Shownotes
In this week's episode, join Kim Clark as she engages in a compelling conversation with Miriam Khalifa, delving into the profound impact of messaging strategy as it relates to DEI. With a background rooted in political and public opinion research, Miriam's involvement in top-tier U.S. campaigns adds a unique perspective. The discussion centers around the crucial alignment between words and actions, emphasizing the necessity for corporations to uphold their messaging while remaining mindful of social causes. Kim and Miriam explore the vital link between genuine actions and communicated intent. The conversation also navigates the realm of DEI benchmarks, shedding light on the judicious employment of political communications. Tune in to this episode to uncover the path forward for organizational communications.
About The Guest:
Miriam Khalifa (she/her) is passionate about the power of communications and data to create organizational and social change. She began her career in political and public opinion research, shaping the messaging of top campaigns in the U.S. As a DEI strategist, she has leveraged communications and research to establish effective initiatives for diversity, equity, and inclusion. Currently, she does consulting and data analytics to optimize the impact of DEI strategies for financial services and technology companies.
Find Miriam Here:
About Kim:
Kim Clark (she/her) focuses her work on the communicator and content creator's role in diversity, equity, and inclusion (DEI). She is the co-author of The Conscious Communicator: The fine art of not saying stupid sh*t, an Amazon #1 bestseller and the leading voice for DEI communications and social justice messaging for brands.
She speaks at conferences, writes custom workshops, writes inclusive communications guides, and consults with companies on all things related to diversity, equity, and inclusion communications. Kim is a member of the LGBTQ+ community, a cisgender woman, Native American (Muscogee Nation) and a mom of two kids with disabilities. These marginalized identities and the privileges that come with society seeing her as White motivate her daily for social change.
Communicate Like You Give A Damn Podcast
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Transcripts
Okay, thanks for joining on communicate like you
Kim Clark:give a damn, I have a very cool guest, who, actually the way we
Kim Clark:crossed paths Miriam was I think he just reached out to me on
Kim Clark:LinkedIn and maybe like asked me a question or you wanted to you
Kim Clark:know, you wanted to get together for a minute. And I ended up
Kim Clark:like listening more to you and fascinated by your background
Kim Clark:and your perspective of what was what's going on in the world.
Kim Clark:And that's when I was drafting the conscious communicator, my
Kim Clark:chapters for the conscious communicator book. And I
Kim Clark:thought, I think she has a really interesting perspective
Kim Clark:that can be added to the book. And it just turned into this
Kim Clark:whole thing. Like I'm sure like the when you just reached out to
Kim Clark:me called on LinkedIn, that wasn't something that you
Kim Clark:expected that you'd end up as a contributing author in a book,
Unknown:by any means, but it was such a fortunate
Unknown:circumstance. And I'm so glad that you know, we met and the
Unknown:rest has been history.
Kim Clark:So I've gotten to know you over the time that
Kim Clark:since we've originally connected, but introduce
Kim Clark:yourself to our audience.
Miriam Khalifa:Yeah, so my name is Miriam Khalifa, I am a Bay
Miriam Khalifa:Area native Oakland, born and raised still here. And I am a
Miriam Khalifa:dei strategist and research enthusiast who believes in the
Miriam Khalifa:power of communications to create change.
Kim Clark:Oh, I love it. So tell us about your path, like
Kim Clark:how did you get into di I kind of what was the pulling vision
Kim Clark:for you? And what's your background?
Unknown:Yeah, so, you know, I've always felt this kind of
Unknown:innate sense of injustice in the world, and almost like a
Unknown:responsibility to see how I can, you know, make life better for
Unknown:people, people of all walks of life. And so, you know, the past
Unknown:few years, have really been focused on creating equitable
Unknown:opportunity for underserved communities, primarily through
Unknown:corporate strategy, but also through public policy. So I'm
Unknown:currently building data driven dei and change management
Unknown:strategies, primarily for finance and other private sector
Unknown:clients, as well as doing research on how to increase
Unknown:equitable impact for underrepresented talent, and how
Unknown:companies can better support them. But prior to the EI, I was
Unknown:doing political research and public opinion polling, which
Unknown:was really centered around gaining insights, that shaped
Unknown:messaging strategy, so for polling this often was for
Unknown:public policy, and, you know, big NGO campaigns. And then I
Unknown:later on did the same thing for congressional and presidential
Unknown:campaigns where we know messaging is everything.
