Artwork for podcast WebJoy
S1 E31: Trying to be that person I wished was there when I was learning to code (Rizel / @BlackGirlBytes)
Episode 312nd January 2023 • WebJoy • Eddie Hinkle
00:00:00 00:24:17

Share Episode

Shownotes

Rizel Scarlett joins the show to talk about her origin story, from pursuing a degree in Psychology to becoming a Developer Advocate at GitHub.

We discuss the challenges getting into tech, particularly for people of color, and how non-inclusive environments can sometimes create the illusion of imposter syndrome, when it's really a lack of healthy workplace culture. We talk about how Rizel started G{Code} House to help carve a path for young women and non-binary people of color because of her own challenges in the tech industry.

Discussed Links

Transcripts

Eddie:

Welcome to episode 30, one of the web joy podcast.

Eddie:

I'm your host Eddie.

Eddie:

And in this podcast, we interview guests about their origin story and

Eddie:

what makes them excited and joyful to be part of the tech community.

Eddie:

I hope you enjoy today's episode.

Eddie:

Trying to be that person I wished was there when I was learning to code.

Eddie:

With results, Scarlet.

Eddie:

Welcome to another episode of Web Joy.

Eddie:

I'm excited to have Raelle with us today.

Eddie:

Raelle, say hi to everyone listening.

Eddie:

Hey

Rizel:

everyone, like you said, my name's Raelle and I'm really excited to be here.

Eddie:

Awesome.

Eddie:

Well, so for those who might not know who you are, just go ahead and mention kind

Eddie:

of what you do, where you work a brief.

Rizel:

Yeah, so my full name's Raelle Scarlet, and I work at

Rizel:

GitHub as a developer advocate.

Rizel:

And what that means, like in a short way, is like I'm empowering developers

Rizel:

through content, code, and community.

Eddie:

I love that though, empowering developers through content.

Eddie:

Code and community.

Eddie:

That was, that was slick.

Eddie:

That's real nice.

Eddie:

Thank you.

Eddie:

What's the short version of your story?

Eddie:

Right?

Eddie:

How did you decide that you wanted to get into programming and that tech was

Eddie:

something that you wanna be involved

Rizel:

in?

Rizel:

Yeah, really great question.

Rizel:

So short version is I was in college study in psychology because I thought like, I

Rizel:

don't know what to study, that it seems cool to maybe know about people's minds.

Rizel:

And then I realized I didn't have enough finances to continue.

Rizel:

And I kept talking to people and they're like, yeah, you're gonna need

Rizel:

to like go to grad school to actually like start working as a psychologist.

Rizel:

So I was like, oh.

Rizel:

They're like, . I'm like, I don't even have money for this semester.

Rizel:

So I, I , I ended up like dropping out and like re.

Rizel:

Thinking about like what my plan was and I was Googling what

Rizel:

jobs make the most money Nice.

Rizel:

And like all these technical jobs kept coming up.

Rizel:

And I was like, okay, I can use the computer.

Rizel:

I'll, I'll try that.

Rizel:

. Um, and then I signed up for a community college study,

Rizel:

computer information system.

Rizel:

Started working as a help desk technician, but I felt like very

Rizel:

quickly that I was, it was fun for me to like, help people face-to-face.

Rizel:

I really enjoyed that, but I felt very quickly that it wasn't challenging for me.

Rizel:

Like, I'm like within six months to a year, I feel like I, I know

Rizel:

most of the things, so I wanted to challenge myself a little bit more.

Rizel:

I kept hearing people at a company I was working at, talking about APIs and stuff

Rizel:

like that, and I was like, what is this?

Rizel:

I kind of wanna learn to code.

Rizel:

So I went to a coding bootcamp.

Rizel:

I called Resilient Coders, learn to code.

Rizel:

became a software engineer and at the same time got my degree in

Rizel:

computer science and then after that I switched into developer advocacy.

Rizel:

But yeah, that's the short story,

Rizel:

. Eddie: Wow.

Rizel:

Awesome.

Rizel:

Well that's amazing.

Rizel:

Like you actually did a coding bootcamp and got a degree.

Rizel:

Yeah.

Rizel:

As a career switcher.

