing is, no, he.

No, I mean, Fat Pimp said you finessed him on some bread.

It wasn't a finesse.

It's not a finesse.

Not.

It's a difference.

I owe.

I got an outstanding balance.

That's totally different from a finesse.

An outstanding balance.

And a finesse is totally different.

I have an outstanding balance, okay, That I have not yet paid.

That's totally different.

Everybody got an outstanding balance somewhere.

Now, for real, like, I got an outstanding balance, okay?

The producer wouldn't clear the beat, so the feature I was trying to get him on, I couldn't get it cleared.

So I didn't pay him for the feature because I didn't put the song out.

So it's outstanding balance.

Now, how long has that been since that happened?

19.

But we got songs since then that I put out so.

But just for that particular situation, I have an outstanding balance.

Let that fall.

That's Fall off.

Car off after three.

Exactly.

I got.

Exactly.

That's what I'm saying.

I acknowledge the outstanding balance.

I ain't saying.

I'm not saying that.

He was not wrong in what he said.

I acknowledge the outstanding balance.

I do.

I have an outstanding balance with Fat Pimp Incorporated.

Yeah.

What was the original question?

Why.

Why don't you niggas get together and start a goddamn boogie tour, man?

Who gonna close the show?

Ah, y'all niggas.

Egos that sick.

I'm asking a question.

I'll open it.

I don't give a fuck.

All right, all right, let's bro.

Long as I get paid, I go out there, do homegirl, and I sit and kick it and chill and smoke.

Who do you think should.

For three hours.

Who do you think should close the show?

Pit Pat Pimp.

All right.

Who do you think should close the show?

Lil Joe.

Lil Joe.

Watch me do this.

The nigga who started the whole boogie shit.

Oh, well, I mean, you know, the.

Nigga who made it cool to dance.

No, I know what you talking about.

I know what you talking about.

I know what you talking about.

I'm a Spain guy.

I'm a Spain guy.

I love Spain.

I know.

I feel.

I feel you.

But, see, for me, it was Rhythm City Lil Peace.

Yeah.

Rhythm City Lil Peace.

For me, that was, like, my first.

Not my first, but my first real.

Like, really seeing that this shit was a lifestyle.

Cause it was a girl in the club that night in Rhythm City.

And she boogied from the time she came in the door to the time that bitch closed.

I'm talking about she got a drink.

She had a drink in her hand.

She was boogieing like, I literally.

She real life boogied through the door.

Like, before that.

I'm.

And this had to be 45 years for that.

Made the song he real shot.

Kbizzo like real life.

Thug Boss Nation.

Yeah, yeah.

Like.

Like, real.

Like, real life.

This young lady boogied through the door.

And she was booked.

She real life boogie for three hours.

I didn't.

I no shoes on.

She had her shoes in her hand.

Swear to God, that was that pill.

Hey, you know, whatever it takes.

Whatever it take to get you there.

Whatever it takes.

But.

But when I seen that, I was like, yo, this is some real.

Like, this ain't, like, just kind of like.

Like, this some real.

I wanted to be involved.

You know what I mean?

Just and then, you know, then they have the Texas Music Summit every summer.

That was big.

So all the artists from Texas used to come up there and do that.

So you just trying to like, damn, how do I get in there?

And that used to be expensive.

As.

I wonder how my.

How much Mike moves.

Y'all gotta do some research on that.

Find out how much Mike moves we made off the Texas Music Summits.

Is that the conferences off the.

Off.

That is that thing where they used.

To just come and judge.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

You know, every summer.

Not every summer.

Texas music company over there was 75.

Yeah, that, bro.

That was a cash grab to me.

It was a cash grab.

But see, back then, it was a cash grab opportunity because I was.

And then, you know, like, I know y'all watch bmf, but y'all remember the episode with Jack the Rapper?

Yes.

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

So that's.

That was just an example of Jack the Rapper.

You know what I mean?

It's a cash grab, but at the same time, all the rappers go.

You know what I'm saying?

And then Mike was bringing in from BET and everywhere else.

So I guess what just made that shit, I was like, you never saw the benefit of an artist actually being.