Kim Clark:And how did you get interested in that?
Unknown:Good question. You know, I think that I feel, I've
Unknown:always felt politics is, you know, the kind of center of of
Unknown:who we are as a nation, and opportunity and experience, you
Unknown:know, should be equitable for everyone here, because, you
Unknown:know, we're American citizens. And I think that I was drawn to
Unknown:policy, because I saw that this is a way to create widespread
Unknown:change, and reach, touch, you know, so many lives through,
Unknown:through a simple thing, like communication strategy, the
Unknown:impact is, is really magnified. And what I'll say is that it has
Unknown:been a winding path through that I'm working on various types of
Unknown:campaigns, you know, initially, the polling that I was focused
Unknown:on was was very much around social issues. So reproductive
Unknown:rights, environmental justice, oftentimes, touchy subjects are
Unknown:hard for, you know, public discourse to really kind of wrap
Unknown:its head around and, and move forward on just because of how
Unknown:things pull how polarized things were. And so the power of you
Unknown:know, messaging strategy, and really public opinion research
Unknown:as a whole is that you're able to tap into the values of the
Unknown:people you want to reach and understand how do I get them
Unknown:where I want them to be? How do I be most effective in what I'm
Unknown:doing here? Whether that's, you know, to turn out the votes to
Unknown:get people to see you know, think differently about what it
Unknown:means to be pro life, you know, you name it, but I was really
Unknown:drawn to that idea. Have, we can shape the future of this country
Unknown:just by the way that we message to people and by the way, we are
Unknown:able to speak to them and what they care about.
Kim Clark:So there's a lot of skill set around persuasion and
Kim Clark:influence. And a lot of that has to do with speaking the language
Kim Clark:of your targeted audience and to your point tapping in to the
Kim Clark:values and what what it is that they value. It's not, we're not
Kim Clark:talking about company values like that sit on a badger, a
Kim Clark:lovely poster in the break rooms. This is genuine people's
Kim Clark:like, what they value and the values that they stand for in
Kim Clark:their life and being relate to them in that way. Now, the what
Kim Clark:you contributed to the end of the habitual chapter, so the
Kim Clark:depth model is five pillars, de Pth, deliberate, educated,
Kim Clark:purposeful, tailored, and habitual. And so we put you at
Kim Clark:the end of the habitual chapter, because the title of your work
Kim Clark:is communications for social impact more than a slogan. So
Kim Clark:it's not like you're in, you're out, right? It's not a one off.
Kim Clark:That's not what this work is about. So as a DI strategist who
Kim Clark:really values and understands the power of communication, what
Kim Clark:in this article and feel free to read some if you'd like? What is
Kim Clark:the key takeaway that you hope that the audience would get from
Kim Clark:this work?
Unknown:Yeah, thanks, Kim, happy to share, you know, a few
Unknown:little clips that I think kind of embody the message I was
Unknown:trying to get across. As a former public opinion, and
Unknown:political researcher, I learned a lot about the time and thought
Unknown:that goes into a campaigns messaging strategy. Public
Unknown:opinion, polling falls under the broader category of market
Unknown:research, which is used to inform campaigns on the win over
Unknown:their audiences, whether that be a product launch or an election.
Unknown:The goal of market research is to understand your audience
Unknown:segments and their values. This information informs the campaign
Unknown:on how it can tap into those values using communications,
Unknown:regardless of whether the goal is to sell a product or get
Unknown:constituents to learn and care about an issue and then vote on
Unknown:it. Companies use market research to inform their ad
Unknown:campaigns and generate sales. And candidates can win elections
Unknown:based on their messaging, it's time for organizations to
Unknown:utilize similar strategies for the social causes they speak on.
Unknown:They're serious about going beyond performative
Unknown:communications and want to make progress. Companies can instead
Unknown:use their platforms to create and reinforce positive impact.
