Transcripts
Welcome back to Unboxing Logistics.
Speaker:I'm your host, Lori Boyer of EasyPost, and you are in for a treat today.
Speaker:We are going to be talking on today's show with the great Nate Skiver, all about costs, carriers,
Speaker:the Chinese, I got like triple C's going on here for us to be talking about all of the latest
Speaker:trends coming into 2025 around these topics.
Speaker:And I brought in one of the, the great educators, really a great person in the space here of
Speaker:logistics and supply chain, Nate Skiver.
Speaker:Can you introduce yourself a little bit to our audience who might not know you?
Speaker:Absolutely.
Speaker:I appreciate the amazing introduction, Lori but my name is Nate Skiver.
Speaker:I'm founder of LPF Spend Management, which essentially means I'm an independent consultant.
Speaker:I am a 20 plus year parcel nerd that about five years ago, decided to move
Speaker:into consulting after 17 years in retail.
Speaker:So I help you package shippers ship smarter and reduce cost.
Speaker:I also help package carriers, not UPS and FedEx.
Speaker:They don't need my help.
Speaker:Compete in the marketplace.
Speaker:So I've been doing that for the past five years.
Speaker:And I've really valued the opportunity to work with so many different companies and, and help
Speaker:them optimize their, their parcel programs.
Speaker:That's fantastic.
Speaker:Unboxing Logistics community, you're basically getting like free consulting care today.
Speaker:So, from the great Nate.
Speaker:So get ready buckle up.
Speaker:It's gonna be really fun.
Speaker:Before we get started, one of the things we've been doing that I have just absolutely
Speaker:loved this season is I've been asking my guests to share a person in the industry
Speaker:that they really admire or even a role in the industry that they really admire.
Speaker:This industry is so full of connections, and the importance of relationships is huge.
Speaker:And I've really been interested to hear about who people admire and who have been great mentors.
Speaker:So Nate, do you have somebody you can share with us?
Speaker:I do.
Speaker:And it's, I'll say mine isn't directly parcel necessarily, but you know, a lot of people
Speaker:will, will, will know this one, Rick Watson.
Speaker:Rick is a really dynamic, presence in the ecommerce industry you know, a veteran of
Speaker:that industry on, with several companies.
Speaker:And he's been consulting on his own for a little bit longer than I have.
Speaker:And so early on in my consulting career, I started to follow Rick.
Speaker:You know, I've chatted with Rick and so really admire the work that he does, the
Speaker:candor that he has, he brings to all of his content or also does, has his own podcast.
Speaker:So really value the work that Rick does.
Speaker:Absolutely.
Speaker:That's amazing.
Speaker:And I just want to say I've really enjoyed as I've heard people share about mentors and
Speaker:examples that they've had in the industry.
Speaker:You know it's just really reminded me for all of you out there listening there are
Speaker:so many opportunities, if there's a job role you're interested in, if there's you
Speaker:know If you're wanting to pivot in your career a little bit kind of like Nate did
Speaker:in becoming a consultant, look for those people that you admire and reach out to them.
Speaker:So often, if all you want to do is say, I'd love to have a conversation with
Speaker:you about how you're making this work, or, you know, do you have tips for me?
Speaker:So many people in this industry are just fantastic about that.
Speaker:So I love that.
Speaker:Thank you.
Speaker:Shout out to Rick.
Speaker:That's awesome.
Speaker:Okay.
Speaker:Another cool thing we've been doing.
Speaker:You know, Nate, you know, I know, you can't go like even five steps in this industry
Speaker:without hearing about AI, hearing about tech.
Speaker:It's a big thing everyone's talking about everywhere.
Speaker:But when it comes to some things like ChatGPT it's often, you know, as we've used it more
Speaker:and more, it's easy to see sometimes, you know, it's so good at kind of starting a foundation.
Speaker:It maybe gives you some good points, but sometimes it's a little bit missing.
Speaker:And sometimes it's right on.
Speaker:So, the best way to kind of fact check it is with our experts here.
Speaker:Make sure, you know, see what their take is on what it says.
