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9:15 #thinman
Episode 15 • 17th October 2024 • Devil's Trap: A Supernatural Podcast • Don't Be A Dick Productions
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Liz:

On this week's episode of Devil's Trap podcast.

Diana:

It's hashtag Ghostfacers, hashtag Ghostwatch, hashtag Deviltrapodcast.

Liz:

Let's do this.

Diana:

Welcome to this week's episode of Devil's Trap podcast.

Diana:

I'm Diana.

Liz:

I'm Liz.

Liz:

Allegedly.

Diana:

And this week we're going to talk about Hash Thinman.

Liz:

There really is a hashtag in the title of the show.

Diana:

There is.

Diana:

I didn't share that.

Diana:

Yeah.

Liz:

The aughts.

Liz:

This was the teens.

Liz:

I don't know, the 20.

Liz:

The think it's still a thing.

Diana:

Don't people still do that?

Liz:

What?

Diana:

Hashtags and things.

Liz:

Hashtag my.

Liz:

I know, probably.

Liz:

So what have you been up to?

Diana:

I went and saw some music this week.

Diana:

I know, it's so weird.

Diana:

No, it's kind of fun, actually.

Diana:

We did a babe and I ran around.

Diana:

We did two shows in one night.

Diana:

Went to american aquarium at Longhorn Ballroom, which is fun.

Diana:

They put on a really good show and then not a fan, I guess.

Liz:

And then, hey, I was saying it silently.

Liz:

You didn't have to, like, express it out loud.

Diana:

They just put, they're really good performers, and then went over to another spot to go catch some punk rock to balance it out for the night.

Diana:

And saw the raging Nathans, who I really, really, really liked and had not seen before.

Diana:

I did not know them before.

Diana:

And then sack, which is members of teenage Paul Rocket fun.

Diana:

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Diana:

I mean, just been doing stuff around the house and whatnot other than that, so.

Diana:

Yeah.

Diana:

How about you?

Liz:

Let's see.

Liz:

I got.

Liz:

The most exciting thing is I finally got a fridge, and it's amazing.

Liz:

And if you've ever lived a while without.

Liz:

I mean, it's not like I didn't have access to a refrigerator, but it's been in another.

Liz:

It's a thing.

Liz:

So there's enough.

Liz:

I've had to go outside of my house to go access a refrigerator for a while.

Liz:

And so having one within my kitchen now is.

Liz:

Is quite heavenly, and it feels very luxurious and it's super fancy.

Liz:

And every.

Liz:

All my other stuff is very basic.

Liz:

And, like, I have a super fancy fridge, but, you know, there was that.

Liz:

And then also I got to hug some baby goats on Friday, which was pretty fucking amazing.

Liz:

There is a company called Gauche, not ghost.

Liz:

You would think it would be ghost, but called goat shenanigans.

Liz:

And they basically take goats around to different things in this place.

Liz:

They took it to a vineyard that's outside of San Antonio.

Liz:

It's one of those, like, you know, semi hill country, sort of a veneer, but not really places.

Liz:

We have music and tastings and stuff.

Liz:

It was a nice place.

Liz:

It was.

Liz:

The atmosphere was great.

Liz:

And there was fucking baby goats.

Liz:

But I did go because it said there was going to be baby goats in costumes, and the goats were not in costumes because it was too hot.

Liz:

And boo, indeed.

Liz:

I mean, I appreciate that baby goats don't want to be in things when it's hot, but you could have at least, like, put, I don't know, a hat.

Liz:

A hat on one.

Liz:

But they're very sweet, and they were on leashes, so I got to walk them around.

Liz:

And they don't.

Liz:

They don't really obey.

Liz:

No, no.

Liz:

They kind of.

Liz:

They walked you around, but they were adorable.

Liz:

One of them, he was just, like, black with blue eyes, and he just looked like a little Philip and he.

Diana:

Looks a little evil.

Diana:

Evil baby goat.

Liz:

I love an evil baby goat.

Liz:

Title of my next ex tape.

Diana:

Absolutely not.

Liz:

Title of the next album.

Liz:

Yes.

Diana:

That's okay.

Diana:

I love it.

Liz:

Yeah.

Liz:

Okay.

Liz:

We got in there.

Liz:

So, yeah, that was.

Liz:

That's been my weekend.

Liz:

Looking forward to tomorrow is my first fire class, and I'm super stoked about learning to see.

Liz:

I don't even know how I'm gonna be learning.

Liz:

So I'm gonna go learn to play the fire at circus school.

Liz:

Cause that's what I do.

Diana:

That's fun.

Diana:

That's exciting.

Liz:

That is.

Liz:

I'm very excited about that.

Diana:

I did also get to go back to the fair.

Diana:

I forgot.

Diana:

I did get another state fair.

Diana:

Texas trip in.

Liz:

Well, good.

Liz:

What was the highlight?

Liz:

Food.

Diana:

Why did.

Diana:

Well, I was with.

Diana:

This was my sister, and my brother in law took me and Addison to the fair.

Diana:

That's what this night was, so.

Diana:

But once again, again, cotton candy bacon wins today.

Diana:

That's good stuff.

Diana:

Though, I will say the Nutella filled churro was not disappointing either.

Diana:

I found the dole whip.

Diana:

I did find the dole whip station.

Diana:

And here's the thing.

Diana:

It was good.

Diana:

I'm not mad at a dole whip ever, but it wasn't great.

Diana:

I would rather go to swizzle their dole whips better.

Diana:

Or pineapple iihdem.

Liz:

That is.

Liz:

That is the ruling of the Dole whip.

Liz:

You have.

Liz:

You have heard it here first.

Liz:

That is Diana's opinion.

Liz:

And, you know, slide into her DM's and tell her how you feel about her dole whips.

Liz:

Yeah.

Diana:

Oh, my gosh.

Diana:

Well, tell me about this episode, Liz.

Liz:

So, hash thin man, this was episode 15 of season nine.

Liz:

,:

Liz:

I have no idea.

Liz:

Still, I'm saying that name, right.

Liz:

We last saw him in season eight, slarp and the real girl before that, adventures and babysitting.

Liz:

And it was written by Miss Jenny Klein.

Liz:

So in our recap, we get ghost.

Liz:

Ghost facers.

Diana:

Yes.

Diana:

Yeah.

Diana:

And then, of course, Sam and Dean talking about how we're business, not family.

Liz:

It's risky business, but also, like, it's like the family business.

Liz:

Like, so I feel like there's a bingo card here that we're gonna start having one.

Liz:

It's like, business.

Diana:

Yeah.

Liz:

I'm business Dean and Sam.

Diana:

Business Dean and Sam.

Diana:

So we open in Springdale, Washington, and we've got, actually, interestingly, the song playing this.

Diana:

There's a teenage girl taking a bunch of selfies.

Diana:

So there's a song playing.

Diana:

It's called this house is a hotel.

Diana:

It's by a band called the Wind and the Wave, which are actually based in Austin.

Diana:

And they're still an active band right now.

Liz:

Yeah.

Diana:

Anyways, there.

Diana:

I'm familiar with them.

Diana:

So I was like, hey, I know this band.

Diana:

So the teen girls taking all these selfies.

Diana:

She hears a noise.

Diana:

She calls out for her mom, doesn't get a response, closes and locks her bedroom door.

Diana:

Mom's not home, and she keeps taking selfies.

Diana:

And this is when Diana hates this episode.

Diana:

I don't do mirror shit, and I don't like weird shit in photos.

Liz:

Yeah, I kind of figured you weren't gonna like those.

Diana:

That's.

Diana:

Those are things that we're.

Diana:

Creepy eyes and shit in mirrors or photos.

Diana:

Fucking scares me.

Diana:

I don't like it.

Diana:

Not into it.

Diana:

And she's got some scary fucking guy without a face in the background of her photo.

Diana:

And then she keeps scrolling through the fucking photos to make sure he's in more than one of them before turning around.

Diana:

What the fuck is she doing?

Liz:

Well, I think, to be fair, your brain is probably not gonna process that.

Liz:

Well, I mean, I would have immediately turned around.

Liz:

I think that would have been my instinct, but.

Liz:

Teenage girl:

Liz:

I need to go check on Twitter to see what is behind me.

Diana:

Well, either way, finally, she sees this guy, but then the power gets turned off, and so she runs to the closet in the same room she's in with this dude.

Diana:

Oh, my God.

Diana:

This girl.

Diana:

Casey, come the fuck on.

Liz:

Yep, but at least she has her phone.

Liz:

And she uses it to dial 911, but then she freezes up when they.

Diana:

Ask for her address.

Diana:

She freezes.

Liz:

Poor girl.

Diana:

Damn it, Casey.

Diana:

Anyways, but the guys in the closet with her anyway, so it doesn't matter.

Diana:

And he's got his knife.

Diana:

And while nine one is trying to trace her call, we cut out to the outside of the closet.

Diana:

We got a scream and then an insane amount of blood is pouring through the slats of the closet door.

Diana:

Am I wrong?

Diana:

It's a lot.

Diana:

It's a lot.

Diana:

It's a lot.

Diana:

I was like.

Liz:

And realistically, you would have to be like.

Liz:

It would have a lot of thing factors would have to go into making out that door.

Liz:

Yes.

Liz:

Anyhow, anyhow, there's some, there's some blood.

Diana:

So.

Diana:

Yeah.

Diana:

So we cut to Sam and Dean in the bunker.

Liz:

And Dean is acting like a teenage girl.

