I got Matt Froehlich on the side lines today during his busy schedule to talk about life in Green Bay and what its like to be a Madden Esports coach. In the second half, Matt gives us a locker room tour at the only daily Packers podcast and draws up some plays for marketing your podcast.

Guest's Links:

• Twitter
• Twitch - Streaming Madden regularly!
• Pack-A-Day Podcast
• Game On Wisconsin
• Baer Performance Marketing

Local Places Mentioned in This Episode:

• Big Brothers, Big Sisters NEW
• UW Green Bay
• Lambeau Field

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David Kalsow 0:00

Today's episode is sponsored by Baer Performance Marketing. Baer Performance Marketing is a full service marketing agency located in Green Bay, Wisconsin blocks away from historic Lambeau Field. From web design to social media bear helps your business grow by getting your story seen. For more information go to bear pm.com that's barpm.com. On to the show.

Matt Froehlich 0:25

Living in Green Bay, it's usually after the weather we talk Packers.

David Kalsow 0:29

I'm David Kalsow. And you're listening to APC Presents for I showcase independent podcasters from Northeast Wisconsin. Today I talk with the sports master himself, Matt Freolich. Matt's nine to five is on the team at Baer Performance Marketing, which you just heard about in the pre roll. Every other waking moment I found out Matt dedicates to people and sports. He coaches at local high schools as a big brother for the Big Brothers Big Sisters program of Northeast Wisconsin, head coach of Madden for Carroll University's eSports team, a host for the Game On Wisconsin podcasts and the Pack-a-Day podcast, a daily Packers show. So if it sounds like a lot, it's because it is! But it was a joy to hear how over the years Matt discovered exactly what he loves to do. When it comes to the podcast side, he gives us a little breakdown on how a full team of Packer lovers makes a daily show possible. He also draws up some nice plays for promoting your own podcast. I'm pleased to present Matt Froehlich.

So that we kind of met at a lunch and learn in passing but this is the first time we've actually sat down to talk to each other.

Matt Froehlich 1:48

Yeah, and David, we don't show it for a little while but I'm excited to to talk shop talk podcasting and just kind of just connect here this great conversation to be had.

David Kalsow 1:56

I've been looking forward to it for a while. So let's start off with a doozy of a question Who is the goat Benny the jet Rodriguez or Pablo secret weapon Sanchez.

Matt Froehlich 2:09

do that so that's not fair that you would say Pablo Sanchez. I just tweeted like I'm good for at least like five or six Pablo Sanchez gifts throughout the year and I just used one of the two or like one of Yeah, I'm like I'm I guess I didn't use one first quarter of the year. So I'm I'm probably do but I honestly, I love any like Pablo Sanchez. Dude is Pablo. Like cuz he like it's 100% possible because he could play multiple sports and like you could have him a pitcher. You could have a mat outfield you could put them at goalkeeper he could be the point guard like he was he did it all in that backyard situation like Benny the jet like you know, he did make the the Major Leagues played for the Dodgers. But whatever. Pablo did it all triple triple sport, maybe quadruple he was there was a hockey game at some point. I'm sure he was getting the skates. Yes, I'm going Pablo.

David Kalsow 2:59

Yeah, nice was a backyard baseball, one of the first games you got sucked into or what was it? The first one I got sucked into, if

Matt Froehlich 3:06

you will, would be backyard baseball. Now, I don't know if it counts. Like when I didn't have a system on my parents house. And we go to like the cousins or whatever. And like really dive into games that maybe GoldenEye. But like the first first game I really like got into was backyard baseball and loved love drafting a team and just running run into the championship.

David Kalsow 3:25

Yeah, that's awesome. So it seems like sports are kind of ingrained in sort of every part from video games to what you do every single day. But can you sort of paint us a picture of your story?

Matt Froehlich 3:38

I'll lean into the sports more because that's literally like the foundation of my I don't want to say existence. But like, that's I grew up with two younger brothers and a dad that was passionate about athletics and parents that were always wanting us to be in a sport. So it was like, it was just kind of what it was like, we like the best athletes in town. No, but like we wanted to play our parents gave us the opportunity and like also, like, we're able to do that. Because that's I mean, just time alone is is crazy for parents running kids in the three at the time. So I think sports is a huge thing. It taught me a lot about myself a lot about teamwork. I still have some great relationship with kids or kids. I guess we weren't kids at the time. But we're turning into adults over the 20 years 25 years since playing together and like we're still friends like it's crazy, like so. I love sports. I love everything about it. I've gotten into coaching over the last couple of years which has been awesome coaching baseball right now at Green Bay Southwest so that's a blast but I just I love the when you boil sport sports down like you get rid of the statistics or you get rid of the the jersey colors or the rivalries or whatever, like just the pure essence of like, fanaticism and like competitiveness is like some of the more raw emotion you'll ever see. Like you can really I feel like kind of like, see someone for who they are depending how they deal with adversity. Do you deal with success deal with struggles, you know, mental lapses, physical issues like it's, I just love athletics like really what it boils down to. So that's part of it. And I try to expand my passion for sports throughout a lot of my life. So like I said, I'm, I coach, baseball, I've coached fifth grade, no, I was at seventh grade girls volleyball when I was in college, because I needed I needed it for a credit, mind you, but it was still it was still great. Like it was awesome. Coach, fifth grade girls basketball recently to a couple baseball teams, some flag football in there. But also, like, I do the podcast that we'll get into mostly Packers content, but it's just, it's just another creative way to keep me engaged in what I like to do and just find another angle once you know, reached my 30s. My, my success to be a gym class hero is pretty much down the drain at this point, like we're just, we're hoping for a little rec league softball championship. But besides that, you kind of got to just like, Alright, like, you know, terna knees, probably not the best thing I still try to stay somewhat, you know, in shape. But it's you definitely don't bounce back like you used to. But I would say that's, that's really what, that's what makes me who I am kind of just that competitive nature and just trying to apply that throughout many aspects of my life.

