Welcome back, Late Boomers! We’re Cathy Worthington and Merry Elkins, and in this episode, we open the door to a topic that quietly but profoundly shapes every part of our lives: mindset. If you’ve ever wondered how your habits of thought can influence your success, resilience, happiness, and even how you approach aging and reinvention, you’re in the right place.

This week, we’re thrilled to welcome Michael Graham, founder of Mindset Matters Consulting. Michael’s background is as unconventional as it is inspiring: from high-stakes presidential protection details and endurance triathlons, to law enforcement supervision and elite coaching, his journey is a masterclass in the power of mindset under pressure—and how mental shifts can spark transformation at any stage of life.

What You’ll Hear in This Episode

Introduction & Michael’s Unique Story:

We kick off with Michael’s fascinating entry into law enforcement and how serving alongside the Secret Service on presidential details taught him about mindset, leadership, and decision-making under pressure.

The Power of Preparation & Courage:

Michael explains how training for every contingency—not just in policing, but also as an Ironman athlete—trains the mind to respond rather than react, and how these lessons apply in everyday life.

How Endurance Sports Reshape Thinking:

From grueling physical challenges to powerful mental visualizations, Michael reveals how focusing on the present, harnessing higher vibrations of gratitude and love, and reframing setbacks became superpowers that carried him through extreme endurance events.

Defining Mindset and Breaking Old Patterns:

We dive into what “mindset” really means, why it’s foundational to success, and how shifting self-talk and noticing your thoughts are critical first steps to change.

Mindset Shifts as We Age:

Michael shares beautifully about the evolution of mindset in our later years—how we can become kinder to ourselves, focus less on differences, forgive ourselves more readily, and continue learning without shame.

Leadership, Organizations & Measurable Change:

We explore how intentionality, values-driven leadership, and genuine compassion can drastically improve not just individual performance, but organizational culture … and, yes, profits too!

The Secrets to Successful Mindset Shifts:

Michael gives actionable ways to catch negative self-talk and reset with powerful affirmations and consistency. He also draws on his own leap into consulting, encouraging listeners to notice both their longings and any lingering discontent—and to take action on what calls them.

Key Takeaways

1. Mindset is strategy, not fluff: Our thoughts shape emotions, drive actions, and ultimately create our results. Change your thinking to change your life.
2. Notice your self-talk: The first step to change is awareness—“notice what you’re noticing” and take action to re-pattern self-limiting beliefs.
3. Preparation brings peace: Planning for the predictable makes the preventable possible, giving you strength and confidence under pressure at any age.
4. Kindness begins with yourself: Especially as we age, give yourself grace, forgive mistakes, and never stop learning—much like a child learning to walk!
5. Follow your longings: Pay attention to that inner nudge toward something more—your desires are part of your soul’s instructions, not just selfish whims.
6. Intentional leadership raises everyone up: Organizational success flows from clear values, compassion, and support at every level.
7. Affirmations and repetition rewire self-image: You cannot outperform your belief in yourself, so feed your mind what you want to believe—consistently.

Are you ready to rethink what’s possible and create your own extraordinary third act? Start today by noticing your mindset. What do you long for? Where do you feel discontent? Give yourself permission to follow your curiosity and improve your self-talk.

We invite you to share this episode with a friend, subscribe, and leave us a review! For more wisdom on reinvention and thriving at any age, check out our website at lateboomers.us or listen to all our episodes at ewnpodcastnetwork.com.

And if Michael Graham’s story resonated with you, explore his work at mindsetmattersconsulting.com.

As we always say, it’s never too late to rethink what’s possible.

— Cathy & Merry

Mentioned in this episode:

Late Boomers is part of the eWomenPodcastNetwork.

eWomenPodcastNetwork

Welcome to Late Boomers, our podcast guide to creating your third act with style, power, and impact.

Hi, I'm Cathy Worthington, and I'm Merry Elkins. Join us as we bring you conversations with successful entrepreneurs, entertainers, and people with vision who are making a difference in the world.

Everyone has a story, and we'll take you along for the ride on each interview, recounting the journey our guests the path they've taken to get where they are, inspiring you to create your own path to success. Let's get started. Welcome back to Late Boomers. I'm Cathy Worthington, and this is the podcast for people who know that life doesn't slow down, it just gets more interesting.