Speaker:So, I have asked ChatGPT, what trends will we see between the big name carriers
Speaker:and the smaller kind of regional or more alternative carriers in the next five years?
Speaker:What it anticipates seeing kind of the trends here.
Speaker:So I'm going to read these to you, Nate, and we'll get kind of your feedback, see if you think
Speaker:it's missing anything, see if you think it's on.
Speaker:So first, its number one thing it said was it believes we'll see collaboration
Speaker:between them over competition.
Speaker:Okay, so you can think about that.
Speaker:Number two, we will see increased diversification by shippers.
Speaker:So increasing diversification.
Speaker:And three, adoption of tech and data sharing between the big carriers and the smaller carriers.
Speaker:Okay, so gut check reaction first.
Speaker:Collaboration over competition.
Speaker:Increased diversification.
Speaker:That one seems like kind of pretty fairly is already happening.
Speaker:But also adoption of sharing of technology and data.
Speaker:Wow.
Speaker:So the collaboration, if we're talking, if I understood this correctly,
Speaker:collaboration with each other?
Speaker:Yes.
Speaker:It says major carriers will increasingly lean on regional players to meet
Speaker:their customers' expectations.
Speaker:If that's within the five year horizon, I think that is on the back end of that.
Speaker:That's what I thought.
Speaker:Because right now, it doesn't appear that way very much at all.
Speaker:There's really intense competition right now.
Speaker:Even if you, I mean, if you throw the USPS in there, they're a very large,
Speaker:you know, player in the industry.
Speaker:They are taking the approach of hey, we've we've got this.
Speaker:We're gonna do it on our own.
Speaker:So which is a massive change from what they've done.
Speaker:So, so I don't, I don't know about that one.
Speaker:I think if it happens it's, it is at the end of that five years.
Speaker:What about consolidation?
Speaker:Do you see consolidation at all?
Speaker:Like, you know, the purchasing of some of these smaller regional carriers by the big ones?
Speaker:On a really small scale, possibly.
Speaker:I think that's what I would expect.
Speaker:Like, not necessarily a, just to make this up, you know, I'm not saying this would ever happen,
Speaker:FedEx acquiring OnTrac or something like that.
Speaker:I don't think that is what we see and we maybe can talk about a more, more organic
Speaker:consolidation of, you know, some providers not being in the market anymore, that I
Speaker:think is much more likely in the short term.
Speaker:Yeah, I could see that.
Speaker:Okay, diversification by shippers.
Speaker:That one I would agree with.
Speaker:It's, it's been a building trend and it's not a one size fits all.
Speaker:Not every shipper has to diversify or anything like that.
Speaker:But I think all of the things that go into that, you know, available options from just
Speaker:a delivery provider standpoint, technology.
Speaker:And then, you know, inventory getting closer to the customer enables a lot of
Speaker:those things also, so I think that will continue, so I would agree with that one.
Speaker:Okay, and then the last one, this is one that I was really hesitant on, that we would see
Speaker:more adoption of technology and data sharing between the large carriers and the small ones.
Speaker:Again, I think I'm with you, like it feels very competitive right now, and everybody's
Speaker:protecting stuff, so it's hard to see, but.
Speaker:Yeah, I'm not, I'm trying to think of a, a use case, not in a literal partnership
Speaker:as far as delivery services goes.
Speaker:I'm trying to think of how that might work.
Speaker:I can't think of anything right now, so I'm not sure exactly where that one's directed.
Speaker:But,
Speaker:chatGPT must think that it has great hopes that we're very collaborative and helpful in
Speaker:working together, more than I think we are.
Speaker:Agreed.
Speaker:I mean, maybe that might be in, in those providers, regardless of who they are,
Speaker:their best interest, but I don't think it's, it's happening anytime soon.
Speaker:Yeah, I agree.
Speaker:Okay, so what would be your overall grade, A to F?
Speaker:What would you give it?
Speaker:I don't know, maybe a C plus.
Speaker:Yeah, I was thinking in the C range as well.
Speaker:Anything that you would say that it missed?
