Dave Brown, speaker, author, and Founding Partner of Southwestern Consulting, talks about beating "call reluctance", how one call a month can lead to huge rewards, how your parents may have made you a bad salesman, scarcity vs. abundance, what Michael Jordan can teach us about persistence, and why not to let thinking dictate action; ACT your way into healthy thinking.

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This episode is brought to you by Southwestern Coaching.

Southwestern Coaching

Mark Cuban once said that you do not have a business until there is first a sale. Every

business starts with sales. It revolves around sales. That is what we are talking about today.

Specifically though, we are talking about prospecting. And the guests that we have brought

in is Dave Brown, in my opinion, the master in the world at prospecting, and he is definitely the

leading trainer, coach, consultant speaker on helping salespeople and small business owners to

overcome call reluctance and so that's what we're gonna tackle. It's his first time on the show,

Dave, welcome to the show.

Yes, sir. I'm here. I'm here.

First of all, let's talk about call reluctance. Can you sort of like define what call

reluctance is what does it look like? And how does it show up

So let's take it from the standard sales piece because that's where most people would

say that exists the most and then we'll go at it you know, on the personal side, but simple with

salespeople. I mean, if you've been in sales for 15 minutes or 15 years, you know what it is it's

that fear it's that reluctance you have that that that pause that procrastination that comes up when

you don't know what's on the other side of the door when you don't know what's on the other side

of the phone when you don't know what's on the other side of the conversation. It literally

paralyzes you. It's the biggest saboteur. You know, procrastination being call reluctance is the

biggest limiting belief and concept that keeps salespeople away from hitting their goals,

achieving their dreams, getting what they want to get out of their life and having a fulfilled life

and in all areas and others. So let's talk about people now. Like let's actually talk about

something like personal life. I mean, I got a really cool story coming from one of my contacts

out here in Nashville, her call reluctance would be the conversations that she's going to have with

her kids, she doesn't want to I mean, just putting stuff off during the day that she knows she needs

to get done. But she doesn't have like an optimal schedule, so to say to put them in, and before

that long, everything just keeps piling up in her life. So it's like, Oh, my God, and then she just

throws her hands up in the air and really lends to this stress. And you know, never do anything right

then that self doubt crap creeps in that we all deal with. So it's everywhere. It's in every

conversation whenever you don't have a conversation with somebody you're arguing with. I

mean, come on, how much is conflict come up in every one of our lives in relationship business personal.

So what are some of the things that we can do in terms of overcoming this call reluctance?

Focus on the rejection piece of it, I guess, one thing that I loved was whenever I did

get rejected in sales, and this has actually become something I've put into my life, focus on

the nose as being a positive thing. And like actually saying positive things about when you do

get rejected, because that's what we're afraid of. Right. That's why we don't have the conversation.

That's why we don't want to, you know, make that move in our business talk. We don't want to make

that call, you know, for entrepreneurs or business owners, it's like, gosh, should I go down this

road and put all my chips in here, it's, it's just fear, it's coming back to that. But if you can

learn how to on the other side of it, you know, there, there needs to be someone else there.

That's one of the reasons why we're hesitating and actually doing it. If you could just make it a

good thing and just learn how to say positive things about rejection. Thank you so much for

putting me in that place to house that negativity, they're not going to take that out on their family

or their friends, they can give it to me, because I'm strong enough to handle it. But you know, the

people around them may not be so thank you so much for putting me in the way being able to intersect

that. So yeah, there's just stuff like that. And it's it goes to this day, too. I get rejected all

the time, you know, just the car dealership today. And that was the car dealership that I was at was

actually a referral from somebody that told me no.

So you're approaching somebody, they shut you down. So you're asking for referrals from

people who tell you no.

Absolutely, gosh, I gotta get something out of there. Right? No, yes, it was

referrals. Ask anybody that is everybody whether you get rejected or not for someone else to talk to.

So let's talk about referrals for a second, is cold calling dead? Or what do you like? What do

you think about that?

I mean, how else are you going to practice getting good at peddling rejection?