Sure does. And I'm Merry Elkins. Today we're talking about something that quietly shapes everything: our mindset, how we think about aging, work, success, and reinvention, which can either open doors or quietly close them.

Especially at this stage of life, many of us were taught to push through and keep going, but not always to pause and examine how we're thinking.

That's right. And our mindset, it it isn't, isn't fluff. It's strategy. It affects how we handle change, how we see challenges, and whether we believe new chapters are still possible.

And today we're excited to welcome our guest, Michael Graham, who is the founder of Mindset Matters Consulting.

And earlier in his career, Michael served on presidential protection detail, working closely with several U.S. presidents in high-pressure, high-stakes environments.

And Michael's also an accomplished endurance athlete, having completed multiple Ironman competitions and triathlons, experiences that require extraordinary mental discipline and resilience.

That's really impressive too. And today he helps individuals and organizations strengthen mindset, leadership, and performance.

Welcome, Michael.

Thank you very much. It's a pleasure to be here, Cathy and Merry. Thank you so much for having me.

Great to have you.

First, I want to ask you what drew you into presidential protection and what did that experience teach you about mindset under pressure?

Great question. Well, I started off my career in law enforcement at 23 years old. Um, and so I worked for the Santa Monica Police Department and eventually on that, on the department, one of my responsibilities that I was a part of, a detail I was a part of, was our SWAT team. And so I had a chance, um, both as a police officer, not on SWAT, um, work— I was an intelligence officer for a while and then on the SWAT team. So in all three categories, and then, and then fourthly, as a supervisor, as a sergeant, you know, I had a chance to work, be a part of several different presidential protection details, vice president, the first lady. As they would come into Santa Monica. So obviously the Secret Service is the, um, you know, the protective law enforcement protection unit. But when the off— many of the presidents and vice presidents would come into Santa Monica for fundraising and, um, things.

Yeah. For campaigns, raising money.

And so then the Secret Service would, you know, coordinate with the local law enforcement, which was us. And for one of those visits, I happened to be working in intelligence. And so I had a chance to go to 3 or 4 months worth of pre-planning meetings at the federal bureau, uh, at the federal building in LA, um, to meet with the FBI, us, LA, Beverly Hills, everybody that were the, where at that time it was for Bill Clinton would be everywhere he would be going. He would be staying in our city. And so because of that, um, I went to all the meetings and then I got to be a part of the motorcade from touchdown, Air Force One touchdown at LAX till Air Force One took off. I was in his motorcade and a part of his detail for, for all 4 days.

Wow. So that was— Yeah, that's great. Yeah.

How did that shape your approach to leadership and decision-making?

You know, there's so many aspects. I love leadership and I love the topic and there's so many facets, you know, that go into I that. mean, this is making, but certainly when we talk about the president of the United States and the, um, all that goes into protecting his life or her life, you know, whoever the president's going to be is, uh, as well as keeping them on track., for meetings, it was really eye-opening. Um, even though I was involved in law enforcement, I had not been in this, this level of, of operation where we are, you know, pre-planning everything. And then we've got plan A and we've got plan B and we've got plan C, you know, and then really who gets to know and who needs to know about any of those plans and how quickly they can change. So it's, there's a lot, there's a great deal of, you know, not only movement and moving pieces with options for change, but also the safe places that he or she or his family would go if there was some type of a scare or an attack or an assault or, you know, a threat, as well as, you know, where, which medical facilities are lined up, you know, and where, where are we going to take people to get injured and, and recognizing all of those components, you know, and then, and then when he's staying in town, you know, how many personnel are really required to, um, around the clock, keep a level of safety and security and attention to detail. Um, you know, constant. So it was, it was, it was, it's a huge operation and very exciting.

Yeah, it sounds like it. And, and it takes a lot of courage too, doesn't it?