David Kalsow 6:18

As you said, you're you're a coach for the high school sports, you're also a big brother with Big Brother, big sister and coach for the esports at Carroll University, sort of bundling those all together, what drives you to sort of be a part of the community still,

Matt Froehlich 6:35

I think it's like, humbling kind of, I really tried to understand like, where other people like, I want to say come from, but like, their background and like, what, what they're all about, really what it boils down to David is like I was I felt like growing up, like given a pretty fair shake at life. And like, I know, coming from a small town in Central Wisconsin, where I didn't really experience any issues my entire life that were mean, life changing by any stretch of the imagination, I think that was probably safe to say for most of the people I grew up with too. But like when I moved to a bigger city, and you know, I don't think Green Bay is the worst place in the country. I think it's actually a great place to live. But it's like, okay, like there clearly is more issues going on here then, like, you know, suburbia back home and Stevens Point, Wisconsin, like, let's, let's see who we can like impact a little bit here. And like it took a while to like get my footing as far as like, well, I need to make sure like personal is taken care of before I can like expand on that. So once I was able to do that, I was like, Okay, I can can figure some stuff out. And it's helped some people along the way, like the Big Brothers Big Sisters is a super awesome thing. Like I can't say enough great things about that organization, to be honest, like that. It's exceeded my expectations, not only with like, my little brother Cameron, who I'm matched with, but also just like the support you have from Northeast Wisconsin chapter. It's just, it's unbelievable. Like, just the feedback you get and the stuff they try to help you with or just checking in and just like forming relationships with them, like them being like your program specialists or whoever, like it's just, it's very, very fun. And then like the Madden Carroll thing is just it's hilarious like that, honestly, the way it came about like it's like it goes back to the beginning of this conversation of like, the internet. Yeah, like you just have access to all this stuff. And it's just like, Okay, this just happened. So like, I'm a huge Madden head, like I love Madden, like, played it for many, many years have played it competitively since I was in middle school in high school with buddies of mine and then kind of went to college and continue to play in tournaments and just I wanted to be the best of that game because I feel it's like the best game

David Kalsow 8:37

and you don't blow out your knee and you don't

Matt Froehlich 8:39

your thumbs get a little sore, potentially. But yeah, that's Yeah, you don't have to worry about any real real injuries. So yeah, I was playing in a tournament actually for that for it was the Green Bay Packers put it on it was all virtual, obviously had to happen over this last year and got through the weekend got to the I think it was like the final 678 whatever it was, and once you got there was just you got matched up with a player to play. And I got matched up with Lucas Patrick, guard number 62. And good dude, pretty like low key guy. Like I could have saw him being in my high school like science class and him and I would uh, like he was just a very normal dude, which was hilarious. Yeah. And played him. They streamed it. The coach for Carroll coach Joe Loomis saw me playing and DM me on twitter like the next day or that evening? and was like, Hey, that was really cool. And like he clearly had watched because he like specifically said something about the game like okay, he actually didn't just like see this as a replay. He actually watched the whole damn thing. Yeah. And like, I was like, this is really weird. I told my girlfriend she's like, Yeah, I don't know that strange. Like that's just Carroll University eSports Twitter pages dming you I'm like, I guess so I started researching like, the state eSports set up and how that's set up and it's it's Wild and I'm like, so what did you want to play in Madden Joe? Or like, what was your thoughts here? He's like, no, I actually was wondering if you'd like want to coach our team. I'm like, and at first I was like, Well, to be honest, like, I would stack my like of people. I know I'm the best Madden player, but like when it's across the country, like, there's these kids that are playing like they're, they're the 18 to 22 year olds, like they don't have full time jobs yet. They're like there's the kids in college that have the time to do it. So tough to compete. But really, like, I think, just my knowledge that goes back to that like with the baseball thing like what I've seen in Madden, through the earliest Madden still now, like there's a lot of stuff you can apply and like give history to, if you will, and it's just so happened that I can pair like coaching. And I mean, basically just talking with Fiat and like the added knowledge of Madden, and like just talking with five or six college dudes that just want to play Madden and like potentially win a conference championship here coming in the next couple of weeks. So it's just, I don't know what the world is pretty weird to be honest at times, but in a good way. At this point.

Are there any differences between coaching the esports and coaching the live sports to you?

The only similarity is like communication. That's it. Like you need to always communicate effectively I feel like especially with like if you're teaching that's the only similarity to be honest, it is. Because like, it's one it's virtual right now, like I I'm just getting on an Xbox party chat or using discord and trying to message these guys throughout the day because like they're in Waukesha, I'm in Green Bay, like their campus is pretty much like off limits. I can go down there if I want but like, I'd have to leave work early in the day and like, to be honest, like the Madden Madden, the Madden coaching isn't paying the bills yet. So like, it's, it's kind of like, you know, I'm not going to come down for every game, I'm thinking about coming down for their playoff game starting in two weeks, but like, it's, it's way different. And like, those are also young adults who have jobs, schoolwork, like to be like, I don't care if I'd much rather. And I tell this to our student athletes in like, baseball, and whatever else, like I'd much rather you be a successful student and go to college somewhere and be a good father husband than if we you hitting 30 homeruns like, it's gonna be awesome. And the moment you hitting 30 homeruns Yeah, like, I'm gonna be pretty pumped about it, like you might get, you might get like a, you know, a little plaque on my wall or something. But like, really, at the end of the day, like I want you to like be better off the field. So like, if these guys for the mat and like if they have schoolwork, which is can be stressful, some of them are in some pretty high end degrees, stuff that I definitely wouldn't have been able to even get through. Like, they're smart kids, they have jobs, they have girlfriends in personal life. So trying to balance that and also be like, prioritize a video game is a little bit like, I don't know how their parents feel about it. But like, I know, they want to play a lot. And they play a lot. So let's be good and like be successful. We're like, and that's so non traditional, right? Like, just everything about that, like we're talking about a video game, right? Like, this is like it's such a brand new ecosystem for eSports that like older people, and I mean, not even older people, like people that are my age or even younger, like wait, you do what? in there like, I didn't know there was a thing, where it's like baseball, it's like I see them in person like they baseball is like, ingrained in our culture. Like it is America's pastime, which I think it's the NFL No, not gonna get that conversation. But I like that is like you can I can understand, I can communicate more effectively when I'm in person, you can build relationships easier. Like it's, it's, but like, it's just, it's just different. I don't know, it's like, it's not even really the same at all at times, even though they're both coaching.

