How do you let your community know about your business without coming across as cringeworthy?

Gary Mullins joins ‘Not Another Business Podcast with Toby Goodman’ to talk music, motors, and making memorable experiences for high-end clients.

Gary’s a gigging musician turned events entrepreneur and a key player in the Ferrari Owners Club.

We discuss how he bridges two luxury worlds to create standout opportunities for clients and how he has built genuine authority without relying on vanity metrics.

If you’re looking to turn creative work into high-value relationships—and grow your business without compromising your brand—this episode shows you how.

Game Plan Talking Points:

• Gary’s Business and Unique Selling Proposition

• Podcasting as a Business Tool and Authority Building

• The Creation and Impact of ‘Narrow Podcasting’

• Wearing Multiple Hats: Music, Cars, and Self-Promotion

• Defining and Serving Different Audiences

• Community Building within the Ferrari Owners Club

• Building Relationships and Attracting High-Profile Guests

• Linking Luxury Markets: Cars, Watches, and Event Experiences

• Structuring Content for Community Engagement

• Marketing Positioning and Brand Story

• Community Data and CRM Tactics

• Best Practices for Maintaining Relationships

• Launching New Businesses and Qualifying Opportunities

Time-stamps:

00:00 When to Write Before Podcasting?

05:18 Writing My Book on Podcasting

07:55 From Book to Global Recognition

10:44 Balancing Business and Music Careers

14:01 Environment's Role in Communication

18:41 Cultivating Motorsport Networking Events

21:49 Buying Feelings, Not Products

25:47 Exclusive Access for Executive Experiences

28:31 Subtle Luxury and Class Appreciation

32:16 Ferrari Podcast Audience Survey

36:24 Ferrari Enthusiast's Lifestyle Insights

40:47 Qualifying New Business Opportunities

42:42 Evaluating Meaningful Revenue Paths

46:30 Community Leadership: Being a Guide

49:34 Luxury Appeals to Discerning Tastes

Guest Deets:

Find Gary Mullins Here: https://www.garymullins.co.uk/

Connect with Garry on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/garywmullins/

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Here are three ways I can help you with your business:

👀 Watch ‘Get Clients with Your Podcast’ when you join my email list

📖 Read my best-selling book ‘Narrow Podcasting’

🚀 Connect with me on LinkedIn

Toby Goodman: How do you leverage your position in a community of car enthusiasts to help build your music business? What sort of results did I see from self-publishing my book, Narrow Podcasting, and... How do you work out if your amazing idea for your next business is worth the effort? Welcome to 'Not Another Business Podcast' with me, Toby Goodman.

Toby Goodman: I know you as a musician as an entrepreneur if I'd never met you before and I'd bumped into you in, the pub and asked you what you did for a living, what would you say?

Garry Mullins: My response would be that I run a collection of. bands that are designed to provide discerning clients with fun, unique and different experiences that ultimately enhance their events far beyond a standard outfit might do. But I'm not really interested in doing anything especially familiar. I much prefer to try and create a space that I can almost as far as possible, be close to the only thing that's available.

Toby Goodman: And these bands for clarity are playing cover music. They're playing well-known songs, maybe in slightly different styles or what have you. But this is an events business basically.

Garry Mullins: It is fundamentally an events business. Yeah.

I've got a few questions here.

I've been reading your book 'Narrow Podcasting'. There she is. First of all, I have to say it is absolutely brilliant, but I'm not blowing smoke, but this is one of the most actionable books I've ever read.

Toby Goodman: Thank you.

Garry Mullins: and it might it could just be because I'm new to the premise of podcasting and I've not read anything else like it, but.

The number of things that I've pulled out of it so far, and I'm only to be fair, I'm only halfway through. I've got so many bookmarks for places to go that you've highlighted in here of websites other books to read and techniques. It's really refreshing as a book to read. So first of all, thank you for that.