Right? Is it dead? No, I don't think it is. And I don't think you should just leave, you know,

promote your life to just be cold calling either. It's got to be both. And naturally, it's referrals

are a whole lot more easy to work and more enjoyable, so to say. But there are massive,

massive opportunities that are out there for us if we just reach out. And yeah, is it cold? Yeah, but

I guarantee you've served other people the same way that you want to serve this company that

you're calling on. So it's not really that cold if you just tell them how you worked with this

person, or this business or how you handle this situation, and you pull that from your great

experience and put that on the table as you're calling somebody coldly quote unquote, that you

don't have any momentum with their name to use with or someone didn't refer you over to, you're

gonna be fine but you got sprinkle a little bit of that those of you that are in the sales piece,

sprinkle a little bit of it into your lives, because it's not always going to fall in your lap

that the big opportunities, the the massive accounts, if you just put a call into them once a

month, if you just hit a once a month and say you did it for five years, then you will have called

on that company 60 times in five years, I promise you that is showing that person that you're

calling on or that business you're calling on that you actually care about them. And if you're gonna

call 60 times, my gosh, what kind of work are they going to do for us if they're gonna fight this

hard for us. So it becomes warmer, the more that you do it, and the more comfortable you get. And

it also conquers that giant right up front. So sprinkle a little bit of it in naturally all want

to work referrals, but you got to do a little bit of it.

You're demonstrating how hard you are willing to work for that business. Even if they

never talked to you, you're communicating that you're a hard worker, and that you don't have fear

and that you're willing to do whatever it takes.

I appreciate you making me live out the important principles of persistence in our

trade. It feels, I'm literally saying this I go, it feels good to get told no over and over again.

Sometimes I'm not hearing it enough lately. You're awesome. And thank you for the rejection. Keep

trying. Don't stop.

Now let's let's back up here a little bit and talk about actually getting yourself to make

that call. Aren't you scared? Aren't you worried about what they're going to say?

All you're doing is you're just asking all that I'm doing is just asking for their time.

I'm just asking if I can come out and see them. I'm just asking for 15 minutes. Like, I love that

that little piece of my mind got fried a long time ago, when I was young about don't ask we get so

ingrained? Don't Don't ask or, or stop asking, you know, and it's like, I mean, think about your

parents, they will do put this into us we'd ask for that candy bar at the grocery store 30 times,

right? Can I please have a candy bar this time, please have a candy bar this time. And if you ask

one more time, you're going to get in trouble. And it's like, yeah, sure. I don't know what my kids

asking me for that candy bar over and over again in the store. But why not? At least cultivate that

that type of asking like, thank you so much for asking. It's not going to happen this time. But

don't ever forget to keep asking because it's like, I've done some research on this. And it

blows me away why people say they don't want to ask for the stuff that they want in their life.

And if you're in sales, or if you're, you know, running a family or running a business, you have

to ask for what you want, or you're not going to get what you want in anything. And that's all

sales is just asking. So I'm just asking over and over again, if you don't do that. And the reason

why people don't do that is they don't they don't feel like they deserve what they want in their

life. And it's ridiculous. Because they do they do and I know that's a tough word. And some people

have a problem with oh, I don't deserve anything. But it's like, ask, ask for what you want. were

incredible. were amazing beings that live in the best culture that has had the most opportunity

ever in history. But you're gonna limit yourself by not asking for what you can see and what you

want. And that's the only way this world was ever changed. So just yeah, a lot there. Man. A lot of

big stuff there.

Now, you mentioned kids, I think kids our kids are the bit I mean, they're the best

salespeople of all time pleasantly persistent. I mean, kids are like, I mean, they're the masters.

I mean, they're the masters at that they they smile and keep coming back and keep asking now

what if somebody tells you no. Are you saying like, if they tell you no, you just keep asking

that same person or you saying just ask everybody until they finally tell you yes or no and then

move on.

Yeah, but then ask later. You know, always leave it open. Like ask ask everybody

everything until if they tell you no, that's okay. You're gonna get referred back into them.

Something's gonna come up where your lives intersect again, or something's gonna go on and

then you can just ask again later, you're gonna come with some baggage of them telling you no

before, you know, sure. But I just say ask later, man, whenever somebody tells me No, I'm not

hearing a No, what I actually hear is them telling me how can you be more creative? Dave? How can you

be more creative? It's not no, it's how you can be more creative and sure some of you might be

listened to going oh, God, I would hate it if you were calling on me or you know, trying to get a

hold of me but really, like my heart's in the right place. And we do a great thing and so many

of you on this phone that that's listening to this that is listening to this podcast, you do a great

thing but you don't give enough people an opportunity to participate in it's like you you

miss all of the shots you don't take Why was Michael Jordan a phenomenal basketball player and

do this and in finished the game and have all these game winning shots? It's not because it just

naturally came to him. He messed up a lot and he screwed up a lot. And he asked a lot of people he

asked a lot of that basket he asked a lot of his body by taking all those shots so you just got to

keep asking just keep after it. It's not a No it's just how can you be more creative?

