Collaborative divorce offers a respectful, structured alternative to litigation for couples who want to avoid court battles and create agreements that protect children and finances. In this episode, Lesa Koski sits down with Minnesota collaborative professionals Jana Hefty and Michelle Leason to explain how collaborative divorce works, who it’s best for, and why collaborative divorce can save time, reduce conflict, and support healthier co-parenting.

You’ll learn the key differences between collaborative divorce vs mediation vs litigation, how financial neutrals help organize assets and cashflow planning, and what happens if the collaborative divorce process doesn’t work. This conversation is especially helpful for parents considering divorce who want a better way to divorce with respect.

Divorce doesn’t have to be a fight. Collaborative divorce can be a better way.

Timestamps:

(00:00) Welcome + why divorce doesn’t have to be a fight

(01:30) Introducing Jana Hefty and Michelle Leason

(03:15) Jana’s path to law + staying calm in crisis

(06:45) Michelle’s background as a Certified Divorce Financial Analyst and mediator

(10:10) What collaborative divorce is and how it works

(13:40) The collaborative divorce team: attorneys, financial neutral, child specialist

(17:10) Why finances feel scary and how to create clarity early

(21:30) What happens if collaborative divorce doesn’t work

(25:10) Cost and timeline: collaborative divorce vs litigation

(28:30) Divorce With Respect Week (March 1–8) + how to find resources

(30:10) Closing thoughts + next steps

Key Takeaways:

• Collaborative divorce helps couples avoid court and make decisions together

• A team approach supports finances, parenting plans, and communication

• Financial neutrals reduce duplicated work and improve clarity

• Collaborative divorce can be less expensive and faster than litigation

• If collaborative fails, agreements can still be used—progress isn’t lost

Guest Bio:

Jana Hefty is a Minnesota collaborative family law attorney who helps couples navigate divorce with respect, structure, and reduced conflict.

Michelle Liesen is a Certified Divorce Financial Analyst (CDFA) and Minnesota-qualified mediator. She founded Divorce Smart and helps couples understand assets, budgeting, and post-divorce financial planning.

Resource Links:

https://collaborativedivorcecalifornia.com/dwrw/

https://collaborativelaw.org/

https://www.mydivorcesmart.com/

Welcome listeners.

2

I am as usual, excited to

have you here with me today.

3

And today, if you're watching this

on YouTube, it looks a little funny

4

'cause I've got 1, 2, 3 gals and

usually there's just two of us.

5

So I'm excited this week because

we're gonna talk about divorce.

6

With respect week and I know, um,

I have been talking about how, you

7

know, you don't have to have a fist

fight through divorce all the time.

8

And I've got two gals that have Jana

Hefty and Michelle Leason, and they are

9

part of collaborative law in Minnesota.

10

And we're gonna talk about

collaborative law because it is

11

something that I believe in and it's

something that you don't have to.

12

Fight it out and we're gonna

talk more about what that is.

13

But this is just to show you

there are other ways there

14

are better ways to divorce.

15

It doesn't have to be the drag

out fight that it used to be.

16

And I know that sometimes it

is, but it doesn't have to be.

17

So I, you know how I always just let

my guests kind of tell a little bit

18

about themselves and I just have to

kick in here about Michelle, um, because

19

she, she's such a gem and Michelle.

20

Really, I mean, I could

get kind of teary-eyed.

21

Really helped me out through a really

hard time and scooped in, didn't ask

22

for anything, didn't ask for a payment.

23

I was going through a really hard

time and um, she came in, it was a

24

illness and she came in and she worked

with my clients and she took over.

25

And so I always am so happy if anyone

can use Michelle for mediation.

26

And Michelle, you are.

27

Fantastic at the financial

aspects of it too.

28

So I just feel blessed to have you here.

29

And Janna, I don't mean to be like,

oh, and then here's Janna in the middle

30

because, I dunno you, but I think that

anyone who's an attorney who's trying

31

to do this a better way and not fight

it out, I'm just happy to have him here.

32

So Jana, welcome to Michelle.

33

Welcome.

34

If you can each, maybe Jana, share

a little bit about what led you.

35

To be an attorney and

to do this kind of work.

36

Speaker 2: Um, that's, that's

a interesting question that

37

could take up an entire hour.

