Shownotes
Dr. Sarah Boston, DVM, DVSc, DACVS-SA, joins Dr. Andy Roark for a hilarious and surprisingly thoughtful conversation about the worst advice they've heard in veterinary medicine. From "if you love what you do, you'll never work a day in your life" to "just let them simmer" when clients are upset, they unpack the well-intentioned wisdom that can sometimes lead us astray, while exploring career development, work-life balance, veterinary culture, and what actually makes good professional advice. You'll laugh, nod in agreement, and probably rethink a few pieces of guidance you've accepted as truth. Gang, let's get into this episode!
Transcripts
Welcome everybody to the Cone
of Shame Veterinary Podcast.
2
:I am your host, Dr.
3
:Andy Roark.
4
:Guys, it is the 400th episode
of the Cone of Shame Show.
5
:400 episodes.
6
:I- it's so hard for me to believe.
7
:I think this is a great episode I have
for you today to kind of bookend where
8
:we started from because Sarah Boston, Dr.
9
:Sarah Boston, who I have today, was
also the first guest I ever had on the
10
:Cone of Shame show, and we talk about
that a little bit here at the beginning.
11
:, It was kind of a lark.
12
:I had this idea for a conversation that
I wanted to have that I thought would be
13
:really interesting, and I wanted to have a
reason to sit someone brilliant like, Dr.
14
:Boston down and just and talk
to her and spend time with her.
15
:And, and I was like, "Let's
just make a podcast."
16
:That'll give me a reason to do cool stuff
with people that I'm, you know, , either
17
:have always wanted to talk to, or I'm
kind of intimidated by, or I, I feel like
18
:I need a reason to spend time with them.
19
:And, that's just...
20
:I kind of started it from a selfish
reason, and it's turned into one of
21
:the most, popular podcasts in the
industry, by a, by a good margin.
22
:So, it's been a wonderful
journey along the way.
23
:Sarah and I today are talking
about that's bad advice.
24
:We go through and we talk about the advice
that we have heard in our career, and we
25
:thought, "Yeah, that's, that's not good."
26
:, we, we go back and forth a little bit.
27
:Some of the advice we actually wrestle
around with a little bit and kind of
28
:decide that maybe it's pretty good advice.
29
:Other advice, we come to an agreement,
yeah, like that, that's bad.
30
:People need to stop saying that.
31
:Or, , we n- a- anyone who's
heard that needs to, needs
32
:to recognize that's not good.
33
:Don't do that.
34
:And so that's what the episode is today.
35
:If you're interested in the bad
advice that we have heard, , tune
36
:in, buckle up, and hang on.
37
:That's what we're doing for Cone
of Shame, episode number 400.
38
:Let's get into it
39
:Kelsey Beth Carpenter: This is your show.
40
:We're glad you're here.
41
:We want to help you in
your veterinary career.
42
:Welcome to the Cone of Shame with Dr.
43
:Andy Roark.
44
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
Welcome to the podcast, Dr.
45
:Sarah Boston.
46
:How are you, my friend?
47
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: Andy.
48
:I'm great.
49
:It's good to see you.
50
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
It's so good to see you.
51
:We're recording this at the end of my
workday, and I used to say visiting
52
:with you is about the best thing that
can happen to me at the end of the day.
53
:It's really fantastic to see you
54
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
I, I concur.
55
:Anytime's
56
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: out.
57
:Stay.
58
:For, for those who don't know you,
you are, gosh, here's so many things.
59
:You are a boarded
veterinary, onco surgeon.
60
:You have been a faculty member at more
than one college of veterinary medicine.
61
:I mean, you're still in practice,
as anse, and also you are a
62
:blossoming standup comedian.
63
:I see you doing shows, all over.
64
:Canada, you are starting, your
acting career is kind of taken off.
65
:You're starting to do some, you
know, it's kind of taken off.
66
:You're doing
67
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
Well, okay, sure.
68
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
it's it's happening.
69
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: It's a
70
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
happening.
71
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah.
72
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
It's on your calendar.
73
:It's on your, it's on your schedule.
74
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: it
75
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
Okay, perfect.
76
:That's it exactly.
77
:Right.
78
:So that's your, your acting career
79
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
have done
80
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
happening.
81
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
additions.
82
:I,
83
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yes.
84
:I like, to me that's, to me that's it.
85
:That's taking off.
86
:You have, most of us just
think about doing the thing
87
:and you're, and you're out.
88
:You're out actually auditioning
and, and making it happen.
89
:So anyway, that's it.
90
:You are one of my favorite
people to talk to you.
91
:We.
92
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
Thank you.
