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In this episode, I sit down with Marcia Reynolds — one of the most respected names in the coaching world. She’s coached leaders in 47 countries, listed among the Top 10 Global Coaches by Global Gurus, and has served as the fifth global president of the International Coaching Federation. Marcia’s the author of five books, including the international bestsellers “Coach the Person, Not the Problem” and “Breakthrough Coaching.”

We talk about the early days of coaching (yes, 1995!), how she stumbled into the profession, and what it was like helping shape the foundation of the ICF. But what really stands out in this conversation is her wisdom on what actually creates trust — and why respect matters even more than compassion.

Marcia shares how she broke into the “major leagues” of corporate coaching, why respect is the most critical aspect of trusted relationships, and why the future of coaching is all about presence.

If you’re a coach or consultant navigating the noise of automation, this episode is a refreshing reminder that what people crave most is real connection.

Connect with Marcia:

• https://covisioning.com/
• https://www.linkedin.com/in/marciareynolds/

Marsha Reynolds is a rockstar of coaching. She has coached leaders in 47 countries. Coaches 50s has listed her as one of the top leadership coaches and global gurus listed Marsha as one of the top 10 coaches in the world. And by the way, she's the number one woman in the list for over five years. the fifth global president of the International Coaching Federation.

and she's included in their circle of distinction for her contributions in the coaching community. She's the author of five books, including the international bestseller, Coach the Person, Not the Problem, and Breakthrough Coaching. I'm so honored to have Marcia in this podcast. So let's get started.

Hello, Marcia, welcome to the Business of Trust podcast.

Thank you. I'm glad to be here.

Well, I'm so honored that you said yes to being a guest. ⁓ well, I would like to start.

Right.

You're gonna age me.

and you lived through it, you were right at that moment. So can you tell us a little bit about how you got into this line of

Mm-hmm.

Thank

honestly, I didn't know at that moment that it was going to be the career It was the last day of my last job, so I had already resigned. I had intentions of starting my own business. I had been teaching leadership for 16 years in companies, so I wanted to continue that and help people learn and grow.

But because I had been teaching and I even in my effort to make my teaching, my training programs really effective, I even got a second master's degree in adult learning and I was constantly researching how do I make people learn and grow, really change their behavior. People love my classes, they give me happy faces, you know, and then they go out and as soon as they

It feels awkward when they try a new behavior. They go back to doing it the old way and they rationalize they don't have time, this doesn't work, whatever. when I was leaving, I thought, okay, I'm still going to continue to teach because that's what I do. ⁓ But then this thing called coaching came up and the way they described it, I said, this is a different way of people learning and growing, which it piqued my interest because I've always been a researcher.

You know, like how does this work? Well, when I called just to talk to someone about this, there was really only a couple coaching schools at the time. And the person in the articles was Thomas Leonard who started CoachU and the International Coach Federation. And they said, well, actually we're doing, Thomas is going around and doing coaching demos, you know, so you're invited to see one. And as soon as I watched a coaching demo, said, mm.

Something's different here that impacts people in a different way that changes their mind and they commit more to the behavioral change. So I signed up right away. thought, okay, so this could be something else that I do. Again, not recognizing it would become the thing that I do. And then I happened to get into it right as it was coming out into the world and was able to.

you know, get in the foundation of the international coach federation and build this thing ⁓ was just, you know, they say that, you know, luck comes up when you're doing all the work and it appears. Well, it came at the right time that I was able to be significant in the field. I love to research, I love to write, help all coaches do coaching better.

You

You know, and as I kept researching more and at the same time, emotional intelligence came into our awareness and I was learning that and teaching that. ⁓ It's what inspired me to get my doctorate because I said, I got to learn more about what happens in the brain that's different from just teaching. neuroscience is such a new field. So there's always even now new research.

So it's so fascinating to me and I'm passionate about it because of the impact it makes. I just.

I'm so grateful that that article landed in my computer on that last day of my last job.

it was somehow

meant to be. And if we fast forward like

with

Mm-hmm. Yeah. Mm-hmm.

Yeah,

of coaching.

my first few clients actually, you know, were corporations, but were people I knew. You know, like my first big client was Medtronic Semiconductor, but the head, the VP of HR actually hired me at Microship Technology. And then when they had a restructuring, he left and went to Medtronic, so he knew me.

and had trusted to hire me back then. So I looked at, you look at who you know and you reach out and it's about the courage to say I'm doing this thing even if it's not perfect. But actually I wasn't even selling him coaching but he was the one that said, I think this coaching thing's kind of interesting and maybe we should teach it to our leaders. So we were kind of exploring it together.