I never saw one, but I could say from Tony Neal's Texas.

Texas something.

But Texas.

When Tony.

Okay, so it was a Texas music conference, and then the Texas Urban Music Summit, because Tony got.

I think.

I don't know.

This is alleged.

Because Tony.

I'm scared of Tony.

Tony.

I think.

I think Tony got pissed at Mike and he said him.

And he said he gonna do it.

He gonna do his own conference for whatever reason.

So he did the Texas Urban Music Summit.

So I went to the Texas Urban Music Summit, and that's when I met Tony, and he introduced me to city, and that's how I got my deal.

So.

So I can say for as far as the Texas Urban Music Summit goes, I was a success story from that.

Yeah, they definitely got to bring some of that stuff back.

Cause it's gotta do it the right way.

Yeah, it's all Internet now, though.

See, now, but.

See, now, if they did it, it could be.

It could be straight.

Because you could bring in real content creators, and you can bring in real record exams, and you can bring in people with real music, you know, now.

But see, now, trying to do it, they would get in the way because it would be too easy.

You got to do it when it's hard where you got to charge 15, 20, 500 like that yeah, that's crazy.

But as far as the Boogie tour goes, I.

I mean, I think it would be a great idea, but I just think the.

The biggest issue will be lineup for most people, right?

And like I said, I don't have an ego in that fight.

You know what I mean?

Like, I would just perform and just enjoy myself and get paid because that's what I'm there for.

But I think more so for everybody else would be an ego type thing.

Yeah.

So.

So speaking of scams, right?

You have a scam documentary, man.

I got a documentary I'm doing.

It's called Surviving Andre.

Damn.

Surviving Andre.

God.

It's called Surviving Andre.

Wait, are you shooting?

You producing?

What.

What is your role?

I'm y'all on this type of.

So this is the first time I ever did this ever in my life.

You know what I mean?

I ain't even on this type of.

Really.

I just rap.

But Nk she was a.

She was in need of help because everybody she had run into up to that point had bullshitted her.

Just like we were talking about telling her they gonna do the documentary.

Do the documentary, and they send her back some artwork.

Artwork.

Tell me.

Okay, we.

We in the process.

What do you tell you was a pick.

Pick.

Pitch deck.

A pitch deck?

What the is a pitch deck?

No, I don't.

So that's why I'm asking.

All right, so it's like, you gotta.

If me and Piggy come up with a concept, right, we're gonna put it in this nice, good PDF, and you're gonna look at it, and you should be able to know what the show is about.

You know what I'm saying?

It had a synopsis of the show, pictures.

I don't even want to tell you what she paid for that.

I'm not.

I don't even want to tell you what she paid for that.

I can show you a few of them.

I did get it delivered, though.

I got a pitch deck, but he doesn't.

He doesn't think it's anything.

What the.

Do we need a pitch deck about.

About a documentary?

Never mind.

I'm not gonna get into it.

We gonna go straight.

We gonna go straight.

Cause we go.

I'll be on a three hour tangent on that alone.

But the documentary is about this guy named Andre Van.

And like I said, this is my first time doing this type of shit, bro.

You know, but she needed help.

Andre Van.

These are their thoughts, not ours.

We don't know.

Yeah, yeah, she.

But she needed help.

And then so, you know, I.

I flew to Virginia and I sat down with her and she told me a story.

I recorded it.

I got it edited, you know, the best to my ability, you know what I'm saying?

We got everything together, you know what I'm saying?

I got some.

I posted boot.

I'm.

It's coming out on YouTube.

I got a tuby lick, but, you know, it's got to be shot better because I didn't shoot it.

I didn't have none of this.

I need.

Borrow this.

Y'all loan this out.

Y'all like, I got.

Wake up, Circuit City.

Yeah, y'all learned.

Y'all loan this out.

This ain't nothing.

I didn't need this.

This is all I need right here.

I don't even need the.

The.

The.

There you go, right there.

You gotta shoot it right there.

I need one of these, you know what I'm saying?

Like Chris Tucker said, I just need a few of these.

Just one of these, and we good.

And that's all I need.

But, yeah, yeah.