93
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
We have, you might know us from such
94
:podcast episodes as are we bad people?
95
:And this is gross and
you're doing it wrong.
96
:are some of our previous conversations
that we had today, I thought we
97
:would get together and talk about.
98
:That's bad advice.
99
:I think that's, that's what I wanna
call this episode is that's bad advice.
100
:And I thought that we could talk about
some of the things that we see that
101
:would just go, that's, that's bad advice.
102
:I,
103
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: I love
104
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: I
wish they wouldn't do that, but yeah.
105
:What do you, how do you feel about.
106
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
you will just like, send me a
107
:text and be like, Hey, Sarah,
you wanna talk about this thing?
108
:Or like, we'll just come up with
like, we're like, yeah, that's
109
:a good thing to talk about.
110
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
I think, yeah, I think I sent you
111
:a, a text message that says, what do
you think about, that's bad advice.
112
:And we just talk about that
and you were like, I'm in
113
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: sure.
114
:Let's
115
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: it
116
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah.
117
:Book it.
118
:book it.
119
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
book it between, between my auditions,
120
:we put this on the calendar, so yeah.
121
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: Lady
122
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
So yeah.
123
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
audition right
124
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
So lady cop audition.
125
:So yeah, you're going up.
126
:Do you think that being a practicing
veterinary onco surgeon helps you when
127
:you audition for the role of lady cop?
128
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: I do.
129
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah.
130
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
Yeah, I do.
131
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
They're like, she's,
132
:she'll figure this out.
133
:Like she's, at least we
know she's not gonna be dim.
134
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
Some authority maybe, I don't know.
135
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
could see that.
136
:Co competent, I think.
137
:I think you, I think you radiate
confidence and competence.
138
:It's one of the things I love about you.
139
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: yeah.
140
:So we'll see how it goes.
141
:We'll, hope hopefully the casting
director also feels that way.
142
:Yeah.
143
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
I dunno.
144
:Fingers crossed.
145
:So anyway, when I say that's bad advice,
what comes, what comes to your mind?
146
:What is the thing, what is the thing
that you've heard recently or that
147
:stuck out to you in your career where
you were like, that's bad advice.
148
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: Okay.
149
:I've had so much bad advice
through the years and it, so I
150
:don't even know where to start,
151
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
I love that.
152
:Like since I texted you,
let's do, that's bad advice.
153
:I, every couple of days I get
a ping from you that's like,
154
:Hey, I got, I got some more.
155
:And I'm like, look, it's like
a 20 minute episode, Sarah.
156
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: I
157
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: like,
158
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
that's the thing, so I gotta,
159
:okay, so I gotta focus.
160
:Well, this is one that
makes me laugh, and I've had
161
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: okay.
162
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
multiple times when people talk about
163
:when you're, and maybe it's more academic
environments, but I think it's everywhere.
164
:And people say in veterinary medicine,
they say you have to pick your battles.
165
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah.
166
:You think that's bad advice?
167
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: Well,
no, I just like, why am I going to battle?
168
:Like, I'm a, I don't what
169
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
I think that's good advice
170
:to give to you specifically.
171
:You know, why
172
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
Because of
173
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
because
174
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
sense of justice.
175
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
exactly right.
176
:That's exactly what I was gonna say,
because you haven't overdeveloped it.
177
:That's one of the things I love about you.
178
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: I
179
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
But the, you don't turn
180
:down a battle very often.
181
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
Oh, so maybe it's good advice,
182
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
think it's good advice for you.
183
:I do.
184
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
but also like, I'm like, okay, but
185
:I'm like, why is there a battle?
186
:Why is there so much injustice?
187
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah,
188
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
That's my.
189
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
that's,
190
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: So
maybe it's good advice in an unjust
191
:world, but I just think like, can I
just go to work and take care of animals
192
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: yeah.
193
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
going to battle?
194
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
So you're saying I shouldn't
195
:have to pick my battles.
196
:You
197
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: I am
198
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
you people should just
199
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
Yeah, I shouldn't have a battle.
200
:Like unless I'm an
active duty veterinarian,
201
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: you
get the role of lady Cop and then you're,
202
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
it's like,
203
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
you're ready, to go.
204
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
one, that's fine.
205
:'cause I can.
206
:I will find another one.
207
:I think this is another one
that's misleading to the youth.
208
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Okay.
209
:Yeah.
210
:Okay.
211
:Tell me more about that.
212
:What do you mean?
213
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
When people say, and it's not
214
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: I.
215
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
medicine, but I think veterinary medicine
216
:is very, like, very susceptible to this.