But beyond that, a lot of those companies on your list actually came from my coaching community. Ernst & Young came from people who, internal coaches, you know, that were working for Ernst & Young and said, ⁓ you know, we really want you to come work with us. Because they have, a lot of these companies have a huge pool of internal coaches. And so I've worked with the coaches for Google, for Microsoft, for

Ernst & Young for the military. So either they knew me because I taught a class, ⁓ worked with them, maybe even coached so people often ask, well, why should I join the International Coach Federation or EMCC? ⁓ What do they do for me? And it's like it...

It's not about what they do for you, it's the community. You've got to into leadership, let people know you, get to know your community, work together on projects. And, you know, we're all in this together. And so that whole networking thing with your coaching community is critical. You know, so even if it's just local, like people...

here in Phoenix, Arizona, you know, they get to know each other and they help each other find business. So I think that, you know, we don't do this on our own. It's very

a beautiful way of saying that I completely subscribe to that. And that's honestly the reason why I started this podcast, because I think there's so much noise out there and the human component of building authentic relationships is what works. And I love that you just put that into evidence.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

I want to say just

one more thing about that. People hire people they know, and even if they've only seen me online teaching, then they think they know me, So you've got to get out there. You've got to put your face out there. You've got to share things, you know, and join your community. So because then they feel safe with you. They know you.

In the spirit of feeling safe and that they know you, mean, this is called the business of trust. And I want to take a quote from your book, from the Breakthrough Coaching book that we can see in the back there. ⁓ It reads, ⁓ sincere respect is the strongest stimulus of positive feeling when interacting. When it comes to creating trust and safety, feeling respected beats out the other factors, including compassion.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah

Mm-hmm.

And I was so surprised when I read this. Can you perhaps tell us what does respect means in this context and why is it so important?

Mm-hmm.

Yeah, yeah, you know, actually, when I first read the that supports that, I was surprised, too. thought, that I feel the person cares about me. But, you know, respects says, I acknowledge you as a significant human being, you know, and and what we're seeking, what our soul is seeking is to be seen and heard and valued for what we contribute.

Yes, I want you to care about me, but if you respect who I am and what I do, then I feel not just that I belong, but that I should be here. And that's such a great gift we give people and that is often by leaders or even teachers that I know this and I'm giving it to you.

but that I'm not necessarily looking at you at respecting it what you know, So it's such an important human element either creates connection or disconnects that feeling of respect, not just to say, you know, I honor you, I respect your work, but

to really, you know, to feel respect for the person in front of you is so critical.

And you can't fake it, right? It's a very human part. I I subscribe to American Buddhism. there is the Namaste concept of, see the divinity in you. And I think that's the only way to access that.

Yeah, yeah, exactly.

words have no energy, you know, they're just words. ⁓ But emotions actually put out measurable energy. I mean, this is how I know it's okay to be with you or not. So my brain has to know this is safe. That's my brain's primary function is to know to keep me safe. ⁓

to protect me. So I'm energetically reading, is this safe? And so the emotions you put out of respect, of caring, of that, I'm generally interested. These are emotions that my brain must read. So you can't just say it to me, because again, there's no measurable energy from a word. There is from an emotion.

You know, and my radar can tell if you're genuine or not, if you really mean it. You know, so it's like a subconscious thing that I'm reading this in order for me to feel, to be safe.

I'm just thinking of how... ⁓

this philosophy that you practice and embody comes through even in indirect conversations. when I heard your interview with Damien, our coming friend Damien Goldberg, he interviewed you for his podcast that we produced that lived with a coaching mindset. And when I heard you speak there, I could just something about the way you said it and like what you said, the importance of presence. I just felt immediately a sense of like,

you

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

I could trust this person.

Yeah, but that's the critical piece. Right. Right.

You know, I have to come into any conversation, ⁓ whether it's coaching or whatever, with that, know, ⁓ I'm happy to be with you. You know, that that's the energy I have to bring. whether I have to sit down and ground myself and create that or just start making that just who I am.

You know, that that's the, that's, that then opens the door to whatever you can explore in a conversation.

Mm-hmm.

That's essential, that's the essential skill. So it's not just this thing that you kind of think about, but it's the essential skill of having effective conversations is bringing in that I'm happy to be with you.

Hmm.

