Geothermal at GeoEnergy 2025, Bergen, Norway

A special episode recorded in Bergen, Norway

Did you know the heat beneath our feet could power communities almost anywhere in the world?

In this episode, I take you with me to GeoEnergy 2025, a conference dedicated entirely to geothermal energy — from shallow systems to deep wells and next-generation closed-loop designs.

I share my own journey into geothermal, what I learned at the conference, and short conversations with people working across the field. If you’re curious about geothermal or work in oil & gas and wonder how your subsurface skills can transfer: this one’s for you.

🔊 Voices from the Episode

Featuring short interviews and insights from:

• Bjarte Lønøy, GEAN – Geothermal Energy Association of Norway
• Kirsti Midttømme, NORCE
• Kim Gunn Maver, Green Therma
• Jesper Moberg, Norsk Retningsboring
• Øystein Klemetsdal, SINTEF Digital

What You’ll Learn

• What geothermal energy actually is (in simple language)
• Why Norway has huge potential — and big drilling challenges
• New closed-loop systems (“underground thermos bottles”)
• How oil & gas skills translate directly into geothermal
• Why visibility, communication, and scale matter
• How digital twins can accelerate deployment

💛 Thank You

Huge thanks to GEAN, and especially Bjarte Lønøy and Kirsti Midttømme, for welcoming me into the geothermal community at GeoEnergy 2025.

If you enjoyed this episode, share it with someone curious about the future of energy.

Want to be a guest on Stories for the future: Beyond the Bubble? Send Veslemoy Klavenes-Berge a message on PodMatch.

You can always find more information about the podcast and my work on storiesforthefuture.com

Did you know that the heat beneath our feet could power communities almost anywhere in the world?

Enter geothermal energy.

This episode goes underground in the most optimistic way possible.

I only managed to skim a few articles and wrap my head around the basic idea before the doors of that company literally shut behind me.

Ironically, because the oil and gas side was struggling.

Then life moved on and geothermal went back into the deep somewhere.

But a couple of years ago, it resurfaced for me, quite literally bubbling back up when I was working as a research fellow for an American company.

We were trying to calculate the positive climate impact of a geothermal project.

Suddenly, all those old sparks came back.

This idea of clean, constant, steady energy from the ground, it grabbed me again and I got really, really excited about it.

Since then, I've tried to learn more and honestly, I've been a bit puzzled.

Why aren't we talking more about this?

Why is something so elegant, stable and scalable still kind of the quiet one in the renewable family?

And I kept thinking, maybe I should do something about that, or try to do something about that.

At the very least, talk about it.

Show people that this is a space where oil and gas professionals with their subsurface superpowers are not just welcome, but absolutely needed.

So earlier this fall, I got incredibly lucky.

Or, I have to be honest, I actually invited myself.

But I was very warmly welcomed.

So I'm really grateful for that.

This is a conference dedicated entirely to geothermal energy in all its forms.

The whole thing is run by gan, the Geothermal Energy association of Norway.

And I'm grateful to Bjarter Lernay and Kishtimittamme for opening the doors for me and helping me navigate this landscape, which was quite new for me.

And I didn't actually know anybody there when I came to Bergen, but when I got there and being surrounded by geologists, engineers, innovators, academics, and all the people who have been building this field for years, it really felt a little bit like home.

All the engineers, all the geoscientists, all the people working similarly to what I was used to from oil and gas, but still quite different.

And I will get back to that later.

Before we dive into the interviews, let me quickly explain what geothermal actually is in very simple terms, because I'm not an expert myself, but I don't think that you need a PhD in heat flow to appreciate this technology and understand the basics.

At its core, geothermal is about using the heat that naturally exists beneath our feet.

Sometimes that means shallow systems right beneath a building.

Sometimes it means wells drilled deep into the earth.

And sometimes it's new closed loop systems.

Basically a giant underground thermos, they actually call them that, that circulate heat without ever touching the surrounding rock or water.

We will get back to this later in the episode.

And here's the thing.

None of this is science fiction.

It's not even new.

What's new is the momentum and the need.

