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Decoding New Innovations in the Old Economy with Dr. Jeannette zu Fürstenberg
Episode 2329th June 2021 • Decoding Digital • AppDirect
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Industries that resist embracing digital transformation face potential extinction. But change doesn’t come easy to everyone. In this episode, Dr. Jeannette zu Fürstenberg reveals how her venture capitalist fund connects existing economy leaders with emerging digital disruptors to future-proof their processes. She also explains why an entrepreneurial mindset is key to overcoming resistance to change.

Press play to hear Jeannette’s thoughts on…

The Conflict Between Old and New

“If you put two groups together, one has everything to lose. Why? Because [established companies] are at the height of their success and every potential change or disruption could mean a risk to the company. And if you look at startups, it's a very different dynamic, right? They have everything to win and everything to gain.”

Investing Early

“That's what you do as a seed stage investor, you have to tune into the vision and always assume you're the stupidest person in the room. And then these people really have something very, very unique to what they're doing. And obviously you are mindful of asking all the right questions, but typically the best entrepreneurs have thought about them 10 times over before you even ask them.”

The Emerging Global Workforce

“What's so exciting about technology is that code is really a lingua franca. It's a way to tie talent together in a global way. Global talent is becoming a reality. It's great to see teams that interact from all over the world across different time zones, across different continents, different cultural backgrounds, but all unified by a common mission and a common vision.”

Transcripts

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There's always this fear within

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organizations of not hiring IBM,

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of not going with the blue chip

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that is already available and

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existent and betting on a player

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that may not be around a couple

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of months or years from now.

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You need that backing and that

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halo from the leadership of the

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C-level to say, "You know what?

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We want you to do that because

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that's what change will look

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like for us. That's what's going

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to make us competitive five

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years from now."

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That's Jeannette von Fürstenberg,

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the founding partner of La

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Famiglia, a unique venture

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capital fund based in Berlin.

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Unlike traditional VCs, La

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Famiglia looks to connect old

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economy giants in Europe with

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young digital disruptors. So far,

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the fund has raised more than €

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100 million and invested in

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almost 50 companies, 3 of which

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are unicorns. Before La

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Famiglia, Jeannette worked for

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Ernst & Young, Synthesis and AXA.

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She also founded AMAZE, a

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shopping app for smartphones

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geared toward fashion bloggers.

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Not only is Jeannette active in

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the startup ecosystem, she also

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has a deep understanding of the

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historical trends that drive

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business and holds a PhD in

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philosophy and entrepreneurship.

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In today's episode, we'll hear

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how Jeanette and her team at La

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Famiglia are transforming the

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way traditional companies and

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startups build networks and work

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together to create radical

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change. This is Daniel Saks, co-

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CEO of AppDirect, and it's time

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to decode new innovation in the

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old economy. Welcome to "

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Decoding Digital," a podcast for

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innovators looking to thrive in

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the digital economy. I'm your

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host, Daniel Saks, and I'll sit

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down with other founders, CEOs

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and changemakers to decode the

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trends that are transforming the

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way we work. Let's decode.

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Jeannette, I'm so honored to

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have you on Decoding Digital.

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Welcome.

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Thank you, Dan. I'm honored to

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join you today.

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We first got to know each other

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as you graciously hosted the Y

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NOW conference in Germany

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connecting multi-generational

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industrial leaders to tech

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startups. Many of those startups

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are disrupting or striving to

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disrupt the incumbents, so it's

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pretty interesting that you

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brought these two groups

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together. Can you share your

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vision for why bringing these

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groups together would be

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beneficial?

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Yeah, I think there's actually a

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lot that they have in common.

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It's entrepreneurs that are very

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much in the process of running

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and growing their own companies.

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What's interesting about that is

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if you put entrepreneurs face-to-

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face, they may have grown in a

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different generation, but they

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always have the best interest of

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the company at heart. If you

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put them together in an intimate

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environment, where all the

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management levels below that

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fade away and it's all about

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ideas, and it's all about

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progress, and it's all about

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change that everybody opens up.

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That's how you bring them closer

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together and that's very, very

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needed driver to make digital

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transformation in reality here

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in Europe.