217
:When people say, well, if
you love what you do, you'll
218
:never work a day in your life.
219
:You know, that sense of
220
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah.
221
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: like.
222
:You should love this and you
should love every moment.
223
:You're lucky to be here and you
love animals and you should just be,
224
:you should just, this isn't work.
225
:And I'm like, but actually it's work.
226
:Like
227
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah.
228
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
that's, that's good advice necessarily.
229
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
No, I, I think you're right.
230
:I think it's interesting too, so as
you're someone who's, you know, like
231
:been on the faculty and, and stuff,
and like people are like, yeah, this
232
:is, this is kind of who you are.
233
:I mean, do you, do you ever get
that vibe where people like that
234
:you're, did, did people ever expect
you to be defined by your job?
235
:Do you think
236
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: Oh,
well, I think I expected me to be defined
237
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
really?
238
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: job.
239
:I think I am defined by my job.
240
:Don't you think that?
241
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: What?
242
:So tell, tell me what, tell me what
you mean when you, when you say that
243
:you think you're defined by your job.
244
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: every
veterinarian is defined by their job,
245
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
oh, man.
246
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
don't you think?
247
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah.
248
:It's, it's, it's definitely a, a like, I'm
always like, I'm not defined by my job.
249
:And then the first thing I say when you
meet me is, hi Mandy, I'm a veterinarian.
250
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
Here's my website, Dr.
251
:Andy Rohr.
252
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah.
253
:It's like.
254
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
here's my podcast
255
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
Here's my podcast.
256
:It's about, it's a, it's,
it's about veterinary medicine
257
:and I talk to veterinarians.
258
:Yeah.
259
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
I, I think it's okay.
260
:I
261
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Okay.
262
:I think that's fair.
263
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
things like.
264
:Well, for me it's comedy speaking, acting,
and for other people it would be parenting
265
:or playing an instrument or whatever.
266
:Like I think it's just good to
have yourself defined lots of ways,
267
:but
268
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
I hate it when I feel like
269
:people are using the calling.
270
:To manipulate me.
271
:That, that makes me really mad.
272
:You know what I mean?
273
:This, it's kind of like that, you
know, if you, if you love what you do,
274
:you'll never work a day in your life.
275
:It's kind of like.
276
:You really, if you really love
pets, you would do it for free.
277
:You know what I mean?
278
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah.
279
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
say you love pets.
280
:Why do I have to go to
the emergency clinic?
281
:You know?
282
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah.
283
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
sort of stuff like that.
284
:And again, I don't think people mean
it that way and I don't mean to be
285
:harshly sort of judgmental of them, but
I do think when you're saying that, I
286
:think, I think you really have to keep
your own counsel about, about what you
287
:do because you love it and what you.
288
:sort of mark off for
yourself, if that makes sense.
289
:Right.
290
:So
291
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
I've seen veterinarians have
292
:used that too, though, like
293
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
what do you mean when you say that?
294
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: I've
seen veterinarians on social media sort
295
:of say like, this is my calling and,
296
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
Oh, this is my colleague.
297
:Yeah, I,
298
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: And
kind of, kind of almost like, turn that
299
:around and, and sort of like to praise
ourselves and, and not naming names.
300
:Okay.
301
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: okay.
302
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
Not gonna do it.
303
:But
304
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
Alright.
305
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: it
306
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
Oh yeah.
307
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
yeah, you've seen it.
308
:We've all
309
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
I, well, you get, you get pats on the
310
:back when you're like, I love this job.
311
:I love it.
312
:I want to do it forever.
313
:You know what I mean?
314
:And this is a calling.
315
:People go, yeah.
316
:But also there's, there's a flip
side to that, you know what I mean?
317
:Like, you can only, you can only, you
can only take that so far of like,
318
:this is, this is what I'm all about.
319
:And then people are like, well, we
need, we need you to be all about
320
:that on Sundays, you know, and and
321
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah.
322
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
also after hours.
323
:And you go,
324
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
when I text you
325
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: it's,
326
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: Message
327
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
to, put it down.
328
:Yeah.
329
:I think.
330
:I think that I have gotten much
more crotchety in my older age
331
:just because I'm more wary of that.
332
:And I still say to people, I
really love being a vet and
333
:I do really love being a vet.
334
:And also I, you know, I, I, I love
being a dad and I love, you know,
335
:being a spouse and I love working
in my garden in the springtime and,
336
:you know, and, and things like that.
337
:And I, like, I don't want
to, I, I don't think that.
338
:I think you have to be careful about
taking all the credit and the accolades
339
:and being like, yes, I was called
to do this and I do love pets more
340
:than your average person does, but
also I'm gonna be off this weekend.