Rizel:

Like that is definitely unusual for kind of a career switch

Rizel:

. Rizel: Yeah, I think that

Rizel:

I don't think I will recommend it to.

Rizel:

because it was very time consuming.

Rizel:

Yeah.

Rizel:

And financially, well, the bootcamp was free, but college, I was like, Hmm, maybe

Rizel:

I didn't need all of these classes that

Eddie:

I'm doing.

Eddie:

No, that makes sense.

Eddie:

What has the journey been like?

Eddie:

Did you start at GitHub?

Eddie:

Have you been at a couple companies along the way?

Eddie:

What has that journey for you been like once you started programming?

Rizel:

Good question.

Rizel:

So once I started programming, I went to a couple like small companies

Rizel:

in the Boston areas, and then after that I worked at a remote company, I

Rizel:

think it's in Seattle, called Botany.

Rizel:

So I was a software engineer.

Rizel:

Kind of more startupy companies.

Rizel:

It's been almost a year of me working

Eddie:

at GitHub . I definitely kinda had a similar trajectory where it was

Eddie:

like just a bunch of like startups and Noname stuff, and I did one job was

Eddie:

government contracting, but pretty much outside of that it's been pretty much all

Eddie:

startups along the journey until recently.

Eddie:

So yeah, it's, it's nice.

Eddie:

Like, it's funny because when you.

Eddie:

Talking about your journey, you're like, I'm gonna name all these

Eddie:

things that like you probably have no idea what they are, right?

Eddie:

Yeah.

Eddie:

. But I don't know.

Eddie:

It gives you a lot of opportunity, right?

Eddie:

To like do different things.

Eddie:

Like there's so few people.

Eddie:

You have to learn a lot of kind of skills on the job, which I imagine

Eddie:

can probably be intimidating, right?

Eddie:

But, uh, , you walk out with a lot of knowledge.

Eddie:

Yeah, I

Rizel:

agree.

Rizel:

I think we both probably took a lot of transferrable skills from those

Rizel:

roles that helped us to excel in like larger companies because there's less,

Rizel:

less things you have to focus on.

Rizel:

You just have like your one little niche and you're like,

Rizel:

cool, I'll focus on and on that

Rizel:

. Eddie: Exactly.

Rizel:

That is, that is one thing like.

Rizel:

So I started at Glassdoor a little bit around a year ago.

Rizel:

So, um, sounds like we, we changed companies around the same time.

Rizel:

, it was like intimidating because you, you start as big company and

Rizel:

you look around and you're like, all these people are so amazing.

Rizel:

Like, I can't believe.

Rizel:

Yeah.

Rizel:

Like, I'm working with these people.

Rizel:

, but then it's really cool cause you realize like, oh, you feel like you're

Rizel:

not doing enough because you're just doing like one thing and you're like,

Rizel:

shouldn't I be doing like 10 things?

Rizel:

Like

Rizel:

? Rizel: Yeah.

Rizel:

You're like, I'm used to doing this, this, this and this.

Rizel:

Sometimes people are like, wow, you work a lot.

Rizel:

I'm like, I don't know.

Rizel:

I'm used to like the startup life.

Rizel:

So , this feels like working not that much to me.

Rizel:

trying to chill.

Rizel:

Yeah,

Eddie:

exactly.

Eddie:

That's awesome.

Eddie:

Well, what do you think kind.

Eddie:

You have enjoyed most about programming, right?

Eddie:

You kind of went down, you know, this psychology route and

Eddie:

we're like, all right, well this isn't really gonna work out.

Eddie:

So you tried it work and help desk, and that didn't really click right?

Eddie:

That was like, oh, I'm not kind of challenging myself enough.

Eddie:

But you stuck with programming, so what is it that kind of got you to stick with it?

Eddie:

Yeah, I think

Rizel:

the, the constant challenge and the ability to create has

Rizel:

been really awesome for me.

Rizel:

Like I loved it.

Rizel:

Like I will say I loved it cuz I loved like the idea of like helping people.

Rizel:

That's where I was getting my joy from.

Rizel:

But I was like, I wanna do, I wish I could help people in a more proactive

Rizel:

way, cuz with it sometimes it's, People like, oh, I can't open Google Chrome.

