Shownotes
We're all about diving deep into the hiring game. We're here to arm you with all the tips and tricks for acing those interviews. We're big on prepping meticulously and honing in on those behavioral and situational questions that get to the core of a candidate's skills.
Ever heard of the STAR method? We're all about it. It's our go-to for figuring out how candidates handle real-world situations. Plus, we're big fans of job benchmarking. It helps us keep things fair and square by crafting consistent interview questions. And remember those behavioral assessments! They're key to understanding how someone communicates and their soft skills.
Now, let's talk references and social media. They're goldmines for getting a full picture of a candidate's true personality, especially in today's world where personal and professional lives often overlap.
When it comes to making that job offer, we're all about detail. We list all the perks, both tangible and intangible, so there's no confusion about what's on the table.
And once you've got that dream team member on board, it's all about the onboarding process. We're big believers in welcome packages and structured plans to get them settled in smoothly. But it doesn't stop there—we stress the importance of ongoing coaching and support to set them up for long-term success and keep them sticking around for the long haul.
At the end of the day, our goal is to help employers create an environment where their employees can truly thrive for years to come.
Highlights:
-The importance of job benchmarking is thoroughly discussed, with a focus on both behavioral and financial elements. The process is described as multi-faceted and time-consuming, engaging key decision-makers within the company for alignment and accountability.
-We go into the nuances of sourcing talent and the pitfalls of common assumptions about where to find the right candidates, championing the use of specialized recruiting firms for high-caliber roles.
-The conversation delves into the STAR method for interviewing candidates and the significance of conducting behavioral assessments to understand a candidate's communication style, motivators, and soft skills. These assessments help align a candidate's behaviors with the job benchmark to identify the best fit for the company's culture and the specific role.
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Transcripts
Welcome to Blue Collar B's, a podcast that busts the popular myth that we can't find good people, highlighting how the different generations of today, the boomers, Gen X, millennials and Gen Z, are redefining work so that the industrial revolution that started in the US stays in the US.
Steven Doyle [:Hey everyone. Welcome back to another episode of Blue Collar B's with your host, Brad and Steve. Oh, you actually remembered your name today.
Brad Herda [:I did. It's so Gen Alpha of me.
Steven Doyle [:We haven't gotten to the gen alpha of this conversation yet. And that is going to be a whole different hiring world, which brings in our transition. For today's topic, Mister Doyle, it's the hiring process. It is early April, spring is in the air. Contractors are busier and shit and they're going, oh, we don't have any people, we have to go hire everybody.
Brad Herda [:That's right.
Steven Doyle [:We both work with our clients in finding opportunities to create a higher success rate for them.
Brad Herda [:Right.
Steven Doyle [:They don't always listen because they know better and they've already. Well, we don't do it that way. Yeah. And how's that working out for you?
Brad Herda [:Yep.
Steven Doyle [:Try something different. And we talked before the show kind of going through what is, what are the steps to make a good hiring process and practice versus hiring out of fear that I just need a body here tomorrow and hope it all works out. So what are you using with your clients or do with your clients to support them in that journey?
Brad Herda [:Yeah. So in our practice, what we're actually working on, we call it the hiring hero for construction. And the number one thing that we, that we do in the process itself is really the identification of what is the job role slash job description. So we kind of do a needs analysis first, along with creating somebody to show up. Yep. Yep. Don't we all? Don't we all need somebody to show up? But what do you want them to do? What are they held accountable for?
Steven Doyle [:Well, they just need to be here, Steve. They just need to be here and do things. They just need to be and get things done. They just need to go to the job site and get things done. What's the problem with that?
Brad Herda [:What specifically do you want them to do?
Steven Doyle [:Well, just show up and get things done, Steve.
Brad Herda [:Just show up. What time do they got to show up?
Steven Doyle [:Well, lately, just when they decide to get there versus, you know, butt crack a dawn.