341
:And like, I, I think that that's,
that's sort of hard to message.
342
:And so for me, I think.
343
:I think maybe leaning back a little
bit from that and just trying
344
:to, even if I love the job more
than I tell people, I love it.
345
:I think, I think you're better off
loving your job more than you say, than
346
:you are telling everybody how much you
love your job, because I think that sets
347
:expectations with them of how available
you're gonna be or how willing you're
348
:gonna be to put down what you're doing
and, and go and, and do what they do.
349
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah.
350
:My love is like, I just like.
351
:love animals and I will maintain, like
I do talk to dogs, like I'll see a dog
352
:on the road and I'll just, Hey, how's it
353
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
Oh, totally.
354
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
you know, like, that's so crazy.
355
:But I, I, that's nothing to
do with being a veterinarian.
356
:It's just my, I just love them, you know?
357
:And I, and so I feel lucky that I
get to work in an environment where
358
:I get to see animals and I, that
could be hard for me not to do that.
359
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah.
360
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: you
know, when my female cop role takes off.
361
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
Yeah, when you're, when you're known,
362
:when you're known as a hards female cop
who doesn't take flack from anybody.
363
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
How will I let this go?
364
:Yeah, so, okay.
365
:well, okay.
366
:Tell me your list.
367
:I have a list.
368
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
okay, so I've got, so I, yeah,
369
:so I, I put together a list.
370
:A list as well.
371
:so, okay.
372
:So the first time that I made a
pet on a really mad, my boss told
373
:me, he was like, let them simmer.
374
:Like, like we got, I got a letter,
I got a a, I got a letter from a pet
375
:owner that was really angry and like,
everything, everything worked out
376
:and I, I did drop, like, to be fair,
I dropped, like I dropped the ball.
377
:So I had this, I had this tiny
little Yorkie that always had
378
:vomiting and diarrhea and it always
had vomiting and diarrhea and.
379
:On this day I was swamped and the
person called and they were like,
380
:Hey, he's having diarrhea again.
381
:And I was like, look, they had a whole
pharmacy at their house, you know what I
382
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah.
383
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
like, Hey, look, put him, put him back
384
:on the stuff and let's see how it goes.
385
:And then it just got worse.
386
:And that night he was so small,
he got dehydrated pretty quickly.
387
:They take him to the emergency clinic and.
388
:I should have said, Hey, you
know, bring, bring him on back in.
389
:But I was kind of, I was trying to
help them and I was like, you guys have
390
:the stuff, just go ahead and do this.
391
:And anyway, they were,
they were upset and like.
392
:And rightfully so.
393
:Again, I was a brand new veterinarian
and I just, I, I missed that
394
:trick and I've never forgotten it.
395
:It's made me better.
396
:but they wrote this letter saying that
they were disappointed in the care that
397
:they got, and, and it got, and, but
my boss was like, just let 'em simmer.
398
:We'll call 'em in a couple of days.
399
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: Oh.
400
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
that was a terrible piece
401
:of advice because they, they
402
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: It's
403
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
were mad.
404
:And then, yeah, and then they
got, they were more mad and they
405
:felt like they were ignored.
406
:And I was just like,
407
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah.
408
:Now they're mad about two things.
409
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
they're mad about two things.
410
:Exact, exactly.
411
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
said, look, I, in retrospect, that
412
:wasn't a mistake and I'm so sorry.
413
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
Exactly right.
414
:And,
415
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: would've
416
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
and, that's how I felt too.
417
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah.
418
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: like
I was, I was like, yeah, I, they're not,
419
:they're not wrong in what they're saying.
420
:And so anyway, but I think back
and like I was thinking about
421
:bad advice that I have gotten.
422
:I think that was, that
was very bad advice.
423
:And I was, I was brand new doctor
and I just didn't know better.
424
:And I started trusted this person
who was like, yeah, I would let
425
:this set, that was a bad piece of
advice that I would like to pass on.
426
:Like, don't do that.
427
:Don't let 'em simmer.
428
:Go and talk to him.
429
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
Okay, this is okay.
430
:Can I go back
431
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah.
432
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
really far back?
433
:Okay.
434
:where I went to vet school and I've
heard this advice to other vet students
435
:when they tell, they're trying to like,
stop vet, vet students are so like.
436
:A type personality and
they've had to get 90% to get
437
:into vet school.
438
:And they're just so used to that
and, and they're trying to, like,
439
:I know the faculty are trying
to like, make them not do that.
440
:So you hear them saying like, marks
aren't that important anymore.
