How can you build a happy, healthy life while navigating complicated family relationships—and still set boundaries that honor your well-being?

In this thought-provoking episode of the Collide Podcast, we sit down with therapist Greg Fischer, PhD to talk about navigating complex family dynamics and setting healthy boundaries. Greg helps us unpack the unspoken roles, patterns, and scripts many of us inherit within our families—and how those dynamics impact our relationships as adults. Whether you’re navigating ongoing conflict, wrestling with forgiveness, or discerning when boundaries are necessary, this episode will remind you that healing is possible and clarity brings freedom.

Meet Greg Fischer, PhD

Greg is a licensed therapist, assistant professor of clinical psychology at George Fox University, and former pastor with a deep understanding of family systems and relational healing. He holds a PhD in Marriage and Family Therapy and brings both clinical expertise and pastoral wisdom into conversations around conflict, repair, and reconciliation. Greg is passionate about helping individuals and families move toward health, honesty, and sustainable connection.

In This Episode, You’ll Learn

1. How to take inventory of your family dynamics and relational patterns
2. How to recognize inherited roles and scripts that shape your behavior
3. Whether repair is possible after relational harm—and what it can look like
4. The difference between forgiveness and reconciliation
5. When boundaries are necessary and how to implement them well
6. The best ways to address conflict with a family member in a healthy, grounded way

How This Episode Will Encourage You

If you’ve ever felt stuck in painful family patterns or unsure how to move forward without causing more harm, this episode will offer clarity, language, and practical tools. You’ll be reminded that setting boundaries is not unloving, repair takes wisdom, and you are allowed to pursue peace without abandoning yourself.

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Hey there. Welcome to the Collide podcast. I'm so glad you hopped on here.

We are a little bit out away from the holidays, and I don't know if you've had a moment to take a deep breath and pause and reflect, or if you're still sort of reeling from things that happen in your family over the holidays. My hope is that that's not the case and that you had pure joy, light, and love.

But I think what's true is a lot of us have complicated dynamics, complicated relationships, complicated family. And because of that, I really wanted to do this interview with Greg Fisher, who is. He is many things. He is a therapist. He is in pastoral ministry.

He graduated with a PhD in marriage and family therapy. And he also is a professor at George Fox University.

And I wanted to have him on and talk about what does it look like to pursue peace and navigate family dynamics, because so many of those just really peak at the holidays.

So I don't know what happened between you and your aunt or you and your mom or you and your kid, but I have a feeling that this conversation that I'm about to hand you is going to challenge you, bless you, and encourage you. Take a listen. Greg, you are a man of many talents. I've been doing some research on you and your life.

You've worked in private practice, pastoral ministry, and now train future clinicians at George Fox University. I mean, what don't you do?

Yeah, for a while I called it my sampler platter of ministry and type. Yeah, I've done quite a bit and I do love that. Even still the variety. I still have a small private practice. I teach, I supervise, I get to do a lot.

And I'm blessed and have all these opportunities.

Really, I love that so much. And you whitewater raft, play soccer and do CrossFit, which my husband does. And so good for you. That's an intense little side sport. Hustle.

Yeah. Keeps me. Keeps me active, for sure.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Cool. Well, thank you for making the time to hop on.

We're sort of engaging in this conversation after the holidays and we, when we thought about having you on, we thought we really want to have a conversation about pursuing peace and navigating family dynamics because so many sort of dysfunctional dynamics pop up over the holidays.

And then after everyone goes back to their homes and their jobs and we take the Christmas decorations down and people get busy again, I think a lot of us are left with, oh my goodness, concerns, worry, anxiety, old family of origin, roles and identities creeping up. Somebody lashed out. At the Christmas table. And now we have a need for confrontation. I mean, there's all these things that pop up.

And I'm curious, in your work with people, what do we do? What's our first step? When we start to feel like, oh man, we saw some family dynamics that we are uncomfortable with, what do we do with that?

Because a lot of us, I think, tend to just sort of sweep it under the rug because we don't know what to do.

Yeah, yeah. That's the question, right? What do we do?

Because I think our go to our tendency is way too like, those holidays are stressful and we so easily just kind of brush it off thinking, like, even if it's conscious, but a lot of times subconscious, like, I don't really have to deal with it again for another year. No, the question of what do we do with those things, I think it's much more important to.

In the right proper place and time, but to address these things. I just think it's how we have to grow as people, as individuals, as units, even like a unit family, but even like a larger extended family. Too many.