And I am a big proponent for eSports I think it is like the leveling the playing field for getting those kids that are like are in wheelchairs or have disability of some sort to get them on the same playing field as other kids. eSports is that path? Absolutely. There's,

there's like just a little side note, like there's a I don't know is that once it's Tony, I don't remember his last name or his I guess his gamertag whatever. But like he's, he's handicapped. He's in a wheelchair, but he's top I would say top 30 in the in the entire country in Madden and like, grips the controller different does some other stuff. But he also plays with some top competitive and like just the way to adapt like, it's not like it's it's incredible and like they can do that high of a level and like even the playing field is it's amazing.

Mentally, they're on the same playing field. And the thing is just maybe his hands just don't work the same way as exactly so he can't hold the football but he can hold a controller and knows the ins and outs of the football strategy because he's dedicated to it. I want to go back to the big brother for a second because it's something that I've been interested in doing but I haven't haven't pulled the trigger on it. What was your experience? Like signing up for them? What's sort of changed through the, through the pandemic? with that? Yeah,

good question. This is about a year and a half ago, I was like, Okay, I want to do this. And so it'd been, you know, October 2019. So right now it's four or five months before the world came to a screeching halt. pretty extensive background check. You have like two interviews where it's like, it's like a personality assessment type of thing, how you know, what your experiences with children, just a whole entire situation like that. And then you kind of get put into like a, like a roster or like a draft pack. Yeah, kind of to be honest. And they're pairing you with personality. And, unfortunately, and just the reality of the situation. There's way more liberals out there that need to be matched with people like you or myself or whoever, then there are people like you or myself. So there's kids that have waited years, like, I think Cameron waited. I want to say it was like two or three years. Yeah. There's other people that have waited longer, but my experience has been fantastic. Like it took a little bit while to get settled in of course with COVID and just making sure it's the right fit but that's been literally amazing. I can't say enough things about it. I you have to obviously like kids to some extent that that's huge, but it's great to coax even more I know that the entire state of Wisconsin or even everywhere for Big Brothers Big Sisters needs more male bigs that's like a huge thing. Younger one. So you and I both check boxes that way. So I don't know. I guess the best way to say it. It's like it's not like you're having a child. It's not like that because people always say like, you're not you'll never be ready. But like, I think you're just like have to understand like, okay, it's not that big of a commitment timelines, you can make it what you want it to be. I think it's good though, to mentally go in like, this is a commitment. This is something I need to you know, I can't just go through the motions with it. But like, I don't think you're ever like in a perfect situation. Like, what I want my house to be a little bit bigger for him or like a backyard we could play or maybe in a different neighborhood. Yeah, it'd be cool, but like, they just want camaraderie and like, hang out, like that's literally it. And be a brother. Yeah, honestly. And it's like we do just like nothing crazy man. Like he loves football. That's awesome. So we'll play football or talk about football. He's like a historian almost, if you will, like he knows about Barry Sanders and Lawrence Taylor and all these guys like Dude, you weren't there. But like I wasn't even born when these guys were playing most of the time like it's not so like and that's YouTube. Like he's on YouTube digging in so they make sure to match you with the right situation which is great. And to be honest, from what I know of you and Lindsey I think you guys would be a great big couple. So I would highly I would highly consider it it's it's pretty fun. It kind of boils down to like 10 or 15 hours throughout the entire month and like we all watch Tiger King last year David like we all have enough time to spend something in like actually written you can even watch Tiger King with your little who knows. I don't know. I wouldn't I wouldn't. I would find something else on Netflix that everyone like that's just trending.

Yeah, something that doesn't involve gay Tiger Wranglers that are taking over the world. It's that that show but anyways, yeah, yeah, I'll definitely look into it more I just want us to name a few more points down before we finished up this first half as they're started talking about you but you I saw I saw online that you worked in sales and operations for a long time What made you switch to marketing

Ah, to find a job I didn't hate and to minimize the Sunday scaries as much as possible. That's pretty much it. A lot a lot went into that. personal growth, like maturity finding, you know, just having to get a job that sucked in. I don't know. Like there's I've never really had like too bad of a job situation. No disrespect to anyone listening. But like, I was a teller at a bank for a while, that really sucked. I didn't like that. But that's just me. Like, I don't want to stand around and touch money all day. So unless it's my money,

yeah, I mean, look at what you're doing right now. You're you're part of a podcast, you're coaching a bunch of people you like, want to

have a good, good point. But no, it was just kind of like a you know, for a while is like early 20s. Like I can, you know, work in sales and make a lot of money and you can but I think just I'll compensate maybe, you know, an extra zero here too, or along the way over a decade or so of being a deal enjoy my life and have time for other things and not essentially, amen. My mental health and physical health just add a toll. So,

yeah, not burning out at the end of every week. 100% he said he grew up in Stevens Point. What brought you up here to the Northeast Wisconsin area.