Unknown:So I think that kind of sums up the gist of my point. And you
Unknown:know, it really is that it's about taking the time to be
Unknown:authentic, intentional, and like you said, habitual. It's not,
Unknown:you know, releasing a statement willy nilly, or as kind of a
Unknown:response to something that's happening. It's really about,
Unknown:you know, thinking through your company's values, your company's
Unknown:priorities and our track record, before speaking on an issue, and
Unknown:asking yourself, you know, is this something that we have
Unknown:consistently prioritized and been, you know, public about? Or
Unknown:are we responding to a current trend? Or maybe even responding
Unknown:to backlash? Because we didn't speak out initially. You know,
Unknown:and then lastly, asking yourself one can we live up to what we're
Unknown:saying, and to, is it in line with the brand that we're
Unknown:building, and everything that we plan to do going forward? That
Unknown:last line as well, kind of, you know, some sub Hey, like
Unknown:conscious and habitual communications can do more than
Unknown:just communicate, follow through on your company's commitments,
Unknown:they can also enhance accountability and increased
Unknown:likelihood of actually achieving your goals. Once you've put that
Unknown:out there. And when crafted, well, they have the power to
Unknown:reinforce and reinvigorate your company's missions and values,
Unknown:by tying those to tangible actions that people can do
Unknown:beyond the company.
Kim Clark:That's definitely something I want to follow up
Kim Clark:with you first. You know, you talked about, you know, the
Kim Clark:whole part of the title talking about more than a slogan, one of
Kim Clark:the things in in you, you expanded upon that and what you
Kim Clark:just shared, one of the things that I've seen consistently from
Kim Clark:brands who don't do social cause messaging, well, is that they
Kim Clark:may say, and even have the CEO say, and, and in a formal
Kim Clark:statement, we stand with the LGBTQ plus community or we stand
Kim Clark:with the black community, we stand with dot, dot, dot, but
Kim Clark:then when you see their actions there, and they are actually
Kim Clark:folding when there's any kind of a whiff of a push back for some
Kim Clark:some takes a little bit more of a push back or, you know, you
Kim Clark:know, allow it or push back or a lot Longer pushback, but they
Kim Clark:eventually still fold. So what I'm seeing here is this this gap
Kim Clark:of say and do, where we'll say that we stand with the
Kim Clark:community, but we're not able to withstand the pushback that, you
Kim Clark:know, because we don't have the legs underneath that we don't
Kim Clark:have the strength, positionally from a reputation standpoint and
Kim Clark:the work behind it, to really have the teeth to show that we
Kim Clark:understand what we're saying. And this is how we're backing it
Kim Clark:up. And we're going to withstand this storm, if you will, and get
Kim Clark:through it and continue to be with the community that we are
Kim Clark:advocating for. Because these folks are our customers, these
Kim Clark:folks are our employees, and we are going to stand with them and
Kim Clark:withstand any pressure to create a division between us and this
Kim Clark:community in our customer and employee base. So there's
Kim Clark:there's a great opportunity for brands to actually withstand and
Kim Clark:not allow the division on their watch. You're a DI strategist,
Kim Clark:you've talked about equitable impact. And there's a lot of
Kim Clark:folks who are interested in di measurement, that was something
Kim Clark:else that you mentioned, as well. So if you could help us
Kim Clark:kind of understand, as a DI strategist, what do you see as
Kim Clark:the role of communications? How do you help communications
Kim Clark:further equitable outcomes? And do you measure it? How do you
Kim Clark:and if so, how do you measure it?
Unknown:Great questions. So yeah, communications is actually
Unknown:a really, really fundamental part of, you know, DDI strategy
Unknown:and rollout. And oftentimes, I think communications, it's
Unknown:required throughout the entire process, but where it becomes
Unknown:really, really crucial, is that last piece where, hey, you know,
Unknown:and data, I think, kind of flows through this as well. So the way
Unknown:that I think about this, and the way that, you know, I've done
Unknown:this work is, you start by evaluating where you're at, you
Unknown:can't make progress, if you don't know, what to benchmark
Unknown:to, and what you're working with what the underlying issues are.