441
:And they'll say, you know, you know
the person who got the lowest mark in
442
:the class, you know what they call him?
443
:They call him doctor.
444
:Ha ha ha.
445
:And I'm like, okay.
446
:You don't know what you're gonna wanna do.
447
:And so I, I've seen
448
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah.
449
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
students who then suddenly, like
450
:they third year, they're like,
oh my God, surgery is so cool.
451
:Or I wanna do a PhD, or I
452
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah.
453
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: And
it's like, well now because you got
454
:this advice that it doesn't matter.
455
:yeah, you're not gonna
get a surgery agency.
456
:Like it's not gonna happen.
457
:And
458
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah.
459
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
I think that is not good advice.
460
:I think.
461
:Advice would be like, stay in
the top half or keep your options
462
:open or stay in the top quarter.
463
:Don't be so competitive.
464
:Don't like, you know, I think we're
trying to stop people from like it
465
:affecting their mental health, that
466
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yes.
467
:Yeah.
468
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
all the time and that is good advice.
469
:But to be like, blah, can be the
last in the class and no one cares.
470
:I mean, first of all, you do
need to learn these things so you
471
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah,
472
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: doctor.
473
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
be, actually a competent
474
:doctor when you're done.
475
:Yeah.
476
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: There
is a reason you're learning this stuff.
477
:So I think that is just.
478
:It's good intention, but it is
actually like kind of bad advice.
479
:And like the stage I would get to
these students was like, when I was
480
:a faculty, it was usually their like
third or fourth year, and then I was
481
:like, oh, you're, you're cooked like.
482
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah.
483
:That's brutal.
484
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
You can't go back.
485
:Like you
486
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah,
487
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
and upgrade that.
488
:You can't, there's, you're just like,
oh, that you're never gonna be that.
489
:And I think that's really unfortunate.
490
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
that's brutal.
491
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: there's
some students who maybe weren't as strong
492
:and then when they hit their clinical
year, they're, they're like, oh, this
493
:is, it's just how their brain works.
494
:There's so
495
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Oh,
496
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
in the clinical part.
497
:there's, you know, so anyway, that if
there's any vet students listening.
498
:I'm just saying
499
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: I.
500
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
options open.
501
:You know, like don't, don't put yourself
in a box of like, I'm only gonna do
502
:this thing 'cause you don't know that.
503
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
Yeah, I, so, okay.
504
:I have a question for you.
505
:So is this bad advice
And so I was told once.
506
:More than once that yes, you
should let the technicians do
507
:stuff for you, but you should be
better than them at those things.
508
:You know what I mean?
509
:Like, you should, you should like
the, the vet should, you should be
510
:the, you should be be able to draw
blood better than technicians do.
511
:You know?
512
:You should be able to, like when
they can't hit a vein, you should
513
:be the one who can hit the vein.
514
:Things like that.
515
:You should have those skills.
516
:I don't buy it because one, I just,
I've not found that to be feasible
517
:because the techs are drawing blood
all day long and I just don't do it.
518
:And so how in the world am I gonna
magically be better than these
519
:people who do this all day long?
520
:It's like, I'm just not, I'm, I'm
just not that, not that person.
521
:So part of me says, well, Andy,
you're just, maybe you're just
522
:letting yourself off the hook here.
523
:But another part of me goes, I don't.
524
:Maybe times have changed.
525
:I, I don't know why I should
be better than the techs at
526
:the job of being a technician.
527
:Like I don't, I don't
know why I should do that.
528
:And it seems like a weird place
to invest my time and skills.
529
:And I see a lot of vets who
are like, no, I'm gonna make
530
:sure that I do these things.
531
:And I'm like, that's wildly inefficient.
532
:And I just, anyway.
533
:Yeah.
534
:So what do you think, I mean,
should the doctor be better than the
535
:technician at these technical skills?
536
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
been called in, like, no
537
:one can get this, whatever.
538
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah.
539
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: And then
you are, then it's you who's gonna do it.
540
:And maybe I have an, like, as a surgeon,
I'm always doing stuff with my hands.
541
:So maybe that is something like
with tactile things, like I
542
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
Can see it.
543
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
I maybe am better at some of those
544
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
Yeah, sure.
545
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
you ask me to put an anesthetic
546
:machine together, like, I will kill
the patient, like they will die.
547
:I, I'm like, I don't even know.
548
:I don't know how to put it together.
549
:I don't
550
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
Right.
551
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
talking about.
552
:I don't know.
553
:I don't know the different
circuits anymore.
554
:Like I really, I don't, I'm
sorry, but I don't, I don't know.