Speaker:That you would see as a trend coming down in the relationship there.
Speaker:Of UPS and FedEx diversifying their businesses, where package delivery might still be the
Speaker:majority of revenue, but not what it is today.
Speaker:So other types of services to where they aren't dependent upon delivery as
Speaker:much as they are, because that, I think, over time becomes more commoditized.
Speaker:Okay.
Speaker:Okay.
Speaker:Do you think that they'll focus more on some of those, like, kind of niche markets?
Speaker:Or how will they handle those?
Speaker:Somewhat or or adjacent, whether it's kind of market segments or capabilities that maybe
Speaker:they already offer, but expanding those.
Speaker:I mean you know, UPS is focused on, on health care.
Speaker:So I just think kind of areas that are adjacent, maybe even current service offerings that they
Speaker:build out to to diversify their revenue a bit.
Speaker:Okay, perfect.
Speaker:Love it.
Speaker:Okay, so what do you see kind of as the trends as we're going into 2025?
Speaker:What are sort of the most significant things that you anticipate for shippers?
Speaker:And for the carriers as well.
Speaker:As we move into kind of an uncertain year, we've got, you know, political
Speaker:changes, and we've got global conflict and all kinds of potential disruptions.
Speaker:But what are, what are your predictions?
Speaker:What are your thoughts?
Speaker:Yeah, I mean, I think a fair amount of some of the things that have happened in 24 will either
Speaker:continue or maybe evolve to an extent in 25.
Speaker:I mean, one of the things is, even though the market, I guess just package volume, if
Speaker:you want to kind of size the market, isn't really growing or changing too significantly,
Speaker:there's a lot of change happening in the market with different providers either entering the
Speaker:market, trying to expand, gain a foothold.
Speaker:FedEx continues, and UPS, continues to make pricing more complex.
Speaker:So that's, you know, just something that the pace of change on that front also
Speaker:is very, very difficult to keep up with.
Speaker:And so I think that along with the complexity of, that comes with all of the choices in the market.
Speaker:So it's a good thing, but it's also a bad thing.
Speaker:I think that continues to be something that shippers have to really stay on top of.
Speaker:And stay on top of the market you know, understand where it's headed from a pricing
Speaker:standpoint and do their best to prepare for it.
Speaker:I think uncertain, I think you mentioned that word, there is uncertainty around
Speaker:this group of alternative carriers.
Speaker:Some of them may not exist.
Speaker:Some of them may persist and hopefully survive and thrive.
Speaker:But it's really something, again, that a shipper has to investigate, explore, to
Speaker:really understand and take advantage of.
Speaker:Last two things, if that wasn't enough, I think for two other players in the market that
Speaker:one has had an impact for a while, the USPS.
Speaker:They've been changing their network for quite a long time.
Speaker:So that's still in process.
Speaker:And they are being much more intentional with their strategy around their package services to,
Speaker:you know, I guess they've also really kind of taken hold of that volume of business perhaps
Speaker:at the expense of some of their partners.
Speaker:And so that has created some uncertainty with pricing, particularly lightweight packages.
Speaker:That's not, we're not done with that.
Speaker:That's in process right now.
Speaker:And so I think particularly first half of the year is where you know
Speaker:that might show up more in the market.
Speaker:Last thing, Amazon.
Speaker:So Amazon Shipping been kind of hanging out there for a while not really at
Speaker:least publicly making much of an impact.
Speaker:From what I'm seeing and hearing they're being more intentional as far as go to
Speaker:market and in trying to win some volume.
Speaker:So we'll see if that actually surfaces.
Speaker:Interesting, so one thing you mentioned were costs.
Speaker:And well, I I recently had on an episode.
Speaker:Dr Chris Caplice of MIT, and he shared that he believes that we're going to in the next
Speaker:year or so switch over to being kind of it's been sort of a shippers market in terms
Speaker:of, you know, carriers vying for business.
Speaker:And he thinks we're going to see a little bit of a shift back to carriers
Speaker:kind of having the upper role.