38

However, we'll try to cut it down

to the very brief cliff notes here.

39

Um, I did actually have a

couple prior careers and, um.

40

I was, uh, actually in a bank robbery.

41

Um, what?

42

Speaker 3: I never expected that.

43

Speaker 2: Yep.

44

The whole story is kind of a big one.

45

Speaker 3: Wow.

46

Speaker 2: Um, but ended up in federal

court working, um, with a, a victim's

47

advocate and the state's attorney who

encouraged me to go back to law school.

48

So, in short, that's how I

ended up changing careers, going

49

back to law school and, um.

50

Pursuing a better way in a difficult time.

51

Speaker: Yeah.

52

Okay.

53

So, I'm sorry, but just because I'm

so curious, and we might go just a

54

little bit longer, you gotta tell me

a little bit about the bank robbery.

55

Like, I mean, what does that feel like?

56

Speaker 2: I was working as a, as

a teller, um, I also was an EMT.

57

So I, small town.

58

Small town.

59

Speaker: I love it.

60

Speaker 2: Um, and I.

61

I had actually just taken some training,

um, EMT training and that I think really

62

helped me stay calm during the robbery.

63

So I was the teller and he came around.

64

But, um, some of the things in training

triggered me to stay calm, be observant,

65

you know, not escalate the situation.

66

And everything turned out as good

as it could for the situation.

67

Nobody got hurt.

68

I mean, it was money.

69

Money is money.

70

Um, but they did arrest him and.

71

He served his time and

we're all on with life, so,

72

Speaker: wow.

73

Okay.

74

So Janet, I, I think what's really

cool, for one, you look way too

75

young to have had a million careers.

76

Not a million, but a couple.

77

And for two, I love this,

that you were an EMT.

78

Now my husband jokes about how I

immediately get sick to my stomach

79

if a grandchild cuts their finger.

80

And I, but I think that what you're

saying is so important when you're

81

working with people through a divorce.

82

That training.

83

I mean, I think it's something that's

in us that can help people do that.

84

And that's obviously in you,

you were able to remain trained.

85

Can you, if you can, what were, what

were some of the tricks to remain calm?

86

Because a lot of people who are

going through a really hard divorce,

87

you know how it escalates and then

you're not using your brain, right?

88

I mean, I always.

89

Say, wiggle your hands.

90

Sometimes you just have to move your body.

91

But how did you stay calm?

92

Like how, how did you stay calm in that?

93

Because that could help us.

94

Speaker 2: I, I do think part of

it is practice from being an EMT.

95

You know, we're running into the

worst time in someone's life.

96

Mm-hmm.

97

Much like this.

98

Um, we're interacting with people.

99

During some of the worst

times in their life.

100

Speaker 4: Yeah.

101

Speaker 2: Um, I agree.

102

Sometimes part of it is

just how we're built.

103

We have different Yeah.

104

Um, abilities in that way.

105

Um, one of the things that, I think

it's part of naturally who I was.

106

Mm-hmm.

107

But that did come up

in that situation was.

108

I see this one.

109

I don't wanna make it worse.

110

We don't know if there's more outside, you

know, I don't know who else is with them.

111

So relating that to divorce, it's

kind of like I know my spouse, right?

112

Or my soon to be ex spouse, but.

113

I don't know the bucket that's

coming after because I've never

114

been through a divorce before.

115

I, I've never gone to through this phase.

116

Yeah.

117

And so if we can calmly walk you

through the next steps for those

118

of us who work in this area,

119

Speaker: yeah.

120

Speaker 2: It's, it's a better

way to get through a tough spot

121

Speaker: and no one better than you.

122

So thank you for taking that

advice and putting in the hours.

123

Of going back to school

and helping people.

124

I love that.

125

That's so awesome.

126

And then Michelle, would you mind

just sharing with the audience

127

what led you to do this work?

128

Speaker 4: Sure.

129

And Jana, I had no idea that that

was your background, so that's Wow.

130

Um, to follow that a little bit

about myself, um, I went to law

131

school, actually not a practicing

attorney, became a financial advisor.

132

I have and still am a financial advisor.

133

This was my 28th year.

134

Uh, I have a company called

Wealth Planning Group that I've.