555
:I'm never at that
556
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah.
557
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
the table.
558
:I don't, and so, and also like we have
an anesthesiologist at my practice, but
559
:if he's not there, technicians are so
trained, they'll be like, so like, this
560
:is happening with the blood pressure.
561
:I'm gonna start this thing.
562
:Like, what do you think?
563
:And I'm like, yeah.
564
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah.
565
:Yep.
566
:All right.
567
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: Do
568
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
Let me,
569
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: Like,
570
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: yeah,
571
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: like,
572
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
keep me posted.
573
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
I, but so yeah, I don't, I don't
574
:think that I, I don't know that you
can be so black and white about it,
575
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah.
576
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
have this very strong belief that for
577
:people to be happy in their work, every
single person should be working at
578
:the highest level of their training.
579
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah,
580
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
And if you take that away from
581
:your technicians, like that's.
582
:That's what they're trained to do.
583
:That's
584
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: yeah.
585
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: good at.
586
:And if someone, if that person's
having a bad day, then get the other
587
:technician who's, you know what I mean?
588
:Like, don't get the doctor, get the other
technician who's really good at that
589
:thing, because that they're probably
gonna have a better success rate.
590
:but also sometimes people
are just having a bad day and
591
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah,
592
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
know, yeah.
593
:So I don't know.
594
:I don't think it's good
blanket advice, I guess.
595
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
no, I think, I think you're right.
596
:I think, I think you don't wanna
be a liability, but I like your
597
:advice better of train people to,
and work the math the highest,
598
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah,
599
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
of their credentialing.
600
:I think that's the right advice.
601
:Alright.
602
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: advice.
603
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
I like that.
604
:I like Sarah Boston advice.
605
:All right.
606
:What do you got?
607
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: Oh,
I feel like I'm taking your, okay.
608
:Well these are just two quick ones.
609
:I'm gonna say when I,
this was like so long ago.
610
:It's just funny to me now.
611
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Okay.
612
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
I had a nose ring in vet school
613
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Okay.
614
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
I was, you know, trying and trying
615
:to get a res and it was okay.
616
:I graduated in 96.
617
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Okay.
618
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
one had a nose ring.
619
:Okay.
620
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
was gonna say, yeah,
621
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: It
622
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
think that I, I wasn't gonna ask,
623
:but also it's kind of important of
when we're talking about, you know.
624
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: yeah.
625
:And it was radical.
626
:Like it was like, it was like no one
had, no, it was unprofessional, whatever.
627
:And so like I had someone who was I think
a surgery resident at the time and she
628
:said, you're never gonna get a surgery
residency with that thing in your nose.
629
:You should take it out.
630
:And I didn't take it out and I didn't
get a surgery entry right away.
631
:And she probably was right.
632
:But now I see like.
633
:Full sleeve tattoos,
634
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah.
635
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
hair, tongue ring, like
636
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah.
637
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
I'm like, I had a tiny, like,
638
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah.
639
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
like a tiny stud.
640
:You could barely see it.
641
:And like I was like, whatever
people thought, you know?
642
:Anyway, it makes me laugh.
643
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
Yeah, you were ahead of,
644
:you, were ahead of your time.
645
:That's, that's your problem.
646
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
took it out 'cause it was
647
:like they became so common.
648
:I was like, hmm, no,
649
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
you're like, now that everyone
650
:has this, I don't want it anymore.
651
:It's not the, it is not the rebellion
that I, that I signed up for.
652
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
rebellion I was hoping for.
653
:And then the other advice I got when
I was like trying to decide on a
654
:career, someone who's very nice, and
again, it was a long time ago, but I
655
:was contemplating surgery, whatever.
656
:And our ophthalmologist at the
time told me like, he sat me down.
657
:He goes, Sarah, you should really
consider ophthalmology 'cause it's
658
:a wonderful career for a woman.
659
:And you
660
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
Did you, did they, did you
661
:immediately discard ophthalmology
at that point where you're like, oh,
662
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: that.
663
:Well, you're gonna have to You're
664
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
No, you got no.
665
:Yeah, that's fine.
666
:It's fine.
667
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
edit out those curse words.
668
:Yeah.
669
:No.
670
:I was like, yeah, not doing up though.
671
:I'm not doing that.
672
:Gonna do surgery.
673
:It's not,
674
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
that's funny.
675
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
I got that advice and I, yeah,
676
:it made me not wanna do it
because I was like, no, like I.
677
:You know, don't tell me like it
shouldn't be gendered and whatever, but,
678
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
You're like, like you should wear
679
:a nose ring and do ophthalmology,
and you're like, I'm not
680
:doing either of those things.