So the guy's Andre Van.

He goes around as Geppetto Jackson.

He's been.

He's a professional American con man.

I call him the Hip Hop con man because he's.

He's taken over the identity of Jermaine Jackson's illegitimate child.

Jermaine lives in Europe, so he has no way to verify or unvermaine Jackson.

Yeah, Jermaine Jackson.

Wait, how did he get that off?

Does he look like he got an S curl?

Does he look like the nigga.

Let's put it.

He got an S curl.

He does S curl.

He do the dark to get it done.

Yes.

And the dark glasses.

You know what I'm saying?

Like, you know, I think I'm a full.

I'm a full believer that if you.

If you, like, keep.

If the power of the mind is real strong.

So if you keep, like, thinking something like, I'm Jermaine Jackson, son.

I'm Jermaine Jackson's son, like, and then you got the S curl.

You wear the clothes, you got the glasses.

Like, eventually, you know, you can.

It's something about that that just tweaks everything.

Manifestation.

He did it.

He will not me.

He willed himself into, bro.

He sure did.

He sure did.

So for over.

For over 10 years, he has been scamming people as Geppetto Jackson.

He been getting this off for 10 years?

No, he started when he was, like, teenager, and he's 40 now, so.

Over how many years?

You know, my man bad.

But how many years that is like over 20 plus years he been.

He's been a.

That's why I call it.

He's not a scammer.

He's a con man.

See, he is a different.

You got niggas that scamming, like, oh, I can get you a meeting with.

With, you know, with Def Jam or some shit like that, but.

And then you got niggas that are con men who wake up every day as another person with the intention to scam the shit out of you.

Like the somebody.

I don't give a fuck who it is.

I'm going to get somebody today.

So he's a con man.

Have you been conned by him?

No, no, not me when I met him.

I mean, so.

Ah, come on.

Everybody that met him.

So like, I don't know.

He sound like ho ass.

No, my guy didn't do my artwork.

Your image.

He met him so.

Cause I.

Cause, yeah, that's my.

Hey, he's still doing artwork.

He do my.

You know what I'm saying?

But he.

I got him to do the.

That we did.

And he was like, man, I met that.

That tried to get me in flip.

So he.

But I met him at the same time.

I met him in Victoria, Texas, in the garage, you know what I'm saying?

Out there with a.

With an S curve.

I said, this really like got an S curve.

You know the.

What it takes to put an S curl on.

How to do it properly, you gotta do.

Because you can.

You gotta take it off at the right time.

You leave it on too long straight.

So to get the proper curl, you.

Man, I don't know how take a lot of effort.

No, he putting the effort in, bro.

Let me tell you what he does, right?

He finds like the Jacksons, they go on tour, but it ain't Jermaine.

It's just Tito, Randy and.

Jackie.

And Jackie.

Hey, hey, man.

See, there you go.

You know them niggas fight, you know, joking, comedic.

It was comedic.

And you know, you know the niggas fight where they come on here and do an interview.

So you said the tour was ass, did you?

When y'all get y'all Jackson interview.

So the tour is ass, huh?

So have you been there?

Fuck this shit.

They start throwing everything like, man, you.

Know, don't nobody come up.

No, Tito just threw shit all over.

I was shocked.

Nigga, we ain't let nobody come up.

In here but Janet.

Nah, real.

But he goes to their tour and he went to Janet's.

He goes to the tour and he pays for the meet.

And greetings and pretends like he's going to meet his uncles type shit.

And like, oh, I just seen Unc and them at the show.

He paid for the meet and greet.

Like, paid for it.

Like some Chris Brown shit.

Like.

Like he does that.

Like, he'll wait till he'll find where they gonna perform at.

Go to the motherfucking show, pay for the meet and greet.

Take the picture.

What's good?

So what does he do?

The scam?

What does.

He's.

He's a con man.

I'm saying, what does he do?

Okay, so.

Okay, well, so what did he do.

In this scenario to get a document?

Okay, tell him.

Cause.

Yeah, yeah, tell him.

Tell him.

So literally, he impersonated Megan Walsh.

Who?

You know, John.

John Walsh's daughter.