I mean, way too much. I think particularly Western and American culture, we lean to not having these conversations rather than actually having them. And so.

So that's kind of step one is it's not okay, let's just ignore it or brush under the rug or deal with it in future interactions, but to actually address and deal with things well.

And so I would say that in dealing with it isn't just like to approach or force a conversation, But I think, to put it simply, I usually say the goal has to be truth and the method has to be love. I think those two things are going to be essential. So not I have to be heard. I have to get my point across, blah, blah, I have to win an argument.

Those don't usually, when you start with that plan, it doesn't usually go great. But when you really approach of no, my goal is to love and to build in this relationship. That's a great place to at least start.

Hmm. I love that quote so much I just wrote it down.

I'm curious if you can give us some examples of what if your goal is truth and the method is love, what that looks like versus what it doesn't. Like an actual example of going in with this posture versus going in with this posture. Going in with this posture versus this.

Yeah. Well, I think it's when. Well, so it's human nature. We naturally get defensive and those defenses go up quickly Anytime we start to feel threatened.

And so even when the person we're having a conversation with or we're trying to have with, we don't mean to be offensive if they perceive that defenses are going up. And so that's kind of why I just. That's just a general where I start of a method being love and the goal being just truth and relationship building.

That can ease a lot of that. If that's truly understood. If I truly receive from the person trying to talk to me like, oh, they mean well, I may not agree.

I might even still be offended at some things, but I know their intentions, that's going to lower a lot of defenses.

Before we get in more to this idea of how to communicate our truths to people in love, what's the long term effect if we just continue to ignore the family dynamics that are unhealthy?

Yeah, I think we've all seen that in our families. I think we know the long term effect is it builds resentment and frustration. And these things will only surface the next holiday season.

When we don't deal with these things, they don't fade away, they just fester. I always tell my clients, well, I usually say this about anger, but it's true about an issue like this too.

It is going to surface somewhere and it'll probably, if it's not dealt with, it'll probably surface in a way you're not prepared for or not expecting. But the idea that it's just going to fade away, that's a falsehood.

It's so interesting because I feel like there's family dynamics or relationships, and I'm sure you could put this in way better terms than I can, where we've been in relationship with someone in our family in such a way where they've acted in a way that has taught us or trained us or coached us not to confront their behavior. Like, oh, if I confront this person, they blow up and get angry. Or if I confront them, they gaslight me.

Or if I confront them with my truth, they whatever. And so we've been trained to just continue to keep ignoring it because ignoring it feels easier than bringing it up.

What's your advice for people who are in that position?

Yeah, so that's a great question, because there are a couple things there.

If it is a really hostile dynamic like that, I mean, even just the thing you just described could essentially, and I don't like to throw this word around too flippantly, but essentially as that progress could be in a kind of a narcissistic category, and that's we're dealing with some real issues there. Right. And someone like that, and that's just one example.

There could be several different personality disorders or some major chronic kind of relational issues that, if that's the case, even when love and good intentions is communicated, that's never going to really be received because so particularly a narcissist. That's actually what a narcissist is, is they never trust that you actually, they don't even see you as a human able to love them.

So they're never going to trust that that's actually what you're wanting to do. And so that gets us some really dysfunction. But again, I, I don't want to quickly label this. Just a lot of problems, just, oh, a narcissist.

I think that happens too quickly sometimes. But to your question, in those situations, I mean, I'm a therapist. I'm a big fan of getting a family therapist involved if that's what's needed.

Because you're very right in just attempting to address these things or talk about these things is only going to perpetuate that cycle. If you're really not breaking out of that and it steps into some of these very similar patterns.

That's really where I'll see, like, you need a third party, a mediator, ideally some kind of family therapist.

How do you bring up the idea of bringing in a third party therapist to someone in your family without being like, you have problems. We need to get therapy. Like, what's a way to lay out that invitation that feels healthy.

Yeah, I would lean back to the same kind of things. I always say.

So when I'm seeing a couple or any kind of even parent to child, any kind of relationship sitting on my couch, I tell them, the client here, my client is this relationship. It's not either individual or whatnot. And some of that I just say so they help kind of understand the dynamic, what's going on.

But I think I encourage clients to present it that way as well. Not the message, you have a problem, we need to go to therapy, fix. But like, our relationship is not what I want it to be.

I think most people can get on board with that. Like, hey, I'm inviting you to step in with me.

That we could be stronger, healthier, more beneficial for each other and our larger family context as well. I think just about anybody would be on board with that. If not like that, that's a red flag.