Unknown:And that's often the time where you first start looking at the
Unknown:numbers. Right? Okay, so we can say that, you know, everyone's
Unknown:happy working here, or that we have a great team, and we all
Unknown:get along super well. But when you look, you know, by the
Unknown:numbers, where's that representation? You know, where
Unknown:are your underrepresented employees? Are they all coming
Unknown:in a second year talent and then leaving by their third year and
Unknown:cycling through? You know, are they? Are they in decision
Unknown:making roles? How much, you know, effect are they able to
Unknown:have on the culture are their voices heard when they have
Unknown:issues. And I think really looking at kind of the structure
Unknown:of an organization is a great way to benchmark and to work
Unknown:forward. Especially when you're thinking about, you know, D, I
Unknown:think can be very intangible at times, like, how do you put a
Unknown:metric on someone's feelings, right, but you can survey them.
Unknown:And you can say, this is what we're hearing right? Now, let's
Unknown:come back. And it may not even be you know, as a consultant, I
Unknown:may not be there in two years, when that survey takes place
Unknown:again, and they have done the work and they have, you know,
Unknown:invested time and money and been patient to see that follow
Unknown:through. But if you come back in two years, you should be able to
Unknown:see, hey, we had 46% of our folks saying that they feel when
Unknown:they raise a concern that it is taken seriously. And you know,
Unknown:things are being done about it. Two years later, you should see
Unknown:a noticeable increase. And so I think being, you know, realistic
Unknown:about hey, what can we measure, and then doing everything you
Unknown:can to get there is a really important piece of this on it's
Unknown:often overlooked. And once you understand where you're at, then
Unknown:you build a strategy for how to get where you want to go. And
Unknown:that's where, you know, communications becomes really
Unknown:important because you can, you know, work with senior leaders
Unknown:build as much strategy as you want. But if they don't have the
Unknown:tools and the change management, the implementation, you know, to
Unknown:really get this on the ground and get everyone on board. Like
Unknown:they're not the one you know, senior leaders are not the
Unknown:people executing on this you need your managers to understand
Unknown:and be on board they need to be consistently informed and and
Unknown:you know, able to have a two way communication channel of I
Unknown:understand this is where we're trying to go. I'm having some
Unknown:issues here. How do I work through this? They need You
Unknown:know, playbooks, they need scripts, they need to be able to
Unknown:talk to this to their own employees. And I think that
Unknown:that's where this, you know, communications is really kind of
Unknown:the make or break point. Because strategy is very pie in the sky.
Unknown:And we can have the best ideas to make everything perfect. But
Unknown:without that change management piece, it's not going to go
Unknown:anywhere.
Kim Clark:Great point. Great point. You were talking about
Kim Clark:working with leaders and executives, then when we tie
Kim Clark:that to your piece within the conscious communicator book, but
Kim Clark:also your experience in working as a political strategist, etc.
Kim Clark:What are some of the similarities and differences
Kim Clark:between the politicians and how strat strategic messaging is
Kim Clark:used in order to garner votes and ultimately meet the goal of
Kim Clark:having that person that candidate elected? Versus is
Kim Clark:there? Is there any kind of similarity or a difference when
Kim Clark:we're talking about our CEO and engaging our CEO? Are there
Kim Clark:things that we can learn from the political messaging strategy
Kim Clark:process that we can apply to engage our CEOs tapping into
Kim Clark:diversity, equity, inclusion and communicating about it and the
Kim Clark:values that are important to our employee in our customer? Base?
Unknown:Yes, absolutely. I think there's a lot we can learn
Unknown:from political, you know, communications, and just the way
Unknown:that they operate these campaigns. But, you know, coming
Unknown:into that world, I think the piece that took me aback was
Unknown:just how much dedication there is, how much time is invested?