Brad Herda [:All right, right. And, uh, how do they need to show up? They just need to be there. Just, just crawl, walk, uber, whatever. Right.
Steven Doyle [:Shorts, t shirt, flip flops. That's good.
Brad Herda [:Okay. All right. Okay. Okay. And then, uh, you know, because we see it all the time. How. How are they. How do they know what, you know, success actually looks like? Like, for them? Like, hey, did I actually do a good job, boss? Huh? Did I?
Steven Doyle [:Well, you're talking. You're yelling at me all day, so that's why we've. Because my super is an asshole.
Brad Herda [:Don't be a dumbass.
Steven Doyle [:Exactly. So we digress and joke a little bit, but I'm sure you have all, anybody listening to the show who's been in the construction world has seen that, been there, done that in some way, shape or form. Our guest a few weeks ago, Matt Vetter, you know, he's doing very great diligence to take that out of his business. But it's a journey. It's a, it's a long cleansing to move this titanic down a different direction. And it starts with each owner and each leader of each organization to be better so that we can attract and retain. So you got your hero, you got your job description. What do you guys put in your job descriptions? What makes a good job description?
Brad Herda [:Honestly, we want to know what and how somebody is being measured for success. So it's not like, hey, I want you to, you know, literally, I want you to show up every day between seven and three, and I want you to have a positive attitude and all that and all of that stuff, because that's kind of like a quote unquote, given. But we actually, for the better job descriptions, we actually identify what success looks like and what employees are going to be measured against per that job role.
Steven Doyle [:And is that going into your job description, or is it a separate document outside of the job description?
Brad Herda [:No, it goes right in the job.
Steven Doyle [:Description because I've seen it done both ways.
Brad Herda [:Yeah, that part goes right into the job description. Why? Because we want everything in one area. But, but again, we're writing jobs. We're writing job descriptions for roles. We're not writing job descriptions for people. So there's a very clear delineation on are we hiring people to do work or are we hiring for the role that we have within, you know, for. Define, you know, something defined. Now, we always do a.
Brad Herda [:There's always a catch all in, in the job descriptions. Like, hey, there's. This isn't necessarily everything as other duties assigned. Right? Yeah. Like, there's going to be some other things that you may have to do, but here are the key accountabilities that you are going to be held accountable for.
Steven Doyle [:So, example, would you have in there. If you've got a framer that you're hiring, that, would the job description contain no more than 4% scrap lumber from framing of this job? If that was a area of concern, it could be.
Brad Herda [:Not saying it can't, but would that be.
Steven Doyle [:Would that be something that would go in your job description, or would you keep that offside to be measuring on something else as part of your other.
Brad Herda [:Metrics for the work that we do with our clients? We would put it right in the job description, because that translates to any framer that comes in and they're held accountable to that. Versus if I have a separate document, did I send that document? Was that document actually sent? Was that document provided? How do I know that they actually read that? Right. So I have it. We have it set up. So it's one document, and the last page of the document is an actual signed copy, dated and copied. Like, hey, yes, I understand the requirements and what I'm being held accountable for, for this role. Here's the date. Here's the hiring manager signing off on it so that we know that everything is in one document.
Brad Herda [:Because, you know, like you've mentioned, you've seen it done both ways. Where I have seen it, everybody get burned is I wasn't told I needed to do this. I wasn't told I was being held accountable for it. I never received a copy of it. You never sent that to me. I wasn't told that in a job interview. And here we are six months later, having arguments about what roles and responsibilities are because I wasn't told that.
Steven Doyle [:Okay, I can. I can accept that. Let's.
Brad Herda [:Let's see it both ways.
Steven Doyle [:As long as you have. As long as you have a ability to create variation within your role between, you know, the guy that's coming in at 22 versus the guy coming in at 40, long as that role has variations. So you're building out your. So you might have Framer one, Framer two, framer three as a job description versus a general framing job description, and then the one, two, and three on the outside from the expectation.