681
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
supposed to take my nose,
682
:ring out and do ophthalmology.
683
:Yeah.
684
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
Gotcha.
685
:That's what I was.
686
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: those
687
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
Fair enough.
688
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
Tell me if you have another one.
689
:Okay.
690
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
Oh man.
691
:I, I got a couple, I said I've
got one, and it was someone else
692
:pointed out to me, so I was thinking
about this, about us talking, and
693
:I was thinking about bad advice
694
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah.
695
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
and, and one of my friends said, he was
696
:like, do you remember like five, six
years ago, when telemedicine was brand
697
:new and, and there was this huge push.
698
:Telemedicine was gonna be everywhere.
699
:And vets should be like, you
should be figuring out how to do
700
:telemedicine in your own practice.
701
:And like, and I do remember that.
702
:I like, I remember that was a big thing
is like, wow, this is, this technology
703
:is here and pet owners want it and
we should figure out how to do it.
704
:And it was funny because I think the vast
majority of vets just kind of ignored that
705
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah.
706
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: and
now we've gone on and yes, telemedicine
707
:is a thing and there are vets that
do telemedicine, but I feel like.
708
:Vets in general have kind of given
up on the idea of integrating
709
:telemedicine into the standard practice.
710
:And so I don't know if, if that was
everybody should be doing telemedicine.
711
:I don't know if that was bad idea.
712
:I think it was just interesting that
it was everywhere and I feel like the
713
:vast majority of vet practices just
ignored it and now it, now the time
714
:has changed and now it's, you should be
using AI for everything and everybody
715
:should be using ai and so, I don't know.
716
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
though because I
717
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah.
718
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
I think telemedicine, I mean, I'm
719
:a big proponent of it and I was
actually trying to start doing it
720
:before the pandemic for other reasons.
721
:Like I've got
722
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah.
723
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
that come from far away.
724
:A lot of times with cancer, they're so
wound up that like they really need a
725
:consult before they're left their home.
726
:So they know like what's gonna
happen and what, you know, like.
727
:There's so much talking, and I
could give them a quote and then
728
:I could have everything set up.
729
:'cause if they're coming from
far away and then I'm like, oh,
730
:sorry, we can't do a CT today.
731
:They're very upset about that.
732
:So I found
733
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah.
734
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: it
was more to like, help the client be
735
:prepared, get all the talking outta
the way, bring their stress level down.
736
:And then when they came in, all I
had to do was like, do a physical
737
:exam, do whatever, the CT and stuff.
738
:And so, then I was like playing with
different platforms and then the
739
:pandemic happened and I was like,
well, here's what we're doing now.
740
:I, I think it.
741
:I still wish we were, I
was doing it more like
742
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah.
743
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
those, for those other reasons.
744
:But it does feel like since
the pandemic we're just kind of
745
:like, we don't need that anymore.
746
:I, I think it has a role.
747
:I don't think it's gonna
take over anything.
748
:yeah, so I don't know if it's, I think
it's not bad advice, but it didn't
749
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah.
750
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
thought it was gonna do.
751
:But I think it's 'cause a lot
of vets don't like change,
752
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
Yeah, I think, no, I, I think that that's
753
:too, I said that was, that was one that
I, when I heard it and he said it, he
754
:was like, yeah, you know, that like,
it, it, it was a couple of years ago
755
:that was, you know, that was such a big,
it was such a big push and it was the,
756
:it was the advice of, of the day and.
757
:It didn't go away.
758
:And there's definitely
good, good uses for it.
759
:And it's funny when you say that, I'm
like, eh, you know, I don't even know if
760
:we came out to the best place possible.
761
:You're right.
762
:Like I think that there's probably
reasons, to use telemedicine that,
763
:that we haven't done or we missed
some tricks, but it was just,
764
:it was just sort of interesting.
765
:But that was brought to me and I
wanted to hear your thoughts on it.
766
:I knew you, you do a lot
with telemedicine, so anyway.
767
:Dr.
768
:Sarah Boston.
769
:Thanks for, jumping on today
and talking with me about,
770
:about all manner of bad advice.
771
:Where can people find you
other than watching television?
772
:Looking for un
773
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: A
774
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
unknown lady cop,
775
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
I'm a, yeah, I'm on Sheriff Country
776
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
sheriff country is what it's called.
777
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: Well,
that's a, that's not the lady cop though.
778
:I'm a patient.
779
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
Oh, okay.
780
:So you're a patient on sheriff country.
781
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
you'll miss me.