Liz:

He's acting like that girl taking selfies.

Liz:

And he comes out with a backpack because he's going.

Liz:

And he didn't invite Sam because I don't know, like what you want and we're just not going to talk about it.

Liz:

And I'm just going to pack my things up in a bag and go because we cannot talk to each other.

Diana:

I just assume that you're not going to want to go.

Liz:

It is just like the most, like when you're on that, when you should just break up.

Liz:

This is like the relationship that should just end at this point.

Liz:

It's not healthy.

Liz:

But Dean has got some dirt from the killing.

Diana:

Yeah.

Diana:

He saw a photo was leaked from the crime scene and you can.

Diana:

It's a selfie.

Diana:

So.

Diana:

But all the doors and windows to the house were locked and so he thinks that it is a ghost caught on film situation, which does make sense.

Liz:

From, from their perspective.

Liz:

But I mean, has that happened before?

Liz:

Have we had, I guess, in this, in the canon of supernatural?

Liz:

Have there?

Liz:

I guess there's been ghosts and photos.

Liz:

Have there?

Diana:

I don't think so.

Liz:

I mean, this is definitely like falling into proof of the supernatural, which is kind of a big deal.

Liz:

But also they don't feel like it's a big deal.

Liz:

Right.

Liz:

It doesn't seem like it is.

Diana:

Right.

Liz:

It just seems like a case like, oh, interesting, there's a ghost in this photo.

Diana:

I wonder if that's just like, maybe there's like, you know, we always in real world, not in supernatural canon, but there's always like, when you see like a little bit of people, a lot of times people claim to see a little bit of a specter in a photo, but it's not necessarily considered proof of.

Diana:

So maybe that's kind of like that.

Liz:

Yeah, I guess I don't know.

Liz:

Apparitions in a photograph.

Liz:

I mean, that's a pretty, it's full on believable thing.

Liz:

A proof of beetlejuice would be like a maze.

Liz:

You know, it's proof of.

Liz:

Anyhow, okay, so where were we?

Diana:

And so they decide to go.

Liz:

They drive my nose to say, oh, my God, I want to strangle them both.

Diana:

And then.

Diana:

So they.

Diana:

But they end up both going.

Diana:

They're driving, and nothing is resolved, but they both leave together.

Diana:

I don't.

Liz:

Yeah.

Liz:

So they go to Washington.

Liz:

And then my notes say, yes, you need to rip up this carpet, lady.

Liz:

Why is this even a question?

Diana:

Casey's mom is still scrubbing the carpet because the room colors were something Casey picked out.

Liz:

She picked out the carpet color, so she wants to keep it.

Liz:

I'm like, no, you need to throw this carpet away.

Liz:

One carpet is gross in the first place.

Liz:

But also, this is dope.

Diana:

Ma'am.

Liz:

And also, ma'am, why are you cleaning this?

Liz:

You pay somebody else to clean this, you don't do this yourself.

Liz:

Ma'am.

Liz:

Ma'am misses miles.

Diana:

No, no.

Liz:

Also, it's a biohazard.

Liz:

That's what that color is.

Liz:

That color is biohazard.

Liz:

And it's not in the Pantene group for a reason.

Diana:

Well, Sam's asking her questions, and she.

Diana:

She's.

Diana:

He starts poking around about weird stuff in the house, lights flickering, tv.

Diana:

And while Dean's trying to subtly use this EMF reader in the background.

Diana:

And before, like, Sam even, like, finishes, like, asking the question, she's like, oh, no cold spots either.

Liz:

And she just throws that out there, and everyone's like, whoa.

Liz:

What?

Liz:

Whoa, how you know about cold spots?

Diana:

Because apparently she got a phone call from, quote, supernaturalists.

Liz:

What a great term.

Liz:

I love it.

Diana:

It is a good word.

Diana:

And she knows it's not orthodox, but she's not getting shit from the police, and she can't afford a PI, so.

Liz:

She'S gonna hire these supernaturalists, and they're coming today.

Liz:

And they have a name.

Diana:

Oh, they have a name because Sam and Dean go outside and they see the ghost.

Diana:

Well, they go to a restaurant, they find the ghost facers, man.

Liz:

And they're eating.

Liz:

And Harry's really happy that they got not here.

Liz:

Ed is really happy that they got two new followers.

Diana:

Yes.

Diana:

He's very excited about that.

Diana:

But Harry is very upset because Dana has now ex on social media, has a dude's arm around her, but you can't see the dude.

Liz:

Yeah.

Liz:

So she's in a relationship.

Liz:

She's not in the point where she's posting the picture of the dude she's with.

Liz:

She's definitely with a dude.

Liz:

So that's a thing.

Liz:

And you have every right to be worried, Carrie, that that is a sign.

Liz:

But our boys come in and just drop themselves at this table, and it's hilarious.

Diana:

Yes.

Diana:

And they are not.

Diana:

And Harry and Ed are not happy about this.

Diana:

But dean's like, you need to leave, or I'm gonna put holes in your.

Liz:

Knees, which is very violent.

Diana:

Very violent, violent threat.

Diana:

And then while this is happening, the restaurant, like, the busboy and the restaurant manager is standing by them, and the manager's, like, a total dick to this busboy guy.

Diana:

It's just kind of a weird aside that we actually, like, see for no reason.

Liz:

It is a weird.

Liz:

Yeah, it is a thing.

Liz:

And he's yelling at him about dishes not being clean.

Liz:

I'm like, why is the busboy washing dishes?

Liz:

Like, what the fuck?

Liz:

The fuck?

Liz:

Like, don't yell at your employees like this.

Diana:

Anyways, he's not in front of people.

Diana:

That's extra rude.

Liz:

No, it's so.

Liz:

It's so much worse.

Liz:

Like, it's just not.

Liz:

It's not a good place to work.

Liz:

So while that's happening, though, we get to see that Harry has gotten himself a pistol arrow.

Liz:

But I.

Liz:

He has not bought himself a holster.

Diana:

No.

Diana:

Cause he's got it shoved in the front of his pants.

Liz:

You're gonna shoot your dick off, dude.

Liz:

That's how you shoot your dick off.

Diana:

Yes.

Diana:

You're not supposed to do that.

Diana:

And Dean calls it a lady gun.

Diana:

Cause it has a little pretty little.

Diana:

Pretty little.

Liz:

It's a nice little pearl handle on it.

Diana:

Oh, it's a lady gun.

Diana:

I have one like that.

Liz:

Everyone likes a pearl handle, so it's pretty.

Diana:

But anyway, Dean's, like, calls them fame whores and accuses them of exploiting this mom who just lost her kidde.

Diana:

Not wrong, Dean.

Diana:

Not wrong.

Diana:

All right, good call.

Diana:

Out.

Diana:

Um, so he is like, he asked.

Diana:

The dean does also ask where the rest of their team is now.

Diana:

And they kind of like, oh, well, they're not.

Diana:

We're not really a group.

Diana:

It's just the two of us now.

Diana:

Hmm.

Liz:

Oh, they don't have a crew anymore.

Diana:

Hmm.

Diana:

Well, but this ghost is going to get them killed.

Diana:

And Harry and Ed start laughing because they know that it's not a ghost, apparently.

Liz:

And Harry is very excited and wants them to Amazon him bitches.

Liz:

Which implies that he has a book, and you can buy it on Amazon.

Diana:

Yeah.

Diana:

Yeah.

Diana:

And Dean does not like this response.

Diana:

And he responds with, I will shoot you.

Liz:

Sometimes, though.

Liz:

I mean, I feel him a lot.

Liz:

So what we learned, though, is that Ed and Harry have written a book on thin man.

Diana:

Called the Skinny on thin man.

Diana:

Which is pretty good pun.

Liz:

It's not bad.

Liz:

Not bad.

Diana:

Not bad.

Diana:

And they have a lot of photos on their website about this.

Diana:

And it looks like what was in Casey's pictures.

Diana:

Like, Casey's photos.

Diana:

Her selfie with like, this kind of a.

Diana:

A no face.

Diana:

Thin.

Liz:

Thin man.

Diana:

Man.

Diana:

Yeah.

Liz:

Thin man.

Diana:

Yeah.

Diana:

And so it's become basically, it's an urban legend on the Internet.

Diana:

And it's something that, like, lurks in the background of people's lives.

Diana:

Until it decides to kill them.

Diana:

There's been thousands of sightings around the world.

Diana:

And, yeah, it's.

Diana:

And so Jean's like, so it's like a ghost with like a brand name.

Diana:

And Sam's like, no.

Diana:

Is it.

Diana:

Do you really think it's a ghost or you just hate the ghost faces that much?

Diana:

But Dean, apparently they're talking about how their EMF reader could have been wrong because of power lines.

Diana:

And.

Diana:

And.

Diana:

But they still come back to a girl died in a locked room.

Diana:

So.

Diana:

And could it be that the veils all fucked up?

Diana:

Maybe it could.

Liz:

I.

Liz:

And that is something that I think really needs to be talked about more.

Liz:

That is, to me, that's an emergency.

Liz:

I would consider.

Liz:

That would be what I would be so good.

Liz:

Like, Sam is just kind of sitting there.

Liz:

Like they're all like, well, we got a case.

Liz:

And I'm like, y'all, the veil.

Liz:

Like, there's just like, why are y'all not trying to solve this?

Liz:

Like, maybe.

Liz:

Do you not feel it's your problem?

Liz:

I feel like it's your problem.

Diana:

Maybe they think it goes dates into the angel stuff.