Like if someone's really opposed to improving a relationship. So that's usually where I'd say to come at it from beyond that. And this, this happens a little more within marriage.

But it's hard for anybody to hear, oh, if there's something wrong with the relationship, it means there's something wrong with me and they can't handle that. That then we're talking some more kind of diagnosable problems as well.

Yeah, I like the invitation of I really care about you and I want to better this relationship. I feel like you talked earlier about putting people on the by how we communicate and I think that lessens the defense. Right.

Like if it's from a place of I love you and I want to be closer to you and I think this could help us get there. That's so different than I'm so sick of this with you. I'm so tired of cycling. You have problems, you need to go to a therapist, right?

Absolutely. Because as you said, the one sounds like an attack, like there's something wrong with you.

Whereas opposed to the other, like, hey, I'd actually like to be closer, more intimate with you. That can be an invitation that every one of us wants. Right. Even if we don't admit it. That is a deep core something like God gave each one of us.

So that's an invitation I find very few people are going to reject.

You talked about the goals truth, the methods love. What are some Greg Fisher's don't do this when communicating the truth to someone else.

Well, I chose the word truth on purpose because we even have to get real, start to realize our perspective does not necessarily mean truth. And so that's where a lot of these statements like as, as in the therapy world we're pretty used to and a lot even roll our eyes at now.

But it's the, the I feel or when you I feel statements when you do this I feel this. That kind of pulls it back into just a place we can talk about it rather than like, do you have the problem?

Or even the way I see it, like the way my perspective, if I present that as truth, that becomes a problem. So that's the reason I choose truth as the goal. It's a very specific word.

And beyond just like my personal truth or my perspective, that part's really important to me.

So I know you kind of made a joke about we might roll our eyes on the when you I feel but could you give us some examples of some healthy ways to communicate to say a parent that you're frustrated with or a spouse you're frustrated with? That's a loving way to express those truths.

Yeah. So like I Said just in the therapy world, that statement has been just kind of overdone. But there's a place for it.

And so it's just keeping things in the realm of, so you're not presenting as what you're doing is fact or certainly I knew your intentions, but to say, this is how I interpret it felt and this is how it affected me, that's valid and, and, and much harder to refute. I see a lot of couples or clients working on a relationship. They get caught up in the minutia of, no, that actually was true.

No, like, you know, words like always never always mess us up because was like, well, it's not always. Well, you're totally missing the point. She really think it's actually always. She thinks it's just very common.

It's just a very, very likely pattern that she's stuck in. I'm drifting away a little bit. Your question was how to approach that to loved ones or even parents. I think. I think humility is a big one.

So it's not just my feelings are valid or my experience of this relationship, but it's, hey, I'm also concerned how you're experiencing, interpreting me and understanding that those communication is going two ways, both in what you're sending each other and both how you're receiving from each other. That kind of understanding, I think is a good place to start, for sure.

That's so good. I mean, I'm even thinking of, I had one conflict this holiday.

I won't go into it, but it's so good to hear you say, well, actually I had a really fantastic Christmas.

But even you saying that, I think that's a good question to ask ourselves before we go into a conversation with someone that we're having conflict with, where they bring their struggles to us. And. And I just asked myself, am I caring and concerned about how they feel, or am I only trying to defend myself? So I love that you brought that up.

Greg. What do we do about the inherited roles and scripts that we were handed to in our family of origin that we no longer like nor want to live into?

How do we break free of those?

Yeah, it's a great question because I think we all have those. Every family has this, like, we use the term homeostasis. We borrow that from the science world. It's this kind of like, typical pattern. We're just.

Whether it's healthy or not, it's no comment on how healthy it is. It's just what's typical and expected of a family. We all have one. I Promise. We all do.

And even when someone tries to step out correct, like I want to interact better, I want to change this or improve. It's natural. Every one of us gets pulled back into that natural kind of place because it's what we're so used to.

The first place I think to start is acknowledging it. We got to talk about, hey, this is our pattern guys. We all get stuck in this.

I was working with a family the other day and their go to is when they're together, everybody's on their phone individually. That was like a major issue they all had to talk about. And the first thing to do is just acknowledge it.

And some people were like, I don't think we're on our phone any more than any other family. Others saw it as more of a problem. Some of it never even thought about it. And so it was just something to at least we have to talk about.

Then the next question is kind of that getting to a place of do we agree on what's healthy or what's not? And there will be some disagreement there. Some people will be like, I think it's fine, I don't think we should touch it.