And so I've got a few questions about how you've approached your podcast career. And various other elements of your career. And I'm really keen to learn more about what you've done. I think you are fascinating. Just starting from the book in particular, the fact that you have a book, I'm curious to know how valuable it is in validating your position of authority in the niche that you are targeting in your own business.

I, what, when, considering the question, I've realized that I can use the podcast as a way of writing the book. So I see value there.

Toby Goodman: Yeah.

Garry Mullins: be curious to know your thoughts on all of that.

Toby Goodman: I had a version of this conversation with Kym Medina on this podcast, so you can listen back to that as well. 'cause she asked the same sort of question and she was in a similar position, different business considering starting a podcast to serve the business. And there's a couple of contextual things that are worth noting.

And because AI is so good, now you can do that in like warp speed compared to what happened when I was writing it during Covid, right? I'll tell you exactly how I wrote my book. So first of all, I was making podcasts for myself for a long time for businesses, and then people started to hire me to help them make their podcasts for their business.

And if they wanted to show up, I think it was on a Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, it was during Covid, so everyone was at home. That was the other part. I was gonna tell them everything I knew over three sessions.

And I'd planned out the chapters of that book. Start here, finish here, I did about an hour of talking. I stopped a lot to ask what questions they had, and to ask them what they found most useful, because that helps.

Garry Mullins: Yeah.

Toby Goodman: And then I wanted to know what I'd missed. So then I opened it up for q and a and the price of that was their time. And they paid me, I think something like two grand each to do that.

Garry Mullins: Wow.

And in fact, this week I'm doing my third Podcast Show London, which is now the biggest podcast show in the world.

I'm quite a nervous speaker. I don't really like it very much, much for this kind of thing, but it gives me that instant credibility so that when clients who are making a serious investment in me, look at who I am and what I've done, I would wager my best clients

don't read my book, but I think they go, oh, cool, he's written the book on it. Now what's he gonna say about where I am now. 'cause I haven't got time for this shit. So that's how it's helped me and it's definitely paid for itself many times over. And I think it will continue to do so despite the fact that I've learned so much more in the intervening years.

Garry Mullins: Yeah, that's super useful. Are there any other things that you would change in the book off the top of your head?

But since then, I've worked with much larger organizations. With $80 million a year multi-state healthcare organizations, and I've applied different methods through the lens of people with a massive team, like hundreds of people. So you can do more when you've got a bigger business with different segments, right?

You've got different locations, you've got different skill sets within your team. You are offering more than one product, whereas a lot of the people I was working with were offering coaching.

So the one thing I will say to you is. I found as a muso to muso. I would say to you, I found it incredibly uncomfortable to talk about the fact that I'd written a book and I completely siloed who I was as a guy that does business away from the decades of experience I've got as a muso in the trenches, right?

Because I felt that most musicians would think I'd let the side down. The self-talk around how I show up as a musician is brutal when I know I've been basically making money in business doing something else. And what I've learned over the years is that's my problem and I have to go over it.

I think we basically both grew up where we had a preconception of what being a successful musician was. And you can talk to the people that we put on pedestals and they'll all tell you that industry and those careers don't really exist anymore. Yeah, a little bit self helpy on my part, but also hopefully that gives you some context. The reason why I quite like doing a podcast this way is 'cause you can hear me talk about it and it's not just copy on a page. You can hear the tone and you can hear the questions I'm asking myself all the time.

And I hope that's useful to you and to anyone that might be listening.

Garry Mullins: Yeah, just to follow up on that premise, I have similar mental challenges to work out how I promote and present myself in different arenas. I'm quite as you alluded to with the car thing, I'm quite busy in the exotic car space, and

Toby Goodman: You and me were on a gig together like a couple of weeks ago and I got a phone call from somebody who I thought, 'cause I played you the voicemail 'cause he was funny. Somebody who, is probably the person who I love playing with the most and I've realized over the years that he doesn't care what else I'm doing. And in fact, he supports what else I'm doing 'cause I've spoken to him about it. And 'cause he happens to be an American he knows of some of the more prominent figures I've worked with in the US government former administrators and stuff, and he's cool with it.

