Tom van der Lubbe is a co-founder of Dutch financial services firm Viisi, which was set up using self-organising principles.

I read his Corporate Rebels blog It's About Solidarity, Stupid (Why Avoiding Layoffs Makes Sense) and was delighted to be able to record this conversation for the 21st Century Leadership podcast.

Tom shares his ideas and thinking, and explains why he doesn't consider it to be a provocative approach.

You can read Tom's Corporate Rebels post here.

And here's a link to the Viisi organisation chart we refer to in the discussion.