Diana:

And they don't have a solution for that yet.

Diana:

I don't.

Liz:

I don't know.

Liz:

I feel like they're not as concerned about this as they should be.

Liz:

But anyhow, so Sam.

Liz:

But Sam does point out that.

Liz:

No.

Liz:

Like, this legend actually goes back before the veil got fucked.

Liz:

So Dean's like, let's let me go start checking on the local deaths.

Diana:

Yeah, so either way, he's going to go look into that while we've got.

Diana:

Harry and Ed are now back over.

Diana:

Or they're now at the Miles house.

Diana:

So with.

Diana:

They're in the victim's room filming.

Diana:

And while Ed is trying to record his monologue.

Diana:

Harry should be filming.

Diana:

But he's very distracted looking again at Dana's social media.

Liz:

Yeah.

Liz:

And she has changed her status, too.

Liz:

It's complicated.

Liz:

And this was:

Diana:

Yes.

Diana:

So.

Diana:

And Harry is going to start discussing in the closet about how close they are to finding thin man and that he can even smell his musk.

Liz:

His musk.

Diana:

Anyways.

Diana:

But Ed's like, yeah, I don't really want my knees blown off, though.

Diana:

Maybe.

Diana:

Maybe we just bail on this whole thing.

Diana:

And then Harry's like, no, we're not gonna let those Winchester steal our glory.

Diana:

They don't even have a Twitter.

Liz:

I really, seriously.

Liz:

And it's all about those haters eating their words.

Liz:

Those deserters, Maggie and spruce.

Liz:

So we know Maggie and Spruce have failed, but now they just think they're gonna get on Doctor Phil with this shit.

Liz:

And then Ed comes out of the closet.

Diana:

They're gonna start recording.

Diana:

And Ed's in the zone has come out of the closet.

Liz:

Yeah, he literally did.

Liz:

But I just thought it was appropriate for what was happening this episode.

Liz:

And his man love, he has a.

Diana:

Lot of man love for Harry.

Liz:

A little obsessive man love.

Liz:

A little too much.

Liz:

He's going a little far.

Diana:

And then as Harry does a really awful monologue, or, sorry, Ed does a really awful monologue.

Diana:

Harry blows smoke of his ass saying it was good and then starts talking about how much gets cut off before he gets to say pussy.

Diana:

They were going to get for after they broke the thin man.

Diana:

The case open, misses miles, strolls in with lemonade.

Liz:

And it's just a very awkward and gross moment, and I don't like it.

Liz:

So we go from that awkward moment to the motel.

Diana:

Yeah, back up.

Diana:

They're still researching because Dean's found three deaths that are suspicious, but none have any connection to Casey.

Diana:

So they can't be her.

Diana:

So Sam's like, yeah, there's just.

Diana:

There actually have been deaths pinned on thin Mandeh.

Liz:

And he says, according to the Lord.

Liz:

And that becomes one of Sam's catchphrases, as we know and also would of mine.

Liz:

And so we are going to talk about the lore.

Liz:

Yes, but we're not going to talk about the lore of what everybody is thinking that we would do the natural.

Liz:

The natural follow through would be to do Slender man.

Liz:

I think Slenderman is real gross, and I don't want to talk about it.

Liz:

And so we're going to talk about something else.

Liz:

We're going to talk about ghost watch.

Liz:

Have you ever heard of ghost watch?

Diana:

No.

Liz:

going to time travel back to:

Liz:

Everyone was dressed exactly as they are dressed now.

Liz:

There was a writer named Stephen Volk, and he had this great idea for a drama for the BBC.

Liz:

He wanted to do a six part drama about a reporter investigating a haunted house that escalated into a one night live broadcast inside said haunted house.

Liz:

Right?

Liz:

But the BBC didn't go for the six part drama.

Liz:

But they did, like, this idea of a live night inside a haunted house.

Liz:

And that was something they could work with.

Liz:

So they tapped this woman, Leslie Manning, direct and slated 90 minutes for Halloween night for Ghost watch.

Liz:

Now this thing, and I'm just gonna spoil some stuff, this becomes a really massive broadcast in England.

Liz:

And it was in, like, the top, like, whatever the BBC charts are and stuff.

Liz:

And the show is set up so that a broadcasting unit has been sent to a house in west London.

Liz:

And this house belongs to a family called the earlies, and it's Pamela and her two daughters, Susie and Kim.

Liz:

And they actually refer to them as a broken family within this because this is, you know, this is the nineties.

Liz:

And so.

Liz:

But they're saying that this was the most haunted house in Britain, right?

Liz:

And they tell on the program ghost watch when it airs, this is going to be the shtick that they have been investigating this place for the past ten months, and it is definitely the most haunted thing.

Liz:

And they're going to film a film crew out there live in Halloween once and for all, to prove the existence of ghosts.

Liz:

Right?

Liz:

So they're telling everybody they're setting up this real live show.

Liz:

But it's a drama, right?

Liz:

So they used real BBC personalities and were basically staging one of the first reality found footage mockumentaries.

Liz:

This is before the Blair Witch.

Liz:

This is before reality television.

Liz:

This is:

Liz:

So in:

Liz:

I didn't even know the real world was out yet.

Liz:

So the.

Liz:

This style of shooting and all this ideas of reality, of that you would be producing something that was fake, wasn't really even in the social construct.

Liz:

But also, if you can think back to this is going to be a comparison to war of the world in the.

Liz:

Whatever decade that was in the.

Liz:

In the early 20th century.

Liz:

And, you know, that story where, you know, the radio broadcasts, everybody thought aliens were invading.

Liz:

So this becomes a very similar thing.

Liz:

Right?

Liz:

So I'm giving some stuff away, but it's important to set up.

Liz:

So, like I said, the show used real BBC personalities, the main host in the studio, which was set up to look exactly like BBC one was Michael Parkinson, who also had a BBC one talk show at the time.

Liz:

He was very well known, the reporter.

Liz:

They had a reporter on site at the house, and that was Sarah Green, and she had a BBC morning children's show and her mic, her husband, Mike Smith, was in the studio taking calls.

Liz:

Right?

Liz:

And so they were a very kind of well known tv personality couple.

Speaker C:

Right?

Liz:

So they say that they're going to be there doing.

Liz:

Doing this.

Liz:

Right?

Liz:

Another actor from the series Red dwarf, Craig Charles, is acting as an on site reporter, but also as himself.

Liz:

So he's playing himself as a reporter.

Liz:

In the studio with Parkinson was a parapsychologist named Doctor Lynn Pascoe, who was played by the actress Jillian Bevan.

Liz:

So it looked exactly like the news broadcast BBC one was doing at the time.

Liz:

But it was all pre recorded.

Liz:

So they shot all the house footage, like five to six weeks before they shot the studio footage.

Liz:

And then when they shot the studio footage, they piped in all the stuff that they shot in at the house.

Liz:

So this is still the nineties and, you know, some things they couldn't do, but.

Liz:

So.

Liz:

And then they recorded what was shot in the studio, and then what was shot in the studio was what was being broadcast on Halloween.

Liz:

Nothing was live.

Liz:

It was all pre recorded.

Liz:

The cast and crew were all off in a pub somewhere in the middle of nowhere, drinking.

Liz:

So the scene resembles though, and the show itself resembles any reality show about hauntings you would encounter today.

Liz:

But they didn't exist again, they didn't exist back.

Diana:

All we had back then was unsolved mysteries.

Liz:

We had unsolved mysteries.

Liz:

We had a few things.

Diana:

I know.

Diana:

I'm teasing.

Liz:

Yeah.

Liz:

So back in the shakespeare, old man shakes fist at Dateline.

Liz:

So, all right, so they start off and they're showing this house in west London, right?

Liz:

So Sarah Green, the reporter, is there, and she's there with the family and her camera crew.

Liz:

And they are going through the house and they're discussing the haunt that's been happening there.

Liz:

Right?

Liz:

At one point, they actually watch footage of Pamela on local television discussing the haunting.

Liz:

And that's just a meta.

Liz:

This is so fucking meta.

Liz:

Right?

Liz:

Like.

Liz:

So they made a fake tv show about Pamela to film, to put into the fate tv show about Pamela.

Liz:

It's inception.

Liz:

It really is.

Liz:

So Doctor Pasco, in the.

Liz:

In the narrative, has written a book about this experience called angels of the odd.

Liz:

They have like a mock.

Liz:

They have the book there, and she presents like, a tape of, like, all the stuff that was happening before, including Suzanne being possessed and this disembodied voice coming out of her.

Liz:

And she reveals at what point we filled Suzanne's mouth with color liquid, then sealed her lips with tape, and the voice continued.

Liz:

They just nonchalantly say that sentence and just go on what?

Liz:

You waterboarded a child, and we're just like.

Liz:

And yet nothing happened.

Liz:

So nobody comments on that.

Liz:

But they go.

Liz:

So during this broadcast, they are also displaying the standard number for BBC call in shows.

Liz:

And then shows at the time, there are things called, like crime watch, right?

Liz:

So the ghost watch is like crime watch.

Liz:

So crime watch, I don't know, watching crime.

Liz:

And so.

Liz:

But goes, watch, they're watching ghosts.

Liz:

So they have this number on there.

Liz:

And the broadcast seems to be taking in live callers, but they were all pre recorded.

Liz:

One was Leslie Manning, the director who stepped in as the original actress hired, was unable to deliver the lines as intended.

Liz:

And so, yeah, so they have this.