And if he's still calling me for gigs

Doesn't really matter. So actually I care less.

It has to be that, and some of that is you don't even have to speak to them before you can decide how you might pitch yourself. Because if someone is driven to a nice country pub and they've pulled up in a Ferrari and you end up standing next to 'em at the bar, you're probably not gonna start talking about music to them because you've got other things that you can talk about and connect with.

So the environment is really so crucial. One of the things that Julian Treasure's and I talk about 'em all the time, and I will continue to talk about him 'cause he's incredible. One of his TED talks talks about, there's a noise of a building site or something that he puts on quickly and he speaks over it.

The biggest thing is tell me all of the other elements at play. But when it comes to online stuff, there will be an episode that comes out next week. So certainly by the time this goes out with my friend Dayna Steele. And Dayna is a Texan who is a rock and roll dj. She married a NASA pilot and she was the first person to set up the NASA online store.

Garry Mullins: Oh wow.

Toby Goodman: So there's two things. So she's Rock and Roll radio dj. She's a entrepreneur who moved NASA merch online. It's no small thing.

She's written 17 books. One of them is. About how she coped during her mother's decline during Alzheimer's.

Like she's cool, she's got a really interesting life. She does loads of cool things. The thing that I realized and I know this about her because she's helped me a lot she's been a client and she's also helped me a lot, is that she does definitely live to serve and help people. And she's always done that.

Garry Mullins: Yeah,

Toby Goodman: Ah. Tax man.

But who's asking? These are the things I'm interested in. I've built businesses in all of these areas. Join me. Ask me a question. Find out something. So turn every part of what you do into an action plan for that person. Book great live music in the UK for your special event as a generic CTA, that is still quite specific.

Tell me about what you wanna do in the car arena. 'cause I know you own cars and I know you attend events and I know you are in communities. What does that look like? Is that something that's happening or is that a plan for the future?

places of interest that the members of the club might find interesting to attend, so I have to organize those events. You mentioned the watches, we've got visits to watch factories in the UK and other designers and so on. And so there are a lot of people that could benefit from the network that I look after.

And one of the things that I've been thinking about, which ties in really well with a podcast premise is creating events and talking to high profile and characters from within Motorsport. And so it actually leads on to my next question, which is like, how would you recommend cultivating ideal prospective guests who don't necessarily have an immediate need of what I might be able to reciprocate with?

So obviously I'm familiar, in the book that you've got good, better, and best outcomes and, best is, them employing me potentially better is me making a recommendation and joining, the interviewee with somebody that in my network. If I don't have really, if I, if they're not in a position where they need either of those things, how can I create a relationship?

My concern is like how I get to the point where I can do that with credibility, with nothing really to offer.

Toby Goodman: Okay, so first of all, I love everything about this. Second of all, you have everything to offer and there's a couple of things. I will pull directly from, I think Seth Godin. Are you familiar with Seth

Garry Mullins: Yeah, exactly. Not personally, but yeah.

Toby Goodman: Know. Seth, one of the big boys.

One of his phrases is "people like us do things like this".

Garry Mullins: Yeah.

Toby Goodman: So you've said to me. Turns out people who drive nice cars also like nice watches.

other luxury stuff. And you sell what I can buy from you today are experiences that make things more memorable.

And that is music. That is a live music solution, right? So that's how those markets link. So that's super cool. I don't know if this is Seth Godin, but I'm pretty sure that I heard him say it first.

So I don't know who said this, but have you ever heard someone talk about no one buys a drill?

Garry Mullins: Yeah, I know that story. Yeah.

Toby Goodman: But they buy a tool so they can get the hole in the wall. They don't want a hole in the wall. They want a space, but the nail blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

They want a picture, they want, and then it ends with, they want the feeling that the picture gives them.