⁓ energy.

in the relationship of coach, coachee, ⁓ you advocate for ⁓ the practice of.

Mm-hmm.

unselfing, right, of detaching your ego from the picture. And you're going to laugh, but like I'm single. And when I'm dating someone that I'm very interested in, I have this thing in my head that says like, no agendas, no agendas. Because when I put an agenda, I'll inevitably put a mask of the person that I want this person to think I am, to like me. So I have to repel. And but in the context of

Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm

Thank

Yeah. Alright, right.

professionals setting, inevitably

we're gonna be in a moment where we're gonna meet someone who we know is gonna be very important for our career. And there's this like agenda bug trying to have us do something, but.

Yeah.

I want them to know how

great I am.

Yes, but on the other

hand, what truly builds that ⁓ relationship is showing up in an unself way. How does one reconcile one with the other? Are they are odds or not?

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah, you know, that's an interesting ⁓ point you make that we call it posturing, you know, that ⁓ whenever I'm in a new environment, whether it's a team or on a date, you know, or an interview or first day on the job, can, it comes back to

the safety that I must put out. These people must know who I am and what I can do. And you're absolutely right. It's the worst thing because I, ⁓ I, I'm single, but I quit dating because it's like, that's all they do is sit there and tell me about their stories and who they are. And it's like, it's like, ⁓ it's so boring. ⁓ know, yeah. Instead of coming with, you know, let's just be here together with each other.

You know, but to understand even with coaches, it's like a little bit of, I have to demonstrate I'm a good coach first, you know, instead of just being there with them. and yet again, people pick up, you know, who we are and, and, and, and what we can do without saying, you know, so like even in my last job, it was a very significant job. And, you know, it to run the training department, but they were facing,

big change and they had had layoffs. I was hired the day of a layoff, but they're going to restructure the entire organization and needed to change the culture. you know, and they hired me and I went to my boss, I said, why did you pick me? You know, I knew this other woman that was vying for the position had far more experience doing that than I did. And he said, ⁓ we have a lot of changes to make.

We need someone who's going to dig in and do this and do exactly what it takes and not give up, you know, and just, and we'll give everything to this. And he said, I know from all that you've accomplished and all that you do and that you keep, you know, taking on different challenges, you're going to have exactly that determination, that dogged ⁓ persistence.

The courage to step in and do that, I know that and that's why I hired you. It wasn't based on my experience. It was based on what he thought was needed by my personality. I never told him that. He just got it from the way that I am and what I've done. And so we're reading people all the time. Again, it's our protective mechanism. We have to read, read the room, read people.

You know, and so honestly, it's the energy behind our words that that's so critical. People see that they'll give you opportunities. And almost in all of my jobs, ⁓ it was more about trusting what I personally brought, you know, not necessarily the skills. Every company I ever joined, I had no idea.

Yeah.

what they were doing, you know, what they made. ⁓ But that's not why they were hiring me, I went from healthcare to computer hardware to semiconductor and knew nothing, but I had the idea like, well, I'll figure it out, you know? And they trusted that, that, okay, she's gonna come in and figure it out. And so, you know, I think mostly it was that

⁓ courage and determination that they picked up. And that's the essential element that opens up opportunities.

Now Marcia, after this trajectory of 30 years in coaching for you, is there something that you wish you'd have learned earlier on about having a successful firm?

Mm-hmm.

was a bit general starting off. I was holding on to what I had done in the past, all the leadership training and even teaching some things that I didn't really like to teach, but can you teach delegation? Can you teach conflict resolution or whatever it was? ⁓ But I kept finding that, but this...

I used to do that, it's not a challenge anymore. And when I finally made the decision that, no, I'm a coaches coach. I like working with coaches or leaders that want to coach, that I want to focus what I do. As soon as I focused, the business took off, and it wasn't a struggle at all anymore.

For some

people, the feeling of focusing can feel like letting go of lot of opportunities and they feel that, well, if I focus on these things, what about all of these other things that I...

you

Yeah, well, there's always going to be a lot of other things,

you know. But the thing is, then you're dissipating your energy. That it's really better that people get to know you. I mean, then they don't know you of what you do. For years when I was teaching emotional intelligence, you know, people knew me as the brain lady. Well, they know I still have that expertise, but they don't call me that anymore.