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It's very powerful and I was so

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grateful to be there and some of

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the relationships I've built end

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up being business contacts,

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friends, and it's an incredible

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network. Many times in

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technology, we interface only

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online especially in this era,

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but the importance of deep

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relationship is important. Can

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you tell me when you're advising

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your companies and the people

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you interact with across Europe,

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how did they build this network

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and how did they get to know

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each other?

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It's an interesting question. A

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part of the reason why Renee and

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I got together and said we need

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to do something about the

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ecosystem there is that they

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seem to be very separate for a

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long time. There was not many

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interfaces where they would

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actually meet. Question is

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always, if you put two groups

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together, one has everything to

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lose, because they're at the

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height of their success and

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every potential change or

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disruption could mean a risk to

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the company. If you look at

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startups, it's a very different

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dynamic. They have everything to

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win and everything to gain.

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That's where in those different

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speeds and those different modes

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of emotion you can create

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friction. It's very important

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that you have a trusted

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relationship environment, where

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you can interact and where

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everybody opens up to actually

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embracing change and embracing

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potentially new or even

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disruptive ideas. I think the

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idea was very much born from the

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way that we host friends as a

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family, where it's about

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intimacy, it's about trust, it's

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about also having fun together,

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it's about sharing memories.

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That's the base as to how, we're

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now came into being and also,

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the way we try to now have our

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portfolio companies be connected

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to potential customers, connect

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to potential partners. It's a

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very necessary aspect of our

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European ecosystem to bring

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these two groups into a closer,

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codependency or core

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relationship, simply because I

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think Europe will only survive

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if we manage to shift the

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existing value creation that is

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very much existent in our many,

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many industry fields, from

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process industry, to

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manufacturing, to automotive,

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etc. These are very, very

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native and rich industries where

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a lot of the knowledge is locked

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up in processes and industry-

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specific knowledge that is now

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being transitioned and being

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formed into digital products.

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The more those two generations

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of entrepreneurs intersect and

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the more they cooperate, the

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stronger the outcome will be for

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Europe eventually.

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Certainly. We have a fundamental

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belief that digital

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transformation is not just about

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technology, it's about the

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people. Oftentimes, it comes to

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those human relationships. The

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example that you gave, you

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mentioned René. For those

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listeners, we had René Obermann

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on the podcast earlier in the

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season. He was formerly the CEO

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of Deutsche Telekom and is now a

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partner of Warburg Pincus and

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chairman of Airbus. René and

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Jeannette hosted Y NOW, which

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was a conference bringing

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together these different leaders.

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It's such an example of how

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people are able to open up. René

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and I got to know each other

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when we were innovating at

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Deutsche Telekom and enabling

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them to digitally transform to

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offer cloud services. Those

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relationships are what drives a

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proliferation of technology.

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That's what Jeannette did with

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La Famiglia. Can you tell us a

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little bit more about how you

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became a venture capitalist and

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your vision behind it?

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Yeah, super happy to. I was

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always driven and motivated by

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entrepreneurial vision as a

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major force of change, in a way.

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What's interesting, especially

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about seed-stage companies, is

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that they're almost like a

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seismographic anticipation for

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societal change and for what

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will manifest into an economic

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reality three to five years from

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now. By being very close to

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that pulsing element of what the

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future will become, you're

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automatically in a position

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where you have some degree of

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influence. I don't want to

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overplay it, but you take at

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least ownership of what this

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future could look like. That's

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from a very macro philosophical

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perspective. That's what would

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drives me into the sector. Next

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to working alongside very

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talented entrepreneurs, they

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have incredible energy and

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incredible vision that deserves

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so much respect and deserves all

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the support they can get. Now,

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that brings me to the support

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angle. When we first started La

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Famiglia, now almost five years

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ago, the idea was very much to

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see where we could build bridges.

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Especially for B2B founders, we

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could enable them to speak to

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partners in the industry to test

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their product, to run initial

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PoCs, get customer feedback and

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validation on the products that

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we're building. Initially, what

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you see within the start-up

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ecosystem, you typically have a

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strong founding team and

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potentially great technology.

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You have what seems like a great

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and big market, but you're

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always missing investment in

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seed stage. You're always

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missing these initial revenue

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validation points that larger

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investors are then looking for.

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The earlier you can bring those

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to the table, the faster these

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companies typically get to early

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product market fit and from

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there to scale. Doing that, by

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helping them build these bridges

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early on, is a better use of the

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capital invested. Time is money.