You need to be prepared for a lot. Yeah. I mean, you get into the job, you, when people want to become a law enforcement officer, and for me, a police officer, a city, a municipal police officer, there's a desire to do it. And there's a love for people and a desire to help people and all of that, to bring order to chaos and all of that. But you have no idea what your job is really going to entail until you get in and until you start learning, you know,, and then you become increasingly comfortable if you stay in the job with a level of courage that's required, a familiarity with the, I would say the biggest thing is the, I'm drawing a blank on the term, but when your body is flooded with adrenaline and you've got that flight fear thing going on and still being able to make a good decision. And so, you know, that's one of the, and so really as I, as I progressed in my career and then I promoted and then my last 16 years, I was a supervisor and instructor and all of those things, you know, so much of really it comes down to your mindset and then it comes down to your preparation. So having good training, thinking through ahead of time, going back to that pre-planning that we did in the presidential details. What is going to be, what can go wrong? You know, this is what I want to do.

Now that, now that I know what I want to do, what can go wrong? Let's explore. Let's explore that. Okay. How can I remedy that? One of my favorite quotes that I learned from, um, one of my favorite police instructors with a different same name, no relation was Gordon Graham. And he taught me, taught us the risk management term. If it's predictable, is preventable. Mm-hmm. We would look at what we could predict might happen, and now what steps can we take to prevent that?

Well, that leads me to a question about endurance and racing Ironmans and triathlons. And what do those teach you about mindset?

You know, you need to— thank you for asking that. Um, you take each day, you take each moment, you take each task as it comes. It's easy to be trying to do or accomplish one task, but thinking ahead, you know, but this one's coming, you know, it's easy to let your mind go to some other places, but you know, and you don't, and, and, and and that affects your ability to finish well and do well what you're actually doing. So the triathlon in the Ironman triathlon is a distance. It's an endurance one. The full Ironman is 140.6 miles. So it's a 2.4-mile swim that you gotta get through. It doesn't do any good to think about the bike that's coming if you can't get through your 2.5-mile swim.

4-mile swim. Then you go to a 112-mile bike race. Okay. It doesn't do any good to think about the marathon that's coming until you finish the 112-mile bike race. And then you get to the marathon. And now don't worry about mile 26 if you can't finish mile 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, you know. So it really taught me to stay focused on what is in front of me. What am I doing? Let me master this.

If I don't master this, I'll never get to those. The second, one of the most powerful things, you know, in my, in my speaking and teaching and consulting that I do and the coaching that I do, you know, we've got energetic vibrational levels, if you will, the vibration or energy or emotion or whatever you want to call it.. And certainly when you do things for love and gratitude and you think you're thinking thoughts that are grateful, you know, you're thinking at a higher level versus if you're, if you're stuck in regret, remorse, shame, you know, those are very low energy, low vibration places. So one of the things I discovered 20-some years ago on my first Ironman was on the bike race. And I had not, to be honest, For all of those Ironman triathletes out there who, you know, have trained for years and years and years to complete this day, I didn't do that. Uh, I trained for 3 and a half months my first time.

Oh wow.

I was a swimmer, so this, the 2.4-mile swim was no problem. I'd done that many, many, many, many times and more. The bike, I, the farthest I'd ever biked my, was 60 miles. And it was 112 in the race. And then I ran 15 miles 3 times a week, but that's the most I'd ever run in my life was 15 miles. And yet the race was 26.2. So the, the day, and it's all, it's, it's one after the other. It's all one day.

Mm-hmm.

I know I watched it in Paris.

Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah.

All of it. I loved it in Paris on my.

Bike, having now gone to my max. I've 60 miles. I'd never gone farther than that. And now I'm farther than that. All of a sudden, this is quite personal, but I went to a place in my mind and I don't know why I did this, but it, it became a very powerful thing that, that I use now all the time. I went to imagining my two children. I had two children at the time that were there. One was five and one was three.

I imagined my three-year-old son in the hospital with me at his hospital bed on life support, fighting for his life. Now that never happened. That was all in my mind. That was all in my mind. It was, it was, but that's, as I was struggling to get through this hard day, I went to a hard place for a child that I loved. And I stayed in that place and I fought to keep him alive all day and all, and that got me through 112 miles. And then I fought to keep him alive my whole run, and that got me through the run. And I, it was a double, it was twice as far as I'd ever gone in my entire life, and I was able to do it.

And I made all the cutoffs and I, and I finished strong and I ran across the, the, you know, the, the, the finish line. As one of the most amazing days of my life. But what got me through was the mindset that the place I was in my mind, in love, trying, doing all I could to save my little son's life. And that took me through tremendous pain, tremendous exhaustion, and took me to the finish line.