Rizel:

And I'm like, did you try double clicking it?

Rizel:

And they're like, wow, that works.

Rizel:

So . Like, I wish I was like, I wish I could do something more proactive

Rizel:

and helping people have better user experiences and stuff like that.

Rizel:

And I feel like I've gotten that from programming and I think even more so

Rizel:

from developer advocacy where I can like talk to other engineers and be

Rizel:

like, Hey, how is it going for you?

Rizel:

Or talk to open source maintainers and figure out.

Rizel:

How we can make the product better for them, what struggles they're

Rizel:

currently having and how I can like make their lives easier.

Rizel:

So I think it's like I just have an intrinsic interest in like helping others

Rizel:

and being like challenged a little bit.

Rizel:

So I think that's that's where

Eddie:

it is.

Eddie:

Yeah.

Eddie:

Yeah.

Eddie:

I definitely noticed as you were just talking, The thing you liked about

Eddie:

Right doing the help desk was that you really liked helping people, and it

Eddie:

instantly, in my mind, I'm like, well, it makes complete sense that you're

Eddie:

a developer advocate then, right?

Eddie:

Like developer relations.

Eddie:

Like it is the blend of programming, technology and helping people

Eddie:

together, so that's awesome.

Eddie:

Exactly.

Eddie:

Have you kind of always been, since you learned a program, have you always

Eddie:

been doing kind of developer relations or is this more of a new thing?

Rizel:

When I hear about like what other people were doing before

Rizel:

developer relations, they're like, yeah, I had a YouTube channel and all

Rizel:

these blog posts and stuff like that.

Rizel:

I didn't have those things, but I did help to start an organization

Rizel:

called G-Code, which I guess could be considered developer

Rizel:

relations like we were introducing.

Rizel:

Women of color and non-binary people of color to web development.

Rizel:

So like I made the curriculum, I created the slide decks, I taught, I even taught

Rizel:

like other volunteer mentors how to teach.

Rizel:

So that in a way was like developer advocacy.

Rizel:

But it wasn't in the more traditional way that people think of it.

Eddie:

Sure.

Eddie:

That's awesome.

Eddie:

Cuz that was on the side, right?

Eddie:

Yeah.

Eddie:

So kind of before you were doing really develop advocacy in your

Eddie:

day job, you started take kind of living that passion out on the side.

Eddie:

Yeah, exactly.

Eddie:

That's awesome.

Eddie:

I love that.

Eddie:

And thank you.

Eddie:

Like you said, trying to Right, expand.

Eddie:

Tech.

Eddie:

Right.

Eddie:

Making it more available and inclusive to people of color.

Eddie:

I love that.

Eddie:

Especially obviously that's something that you have experience with, right?

Eddie:

Yeah.

Eddie:

I feel like a lot of times, you know, you see a lot of good, well-intentioned

Eddie:

organizations, but it's oftentimes set up by people in the establishment.

Eddie:

Right?

Eddie:

You might have like Yeah.

Eddie:

White cis men.

Eddie:

Yeah.

Eddie:

And it's like, all right, we're gonna create diversity, and I love.

Eddie:

That that is their goal, right?

Eddie:

Like it, yeah, it's better than them not wanting to do that.

Eddie:

But I also love it when people who actually have that experience,

Eddie:

right, of what it's like to be a person of color in tech.

Eddie:

It's much different, unfortunately.

Eddie:

And so yeah, you're able to really shed light on and and help people, which is.

Rizel:

Yeah, I think that really helped me to run the program well and helped me

Rizel:

to, to get really excited about the idea of empowering engineers because like I

Rizel:

could relate to those students and I was like, oh, I know how it would be for you.

Rizel:

And we, we did a lot of things.

Rizel:

Me and, um, my colleague Bailey, we did stuff like making sure they

Rizel:

had to like Uber each gift cards and stuff like that during class.

Rizel:

, you know, other stuff that would meet their needs rather than

Rizel:

just only thinking about coding.

Eddie:

Yeah.

Eddie:

It has a more holistic approach cuz you wanna kind of understand

Eddie:

the mindset and the circumstances that they might be coming from.