Brad Herda [:Yeah. So before we get into actually, you know, the job description, we're talking about needs analysis, and we're actually creating, you know, succession plans within an organization. Like, what does that actually look like? So that's for a whole nother show, right? For, you know, how do we actually structure growth in an organization for an individual? Like, if you're in an individual trade and you want to grow within a company, and, hey, how do I actually grow from coming in as a framer and then, hey, you know, in x amount of years, I want to be a project manager. Okay, well, that's a career path. That's a whole separate conversation that we'll have. But today we just want to focus on, hey, do we actually have agreement in alignment with the job description? And the other key aspect with the job description and the reason why we focus on roles in the job description is that alignment piece across the company. Does everybody agree in the company that needs to have agreement? Do we all agree on what the roles that this person is going to be held accountable to? Because we've written job descriptions, we've had clients write their own job descriptions, and there is not alignment on what actually needs to be done across the organization. So now you've got somebody sitting in a role not actually doing anything, but because they were hired, because we hired the person we didn't hire for the role.
Brad Herda [:Now let's make a job description. Nobody's being held accountable for it. I've got employees over here screwing off, and everybody's just kind of like, well, I don't know. We don't need this role. We don't need this. Okay.
Steven Doyle [:And it's very apparent in many family companies, yes, that's what happens. And that becomes a very large sticking point. That, uh, cousin, cousin Eddie has gotten hired for something that's not doing anything that nobody believes cousin Eddie needs to be there, but is sucking off of the teeth of success of others instead of just being there and being a contributor. Okay, so job description, really important. You spent a bunch of time on that.
Brad Herda [:Yep.
Steven Doyle [:Your next thing that I see in your notes here is benchmarking. Is that from a pay perspective, total compensation viewpoint, how, when you say benchmarking, what are you referring to?
Brad Herda [:So when I talk benchmarking, it's a composite of a bunch of different things. When I say a bunch of different things, you've got pay, you've got compensation. But then part of the benchmarking is for this role. What are the key behaviors that are going to be successful? And so, and then when we talk. So there's. So, yes, there's. This part also has an assessment component to it.
Steven Doyle [:So behavioral benchmarking, as well as financial benchmarking is what you're doing for the role. So when you do a. I'll just use the talent insights ti job as job benchmarking. As an example. When you take your clients to that benchmarking, how often do you have arguments over the scaling of what they're looking for. Given your knowledge of what the role really needs versus what they think. Yeah, we don't want somebody paying attention to detail. They just need it done quickly.
Brad Herda [:Are you sure that part, honestly, that does take a fair amount of time. When we talk fair amount of time, we're not talking, you know, this is done in 15 minutes.
Steven Doyle [:Easy.
Brad Herda [:Usually when we do them in their rock solid, we're talking half a day discussion about that. And there's. But we're not doing it with just the owner. This is where when we talk about alignment, we have alignment across the key decision makers in the company. Now, it could be, and, you know, the smaller shot, it could be, you know, a husband and wife team, it might be the executive team, it could be, it could be a leader and then some of their direct employees coming up with this.
Steven Doyle [:Right.
Brad Herda [:You're kind of looking at, you want to have more eyes on this for alignment purposes. And with that alignment also comes the accountability side. So that's why we do it that way. But the conversations end up being really great when they're facilitated. Now, if we were to do this and just have our clients just do it on their own. Yeah, it's done in 15 minutes and you get it back and you're like, you guys not saying it's wrong, but you are not going to get it's wrong.
Steven Doyle [:We need to redo this. Yeah, I'll say it's wrong. I have no problem telling my clients that it was wrong. The Ti job report. So for myself personally and the clients I've used it with, it's 100% long term success rate. When you follow, when you get facilitated to go get the thing that you're looking for to find the right behaviors to fit the role you're asking them to do. And too often when we go through that benchmarking process, yep. It's usually we're trying to out do something away from that.
Brad Herda [:Right.