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Also, for these founders, the

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earlier they can actually get

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their product into motion, the

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more chances they stand. Also,

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from an international

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perspective, to become the

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winner in there, the finance

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sector. That's why La Famiglia

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was created. It's very much the

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essence of our platform, is to

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connect established industry and

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the startup ecosystem, making

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sure we use the tail-end to

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prevent for both sides to make

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bend the change, for what's

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possible in Europe.

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I've been proud to watch La

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Famiglia grow over the years.

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You've built up an incredible

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portfolio. Can you share some of

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the companies that you have in

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your portfolio?

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Yes, sure. I'm happy to. One of

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the more notable ones would be a

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company called Personio, which

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is an HR platform for SMBs,

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similar to Workday in the US,

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but for smaller and medium-sized

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businesses. That is doing

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incredibly well. Another one

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would be Forto, which is a

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freight forwarding company

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essentially digitizing logistic

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workflows, or the freight

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forwarding services. Mainly, now,

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between Europe and Asia, but

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potentially also, going global

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as a next step. We've pre-seeded

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them. Especially for this

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company, it was so important to

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get connections and warm leads

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as they scaled from the initial

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Amazon power seller to a smaller-

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sized business, to medium-sized

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businesses, to larger-scale

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businesses. It's important you

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get the volume right. You

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initially needed the trust of

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entrepreneurs who went to their

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freight forwarding department

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and said, "You know what? We may

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not give them 100 percent of our

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rate capacity, but we can give

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them 10 percent." I'm just

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curious to see what it will do

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to the transparency in my supply

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chain, what it will do to my

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freight cost, and what it will

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do to the overall transparency

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and views we get from a shipper

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perspective." Hadn't we had the

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buy-in of these founders

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initially, that made sure they

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elbowed this into their

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organization and work that

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muscle, it probably would have

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been a lot harder for these guys

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to get to initial customers.

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There's always this fear within

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organizations of not hiring IBM,

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of not going with the blue chip

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that is already available and

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existent, and betting on a

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player that may not be around a

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couple of months or years from

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now. You need that backing and

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that payload from the leadership

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of C-level to actually say, "We

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actually want you to do that.

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That's what change will look

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like for us. That's what's going

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to make us competitive five

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years from now." That was a win-

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win. It was a win for the

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companies that embraced Forto

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early. It's a win certainly for

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Forto as well, because they've

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now become a big player here in

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Europe and continue to scale at

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a massive speed. That would be

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another example. I could keep

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going and going. There's so many.

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These are two great examples to

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start with.

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Forto is such an incredible

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example. We've noticed, when

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we're trying to drive digital

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transformation within an

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enterprise, is that it takes a

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certain set of characteristics

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of an individual in order to

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drive that transformation. We

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call those people digital heroes.

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Those digital heroes can exist

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at any part of the organization.

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In many cases, they can be the

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CEOs or the owners. In other

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cases, it could be people on the

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ground that are going to

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champion this innovation. To

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have a culture of innovation at

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a large enterprise, it does

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require some level of risk-

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taking and alignment. 10 years

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ago, when we were working with

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businesses in Europe, there were

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very few companies that had the

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commitment of both the executive

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leadership as well as the

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innovators on the ground to take

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that risk to work with a startup.

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What I found is that there's

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definitely been an acceleration

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in innovators in Europe

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recognizing that they need to

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disrupt themselves. Is that a

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trend that you've seen? How

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often do your companies still

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face disruption or challenge?

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It's interesting to hear your

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perspective. You are obviously

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very established. You've been

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around for many years now.

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Looking at the learning curve

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that I had when we first started

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out five years ago, a lot of B2B

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companies we went to and we

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confronted with a problem, they

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were like, "Well, that is all

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B2C phenomenon. Like Uber and

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everything you're telling me

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about what's happening and

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disruption on the consumer side,

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has nothing to do with my

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business, right? We're going B2B."

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At the time, it was very hard

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for them to embrace the idea of

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how software is eating the world.