Eddie:

Yeah.

Eddie:

Well, cool.

Eddie:

You know, one of the things we like to talk about on this podcast is

Eddie:

something that brings us joy and so I kind of just wanted to say,

Eddie:

you know, what's something that.

Eddie:

you've been involved with that brings you joy that you'd like to talk about?

Eddie:

Yeah.

Rizel:

Um, G Code is definitely an organization that brings me joy.

Rizel:

I've moved more into an advisory role rather than the director of

Rizel:

programming, which is what I was before, just because it's easier to balance.

Rizel:

But one of the reasons that it brings me joy is that I am trying to.

Rizel:

That person that I wished was there for me when I was learning

Rizel:

to code and like learning to, to navigate the tech industry.

Rizel:

I feel like, like you said, like as a person of color, as a black

Rizel:

person specifically, it's a much different experience that a lot

Rizel:

of people aren't educated on.

Rizel:

I really like being able to help them and I really love when they

Rizel:

come back and they do tell me, like, that was really helpful for me.

Rizel:

I really like, enjoyed the classes, gonna miss you, stuff like that.

Rizel:

Or they come back and tell me they landed a job.

Rizel:

Um, like those are the type of things that I appreciate and get excited about.

Rizel:

What does

Eddie:

the kind of pro program.

Eddie:

What kind of look like and feel like.

Rizel:

It's not a long-term like coding bootcamp, so what we do is like we start

Rizel:

off by, I think we meet on Sundays.

Rizel:

Yeah.

Rizel:

I don't know if they changed it since now I'm in advisory role, but when I was doing

Rizel:

it, we met on Sundays and it would just be like six to 10 Sundays and we did Sundays

Rizel:

because it would be easier for them to.

Rizel:

Like be cutting off their work schedule and stuff like that.

Rizel:

It was more flexible for the students.

Rizel:

So we meet on Sundays and we will go over like H T M L, CSS and

Rizel:

JavaScript and that would be it.

Rizel:

After that, we would move them on to like another longer term program that

Rizel:

we have like partnership with or we know is free, like Code the Dream or launch.

Rizel:

And I think the, the way I structured it really well, like I don't go

Rizel:

faster than they would understand.

Rizel:

So if they're like, Hey, I don't get this, like, we will do another

Rizel:

day of like learning that concept over and in different ways.

Rizel:

I make sure that like we're not just learn focused on one learning style.

Rizel:

, I believe that people learn from like repetition, so I'll do it in like visuals.

Rizel:

I'll do it by them doing hands on and I'll do it by them like hearing

Rizel:

it so they'll get all like all three or all the possible options.

Rizel:

And then of course we try to make sure there is like holistic approach

Rizel:

as well and we'll have like game nights and stuff like that for them

Rizel:

to get connect with each other.

Rizel:

That's, that's kind of how it is.

Eddie:

Awesome.

Eddie:

No, that sounds great and I love.

Eddie:

You're not trying to tackle everything, right?

Eddie:

You're no doing a strategic starting point, and then you've built

Eddie:

partnerships to say, Hey, like this can kind of help carry you through.

Eddie:

That's really well, well thought out.

Eddie:

I guess.

Eddie:

What challenges do you feel like exist, right?

Eddie:

When people are getting into tech, right?

Eddie:

You got into tech, you're helping all these people get into tech.

Eddie:

What kind of things kind of have you.

Eddie:

Encountered or have you seen people encounter that make it difficult?

Eddie:

Yeah,

Rizel:

there's a lot.

Rizel:

I think one of the things is like quote unquote imposter syndrome.

Rizel:

I say the quotes because a lot of times it's not really that the person has

Rizel:

imposter syndrome, or maybe they have a little bit, but a lot of times it's

Rizel:

like other people telling them things.

Rizel:

Like that's what I experienced at least, and I've talked to.

Rizel:

Underrepresented minorities, and they said like, yes, they agree.

Rizel:

Like a lot of times you'll be like, at least I went in and I was

Rizel:

like, okay, maybe I don't know any everything, and I'm a little bit

Rizel:

nervous, but I'm willing to learn.

Rizel:

But then you may meet with some in tech.