Speaker:Do you agree with that?
Speaker:Disagree with that?
Speaker:And if you do agree or either way, you know, how do you feel like shippers should respond?
Speaker:I don't know that there's going to be a dramatic shift, say, 180 degrees, I guess that's right.
Speaker:But a strong shippers market, or excuse me, carriers market, rather.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:I mean, a few things have to happen.
Speaker:I think both, you know, volume growth in the market, it's really not there.
Speaker:And one of the few sources and you kind of mentioned, alluded to this a little bit in
Speaker:the opening is volume from Chinese retailers.
Speaker:There's not much growth outside of that.
Speaker:And the only way that the market really kind of swings back the other way
Speaker:significantly is if capacity is taken out of the market, like significant amount.
Speaker:And I know that that Is part of the strategy from UPS and to an extent FedEx as well.
Speaker:They're kind of right sizing their networks.
Speaker:But I just don't see it happening that quickly to where now those carriers and presumably
Speaker:others are in a really strong position to start commanding much higher prices.
Speaker:Yeah, so probably not, you're anticipating probably not 2025, maybe at some point, but
Speaker:we're still probably sticking in shippers market.
Speaker:In doing so, what do you recommend to get, you know, to really take advantage of that?
Speaker:So if we're still in a shippers market, do you recommend locking
Speaker:in good rates for a lengthy time?
Speaker:Do you recommend the opposite, you know, trying to get your rates being shifting all the time.
Speaker:How do you recommend they best take advantage cost wise?
Speaker:I mean, one thing, it's somewhat dependent upon how I mean, say in the last 12 to
Speaker:18 months, what the approach has been for, you know, particular shipper.
Speaker:If they've been closely managing it and responding when things change either in the
Speaker:market or within their own business, you know, volume changes, things like that, then really
Speaker:it's, it's continuing to stay on top of you know, where, you know, if the volume or if
Speaker:the market is growing then they may start to actually need to look at it differently
Speaker:and potentially expect some rate increases.
Speaker:But if, if they haven't been negotiating, say frequently, or haven't bid their business
Speaker:in, you know, 18 months or longer, that is going to be my, my first recommendation,
Speaker:and that would be early in the year.
Speaker:And, and that's just to make sure that you have the best pricing that you can obtain
Speaker:with the right providers that meet your needs.
Speaker:And while I don't expect, I guess, the, the shippers market just to
Speaker:fade away really, really quickly.
Speaker:It's not going to be here forever.
Speaker:Right.
Speaker:It's always cyclical.
Speaker:Exactly.
Speaker:So being able to get, you know, the, the best pricing that your volume commands really does
Speaker:need to happen, you know, early in the year.
Speaker:And then you can adjust thereafter.
Speaker:How early, Nate?
Speaker:We're talking January, February, just Q1 is good enough?
Speaker:I would, I would start as, as soon as you can.
Speaker:Okay.
Speaker:Start now, people.
Speaker:Start now.
Speaker:I mean, ideally, you know, you would have taken some time maybe in December to plan for January.
Speaker:And then, you know, get it kicked off.
Speaker:But that just happens to be one of the, the, you know projects, from prior experience and
Speaker:now consulting, that happens to get kind of pushed down the list if it doesn't get a start.
Speaker:Peak season all of that, this is crazy.
Speaker:So let's say they haven't the you know, they forgot, they were busy.
Speaker:They were killing it in December.
Speaker:They had so many, that's what we're gonna think, they were doing so good
Speaker:that they sort of forgot to plan.
Speaker:So do you recommend plan first and then you know, don't rush into it.
Speaker:How I guess what would be your strategy if they came to you and said Nate, help me, consult me.
Speaker:Should I spend a few weeks planning, you know, out what I want to do and then go bid?
Speaker:Short answer to some of the last part is yes.
Speaker:So, take, I mean, whatever time frame it takes you to really just assess the current state
Speaker:of your agreements, your rates, contracts.
Speaker:But then also just, if you know already, set some very clear objectives with with your
Speaker:program, be it both on cost and and service.