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Now, five years forward. what

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we're seeing is that is no

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longer even a question. It's not

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even a question of whether

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software is eating the world. It

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has eaten the world. Everything

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is being defined by technology

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these days. It's no longer a

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single vertical, but actually

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completely horizontal and going

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a lot across all layers of value

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creation. That's where some

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people, and that goes to your

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point then around innovation

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mindset and culture, if you're

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open-minded. Most entrepreneurs

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remain curious until they're

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very, very old. They drive that

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curiosity into the DNA of their

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company. That's what makes them

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remain competitive. We have a

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couple of people we work with

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where the founding entrepreneur

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is still very much up and

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running. He's maybe above 70,

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but they're still embracing

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change. They want to learn

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about what's going on. They may

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not understand the full depth of

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it, but they want to make sure

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that part of the people get it.

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To your point about the digital

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hero, that's one group.

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Certainly, you have the other

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camp that sees that as well, but

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is in denial with regards to

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what it will mean for their

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business. It's still not

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sensible. It's a little bit like

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popcorn. You put it into the

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microwave and for 5 minutes,

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nothing happens. All of a sudden,

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everything explodes. That whole

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disruptive element, it's very

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hard for them to sense because

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they've come from a motion.

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That's an interesting historical

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fact. They've always grown by

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capturing markets. The whole

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innovations always geared to

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conquering something new. They

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were never confronted with a

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disruptive innovation force they

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just had to react to all of a

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sudden, that just put the whole

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organization under pressure. For

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them, it's much harder to get

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to that level of change.

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Another aspect of the mindset

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that I've observed in many cases

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is that if you look at post-war

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Europe, a lot of the companies

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that we see now being really,

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really successful were formed

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then. They were formed in a very

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decentralized fashion.

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Especially in Germany, we have

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these hidden in the rock market

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champions that sprouted in the

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middle of the Black Forest. You

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would find a world market leader,

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the brand you know, but you

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would never find your way into

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that little village, which is

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great, right? It certainly has

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nurtured our so-called

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Miittelstand that is so globally

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well-perceived. What also is

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interesting about these types of

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companies is that they have very

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much grown from an idea of

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patent-driven innovation. Like I

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come up with an idea of anybody

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wants my new screw. Because the

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screw becomes a huge success, I

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patent it for 20 years. I milk

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the cow. I develop the next

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screw. I damn well make sure

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that I have the walls up. Nobody

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sees the drawings while I think

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about my third screw. I

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definitely don't want to share

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any insights about that because

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that's where my bread and butter

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will be born. For these people

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to transition in their mindset

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into an open innovation

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ecosystem, it's terribly hard.

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It's a technique so deeply baked

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into their DNA that when you

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tell them about a platform, even

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if they get the other platform,

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they go, "We need to build our

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platform." No. You're not

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building your platform because

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it's very hard for you to build

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your own platform. Try to

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understand what part of your

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value creation do you actually

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think you can retain five years

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from now and what part will just

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go away. What is it may be

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about what you're doing right

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now that there's so much core

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understanding and knowledge in

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the process that could

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potentially transfer into some

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degree of digital service,

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digital revenue? Where is it

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that you may want to partner

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with a startup or invest into a

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platform and to then partner

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with my next? This whole mindset

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and ecosystem of innovation is

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something that is utterly

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foreign to them. That needs to

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change.

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A lot of enterprises that are

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cash flow rich and used to

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generating cash flow have a hard

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time taking bets and investing

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in partnering with third-party

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platforms that may not see a

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return in the next year or two.

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Do you see that across the

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industrial companies? Is that a

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barrier to their innovation?

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Yeah. That's definitely a part

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of it. Even though that is even

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stronger within traditional

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investors, what's interesting is

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that the US ecosystem has

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produced so many winners already

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that there's a very broad base

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of investors that have seen

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success of the asset class over

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and over again. They just are

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very eager to participate and

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are very much attuned to the

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of the future

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discounted cash flow. In Europe,

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it's very much not the case.