But that kind of thing also has to be ventured in a talk. Talked about. Yeah. And not. And then I guess along with that and not being afraid to have a disagreement is going to be really important too.

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I mean I think sometimes we throw boundaries around like oh, we're unhappy with someone in our family. We just kind of want to scream boundaries and put up a wall so we don't have to like deal with something we don't like.

But obviously boundaries are also very necess.

So how do we know when we're supposed to instill boundaries and what those are versus we're using boundaries as an excuse to not have to deal with conflict in relationship.

Yeah, that's such a good question because.

You'Re laughing at me as I ask it. But I honestly I think this is something we sometimes do is like we don't want to deal with a hard relationship so we just slap a boundary up.

Yeah, no, no, I'm not laughing at you.

I'm like, yes, no, no, no.

Very relevant question.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, no, I'm laughing with you laughing because it's like, oh, yeah, no, we do this for sure.

Yes.

Unfortunately, what I think happens a lot is people who tend to have rigid boundaries only escalate and push their boundaries, and people who have poor boundaries tend to get bulldozed, if that's. That's the dynamic. And it's kind of like we need to send the opposite message to those two camps. The.

Those with rigid boundaries need to learn to be more palatable. Where some of those who get bulldozed, they. They're the ones who do need to set some boundaries.

So often in culture where we have confirmation bias and we send those to the wrong. They'll send those messages to the wrong camps, I think. How to set boundaries. There is a. I mean, there is a time and place.

There is absolutely a time and place where you know what you are. Someone may be unhealthy to me in my life or my family or whatever it might be, and there needs to be cut off or at least some kind of limitations.

I do think we went kind of swung the pendulum a little bit culture wise. We run to that a little bit too easily.

And I think there's not as much effort and work put into, hey, I really want, like, this is toxic or might not be that healthy, but I want to work on this relationship. I don't think we always run to that as much as maybe we should. I was reflecting the other day, I caught up with some. I ran into an old friend.

Like, she was a friend from high school and college years. And she told me, you know, just catch up, how's this? How's that?

She goes, oh, well, you know, I asked her about her parents and she said, oh, well, I don't speak to my parents. You know, I cut them off. And she almost said that as like, like a source of pride.

Like, like, it almost felt like I should follow up with, oh, congratulations. And. And I was just like, it just struck me as how much we applaud that, I think in certain camps and culture and subcultures. And I really.

I really walked away, just sad, you know, like, like, yeah, that parent to child relationship is severed for right now. And of course, I don't know all the details and whatnot. I really hadn't kept in touch with her.

But I do think as a culture, we can run to that too quickly. But I also, I'm sitting here thinking, which Camp am I talking to.

And as you said, you minister to women, I would imagine, and I don't really know the research on this, but I would imagine women are a little more in the camp of getting bulldozed. And so I don't know.

That's a real good question too, of the right time, of when to set bound, when those boundaries need to be not just set, but then enforced. I think set is an initial phase and then there's like follow up maintenance, really.

Yeah.

It's interesting, you know, I think about my own pain, my own family dysfunction, and certainly there was much for me as a child and growing up with the parents that I had and then becoming a follower of Christ and seeing the continual invitation to forgive, to reconcile. We have a God who reconciles those who are far away to himself, and he calls us to do the same.

A God who is always giving second and third and 100 chances and this idea of grace. And so it's hard to sort of shake the radical call of Christ in this. But also there are truly relationships that are continuing to harm us.

And I think what I found, and you might be able to speak to this in more of a professional manner than I can, but as a person who's had to wrestle through those things of like experiencing abuse and addiction and neglect and all of these things. And then when I gave my life to Jesus, hearing this like radical call to forgive and reconcile, I had to wrestle with those things.

And I think what really helped me was continuing to spend time with Jesus in his word, collide with him, look at him, want to be like him, go to therapy, bring up the hurt and the pain, and have a professional kind of guide me on what would a process of walking towards forgiveness and reconciliation look like and what do boundaries look like along the way? And then also surrounding yourself with friends and people you can trust who will speak into.

They won't just tell you congratulations when you put up a wall, but they also will keep you safe.

And so to me, it's almost like this thing that needs to happen in safe community where people are speaking into your life on the best way to know when to put up a boundary and when to walk into forgiveness and reconciliat. Does that make sense?

Yeah, absolutely.

Do you have any advice on how, when you meet with clients, how they know when to do what?

For sure, yeah. So I teach a course on conflict reconciliation, forgiveness. That's what the whole course is on. It's one of my favorites.