I'm sure they, I could have said that more eloquently, but you know the story. So people don't buy a drill. They buy something that enables 'em to have the feeling that the picture that they can hang on the wall gives them the short version.

And those people value their time. They know what their time is worth and they will spend money to create feelings and memorable experiences. And that is the common thread between you selling a band and you being a recognized, respected community member of the Ferrari Owners Club. I don't know what part of the book you've got to, but when I started that podcast years ago, we didn't start a podcast about a band,

Garry Mullins: Yep.

Toby Goodman: And it can be sponsored by your, live music company. So every time someone listens, they understand they're talking to someone who knows their shit in the car space and in the watch space and in the kind of luxury lifestyle brand space, which you're really into, and you are putting your brand of, there's nothing worse than putting on a party with all your, you put your watch on, you've parked your cars up there, nice and clean in the front drive, you're playing a shitty Spotify playlist.

Because that might end up being, okay, there's a podcast, 'cause that's the source content, it's a human conversation and all of that stuff.

Are you already sending out a monthly newsletter?

Garry Mullins: Yeah. That goes out to the members.

Toby Goodman: So all of that stuff, and I don't know if there are additional political conversations you need to have because it's a larger, Ferrari already branded and stuff. But I would look at Ferrari's people and say, I'm gonna improve this.

Or whatever

Garry Mullins: Yeah.

Toby Goodman: You can do it in cool ways that appeal to them. And then, a lot of the business is gonna happen a. When you've pressed stop in the, in what I call the Post Coital Pod moment, like that's when the business is gonna happen. 'cause they're gonna go, that was amazing. Thanks for asking me all those questions.

That was a really fun chat. And then your good, better, best is okay, they might become a client. They might say, my one of my daughters are getting married and my son's got an anniversary. And yeah, they might book 10 events with you, like great. Or they might be someone who isn't quite there but runs an independent Ferrari dealership.

Garry Mullins: Yeah.

Toby Goodman: and who might book you once a year.

If we know that about people, then we also know they like to be first in the queue for anything that you've got. So that's a positioning thing for you, but it's also fun. It's actually something that you're like, I'm like jazzed to do this because you can see it .

But I think it's it's clever. I can see the value of doing it and it's quite exciting as a premise.

Toby Goodman: I've got some notes I wrote down. I wonder what this episode is gonna be called, right?

Garry Mullins: Yeah.

Toby Goodman: Oh, what would I call this episode? I was just as we were waiting to get on the call and I wrote How to make Money Mixing Business With Pleasure.

Garry Mullins: I like it.

Toby Goodman: Because I know that about you. I know that you're into that stuff. I also would look at the kind of, not the dark side, but the side that gets a lot of shit around dudes with nice cars, right? People with flashy cars get abuse, right? There's a lot of posing on the internet.

Garry Mullins: Yeah.

Toby Goodman: Yeah. So that's very different from some bro who's bought a neon colored Lambo or whatever. Like it's a different market, and I would imagine that the people that you hang around absolutely despise those people because they actually devalue the class.

They appreciate the details. I would play on that massively, and I'd use the repellent part of the magnetic marketing to say this is about people who love the art and the science of these machines, these cars, these watches, these luxury items and find true pleasure and true joy in it but aren't necessarily wearing Burberry tracksuits.

I'm exaggerating, but like telling people, I say this probably all the time as well, and I don't mind repeating it, talking about what, who you're not for and what you stand against in some ways is so powerful to them.

I think you can enter the conversation in the head of someone who's I've just sold my company for 10 million pounds, for example.

And now I'm in a position where I can do that, but I actually wanna spend time with it and I want to meet people that are into the same stuff. And I wanna be around people who have also had an exit about the same value. So I've, I'm also probably looking because I'm upward upwardly mobile and I've made an exit.

I'm probably in a weird kind of way looking to make new friends that I have something in common with, rather than people I grew up with who I don't anymore. For whatever reason. That's not always gonna be the case, but that's gonna be one of the things that's happening. And making friends as a middle-aged person is weird.