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Everybody that did an industrial

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company, or private investor, or

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an institutional, they're always

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used to the notion of cash-flow-

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based investing. They will buy

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the running company. They will

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potentially buy a competitor,

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but then they want to have a

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multiple that is somewhat in a

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size or range that they feel

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comfortable with. I've heard

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this over and over again, "Oh,

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my God. Valuation is crazy." Why

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are you trading at a 10x

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multiple to revenue? That's

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insane. People have said that

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over and over again. This grand

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slam nature of large tech

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platforms and how they have

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evolved over time and how they

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keep getting bigger once they

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hit scale and escape velocity is

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something that is very foreign

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to our understanding. We haven't

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seen that many in front of our

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doors yet. Think, you look to

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the US, and you feel like this

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is a very different kind of

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unicorn landscape if we even

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want to call it that. What we

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have here is substantial

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production companies that know

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how our products are shaped and

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done. For them, this whole

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digital nature of products and

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the way they work is nothing

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that they've seen manifested yet

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in success stories to the same

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degree.

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It's interesting. I've observed

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many more companies in Europe

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becoming global leaders, very

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much so, because of your local

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investments in cultivating of an

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ecosystem. Is that something

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that you see on the ground as

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well as more efforts to start

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global companies from Germany?

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Yeah, if you look at the

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founders we're backing, a lot of

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them are...Actually, I think

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maybe one-third are guys that

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maybe they're underground in

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Germany or Europe, but then they

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all went to the US. They were

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semi-US educated, went to

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Stanford, and then work one of

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the Big Five's, if that's where

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they smell the air of digital

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products and scale. They've all

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come back to Germany or Europe

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to double down on the

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opportunity that we have here.

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For us, the opportunity is very

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much based in the fact that we

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have a very strong university

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landscape. We have an incredibly

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strong educational ecosystem

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across Europe. It's not a

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centralized as in other

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countries. Especially if you

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looked in Germany, we have at

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least 15 technical universities

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that have been or absolutely

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global significance in the

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research that they do. That is

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one fundamental building block.

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The second fundamental building

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block that these founders relate

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to is the fact that you have

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these companies that we

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mentioned before and all of them

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are either nurturing talent

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within them through the

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apprenticeship programs that

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they have. Also, then go again

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in these universities and

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partner with them and they have

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co-development programs. That

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just creates a very specific

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process understanding and

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process knowledge that is needed

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in order to build a digital

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product in the space. I don't

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think you would have the same

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degree of understanding or the

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same degree of ability to

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potentially disrupt like the

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chemical industry or automotive

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manufacturing, because it's so

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complex that you really have to

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understand what you're doing.

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Technology is not so much a

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differentiator. The

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differentiator then becomes that

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process know-how. Then you build

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it on top of TensorFlow maybe,

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or you have toolsets and

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infrastructure, but that is more

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of just the enabler or the

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building block. The core

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differentiator of what will make

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them successful and what will

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give them defensibility is that

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degree of understanding and

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being able to translate that

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into the nature of digital

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products. I think that's what

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we've seen mainly, is that being

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the fundamental driver for our

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ecosystem build-up here.

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Very powerful. On your website,

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it says, "We believe contrarian

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investments outperform

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conformist investments." Why do

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you believe that's the case?

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I believe that if you look

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at a lot of the

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founders, if you look at great

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leaders in general, they have an

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ability to see 10

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or 15 years into the future.

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They have a fundamental...I

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would almost call it a reality

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distortion field around what the

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future should look like. Then

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where they become strong leaders

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is the ability to break that

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complexity down into something

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that we can grasp today that we

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think we can somewhat follow

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them, not only us as investors

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but also the team and potential

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customers. What's interesting

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is that if you listen to some of

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these ideas now, they seem

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almost surreal, and I think lots

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of people maybe listened to them.

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It's a little bit like an art

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painting, right? If you look at

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a Picasso drawing, some people

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will say, "Oh, my God. This

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doesn't look like a bird or like

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a woman." But then you could

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also look at it and say, "Well,

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there's actually just a new

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language there. There's

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something that's being created

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here that is utterly unique, and

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that hasn't been done before."

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That's what you do as a seed-

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stage investor. You have to tune

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into the vision and always

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assume there is the stupidest

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person in the room. Then these

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people have something very, very

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unique to what they're doing.

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Obviously, you're mindful of

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asking all the right questions,

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but typically, the best

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entrepreneurs have thought about

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them 10 times over before you

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even ask them. That's what I

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find incredibly unique and

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powerful, and that's where I

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think often these ideas seem

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contrary in the beginning,

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because in the beginning, not a

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lot of people will be willing or

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able to follow them. That's

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where the stage is particularly

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exciting, particularly

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interesting.