Steven Doyle [:That entrepreneur that's doing all the work, the stuff they don't like doing. So as you go through the benchmark, it's ironic that they want to have somebody do be just like them to do the work they hate doing. And you go to.
Brad Herda [:Yes.
Steven Doyle [:So you don't like doing it. Why do you think somebody, if you don't like doing these role, this stuff, somebody, why would you ask, why would you want.
Brad Herda [:No, no, no.
Steven Doyle [:You don't want to do it, you don't like it. Why do you think somebody that's not you with the same behaviors would like that versus not like it? Benchmarking is very critical to increase your success rate for opportunity.
Brad Herda [:For sure. Then the, you know, once that starts, the once that part is done, you've got your job description. Everything's great, your job benchmark portion is done. Then we get to the real, hey, we need to find the people, right? And I will tell you, I often am amazed at where people think they should be posting and trying to find people.
Steven Doyle [:The gas station bulletin board, I mean.
Brad Herda [:There'S that or Craigslist. Those are the first two. I'm just like, are you kidding me right now? Or, hey, I'm going to go stand in the home Depot parking lot. Right. And, you know, that's how we're going to find people. Now, not saying that all of you know, you're not going to find good people there, but the caliber of person that you're looking for may have an impact on where you're looking. Actually, it really does have an impact on where you're looking for to fill those roles. So sourcing is actually really huge, you know, for finding the right talent that fits the culture for the people that you want to bring in.
Brad Herda [:Yeah.
Steven Doyle [:And too often we think we can do it ourselves. And so one client we worked with, we did, we went through the description, the benchmarking, getting clarity. We went to a recruiting firm that I knew, and they use a very, they do it on behaviorals, and they go out and they do the search. We thought for sure it was going to be a six to nine month opportunity. We had the gentleman hired in under three months.
Brad Herda [:Yep.
Steven Doyle [:In the role for a unicorn type role in a PM estimating slash specialty construction field. And it's been awesome because we took the time to go do the things on the front end versus just right, put an ad out there and hope somebody shows up. And, oh, they seem like a good person. Let's give them a shot.
Brad Herda [:Yeah. Yep.
Steven Doyle [:Interviewing so we sourced it. We got some opportunities. They got through the front door. They passed the stiff test, and now we get to talk to them in greater detail.
Brad Herda [:So when we talk, oftentimes with what we, what we perceive we need to do is, you know, look at their resume. Look at their resume when they get it and then just start asking questions. Oh, did you actually do this on your resume? Like. Oh, yeah, right. Oh, you did? Oh, well, how'd that work out? Okay. And they're very much close ended questions that are being asked in the interview process. We're not really gauging anyone's behaviors at all. Or are we behaviors from the standpoint, like how do they handle themselves in situations? How do they really like being hands on and can they work alone? Do they need support?
Steven Doyle [:Are you a fan of leading the candidate through the star method?
Brad Herda [:I am. I am. So letter. So when we talk the star method, Brad, what are we talking about? Are we, are we talking about, you know, we gold star kids, the mommy and daddy, mommy and daddy patted us on the back and said, oh, you're a star. You could do whatever you want.
Steven Doyle [:No, I'm talking about the star method, where you talk. It's a situation. The tat. Describe the situation.
Brad Herda [:Yeah.
Steven Doyle [:Provide me the tasks that you needed to take care of the actions you took to resolve those act. And then what were the results accomplished through that activity? Lead them down a path of behavioral questions or situational questions. Here's the best thing, though. When you do a job benchmark, it gives you the questions.
Brad Herda [:I know, it's awesome.
Steven Doyle [:And you don't have to think about it.
Brad Herda [:Yes.
Steven Doyle [:And you can do it consistently across all candidates and then you don't have to worry about any of these other HR problems. So here's my questions. I've asked everybody the similar questions.