I was thinking about this morning 'cause a lot of my clients are in men's clubs and stuff and they're cool. That's just a thing. Whereas in the UK that's a bit odd. It's a bit of a non thing.

Garry Mullins: Yeah.

Toby Goodman: It's music or you find your way, but also you can use that again, someone talks, when we talk about building communities, people will come for one thing because you've said... anyone on this list or any of people in my close community will get first access to when the next watch Factory tour is exclusively for Ferrari owners clubs.

Get it here and they'll be like, oh, I really wanna secure my space on the waiting list for that watch. I really want that day out. They'll have such a good time. If you do a good job, they'll stay for the community.

Garry Mullins: Yeah.

Toby Goodman: Which is exactly the same as the conversation I had with Ciara about women drum camps.

As much as, I hate to say these two words, your personal brand. Sounds like you quite, I also like this by the way, like being a good guy to know . Gary, I'll sort you out.

Garry Mullins: Yeah.

Toby Goodman: Think about those things and what they're saying and when you onboard them. This is what's so beautiful is you've already got the community, right?

You get to say, guys, I'm stepping up a gear. I'm gonna start a Ferrari owners podcast. I really wanna get to know you a little bit more. Here's a Google form that says, why do you love Ferrari's? What's the first Ferrari bought? What's your dream ferrari? Who's your favorite racing driver? What other luxury items do you enjoy?

Is it a watch? What kind of watch is it? When were you born? Maybe they don't wanna give their age, but between this age. So get the, get that info. And then you can look and you might, I dunno if you want to go that far in, but. Do you have children? Great. Are they grown up and married?

'cause he just had that data point.

And he just sold cars all year round to everyone in those families.

Garry Mullins: That's powerful.

Toby Goodman: Really powerful. When you think about if someone can afford a Ferrari, they're a hundred percent in the market for making sure the live music is good.

Garry Mullins: Yeah.

Toby Goodman: You've always dreamed of having that event in that location. The dress is sorted, the suit, the tailoring is awesome.

What are the other complimentary suppliers around any event, any landmark event? Now let's secure the memories with the perfect soundtrack. Boom. How do you feel?

One of my other questions was gonna be about how you maintain relationships with perspective, but also past podcast guests. That you've illustrated there, that's one of the things that you could easily do and remain in that sphere and be a constant at the top of people's minds for something.

Toby Goodman: So worst, not worst case, like just a really good practice. A good practice is to say after you've done the recording. Thanks for being on the show. So postal pod moment. Hey Gary. I don't wanna blow my own trumpet or anything, but I think I'm a pretty well connected guy. Who can I connect you with?

But if I'm the guy that introduced you to a dentist who saved your tooth, then you'll talk about me to people who wanna start a podcast maybe for their business and are not sure how. That's how that goes. So the interesting thing also about a Ferrari owner is that I imagine many of them own businesses.

And I would wanna talk to them about their business and I would want to put them on stage. We're gonna talk for 10 minutes about your love of cars, and I want to say thank you. I want you to talk about your business to me because I want the rest of the community to know what it is you do and how you help your clients and what kind of results you get for your clients.

What are the things that people miss? There's always good questions to ask people who are experts in anything, if you're interested and it stops you from being. Let me tell you about the great, five piece lineup we've got. No one cares. No one cares if it's five or six piece. They just care about it being the coolest thing and the best thing and the highest

Garry Mullins: a feeling thing. But you mentioned,

Toby Goodman: feeling thing.

Yeah. And you say when it comes to Ferrari. It's literally one of those brands where it's yeah, I know. I already know one thing about you, which is you like driving the best machines in the world. You love the feeling it gives you and you've worked your ass off to get to a stage where you own one.

Or the tread pattern because they're not at work. So by mixing that somewhere else and then just feeding it into the community, they're listening to each other's stories between meetups, you will get loads more bookings if you do that. There's literally no question.