Good question college UW Green Bay. So I come from a graduating class, I think it was like 680 we'll just say I had a pretty fun social life in high school, we had a really good group of people little younger than me older than me. And I feel like everyone just got along really, really well. But I could see that majority of people are gonna stay on point, or they're gonna go to Milwaukee or Eau Claire. I just was like, I don't really want to do what everyone else is doing. Because I want to meet other people. And I can't stand students anymore, because I'll be doing the same stuff I've been doing with the same people and it just won't. It's it wasn't where I needed to be growing. Yeah, exactly. And at the time, like 1718 years old, I had no idea what I want to do with my life, I had no idea where I would want to live. I didn't realize I would hate the winters much when I became a cranky, 30 year old. So like, school brought me here. We'll say the Packers somewhat kept me here at Green Bay has grown quite a bit for the better. It's growing on me now, having been here for 13 years. Like, is that where I'm gonna be with my whole life? Probably not. I would hope that I don't know what will come. We'll see what happens. But Green Bay stream is good for now. And I guess it's good enough that I haven't left. I mean, you've got the Packers

there, which super helpful Martini. Yeah, family is really important, too. So that's awesome. cool to hear. I think you answered my other my next question, which was why do you choose here, so there it is, the packers and this is your season?

Yeah. It's also a little tidbit is like when the Packers play. I don't have to go the game off. I try to get to one gaming here. But like when the Packers play, like, I have family, friends and whoever else coming into town most the time I can meet up with someone I haven't seen in a few years or only see them once a year because they come to a game so like that's a huge perk because like people coming to me, I don't even have to travel to see them. It's just they just show up. So that's that's been an added benefit to

Welcome to the Podcast Fast Class. Lesson three was episode ideas. Lesson four, we're talking about structuring your episodes. Organizing your show kind of happens naturally and helps set the listeners expectation part of a framing device anchoring whatever you want to call it. This is the point where you get to design your show. Here are some of the typical segments you'll find you have ads dynamically inserted or baked in, you typically see ads and three spots, then you have a hook. It's usually a soundbite or a question that's meant to intrigue people followed by the intro, you can think of this as like the title sequence for your favorite TV show, then you have your content really is the most important part that people are actually listening for. Then you have your plugs and your call to action, you've delivered some great content now send them somewhere, then you may have credits if you have a team helping you out. Then you have a bonus maybe a blooper or a sneak preview of the next episode, where you put these roadsigns truly depends on what kind of show you want to create. Remember that podcast playback is on demand. It can be paused, sped up scrubbed, skipped, skipped and downloaded by listeners. So what's your plan for structuring your show? Let us know and watch the slower video version of this in the APC members Facebook group link in the notes back to the show.

Let's dive into some podcasting then.

Let's do it.

do you have any favorite podcasts that you listen to personally?

Good question. I would say my favorite podcast longest running is Joe Rogan. And I know that's probably a very cliche answer.

But it's just the most popular

it is it is and it's just like his personality has grown on me. There are definitely parts of it are like yeah, I don't know if I would say that or do that or whatever. But like I like it. The variety is probably number one like tough, tough, tough. So listen to a podcast that's two to three sometimes four hours long and then get to the next one so like I try to cherry pick a little bit of people I like the most recently I listened to was Demi Lovato was on there that one was okay but I tried to listen to some people that are a little bit more maybe that I don't know a lot about or want to know more about she would fall into that category but there's been I mean obviously it's just like super relevant to in pop culture from Elon Musk to everyone else I'm omitting out of my brain of that he's had on that's been incredible. That's number one. And I dabble with like some barstool sports stuff here and there I I'm not really a huge like, I know I should I say I know I should like NPR like NPR type stuff for like really news heavy stuff would be great. I just don't make the time for it. I guess I get that information elsewhere.

Right. You're on Twitter. Yeah, exactly.

Like Twitter's Twitter's Twitter's the best. I love Twitter. Ah, besides that I don't really have I mean I listen to like, like I've listened to your podcast before listen to other people's in the APC but like I like to listen to like to hear what people say see the structure that I'm really like I'm in and like, part of me is like I create podcasts. So like, it's nice to like listen to what other people do and especially like the post production or the other elements to do but like I'm just so damn busy podcasts are easy to listen to. But like it's also like,

it's just one. It's a two hour show. Yeah, just to get through the whole commute

from a long trip are the best if I have to travel home to Stevens Point or down to Milwaukee or wherever else up to the cottage in Sturgeon Bay, like, boom, I know, I'm gonna crank out a long podcast at that point. So it's, that's a good time to find me doing that, for sure.

You fill that queue up for that long trip. Yep, absolutely. Get that. So you have sort of a variety of podcasts that you're a part of, can you tell the listeners what podcasts you're a part of a summary sentence of what they are? Yeah,

right now, for my normal nine to five for better performance marketing, I started a podcast for us about a year ago. It's called bear den. So just kind of plan words there, I guess, if you will. But it's basically I have a friend of mine who actually audio records, our blogs we put out every week. So we put out one blog a week, and he will just turn that into a podcast episode. And it's like three to six, seven minutes. He works a radio, he's done it for many, many years. That's part of it. It's just like a nother way to repurpose our written format. And then the second leg of that is like having people on the have small businesses or work in marketing or kind of check some of those boxes to talk about their story, their successes, their struggles. That's what bear den is pretty pretty self explanatory.