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I love your art analogy. I know

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you did your dissertation on art

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and entrepreneurship in the

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Renaissance. Are there any

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timeless lessons that were just

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as true then as they are today?

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There's so many, to be honest. I

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really think we're living almost

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through a new Renaissance now.

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One thing that I thought was

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incredibly interesting is the

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notion of the word disegno which

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is a term that was originally

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used by artists to describe

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their just grab a drawing. They

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would call it the disegno. What

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they also meant by it is the

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transformative process that you

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actually do whilst taking an

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idea that is very ephemeral at

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the beginning. Then, you

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transform that into something

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that others can see, or can feel,

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or can touch. I then thought

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that is actually in essence what

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an entrepreneur does. When in

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the beginning, it all feels

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ephemeral. It all feels like

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it's building blocks and little

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facets of something that could

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become a reality. That's one

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term that I've always loved and

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I've taken to heart since my

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dissertation. Going a little

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bit more concrete into the

Speaker:

Renaissance, what was

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interesting or what spurred this

Speaker:

whole ecosystem at that time was

Speaker:

very much the fact that they

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lowered the barriers to entry

Speaker:

for different crafts. Before,

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if you were born into a wooden

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craftsman family, then you would

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only do wooden craftsmanship.

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You weren't allowed to paint.

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You weren't allowed to weave or

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do other crafts. In that sense,

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Leonardo da Vinci's the best

Speaker:

example of what happened when

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you unleashed someone and

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allowed them to take a different

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skill set and give them a

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profession that they have

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learned in one field and apply

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that idea to other areas that

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intersect with other areas.

Speaker:

Therefore, you had this very

Speaker:

strong boost of cross-

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pollination. That spurred trade.

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That made them a lot more

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innovative in selling and buying

Speaker:

goods. From that initial wealth

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that was generated, they had the

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urge to say, "Hey. Now, we are

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also rich. How do we make sure

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we can show that in an

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appropriate manner?" Art was in

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the beginning, definitely, the

Speaker:

initial instinct was one like, "

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We just hire the best artists."

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By being wealthy and by then

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inviting these global-wheeled

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artists into Florence and Sienna

Speaker:

at that time, you all of a

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sudden have this incredible

Speaker:

density of talent that was

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rapidly innovating. If you look

Speaker:

at the whole way art history in

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the time evolved, it made a huge,

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giant leap step forward. By

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having this increasingly dense

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competition of artists, you also

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had a higher intersection or a

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lot more meetings that took

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place between patrons and

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artists. At that time, the

Speaker:

artist was not so much

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considered the genius yet. He

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was more the craftsman that was

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hired by the patron. Patron, in

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that sense, was often the

Speaker:

entrepreneur. The Medici then

Speaker:

are a great example of how they

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almost became, there's a term in

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German, we say congenial. I

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don't know how that would

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translate into English. It's

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almost this way of...there are

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many letters between Cosimo de'

Speaker:

Medici and Donatello, for

Speaker:

example, where they talk about

Speaker:

the nature of the painting, what

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they want it to be, and what

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they want it to look like or a

Speaker:

given famous door, that type of

Speaker:

relationship that unfolded there.

Speaker:

There are many letters stating

Speaker:

of how they spend the whole

Speaker:

dinners together and how the

Speaker:

dinners were always populated by

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people that were not purely

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bankers or not purely artists.

Speaker:

It was this wild mix of

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scientists, craftsmen, artists,

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and entrepreneurs. If you then

Speaker:

look what that did to the way

Speaker:

the Medici operated as

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entrepreneurs, it was

Speaker:

interesting. They didn't invent

Speaker:

something new. The bill of

Speaker:

exchange existed already 150

Speaker:

years ago before they actually

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said, "Hey, we were not allowed

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to officially give out credit,

Speaker:

but that material, that bill of

Speaker:

exchange would allow us to give

Speaker:

out credit without this being

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considered a sin." Which is why

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before that everybody would turn

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to just Jewish community for

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credit, which was very much

Speaker:

forbidden. All of a sudden, they

Speaker:

took this invention. They saw

Speaker:

how an existing product could

Speaker:

basically be used as a means and

Speaker:

as a lever to accelerate their

Speaker:

own business. That was the key

Speaker:

element that boosted their

Speaker:

entire banking system and

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banking infrastructure across