Garry Mullins: I can see how that would come to pass. Certainly. Yeah, we've got a lot of work to do.

Toby Goodman: Here's the thing, you don't really have that much work to do. ' cause you've got a Zoom account and you can press record. There's a few things, but you can delegate a lot of the post-production. I would just think about 10, 10 people who, you know, who are cool, who've got quirky businesses, who spin a good yarn.

Just get them on and say, look, I wanna try this thing. To put it out. It'd be a great value add for the people in the club. Great. So I wouldn't overthink it. I would just do it.

So we've talked about that a little bit. One of the other things that I was going to ask about was what your advice is for someone that's creating a completely new business with no existing clients, where the target avatars are someone like musicians, in my case they will be musicians, but the product I'm looking to sell is ultimately going to be subscription based.

So yeah, I guess the real thing is like they're starting from a completely new slate, does that change anything in your view?

What comes to mind is, do you like them? Which you do because you are one in some ways where you are a musician for sure, but can they pay? Yeah, but how much can they pay? So what is actually sustainable,

Garry Mullins: Yeah.

Toby Goodman: right? So there's that.

Is it worth the bother? Think about that clearly. What's the value that they get? Why is it different? All of the standard shit that any new business should be. Like why should a musician subscribe to what it is that you've got to offer? And I think there's some really great case studies of really good music-based subscription stuff working very well.

But I've got a lot of questions and I'll tell you right now, like I'm doing this because I love talking to musicians about business and I've found out that there's a few of us around

And this creates great content for me. But you are not paying for it. And that's cool. That seems like a cool way to start a relationship.

Privately. Fine. But I don't, that's not even slightly at the top of my mind. What's at the top of my mind why I'm doing this is it helps me prove to people I know what I'm talking about because it's a conversation with somebody who I consider to be a peer in a lot of ways. That's the position I like to have with clients.

I don't like this kind of, I work for you and like I don't, so these are the kind of peer-to-peer conversations I have with clients and that's how I like to position it. And I think you've got the same with the Ferrari thing. A great result might be that . That accountant happens to own a Ferrari that you know is looking for someone to help him with his marketing and messaging, and he's trying to get into the 21st century with all this podcasting stuff.

And if it doesn't exist, are you an absolute genius or is there a very good reason why it doesn't exist? Without talking about exactly what it is, 'cause I'm not gonna do that to you. I would speak to the person in the target market or a proportion of people in the target market. And I would say something along the lines of... what would it be worth to you if you could x?

And what are the, what are musician's most pressing needs would depends on where they are in their life. So if they're in their twenties, late teens, twenties, thirties, most of them are just still hustling. They wanna make money, they wanna travel, they wanna have a good time, they wanna get laid, like they wanna do all the things.

Garry Mullins: Yeah.

Toby Goodman: Musician isn't good enough and professional musician isn't good enough.

It's like a professional musician who is also constrained by certain things. And then think about who they are. Think about who you wanna work with. Think about who you want as clients who won't piss you off. There's nothing worse. I'm sure we can both agree than dealing with, it could be the best player in the world.

They're a nightmare to work with.

Garry Mullins: Yeah.

Toby Goodman: You dunno if they're gonna turn up, they're not the kind of people you want. So what are the other things they've got in common other than the technical skill of being a musician? In your case. I'd look at that and I'd be really careful.

Does this mean I can move house? It's not the money it's what I can do with it. Does this mean we can upgrade to premium economy on that long haul flight? Or does this mean I can fly business? It's like, why am I doing this? So I think the fastest path to actual revenue for you is probably to stay over on the other side of the conversation we had, and then if you see a real need for it it also makes money. Great. Definitely do it. But actually, what's the time cost? And is it gonna be, is it gonna be as fun as going to car shows and watch factories with guys that are worth, tens of millions of pounds that just love hanging out with you and helping you grow your business?

Garry Mullins: Yeah.

Toby Goodman: I think you and I are

Garry Mullins: Yeah.