Yeah, I'm a sucker for a good pun. So

yeah, we were pretty good with that we just came out actually just launched. Today, depending when this comes out, we just launched our bare essentials angle of our content, which is a video focus tips more centralized to our personalities of what pockets of our business are into so mine more social media or podcast related, other colleagues or graphic design, digital marketing, etc, etc. So very cool, pretty fun. And then the two other ones, I'm a part of our packet, a podcast and game on Wisconsin. Now you can probably guess what those are about based on half of what's coming out of my mouth before it's about the Packers. Wow, I

thought it was about backgammon. No, no. So

someone actually did one say, David, they said, is it about? Is it about smoking cigarettes? And I'm like packet Oh, yeah, I

guess that. Like No, I'm pretty sure that was the original intent. Or humor of it.

Yeah. And it's Yeah, we took it took a different angle, it took a mind of its own. So just about the creep onto our 1000s episode, which is absolutely insane. like to thank you. Thank you, thank you, thank you to think of like, where it manifested from is a simple tweet that Andy Herman, people might know who that is put out was like, hey, looking for some people to do a Packers podcast with me wondering if there's two or three people that would DM me? Well, he had like, way more than two people. He's like, Well, I have so many quality, quote unquote, quality applicants that submitted like, we're gonna try to do a daily podcast and we've come out with a new episode every day for like 980 straight shows. So that's unreal. It is absolutely insane. Like the, you wanna talk about relationships like oh my gosh, like I've been recording with some people for almost three years now. I've met some really great people through that had numerous opportunities opened up to me because of just working at that craft and grinding through it and you know, whatever else so packet is awesome. And I know a lot of people that have been a part of that can say the same thing because there wouldn't be game on Wisconsin without packet a podcast to be honest. So game on Wisconsin is kind of a new thing. I'm getting into some friends of mine from packet a podcast, some other websites out there that are huge Packer fans like me, kind of came together this last year and put this together and it's been really really successful. I really have had zero part of it because I just started with them a month ago. I helped with our tournament of hate, which was fun. It was 64 seated personalities, players and coaches in a tournament style so Skip Bayless just won last night so that's that was good skip Skip Bayless versus I think it was Colin coward at the end which seemed very very obvious there were some late pushes by a couple of players but you know those those Talking Heads really piss off some Packer fan so they got that but

I get the the Joe buck hate from all of my friends they're like oh, and that

he didn't last I think he got upset in the first round I don't know if it was a tough 512 matchup or what but he he got stomped right away so and like anything it for him yeah yeah and we got laid

out for you the most hated no and not a bad thing

not a bad yeah Oh, so everything on game on Wisconsin's very unique like we're currently getting ready for the draft and my buddy Dan caught Nick to do packet it with does Tuesday draft day where they come up with like a category today was chocolate and he had himself three other people on to draft chocolate first pick through four picks. Spider back Can you get five selections and let the graphic decide on Twitter who does the best. So like those are just small pockets of stuff we do. There's a ton of really great writers we have, which I think is a huge asset. I'm not a huge blogger or like to read blogs, but I know in my marketing space, the knowledge that's important to grow your website, and it's essentially another extension of your website and it's another way people can find you. So that's huge. But yeah, a game on Wisconsin's a blast trying to create more of a niche there myself trying to fit it get in where I fit in. But it's been a it's been awesome and a lot of hard work and people are there. That's really my podcasting extent. I love coming on and talking podcasts or just connecting with people to have conversations. Certainly, it's just a part of my personality.

Yeah, that's awesome. There's a lot of a lot to unpack there. And so I want to I want to try and do that from a from a podcasting, the art of podcasting there. 1000 episodes. Some people are just happy with like 52 episodes a year, like if they can get a one a week that is high praise, but 1000 How is that logistically possible?

Great question. So I buried the lede a little bit, but that's okay. I don't do 1000 episodes. I do one every other week, or one once a week. Now, not to say that's not a huge feat, either.

No, that's still 52 episodes for you.

Correct. Lucky. We have again, shout out to Andy Herman. I don't know how he does it. Like he, we have a slack that's super helpful. He sets a schedule, you collaborate, you kind of just connect with who you need to connect with. I've been paired with Dan and Janelle now for like over a year before that Joe and I started together on our first episode together, but it's just a lot of communication, I think, too, is knowing when to do it. So like, we had a podcast coming out on Sunday, previewing some of the receivers in the NFL Draft class on I don't know, Thursday reached out to the guys, I'm like, Hey, I got a buddy, come on in town this weekend. We have some, you know, Saturday activities planned, it's gonna be beautiful in Green Bay, good drinking weather, like, Can we get this podcast done in the morning. So it's just like, you're coordinating this a couple days ahead of time. And then Saturday, you're connecting. And then usually, there's someone that will take the lead on the editing portion, and, you know, put that together, and then they send it to Andy before, I don't know, hopefully a reasonable time at night, depending on the date. I mean, again, there could be technical issues, there could be breaking news that happens and your podcast gets scrapped and thrown to the heap. And you might have not had time to re record so someone will fill in and like, there's a lot of behind the scenes that happened that has been able to grow this thing to almost the 1k mark. And it's just a lot of it's just like, not putting too much on everyone. But it's also knowing when we need to cut our losses, knowing when certain people just maybe we need to just tweak their their teammate, if you will. But it's been it's been a really, really huge success. And logistically, it's just everyone kind of finds their own way and the way they like to record or how they do it.