Brad Herda [:So the, the star method is really great, but it's, most people don't really understand, you know, they're, they're, they're looking for just very short, quick answers in the interview process because they're the, what I find a lot of times is the person giving the interview is just as nervous giving the interview as the person coming in, getting interviewed. And it's like, no, just have a conversation. You know, maybe chew a gummy or something before you go for this interview and just chill out. You know, that's a whole other question. That's a whole nother topic, right.
Steven Doyle [:Preparing for interview. Just be prepared. Be chill. Just be inquisitive. It's sort of like, it sort of reminds me of Mister Doyle back in 2016. We're not trying to conduct an SBIR.
Brad Herda [:Ask curiosity.
Steven Doyle [:Oh, my. Sorry. We digress.
Brad Herda [:Anyhow, I have PTSD from that. From that whole thing. Yep.
Steven Doyle [:We've gone through the interview process. So we've had our job description. We've created the role. We know what we're doing. We've benchmarked the job to know what behaviors and payroll and salary compensation we're looking for. We've done the sourcing. We've created the interviews. Now we have some potential two or three candidates.
Steven Doyle [:What's next?
Steven Doyle [:We actually have them fill out a behavioral assessment. So we are very, is there anything you use in particular, me specifically, I am either going to use one of two, one of three assessments from TTI, which is our, my assessment provider, which covers their, their communication style. I want to know how they prefer to have, you know, be communicated with. I want to understand what their motivators or their driving forces are. And I might evaluate emotional intelligence depending on this role. I might evaluate sales skills, depending on the role. I may evaluate some other soft skills that, you know, if they're applying for more of a leadership position. So somewhere in there I'm kind of gauging based on the role.
Brad Herda [:But what I'm really getting at with those assessments is I understand how I can better communicate with somebody. The team understands how we can better communicate with them. And then there's also some behavioral components, some soft skills that, there's twelve behavioral components that are inside of those assessments that correlate with success in a role. And so that's why we do that. And then I can compare those key behaviors and those, you know, how they communicate with what we set as the benchmark to identify best fit. Right. That's the sweet spot right there. That's the sweet.
Steven Doyle [:And, and the beauty of that as well is if you've done the benchmark and we'll just, let's just talk disc for a moment from a language perspective. If you need somebody that has to be a very high compliance, high c, process orientated person and they come in below where you need them to, where they need to be, but they've shown some ways to adapt, at least now you know what you need to work on. If they fit the culture and they do all the other things, they could be a 80% match. But they need. This is where we got to focus on cool. At least now you know what the potential gap is or understanding is or what to do versus just, well, we just made a bad hire onto the next. Onto the next. And then bitch and complained about it.
Brad Herda [:Right.
Steven Doyle [:So we've done. So we've got a couple people. We're not assessing everybody that comes in for interviewing. We're probably only doing that to our final two or three candidates. And now we ask for references. How often? How often do you actually. Yeah, how often do you actually check references?
Brad Herda [:Most people are not checking references and they should.
Steven Doyle [:Yes, 1000% agree they should. And they should be checking personal references, not business references, because most organizations will only tell you, yes, they worked here from here to there.
Brad Herda [:Yes, the normal companies will. When we look at references, we, some of my more astute companies will actually send some of their employees out to actually scour their social media profiles, right? And they will see, you know, what type of person are they? Outside of office, outside of work, because it all translates, don't go look for.
Steven Doyle [:Steve Doyle's fans only page. Don't do it, folks.
Brad Herda [:If you find one, let me know, because I have never, you know, that would be, you know, why not? Let's, let's see what's out there. Be a shock to me. But hey, why not?
Steven Doyle [:See, he's trying to cover it up, playing. Doesn't know he has it.
Brad Herda [:Don't know I have it. Why not? I ain't got time for that shit.
Steven Doyle [:But anyways, references are important. Going through social is important. Understanding who the person is. Too often, because we do separate work from personal in many cases, but too often, today's world, it's blending more and more together that we're not learning to adapt to the environment because we are so just, well, it just is what it is. Type world. It's not what it needs to be. So you got to make sure you find the right things. References check out.