And the answer is, people who like luxury watches and play music. And it's not my problem guys.

Garry Mullins: Yeah. I think one of the things that I am aware of is that challenge of asking the question, what's practical, reasonable and valuable for musicians specifically to pay for a subscription based service? And also combined with that, like that's a field that I know really well, and I've got a lot of connections in that realm.

A lot of experience. And I feel like that's probably my best avenue for creating that value in the short term. And I'm still quite green, I think, with the supercar space. And I, it is not to say that I couldn't overcome that. And obviously I'm already creating value for a lot of people in that, in a very specific area of the country.

Toby Goodman: But the positioning is slightly more high end than that. It's your live music agency. Which is true, I'm not, that's not bullshit. Like you put out more than one band. So therefore

Garry Mullins: yeah.

Toby Goodman: there's that and that aligns much more with, oh, I run a band that plays the dog and duck, every Thursday night.

That's not what you're doing. Second of all, something else that you've just said that I would like to help you with. You just said you feel like you are green in the supercar space compared to music, because that's your technical skill.

Garry Mullins: Yeah.

Toby Goodman: I think that's not a problem at all.

They are shitty communicators normally.

Garry Mullins: Yep.

Toby Goodman: and your whole thing when it comes to podcasting, when it comes to leading a group, is not to be the expert.

Garry Mullins: Yep.

Toby Goodman: Not to be the expert. It's you know about the hero's journey as a concept. There's highs and lows, and this is how you win.

That's the sort of arc of so many stories that have been written, apologies for the terrible articulation of that, but what you are as someone who leads a community is not the hero. You are the guide. So when you think about music, and I think about music, we can both, because we're both technicians, we can have a very geeky conversation about dotted eighth and eighth note feels, right?

You're talking about what happens when you could say, I have found the best independent ferrari dealer in the Southwest who keeps your cars running so that you get the feeling like you, you just, you are the guide. You're someone they trust. And I think they like the fact that you're on the journey with the technical stuff, but the value is in curation, right?

The value is not in. I know the five best musicians that make the super band ever, and no one cares. Like you found the five best musicians who work well together to make your event memorable. That's what you're selling. No one gives a shit how good you are at playing the guitar, and no one gives a shit about how good I'm at playing the drums.

That's the gutting truth of it.

Garry Mullins: Yeah.

Garry Mullins: Okay.

Toby Goodman: because part of the podcast thing in this case is documenting a journey. Right now I'm here, these are the cars I've owned I dream of owning these cars one day. I'm growing my business. I'm like, that's a lovely thing.

People will want to help you. People will want to be part of your story. If you guide them to this call event, they will guide you to their friend who's got a massive end of year party for their private bank you don't like. That's how that's gonna work. I'm like really excited that you've got that. 'cause I didn't know to what extent you had that.

I just knew that you liked cars

Garry Mullins: Okay.

What's been most useful to you in the last hour?

Garry Mullins: I would say the revelation that I don't necessarily have to separate those two worlds and those two interests, and that actually there are, lots of practical and meaningful ways that I can combine those two disparate interests. But I've made as many notes as I possibly can.

And I'll definitely be watching back to bulk these out, but there's been so much that's been so valuable there. Yeah.

Toby Goodman: Mate. Thanks for doing it.

Garry Mullins: I'm really grateful.

Toby Goodman: I'll leave you with one last thing because it's really a strong feeling that I have around your target market and your community. Is that people who buy Ferraris , people that appreciate the finer things in life, like less noise and are willing to pay for it.

There's nothing more offensive to our discerning ears. And that is the same as you settling for DJ double decks, Dave And you know that because I invest in Ferraris too, so that's how you tie those things together.

Garry Mullins: Yeah.

That was really useful. Yeah, I like the comparison.

Thank you Toby so much. Thank you so much for your time.

Toby Goodman: Oh, mate, pleasure man.

Garry Mullins: been really valuable.