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Europe. Taking that analogy,

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it's interesting to see how

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artists operate in exactly the

Speaker:

same way. Say a painting, while

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it's always paint and canvas or

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whatever, you think the

Speaker:

materials don't necessarily

Speaker:

change so much. It's more about

Speaker:

what is it that they actually

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see different. They have a

Speaker:

different perspective, a

Speaker:

different passage with which

Speaker:

they view the world. That's what

Speaker:

made the Renaissance. That is

Speaker:

also essentially what defines

Speaker:

our tech ecosystem now. It's all

Speaker:

code, if you like. It's the way

Speaker:

they used that as a means to

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express something new and to

Speaker:

redefine the way we live, the

Speaker:

way we work, the way we interact

Speaker:

as humans. I find that

Speaker:

fascinating.

Speaker:

It's so fascinating. In Silicon

Speaker:

Valley, we saw people coming

Speaker:

together in an interdisciplinary

Speaker:

way. There's a technology and

Speaker:

entrepreneurial renaissance. Now,

Speaker:

I definitely feel it's much more

Speaker:

global. Do you believe that the

Speaker:

location still matters? Do you

Speaker:

believe we're seeing a global

Speaker:

renaissance in terms of

Speaker:

innovation, creativity, and

Speaker:

technology?

Speaker:

I actually think it's a

Speaker:

completely global renaissance.

Speaker:

That's what's so exciting about

Speaker:

technology. That is somewhat

Speaker:

like code is lingua franca. It's

Speaker:

a way to tie talent together

Speaker:

in a global fashion, in a global

Speaker:

way. That's one of our thesis,

Speaker:

is also having fun. We've been

Speaker:

investing into future of work as

Speaker:

we call it already since five

Speaker:

years. Looking at a company

Speaker:

like deal within our portfolio

Speaker:

that promotes or allows you to

Speaker:

hire employees all over the

Speaker:

world, tie them into your

Speaker:

payroll infrastructure, and just

Speaker:

making sure you're compliant

Speaker:

with local rules, etc., which

Speaker:

has always been an impediment

Speaker:

with this type of global scale.

Speaker:

It's the rapid growth of that

Speaker:

company is basically just an

Speaker:

index of how fast this global

Speaker:

workforce and this global talent

Speaker:

is becoming a reality. I find

Speaker:

that actually really beautiful.

Speaker:

It's a great way to see teams

Speaker:

that interact from all over the

Speaker:

world, from India, to Israel, to

Speaker:

America and across different

Speaker:

time zones, across different

Speaker:

continents with different

Speaker:

cultural backgrounds. They're

Speaker:

all unified by a common mission

Speaker:

and a common vision, which is

Speaker:

what is so great about strong

Speaker:

founders, they can do that. They

Speaker:

can rally these very different

Speaker:

people behind them and give them

Speaker:

the North Star to which they're

Speaker:

bringing in the entire

Speaker:

capabilities. It's a beautiful

Speaker:

evolution to see.

Speaker:

Jeannette, you're such a

Speaker:

pleasure, chatting with you on

Speaker:

so many topics. I could see your

Speaker:

passion for connecting people,

Speaker:

for entrepreneurship, and for

Speaker:

creativity all coming through.

Speaker:

Our viewers are going to enjoy

Speaker:

this. Thank you again for

Speaker:

joining.

Speaker:

Thank you so much, Dan. It was

Speaker:

good to see you.

Speaker:

Good to see you, too.

Speaker:

On the next episode of Decoding

Speaker:

Digital...

Speaker:

When you go deep on a vertical,

Speaker:

there is huge opportunity to

Speaker:

expand wallet share and expand

Speaker:

your average revenue per

Speaker:

customer over time. Furthermore,

Speaker:

what's become really clear over

Speaker:

the years is that you can drive

Speaker:

much more efficient customer

Speaker:

acquisition economics in a

Speaker:

vertical plate versus a

Speaker:

horizontal plate.

Speaker:

Co-founder and CEO of Clio, Jack

Speaker:

Newton.

Speaker:

Thanks for listening to Decoding

Speaker:

Digital. Make sure you never

Speaker:

miss an episode by subscribing

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to the show in your favorite

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podcast player. To learn more,

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visit decodingdigital.com. Until