Steven Doyle [:We're getting ready to make them an offer.
Brad Herda [:Yep. That offer is so critical. Um, it's not as much as. So when we make offers, we actually have an offered letter that goes out that includes not just the tangible, hey, this is what you're going to expect, but it also should include those kind of like hidden, quote unquote hidden values, those company perks that you might have and talk about and actually have an offer sheet written out that says, yes, your, your salary or your hourly rate is this. It includes, you know, so many weeks of vacation. Maybe it includes the, you know, your healthcare, health, dental vision. It might include a vehicle. It could include gas cards.
Steven Doyle [:It could include maybe, maybe your company has a company airplane and you get to use it one time a year where you can fly anywhere you need to fly for a family vacation. Again, those are all perks. But people, what we, what we try to help people with is actually put a value on what those perks are so people actually understand. Hey, yes, my salary or my hourly rate might be, and I'm just gonna throw out, you know, maybe it's 65,000 a year, right? It could be 50,000 a year. But all of those perks, when we actually line out a might, you know, put all of the perks together, it could total up to at least your salary. Plus some people lose line, they lose visibility when they see all these perks. They don't actually understand the cost for all of those things. So again, it's always good, it's a good practice that most of my clients are following.
Brad Herda [:When they do an offer, there's an offer sheet that comes out that list. What are those non tangible things that people aren't seeing? And it puts a value on those lists.
Steven Doyle [:Yeah, because total compensation is the thing that's really important. It might be $65,000 of base salary. You might have another 4% and 401K match that's coming in. You might have another $15,000 in insurance benefits and another two and a half, three weeks of vacation. This net, what's, what is this all worth? At the end of the day, your total compensation value is about $145,000, correct? What? I don't make that much. Yes. That's the value you're receiving. So that offer letter and total compensation is really, really important.
Brad Herda [:Yes.
Steven Doyle [:After they say yes, now comes the shit show that we all have in every organization. It's the onboarding process.
Brad Herda [:Welcome to the insane asylum, people.
Steven Doyle [:Let's go peek behind the curtain. Mother.
Brad Herda [:That's right.
Steven Doyle [:What you thought it was going to be? You follow Joe over there. You'll be okay.
Brad Herda [:Yeah, I will tell you more often than not, that's absolutely what happens. There's no jot, there's no written descriptions for, you know, how work actually happens, how work flows. Hey, I just want you to go shadow them and, you know, somebody will be with you in a little bit. There's one of the things, one of our previous guests that were on the show, Mrs. Like when they make people an offer, they actually send them out, you know, clothing. They send them packages of, hey, thanks for, you know, thanks for signing up with us. Here's your offer letter. Here's everything.
Brad Herda [:Dude, we don't, we're not giving people welcome packages. We're not actually making it a big deal. Like, hey, we brought somebody new in and actually make them feel important that, hey, we value you coming in to the organization and, hey, actually, here's actually what's going to happen in the next 90 days, right?
Steven Doyle [:I'm a big fan of the 30 60 90. Here's, you should have every, every job role, should have your, as you're doing your job description, you should have your 30 60 90 day onboarding plan with that job description to set that expectation and just, it's flexible because maybe Joey's gone and now it's George doing it or Sally. But you know what they need to do. You, you know, the setup, the, it setup. There's nothing worse than, than dumping on an employee. Oh, hey, here's your new computer. Oh, shit. We didn't get it set up.
Steven Doyle [:We gotta call our third party it person. You got nothing or your phone doesn't work or any other type of stuff. There's nothing worse than that. It sets a really shitty example for how you run your business with a new employee. And first impressions matter on that day one. So, yes, onboarding is vastly, vastly important through that 1st 90 days, understanding the culture, understanding the team, getting to introduce and met and meet each team, being involved with the leaders of the organization, I try to make sure my clients, when they hire somebody, they take that first person to lunch that at least once or twice that first week to stay in touch, and then make sure the leader is touching base at least once in that 30, 60, 90 day period each month so that they can validate their supervisors are doing what they need to do and, and use that new lens of people coming in as insight for improvement and for opportunity to grow and develop. And too often, leaders do not take advantage of the new eyes on their business.