135

Um, started on my own 11 years ago

and after having gone through my own

136

divorce and having it be less than

optimal, took taking three years.

137

Um, two failed mediations.

138

Ended up going to trial, seeing

how the system was broken in my

139

opinion, and how people needed help

and needed help to do it better.

140

So I became a, what's called A-C-D-F-A

Certified Divorce Financial Analyst.

141

I then also became a licensed Mediator.

142

Mediator, or qualified neutral through

the state of Minnesota Supreme Court.

143

And I started my second business

divorce Smart and have been helping

144

couples divorce better ever since.

145

And kind of my why I would say is twofold.

146

One is I wanna help people

do a better than I did.

147

Right.

148

You know?

149

Yeah.

150

There's a better way to do it.

151

You don't have to go to trial, you

don't have to duke it out in court.

152

And number two is the kiddos.

153

Um, trying your best to keep the

kids out of it and doing it a better

154

way so that you can all move forward

on a, on a path to happiness.

155

So,

156

Speaker: mm-hmm.

157

Speaker 4: Um, those are the

two why's of why I do what I do.

158

Speaker: I love that.

159

Okay.

160

So let me ask you, in your own

situation, looking back on it, do you

161

think you could have gone through the

collaborative process with, because

162

sometimes there are times when you can't.

163

Yeah.

164

Correct.

165

I mean, it, it's, yep, for sure.

166

Do you think in your

situation you could have,

167

Speaker 4: I don't know if we were in the,

the head space to do that, to be honest.

168

Um, maybe, but yeah, I think court

was probably in our future and

169

that's just the way it was gonna be.

170

Speaker: Mm-hmm.

171

Speaker 4: But I, I like helping

people not go that route.

172

Speaker: Yeah.

173

Amen.

174

Well, so that's what I love about you

too, is you went through something hard.

175

And you learn from it, and

now you wanna help people.

176

And Jana, I'm like you.

177

I've been married for 34

years and so I hate divorce.

178

And it's funny because I kind of stepped

away for a little while thinking,

179

eh, and then all of a sudden, like

one day I was like, wait a minute.

180

I need to help these women.

181

Like this is my background, this is,

why would I stop helping these women?

182

So I know, you know, I came

back in and it's fairly new that

183

I've started doing this again.

184

But I mean, these are the

people that need our help.

185

Speaker 3: Mm-hmm.

186

Speaker: So, okay.

187

Either one of you who wants to share a

little bit about collaborative divorce

188

and the process, because I think a lot

of my listeners know about mediation.

189

You know, there's different

ways that you can get divorced.

190

You can just fill out the

paperwork on your own.

191

I have an online course.

192

Some people do it.

193

You can hire a mediator and come up

with agreements together and then

194

take them to attorneys or you can

fight it out each hire your own

195

attorneys, right, and And move forward.

196

So tell us about collaborative law.

197

Speaker 2: Do you wanna Go ahead.

198

Um, collaborative divorce is, is

another process, like you said.

199

There's, there's lots.

200

When someone comes in and speaks with me

about a divorce, I like to educate them.

201

'cause the point is to make the

choice that's right for you.

202

As you mentioned with Michelle

earlier, collaborative might not

203

have been the right choice for her.

204

So I try and that's what Divorce with

Respect Week is doing, is trying to

205

educate people on the options available.

206

Um.

207

So collaborative divorce uses

professionals in their correct area,

208

so attorneys aren't necessarily

child experts, attorneys aren't

209

necessarily financial experts.

210

Yes, we deal in both areas.

211

We can help you understand and draft

up documents that have the right

212

legal terms for maybe what you're

choosing or what the court determines

213

is going to happen in your life.

214

However, collaborative is a process

where we use financial neutrals,

215

um, to do financial cash flows.

216

For the new situation.

217

We also use, uh, mental health

professionals to help create parenting

218

plans or ongoing communication

systems, um, for the families to

219

continue their relationship in a

different way than it's been, right.

220

Hopefully a healthier way than it's been

if you're going through the divorce,

221

Speaker: right.

222

Okay.

223

So if somebody's listening and they're

thinking about divorce and they're

224

like, oh, I kind of wanna try that, it

means they both have to be on board.