782
:But yeah, that's happening.
783
:or you can go to my Instagram, Dr.
784
:Sarah Boston.
785
:that's the best place.
786
:Or my website is dr sarah boston.com.
787
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
Is your Instagram more onco
788
:surgery or television slash comedy?
789
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: It's a
lot more comedy and pictures of my dog.
790
:I'll be honest, I don't know, I
just like also just 'cause like the
791
:social media policies at work and
792
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah.
793
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: I, I
794
:kind,
795
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
also it could be, it's quite a
796
:curve ball when people are there
for the comedy and then, you know,
797
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: yeah.
798
:Or vice
799
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: you
give them a reel of taking a tumor out.
800
:Yeah.
801
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah.
802
:I had it happen in real life.
803
:I had, did I tell you it was like really
kind of a difficult case I've been working
804
:through with these owners and then.
805
:wanted to, I guess, with their friends,
they went to the art comedy club, yuck X.
806
:They didn't know that I do comedy.
807
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: No.
808
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
also I hadn't met them in person
809
:because speaking of telemedicine,
not real telemedicine, but they had
810
:work, been worked up through oncology.
811
:And then I just did a phone consult.
812
:So
813
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah.
814
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
been in the same room as these people.
815
:I've talked to 'em on the phone
like a lot over the last few weeks.
816
:And then, and then I am on stage
talking about crazy things.
817
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah.
818
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: not,
819
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah.
820
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
like, and then they were like on
821
:their phones, like looking at the
website of our clinic and then like,
822
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
They're like, that's her, that's, that's
823
:the woman who's gonna save our dog's life.
824
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: it
was her cat, and then they came up to
825
:me with their, at the, at the end of
the show, people like to come and talk.
826
:And then this woman came up to me and
she goes, you're not gonna believe this.
827
:I don't know who she is.
828
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah.
829
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
puts, just puts a picture of her cat,
830
:but it's just an orange and white cat.
831
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
Right.
832
:You're like, I don't know.
833
:I've never.
834
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: I
was like, and like I, I had done a
835
:big surgery on this cat, but this cat
was pre-surgery, so I did not have the
836
:context of like, it's just a cat in a box.
837
:And I was like, and then
I was like, oh, and.
838
:Anyway, so then I was like, talk, trying
to figure out who it was, and I, I, I kind
839
:of realized who it was and I was like,
oh, this, you know, and talking to her.
840
:But then she was like talking about the
cats not eating and like it turned into
841
:a consult in the middle of yuck yucks.
842
:And then out of the corner of
my eye, I can see four women
843
:standing waiting to talk to me.
844
:And I can't explain this, but I'm
sure people listening will understand.
845
:I knew there were veterinarians.
846
:I didn't know them.
847
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
Oh yeah.
848
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
I was like, that's, those
849
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Just
by the way, you're, they were standing.
850
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
Everything about them.
851
:I don't You play that
game when you're at a
852
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yes.
853
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: Like
854
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yes.
855
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
I'm like, I call it Spot Vet.
856
:I'm like, that's a vet,
that's a veterinarian.
857
:Anyway,
858
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah.
859
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: So I
finished this consult with this woman.
860
:I turned to them and they go,
was that one of your clients?
861
:And I said, yes.
862
:Anyway, we laughed really hard and
I was so grateful they were there.
863
:'cause I was like, no one
else would understand.
864
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: Yeah.
865
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
weird this experience was.
866
:I was like, they didn't
know I'm a comedian.
867
:I didn't know what they looked like.
868
:They didn't know I was gonna be on stage.
869
:I was saying crazy stuff
like it was, anyway, that has
870
:nothing to do with bad advice.
871
:My
872
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143: No.
873
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143:
don't don't be in that situation.
874
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
Yeah, try to, try to try to
875
:avoid meeting clients when you're
coming off stage at yuck yucks.
876
:All right.
877
:That sounds great.
878
:Thanks for being here guys.
879
:Thanks for tuning in, everybody.
880
:I'll talk to you later on.
881
:Okay.
882
:sarah-boston_1_03-06-2026_162143: bye.
883
:dr--andy-roark-_1_03-06-2026_162143:
And that's what I got guys.
884
:Thanks for being here.
885
:Thanks for Sarah for being here.
886
:I always enjoy talking with her.
887
:She makes me laugh.
888
:She's such a fun, smart, creative person.
889
:I just, I just really enjoy
her and her perspective.
890
:So anyway, guys, I hope
you enjoyed it as well.
891
:Take care of yourselves, everybody.
892
:I'll talk to you later on.
893
:Bye.