Liz:

So you can picture this now, this kind of, like that set where you, like, call in and tell us about your ghost stories.

Liz:

And here's our number of it's being gone across the screen.

Liz:

And there's a, like a section where there's people taking phone calls.

Liz:

And the reporter, Sarah, her husband is there, who's like, kind of directing that.

Liz:

So the, you know, the.

Liz:

And then in the studio, there is Parkinson and the doctor.

Liz:

And so they're basically talking to Sarah on site at the house.

Liz:

And in the studio, they're talking to people on the phone.

Liz:

Kind of get it?

Liz:

Does that make sense now?

Liz:

Yes.

Liz:

So the haunting of the house, throughout the show, they talk about a poltergeist haunting the house.

Liz:

The family has dubbed Mister Pipes because he makes noise in the pipes.

Liz:

Then about 13 minutes into the show, as they're talking about this, people are calling in, right?

Liz:

And so when somebody calls in and they say, hey, there's a hidden figure in that girl's bedroom that you're showing.

Liz:

And so they're like, what?

Liz:

And so this is different.

Liz:

So they replayed the footage, and now everybody can see that there is a figure in the background of this.

Liz:

But to make things even more fucked up, it was different footage than what was aired the first time.

Liz:

So the first time they aired it, like, the first footage, it goes through, there's no ghost.

Liz:

They go, let us go replay it.

Liz:

show a ghost now because it's:

Liz:

You don't have Tivo, you don't have a DVR.

Liz:

You don't have, you don't have live tv.

Liz:

This is, unless you're recording on a VCR, there is no way for you to go back and see what they're doing.

Liz:

So they play it through one time, no figure there.

Liz:

They play it through a second time, and they're like, oh, can you see that?

Liz:

And they're like, it's not kind of.

Liz:

And they play it through a third time.

Liz:

The figure's not there.

Liz:

So there's completely fucking with everybody's mind.

Liz:

And it's just fucking brilliant.

Liz:

Right?

Liz:

So.

Liz:

And then this becomes like the stick throughout the show, and they don't, they don't talk about it, but this figure of the ghost is showing up.

Liz:

So there's seven times that he appears, and it's like an Easter egg hunt to find him.

Liz:

And this is from monsterpedia.

Liz:

And so this what these are don't.

Diana:

Really so much anxiety.

Liz:

Yeah, I'm going to tell you all this, but, like, they did this seven times.

Liz:

So seven times they had, like, this figure of this dude in there.

Liz:

And so it would be, like, outside in the crowd, or it'd be reflections, the things you hate.

Liz:

Reflections in mirrors and windows and camera crews sometimes behind doors.

Liz:

But they never really talked about that, right.

Liz:

Which I just think is also part of the thing is it's also pretty awesome.

Liz:

But then they, you know, pipes has never shown that clearly, but the girls describe him as having an old man's face and that he wore black dresses, his eyes were missing and he was covered in scratches.

Liz:

Then all these people are calling into the show, right?

Liz:

And the people that the ghost that they're describing looks like that.

Liz:

Then at one point, a man calls into the show and says he was a social worker.

Liz:

And the Ghost pipes actually was a child molester named Raymond Tunstall, who was possessed by another ghost named mother Seddons.

Liz:

And the crowd outside earlier had given the breadcrumb of mother Seddons, who was a victorian woman who was a baby farmer.

Liz:

So that's a word they used.

Liz:

And apparently a baby farmer is a woman who has a daycare.

Liz:

But in England, they call them baby farmers.

Liz:

That's a horrible thing to call them.

Liz:

And.

Liz:

Yeah, I don't like it.

Diana:

I don't like it.

Liz:

So she.

Liz:

But this woman apparently also murdered the children that were in her baby farm.

Liz:

So Tunstall was possessed by her.

Liz:

He is said to have hung himselves in what they called a glory hole, which is apparently a british term for cabinet under the stairs.

Liz:

Harry Potter, the boy who lived in a glory hole, just doesn't have quite the same ring.

Liz:

But I also figured out that you cannot confirm or deny that a glory hole is what that is called without just going straight to Pornhub.

Liz:

That's.

Liz:

That's immediately what all the resorts were.

Liz:

So we'll never know, I'm assuming.

Diana:

Yeah.

Liz:

So Tunstall was said to be in that glory hole, and he was locked in there with a dozen cats, and the cats ate him, and they also ripped out his eyes.

Liz:

So that's why pipes didn't have any eyes, because they were scratched out.

Liz:

And he acts basically like a poltergeist.

Liz:

He knocks on walls, he throws things, he scratches people, makes lots and lots of cat noises.

Liz:

Like, every time around was like, my cat was very upset as I was watching this today, just because there are an extraordinary amount of cats, like, fighting in the background of this movie.

Liz:

So he's also purportedly possessing people.

Liz:

And when somebody is possessed, they start talking in nursery rhymes.

Liz:

So Suzanne, who is the oldest child, I think she's, like, nine or 13.

Liz:

I don't remember which one, maybe 13.

Liz:

But she's caught making noises, and so everyone is accusing her of faking these things, right?

Liz:

But then she falls into a trance, and her face is covered in scratches, and she starts speaking with a different voice.

Liz:

And then at some point, they're in the studio, right?

Liz:

And they're like, oh, everything at the house has gone back to normal.

Liz:

And doctor Pasco realizes that the footage is being looped.

Liz:

And they're like, oh, my God.

Liz:

Pipes has looped the footage.

Liz:

He is a ghost in the machine.

Liz:

And what they have done is created a national seance, right?

Liz:

And people start calling in, reporting that things are happening in their homes.

Liz:

Glass tables are exploiting.

Liz:

There's wallpapers covered in blood.

Liz:

Like, everything is on the fritz.

Liz:

And so by the end of the show, like, most of the people have, like, fled the house, but Sarah and Suzanne have gotten locked in the glory hole, and pipes ends up, like, entering the studio.

Liz:

And everybody, like, flees the studio, but Parkinson.

Liz:

And so Parkinson, the main, like, news anchor guy, becomes possessed.

Liz:

And then it ends with, like, him, like, reading nursery rhymes off the auto queue and then saying the words fee fi fo foam.

Liz:

And then they.

Liz:

In that way, and then they go to the casting credits, right?

Liz:

And so this thing.

Liz:

Cause that's.

Liz:

That's it in a nutshell.

Liz:

You can watch it on chaos.

Liz:

It's chaos.

Liz:

You can get a dvd of it, and you can buy it off of YouTube.

Liz:

You supportedly at one time.

Liz:

You get it off of BBC, but even if you tell BBC that you're from England.

Liz:

You can't get it anymore.

Liz:

So, I mean, I'm not from England, but I.

Liz:

In.

Liz:

First it didn't let me because I wasn't from England, but then I was from England.

Liz:

I went to England really fast.

Liz:

I don't know how I got there, but, um, it wouldn't let me get it, so.

Liz:

But you can find.

Diana:

How long is this thing?

Liz:

It was 90 minutes.

Liz:

So this was originally supposed to be a six part, like.

Liz:

So there was supposed to be a six part drama with, like.

Liz:

And then end in one night.

Diana:

So they should have been like.

Diana:

It should have been three to 6 hours long.

Diana:

By making it like that, it was the original intent.

Liz:

Right.

Liz:

So they condensed this all into 90 minutes.

Liz:

But they did, like, it's very.

Liz:

How much it influences how paranormal shows are done today is just amazing.

Liz:

All the things that they set up in there, you know, the telling of the story, the going back and, like, you know, the history of the house, that it.

Liz:

They also just wanted to use all the latest and greatest, like, technology that was available in the nineties, both for, like, ghost hunting and for the tv.

Liz:

Right?

Liz:

So they had remote, wide angle cameras in all the rooms, which we see in every reality show today.

Liz:

That's just a given.

Liz:

But that was really new.

Liz:

Right?

Liz:

There's one point where they're like, oh, look, you can draw on this tv and it'll appear on the screen.

Liz:

They thought that was really cool.

Liz:

They used the now common page turn effect, which became, like, a thing that was really popular on top of the pops.

Liz:

You british people are fucking weird.

Liz:

They had an on screen map graphic that showed the locations of phone and callers.

Liz:

It was actually printed artwork, but there was a segment where they were interviewing people about their real ghost experiences.

Liz:

And then they, like.

Liz:

So then they put some real shit in there, too.

Liz:

Right?

Liz:

So they had people who had experiences with ghosts tell their stories of what their experiences were and then inserted that into the show.

Liz:

So there was real stuff inside.

Diana:

I mean, real in the middle of this other stuff.

Diana:

Yeah.

Liz:

Right.

Liz:

So people's real life stories.

Liz:

Real.

Diana:

Real accounts.

Liz:

Real accounts.

Liz:

But one of the guys didn't want his face being shown, so they got to use pixels to cover his face.

Liz:

And that was also new, and they were very excited about that.

Liz:

But a side note that the people telling their experiences said they were just really happy to have a place to tell, to tell these stories to that somebody could remember them.

Liz:

But after the broadcast, the UK just went bat shit crazy because a lot of people thought this was real.

Liz:

According to various sources in this, the numbers are.

Liz:

I'm about to throw a bunch of numbers at you because nobody knows what the fuck was going on.

Liz:

So according to the BFI DVD audio commentary the BBC received between 20,000 to 500,000 phone calls to its being switched forward.

Liz:

That is a large variation of numbers range.

Diana:

Yeah.

Liz:

Yeah.

Liz:

These calls comprise a mix of complaints, praise and inquiries regarding the authenticity of the show.