Unknown:You know, this is, these are months long research projects,
Unknown:sometimes even, you know, years not. It's not like, oh, yeah,
Unknown:just we think this sounds good. We think this will resonate
Unknown:with, hopefully, the people are going to vote for us, you know,
Unknown:there's such an investment into time, you know, money and time
Unknown:that goes into discovering how they can most effectively use
Unknown:messaging to reach their desired outcomes. And then once they
Unknown:figure that out, they're very, very strategic on not only you
Unknown:know, understanding our audiences is many different
Unknown:groups combined with their own, you know, their own values,
Unknown:their own opinions, and how do we, you know, best reach those
Unknown:different groups to gain buy in from everyone that is on the
Unknown:table for us. And I think that, you know, oftentimes we see
Unknown:companies investing that same time, those same resources into
Unknown:what what would be considered market research. But mostly when
Unknown:it comes to, you know, finding product market fit, or driving
Unknown:sales. And where companies oftentimes diverge from
Unknown:political communications, is when it comes to social impact
Unknown:issues, you know, whether we're calling that ESG, the AI doesn't
Unknown:matter. We've often seen, you know, especially since 2020,
Unknown:companies are kind of rushing to put something out saying
Unknown:whatever sounds good reacting, as opposed to being proactive
Unknown:and showing that this is a long term commitment for them, you
Unknown:know, not laying the groundwork to say, here's what we've done
Unknown:so far. And this is why we care. And this is why we're releasing
Unknown:this statement. And not being consistent. It's kind of oh, we
Unknown:said it, that should be enough. And then then everyone forget
Unknown:more
Kim Clark:do you want from us? We said it. Exactly. And I
Kim Clark:really appreciate that, because that's part of the habit is
Kim Clark:being habitual, not just on the surface level of talking about
Kim Clark:it, but actually showing the work because one of the one of
Kim Clark:our superpowers as communicators is visibility can drive
Kim Clark:accountability.
Unknown:Yeah, exactly. And I think that, you know, it's, it's
Unknown:sad, because what we've seen as a result of the way companies
Unknown:have handled this so far, is you know, they're releasing
Unknown:performative communications that at times even contradicts the
Unknown:company values and their track record completely. But
Unknown:ultimately, you know, you can get backlash from your your
Unknown:customers, your employees because they see through this
Unknown:and not only have you lowered, you know, their trust and their
Unknown:confidence in the validity of the work you say you're doing or
Unknown:the causes you say you care about, but it's also a discredit
Unknown:to you know, ESG and dei work as a whole people see it as
Unknown:Toothless when over and over. This is the trend
Kim Clark:I really am so glad that you pointed out. While
Kim Clark:everything that you've been saying in specifically, the
Kim Clark:investment of political campaigns on research, what do
Kim Clark:people care about? How do we message to that? What's gonna
Kim Clark:win us that election. So if our executives, if our CEO was that
Kim Clark:politician, to, you know, align with employees and customers at
Kim Clark:that level, the level of research and understanding our
Kim Clark:employees and what's important to our employees, what's
Kim Clark:important from a values based because that's what you're
Kim Clark:talking about is the values of this of the base that they're
Kim Clark:trying to move, persuade influenced vote for that person.
Kim Clark:It's an it's like, any relationship where every day we
Kim Clark:need to have them choose their partner every day, we want
Kim Clark:employees to choose that job. And every time that we're doing
Kim Clark:political campaign messaging, we want that person to choose
Kim Clark:ultimately, that candidate when it comes time to vote, but that
Kim Clark:we're, I haven't seen a lot of that Mariam where there's this
Kim Clark:level of investment in understanding that we have to
Kim Clark:understand our employees so well, to understand what's
Kim Clark:genuinely important to them, the months of research, the
Kim Clark:dedication, the the importance of understanding, the
Kim Clark:connection, which is the objective of communication is
Kim Clark:that connection between sender and receiver, we're seeing it
Kim Clark:from a political standpoint, they understand what's at stake,
Kim Clark:millions of dollars are spent, right. But we don't see a
Kim Clark:similar commitment and process within companies, that to your
Kim Clark:point, we could really learn from
Unknown:under percent, and I think it's actually, you know,
Unknown:employees, you know, that, that is that is what the value of a
Unknown:company, you know, they lose their employees, they have
Unknown:nothing. But I think, you know, especially for folks who if
Unknown:you're expecting anyone in your company, to actually feel
Unknown:committed to what you're saying, and to maybe even be in charge
Unknown:of rolling it out and doing some, some work for you, so that
Unknown:it isn't just, you know, hey, a statement, and then that's it.