Speaker:And since we're talking more about cost here is, is setting those objectives and then
Speaker:deciding how to build out the plan to source the right carriers to meet those objectives.
Speaker:So, so take at least whatever time you need, hopefully just maybe a few weeks at the most.
Speaker:And if, if not, of course, there are other partners who can help, be it consultants, if
Speaker:you have a parcel spend management solution or partner in place, that can help expedite the
Speaker:process because you have the data available.
Speaker:So, but don't skip that step.
Speaker:Just make sure you're very intentional with it and don't let it, you know, linger too
Speaker:long before you get into the actual say RFP.
Speaker:Perfect.
Speaker:So a couple of things in there kind of came to mind for me.
Speaker:So diversification, you mentioned at the, you know, beginning of the show that diversification
Speaker:of carriers might not be right for everyone.
Speaker:So I want you to kind of share when maybe you think it is right, or maybe on the flip
Speaker:side when is diversification maybe not best?
Speaker:And kind of walk us through maybe then rate shopping technology, those kind of things
Speaker:in terms of cost, what your recommendations are for shippers out there on that.
Speaker:Diversification.
Speaker:I mean it it's something that I think, you know, I just mentioned related to an RFP
Speaker:specifically of setting objectives, but really just broadly with your overall parcel program
Speaker:is, is if you don't already have them set, you know, what cost targets you have or need to be.
Speaker:And also the service and transit time, delivery reliability, delivery speed.
Speaker:Those should all be established.
Speaker:And then look at it and and see where the gaps are.
Speaker:If you're not meeting those objectives and can at least determine, you know.
Speaker:If you aren't meeting the objectives, then the current providers have to
Speaker:be contributing to that in some way.
Speaker:And so, that's where you can look for opportunities to find the right partner
Speaker:or partners to help close those gaps.
Speaker:But it should be specific.
Speaker:It shouldn't just be.
Speaker:You know, diversifying isn't, I've been working with FedEx for 10 years and
Speaker:every once in a while, there's something that kind of pops up they can't handle.
Speaker:So I'm just going to throw a regional carrier in there and give them 1 percent
Speaker:of my volume, you know, done deal.
Speaker:Like, it's being more specific with what those objectives are.
Speaker:And if you go through that exercise and determine FedEx is meeting all my
Speaker:needs, then you don't need to diversify.
Speaker:But if you never go through the assessment process, then you don't reach that answer.
Speaker:You just assume it's good enough.
Speaker:Can you give an example maybe of when it would make sense to diversify?
Speaker:I don't know if it's a company or just even just generic.
Speaker:One example might be if something changes with your volume profile.
Speaker:So a lot of the packages that you usually ship are not heavy, but heavier,
Speaker:two, three, four, five, 10 pounds.
Speaker:And there's a new product line that, you know, you release and all of a sudden you've
Speaker:got a lot of volume that's under a pound.
Speaker:And so it's less than one pound.
Speaker:You're shipping packages that are in poly mailers that are 8 ounces that you haven't shipped before.
Speaker:And your partner is FedEx.
Speaker:Just, FedEx doesn't offer a service they used to, but they don't offer a service that
Speaker:has ounce based pricing that's competitive.
Speaker:And so that's where it's something that you really are very well incentivized to go
Speaker:source another carrier specifically just for that need, and that's on a cost basis.
Speaker:Whether it's USPS UPS mail Innovations, DHL eCommerce.
Speaker:There are options, and that would be a pretty clear cut example, I think of almost.
Speaker:It's not forced, but somewhat forced diversification.
Speaker:Yeah, and I love that that point that kind of a change occurred.
Speaker:I love how you said that, because so often, you know, maybe you're expanding internationally,
Speaker:maybe you're, you know, there are all kinds of little trigger points to watch for.
Speaker:You're opening up new DCs.
Speaker:You've got whatever it is may mean that shifts are required, or at
Speaker:least probably should be looked at.
Speaker:So let's talk a little bit about the Chinese then.
Speaker:So, we have been seeing, you know, massive influx from Temu and SHEIN and, you know, all
Speaker:of these kind of low cost goods flowing in.