Did you get to choose your co hosts there, you sort of get a get to get sort of feel out the personality? No, so Andy's

I feel like he was a teacher at some point in my like a past life. He's like really smart. I feel like on how to pair people he's like very strategic with it. So he started me out with Janell, I think, based off of us living in Green Bay, which helped so we recorded in person actually, which was rare. At the time, no one else was doing that. Number two, I think I had a little bit more podcasting experience. When I joined there, I had my own podcasts at one time called in the fray like a it was kind of interviews with people I knew hip hop, music, sports, whatever, whatever. So I had some experience she had some to with in college, but yeah, I can it's it's just grew, I don't know, there's it's just kind of like it's kind of like an assignment. When you're in like, I don't know, class back in the day, like your partner with that person who's like, oh, shoot, I hope this person's good. Like I don't, I'm at a new school. I don't know what's going on. And luckily, she has been

is a little bit more traditional broadcast with the flexibility of the modern content creator. Exactly. Exactly. And he sets the programming schedule, and you guys get your content. And when you get your content, what does that look like for research? Are you out only in that slack for talking? Are you guys like sending audio messages? How do you do your research for a show?

Good point. Good point. So most shows mind you from late August, not even that like most shows, you kind of know what's going to happen. So if it's from if it's a couple days before week, one in early September through potentially the day after the Superbowl like you know, pretty much what you're going to talk about like either right, you're previewing a matchup you're recapping a matchup, you're talking about an injury. You're talking about some recent news that came while you're talking about this. Yeah, like it's, there's so much meat on the bone. It's like almost too easy. Now in the offseason, he'll set it a little bit different when we're talking draft or whatever. But like the way we communicate is like everyone's got their own style like Twitter DMS are awesome. Like Twitter's Twitter's the goat of Twitter of social media, in my opinion, but like Twitter, DMS, I have a lot of DMS that I'll just go scroll through, like, holy cow. I'm like, I was messaging this person how many months ago and like, oh, wow, I did that then like, it's like I'm scrolling through right now. Like, it's nuts. So that's, that's how I communicate, I think we have a text chat between the three of us to unfortunately danza an Android user. So we don't have the privilege of a nice iMessage situation. But you know, we just we just that you just adapt, you just gotta you gotta figure it out. But everyone has their own style. And I think some PrEP is good. Too much PrEP is terrible. But if you want to throw out a statistic or something like if I would have known you're going to throw those those goats at me, I would have came up with some real estate school analysis, but it didn't. And there's just that's just what it is. It's off the cuff and you got to be able to think on your feet a little bit. And sometimes you got to pull up the the Safari browser on your iPhone and Google something real quick before you're gonna

get to talk about it, and help your co host can fill that space. Exactly. That's very important to fake. And that takes a while to figure out that's just repetition. What would be your tips for a new podcaster of like, doing research for the content? You said he do a little bit Twitter conversations, it seems like

or just reading? Yeah, I absorb a ton of content from Twitter, not even just like conversations I have with like, the people I do a podcast with or like, even in our group of people on hackaday. Like, it's just like constantly taking in information. I think you have to be have a foundation of what you're wanting to talk about too. So like I wouldn't, by no stretch of the imagination. Perfect example, start a hockey podcast. Like, I know, the bare minimum of hockey, like I barely know what offsides is, like I can I I've figured it out. But like there's I don't know enough. And like that would just be painful, it would be like taking a test, I don't want to do that. Like, I just want to turn on a microphone and have at least one or maybe one and a half good points and be maybe somewhat entertaining that someone would even consider listening to me talk about something and that's it. So you need to be knowledgeable, you need to try to be credible, you need to lean into a joke if you're trying to and again, there's no visual like it's you need to be emphatic with your voice or you need to, you know, prioritize certain words to say in the right order. So it's it's, you just got to kind of work through it. It's just like anything, it takes repetition, but be knowledgeable. I think that's big. You can have a couple notes notes aren't bad. A couple points to get to. But definitely don't script your entire situation scripting in the intro, maybe an outro is not a bad idea. If you have some ad reads in there, always make sure you're polish on that

know how you transition. Yeah, that's that's a huge thing. And that can get you can get long winded. You know, NPR has their auto scripted podcast, but those are like journalists who love writing and do it. And we're podcasters we're passionate about really unique things. And we just want to talk about those unique things. We don't need that that scripted thing. You sort of answered this, but I kind of want to answer in its own little section, how would you choose the subject matter for what you would do a podcast about,

you have to have a baseline knowledge, but you also want to be like somewhat, I want to like immerse yourself into that topic. Like, I thought I knew the Packers pretty darn well. And I've learned an absolute crap ton more. And it could be but you have to figure out how you're going to find that content though. Right? Like, if you're like, Okay, I'm just gonna read blogs from this website. Okay, that's not a bad idea. I'm gonna just read every book, I can, oh, that's gonna take a lot of time. And some of that information is obsolete because that's a book. It's kind of like you're going to you're you're going to high school and it's the first day of school and you get there and there's like nothing in there like what you're like, What am I supposed to do? They're like, you get to pick and you're like I get to pick like that's, that's new. So you just pick something you really really like and of course you're just gonna run with it and even get more into it and enjoy it and talk about it more and you'll find you'll keep peeling back layers of and you won't even really realize it

Are you sick of Packers now?

No I get I get sick of like the get sick of like the same old hot takes or the same old like content not even like from like national media or even local media beat writers but it's like the disgruntled fan like I am a disgruntled fan once in a while like but like dude but let's put it let's put it the rest about like the Kevin King TJ watt selection a couple years ago, let's put it the rest on certain stuff. Like let's just, we're gonna bury a hatchet but like, that's not sports. And that's 100% not Green Bay Packer fan so you kind of just kind of live with it and trolling is fun once in a while with a good, the good. Good thing on Twitter that usually gets me going a good meme. Yep.