Liz:

In a:

Liz:

And the numbers from viewers throughout the evening could have reached as high as a million.

Liz:

However, in:

Liz:

I guess that's a BBC things.

Liz:

382 individuals said the show was an insult to their intelligence.

Liz:

275 considered it in poor taste.

Liz:

Six east, two offered general complaints and 116 stated they thoroughly enjoyed it.

Liz:

During a subsequent edition of bite back and discussed the program, Hosu Lawley noted the BBC switchboard received 20,000 calls.

Liz:

But there was also just some general, like, mayhem that came out of it.

Liz:

So that phone number that they had up on there, if you called in to that number, you were supposed to get a recording that said this is a drama and, you know, it's not real.

Liz:

But because so many people were calling in, nobody was getting that message.

Liz:

Everyone just kept getting the whatever, whatever thing.

Liz:

So a lot of people didn't.

Liz:

Didn't get the message right.

Liz:

And at the beginning of the show it says as a drama and there's like, you know, written by.

Liz:

And at the end there are the credits.

Liz:

But people, apparently they said there was something else that was on another channel and people flipped over during, you know, after that had already started.

Liz:

So they didn't see the beginning where they kind of like set up that thing so it just looks completely real.

Liz:

Some of the people thought that the parapsychologists were pissed about how they were represented.

Liz:

But the writer thought he did actually a realistic representation.

Liz:

A vicar called in and complained that he said he knew that it wasn't real, but they still raised demonic forces.

Liz:

People were very upset.

Liz:

They let that poor girl get all scratched up.

Liz:

Three p.

Liz:

Three women went into labor that night.

Liz:

This one is really fucked up.

Liz:

An 18 year old boy named Martin Denham, who had the mental capacity of a 13 year old committed suicide five days after the show aired.

Liz:

His parents said he was hypnotized and obsessed by the program they had knocking in their pipes.

Liz:

Due to their heating system.

Liz:

And they think that he related the two and thought that was a ghost.

Liz:

In his suicide note, he read, if there are ghosts, I will be with you always as a ghost.

Liz:

So there was a lawsuit that was not successful.

Liz:

Out of that, there was a report published in the British Medical Journal in 94 describing two cases of ghost watch induced post traumatic stress in ten year old boys.

Liz:

They say that this was the first reported case of PTSD caused by a television program.

Liz:

So that's just went on.

Liz:

And then.

Liz:

So to mark the show's 18th anniversary, a live event took place in lieu of a full repeat screening on television dubbed the national seance.

Liz:

of the show show at precisely:

Liz:

just as it was originally broadcast, and then tweet about the screaming as it happened on Twitter.

Liz:

And then it's become a yearly tradition and celebrating the original drama by unveiling special artwork and doing other material related to the production and often contributes to the hashtag hash ghostwatch.

Liz:

Trending on the platform.

Liz:

In:

Liz:

So a bunch of people participating in it.

Liz:

There's another documentary that came out called behind the curtains that was impossible to get.

Liz:

I don't know who's.

Liz:

So, yeah, they're very particular about keeping their media away from us in England.

Diana:

But that's weird.

Liz:

It is weird.

Diana:

But anyways, they like our media.

Diana:

Sometimes we want their media too.

Liz:

Well, I think they keep it away from themselves.

Liz:

Yeah.

Liz:

Or maybe these people don't steal it as much as we do.

Liz:

I don't know.

Liz:

But it was something.

Liz:

Not everything was easy to find for free.

Liz:

And I guess, yes.

Liz:

Okay, maybe we need to pay for things, whatever.

Liz:

But anyhow, ghost watch.

Liz:

So much like ghost facers.

Liz:

Ghost watches.

Liz:

Fascinating.

Liz:

I can't believe that was the thing I didn't know about until now.

Liz:

And it's really cool.

Liz:

And I think that's just.

Liz:

It was really neat story and way better than learning about the slender man's shit.

Liz:

But you thank me.

Diana:

Yeah, no, you're right.

Diana:

It's like.

Diana:

It's like a modern.

Diana:

Like a wars and wells thing, right?

Liz:

Yeah, it's a modern war of the worlds.

Diana:

Yeah.

Liz:

That was Orson Wells, correct.

Diana:

Yes.

Diana:

I had a moment where I was like, oh, no, what?

Diana:

I say.

Diana:

And then when you try and sound.

Liz:

Smart and you're like, know what I'm talking about.

Liz:

I know.

Liz:

I know about this thing.

Diana:

And then, like, I wonder, then my thought goes to, I wonder if the creators of the ghost of the Blair Witch project were familiar with.

Diana:

Yeah.

Liz:

So there's, and there is a lot of pretty much almost most especially british horror people, but also just, this was so influential on things and just the way that it was shot.

Liz:

Like, at one point they had, I mentioned they, they had a thermal image camera, and so all the lights go out in the house and there.

Liz:

And so thermal image cameras had just come into fashion because of the Gulf of.

Liz:

So that was the first time they started getting used there.

Diana:

Yeah.

Liz:

And so, like, they were using it as.

Liz:

So in the show, you can't see the ghost, but when the lights go out now you can see, you can see Sarah and Suzanne.

Liz:

I think it's forgot, but, yeah, you can see them going around.

Diana:

Very interesting.

Liz:

Yeah.

Liz:

And it's a really fun thing.

Liz:

I mean, you can.

Liz:

So I said there's a few ways you can watch it.

Liz:

And I actually watched it a couple of different ways.

Liz:

So in the dvd, just watched a couple of different ways that I don't have a convenient way to watch my dvd player right now, so.

Liz:

But on the DVD of Ghost Watch, there is commentary from Stephen Falkland and Ruth Manning and from Sarah Green's on there, but there's a couple of different versions of commentary above the film and a documentary on there.

Liz:

And then I had, I wanted to watch it without the commentary, but I didn't want to watch it on my dvd because again, I.

Liz:

It was uncomfortable and I had to sit in my office to watch it.

Liz:

So you can rent for $1.99 off of YouTube or you can buy it.

Liz:

So I paid $1.99 to YouTube to rent it.

Liz:

But I think that, honestly, I think it's worth a dollar 99.

Diana:

So dollar 99, well spent.

Liz:

Dollar 99 rolls.

Liz:

I miss the dollar movies.

Liz:

That's a tangent.

Liz:

I'm not going to go on, but, man, bring about the dollar movie theaters.

Liz:

That's all I got to say.

Liz:

All right, so that is ghost watch.

Liz:

We're going to go back to ghost facers.

Liz:

Yeah, but we're not there yet.

Liz:

So we are back in the bunker and they're looking at all the photos that look pretty fake except for Casey's.

Liz:

And again, after going through this, like, meta thing of like, real life versus fake, what I've this mind, this episode really fucks with your head of what was doctored by.

Liz:

No, we know at the end.

Liz:

Right.

Liz:

So what is doctored by who?

Diana:

Right?

Diana:

Because they know that these are fakes.

Liz:

And are they being faked by the Internet people?

Liz:

Are they being faked by.

Diana:

Because people do, like, create their own, like.

Diana:

Yeah, they created this whole, like, fandom lore.

Diana:

It's in a way.

Diana:

I don't know.

Liz:

Well, that's what slender meaning.

Liz:

Yeah, it is.

Liz:

It's.

Liz:

It's fandom, Lord Fandom.

Diana:

Urban legends.

Liz:

Urban legends on the Internet.

Diana:

Yeah.

Diana:

So it's.

Diana:

It's weird, but Dean thinks everybody's an idiot and wants to understand how something can be both real and fake at the same time.

Diana:

That's what he wants to know, which is fair.

Diana:

So he.

Liz:

Maybe they explain it in terms of boobs.

Diana:

Well, I like that he goes that he has the right.

Liz:

Boobs can be real.

Liz:

And really, at the same time.

Diana:

They can.

Diana:

They can be real and fake at the same time.

Liz:

Considering his, you know, his love strip clubs, I'm thinking he would know that.

Liz:

So.

Diana:

So.

Diana:

But I think they ask a smart question now is how did her photo end up online?

Liz:

Yeah.

Liz:

And this is, like, that is how did that happen?

Liz:

Right.

Liz:

And.

Liz:

But then they're also, like, ended up on a fan for him, but the ip address isn't blocked, and, like, unless you hack the fan for him, you can't tell that.

Liz:

But anyhow, so they go to a sheriff's office where the sheriff is on.

Diana:

A hunting trip, but, yeah, so this deputy is going to give them this evidence box and.

Diana:

And in it.

Liz:

Because they're playing feds.

Diana:

Yeah, because they're.

Diana:

Yeah, they're playing fed.

Diana:

So Sam's like, oh, is this her phone?

Diana:

And was it cracked when you got it?

Diana:

Because.

Diana:

And then they start talking about how it's weird that they.

Diana:

ended at:

Diana:

The coroner is saying that she died at midnight, and the.

Diana:

picture was posted online at:

Diana:

weird.

Diana:

And.

Liz:

But it's also not impossible if you schedule your stuff to go out at a certain time.

Diana:

That's true, but the deputies suggest that something supernatural could be at play.

Diana:

Why does he think that?

Diana:

Because two young men stopped by, and they might be able to help.

Diana:

He gave them a copy.

Diana:

They gave him a copy of their book about the thin man.

Liz:

And they're supernaturalists.

Liz:

I think that's gonna be my new job title.

Diana:

Supernaturalist.

Liz:

Supernatural.

Liz:

And you?