Speaker:There's been a little talk about, you know, you've talked about a little
Speaker:bit, expanding kind of the fulfillment capabilities here in the U.S. logistics.
Speaker:What, I guess, what are you seeing here?
Speaker:What do you feel like their entrance is meaning for everyone else in the
Speaker:industry here in the United States?
Speaker:A lot has to do with whether, from a domestic standpoint, what impacts there
Speaker:will be, likely, from tariffs and/or just trade regulation changes on the import side.
Speaker:And I don't think either or both of those are going to just completely, you know,
Speaker:kill the inbound volume from from China.
Speaker:But it might expedite or push more of that volume into domestic fulfillment for these companies.
Speaker:And I believe, could be wrong, but I believe SHEIN is ahead there.
Speaker:They've had fulfillment in the, in the U.S. For at least a year, probably two.
Speaker:And this all comes down to the volume.
Speaker:The volume isn't going away, whether it's shipped domestically in the
Speaker:U.S. or inbound from China or both.
Speaker:And I think that's going to continue to grow.
Speaker:And to an extent, I mean, it's, it's really kind of cropping up the
Speaker:U.S. Parcel market at this point.
Speaker:And it's, it's having impacts kind of across different groups, but just from a carrier side,
Speaker:alternative carriers, regionals, final mile carriers have really benefited from this volume.
Speaker:There are some actually built their service offering almost entirely around it.
Speaker:There are others who, you know, have taken on a large portion of the volume
Speaker:and presumably have leveraged that to, you know, provide some cost unit cost
Speaker:benefits because of the delivery density.
Speaker:So even though it's low revenue, because these companies, Temu and others, command very,
Speaker:very low rates, it can enable, you know, the delivery density a carrier gets allows them
Speaker:then to maybe offer competitive pricing to other retailers, you know, still with margin.
Speaker:And they can take advantage of those kind of economies of scale.
Speaker:Then we've seen, you know, publicly at least because it comes up on
Speaker:earnings calls for FedEx and UPS.
Speaker:FedEx has at least stated they don't have, I don't know what the verbiage
Speaker:was they used, a significant say commitment or investment in that volume.
Speaker:Okay.
Speaker:UPS however I think I would still say that they do, they did have more and it kind of blew up in
Speaker:their face after Q2 earnings, because it was one of the reasons why the earnings weren't as strong.
Speaker:I think they've since made some, some changes.
Speaker:And so they've pulled back from that or kind of rationalized that a little bit and
Speaker:aren't as deep into that volume at such a low price as they were, say, six months ago.
Speaker:So Nate, for our carrier audience who's watching what, what are your recommendations
Speaker:for you know, working with Temu, SHEIN, these other, you know, really low rate organizations?
Speaker:Is it a risk?
Speaker:Is it, I know that, you know, de minimis is a big debate right now
Speaker:going on in Congress and import fees.
Speaker:Trying to kind of slow some of that down coming from China.
Speaker:I guess, yeah.
Speaker:So what is your recommendation to carriers?
Speaker:Work with them?
Speaker:Is it too risky?
Speaker:There's a lot of volume, but just what would you say?
Speaker:It's very situational.
Speaker:Just, I'll just kind of practice saying that so I can't make a blanket recommendation.
Speaker:You're giving us the political answer, I love it.
Speaker:We gotta do it.
Speaker:But because they, I'll just say, you know, carriers know their own cost
Speaker:structures better than, better than I do.
Speaker:And so this is pretty obvious, but of not being, you know, too dependent on
Speaker:that volume for a significant amount of percentage, I guess, of the company revenue.
Speaker:That, I mean, that's what I would say, because it's actually, while there's risk on the
Speaker:regulatory side, there's actually just as much risk or probably even more of just, from what
Speaker:I've been told of how some of these companies manage their volume with these providers and
Speaker:will flip volume from one carrier to another to save a pretty small amount, but to save on cost.
Speaker:Yes.
Speaker:When your costs are so low, I mean, every penny is making a huge difference.