Rizel:

Sometimes we wanna seem like we know it all.

Rizel:

So you might have coworkers who they may speak to you in a more

Rizel:

condescending tone or say things like, oh, I would've expected you would

Rizel:

know this, or something like that.

Rizel:

And I think that kind of stuff starts to create imposter syndrome in somebody else.

Rizel:

Or they might even tell you, oh, you just have imposter syndrome, and

Rizel:

I'm just like, no, you are making that person feel bad and you're not

Rizel:

creating inclusive environment for them to feel confident with learning.

Rizel:

So I think that's like a big issue that does happen.

Eddie:

Yeah.

Eddie:

I love that call out because I think for plenty of people, like imposter syndrome

Eddie:

is real, but it has to be separated from the actual act of someone making someone

Eddie:

feel unwelcome and feel like an imposter.

Eddie:

And I think that is dangerous, right?

Eddie:

If we just always kind of cloak it as, oh, that's imposter syndrome,

Eddie:

you're just feeling like an imposter.

Eddie:

Like, well, no, there's an environment that's making you

Eddie:

feel that way and exactly.

Eddie:

You can self-talk all you want, but if someone keeps saying

Eddie:

You don't know that, then like you're never gonna get over that.

Eddie:

Like you have to change.

Eddie:

Yeah.

Eddie:

The environment has to change and be more welcoming and inclusive to allow

Eddie:

that self-talk, to be able to kind of put it to the sides, you know?

Eddie:

Yeah.

Eddie:

You said it

Rizel:

really, really perfectly.

Rizel:

Aw

Rizel:

. Eddie: Thanks.

Rizel:

That's really great.

Rizel:

I think that's one thing.

Rizel:

I really have appreciated about tech Twitter lately, although

Rizel:

there's definitely areas of tech Twitter that can go off the rails.

Rizel:

Environments can be what they can be.

Rizel:

Yeah.

Rizel:

But I know when I really got into tech, like no one was really willing

Rizel:

to share what kind of issues they ran into or what challenges they ran into.

Rizel:

And so I do think as.

Rizel:

Unfortunately, people in this industry who are going to kind of talk down and

Rizel:

kind of gate keep, you know, and try to keep it be like an elite class of

Rizel:

like programmers or whatever, whatever nonsense they're trying to pedal, at

Rizel:

least like in the community and like Twitter and different things like that.

Rizel:

We do have a number of people who.

Rizel:

Can kind of shed light on that.

Rizel:

Right.

Rizel:

And we have, yeah.

Rizel:

Communities like the G Code House that can help prepare and say, Hey listen,

Rizel:

here's some things you're gonna run into and find people who build you up.

Rizel:

Find people who invest in you rather than just tear you down.

Rizel:

Yes, I

Rizel:

love tech Twitter for that reason.

Rizel:

When I was having a tough time in tech, it was definitely.

Rizel:

My, my go-to and I've found that like similar to what you said about

Rizel:

communities, I've found that finding community helps to like reduce

Rizel:

those feelings of imposter syndrome.

Rizel:

Cuz like that's, that's the main thing behind imposter syndrome

Rizel:

is that you feel like you are the only one and you don't belong.

Rizel:

So once you find those, those communities, whether it be online, You,

Rizel:

you have a group of people in person.

Rizel:

I really do feel like that can help to reduce the The negative experience.

Eddie:

Absolutely.

Eddie:

Right.

Eddie:

Especially cuz like when people are actively hearing like those statements

Eddie:

and then you log on Twitter and you see people at prominent companies, right?

Eddie:

Like I follow someone who works at Netflix, right?

Eddie:

And then of course, yeah, you work at GitHub and like when people at these

Eddie:

more well-known companies are willing to.

Eddie:

Open and transparent and say, Hey, here's what people have told me.

Eddie:

And like people are actively, like they'll tweet things and

Eddie:

then they'll be like, oh, okay.

Eddie:

Everyone's coming out and saying, I don't know how to do this.

Eddie:

Like, I think I know how to do it.

Eddie:

I work at Netflix.

Eddie:

You know?

Eddie:

And it's like, yeah, showing that even when someone is successful, like

Eddie:

people are still gonna kind of try to.