Always good for that. One of the biggest parts and you sort of talked about this with the game on and I'm sure I see you guys do with Pac a day is being involved with your community? How do you connect with your your listeners, um,

Twitter 100% keep referencing that. I also, this is a weird way I go about it. But like, a lot of people I know, in real life, don't listen to my podcast, I'm sure some do. Some don't. They just pick and choose right. But I use them. If they have an interest in the Packers as a sounding board, it's easy to have conversations with them back and forth. Especially if you're just like, like, I'm sitting around a fire and buddy of mines over or even someone that really isn't a Packers fan. Like they're kind of like an NFL fan. They'll ask me questions now. And I'll be able to tell them and I can like sift through my thoughts and like, I guess it is really what I feel about that or like maybe they'll have a different perspective, that's like, super high level or super low hanging I didn't even think of because wherever their interest level is, or their knowledge or understanding of the game, or the packers are so that I think that's important to get a different perspective and different feedback. Because like, I might, might bring up a little nugget that I might definitely give credit to depending who it is on the podcast, okay, my so and so thought of the other day or like it just a different idea. And I think too, it's like, I'm always willing to interact with anyone, whatever is it like, as long as you're like coming with like, some facts or something that not even like super hard data, just like if you have a real if you have an opinion about something, and that could be anything really in life, like just come with, respectable and somewhat like even keeled. And like we can have a dialogue all day through the Twitter DMS when I have time and we go back and forth or like go back, like it doesn't matter to me like I'm, I'm open to that. So yeah. Really, anyway, you're gonna come just don't come like a jerk. And we're all good.

Yeah, that's true game on ampac. They both do like things to get people involved on social media and stuff. How is that beneficial for a podcaster to grow their audience?

It's almost one of like, the most important things to me. Because it's very simple to record a podcast now, like, it's not that hard. It's very, very simple if you just research it, because Google's a thing. And you can just like figure out, you could do it within a couple days, really, the quality might not be up to suffice if you can't get an Amazon microphone or wherever else. But like, anyone can have a podcast. So just because you have a podcast doesn't mean we're gonna listen to it, you have to pump it out to the masses. I think creating snort, snort short snippets of the audio and putting it into some sort of wave graphic or motion is great having some sort of video component where people can click and kind of tease it. And then make sure it's accessible everywhere. I'm a huge Apple person, I have an iPhone, I have a MacBook Air. But like not everyone has Apple podcast mat, like it's paid for that. Like you could use Spotify and like whatever what else so like, as long as you're checking like the three Tommy's like Google podcasts, Spotify, and Apple, I think those are huge. And wherever else you get your podcasts as long as you have that type of jargon in there as big, making it easy for people to like, make sure you're hyperlinking it like people are lazy as hell just because they see a Twitter like, they see a tweet of like, Hey, listen to my new episode today for packet a and I even add them Wow, good job. Like, it's still like, people are lazy. Like they don't want to have to switch and click and even sometimes then if it doesn't load fast enough, like we're just we all have ADD It's terrible. Like but again, figure it out. So you got to make it easy for people.

Yeah, so you're on your marketing your I am

on my marketing soapbox. Other ways I've done it to grow mine. Like I had like a group of like 20 buddies. At one point. I was just sending the link in there and a text message when I would do my episode. Some grassroots kind of Yeah, you wanna talk real grassroots here, David. This is like, this is like family functions. I put my cottage where I'm like talking to someone. And they're like, I'd really like to listen, like Give me your phone. Like what? Like, give me your phone. And like, I'll walk them through to like, all right, do you Spotify or Apple? Apple, my great. Where's your podcast app? And I'm like, I set it up. I'm like, Okay, see that purple thing on your home screen, you're going to tap that you're going to tap that every day. And like every day, every day, every day, like there's like discipline in like, so it's just like, make sure you're subscribed on here too. So it's like, I'm literally like, I've done that for I don't even know how many people like I'm just like, give me your damn phone. We're gonna figure this out together. If you don't listen, you know, listen, but the subscription goes a long way.

Well now what you can do is you can add the podcast widget and It'll show the latest episode right there. You don't even have to click in. So that's a good idea. A few future opportunities. Absolutely. Now, another thing that I like you mentioned with the came on was that your bracket of hate lists what how is like those things great for building engagement,

because it's super off topic like it's, it's relevant because March Madness was going on. People love brackets, people love to express their opinion. And it's kind of like, you're just combining two aspects of entertainment. People have opinions, people have emotion, especially people that hate or love and just kind of lean into that. So make it accessible to people too. We went through a couple of weeks of figuring out the best way to do it. We wanted to stretch the content to last a few weeks throughout the tournament. We could have done a Twitter poll and just had it running there. But we really had a strategy behind it. We said we want to get people to the website. website views, get advertisements, people find other stuff on there. Oh, you guys sell merch? Cool. Oh, you do these videos? Awesome. Oh, I didn't know this person did a blog and they get there. And they're there. They're clicking around because they're curious. So that was the first thing I was like, how do you do that? Like, we have the idea? How do we execute it. So I think we ended up using Google Forms, embedded that and updated that every couple days. And once it would update, we'd put that out on all of our social platforms, people to go vote. And to be honest, like the first week, it exceeded my expectations, many people would vote, I was blown away. And it's been successful. But you really got

to get creative with like the there. I love that about podcasting and content creation in general is that like, the door is open. It's not traditional TV ads, or anything like that, get creative with how you're engaging with your listeners, and go to what they want to do like the bracket, it's perfectly seasonal thing that's happening, and you're just sort of tweaking it to get people to engage with your website and sort of see everything else that you guys are doing. Absolutely. People want to start a podcast or like, I just want to put my voice out there. Why is it important to sort of cover all your bases, from social media, to a website to everywhere else,