Speaker:Yes.
Speaker:And so that's the thing where it, it's difficult to rely on that volume and revenue
Speaker:indefinitely, because it may change very quickly.
Speaker:So, I would say, you know, test and learn.
Speaker:So, kind of, you know, take on a certain part of it that wouldn't cause you know,
Speaker:issues if you lost it two months from now.
Speaker:And see if, if it's worth, you know, building out in areas that actually,
Speaker:you know, benefit your network.
Speaker:Fantastic.
Speaker:Okay, Nate, we are already, I don't even know how, we're already at time.
Speaker:You have so much that you have, I just feel like I could stay here all day and learn from you.
Speaker:But any other final advice?
Speaker:We've talked costs and carriers, you know, diversification.
Speaker:Any final recommendation for shippers specifically, first, going into 2025 final
Speaker:thoughts that you recommend that they make sure they lock down great advice on, you know, getting
Speaker:your RFP going early on, making sure you're looking for those trigger points of change.
Speaker:If anything happens, you know, to know if you need to diversify.
Speaker:Any other final thoughts that you have?
Speaker:It's kind of a theme with some of the things we've talked about, but prioritize parcel.
Speaker:I'm, I'm a bit you know, biased here, but
Speaker:parcel kind of gets the short end of the stick within supply chain.
Speaker:And even though it's a, it ends up being, particularly for retailers, a very, very large,
Speaker:you know, expense budget line item, it, it just doesn't get the priority, perhaps, and it should.
Speaker:And so I would just encourage shippers to prioritize parcel.
Speaker:Invest in people and partners.
Speaker:And so from a partner standpoint, whether that is on delivery partners shipping technology
Speaker:and multi-carrier shipping technology or parcel spend management, those partners that should
Speaker:be a very clear and intentional investment.
Speaker:And then people.
Speaker:There, there's not a lot of people who really have a lot of parcel expertise or experience,
Speaker:but it should be something that many shippers, I think intentionally can invest in their people.
Speaker:To actually devote, be it a person, start with one to, to parcel.
Speaker:I think I think the payback would be pretty quick.
Speaker:Okay.
Speaker:I love that you said that in multiple reasons.
Speaker:There's multiple things there that you said that just related to me.
Speaker:First, parcel.
Speaker:I feel like you know, parcel has boomed recently in terms of ecommerce exploding,
Speaker:but it has not gotten the attention, and it has, we have not yet seen that investment
Speaker:from our shippers in in recognizing that.
Speaker:So I think you are spot on on that.
Speaker:You and I are so in agreement on that.
Speaker:And I love how you said, around people, start with one.
Speaker:I think so often people think it's like, okay, I'm gonna dive in and do this giant thing.
Speaker:Just start small and grow from there.
Speaker:So that, I mean that's brilliant.
Speaker:Love that Nate.
Speaker:Thank you so much for being here today.
Speaker:So appreciate it.
Speaker:I know our audience is going to want to connect with you, reach out to you.
Speaker:What is the best way to connect with you?
Speaker:And obviously a great person if you want help is Nate Skiver.
Speaker:So where can people reach out and connect with you?
Speaker:Well, one way, you mentioned it early on, I think, is, is LinkedIn.
Speaker:So follow me on LinkedIn, DM me on LinkedIn that's, you know, I'm very, very active there.
Speaker:Post content every day.
Speaker:Also.
Speaker:He'll get you thinking there.
Speaker:He'll get you thinking.
Speaker:That's my, that's part of the reason I do it.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:To really create some engagement.
Speaker:But then also, email nate@lpfspendmanagement.com.
Speaker:And there's more information about my consulting services at lpfspendmanagement.com.
Speaker:Fantastic.
Speaker:Well, for all of you in the audience, wish you the best 2025.
Speaker:It's going to be an awesome year.
Speaker:Crazy.
Speaker:This industry is always crazy though.
Speaker:So expect the unexpected.
Speaker:Nate, thank you so much.
Speaker:Thank you, Lori.
Speaker:And we'll see you next time.