Unknown:Those people need extreme, you know, they need to be bought in
Unknown:like no other, they need to see that you're invested, they need
Unknown:to see that this goes all the way up to the top. And you also
Unknown:need to be thinking about, you know, different the different
Unknown:audiences that you have, and the information that they need a
Unknown:different cadences to be successful and to be kept in the
Unknown:loop. It's not the same for everyone, and you are going to
Unknown:be talking to, you know, your customers about the work that
Unknown:you're doing for black lives matter what have you very
Unknown:differently than the folks who you're expecting to launch some
Unknown:type of, you know, campaign around and have the company say
Unknown:this is the work we're doing and expect them to execute on it.
Kim Clark:You know, obviously, we are in quite a historical
Kim Clark:moments, were given the social context, you were just talking
Kim Clark:about that referring to the climate that we're in, where do
Kim Clark:you see communications needing to go? And understanding the
Kim Clark:importance of of communications as a key component of any kind
Kim Clark:of successful efforts of diversity, equity inclusion
Kim Clark:within organizations? Where do you? Where do you see thing, you
Kim Clark:know, organizational communications needing to go in
Kim Clark:order to show up and step up? In this incredible time in history?
Unknown:Yeah, you know, I think we have started seeing some
Unknown:companies really reflect and take a look at themselves and
Unknown:say, you know, what, instead of just releasing a statement on
Unknown:some headline that we know, everyone is upset about and
Unknown:expects to say something on, you know, how have we either
Unknown:contributed to the solution or the problem, you know, and
Unknown:owning that and really saying, hey, you know, if we're speaking
Unknown:about LGBTQ rights, then, you know, if we need to look at
Unknown:ourselves and say, Do we have a track record, to contributing,
Unknown:you know, we're lobbying for candidates, we're the ones
Unknown:passing these measures, and, you know, really kind of taking a
Unknown:step back, taking the PR lens off of things, and just being
Unknown:real with people because at this point, you know, trust is key,
Unknown:and like you said, I think there, there has been a lot of
Unknown:trust lost just in the way that these instances have been
Unknown:handled by companies. And it's really time to just say, you
Unknown:know, let's, let's just be real, we know that we have things to
Unknown:work on. And then speaking about what you're planning on doing.
Unknown:And, you know, I will say, I think this is a difficult time,
Unknown:given, you know, being in the Bay Area, we know, tech
Unknown:companies have laid off, you know, 10s of 1000s of employees.
Unknown:We're market conditions are kind of uncertain. And I think it's
Unknown:understandable to not constantly have results to show. And that's
Unknown:why it's even more important to just say, okay, you know, maybe
Unknown:we have had to pause the work that we were so public about,
Unknown:and so proud of when we launched in 2021. But being honest, and
Unknown:saying, you know, what, this is where we're at, here's where we
Unknown:have to go, here's maybe why we haven't been able to make
Unknown:change, or, you know, here's maybe even we have to lay off
Unknown:our di t give the reasoning, talk about, you know, what are
Unknown:we going to do once we're able to, and seeing this as as not
Unknown:just a transactional relationship, but something that
Unknown:you have to invest in, to regain folks trust and to get them to
Unknown:see, nobody's perfect, but that the effort is there, and it's
Unknown:real.