Liz:

Technically, I think I am.

Diana:

You might be?

Liz:

Might be.

Diana:

Hi.

Diana:

Good.

Diana:

Uh, so we go back my LinkedIn right now.

Liz:

Quarters of fuck off.

Diana:

All right, so, yeah, Johnny's apple country diner.

Diana:

Trey is way overdressed for the manager of a diner, this type.

Diana:

It's just really odd.

Liz:

He is, but, oh, my God, all the pie.

Liz:

Look at all that pie.

Liz:

There's pie.

Liz:

There's cake stands.

Liz:

And everything just looks better in a cake stand.

Diana:

It does.

Diana:

That's why I have one, just for that reason.

Diana:

It's not always in it, though.

Diana:

Like, the very rare times I make cake.

Diana:

Yes, I do, because I don't make cake often, but if I'm gonna do it, it's going in my motherfucking cake stand.

Diana:

Yeah, it looks prettier if it's not always the most efficient storage container.

Diana:

It looks pretty.

Diana:

It makes me happy.

Diana:

Yeah.

Diana:

So either way, he's, like, looking around, like he hears a noise, a knock on the window, doesn't see anything, looks around, and then it knocks again.

Diana:

And so he pulls up his security cameras like you do, and while he's doing that, he's clicking around all, like they're all around the business.

Diana:

He sees a flash of somebody in the parking lot, then clicks around, and then all of a sudden, the thin man is behind him.

Liz:

Uh oh, man.

Liz:

You dead?

Diana:

Yeah.

Diana:

So, in the morning, Sam and Dean arrive as.

Diana:

As.

Diana:

As feds with.

Diana:

And the deputies there with forensics, everybody else at the diner.

Diana:

And Harry and Ed are there.

Diana:

And Dean's not thrilled about this, but they're being fucking dicks, man.

Diana:

Like, they're, like, grossly filming this poor.

Diana:

Like, I know Trey was a dick, but he's still, like, a person, and he's dead.

Diana:

And they're, like.

Diana:

Like, exploitatively filming his body.

Liz:

Yeah, they're.

Liz:

They never really good at what they did.

Liz:

Right.

Liz:

So, anyhow, they're gross and.

Liz:

But the police want to go medium.

Diana:

Yeah.

Diana:

Because, oh, there was some lady that, you know, that helped, um, some, you know, psychic lady that helped find a missing boy in the couple towns over.

Diana:

So they.

Diana:

He's into it, and so.

Diana:

But in the meantime, he is going to show Sam the security footage while Dean goes and threatens Harry Annette and tells them to leave.

Diana:

But Harry does have a good card to play in that.

Diana:

He can just out Sam and Dean on not being real agents.

Liz:

Yep.

Liz:

Yep.

Liz:

Certainly something that he could do.

Diana:

But he does.

Diana:

Dean does lecture them on playing paparazzi and all this kind of stuff, but.

Diana:

But there, you know, he's.

Diana:

Dean asks if the belief in the thin man created the thin man, which is not a dopa, not a tulpa, but they insist it because there isn't consensus on what it is.

Liz:

Well, the Lord changes from blog to blog, which makes sense.

Liz:

Right in the telling of this.

Liz:

And as somebody who reads urban legends online and tell you, they change from blog to blog, it's very frustrating.

Liz:

And so.

Liz:

But they're just like, we have no idea what we're doing.

Diana:

Yeah.

Diana:

And in the meantime, the deputy and Sam have found some really interesting footage with the doors being locked.

Diana:

And apparently.

Liz:

Oh, no.

Liz:

We did.

Liz:

We did miss the part where the thin man is part man, part three.

Diana:

Oh, God.

Liz:

He emerged in the nightmare of an autistic boy.

Diana:

Then Dean's like, okay, bye.

Liz:

And part of the.

Diana:

So ridiculous.

Diana:

But the doors were locked.

Diana:

And according to Harry, it doesn't matter because thin men can teleport.

Diana:

Um.

Diana:

And, um.

Diana:

And, yeah.

Diana:

So there we go.

Liz:

There we go.

Liz:

So how can he, you know, of course a thin man can teleport, but there is, you know, that is, there is something else we're wondering, like, really, how did this happen?

Liz:

How did they go from one place to the other?

Liz:

And this happened kind of twice now, so.

Liz:

But there's.

Liz:

Now we figure out there is nothing on EMF.

Diana:

Yeah.

Diana:

So later that night, Harry and Ed are driving and they find that.

Diana:

And we notice that someone has posted the diner footage in the comments on their blog.

Diana:

But they don't know who's posting it, apparently.

Diana:

But they think it's good news.

Diana:

They think it's a good thing.

Diana:

And Harry is like, Carrie's gonna put on his fucking ninja attire and go in the woods and find the thin man.

Diana:

Obvi, in the woods because he hangs out by trees.

Diana:

Duh.

Diana:

So he wants Ed to just drive him to the woods.

Diana:

And Ed's kind of like.

Diana:

So there's actually, like two people that are, like, actually dead.

Diana:

Now, maybe it's a good idea that we do let Sam and Dean take this shit over.

Diana:

But Harry is not.

Diana:

He does not want Ed to rain on his rainbow.

Liz:

Yeah.

Liz:

And he also just wants validation in the woods.

Liz:

But anyways, any woods will do, right?

Diana:

So back in the hotel, Sam and Dean are drinking some beers.

Diana:

And Sam is like, when I think teleport, he's just trying to figure out what it could possibly be.

Diana:

I think he said he's thinking of crossroads demons.

Diana:

So.

Diana:

And he's also, you know, confused why this video is online already.

Diana:

And he's also starts pondering what types of videos go viral.

Diana:

Like, this is real dark.

Diana:

And we get actually a sweet moment out of this because Dean starts telling a sentimental story about a video he thinks that would have gone viral if there was footage of Sam at age five in his Batman costume jumping off the shed.

Diana:

But Batman can't fly.

Diana:

So he broke his arm and Dean had to take him to the ER on his handlebars.

Liz:

But Dean was nine and dressed up like Superman.

Liz:

And Superman could fly.

Liz:

And he had done that before, Sam.

Liz:

And he was successful also.

Liz:

Good times.

Liz:

This is not child neglect.

Liz:

Not at all.

Liz:

No.

Diana:

No big deal.

Liz:

No, just John Winchester letting his children jump off of shit and break their arms and there to take them to the hospital.

Diana:

And that's the bigger part of it.

Liz:

Well, I mean, there's just a whole bunch of things that go, John Winchester is a shitty father in the story.

Diana:

Well, sure.

Diana:

Yeah.

Liz:

I think that's every Winchester story ends with and John Winchester was a shitty father.

Liz:

Okay, so they're that.

Liz:

And there is a door knock because.

Diana:

Ed's there because he wants to tell them something and give them this case.

Diana:

So.

Diana:

And we cut to Harry in the woods by himself.

Diana:

And it's nothing.

Diana:

Woods.

Diana:

This is like the edge of a very populated area park.

Liz:

There are a lot of people in here and.

Diana:

But he is talking about how he's alone and giving his dramatic monologue back in the hotel.

Diana:

Ed.

Diana:

It's explaining that where the other ghost facers went, one had a startup, one wanted to do roller derby.

Diana:

And he just really didn't want to, like, hold them back from those things.

Diana:

But he just could not watch Harry become a corporate stooge.

Diana:

So he made up thin man.

Liz:

Oh, what?

Diana:

Completely made it up himself.

Diana:

Harry's still in the woods filming with his terrible monologue.

Diana:

But now thin man's there.

Liz:

So how is thin man there if Ed made him up?

Diana:

Retro?

Diana:

So Ed's like, look, I did a lot of Photoshop.

Diana:

I faked one case and then that just kind of like crowdsourced or legend at that point.

Diana:

Point.

Diana:

And.

Diana:

Yeah.

Diana:

And so we built our following and wrote a book.

Liz:

And it was cool.

Liz:

They liked being influencers.

Liz:

And without the sin men, we're just guys.

Liz:

Just ghost facers, man.

Liz:

Yeah, but Sam has something very important to point out to Ed that he wants Dean to hear.

Diana:

Yeah, you gotta tell him because if you think he's gonna leave.

Diana:

If you tell him.

Diana:

But he's gonna leave anyways because secrets ruin relationships.

Diana:

They weird.

Liz:

Could this be a subtle, subtle hint?

Diana:

Well, this is where we go.

Diana:

Hardcore parallel.

Diana:

Not subtle from this point on in this episode, basically.

Diana:

And Ed's like, well, by the way, Harry's in the woods by himself, but it's not really the woods.

Diana:

It's just some trees behind the grocery store.

Diana:

He'll be fine.

Liz:

And tammy are like, it's killed two people, motherfucker.

Diana:

Right?

Diana:

And so they're like, not fine.

Diana:

We need to go get him.

Diana:

Right?

Diana:

Meowdhead.

Liz:

Yeah.

Liz:

We have.

Liz:

We have met Harry.

Liz:

Harry will not be fine.

Liz:

He is not a survivor.

Diana:

No, not a survivor.

Diana:

So Harry has seen a pile of sticks that he makes up some shit about and walks past them and then turns.

Diana:

Hears a noise, turns around.

Diana:

The sticks have been all kicked around.

Diana:

Oh, no.

Liz:

And then he's got a nice headlamp on, though.

Liz:

I did buy a headlamp last weekend.

Diana:

Did you?

Liz:

I figured I need to have one anyways, so it was like, $5.

Liz:

Energizer makes them.