So at that time, John Walsh was taking her kids from her.

It's a whole big story.

So I was in a group with so called Meghan, not knowing this con man is acting like men.

So Megan starts telling me her story.

She was doing all these talk shows, Everything, it was real.

Her father had already taken three of the kids, and she's pregnant with the con man's child.

So I've been watching America's Most Wanted since I was in Nigeria as a kid.

I love this guy, right?

So I'm like, well, Megan Walsh, her dad chases criminals so she can be a criminal.

Not knowing I'm actually talking to a con man.

So within three weeks, literally, she.

Megan, who is Andre Van, convinced me to give about.

Like, it started slowly.

I gave a donation, you know, Then I guess somehow bell started ringing.

I have some money.

So it starts telling me, as Megan, she needs money for the kids, for lawyers, for a house, for this, for that and that she was going to sell her story in three weeks and basically give me my money.

So within three weeks, 100,000 was gone.

So while she's conning me, she's telling me about this guy who's our friend, Geppetto Jackson.

So that's Geppetto putting himself in.

So that he slid in.

Yes, yes.

So he's talking to me.

He's talking to me.

But he changed his voice.

No, no.

Well, no, it's still Facebook.

It's still Facebook.

So basically, yeah.

So when I didn't see.

See the face, because when I asked Megan to actually call me, she slips in her manager, who's a very cantankerous woman called Juanita McDonald's cankerous.

That's a bad right there.

Well, that's Stephen.

A word right there.

Check the dictionary for that word.

But literally.

So Juanita says, you know, her father has been setting her up.

She can't really call you and show her face.

But this is a 70 year old woman.

So I'm like, okay, okay, I understand.

You know, I wasn't thinking.

They'll keep taking my money.

She's like, yeah, you know, I'm her manager.

You know, this is it.

She's gonna sell this and give me back my money.

That's all I wanted, was my money.

Trying to help because we're in a group saving the children, right?

Gets suicidal.

What's going on?

Says she's suicidal.

She's like, well, I'm really trying to get this money.

People, you know, these people are not giving it to me like I should.

And then next thing, Geppetto Jackson calls me and he's like, he actually FaceTimed me.

He's like, yeah, what's going on?

Megan says that, you know, you're upset.

You know, Megan's suicidal.

Me and Juanita, I'm gonna take care of this.

So basically, he facetimes me, but he was.

While he was Megan, he's telling me all about this friend called Geppetto Jackson.

He plays music for the kids.

He's like a little kid.

He's like, Michael, you know, brainwashing me as Megan.

Oh, he's.

He really wants to be your friend, blah, blah, blah.

Even got to the point where she was saying, well, I think he likes you.

I'm like, nah, nah, I'm not interested in any of that.

But good for Geppetto, right?

He's singing music for the kids.

And I'm hearing this music, right?

And it was real.

Everything was based on real facts.

But needless to say, Megan gets suicidal.

So they cut her.

He cuts her character and him and Juanita, this owner of J Mac Enterprises, she says she produces songs and Geppetto is her.

Well, she's Geppetto's manager.

So both of them say, well, they're in the contract.

The deal for selling this, Megan's story, then the deal together, they're gonna get this straight, pay me my money, all of that good stuff.

I'm thinking, well, okay, but this time I'm sweating bullets, you know?

So I guess I said, okay.

He's not acting like he's gonna ask Me for money.

Then the money continues to keep going, you know, give me for this.

Where about.

Well, I have this deal he started talking about.

He was also acting like Maga Jackson.

That was when, you know, the Trump era was on and people are singing songs.

So he was trying to compete with Foggiato Blow and some other Trump artists.

So he's pretending like he got this deal.

He's on YouTube doing music like he does music.

I've never seen anyone do so much music ain't going nowhere.

But he.

So it was all on Real Facts.

I'm thinking, yeah, this guy, you know, why would he waste his time in the studio and all of that talking to me, my whole family, my kids, you know, at the same time, still taking money, spending my money.

Oh, my God, it was crazy.

Long story short, he comes up, I keep asking for money.

It's one day.

Next thing, before you know it, it was getting into six months of taking money.