Kim Clark:Great, thank you so much. There's quite a few things
Kim Clark:that went through my head as you were answering different kinds
Kim Clark:of conversations I've had with clients. And where I will go is
Kim Clark:towards something that we're ramping into, which is the next
Kim Clark:United States presidential election, where there are
Kim Clark:candidates who have created a narrative, tapping into the
Kim Clark:values of their base, using language that creates division
Kim Clark:creates an us versus them, you know, language such as work, you
Kim Clark:know, being very committed to anti woke culture, when woke
Kim Clark:isn't a thing, you know, So language is being weaponized in
Kim Clark:such a way that it is manufacturing problems, and
Kim Clark:stirring people up firing people up all for the political gain of
Kim Clark:the person getting additional, you know, these candidates,
Kim Clark:additional power. And so it's often you know, said that when
Kim Clark:candidates invent a culture war, or tap into a low lying culture
Kim Clark:war, and then bring it to the surface and add a lot of fuel to
Kim Clark:the fire, they don't have any other kind of political plan, or
Kim Clark:social impact kind of plan. What are we doing about jobs,
Kim Clark:climate, health care, you know, what we're going to talk about
Kim Clark:not having bathrooms available for transgender people, you
Kim Clark:know, and that's, that's where the millions of dollars of
Kim Clark:donations are going to and that these are the biggest problems
Kim Clark:is making sure that there's not drag queens near kids, which is
Kim Clark:a classic political move is like, we have to protect the
Kim Clark:kids that Stokes this fear. So language is being weaponized in
Kim Clark:a political system that is driving division within our
Kim Clark:society, but also within our businesses. So it's an
Kim Clark:interesting time to just not just watch, we have to do
Kim Clark:something. And I'd love to hear if you have some advice for
Kim Clark:organizations who are on the effect or the impact impacting
Kim Clark:side of these, the rhetoric of this narrative, where I know as
Kim Clark:a dei communicator when someone says, you know, everyone keeps
Kim Clark:talking about they don't want this woke culture and I said, it
Kim Clark:doesn't exist. It's it's, it's an illusion. And so this battle
Kim Clark:of words that we're seeing play out created from a political
Kim Clark:standpoint for political power and gain, but organizations are
Kim Clark:to your earlier point, reactive right now, they are woefully
Kim Clark:unprepared for handling the narrative and regaining the
Kim Clark:narrative to get to that point of withstanding, if you will, do
Kim Clark:you have any advice on that as we enter into probably the most
Kim Clark:contentious presidential election in recent history?
Kim Clark:Yeah,
Unknown:thank you for that. It's a very interesting
Unknown:question. You know, typically I'm in you know, kind of
Unknown:processing Oh, like, what should if I was still in politics, you
Unknown:know, where do I think the messaging and where do I say If
Unknown:there are missed opportunities that need to be addressed, and
Unknown:people don't usually ask about, you know, hey, as a as a private
Unknown:sector, you know, business, how should I be responding to these
Unknown:things? And I think it does go back to looking at yourself, you
Unknown:know, we've, we've had this conversation of, we're seeing
Unknown:these companies, with all these statements. Meanwhile there, if
Unknown:you go and look at their, you know, lobbying their donation
Unknown:history, we know, not only are they not doing anything for the
Unknown:cause they're speaking out, they're actually a part of the
Unknown:problem. And I think that companies like that need to take
Unknown:a hard look at themselves. And there, there may be companies
Unknown:who say, you know, what, we're taking a political stance on
Unknown:this, we donate to these candidates, that's the values
Unknown:that we're going to uphold. And that should be a very clear sign
Unknown:to anyone who is or is planning on working there. To say, Are
Unknown:these my values is this an environment I want to be in?
Unknown:Maybe not. And knowing that, you know, out the gate before
Unknown:accepting that offer, I think for you know, companies who
Unknown:maybe have their heart in the right place, but are nervous to
Unknown:take a stand. It's really, like you said, it's about stepping
Unknown:back and realizing that basic language has been weaponized.
Unknown:basic human rights have been, you know, turned into partisan
Unknown:issues. And you don't have to, you know, choose Democrat or
Unknown:Republican, as a company, to be able to take a stand on these
Unknown:things. If you care about your employees, you know, what we
Unknown:always hear all these companies have values like, trust, and,
Unknown:you know, compassion, and inclusion, or even going so far
Unknown:to say, we're a family, which is its own thing. But you know, I
Unknown:think,
Kim Clark:yeah, I have thoughts on that as well, for another
Kim Clark:time.
Unknown:Watching it, that's a healthy alternative. But I think
Unknown:that, you know, the, a lot of these companies have been around
Unknown:for decades, maybe even centuries, and the fundamental
Unknown:company values shouldn't be compromised, because they don't
Unknown:want to take a stand on a partisan issue, period. If you
Unknown:care about your employees, and you live up to your company's
Unknown:mission, and everything that you've always said you stand
Unknown:for, you shouldn't have to worry about that you should be there
Unknown:to defend and create space where everyone at your company feels
Unknown:like they belong, you know, feels represented, and and
Unknown:doesn't have to worry.
Kim Clark:Yes, completely, completely agree. So, in your
Kim Clark:opinion, from your perspective, what does communicating like you
Kim Clark:give a damn look like or sound like?