Wow.

It's kind of amazing. I wouldn't think that would work.

Yeah. And that's so powerful. And I mean, was that the moment when you realized these experiences could translate into something else like your consulting work?

You know, no, at that moment, no, that was that first race was, or that first Ironman was back in 2005. And, um, you know, it just, I don't know why I thought of it at the time. I didn't know I thought of it and I went on and And yet at the time, you know, I had, I had been on the SWAT team. I had been, I had in law enforcement and in tactical situations, I was always, if it's predictable, it's preventable. I was always looking. I was always going to places in my mind. How can I make this a success? Okay. If I do this, if I turn right, if I turn left, if I aim here, um, how do I survive this? How do I make it a success? So I was in that practice, but I really hadn't thought about consulting or anything way back then.

And then later, as I got into coaching, mindset coaching, all of these, all of these, and I'm like, okay, how does this really apply? And I'm going through my certification on my training and things. And then I began to remember specific instances like that, like that part of the Ironman. I've done 4 more, you know, Ironman 70.3s, half Ironmans since then. And several other races.

Wow.

But, you know, it's— it— now that I'm— now that I'm spending a lot more time thinking and coaching people on, on the power of mindset and changing, you know, we have a bad day. Why is it a bad day? Because we're thinking it's a bad day. It's a good day. All of a sudden it becomes a good day.

And let me stop you for a minute because I'd like you, for our listeners, for you to personally define how you define mindset and why it's so foundational to success.

Thank you for asking. Mindset really encapsulates a lot of, or incorporates a lot of different things. But for me, mindset is my thoughts, my way of thinking. The set point of my mind. And the wonderful thing about that is when you recognize you, we have the, we all have the ability to change our set point. You know, we might wake up. So I rarely wake up on the wrong side of the bed, but sometimes I do. And when I do, and when I say wrong side of the bed, I mean, you know, I always, I'm in a bad mood.

Like, Who's this guy? Because I'm never in a bad mood. And yet I've even talked to some of my clients and I'm coaching. I said, you know what, today I woke up in a bad mood and I, this is so foreign to me. But what I know is, and I had since done with before I got together with them, we, I, we have the ability to change our mindset, to change our set point, to change. If we're thinking something that we don't like. If we're going down a direction that we don't want to go, we can actually say, we can do something to jolt our subconscious. Up until now, today, I've thought this, but now I'm going to think this. It is a tremendous day.

I'm alive. You know, and we can just break it down to the very, very bottom. You know, even if, even if there's a lot, even if we have a lot of quote unquote problems, we can always think of somebody else who's got worst problems, we could still be living in another part of the world where we're dodging bombs and we're dodging famine and we're hiking to get a glass of water, drinking water. There's all kinds of things. I mean, in America here, you know, we're so blessed. Even on our worst day, we're so blessed, you know? And it just becomes so powerful to me, even like when you go to a grocery store and the clerk is rude and it makes you want to be rude back, or if you get offended. And then, and then later somebody tells you, no, her kids, her kids in the hospital, she's having a bad day. She doesn't want to be here.

You know, she wants to be there. And all of a sudden you go, oh, it's, it's because of that. And then you give her grace, you know? So we know I really make an effort to give people grace because I mean, even if I have to make up the story, you know?

Yeah, me too. I try to do that too.

And it makes you feel better too.

Well, it certainly does because the only person feeling bad when I'm feeling bad is me, right?

Yeah.

Or they don't know I'm feeling bad. They're doing their thing and I'm walking around feeling bad.

Well, if I wake up on the wrong side of the bed, uh, I just think, what did I eat last night?

You always blame it on that, right? I was at the DMV today and the gal that waited on me, was just— looked so unhappy, and she didn't smile, and she didn't— so I go the other way, and I like grin at her, and I take things, and I say when she hands me something, oh, thank you, thank you, because I'm trying to just snap her a little bit out. You don't have to be down that much all day to do your job like that.

It's too bad, right?

Yes.

And that's a wonderful thing for you to do, and I try and do that too.

Yeah, I do it too. Michael, I've been thinking, who typically comes to you for your work?