225

Correct.

226

So, so each person hires a

collaborative law attorney, right?

227

Speaker 2: Yep.

228

Speaker: And then, um, they agree

that they're, is it, is there some

229

kind of an agreement where they're

not gonna fight it out in court?

230

Uh,

231

Speaker 2: it's called a participation

agreement, and it's not an agreement

232

that we're not gonna fight.

233

We still go through lots of difficult

times, um, especially with the

234

heightened emotions and things, things

that are going on through a divorce.

235

It does say that we agree to

communicate openly, to work through our

236

problems together, and that's using.

237

The support system that's here, right?

238

Using your attorneys, using the

financials, um, using the child

239

specialist, but we'll work through

it together and make the choices.

240

The parents will make the choices, right?

241

Not the judge.

242

We won't file motions.

243

We won't use the judge as an

excuse to not come up with a

244

solution that works for the family.

245

So a lot of times in traditional

litigation, you know, family

246

law in Minnesota, minus a few

exceptions, you're ordered.

247

To go to mediation or an ENE,

another alternative dispute

248

resolution system before you go

to a hearing or a trial anyway.

249

Speaker: Mm-hmm.

250

Speaker 2: And a lot of times those

can end up with the battles not

251

being focused in the right area.

252

And kind of the cop out is

we'll just let the judge decide.

253

It's not keeping the right spot.

254

Speaker: And, and I think the great

thing about collaborative law and

255

mediation is what you said is that

the parties make the decisions.

256

The parties get to decide how they

wanna divide things out, and I know.

257

When I help people, I can let them, I

can give them legal information and I

258

don't act as their attorney ever anymore.

259

I'm just doing the mediations.

260

But, um, that's where someone like

Michelle comes in and is so helpful

261

because so many people, the first thing

people are concerned about is kids.

262

If they have their kids,

they're worried about them.

263

And the second thing is their

finances and how is this gonna work?

264

So Jana does, like every person who walks

through a collaborative lawyer's door use.

265

Use the financial, do you automatically

have a financial now, so because sometimes

266

it's probably not that complicated.

267

Speaker 2: No.

268

And like any divorce, right?

269

Right.

270

Any couple, any situation.

271

Obviously if we don't have children,

we're not probably going to need.

272

A family or child specialist?

273

Well that, yeah, help us figure that out.

274

Likewise, on the financial

side, if you're agreeable to

275

everything, both households are set.

276

We don't necessarily need a financial

neutral to help us divide it out and

277

create additional, um, agreements

or understanding about, you know,

278

retirement accounts or how transferring

this money would affect us tax wise.

279

Uh, those are the things that

Michelle is great at and.

280

Most times, I'm gonna say they're

needed because dividing one household

281

into two is a huge financial change.

282

Speaker: It's so scary and I, I

always try to calm people down.

283

And Michelle, I know that you're

really good at that to just like.

284

Take a look.

285

Why don't you talk through that a little

bit, because I think that is so scary,

286

especially for that person who maybe

hasn't been involved in the finances.

287

And I always say there's no shame because

there is usually one person that did

288

that in the marriage and one who didn't.

289

And it can be so scary.

290

But the first step that I find that eases

their minds is to just get a picture.

291

So how do you help people get a picture of

their finances in the very early stages?

292

Speaker 4: That's a great question, Lisa.

293

I would say in a collaborative divorce

especially, um, the efficiency, um, in

294

collecting your financial information

is, is better because you're not, you

295

know, in a traditional divorce scenario.

296

You know, one attorney is asking for all

of your financial documents and all of

297

your other information, the other spouse's

attorney is asking for that information.

298

In collaborative, I am the

point of contact for collecting

299

all of that information.

300

Um, so what we do is we take, collect

that information, you know, three months

301

of bank statements, tax returns, all

a lot of things that seem scary, and

302

we put it down on a balance sheet.

303

And we say, okay, here's

what it looks like.

304

And I help them understand what

they have and how it's owned.

305

Because to your point, Lisa, a lot

of couples, you know, usually one

306

spouse takes care of the finances and

the other takes care of the kids or

307

whatever, however they divide things.

308

So I think it's important for both parties

to know where their money is at, right?

309

And how it, and what it looks like.