Eddie:

Gate, keep them like

Eddie:

. Rizel: Yeah.

Eddie:

You brought up a good point,

Eddie:

. Eddie: So I guess what other things

Eddie:

in tech that you found challenging?

Eddie:

I mean,

Rizel:

in addition to maybe companies or coworkers not being as welcoming.

Rizel:

I think sometimes hustle culture.

Rizel:

Can make it challenging too because you never know or you, you're not

Rizel:

sure like, am I doing enough work or you're feeling pressured to do more?

Rizel:

And that that like leads to burnout and that leads to people wanting to quit.

Rizel:

So yeah, that's been another main issue that I've seen pop up.

Rizel:

That

Eddie:

makes sense for sure.

Eddie:

Yeah, I think it's interesting cuz that's kind of tied in with like how

Eddie:

people do performance reviews, right?

Eddie:

And like how their manager engages with them and it's like, okay, oftentimes

Eddie:

managers can kind of be hands off and just let you do what you do.

Eddie:

And so you're constantly kind of wondering like, where do I stand with this person?

Eddie:

And it's like, yeah, finally once a year, right?

Eddie:

They like give you.

Eddie:

Satisfactory label and you're like, oh, few I made it another year.

Eddie:

Right?

Eddie:

Like . Yeah.

Rizel:

That is how it can be , I feel like on both sides, like the company and

Rizel:

the, the worker or the employee, I don't know what to call them, but the developer.

Rizel:

Yeah.

Rizel:

Um, , I think there can be improvements made.

Rizel:

I think we need to.

Rizel:

Change how we're doing mentorship.

Rizel:

I feel like tons of times that people have been like, oh, this is your mentor.

Rizel:

And then like I've, I've never talked to them beyond like one time

Rizel:

like, oh, hey, you're my mentor.

Rizel:

And then they just like don't, I don't know, like when you

Rizel:

have like an onboarding buddy at GitHub, that hasn't happened.

Rizel:

But at like past companies, it's been like, oh, this is your onboarding bunny.

Rizel:

And then they.

Rizel:

never do anything, or I reach out and ask a question, no

Rizel:

answer questions are answered.

Rizel:

And I think, uh, that's not like, uh, only me situation.

Rizel:

So like, yeah, revamping how we're doing mentorship and like how

Rizel:

you said where you may not know, where you stand with your manager.

Rizel:

Figuring out like a communication plan of like how does your manager want to best

Rizel:

be communicated with, and then versus like, how do you wanna be communicated

Rizel:

with, it's just there's a lot.

Rizel:

Things that I think we can do better, especially for either like junior

Rizel:

engineers or people from underrepresented backgrounds, cuz I think those are, at

Rizel:

least for me, those are the people that I've spoken to that often leave the

Rizel:

industry, whereas they were initially excited and then they get discouraged.

Eddie:

Yeah, because I think right when you are encountering more an additional

Eddie:

blockers, right, like the industry is, is hard enough to kind of break into, right?

Eddie:

And even if you fit the mold, and I am in the fortunate place that

Eddie:

no one's ever looked at me and said, oh, you don't know that.

Eddie:

And it's probably just because of assumptions, right?

Eddie:

The biases and assumptions.

Eddie:

Someone looks at me and I've got glasses and.

Eddie:

I'm white and I'm a dude, and you know, like I kind of fit, like, someone's

Eddie:

like, oh yeah, there's a nerd.

Eddie:

All right.

Eddie:

Like he knows how to program, you know, like . Yeah.

Eddie:

I can say gibberish and like unfortunately that bias works in my favor.

Eddie:

Right?

Eddie:

But, and yet even in that where like I have this systemic kind

Eddie:

of help and support, I still have run into blockers myself, right?

Eddie:

Like, yeah.

Eddie:

And so it's like, Even people who have a pretty smooth path can run into blockers.

Eddie:

Like that's just gonna pile up right on.

Eddie:

People who have kind of systemic issues pushing against them and making

Eddie:

it harder with biases and stuff.

Eddie:

And so I definitely can see how that would lead to faster burnout, right?