Unknown:Yeah, communicating like you give a damn to me, I
Unknown:think it falls along the same lines of everything that we need
Unknown:speaking about. Again, it's, you know, building long term
Unknown:investment, maybe communicating about it all the time, but you
Unknown:have built, whatever it takes to get to the impact, you want to
Unknown:see, if you're saying you care about something, let's see what
Unknown:you've done to get to get to a better place doesn't mean that
Unknown:you've solved the world's issues. But you know, we need
Unknown:some continuity. And maybe, you know, George Floyd is not in the
Unknown:headlines any longer. Maybe, you know, BLM is no longer as trendy
Unknown:as it was. But if you said that you were going to reinvest in
Unknown:black communities, you should still be doing that. And you
Unknown:should still be, you know, the work should be there. You should
Unknown:keep people updated. Even if it doesn't mean that you're
Unknown:constantly releasing press statements, because it's no
Unknown:longer a hot topic. But it doesn't matter if people are
Unknown:watching. That's the point. And I think that's what makes it
Unknown:authentic. And also the habitual piece, right, communicating what
Unknown:exactly you're doing, and the impact that you're having both
Unknown:internal and external audiences. And like I said, you know,
Unknown:taking accountability, and just being real about, here's where
Unknown:we're at, we're not perfect, this is not for PR, this is not
Unknown:to, you know, see a cover asses. We're being honest about our
Unknown:flaws and the good things that we're doing, because we care
Unknown:about this issue. And it's not about making us as a company
Unknown:look good. It's about the people we think we stand behind.
Kim Clark:And that's really how we want the depth model to be
Kim Clark:used is to ground people in his authenticity. And the T tailored
Kim Clark:is specific to every organization's core
Kim Clark:capabilities, so everybody can do something to you. earlier
Kim Clark:point, you're not you don't you can't solve all the things. But
Kim Clark:what is your business? What is your industry? Where do you have
Kim Clark:influence? Where do you have innovation? There, that's where
Kim Clark:you go, that's what you're about. And that's going to is
Kim Clark:going to make you not only stand but withstand, and I loved your
Kim Clark:examples. Thank you. So there's so much more I could talk to you
Kim Clark:about, maybe we'll have you back. Because, you know,
Kim Clark:especially as we you know, build up to November 2024. But, you
Kim Clark:know, so how can your fascinating you're into
Kim Clark:research? I'm always fascinated by research and what people are
Kim Clark:what what the insights are from different kinds of research,
Kim Clark:your dei strategists, where can people can follow you and
Kim Clark:continue to learn from you
Unknown:100% I am on LinkedIn, Miriam Khalifa, just type it in.
Unknown:And you will find me there, you know, talking about the
Unknown:importance of communications, going off about you know,
Unknown:current events, new technology, you name it, but very much
Unknown:through a DI lens and looking at, you know, how is this
Unknown:impacting the folks that maybe aren't in the conversation, and
Unknown:maybe are being overlooked by all the hustle and bustle. And
Unknown:you can also read my Pima conscious communicator? If you
Unknown:don't have the book already? Go get a copy. Yeah. I mean,
Unknown:they're on these issues, you know, from Kim, and other
Unknown:communications and VDI experts, just a wealth of knowledge. So
Unknown:what are you waiting for?
Kim Clark:Absolutely, I couldn't said it better myself,
Kim Clark:you really provide a very unique and very valuable perspective to
Kim Clark:the book. So thank you, again, for your contribution. And for
Kim Clark:trusting me, because you had no idea really what the book was
Kim Clark:about, but you wrote for it, and you trusted that it would be in
Kim Clark:context of your work. And, and I hope people really see that the
Kim Clark:highlight of your work and your contribution to the book,
Kim Clark:overall, really, is a tangible way of how communicators can
Kim Clark:start implementing this work within the organization. So
Kim Clark:thank you very much for that contribution.
Unknown:Thank you so much, Kim. It's it's been an incredible
Unknown:opportunity to be a part of this work and, you know, to hear from
Unknown:all of these voices, and to see some real momentum. You know, a
Unknown:lot of folks this is kind of a hidden issue, and it really is
Unknown:so important to get where we want to go.
Kim Clark:I'll echo my daughter whenever she hits the high score
Kim Clark:on the video game she likes. Let's go. Thank you, Kim.