Liz:

So anyways, so.

Liz:

Oh, fuck.

Liz:

Is a thin man.

Liz:

And he's stabbing Harry.

Diana:

Yeah, he stabs Harry in the stomach.

Diana:

And they get a little scuffle.

Diana:

Harry actually finds back.

Liz:

Good.

Diana:

Good job, Harry.

Diana:

And he's able to run away and not get stabbed again.

Diana:

So Sam and Dean and Ed find him and bandage his stomach.

Diana:

Dean also notices, is able to identify some tire tracks nearby.

Diana:

And Harry's like, well, that can't be related because the thin man doesn't drive.

Liz:

Well, thin man's got a car.

Diana:

Yeah.

Diana:

So Ed's gonna have some splaining to do.

Diana:

But at the motel, it's Ed and Harry in a room.

Diana:

And basically Ed has told Harry everything.

Diana:

Harry is very upset.

Diana:

He says that you crashed the Jenga tower of our lives.

Liz:

He did.

Liz:

And it's just like, I saved you from corporate life.

Liz:

And that's important.

Liz:

It really is.

Liz:

Zachary.

Speaker C:

Zachary.

Diana:

I don't know about that.

Diana:

And so basically, Harry broke up with Dana because Ed convinced them that this is what they needed to do and that with her, it wouldn't have been like, that's not.

Diana:

He wouldn't be able to.

Diana:

Able to keep doing ghost faces like this.

Liz:

Where is.

Liz:

God damn it.

Liz:

Where is that line where the parallel was?

Liz:

There's a parallel line in here, though.

Liz:

We're not in it yet.

Liz:

Okay, let's go through this, and we'll get to it.

Liz:

And I'll come back to this.

Liz:

I'll circle back to that idea.

Liz:

Doesn't have it.

Liz:

Merchant here.

Diana:

And Ed's like, defends himself.

Diana:

He's like, I saved you from this boring job with Dana's dad.

Diana:

And Harry's like, that's really selfish.

Diana:

And I can't even go back because she's moved on.

Diana:

Like, what the fuck?

Diana:

And he's.

Diana:

He's like, well, we could just keep things going for the fans.

Diana:

Like, they.

Diana:

They'll never know.

Diana:

But Harry's like, I would know.

Diana:

And you've made a chump out of me.

Liz:

Yeah.

Liz:

And then Ed offers, like, that they could debunk thin man and just go back to ghost facers.

Liz:

Right?

Liz:

Like, we don't need the theme, man.

Liz:

Which makes us wonder, like, when they split, was it because they were going to thin man, or was it, you know, like, do they say, we don't want to do Ghostbusters, we want to do thin man?

Liz:

Or was that already broken up?

Liz:

And then they got to thin man?

Liz:

I'm kind of.

Liz:

I do want to see the.

Diana:

The breakdown, that progression of the breakdown.

Diana:

I wanted.

Liz:

I think it may be on some of the web series.

Liz:

Who knows?

Liz:

So I just want to know what happened.

Liz:

I'm sure it's a fan fiction somewhere, at least.

Diana:

Well, Harry can't trust it anymore, so it doesn't matter.

Diana:

So Ed's gonna get some coffee and.

Diana:

Yeah.

Diana:

So Sam pops in to say hi to Harry and check on him, and Harry is very upset.

Diana:

He just can't get past it.

Diana:

And that.

Liz:

And Sam punched right in the feels.

Diana:

Yeah.

Diana:

And Sam's like, things.

Diana:

There's things you can forgive and things that you can't.

Diana:

You have to figure out which one it is yourself.

Liz:

Okay.

Liz:

So, yeah, I did.

Liz:

I.

Liz:

Maybe I didn't put it in my nose.

Liz:

Now, I guess this idea is just me rooming around my head until I get it out.

Liz:

So Harry says something in there about how he left his girl to go basically hunting thing to hunting thin man, which I.

Liz:

Then I was, like, running with the parallel of Sam leaving Jessica to go hunt with dean of.

Liz:

I thought I had that in there, but I didn't.

Liz:

But talking about parallels, I wanted to bring that one up.

Diana:

Mm hmm.

Diana:

Yeah.

Diana:

Or just in general, conceptually, Sam leaving the quote unquote normal life, the multiple times he's almost achieved.

Liz:

Yeah.

Diana:

To be run around with Dean, but, yeah.

Diana:

So Dean enters, though, and he's got the deets on the treads.

Diana:

So he.

Diana:

Sam steps out of the hallway because they don't want Harry to hear this, but I thought that was kind of interesting aside.

Diana:

So Sam and Dean are talking.

Diana:

res are on one type of car in:

Diana:

And there's only one in town owned by Roger, who does night security at the mill.

Diana:

So they're going to go find out who the fuck this guy is.

Diana:

So.

Diana:

But Ed was eavesdropping on this whole conversation.

Diana:

So while Sam and Dean take off, Ed goes in to talk again to Harry, and he's like, Harry's like, look, Sam and Dean are just going to clean up this your mess.

Diana:

And it's like, no, I should help clean it up.

Diana:

And we set out to help people.

Diana:

And we got that.

Diana:

You know, we need to go make things right.

Liz:

Let's get back to our roots.

Diana:

Yeah.

Diana:

Yeah.

Diana:

And Harry's on board now.

Diana:

We can make it right.

Diana:

So Sam and Dean go gets this mill.

Diana:

And the deputy is there, and he is.

Diana:

Meets them there.

Diana:

And he's upset about his boss being AWOL and having no warrant.

Diana:

It's very weird.

Diana:

Do you want to know why it's weird?

Diana:

Because he's fucking in on it and tases the fuck out of them.

Diana:

And I jump scared when that happened, but.

Diana:

So the deputy's in on it.

Diana:

He's setting up this crazy, actually pretty elaborate set inside the mill with lights, camera, multiple angles of light, a backdrop.

Diana:

And Sam and Dean handcuffed to chairs.

Liz:

Yeah.

Diana:

And so, um, Dean's like, oh, I guess you're the thin man, but you don't look the part.

Diana:

Because he doesn't.

Liz:

Because it was a team effort.

Diana:

Yes, it was a team effort.

Diana:

Um, and he.

Diana:

But the deputy keeps humming comp town races or Camptown races.

Diana:

And Dean is going to lose his fucking mind.

Diana:

And I don't.

Diana:

Very annoying.

Diana:

So Sam starts asking him questions about teleporting and all that.

Diana:

So enter our thin man, who pulls off his mask, and Dean's like, oh, no, teleporting.

Diana:

Couple of douchebags doing the scream thing.

Liz:

Yeah.

Liz:

And so at this point, at least, the scream thing was already a trope.

Liz:

And so we all knew what that was.

Liz:

And so we find out that they're just a bunch of nerds who've got issues.

Liz:

So why did they kill Casey?

Diana:

Well, they killed Trey was a dick.

Diana:

I agree.

Diana:

Okay.

Diana:

And Casey wouldn't go out with him.

Diana:

And he set her up with someone else.

Diana:

My knife.

Liz:

Oh, gross.

Liz:

No wonder Casey wouldn't go out with you.

Liz:

You're so gross.

Diana:

Also, this guy seems older, and she's like a teenager, so there's other layers there.

Diana:

But anyways, we already know he's gross, so I guess I don't need to rub that in.

Diana:

Um, yeah.

Liz:

And so.

Liz:

And then the sheriff also not.

Liz:

Not.

Liz:

No time off.

Liz:

He dead?

Diana:

No, he's not hunting.

Diana:

He did.

Diana:

So Roger is a psycho and the deputy is a visionary claim for themselves.

Liz:

And then it was like they monologue, which is hard for two people to do, but they monologue at the same time, which I'm not sure if that can.

Liz:

Two people can monologue it ones.

Liz:

But they do.

Diana:

No, but basically, the long and short of it is they're mad because they grew up in a small town and no one saw them.

Liz:

Uh huh.

Diana:

That's it.

Diana:

Anyway, so, Sam's picking his handcuffs while Dean keeps them talking because that's what you have to do.

Diana:

And basically, they were both conspiracy junkies who met in a bar.

Diana:

Oh, that's nice.

Liz:

And this isn't cosplay.

Liz:

It's cause real, which also sounds like a drink, like a terrible martini.

Diana:

And then Dean kind of calls out, though, you're not the thin man.

Diana:

You're just copycat killers.

Diana:

And they didn't really like that anyways.

Diana:

But basically, he's like, it doesn't matter.

Diana:

I'll still be a thin man because y'all were.

Diana:

He's gonna kill both of them.

Diana:

That's about what's about to happen.

Diana:

But right when they're about to start filming and kill Dean, we have a noise.

Diana:

Oh.

Diana:

So, Harry and Ed have entered the building, and immediately, Harry finds the thin man again as they separate.

Diana:

So.

Diana:

And he.

Diana:

And the thin man kicks.

Diana:

Kicks Harry in the dick.

Diana:

Really random.

Liz:

It was a very weird thing.

Liz:

Like, okay, I'm gonna kick you in the nuts, but this is what happens when you don't have a monster fight and you have people that are fighting.

Liz:

And so that's just something that, you know, these aren't monsters.

Liz:

They're people.

Diana:

Yeah.

Liz:

So, the stabbing is happening amongst, you know, human beings.

Diana:

So, well, Ed puts a gun to the.

Diana:

His little gun, the bat.

Diana:

Or he gets the other gun, pushes the back of, um, of the dead man's head, and says, it's Scooby Doo time.