Are there any other strategies you have for dealing with no other than maybe be more creative?

I set goals on how many noes I can get in a certain amount of time. It's not a goal of

yeses. It's how many noes can I get and some of you probably heard this concept before of having

like a no goal or something but how many you actually done it. It makes it fun. It makes it

more interesting. So set a goal for yourself to get knows, and then you get to be excited about it

because you're achieving your goal whenever they come and then prepare man, it's so much easier to

get knows when you have an abundance of people to call on. And the only way to have a lot of people

to call on and a lot of conversation to have is actually prepare for it, if you're gonna make

calls, if you're gonna go knock on some doors for, you know, four hours, three hours, you're probably

going to need about 50 people on that list. And if you just keep going down the list, and you're not

letting you just all you're doing is just calling that list, that's all you're doing. You're just

calling people and asking to meet with them, you're just calling people and ask, asking them to

listen to you, when you have two or three people on that list. It's like, I'm sitting under the

basket to use the analogy of Michael Jordan, I'm sitting under the basket and just throwing the

ball up at the rim, you know, very close to the rim. But if you've only got three names that

you're trying to call on, you're trying to just everything in your business that that's all man,

they're gonna be amazing, then, of course, you've got a scarcity mentality. Of course, it's like

you're standing all the way at the other end of the court trying to throw the ball at the rim. Of

course, you're not going to be successful, you could you could get kind of lucky and catch that

set person for that day, but have an abundance mentality, there's so much out there, I promise

you, none of you that are listening have tapped into not I bet you not even 5% of your potential

market for what you're doing in this in this great country in the world. My gosh, you let scarcity

in. It's all wrong. So abundance versus scarcity, for sure. And then maybe setting, making some fun

playing a game, having having a goal to get a certain amount of nose in a certain amount of

time, I would say there's be some mental parts.

So if somebody is listening right now, and they know they need to be asking more, but they're

feeling fear, what is kind of the first thing that you would tell them to do? Or what action would

you say do this, do this immediately to sort of help them get over that hurdle.

And that could be it's so much could be fear there, there could be self doubt there

could be discussed with their current situation, there could be so much that it's holding them

back. So this is not a light thing, what I would say is, let your legs or your hands or something

else do the thinking. If you sit on the couch, or if you sit at your desk and you're thinking about

going and working out, you're probably not going to do it, you're probably going to end up you

know, doing dinner and then just watching the game or something afterwards. But if you actually

physically go walk and get in the car, and you drive to the front of the gym, your chances go, I

don't know, I've never driven to the gym and and driven home and not actually got out of my car and

gone to the gym. So realize that your mind all it's doing is trying to keep you safe and keep you

not stretching yourself and not doing anything out of the ordinary and just keeping you average.

That's why the word average exists is because our mind wants to keep us there and it's constant

locking us down. So let your legs do the thinking. Those of you that are in sales, pick up the phone,

dial the phone, and then just let things happen. Sure, you might end up paying it up before they

pick up. But then I would say just dial it again, don't let the you're thinking dictate what you're

doing. You need to act your way into healthy thinking. That's what I would say those

conversations that you are avoiding first of all, they're they're not ruining your life, but they

really are having having to bury on they I mean it could be holding untapped potential in you say you

don't even know exists. So I would say go to that person, like go to your kid or your brother or

your sister or friend that you haven't talked to in a long time or your parents that you've got

stuff you're holding on to like, go go call them actually leave a message on their voicemail. Don't

let your mind dictate what the outcomes going to be. We don't know what the outcome is. I mean,

come on. That's what makes great movies, right? That was makes great conversations. You have no

idea what's coming, all you're going to predict is negative things. Our mind is only going to predict

negative things. If you're like me, which maybe you are maybe you're not, but that's all my mind

does. So I've got to convince him otherwise with my actions. So I constantly am acting my way into

healthier thinking, let my legs my hands do the thinking, letting you know just the world play out

by actually doing it that that's that's what I would say, man.

You're the epitome of a practitioner of somebody who's actually doing this. Thanks for