310

So that's the first part of the financial

work that we do in collaborative.

311

The second part of the financial work

that we do, I think Jana already alluded

312

to, is around cashflow budgeting.

313

And okay, if you're going from a

household of one to a household of

314

two with the same level of incomes,

what is that gonna look like?

315

And I think that is a scary.

316

Factor for a lot of people as

they're going through it too, is how

317

am I gonna make it going forward?

318

So I collect things like their payroll

or their pay stubs, um, historical

319

expenses, and we work through them

together to come up with a plan.

320

And I think that's a key difference

in collaborative is, is, is it's the

321

husband and the wife, or both spouses

working together to get that information.

322

Um, once I have that

information from them.

323

Another part I love about collaborative

is the support level, right?

324

So each client has their own attorney

to support them in the process.

325

So not only are they working

with the financial neutral like

326

myself to help them help guide

them through what it looks like.

327

They have the support of the attorneys

to lean on to say, does this make sense?

328

Am I thinking about this right?

329

And I think the thing that sets it

apart as well is that it's all five

330

of us usually working together.

331

Um, and it's, we're working together

for the common good, and that is how

332

to get everyone in a better place.

333

Speaker: Yeah.

334

Amen.

335

Amen.

336

And I think no matter how

you do it, you need a team.

337

Because I know I had, um, someone who

dealt deals with mortgages on, and

338

I, and I'm sure Michelle, that's kind

of part of your, and that's scary

339

because some people have a really

low interest rate on a home and now.

340

If they're going to be selling it

or what have you, they're gonna

341

be spending a lot more because

the interest rates are higher.

342

And what I've, what I've learned,

which wouldn't happen in this

343

kind of a situation, is sometimes

information can get muddled and the

344

attorney can draft the agreement.

345

That, you know, someone's gonna

assume the mortgage and guess what?

346

They don't let them assume the mortgage.

347

And so those are things that can get

missed if you don't have that team.

348

So yeah, the attorney can write it up

and say, yep, uh, you're gonna assume.

349

And then sometimes too, they'll tell

you that you can assume the mortgage.

350

And then when things change and

they see how much you have after

351

the divorce, you're like, oh, no.

352

No, you can't assume.

353

So it's just, it's so, I think,

helpful to have that team.

354

Um, so there's the parenting,

the finance and the attorney.

355

Is there anyone else?

356

Speaker 2: So it's a case by case

situation and there are other

357

professionals that we sometimes

pull in depending on what's needed.

358

Um, one of those is a mediator.

359

Sometimes we have a mediator

help us, uh, just navigate.

360

A situation, um, mortgage experts.

361

We actually have a couple

supporting partners who are Yes,

362

Speaker: you have great ones.

363

You do.

364

Yes.

365

Speaker 2: Um, and they, they, they stay

up on the, the little caveats, right?

366

Mm-hmm.

367

If, if you're divorced, a lot of

times there's things that they

368

can do in that arena to make

sure we get the right wording.

369

So they're refre paperwork is the

most beneficial to you as well.

370

Yeah.

371

Um, another one, you know, realtors.

372

We are hooked up.

373

Speaker 3: Yep.

374

Speaker 2: Uh, with some

supporting partners in that

375

area and parenting coaches.

376

So we do have coaches who are

either aligned or neutral.

377

So a coach can work with both parents,

um, or be aligned to a single parent.

378

A lot of times that has

to do with communication.

379

Right?

380

Yeah.

381

And the forms of what inflames.

382

The situation versus how to communicate

what's needed to be communicated.

383

Speaker: Right.

384

And I mean, I know that there, there

is so much out there that tells us how

385

much better kids do when they have both

parents in their lives working together.

386

Not to scare someone who's

got a freaky narcissistic.

387

Uh, you can do it too, but it does, if

you can work together, it is so helpful.

388

For your kids.

389

And so that, I mean, I think that was

always, I'm a mama, I'm a grandma.

390

That was always one of the

things that really drove me.

391

Um, and Michelle, you had kids right?

392

When you went through

yours, how did they fare?

393

Speaker 4: Yeah, they're doing great now.

394

And I, what's crazy is while you're

married, one of the re one of the things

395

that people often think about is let's

just stay together till the kids graduate.