Diana:

Take off the mask, because, hey, now, you're not thin man.

Diana:

You're a mimi.

Liz:

Because he's not how to.

Liz:

How to say the word meme, which is funny.

Diana:

And he's like, I invented you.

Diana:

And then he gets bonked on the head by the deputy.

Diana:

Womp, womp, womp.

Diana:

So, the deputy and Roger are leading Harry and Ed as captives now, and they're basically.

Diana:

They're pretty proud that they can now kill the creator of thin man as kind of like a Frankenstein homage at this point.

Diana:

Point.

Liz:

So meta.

Liz:

So meta.

Diana:

But when they get back to their set, Sam and Dean are gone.

Diana:

So this, like, was so obvious, by the way.

Diana:

Oh, shocking.

Liz:

What they got away while y'all left.

Diana:

Oh, no.

Liz:

I'm so surprised.

Diana:

Yeah.

Diana:

But.

Diana:

So, we get a fight scene.

Diana:

Dean makes Roger stab himself.

Diana:

Edge shoots the deputy.

Diana:

Or stops the deputy from shooting Sam.

Diana:

And then Harry shoots the deputy.

Diana:

Yeah.

Liz:

So real human beings with real body.

Liz:

Real body problems.

Liz:

Right.

Liz:

And in order to solve this, we get a high trunk.

Liz:

Yeah.

Liz:

Trunk.

Liz:

But Dean stage the.

Liz:

The murders.

Diana:

But, yeah, it's fascinating.

Diana:

So he, like, apparently set up, like, to make it look like the.

Diana:

It was a.

Diana:

Two psychos that killed each other is what they say.

Diana:

So I guess they were able to set up all the footage and everything to look like that.

Diana:

And I guess they would have been able to effectively pin the other murders on the right people, too, when they did them.

Diana:

Yeah, I guess not pin them then.

Liz:

Yeah.

Diana:

So by the evidence, this is:

Liz:

At this point, we've got some DNA.

Liz:

Like, we can at least have forensics.

Liz:

We do have, like, theoretically someone could do some actual forensics and pull out some DNA and at least, like, it'll be solved in ten years, so.

Liz:

But they can at least I prove some of them, you know?

Diana:

And this is where Sam does point out what you've been saying.

Diana:

These are people that are now dead.

Liz:

Yeah.

Liz:

Sam's finally iked out over this.

Diana:

We've got four dead human beings now, not monsters.

Liz:

Yeah, it's dark.

Liz:

It's dark.

Diana:

Yeah.

Diana:

So Harry and Ed are standing outside, and he's, you know, basically, Harry's like, hey, we're never gonna be cool.

Liz:

You.

Liz:

This is.

Liz:

We cannot go back from this.

Liz:

People fucking died because.

Liz:

Yeah, I don't think I would.

Liz:

This is too psychotic.

Liz:

I don't think I could forgive this.

Liz:

This.

Liz:

Live a friendship.

Diana:

And Ed's like, oh, just go to ghost face.

Diana:

Or is Harry's like, no, we.

Diana:

I just killed a guy.

Diana:

No, this isn't like, this is over.

Diana:

So.

Diana:

And just still feels like he did this for Harry.

Diana:

But really as, like, what we've kind of.

Diana:

We didn't.

Diana:

We didn't go in depth on it in our conversation.

Diana:

But what they're talking about is same Sam Dean bullshit is that Ed did it because he didn't want to not have Harry with him.

Diana:

So anyways.

Diana:

But Harry decided that he can't forgive Eddie.

Liz:

He can't.

Liz:

He took away his autonomy, and that's no way.

Liz:

No.

Diana:

So.

Diana:

So Harry asked Sam and Dean for a ride until they leave.

Liz:

When Ed is alone with some tears.

Diana:

In his eyes in the van, and while they're driving, Dean asks Harry if he's okay.

Diana:

And Harry kind of gives a fuck.

Liz:

No, I just shot a dude, man.

Liz:

Like, what the fuck, man?

Diana:

Shot a dude and said bye to my best friend, who lied.

Liz:

I just found out.

Liz:

My best friend just lied to me about, like, my past, like, six months have all been a fucking lie that was orchestrated by my psychotic best friend to get me to dump my girlfriend.

Diana:

And go and give up my future career.

Liz:

He didn't need that career.

Diana:

But you don't know that.

Diana:

He might have liked it.

Liz:

It's not his.

Liz:

His love.

Liz:

He needs to be a ghost facer.

Liz:

That is.

Liz:

That is Harry's love.

Liz:

We know it.

Liz:

We can see it.

Liz:

He does not need to be a corporate stooge.

Liz:

But, yeah, I'm.

Diana:

Anyhow, either way.

Diana:

Yeah.

Diana:

Not okay.

Diana:

He's not okay.

Diana:

There's no way at all.

Diana:

Yeah.

Liz:

And probably won't be okay for a long time.

Diana:

Probably not.

Liz:

He may develop a drinking problem.

Diana:

I mean, like, you do.

Diana:

Like you do.

Liz:

Yeah.

Liz:

But, so we definitely are getting those, some parallel talks about their relationship and Sam and Dean's relationship.

Diana:

Yes.

Diana:

And I feel like that was really the intent of the episode, but that's.

Diana:

And, yes, we'll get to that in a minute.

Liz:

Yeah, but, yeah, and then, uh, yeah, that's how it kind of ends.

Diana:

And I've just got a couple of cast notes for us.

Liz:

All right.

Speaker C:

Casting couch.

Liz:

It's the casting couch.

Speaker C:

Were they on that show that time with that guy?

Diana:

So our deputy, Tom Norwood, was played by Nicholas Carella.

Diana:

He's been in episodes of Degrassi, the next Generation, Sykes, Smallville v.

Diana:

Fringe, once upon a time, wayward Pines, Bates Motel, I zombie and the detectives.

Diana:

And he was the poltergeist man in the movie Tooth Fairy.

Diana:

Roger Slashenheid.

Diana:

The thin man was played by Giovanni Machabob.

Diana:

He's not been in very much, but I just wanted to include him as a main character.

Diana:

Betty Miles was played by Maria Marlowe.

Diana:

So mom misses Miles.

Diana:

She's been in episodes of True Calling, smallville, Fringe, once upon a Time, Arrow, a couple episodes of Riverdale, and then she was mother Hubbard in the Chilling Adventures of Sabrina, which is a reoccurring role.

Liz:

That was really good one, too.

Diana:

And then Trey was played by Benjamin Wilkinson.

Diana:

This is our restaurant manager, who is a dick.

Diana:

He was an episodes of V Fringe, Arrow, Once upon a Time in Wonderland, and Once upon a time, I zombie, Fargo, Chesapeake Shores, Van Helsing, x Files, magicians, travelers, Riverdale, and yellowjackets.

Diana:

He also had a small role in Deadpool and has done a bunch of Hallmark Mark.

Liz:

Cool, cool.

Diana:

So, yeah, so, yeah, I.

Diana:

Those facers are always fun.

Diana:

B.

Diana:

I hate fucking shit and mirrors and photos.

Diana:

C.

Diana:

This episode was clearly just a driver to further expound on the Sam and Dean relationship drama.

Liz:

Yeah, I know the show is about them.

Liz:

I know as it shows about their relationship.

Liz:

But sometimes I just want the show to be about monsters.

Diana:

Well, then I don't like monsters or people people monsters.

Diana:

I want, like, real monsters.

Liz:

Yeah, it always sucks when it's a people monster.

Liz:

I don't mean.

Diana:

I don't need a reminder that people are gross and mean.

Liz:

I watch.

Liz:

I watched your crime for that, you know?

Liz:

I don't need that in my supernatural.

Diana:

I don't even watch that.

Diana:

I watch the news a lot, though, so I guess that's close enough.

Liz:

No, they're very different.

Liz:

They're very different ways of anyhow.

Liz:

All right, but beyond that.

Liz:

So, I mean, I'm sad that Harry and Ed broke up and couldn't work their shit out.

Liz:

I mean, Ed was the psycho, and he has to pay the price for that.

Liz:

But I'm sorry that their.

Liz:

Their relationship has ended.

Liz:

They were a good pair.

Diana:

Agreed.

Liz:

And I don't know, can I predict if Sam and Dean are gonna get over their bullshit?

Diana:

Well, I know there's more seasons, so I'm sure they probably.

Liz:

I mean, we still don't know they're gonna get over.

Diana:

I kind of get why Sam's still Madden.

Liz:

Sam should be mad.

Liz:

Non consensual angel.

Liz:

It's not okay.

Diana:

It left his grace inside him.

Liz:

Ew.

Liz:

Alright, on that note, cheers, jerk.

Diana:

Cheers, bitch.

Diana:

Devil's Trap podcast is a don't get a production.

Diana:

Meow.

Speaker C:

Doublestrap podcast is part of the Ship IT studio podcast network.

Speaker C:

Thanks for listening to this week's episode, episode of Devils Trap podcast.

Speaker C:

You can follow us on Instagram at deviltrappodcast, Twitter at devilstrapppod, or you can email us@devilstrapevelstrappodcast.com.

Speaker C:

don't forget to subscribe, leave reviews, and share with all your friends.

Speaker C:

We're at all your favorite podcast outlets and@devilstrapppodcast.com.

Speaker C:

i'm babe.

Speaker C:

Thanks for tuning in, and we'll see you next time.

Diana:

Going up to the spirit in the sky it's where I'm gonna go when I die when I die you may lay me.

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