So he finally got desperate and forged a letter from President Trump saying that Trump hired him to be.

You know, it was.

Was kind of riding on the Trump, Michael Jackson friendship.

You know, I've seen some clips where, you know, Michael and Trump talked to each other and they were friends.

So he was like, oh, that's my uncle.

And that's why Trump wants to, you know, hire me.

So he gives my husband and I and my whole family a letter saying that Trump had hired him, was going to pay him, like, six, eight million dollars.

I mean, this letter looked real.

Like it says, good job.

You're going to be the R and B singer of the Trump family, and Michael would be very proud of you.

Something to that nature, to that effect.

And at that point, we were getting very suspicious.

I mean, we didn't have any reason not to believe him, but it was just too many things.

So that day came and passed when he was supposed to give us our money.

March 11, someone put on Facebook, if this guy has conned you, you need to call me.

And the journey has literally been hell since then.

What has he been doing ever since?

Scamming and scamming more people.

Now he's on probation for 30 years.

So he was not supposed to even.

He wasn't supposed to be online when he scammed me.

He had just come out of jail for four years.

So he was on probation, not allowed to go online.

So that's why I think he actually took on Megan's Persona So.

So why not just kill him?

If you took 10% of that honey.

Honey.

The guy.

For a honey nuisance?

Yeah.

Nah.

For a hundred bands, actually.

I think I.

I stand over you, boy.

God.

Look, look.

You wake up, he would have woke up.

Picture, he would have woke up in.

The middle of the night, and I'd.

Have just been standing over.

Well.

Well, he didn't take a 100 from me.

By the time it was done, six months later, it was $400,000.

Oh.

Oh, my God.

So what you do for 400?

Yeah.

So the first.

First three weeks as Megan was 100, and then he just kept coming on and on.

And like I said, he had this manager who was 70 years old.

I'm like, she can't.

Yeah, hold on.

No, no, no.

Where are you from?

Nigeria.

Yes, sir.

Have you ever heard of a Nigerian getting scammed?

Exactly.

Listen, listen.

I told him.

Are you Nigerian?

She's Nigerian too.

Oh, okay.

Are you Nigerian?

Where you from?

You What.

What state?

I'm.

I'm not my mom.

Oh, your mom.

All right.

Yeah.

That's awesome.

My kids are here about, too.

Yeah, he's from Dallas.

That.

Today.

Like, my kids, yes, my kids are Nigerian, but they were born here.

But, yeah.

So you obviously heard her story, decided to take action.

What made you 100,000, man.

I know I can get a piece of that.

No, no, no.

Let me tell you.

Let me tell you what happened.

I wasn't even.

She had.

My homie was doing something at the Texas Motor Speedway, and so he was like, just come to the Airbnb.

So I came to the Airbnb, and she had paid for the Airbnb.

That's where I had met her.

And you know what I'm saying?

I was just chilling, you know, and.

She was like, something for the kids, too.

Yeah.

And then, like.

And she was like, that's nk, the one that Andre scammed.

I was like, okay, you know, whatever, whatever.

Oh.

Cause you had got.

I had a show the next day.

So I went and, you know, I kicked it.

Chill.

Then I went and did my show, so.

And then I ended up.

I was working on the.

Working on a project.

Project.

I just released my homie Martell vibe.

Success.

Go download that.

And my engineer was like, bone, man, I really need you to get involved.

Cause he was there at the Airbnb too.

He was like, bon, I really need you to get involved with nk, man.

Like.

Like.

Like nothing's getting done.

I need you to do it.

And I'm like, n.

I don't do documentaries.

N.

I rap like.

But I was sitting there thinking myself, well, this would be a new adventure.

I've never.

It's not that I can't do it.

I don't think I.

I can't do it.

But, you know, and then I started thinking about like in the beginning when I first started rapping, like about how I had to figure this out and figure this out.

I was like, this will probably be fun.

So I called her and I was like, well, whatever you need, just let me know.

And then I flew out to Virginia and then shit.

Like I said, I did it how I did it.

You know what I mean?

You know, I have the 19 cameras, of course, but.

And then I got edited shots of visual film.