396

I remember my ex-husband and I

talked about that same thing.

397

Well, that's not always

what's in their best interest.

398

Speaker: Right.

399

Speaker 4: You know, I remember

thinking, oh, I have to keep that

400

family unit together because I

didn't believe in divorce either.

401

So you, you work through

it and you stuck it out.

402

But it's ironic to see how much

everyone is thriving after divorce.

403

You know, your kids get to

see you in a better place.

404

They get to see your

ex-spouse in a better place.

405

They see, um, you happier and

more in line with yourself.

406

And I think that alone is

something I didn't think about.

407

While I was going through it, right,

it was, everything's changing.

408

What are we gonna do now?

409

How is it gonna look?

410

And kids are resilient.

411

I mean, my kids are amazing.

412

They are doing great.

413

And I just can't, couldn't be more

proud of how they fared through it.

414

Speaker: Well, and Michelle, I think

too, I mean that speaks volumes to you,

415

but I think you, you bring something up.

416

I think children who go through

this, they can be more resilient.

417

They learn how to, you know,

they, the things are change.

418

I mean, you know what I mean?

419

It builds resiliency and grit.

420

And so there are some

good things about it.

421

And then another thing that I like that

you said is, and we always talk about how

422

you have to take care of yourself, right?

423

But we, it's hard to do that.

424

So if you are in this horrible

relationship that's not taking care of

425

yourself and that's, that's gonna speak

to your children, you know what I mean?

426

More than if you.

427

Can separate out in a good way.

428

So, okay.

429

I have to ask you a question because

this is something that people always

430

kind of bring up with collaborative law.

431

They, they get concerned because

what happens if it doesn't work?

432

So I think we have to talk about it.

433

What happens if it doesn't work?

434

Speaker 4: Yep.

435

Speaker 2: So there are a couple

options if it doesn't work, that's

436

part of, I'm gonna call it the, the

choice on the front end and making

437

sure that both individuals, both adults

understand the process, uh, before

438

we sign that participation agreement.

439

So it, it's their choice.

440

Right?

441

Speaker: Right.

442

Speaker 2: Um, once that participation

agreement is signed, we've all

443

agreed to certain conditions that

are in there, and one of those are.

444

If it doesn't work, if one of you

decides to step out of the collaborative

445

process, then both attorneys must

step off the case as well, and they

446

have to go hire traditional litigative

attorneys for the next steps for court.

447

That does not mean all of the

progress or anything that has

448

been accomplished is lost.

449

Um, let's say that they agree

to 90% and there's one thing

450

that they just can't figure out.

451

We can still enter that as that agreement

and they can just go litigate that one or

452

two things that they haven't figured out.

453

Speaker: Okay.

454

That's so key and I'm so glad

that you said that because

455

I think people miss that.

456

I think because this is

what I've heard before.

457

Well, if it doesn't work, you

gotta start all over again.

458

That's what I've heard.

459

That's not true.

460

Speaker 2: It is not true.

461

Speaker: So they get to use

the work that's been done.

462

Then they hire separate attorneys if

it's not working to deal with the issues

463

that they can't work on collaboratively.

464

So, and I know I don't expect you

to have any kinda numbers, but

465

do most of them work that you're

466

Speaker 4: i'll?

467

I'll pipe in on that one.

468

So of all the cases that I've done, I've

only had one that didn't work, and the

469

reason why it didn't work is they couldn't

come to agreements on spousal maintenance.

470

Oh,

471

Speaker 3: and

472

Speaker 4: so to Jana's

point, um, you know, the case.

473

It didn't, wasn't successful and

collaborative, but we did take all of

474

the information, the balance sheet,

the cash flow modeling, everything,

475

the tax planning, everything

we've done up until that point.

476

And yes, they have that information.

477

We got 95% of the way there.

478

We just couldn't get to

the, get to the very end.

479

So they hired new attorneys and,

and took it, took it from there.

480

Speaker: That's, that's good to hear.

481

Okay, so then there's another.

482

Another thing that you

hear sometimes is the cost.

483

Like I just think it's better

because you're doing it a better way.

484

Like how you end something

is how you begin another.

485

I believe that.

486

And so I would just wanna

do it even if it costs more.