And so that's one of the first Things to do is distinguish, right there. Forgiveness and reconciliation are not the same thing.

I think, absolutely, as you were talking about, it is part of our call as followers of Christ to forgive. I don't think it's always necessarily we're called to reconcile, as in to return to relationship.

You also mentioned there talking about serious levels of abuse or that level of toxicity. I would want to be pretty clear on. I'm very in favor of boundaries in those places.

In that example, I remember once I saw a client as a couple, they came to see me, just the intake, just the first session, because the wife told me that he had cheated on her and he had physically abused her. And I just looked at her right in front of him and said. And she explained a lot more detail. But it was.

It was clear to me that this was a pretty toxic situation. And I just looked right at her with him sitting right there, and I said, he's going to cheat on you again. He's going to beat you again.

And you need to get out and get it, get to a safe place. And she just kind of looked a little defeated.

And she's like, here's the third therapist to tell me that I was just like, just heartbroken that she was so stuck in this place and couldn't get out to a safe and healthy place. And I'm not sure this is years ago, so I don't remember exactly what was like, drawing her.

I don't think it was so much religious conviction, but she just felt so tied to him, you know.

So I do like to distinguish that we are all called to forgive, not necessarily always called to reconcile or to stay in a really unhealthy or abusive relationship. I do want to make that clear to anyone listening. Did that answer your question? Sometimes I worry if I trailed off or something.

Yeah, I'm curious how confident you are that repair is possible. Let's take those moments, more serious things off the table.

But sort of, all families have these dysfunctional things that happen and peace is necessary. And I think oftentimes people just think, oh, this person will never change. This dynamic will never change. This pattern will never change.

How do you want to speak to us about how confident you are that repair is possible?

That's such a great question. And I almost like, I want to know, what hat am I wearing? Am I wearing a therapist hat or am I wearing a follower of Christ hat?

And not that I always like to distinguish those two things. I like to merge them, but those answers would kind of be different.

So any question that Starts with is it possible if I'm wearing my follower of Christ hat? Well, all things are possible.

All things are possible through Christ, but I think that takes a radical version of following him, one that we're not always all too familiar with. So it's definitely possible. Now for a minute, I'm going to take that off and put on therapist hat.

There is a reality to at some point some people aren't going to change. We have to face that we can't always be this idealist, that every person is always looking to grow and improve.

There is a level that some people just refuse to change or don't want to or don't have the ability. But what can change is how we interact with that, how we interpret it, how we allow it to affect us.

That can then even have not just repercussions for our own self and mental health and well being, but even for that relationship and that dynamic. And in those cases are probably where some healthy boundaries do need to be established and affirmed.

But I would you talked about repair requires the radical version of following Jesus. What is that radical version?

I think it, what I mean is more than just the, the, The good person, church attending Christian, but the one who says Jesus, I want all of you and I give you all of me and allows that kind of life transformation. And it is, it is a lot. It's painful, it's overwhelming, it's a whole lot of things, but it's also beautiful.

And including our relationship with others, like how when he really starts to transform who we are, it transform every relationship we're in. Unfortunately, even in a majority Christian culture, that kind of expression I have found to be much more of a minority.

Hmm. When I throw these terms out at you, what do you immediately think of when it comes to family dynamics? Real peace versus fake peace?

Yeah, yeah. As far as family dynamics, fake peace is no peace at all.

Just because someone is kept at bay or pleased to where, you know, they're behaving or performing well, I, I don't think that's, that's really going to be healthy at all. I, yeah, I wouldn't call it peace.

Yeah, I think a lot of us are walking around just trying to keep the peace, but it's not real peace, it's fake peace. And I think I'm hoping this conversation encourages people to walk towards real peace.

When you think about someone listening who hasn't had peace in their family, or maybe little things keep happening that bug them, that make them kind of distance themselves or feel annoyed or bitter or Whatever it is. But they're like, it's just little. In the realm of all things. What happens to little things in relationship with family if we don't deal with them?

I mean, kind of, kind of a myriad of things, a spectrum, if you will. Yes, there is something too. If we let little things slide, they will just build up and fester. And like, there's a.

That point is valid, but there's also a. I kind of call it coming at it from the back door rather than this annoys me a little bit, so I need to address it, asking why am I annoyed by that? And kind of going at like, how could I better serve this person, you know, partner, spouse, sibling, parent, whatever, whatever the relationship is.