because people aren't gonna find you otherwise, it's gonna affect your ego really, like you're gonna be like, I'm putting in so much time to do this, and I'm not getting any results. No one even knows I'm doing this. You can see the analytics, she's like, no one's I'm getting nothing like. So find something like whether it's just like just the Facebook page or just your own personal Facebook, you just share the link like that, at least that's something, it can be overwhelming, because there are so many different ways to put out content, you want to check all the boxes, and then have a something like Tic Tac comes around or something like clubhouse or something like Twitter spaces or whatever else you're like, ah, that'd be perfect. My podcasts, I could promote it that way. And then you get distracted. Like, oh, I already had this twitch channel on Snapchat and all this stuff. And these are font like so you just kind of got to like focus and then grow from there. People will kind of tell you, like, you'll you'll know, like, you'll know, you'll just know where people are seeing your stuff most of the time. Like, which gets more interaction where people say they see stuff, but yeah,

same as to be with you. It's Twitter. Yeah, like you lean into that wholeheartedly. So 100%. But how long did it take you to sort of figure out that Twitter was this place? A lot longer than

it should have? I didn't I was like, Dude, this is so ridiculous. This was I was on a, I had my own radio show in college. And I went on some like weird, it was like the start of the show or whatever, whatever. And someone was like messaging me I think via like Facebook Messenger at the time. That's how to interact with some people on that when they would when they call in. And someone was saying like, you should get Twitter and this is 2011. I'm like, I will never get a Twitter. I will not get a Twitter. It was so dumb. If I could somehow go through and find that archive. I can't because it's not there anymore. It's completely gone in the abyss. But no, it took me a long time. I would probably say it took me up until maybe five, six years ago that was like, oh, Twitter's the spot. So it

takes time to sort of figure out where things are not only in your subject matter, but also with how you're connecting with those with those listeners. Yeah, absolutely. Pulling back to more general, what advice would you give to anyone wanting to start a podcast?

No, it's gonna be tough. It's not really that easy. It's very diluted at this point. prepare, prepare, prepare, put some episodes in your back pocket for a rainy day, when you know you're going to miss a week, maybe two weeks, whatever it is that you can throw that piece of content out, make it relevant. Ideally, you'd have a couple in your repertoire that you're kind of pushing out so maybe as in this is all all ideal, idealistic perfectionist mentality. I know this isn't real for most people, but like, start promoting it a few months ahead of time. Start recording them a few months ahead of time and start rolling them out one by one. And use your time wisely. If you need to record two or three at a crack in one sitting, which can be a lot exhausting. Do that, and then edit them throughout the week, and then you have some built up for almost the entire month, I think it's just a matter of using your time correctly. Don't get frustrated with no listeners, to listeners, like, just embrace it, and try to collaborate with other people if you want. And then just try to play the best you can use Google as your friend and then just go. Once you go, like, you're gonna probably look back just like many things, you're like, oh, that was really dumb. But now I'm doing it this way. And like you just learn from it. So there's never a perfect time. But having at least the foundation of a thought process I think is huge.

Yeah. So final question, to play off what you just said. Like, there's gonna be times where you look back and like, Well, look, I was doing this last last year and look at what I'm doing now. How have you grown as a person since you started podcasting?

I feel like I've become a better conversationalist. I think I've always had a passion to like, talk and learn more and talk to people. And I think that's, that's part of why I do what I do just in many aspects of life. But better listener a better try. hasn't worked yet. But try to be a little bit more thoughtful before I say stuff sometimes in conversation. Still haven't fully reached that point. But we'll get there.

You're in broadcast, you got to get a little bit of attention. That's what I mean. That's what I mean. But I mean, you said earlier, like at our first half you are you're interested in people's story. Yeah. And like so it took you a lot of growth and being a part of podcasting has helped you to, to listen and discuss more with people because you're doing that every single week.

Yeah, yeah. Yeah, absolutely. in more ways than one, two. So it's, that's a good, it's a good way to do that. And it's a good way to channel energy or your creativity into one little project. And you can grow that and massage that how you wish but it gets those. It's like, it's like going to the gym and like getting a good sweat. It's like, Okay, I need I need to talk Packers today. I just got to get it out and like, do it and like, Alright, I probably won't talk about it any more than the night and if I do, don't blame me.

A Well, thank you so much for being on the podcast. Matt. I appreciate your time.

Yeah, David. Thanks for having me on as well, man.

And that's the game folks. Matt Freolich. Go follow Matt on Twitter. Follow all the podcasts. He's a part of unpacking a game on Wisconsin. He's also streaming Madden regularly on Twitch. So go check him out. We got links in the show notes to make it easy for all of us incredibly lazy people. As Matt says, next week, I'm dropping my favorite packet a podcast episode in the feed for Matt and his co host recap the Packers versus the jets that preseason game from this upcoming weekend. Like Matt said podcasting takes work, you gotta have some people on your sidelines to keep going. So head on over to Appleton Podcast Co-op comm for community support resources and possibly win some free gear with the Podcast Fast Class. If you know someone else in Northeast Wisconsin who wants to start a podcast or is already in the process of starting a podcast share this show with them. If you've made it this far, please rate and review the show on pod chaser. It really does help our visibility. You can also write your review on a football and throw it as far as you can in any direction. I sincerely hope that you have the strength of Aaron Rodgers. I'm David Kalsow. Your neighborly podcast nerd. Thank you for listening.

I didn't really know how I was using my Twitter when I started it was like in Twitter's evolved obviously but like I've definitely gone through and like cleaned out a lot of dumps. I said back in the day, so that was good. Some bad Packers take some bad verbiage I was using. So it's like, that's smart to clean that up. But like because I never knew I didn't have somewhat of a in my opinion. Like I've never think I'd have these many followers or this much content I'd be putting out.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai