Welcome to Roadmap to Joy!

In the first episode of our mental health podcast, Rob Gent, Chief Clinical Officer of Embark Behavioral Health, and Alex Stavros, Chief Executive Officer of Embark Behavioral Health, discuss the youth mental health crisis and the importance of secure family relationships. They also give advice for parents about how to talk to their children about tragic events, such as school shootings.

Be sure to subscribe to stay informed and find new ways to support the teen or young adult in your life on future episodes of Roadmap to Joy.

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Host Bios:

Rob Gent, M.A. LPC, is the Chief Clinical Officer and one of the founding members of Embark Behavioral Health. Rob has been with the company for 15 years and has led the Embark organization in clinical development and growth of numerous programs. He is the lead developer of the proprietary CASA Developmental Framework, which is pervasive throughout Embark’s programs.

Through his dedication to advancing clinical development, practice, and research, he has become a nationally recognized expert in the field. His specialization in clinical development is enhanced by his therapeutic expertise and has yielded such accomplishments as the development of; The CASA Developmental Framework, Vive Family Intensive Program, Calo Preteens, Canine Attachment Therapy-Transferable Attachment Program, and other specialized programs.

Rob’s dedication has led him to pursue his Ph.D in Psychology with an emphasis on development and attachment. He remains passionate about neurological, psychological, and physiological development and continues to focus on advancing research and the effectiveness of therapeutic interventions.

He resides in Tempe, Arizona, with his wife and two boys.

Alex Stavros, grew up in Peru working, playing and living alongside the troubled youth and desolate orphans of Lima’s slums. Alex’s childhood shaped his professional and personal aspirations. Prior to joining InnerChange Programs, Alex lived in California and was the Managing Partner of an investment fund, which he founded, focused on acquiring and leading mission-driven businesses.

Prior to Lia Capital, Alex lived in Boston and was the Associate Director of Firm-Wide Operations – working directly for the President and COO – of Cambridge Associates, the world’s largest global investment advisory firm to not for profit organizations. Alex also has experience in public service having worked at the Overseas Private Investment Corporation, a U.S. government agency that mobilizes private capital to help solve critical, global social and poverty challenges. And he worked on the Capitol Hill in Washington DC for a Minnesota Congressman. Alex has also earned a Certificate of Public Management from Stanford University. And, while at Stanford, was a Rising Fellow at the Hoover Institution, a world-renowned public policy think tank.

Alex loves the ocean and is a certified open water diver. He has served as a Board Fellow at one of the most enchanting Aquariums in the world, California’s Monterey Bay Aquarium. Alex spends his free time reading up on foreign affairs and international politics. Alex graduated with Honors from American University with both an Economic Theory and International Relations degree and he earned an MBA from Stanford’s Graduate School of Business. Alex is on the Board of Peruvian Partners, a nonprofit established to connect North Americans in a real and significant way with Peruvian families that live in abject poverty.

Alex lives in Phoenix, Arizona and is happily married to his wife, Maria-Paz, who has the most important job in the world, raising their two beautiful children.

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Hi, welcome. Welcome to Embark's first podcast of the

Roadmap to Joy. I'm Rob Gent, the Chief Clinical Officer of

Embark, here with Alex Stavros. Welcome, Alex.

Thanks, Rob.,excited to have this

conversation.

Yeah, me too, it'd be really fun to engage in a

dialogue. And the point is, to what? Boy, to bring relevant

topics, mental health topics, all kinds of health issues, to

really be able to shine some light on how do we treat mental

health? How do we increase mental health? How do we address

the current societal issues, and bring guests on, we're going to

be creating all kinds of conversations, to be able to be

as helpful as as we possibly can. So I'm super glad to be

here.

Yeah, me too.

Kids are over, and they're trying to keep it together.

Because it's just so much society's telling you to keep it

together. And it's all this is the stress and anxiety. This is

compounding and building on it, you know, surprising statistics.

Over the last two years, one in four teenagers contemplated

suicide. And I would assume that the vast majority of parents,

not one out of five, less than one out of five, would say that

there's a good chance that was their kid, the majority would

say there's no chance that's my kid. We don't understand the

amount of stress and pressure that's building on our kids.

It's building on our teenagers. And we're not set up because

we're being overwhelmed with similar information, to be able

to attune with them at a level that is necessary to deal with

this compounding of stress and anxiety, which then just ends up

blowing up. And then we're in crisis mode.

And then what happens is,

now I have no idea what no idea what to do. The simple question

often can be, how do I share this event with my kid? The

hardest question is what do I do now that that event and all the

other compounded, create this big blow up in this big crisis?

And I have no idea where to get help? I don't know anybody else

who is dealing with this because everybody else is keeping it

under wraps. So this youth mental health crisis is this

quiet epidemic spreading a lot of times just because this this,

this information flow this news flow, this social media that is

compounding that stress that you're talking about, with the

kids. Pressure to be active to participate in a lot of

activities to perform. All the kids know what, what schools

their peers got into for college, and they all know the

rankings and it's information overload everywhere. And the

parents know that too. And they know that the next door neighbor

is,

But it's really hard because we don't want to vilify

that stuff.

Uh huh.

That's That's what stuff though, right? Getting

into a great school, doing all the soccer, all that stuff, the

social medias. To swing the other way and to vilify it isn't

the solution.

Yeah, right.

Right. So it feels a little bit overwhelming. Even

for the parents.

Hey, even I'm the CEO of a youth mental health

company, and it's overwhelming for me.

Feeling overwhelmed, too?

Yeah, it's like if anybody should have the answer

should be you and me. But we should feel comfortable. We're

like, Hey, we got it. So it really tells you what, what's

going on out there. And how difficult this is.

It's so difficult. So I like this statistic. I just

got this one in three high school students experience

persistent feelings of sadness, or hopelessness. And that is a

40% increase since 2009. So we're seeing exponential

increases of anxiety, depression, sadness,

hopelessness. And it's hard because like, the, the numbers

are staggering. I mean, I could go through a list of things 5.8

million diagnosed with anxiety. 5.5 million diagnosed with

behavioral problems. 2.7 This is just in the US diagnosed with

depression. I thought this was fascinating too approximately

75% diagnosed with the depression also meet criteria

for anxiety, meaning what? These things go together, right?

You're not just having anxiety, here comes this school shooting.

We're already in a fragile state. But we're so susceptible

now to a whole series where it just gets it gets compounded the

amount of emotional distress we wonder why suicidality, suicide

sort of "ending my life" thoughts are happening.

I can actually have a tremendous amount of empathy for everybody.

The what the trigger in my mind is when

something like this happens, it's a reminder for us to go

home and hold our four year old and play with them on the

ground. Don't tell them the current events.

Because what does the playing do?

The playing connects with an adult that

shows that relationships can be safe, shows that you are valued,

develops a sense of self for the child develops their brain in a

way that interacts with another human being in productive and

healthy ways, sets that secure base. And when these events

happen, and we ask ourselves as parents, now what do I do, I

gotta go home and tell my kid about this. That's about

cognitively that we were just talking about an incident. When

we talk about how that is just one of hundreds of things these

kids are dealing with, that needs to be a reminder for us to

go home and be present, connect, don't go home and figure out a

way to tell them a stressful story better, go home and figure

out a way to give them experiences of safety and

unconditional acceptance.

Well, it's interesting, because I've gotten

the question, how much detail do I give my child?

Yeah.

That goes on.

Yeah.

And what are you saying?

It's not

about the detail, right? Yeah, no details better

probably. And given them more detail, like we know, just even

adult relationships doesn't calm

stress.

So in some ways, it's more about as a parent, it's

hard to make that shift to say, gosh, maybe I have this guilt or

something that I need to get ahead of the story.

Yeah

To be able to tell my kids rather than shifting into

this really relational mindset that if I get home from work,

it's actually more developmentally valuable to hold

them close, give me some eye contact, let me provide some

safe touch. Let me utilize some compassion and empathy to really

ground the child and wow, just even touching them communicates

it gives them a physiological neurological experience that I'm

inherently valuable.

Yeah.

I'm inherently valuable.

Yep.

And then I can actually go out I like to term

secure base and the attachment world we always talk about

secure base, right. Because secure base is about

what launching off from going off from Yeah.

And then you go out until you experience the world

and potentials for shame and hurt come up. And then you

return to the secure base.

A secure base gives you the context through

which you can engage how difficult the world is. And at

this age, developmentally, they aren't from a brain perspective,

from a nervous perspective, able to do it. So we as parents can't

just give them more information, we have to continue to build the

base. And as we build the base and build the base, that once

they're off on their own, and an awful event happens, they're

subconsciously going to be able to go back to a base and

interpret that extent, event and experience in a way that doesn't

overwhelm them unproductively. They can impact them

emotionally. They can connect with it empathetically and

compassionately that ends it, but it doesn't need to overwhelm

them emotionally in a way that is unproductive. But that can

only happen if if we're able to create that base. And that's not

through information early on in life.

Well I'd appreciate that Alex and I, if I'm, if

we're, as we're discussing that it's helpful to articulate the

secure base is the Genesis it's really where the formation of

this sense of worth and value happens. And it takes root.

Right. And I always like to talk about when we have this sense of

self that taken root that is actually what allows us to have

resiliency. That's where resiliency comes from.

Yeah, grit. Yep.

So the secure base develops this sense of what I

would call neurobiological worth, where we have resiliency,

and we can go out and experience anything. I wonder your thoughts

on I know, for us, we're seeing an increase of anxiety,

depression, distress, all kinds of mental health issues.

Expanding. So we're seeing high school adolescents, young

adults, parents. Any thoughts about this sense of well, is

secure base only about zero to seven, or a secure base really

about in our society, maybe there's an opportunity to really

reinforce the secure base throughout the lifespan?

If we think about the brain being malleable is

our sense of self or identity, our nervous system, our brain is

malleable. And what influences all that development the most is

human relationship. Life world is all about relationship. And

so we really need to keep that and when we talked about early

on the zero to seven it's all about relationship. So

continuing to those zero to 7 likely would be the most

important when we're most malleable and most vulnerable,

those early years that the priority of building that base

or laying those bricks on that secure base,

never ends, right?

No, it doesn't. I was talking about, we're always

should be focused on developing the secure base throughout the

lifespan, what it transitions hopefully from our parents, when

we're children, then we learn how to transition the attachment

security and secure base to peers. And then eventually we

have romantic relationships. And those turned into what those are

really interesting in adulthood, because we're actually switching

off being the caregiver and the caregiver. I mean, think about

your wife, is there times that you're really struggling and

your lid might flip and you're emotionally exposed. And she's

there to nurture you. And then you guys switch off these roles.

Yeah.

So my question is, you brought up the term

vulnerability, I find this a very fascinating word because

some people see it as [gasps] vulnerability means you have

you're susceptible. You have a chink in your armor, where I'm

hearing you using a term of its value.

Yeah.

Maybe talk a little bit about what is your

understanding of vulnerability.

I think as an adult, it's a little broader. And I

might, you know, define it as the process of becoming

emotionally whole, The process of becoming emotionally whole.

So if we think about what is emotionally whole, it means that

we don't judge the feelings, the emotions we have. And we work

hard to be attuned to those and how we impact others with those.

And vulnerability comes into play. When we share that process

with others. We invite others into that process of us becoming

emotionally whole. And emotionally whole does not mean

that I this is me with all my good parts everywhere. That

means that the good parts and the bad parts and the scary

parts and the fun parts are all part of a whole. We don't make

it a whole. It's fragmented. In often, what happens when we're

not vulnerable, is those parts that we don't like this part of

the fragments, we put them somewhere else,

we don't share them, we're not vulnerable.

And so for kids can be vulnerable, but not vulnerable,

and the entire sense of the word because they don't have the

ability to share all of their different parts or explore their

different parts. But as we become adults, we can start to

explore all the different parts, not judge them, accept all of

them, and start to expose them and present them to others. And

the process we're going through is that is the process of

vulnerability, sharing vulnerability.

Because what is vulnerability, safe

vulnerability and relationship produce? Certainly the research

developmental research, when we look at this says that that

ability to experience safety, and then to be I would exchange

a term vulnerability as being fully known. I guess that's what

you're seeing in a whole sense. Yeah, this whole sense of that

I'm fully known. I'm unconditionally accepted. I have

inherent value, experiencing experiencing, not talking,

experiencing vulnerability, grounds me in this sense of

self, actually, by engaging in safe vulnerability, it

reinforces that I'm inherently valuable. And that resolves

shame.

Yep.

It actually helps to be a protective factor against

shame. And when we do experience that, because I wonder, I mean,

it's, I wonder I'm curious, but I do know some of this is that

those who lack like the friendship, the male friendships

you talk about, are these safe, vulnerable relationships, what

happens?

We really struggle with insecurities. We struggle with

this sense of self.

I think a lot of parents when they're thinking

about their kids, they want to be better parents. And what's

difficult often is that when our kids struggle, we internalize

that is our fault. And then that creates shame. And that creates

anxiety, which just kind of creates this cycle of

enmeshment. And a lot of it has to do because we haven't done

our own work as parents or we aren't doing our own work. We're

never going to end. But where do parents have a place? Either a

couple, husband, parent, wife is where's your place for where

you're doing your work so you can be and show up as best as

you can? So that when that event happens when that awful current

event happens and your kids find out about it, and you need to be

there for them and present. You can't just show up after work

you have to have done your have, you have to be on your own

journey

so that there can be

where you and and where your kid begins and some good boundaries.

And that could create a healthier relationship, where I

think that's a lot of where parents are struggling right now

is where do I even start to do that, and, and, then, because if

we do that work, and we know we're doing our best, it's not

maybe going to be good enough, but we know we're doing our

best. When something goes wrong with our kid, we don't

necessarily have to blame ourselves. It's not necessarily

productive to blame ourselves, we want to do and that doesn't

necessarily accomplish anything by blame, starting to blame, we

want to focus on is that relationship. And so parents, I

think, are struggling to say when that crisis happens with my

kid. And, and I have shame around, and I don't want to tell

other people about it. And I don't know where to get

information, I don't know what to do about it. There's a lot of

what we're trying to talk about in this podcast, and what Embark

is trying to do in terms of Lower, lower the stigma and the

stigma, create more awareness and equip and empower and

Because just in us having a dialogue today, we've

talked about a lot of stuff. The purpose is to give some real,

relevant information to talk about these concepts. I think

one of them is to really have a sense of empathy to we talk

about this blame, I like your point about, it's hard for

parents to have compassion for themselves, right? I mean, we

blame ourselves and where have I gone wrong. And then I brought

up the concept of external validation in a way that it's

just bringing it up aware that it's easy sometimes when we're

feeling not great about ourselves, or we're stressed out

for the day, to kind of bury ourselves in the cell phone and

how many likes in the Facebook and stuff and not to vilify

that, but it's lots of times that's easy to escape somewhere

else. And see, like, oh, well, this might make me feel better

for a little bit. And I would call that the term happiness

versus true joy, that oftentimes, we, it's easy, and I

think we do this as human beings, right? Like, the

shootings are stressful, I my work is stressful, the demands,

everything is so stressful. It's like, Ah, this is really, this

is a tough place to live, right? And then I'm hurting. And then

of course, substance. I mean, we're fully aware of the

statistics of all this avoidant behavior, right? Substance use,

to sexual stuff to, I mean, all of that screams what? I just

want to break I don't I don't, I'm not taking any sort of

meaning there's no value in going through suffering. So

maybe touch a little about how would you differentiate

happiness versus joy that we're talking about?

Yeah, that's, you know, we are the title of the

podcast is the Roadmap to Joy. And, you know, I

think that the, all those behaviors you mentioned,

they're, you know, they're coping mechanisms, going back to

this idea of being emotionally whole. Good friend, Andy Mauer

really spends a lot of time talking about this, this concept

and, and in, in our pursuit of not being whole, we have we

develop all these other things. Because we're trying to suppress

these feelings and emotions. And the reason we do that is because

we judge them. We judge when something happens and goes wrong

with our kids, we blame, we complain, we judge, and we'll

judge ourselves and then we feel something we judge that versus

accept. And what a lot of our world has done over the years is

created the sense that

the purpose of life is

the single minded individual pursuit of happiness

at all costs, because you deserve to be happy. And you

should do whatever you want to do and should do to be happy.

This is the message that will be given for being given all the

time. And so we're constantly judging things.

Is there something wrong with happiness?

There isn't anything necessarily wrong with

happiness is

I want

my kids to be happy. I hear that all the time. Yeah. Oh, I just

want my kid to be happy.

I think a lot of parents would say that. That is

their number one role as a parent

is to make the get their kids to experience

happiness.

As long as my kid is happy. Guess what?

I'm gonna happy?

I'm gonna be happy.

I did a good job.

Yeah, it's that's that's been if they're not

happy, I'm not happy. What what does that cause? What happens if

you're 10 and you're not happy? And I'm your 42 year old dad.

And now I'm not happy because you're not happy. So you

determine my happiness and my emotions right? What happens to

you as a kid as a 10 year old? What is going to go on in your

brain in your

in your nervous system and what is the impact of that?

You're certainly reducing resiliency, you're

certainly reducing capacity to endure. Resiliency is the word

you become more fragile, right? And then Happiness becomes more,

it becomes this fleeting thing that we seek at all cost.

Because that's our salvation, right? Like that's, that's it,

that's the message.

That's the goal is

if the goal is the individual pursuit of happiness, studies

show that the more you pursue happiness, the more elusive it

becomes.

And the more anxious I get, the more depressed I get,

When I don't have it, it's a big problem. And if I

don't have it, either, it's your fault. Or there's something

wrong with me. So I'm blaming regardless, I'm not empowered,

I'm now more of a victim of the situation. Either it's my fault,

and something's wrong with me, or it's other people's fault

that have prevented me from being happy.

So what's more enduring?

So the challenge is, I think going back to

acceptance, and if we can get to a place where we're focused on

purpose, more focused on meaning, versus happiness, that

life is more about finding purpose and meaning and life

versus being happy. And we can start to realize that you can

experience purpose and meaning in a variety of different

situations. And in fact, some of the most purposeful and

meaningful times are when we're in deep pain, and experiencing

extreme suffering, that we would not wish on anybody. But it

feels we are most connected with this deep sense of why we exist

in that moment.

So why would we avoid that?

So how do we get into that place more is going to be product

question is to say, how do we create joy? How do we focus more

on joy?

Because what because what is -- I like what you're

saying,

Yeah.

Define joy for me, because,

Yeah

H elped me conceptualize, what is, how does

joy really a definitionally? Differentiate from happy?

Yeah,

so happiness is a feeling an emotion, that it's that is

fleeting, because based on circumstances, if things happen

to go, Well, I am going to be happy. If things happen to not

go, Well, I'm going to be unhappy.

But you're a victim of circumstances.

It's based on circumstances. And therefore if

my focus is happiness, I'm going to be focused on trying to

change my circumstances, versus accepting my circumstance and

figuring out how to respond to that circumstance in a way that

reinforces why I exist, what my sense of purpose is, my values

and my sense of meaning. And I can't approach that situation or

that problem, that circumstance that may be a negative one that

wouldn't create happiness, in a way that judges that blames I

can only respond in a way that reinforces purpose and meaning

if I approach it from a place of gratitude, and humility.

But that requires something,

It requires a secure base. It requires a

secure base, a sense of self.

Or gratitude, humility, regret, remorse,

guilt, there's a few things that actually, that help us function

in life and relationships that require this sense of self.

Yeah, what about meaning and suffering? I guess? Can you find

meaning and suffering? If you don't have that secure base and

that sense of self?

I think

it's about a mindset. First, it's, its experience. Second, if

we can, if we can shift our mindset, so much about identity

is, or accomplishing things is about telling us that we are

something and that we can be something and that we will

accomplish something that sets the path for us to accomplishing

and becoming something different. So for example, will

often with with alcohol or with smoking cigarettes,

is when we say,

No, I don't drink I'm an alcoholic. That's an identity

that we've created

for ourselves. Or

if we say, I don't smoke anymore, what is your language

for I don't smoke anymore means that you're a smoker, but you

don't smoke anymore. Our language matters. And so as we

start to change our language, as we start to change the way we

dress, as we start to change the way the places we go, as we

change who we hang out with, that starts to create new

experiences, a new mindset, a new perspective, and then we

want to create experiences to say, if you have a mindset that

there is purpose in meaning, and there can be purpose in me and

suffering. Let's believe that and let's not avoid suffering at

all costs when there is suffering, let's lean into it,

experience the fullness of it. Connect with that pain, with the

difficulty of it, don't rush to try to figure out why did I

experience that suffering, it must be for something else that

I want to do. Because it will come in due time, but we don't

judge. We don't we don't judge that moment, we focus on that

experience in that moment, we're likely going to be more

connected with the people around us than we were before.

But Alex, I'm so appreciative of what you're

saying, because I can't help but think about the book is on your

desk. And it's on my desk, The Book of Joy by Archbishop

Desmond Tutu, and the Dalai Lama. I know when reading that

book you and I have certainly, it was so amazing to read that

joy is made up of this interesting balance that there

there is this has to be this balance of suffering, in order

to be able to then experience joy. Without pain and suffering,

we actually don't know the flip side. Yeah, and happiness is

just one side of this proverbial coin that we don't get the

fullness. So I always liken it to looking at Mother Teresa,

we're not that we're all going to be to Mother Teresa is but

why does she did she choose to go into Calcutta and serve the

impoverished sense of that she got joy out of that some real

meaning and purpose in the suffering?

Yeah, put it putting ourself it putting

ourselves in situations where

we can experience hardship,

is struggle is important. And we need to do that from an

emotional perspective, we need to do that from an intellectual

perspective, put ourselves in the growth growth zone, where

we're slightly uncomfortable, where we're slightly stressed,

stressed. And that helps us grow. And that's going to put us

closer to circumstances that might create some pain and

suffering. Or just go into places where we see it.

Sometimes people don't even want to go see somebody else

experienced pain and suffering. If we expose ourselves to that.

It's another reason why when we have parents whose kids are

struggling, it actually is an opportunity. The goal isn't

happiness, the white picket fence, the Disneyland family.

And that situation you're in right now may be as good as it

gets.

That may be as good as it gets.

And if we change our mindset, say if this is good as it gets,

how would I engage differently in this relationship? How would

I be present? How would I find meaning and purpose in that may

be a lot different than saying that my family isn't the white

picket fence family that that the magazine's told me I was

supposed to have? We get to engage in this process of

creating joy in a much different way. And so families then when

they when they get to these situations where there is

stress, there is anxiety, there is a crisis, they don't

immediately judge it, they find opportunities to find purpose

and meaning. And then it's going to be okay. And this is normal.

It's okay to feel stress, it's okay to be anxious, it's okay to

be have shame and be depressed. All of these emotions are normal

and okay and valid versus, and we can withstand them, we can

handle them. Because if we make them okay, and we can feel them

and have them, then I can live with them. But if

they're not okay. And I can't live with them, what's going to

happen at the end of the day, if they don't go away? I have to do

something to make them stop.

So when you're describing this done such a

great job of describing I think it's important to highlight that

it's really explaining and accentuating why we've entitled

the podcast, Roadmap to Joy, rather than Roadmap to Happiness

or Roadmap to Avoiding Suffering. Yeah, we just didn't,

we didn't say it that right. The Roadmap to Joy was very

intentional, because of our understanding of joy. And how

even the people listening to this podcast, and hopefully they

will, you know, attend all the ones we do. It's really about

creating this capacity that we make purpose in life much more

meaningful. It's just not let's help you out with your mental

health, let's just reduce anxiety. It's much more

enduring, and it drives actually. This connection, this

meaning and purpose that comes from our relationship. That's

what our focus is.

Yeah, a way of being. So who are you most

excited about having on what kind of topics are excited

about?

Boy, great question. We're going to have lots of

people on I think it's important to talk about this process of

joy is more holistic, right you can you compartmentalize it like

man if I just if my work was better, I experienced joy. We're

not going to compartmentalize, we are going to look at more of

what I would call functional, holistic health. So I'm excited.

I'm looking at my list here, we're going to be addressing a

tremendous amount of issues that I think will be relevant to all

kinds of family. I mean, family relationships from development,

attachment, trauma, we're going to be talking about divorce,

marriage, and what what are those hardships that happen

within families who's not going for something like that right

now? Right? Especially with all the scary school shooting? Or

certainly we're going to want to address some societal issues. I

think social media

Great, why didn't just idea of what what do we?

How do we create boundaries? Do you know my daughter's, you

know, 11, she's asking for a phone to give her a phone and

no, don't give her phone, but all of her classmates have a

phone. So now I have to give her a phone. Okay, now I can give

her phone? What do I give her access to? This is what parents

struggle with? And then now that she's exposed to something, how

do I handle that? And there's all these very practical topics

that parents are struggling with, I'm struggling with to

understand how to engage. There's a lot of people that

have explored, there's no, there's no exact perfect answers

to any of these. But there's a lot of great experts that can

that can help shed the light on on how to engage with these

difficult topics,

Well I'm excited to have those people on and make it

really helpful. I mean, I'm really excited to even talk

about some things like OCD and PTSD. I mean, these are, they're

growing, right? I've got written down here, neurodevelopmental

issues. I mean, how am i

How many of us now are aware of somebody with who has a

diagnosis of autism?

Hey, it's grown exponentially

Exponentially.

And why it and why is that, and there's some

theories connected also, not necessarily with kids, but

Parkinson's, also, my dad was diagnosed with Parkinson's and

the rates of Parkinson's have also gone through the roof. All

of these things are interconnected in a variety of

different ways that are fascinating. And with the

knowledge, we don't need fear, and knowledge is power. And we

can accept all of it, we don't need to judge if we don't know

what the answer is, or I didn't know that, and I messed up with

my kid, if I would have known that I would have done things

differently. We seem to know that we've all messed up with

our kids, we've made 1000s of mistakes, and we will make 1000s

of mistakes.

And you're still unconditionally accepted,

which means that you were doing your best. And when I can accept

that I did my best, then that next moment that I'm with my

kid, that's going to be the best moment I can have in the best

moment. But when I'm caught up in my head about what I should

have done, how I can be better, that's me and all my stuff

getting in the way that's gonna, you know, tear down the

resiliency that we're trying to build in our kids.

Alex, we've certainly run the gamut on a big wide

spread of things, right?

Gosh, we could talk for hours. And I think that

family members when we're hanging out with other families,

or cocktail parties, these topics come up all the time. And

I think if I'm a mom or dad out there, if I could just be a fly

on the wall with these types of conversations. And so that's

what we're trying to create. With podcasts, you're able now

to be a fly on the wall. And we'll bring in these experts.

And you know, the topics and conversations are endless. It's

so relevant, so important to this day and age and our youth

mental health crisis. You know, teen and young adult anxiety,

depression and suicide are all time highs today. And Embark

Behavioral Health is set out on our big, hairy audacious goal to

take those rates of anxiety, depression and suicide from the

all time highs today to all time lows. And we believe that the

way to do that is to create more awareness to lower the stigma.

And that's a big part of what this podcast is all about. So

it's a great opportunity.

Yeah, I think this is going to be helpful not only for

the people doing it, but also for you guys, as the watchers

and the listeners on this podcast. We're excited to bring

you evidence based highly researched interventions and

doing the research around the current topics in our society

right now. So we look forward to seeing our next one. See ya