Eddie:

Because it's like if you have that feeling of you shouldn't belong,

Eddie:

you're gonna work harder hours, right?

Eddie:

Because you're gonna feel like you're behind everyone else and.

Eddie:

If you don't feel steady in your job, you might not feel as confident to.

Eddie:

Push back to your manager, right.

Eddie:

And ask.

Eddie:

Yeah.

Eddie:

And like really probe.

Eddie:

And so I think in that way it's, if you're listening and you're in that situation,

Eddie:

like kind of like we talked about, right?

Eddie:

Find community, find people who can say, Hey, here's what

Eddie:

I said, here's what I did.

Eddie:

Um, to kind of encourage you like how you can push back and how you can

Eddie:

kind of take control of the situation, even if say your manager isn't, yeah.

Eddie:

So that's, that's definitely good.

Eddie:

And yeah, and hopefully.

Eddie:

As we continue to, to push and change right?

Eddie:

Our companies and like we get my more diversity in our companies.

Eddie:

Like we'll have managers who have gone these paths and understood right, these

Eddie:

roadblocks and people, right, like me, who are on the journey to learning roadblocks,

Eddie:

everyone is encountering, like hopefully we can continue to make changes inside

Eddie:

that, um, make things more welcoming.

Rizel:

I definitely see us taking that, that path we're getting.

Rizel:

So I don't want it to seem all negative, but I like to be transparent about

Rizel:

this so that if there's other people who are, like you said, like not sure

Rizel:

if they should stay in tech, I want them to know like if this is a common

Rizel:

occurrence or experience and there's ways

Eddie:

around it.

Eddie:

Yeah.

Eddie:

You're.

Eddie:

You're not alone.

Eddie:

Reach out to people.

Eddie:

Twitter is a great place.

Eddie:

But, um, there's also, you know, all sorts of communities.

Eddie:

There's actually been a lot of different communities that have

Eddie:

been mentioned on previous episodes.

Eddie:

So like you can go back through our archives and listen, I'm trying to

Eddie:

get together a website that will actually like list all the cool

Eddie:

communities and different things that people have experienced.

Eddie:

So you can look at the, the podcast website and when you're listening to

Eddie:

this, see if I've actually released it or.

Eddie:

Hopefully by the time this gets released, I've, I've updated the website, , . But

Eddie:

yeah, find there's all sorts of, uh, communities, so kinda look back and,

Eddie:

and find different communities people have recommended and yeah, get plugged

Eddie:

in where people can encourage you and, and help you know which way to go.

Eddie:

So Raelle is there, I guess if someone wanted to get involved in the

Eddie:

G Code house, what should they do?

Rizel:

Yeah, you can go ahead and follow G Code House on Twitter at G Code House

Rizel:

and then on, um, you can check out their website at the g code house.com.

Rizel:

. There is an option where it says like, join us or get

Rizel:

involved, or something like that.

Rizel:

I don't remember, but that's where you would go if you wanted to volunteer

Rizel:

and if you wanted to be a student, there's like an apply section.

Eddie:

Well, that sounds great.

Eddie:

Raelle, thank you so much for joining us today.

Eddie:

It's been just a pleasure of chatting, getting to know you and your story

Eddie:

and just hearing about how you.

Eddie:

I like to encourage people to just keep pushing through when the times get

Rizel:

tough.

Rizel:

Thanks.

Rizel:

It was great talking to you as well.

Rizel:

I really enjoyed this conversation.

Rizel:

Awesome.

Eddie:

Thank you for joining us for episode 31.

Eddie:

Trying to be that person I wished was there.

Eddie:

When I was learning to code with Rozelle Scarlet, you can find out more about

Eddie:

resil on her Twitter at black girl bites.

Eddie:

You can find links to everything we talked about in this episode, as well as a link

Eddie:

to results Twitter in the show notes.

Eddie:

And if you enjoyed this episode, help others discover it as well.

Eddie:

Give us a shout out on your favorite social media platform and tag a friend or

Eddie:

coworker that you think would enjoy it.

Eddie:

Don't forget to follow us wherever you hang out online or subscribe to

Eddie:

our newsletter to stay up to date.

Eddie:

Thank you for listening and have a great day.