Norway, like the rest of the world, needs to find stable, clean energy sources that don't depend on the weather, don't take up huge areas of land and don't require massive new transmission lines.

Geothermal ticks all those boxes.

So this episode is my attempt to bring that story to the surface.

To let you hear from the people at the heart of this field and to explore what it could mean for Norway and for anyone out there thinking about how this could potentially be a new path in their own career.

Okay, let's head to Bergen and here's how it sounded.

One of the solutions to the energy crisis of the future is right beneath our feet.

The whole concept is like we are putting a thermal flask into the ground.

That was Eistein Klemetzdahl and Kim Maver.

And you will hear more from them later.

But first, while I was mingling with all these new people in Bergen, listening, learning and trying to absorb everything, one thing became very clear to me.

This is not just about the technology.

It's about a whole ecosystem trying to come together.

And this is also what Bertelle and I, the leader of Geothermal Energy association of Norway who invited me to the.

Conference is the main purpose is to bring together the entire value chain.

Researchers, industry, policymakers and technology developers.

We need to meet, we need to share knowledge and accelerate progress.

And if there's anyone who understands why this matters, it's.

Is a senior researcher at NORS and one of the long standing voices in Norway's geothermal world.

She has watched the field grow in small pockets, in silos, in separate corners.

And she's been one of the people trying to knit it together.

Here's what she told me about her hopes for this conference.

Sure that we need this network to gather all working with geothermal energy together.

Because geothermal energy have been many silos, some been working with ground source heat pump, some people with direct use, and also people planning for geothermal power production.

So we haven't had this network, we haven't been talking together.

So I hope that this can get us together and also see that we really working with the same thing to develop either it's deep or shallow, or using use of ground source heat pump.

So I think at the end we have the same goal.

Different technologies, different depths, different temperatures, but the same mission use the heat in the ground.

And right now that mission is a bit scattered.

What do you think is standing in the way for more focus on geothermal in Norway?

Both from politicians, from society, from industry.

What is lacking?

We are a local energy that have to be implemented by the private house owner.

And so we are not the big actors like wind and nuclear power, etc.

So here it's small actors and also the drilling company that's haven't the same budget for lobbying and so on.

So I think it's also difficult to compare us with the example wind industry because the installation is much smaller.

It's also depend on the private house owner if what he wanted to use for his energy source.

So it's difficult to compare us with other.

But I think we should also be on the radar for the politicians and we have in some way built stone to stone.

It's also that we have to be together and to show the potential for the energy budget for Norway that private owners install this technology.

And that's also missing today.

No one in Norway, the actors, the energy authorities, they don't know about geothermal energy.

They don't know how much energy you're saving by this technology.

If you ask the Department of Energy, they haven't any number of what's the saving by using this technology.

And we as a.

Organization, we should really stress to get some more information to.

To give some input to the authorities.

Exactly.

So geothermal energy is still kind of quiet and shy.

There are no huge solar farms, no giant turbines on the mountains, no billion kroner marketing budgets.

And that's where innovation comes in.

Because while shallow systems might be small and decentralized, there's a whole world of deeper dreams.

Geothermal technology pushing forward.

So let's move from the ecosystem to the technology.

Let me introduce you to Kim Maver, chief geologist at Green Therma.

Here's how he described their technology to me.

And this technology in my head sounds like if it's working, it's a no brainer.

So the whole concept is like we are putting a thermo flask into the ground.

So the problem is if we drill down to 3,5 kilometers, it'll be 150 degrees.

To get that heat hot water back to the surface, you lose maybe 30, 40% of your energy.

So our pipe that brings the water back to the surface has a vacuum.

So it's actually two pipes.

And between these two pipes is a vacuum.

And that means we only lose a few percent.

So if the water is 100 degrees at 5km, it'll be slightly less, but only slightly less at the surface.

And then we can exchange the heat through a heat exchanger and go directly into district heating networks, for example, in theory, should last 50 to 100 years.

Because this is a closed system, we know exactly which fluids are in the pipes.

So there'll be no corrosion, anything like that, and no downhole moving parts.