487

Does it cost more or is it kind of the

same as if you both hired an attorneys?

488

Does col in general, what

is collaborative law known?

489

Is it more cost effective?

490

Speaker 4: I would say it all

depends on the case, right?

491

It always just depends.

492

Yeah.

493

It's typically more

expensive than mediation.

494

Yeah.

495

Obviously more expensive than doing it

yourself, pro se, but it's typically

496

less expensive than litigation.

497

And I would argue that it's more cost

efficient, like I mentioned before,

498

because you're not duplicating efforts,

you're not paying attorneys to look

499

at, um, multiple statements and

things that are, that were provided,

500

and then some things are missing on

one end, but a have on the other.

501

Right?

502

And then trying to coordinate

that you're paying attorney's

503

fees or you're paying paralegal

fees in order to have that happen.

504

Versus in collaborative, I'm that

point of contact or the neutral is

505

that point of contact where we, we

collaboratively work on it and it saves

506

them time and money in the process.

507

And that's, I think, a key point too

is, um, I would say collaborative

508

takes probably as long, if not

maybe just a little bit longer than

509

mediation, but a lot less time in

than in litigation, in my opinion.

510

Um, so it saves you time for sure.

511

And it can save you money from litigation.

512

Yeah.

513

And you have the support that you're

not necessarily gonna have, but

514

it's also important to be efficient.

515

So in cases that I work on, we schedule

all of our meetings out so we, they

516

know when they're gonna be done.

517

Speaker: Mm-hmm.

518

Speaker 4: Um, versus if you

litigate or if you have mediation,

519

it's sometimes it's up and there on

how long it's actually gonna take.

520

And I remember that being a fear of mine.

521

How much is it gonna cost me

and how long is it gonna take?

522

Speaker: Yeah.

523

So

524

Speaker 4: do I have to keep paying

those retainer fees into my attorneys,

525

um, in order to make that happen?

526

Yeah.

527

Versus I feel like you have

more awareness and it's more.

528

Cost effective in collaborative,

in my opinion, Jan

529

Speaker: and I always, yeah, I always

love the idea of people working together

530

and coming up with their agreement.

531

Together.

532

And that's kind of what, that's

what's happening with collaborative.

533

That's, that happens in mediation too.

534

And mediation can be

part of collaborative.

535

So yeah.

536

So they're both kinda the same.

537

And now I'm looking at the

time and it just sped right by.

538

So I just want to make sure that

my listeners know how to find

539

a collaborative law attorney.

540

How can they get information if

they're just starting this process?

541

Speaker 2: So as I mentioned, um.

542

I'm not sure when this is gonna go

live, but Divorce with Respect week

543

is March 1st through the eighth.

544

And during that week, if you just

Google Divorce with Respect Week,

545

um, it's a nationwide effort and

California is, I'm gonna say the host.

546

Um.

547

Site for it, but on their site, you can

click the state you're from and see all

548

the collaborative professionals in your

state who are participating in this week.

549

What we have committed to is to

give free 30 minute consultations

550

during that time with somebody who's

connected to us from this effort.

551

Um.

552

Aside from that, we have Collaborative

Law Institute of Minnesota, which

553

is where you can find us year round.

554

And on that you can find a professional

if you're looking, you know, to start

555

the process with a financial neutral

like Michelle, or if you wanna speak

556

with an attorney or a child specialist

first, you can find it on that site.

557

Wonderful,

558

Speaker: wonderful.

559

Speaker 4: And then you can

also go to our websites too.

560

So we can sometimes they, sometimes

collaborative cases start with attorneys.

561

Sometimes they start with the.

562

The family specialist.

563

Sometimes they start

with someone like myself.

564

Right.

565

So yeah, if you, if Divorce with

Respect Week, the collaborative

566

site or reach out to Jana and I.

567

Speaker: All right.

568

And I will have that in the show notes.

569

So Jana and Michelle, thank you

so much for taking the time.

570

I know you're busy.

571

I really appreciate it and I

know that this is really helpful

572

information to get out there.

573

So thank you so much.

574

Speaker 4: Thank you.

575

Thank you, Lisa.

576

Speaker: Take good care.

577

Speaker 4: You too.

578

Bye.