Brad Herda [:Right. And then the last thing that we kind of usually falls off with most companies is following through on that 30, 60, 90 day ramp up. And because it's like, it's great for the first week and then things tail off. And the other thing is in that ramp up period is how do the new managers, how are the new managers actually working with those new employees to make sure that they feel that they are valued, making sure that, hey, all the other employees still feel valued because you brought somebody new in? Because there could be a little bit of maybe, maybe jealousy, oh, resentment, like all of those things going on. So when we talk ramp up, we're not just talking.
Steven Doyle [:Nobody did that for me. Nobody. Nobody did that for us when we came. This person gets to go lunch.
Brad Herda [:You should take another jealousy. Now there's. Now there's gossip. Ooh, they brought so and so in. Oh, maybe I need to. Were you worried about my job? Maybe I need to go look for a job. Oh, man. Oh, did you hear how much they got paid? I don't even know, but, oh, my gosh, I'm just going to start it.
Brad Herda [:We laugh, we joke, because we've been there, we've seen it all. But that whole ramp up, when we talk ramp up, it's not just the ramp up for the new employee. It's a ramp up for management expectations, leadership expectations, team expectations. And we actually spend time coaching during those 30, 60, 90, days for the new leaders, for the new managers, for the new employee. Hey, this is actually what we should be doing so that we can ensure long term success. And when we follow this entire hiring hero process, you actually have retention over a longer period of time.
Steven Doyle [:You also have the ability to weed out the bad apple very quickly and go, oh, yep, we made a mistake. It's done. Instead of having to deal with the, the problem for months on end, years on end, he go, well, Sally's was a bad hider. And why do we have, why is she still here doing this stuff? She can't do her job well because.
Brad Herda [:You know, she does, you know, something good 5% of the time. And I'm just tolerant right now. I just don't, I just don't want.
Steven Doyle [:To back to the she, it. They show up, they do something and it's okay, but it's not what's there. I've had a friend of mine, she owns a trucking firm. Her dispatcher was horrible for a bunch a year for like twelve months in a row. Finally walked her out, found somebody new, leaving for vacation on Monday and is like, okay, no big deal. Last year when she went on vacation, it's like, I need to cancel my vacation. This is going to be a shit show. Da da da.
Steven Doyle [:Because that person didn't take the all those things and she put it on herself, which a little bit was on her. But by the same token, the employee didn't take on any initiative as well. So it's also important for the employee to take initiative of that 30, 60, 90 day plan and show that there's some gumption there and show this is what that looks like and move that forward.
Brad Herda [:So yes, it is 100% a two way street.
Steven Doyle [:All right, Mister Doyle, we are well over our time for this particular episode, it seems like. So going back to the hiring process once again, we are looking to have a very, you know, this hiring hero process that you've kind of put together solid job description with expectations. Do the job benchmark, find the right sources, conduct good interviews looking at behaviors, do the assessments on your individuals to compare the gap, to follow up on the references, create an amazing offer letter that they can't say no to. Bring them on board in 30, 60, 90 days and then let them shine for years to come.
Brad Herda [:That's right. You got it. Simple.
Steven Doyle [:So simple. All right, Mister Doyle, until we talk again, sir. Have a great day.
Brad Herda [:All right, you too, my friend.
Steven Doyle [:Thank you for listening to Blue Collar B's, brought to you by Vision Ford Business solutions and professional business Coaching, Inc. If you'd like to learn more on today's topic, just reach out to Steve Doyle or myself, Brad Hurta. Please like share rate and review this show as feedback is the only way we can get better. Let's keep blue collar businesses strong for generations to come.