So we think last at least 50 years, maybe 100 years.

If you go to the North Sea, pull, pull out pipes from the ground after 50 years, they look brand new on the outside.

Well, I mean, what is not to love about that technology?

A giant underground thermos.

So this is a closed loop system, a sealed pipe, circulating fluid, no pollution, no contact with groundwater.

But, and this is important, simple ideas still meet complex geology.

And I know that Norway is special when it comes to complex geology.

So I asked Kim about this.

Does this technology fit anywhere in the world, even Norway?

So you can say these kind of closed loop solutions where you don't flow water through the subsurface, they will work anywhere in the world.

But for Norway you have the two things.

One, if you drill down, the temperature gradient with depth is not very high, so you have to go much deeper than for example in Denmark or Germany.

That's one thing.

And the other thing is you have very hard rock and that takes longer to drill.

So the wells gets more expensive again compared to Denmark or Germany, where it's like drilling for oil and gas, it's much softer rocks, it goes much faster.

So that's why maybe the solution we are proposing is not what you will see tomorrow, but eventually I think it will be everywhere, even in Norway.

So we've done, through a Norwegian research project, we've done a test in stavanger last year, 500 meters of this vacuumized pipe.

Then this year we're going to install our system in the well north of Berlin.

So an old geothermal well that did not work.

We will now install our system and then next year we're going to drill a well in Denmark, four and a half kilometers deep, two and a half kilometers with the horizontal section.

That's sponsored by the Danish government by around 11 and a half million euros.

I asked Kim the classic million dollar question that I kept repeating to most of the people I talked to.

What has to happen for oil and gas people to actually find their place in geothermal?

So I think to really transition big time from the oil and gas industry to geothermal, you need to scale.

The geothermal industry is still a niche industry on a lot of statistics.

You still see geothermal as part of others.

When you look at renewables, you need to get out of that.

I think as soon as we come out of that, there will be really a big need for drillers, for geologists, geophysicists, just like with the oil and gas.

So geothermal needs drillers and geoscientists.

Norway has a few of those lying around.

But the mound is one thing, the drilling economics are another.

This is Jesper Mobarg, the CEO of Norsk Retning Spurring, a company that specializes in deep geothermal wells.

Jesper really knows drilling from both worlds, oil and gas and geothermal.

So I asked him about the transfer of skills, people and experience between the two industries.

I think the drilling part is, is more or less the same.

However, you need to bear in mind that the economy in geothermal is way less than it is in the oil and gas industry.

So you need to go very practical.

You need to really, really have cost benefits, analysis of what you're doing, what is the right speed, how can you minimize the wear and tear of, of the drill bits?

Can you buy lowering the pace, potentially limit the trippings in and out the well by changing out the drill bit, things like that.

So there are differences.

However, a lot of it is the same.

You still need to do rotating drilling, you still need to circulate, you.

You need to use standard drill pipes.

So a lot of similarities, however, also some significant differences.

There was one thing Jesper said during his talk earlier at the conference that caught my attention.

He told the room to keep oil and gas far away from geothermal.

I needed to understand that better.

So I asked him to explain.

I think to be more exact, keep it out of the hard rock formations that we see or the hard rock crust that we see in Scandinavia or the northern part of Scandinavia.

I think that the oil and gas industry are designing.

All the tubing and liners that are great in wells that are massive producers.

But massive producers need limestones and.

Porosity in the reservoir so they can circulate bigger amount of waters and extract more heat.

That's not the case in granite formations.

So by using the usual suspects from the Oil and gas industry, the cost per well becomes too high.

They haven't adjusted their cost base to the extract of energy that you can take out or heat that you take out of the wells.

Meaning that buying the heat becomes too expensive.

As at end of the day it's all about being cost competitive.

I hope I don't offend any of these players, but that's just the reality.

We cannot make a business case out of that product range as it is today.

So we need to apply some savviness and creativity to reduce the cost base because the cost base is just nowhere near where it has to be to, to really scale it up.

That part might have been very technical if you're not into drilling and geoscience.