You know, I think they see me as a coach's coach, that I teach coaching. you it's like you're not letting opportunities go. You're opening a wider door for the one thing that you most love to do. And so if you stay with that, then people get to know you for that, get to trust you for that. It's much better than, you do a lot of things and there's no...

a real identifier ⁓ in that. And even on an individual basis, every time I worked on a proposal or worked on something really hard and then didn't get the business, as soon as I'm like, okay, I wasn't supposed to do that and really just let it go, boom, something else came in. So it's almost like you have to create the space in order to invite it in. So there is an energy component.

⁓ to identifying who you are and putting that out in the world ⁓ and knowing that what's going to come back is the best clients. If they didn't want to work with you, they weren't your best clients anyway.

Beautifully said. And Marcia, you're clearly someone who is very passionate about what they do. And now in 2025 in the world, like supercomputers, general intelligence, AI, all of this, is there something that excites you, that you're very excited at right now, the way it excited you back in 1995 with coaching?

Yeah.

actually what excites me the most artificial intelligence in the face of what we can do so we don't have to count on that. I am not one that thinks that my avatar can coach you when I'm not there. I do not believe that and I will never do that. So what is driven is that I've always said it's the presence that we bring.

makes the difference. But everywhere I go, and ⁓ particularly in parts of the world where ⁓ academic excellence is the most important thing, really big in Asia, it was big in my family with my cultural background, you have to get A's and you have to do it right. And so there was like, I need the formulas, I need the skills and not a real focus on presence.

But that's not going to do it. That's going to get old and it doesn't really work because you're not working within the context of the client. And they don't necessarily feel safe with you. So what's happened now is that, well, simply, AI will be able to replicate just the skills. not in my lifetime will it be able to replicate that human interaction to where we really connect and things just the magic happens in the space between.

You know, and ⁓ that now it's a necessity for coaches to have that, that now they'll listen to me and they're eager and I'm finding it in companies as well that, you know, the concept they keep asking me for leadership presence, but understanding that presence is about energy. You know, how do I get people to trust me? ⁓ How can I engage them ⁓ with the energy I put out, not just

formulaic words I say. And so what AI has done is the counter of made the presence even more important. Yay. That all of that I had been working on and writing about and my next version of Coach the Person, Not the Problem is coming out in March. ⁓

I really like the first chapter, I totally threw out the old one and made the first chapter all about this, that this is the way our profession is going to survive. You know, and if you don't do that, you know, you will be replicated. Yeah. And, and, and it won't exist. so ⁓ putting more focus on ⁓ that energetic connection that we make with our emotions and, and maintaining that throughout a conversation.

is going to be the critical piece. So I'm happy about that and passionate about that and finding more and more people wanting that.

So beautiful because there is a deeply human component of when it comes, I always say business relationships are still human relationships. I mean that and we all long for that sense of emotional safety to be ourselves wherever. And I can't think of AI being able to co-regulate me, especially the way I feel with another person. They don't have the same nervous system. But so, Marcia. ⁓

Thank

Yes.

Yeah, right. Yeah, well, it's still artificial.

You know, we forget that A stands for artificial.

Now Marcia,

if somebody wants to learn more about your work and the way you help coaches, where would you like to send them?

Yeah, well, recognizing not all countries have access to LinkedIn, a lot of people find me on LinkedIn, ⁓ but my website is ⁓ out. Well, you can find it two ways, but co visioning one word, co visioning.com. ⁓ You can also find it at outsmartyourbrain.com. It, know, it cross talks.

⁓ that all my programs are described in there, all my books are described in there. And with the navigation on top, it should be fairly easy to find things. There's lots of free resources, ⁓ assessments, tip sheets, and things that are available. And there's a link that says resources. So just even going there and downloading things, ⁓ I like to share.

Thank you, Martian. Thank you so much for sharing so much today. You were incredibly generous and I really love this conversation. Thank you.

⁓ Thank you. Yeah, I do too. Thank you so much for asking me.

Hey, I hope you like my conversation with Marcia. If you're interested in learning how you can apply relationship-based marketing techniques in your business, go ahead and check out my work at Mundas Media. ⁓ We embody these principles of relationship-based marketing as a way to grow in a successful and enjoyable business. There is so much noise out there around this ad and like this automated funnel, but truly what Marcia just explained today is how...

relationships and the people who know you and the ability to feel to trust you and feel safe with you is what really matters. What we try to do at Mundes is to have a pipeline that allows you to create those relationships with people to have a system that allows you to meet new people and being firm of them in such a way that it builds trust and reputation. So check out our work at MundesMedia.com

And I hope you subscribe to whatever platform you're listening from because there's more of these conversations coming along. Bye for now.