She's from St.

Louis, she's real dope.

And she edited it together for me and you know, we got a product.

It drops this Friday, August 16th.

And so, you know, you can get a more in depth story of how everything happened.

But that was just really, for me, just getting the opportunity to, you know, expand my portfolio, spread my wings out, you know, it wasn't really a money thing for me.

Like I said, she hadn't paid me for this.

He's working totally free.

He just like, like Disco Stu.

So you don't feel no type of way.

Everybody else got paid.

But.

No, I'm joking.

I will.

I mean, you know, but for me it's more.

I mean, you know, I got my master's in sociology.

So for me it's really looking at the.

Yeah, he's smart.

He's trying to.

He's trying to get his PhD too.

Yeah.

But for me it's more so looking into the behavior of somebody that can wake up every day and be somebody else and make.

Make people believe that there's somebody else, you know, like it's just, I don't know, just to try to get into the mindset of somebody that devious.

Just that like where they at, like that's more the interest for me.

And then, you know, like I said, I'm.

I probably write my dissertation about it, you know what I mean?

Doing all this research.

Because we're going to do another part too.

Because he.

She had.

Yeah, no, because she got a civil.

It's a big story.

She got.

She got a civil case coming up 4th October 4th.

So we going to do the.

For the civil case, you know, I mean, that's why I said I need to borrow the Camel, you know, I'm talking about.

So I'm going go, you know how y'all be going.

You know what I'm talking about?

You know what I mean?

Like, whole nine.

What.

What do we want the documentary to do?

What is the goal?

Yeah, so what's my goal?

He didn't.

He has not stopped.

He's currently in jail right now.

Yeah.

So he failed to pay restitution.

He didn't pay restitution.

But, like, we have literally tried to stop his hustle.

So the documentary is trying to get people.

I feel like it took a lot for me to be here, and I'm a psych nurse practitioner by profession, so I know what this could do to people.

I know where it took me.

It took me to very dark places.

And because I'm here to tell the story, I want people all over America.

He has victims all over America spanning into 20 years.

And there's no place where they can tell their story.

So I'm hoping that from me, telling my story will continue to give people the courage to come.

Y'all know what jelly is?

Huh?

Y'all know where he's.

Tampa.

Tampa.

Tampa, Florida.

Box of cigarettes they're getting.

He doesn't mess with men, only women.

He doesn't mess with men at all.

He's some beta male.

He doesn't mess with men.

It's crazy.

You know, so this is one of the things I always.

Because I watch a lot of documentaries, right?

Me too.

Right.

I watch a ton of documentaries and, you know, you see the Tinder swindler and stuff like.

Like that.

And a lot of times, some.

Some of the characteristics that they have is they're charming or they.

They have.

They're good with words or they.

What is it?

That kind of.

Why do you feel like he's able to scam so many people?

What is it about him specifically?

I mean, he's done this since he was a teenager.

He's.

His.

His style never changes.

He mostly scams women, and it's usually a love scam.

For me, it was totally different.

He came as Megan Walsh.

If he came as himself, I'd have been get the hell out of here, literally.

But he's very charming.

But what I think that has helped him is because he sells women a dream.

I'm Jermaine Jackson's son, and he makes a lot of videos.

He even makes videos with some of the family members.

And so people really believe he is this person he says he is, but he's charming.

Definitely very charming.

Couldn't scam no woman from Dallas or Houston, I'll tell you that.

He scammed a few women in Texas.

In Texas.

He don't.

What.

This is a con man.

This ain't.

You're looking at it like, ah, nah, bro, this is a professional.

This is not.

This is Jordan.

This is like when Jordan come to score 20, he come to score 20.

It's not about what you want.

It's about.

He came to score 20 points.

Let me tell you how.

I mean, he has scammed.

He has scammed a new bronze.

He calls himself a witch in Louisiana.

I mean, you gonna scam a witch in the traditional Gila, Louisiana, he might be the witch.

He might got scammed of the year four times in a row.

What you mean?

He got a voodoo.

He got a voodoo lady.

How you get the voodoo lady?

That's crazy.

She should have seen that coming.

How you get the voodoo?