How could I better serve that to where. Basically to where we can navigate these things better. Because big part of the reality that needs to be brought in.

There's definitely something irritating or annoying that, that you do as well. And the question is, what level, a varying level, are we going to bring these to each other? I know this couple.

They're a great couple, from what I can tell. I think they have a great, healthy marriage.

They've been married several decades, you know, and they have a practice on a daily basis of sitting on the couch together and talking about everything that annoyed them that day, when you did this, when you said this, when you forgot to say this or forgot to do this, whatever it might be, whatever it is that day, and they talk about it.

That is a heavy level of vulnerability, exposure on a daily basis, getting to hear, I missed this, I dropped the ball here, or this annoyed my partner in this way. And yet being at that kind of place, there's something really healthy and awesome about that. And I think they have a really strong marriage for it.

Greg, for the person listening who just feels really stuck in their family dynamics, what hope do you have for them today?

Yeah, I mean, the first thing I would say is that you're stuck is a lie. Like, that's just. That's just not true. And there's a little nuance there.

There might be some reality that, you know, what, yes, some of these problems might still persist, but they don't have to keep affecting you or ruling, running your life the way they have been. There's absolutely freedom. Like, you're not stuck. Again, there might be a detail.

Yeah, you might have a parent who's chronically ill. You might have a family member who, yeah, just doesn't want to change or whatever it might be. That could be part of the reality.

I don't want to just dismiss it away, but to say that this is what your life is and this is the repetitive pattern, that's just not true. I truly believe anyone, particularly with Christ in their life, can step out of any kind of trap or pattern that they feel stuck in.

Yeah, I firmly believe that that's probably the guiding principle under my family therapy.

My last question for you, Greg, is if they want to step out of that stuckness, what are the like first couple things you recommend they try?

Big proponent of family therapy if needed. I would also just say continual self growth. Yeah, like, okay, if you recognize a pattern, cool. Learn about it.

Learn about your reactions, how you are, how you are stepping to that pattern as well. Like everything is cyclical, everything is, is a system. And so we can't just point a blame at whoever this family member is.

How you are reacting to it is perpetuating as well. Learn about that. Like there's so much out there, so many great books, podcasts, all these kind of things for. For growth. Yeah.

So many of us just stay stuck because we don't even know there's an option for something different. But I think very much there is and there's. There's a world of resources out there.

Hmm. Well, thank you so much, Greg. I know that there's going to people who want to check out what you do and your work and your therapy.

How can they do that?

Yeah, absolutely. So I'm licensed in the state of Oregon, so if they are an Oregon resident, they're welcome to come see me. I just have a Psych Today page.

You can just look up my name on Psych Today. Greg Fisher. Don't forget the C in my name as well as then I have.

I co own a company with few of my colleagues called Oregon Institute of Behavioral Health OIBH and that does have a website. OIBH is mainly. A lot of my students are seeing clients there.

But either one of those resources is a great way to find or get a hold of me and even if I can't help you or I'm not the right fit, I'd be happy to help or send them to the right place. That would be. So yeah.

Greg, thank you for hopping on and helping us get unstuck.

Hey, thanks so much for having me. This was great.

Friend. My hope is that you don't have to listen to that podcast episode. You didn't have to listen to it because you don't need it.

But what I know to be true about the human experience is that family is very complicated I know that I have been hurt by family and I've hurt family and dynamics come up. And I want to normalize that a little bit because I think if we can be real that that's true for most people, then we're not going to feel so stuck.

This is the normal human experience to have conflict and unrest, irritation and unforgiveness pop up. But my hope is also that you would hear Greg when he says that you don't have to say stay stuck.

It doesn't mean that you can change your loved ones or change their behavior, but you yourself do not have to remain feeling stuck in this place.

And when I look at the life of Jesus in the New Testament, when I've experienced him myself, he continues to show up over and over again in people's lives who feel so stuck, like nothing's moving, nothing's getting better, prayers aren't being answered, circumstances in relationships aren't improving any helps people get unstuck. And so much of that work has to do with us taking the next step, us moving, us participating in the peace and the healing that we long for.

I actually talk about this in my book that's about to release.

And I want to encourage you today to think about what is one step, one move you can make today to help you get unstuck in the complicated or unhealthy family dynamic that you're dissatisfied with. What is the one thing you can do? Lord, I pray that you would give us courage to take this step.

I pray that you would bless this act and move that we are aligning with you to do and that you would bring more peace into our life. And we pray this in Jesus name. Amen, friend. Keep colliding and we'll catch you next week.