But I think the essence is that this is the heart of the transition challenge.

Many of the same skills, much of the same technology, but different economics.

We wrapped it up talking about how there is a gap in the market right now that leaves room for smaller companies to enter the arena.

Yeah, I think right now I think there is a gap in the market.

We see oil and gas prices.

More.

Or less stable within 60 to $80 as long as the price is up there.

I don't foresee a great appetite for the usual suspects within the oil and gas industry to really, you know, shift production and start prioritizing due third thermal.

Why should they?

It's still a cascade in the traditional oil and gas industry for some years to come.

So I think that allows for an opportunity for new companies to enter and maybe get a little bit of a leap in that race towards taking over the geothermal energy.

Then maybe the cynical part of me will say that when smaller companies have matured or become big in the geothermal market, they'll be swallowed by the big companies from the oil and gas because they just come with a massive amount of money.

And somehow it sits well within their portfolio of products.

They just haven't, they haven't bothered themselves to learn the DNA of geothermal drilling or wells in hard rock formations yet.

I think that what Jesper said there about the gap in the market aligns really well with something I saw again and again at a conference.

This field is early enough that you can help shape it.

Isn't that exciting, especially if you're coming from oil and gas subsurface drilling reservoir or data.

And speaking of data, lets look at how digital innovation is changing the game.

Meet Einstein Clemetzdal from Syntev Digital.

He works on digital twins for geothermal.

Basically running the well in a computer before you ever run it in real life.

It's the kind of work that makes geothermal safer, smarter, and cheaper.

My name is Estan Klemetslaw.

I work in syntev Digital in a research group called the Applied Computational Sciences Group.

I work with the development of simulation technology, and I also do a lot of development of digital twin technology for geothermal energy applications.

We want digital twin that can be predictive.

So we would like the digital twin to say something about the state of the physical asset it represents in the future.

And the way we handle this is by simulation technology, so that you can simulate the physical state of the system in time, given the operational constraints that we impose.

And a lot of what we do is very similar to machine learning in that we are calibrating the model parameters so that the output that we get from the digital twin matches the observations from the physical system.

So you can model heat flow, performance and uncertainty before you drill.

And in deep geothermal, that can make or break a project.

So we were approaching the end of a great conference, and at this point, I wanted to zoom out a little bit.

What does the field really need from here?

How do we get geothermal on more people's radar?

Here's how Einstein responded.

That's a very good question.

And if I knew the answer, I would be very happy.

I think we need to be better at communicating how cool geothermal energy really is or how hot it is.

And.

Also sort of be better at probably refining the message.

It doesn't need to be that complicated.

If you let scientists and geologists talk away about their favorite fields quickly become very complicated.

But it doesn't really have to be.

When you're explaining this concept, it's one of the solutions to the energy crisis of the future is right beneath our feet, which is a very nice message, I think.

And yes, communication.

That is why this episode exists.

To make geothermal a little less hidden and a little more understandable and maybe even a little exciting.

Personally, I think it's very exciting.

Once I returned from Bergen and had finally dried up from its famously refreshing climate, I asked Bearter Lernay if he wanted to add a last thought to this episode.

This is what he My message is fairly simple.

Get involved.

Whether you're a student or an engineer, a policymaker, or work in the private sector, geothermal needs your curiosity, but also your skills.

You could start off by learning the basics, follow the latest research and pilot projects, but you could also get connected to organizations like ours.

The Geothermal Energy association of Norway.

The transition to more resilient energy systems requires all hands on deck.

And geothermal is an area where motivated people like yourself can make a real difference.

So help us spread the world.

And that's the part I want to leave you with.

This field is not crowded.

It's not saturated.

It's not fully formed.

It's open.

And it needs engineers, geologists, geophysicists, drillers, planners, policymakers, and, yes, storytellers.

So if you're curious about your own place in the future of energy, geothermal might be one of the doors worth knocking on.

Thank you so much for coming with me to Bergen.

I will, of course, share all important links and information in the show notes.

So go check them out, all of them.

And let's keep exploring the future together.

See you next time.