You know, so far, I've— before I did this, I always said I wanted to be an executive coach, you know, but how do you become an executive coach? But I started speaking at events. I started speaking, you know, at places. And the people who started reaching out to me and said, hey, you know, I'd like to know more about this. I'd like to hear I'd like to hear more about the Stream Builder program you do. I'd like to hear more about this mindset stuff that you do. And each of them, it turned out, were executives of, of their company, either CEOs of their companies or high-level executives. Now, now, and since those, my first several, and then since then it's grown to many of their people, many of the people they write, their friends that they've recommended, some of their family members, you know, people that they have influence over. But it, it, it can be anybody.

It really can be any age. You know, the stuff I started doing this a few years ago, I was, I was approaching my 60th birthday. I'd been a cop for nearly 30 years. I'd been an actor in Hollywood for, you know, my SAG card was, I don't know, 15, 13, 13, 15 years, something like that. I'd been doing mortgage loans. I was doing corporate security, executive protection. It was a lot of things I'd done. And I just thought, um, what I was doing at the time, I wasn't happy doing.

And I thought, you know, I've, I've been through so many— I'm so blessed. I've got to travel as a musician. I've got to be on stage. I've got to do this and that. I got— I've certainly, as a cop, you know, and a supervisor, um, got to respond to and work through a lot of difficult things, and I've got information I can share. Now that I'm hitting 60, I'm I'm old thinking, enough to actually have something to say. You know, maybe when you're young, you feel like, uh, do I really have something to say yet?

But that's our whole podcast, that the boomers are wise and looking for new things to do. And we have a lot of wisdom to share with people. I'm so glad you took it to the next level. And what mindset challenges do you see the most often when clients first reach out?

You know, I think one of the things that's most powerful— what are— everything starts with our thoughts. You know, our thoughts lead to our emotions or feelings. Our thoughts lead to our feelings, and then our feelings, those, you know, direct our actions. If we're not feeling good, our actions are low. If we're feeling amazing, our actions are more motivated and higher. And then those actions cause the results. So everything goes back. You wanna change your results? We gotta go back and change your thoughts, you know, which is your mindset.

Um, also everything's created twice, you know? Uh, we think it's in our minds and then we create it, we draw it, we build it, we do it, but it, everything's created twice. It starts in our mind. As a thought, and then it becomes something with form. So that's really, really important. So what I began to see and learned even for me is so much of our— they, whoever they are, say our conscious mind is about 5% and subconscious is 95%. So we're doing things based upon, you know, our subconscious, not, not necessarily we, we're thinking what we're thinking, but we're really being held back by self-limiting paradigms by our subconscious. So what turns out to be really, really valuable in, um, this coaching that I'm doing in the program and the awareness that we, we bring to, to areas. Is, you know, the self-limiting paradigm that we've been operating in that we don't even notice, you know, what's causing us to delay, what's causing us to, you know, are we, are we, you know, were we feeling bad about something, disdain, you know, like the 5 Ds, you know, delay, distraction, disdain, you know, DEFCON 1, are we afraid, you know, we're, you know, there's so, that's been, and then giving people A, an awareness that, you know, yeah, you know you want to do it, but now, but you're not doing it.

You know why you're not doing it? You're getting busy doing this. You don't feel like it. You know, your self-esteem is low. So we begin to look at the different things that, and come up with technologies, if you will, to use when we recognize one of these self-limiting paradigms is rearing its unproductive head. You know, we can do something to change, to change that, to get over it. Yeah.

I mean, we're always, Cathy and I are always talking about that and working on it on a daily basis. And, you know, it's been on my mind while we've been talking. How do you think mindset changes and shifts as we age? And can you address our late boomers audience and tell them, how do you think they can improve their mindset?

You know, I think oftentimes people, you know, by the time we've gotten to this age, to an older age, you know, we've, we're like that stone that's, that's rolled down the riverbed. In the water for a long time. And we've had— started off with a bunch of sharp edges. We started off knowing them, not knowing at all. We started off, you know, with strong opinions, you know, and then those all get bumped off over years. And, and the value recognized, you know, recognizing that now you actually know you really don't know. You know, we started off knowing everything, and then we, we get down to the end of the, end of the river, you know, and realize, you know, it's— there's just so much opportunity. There's so much there's so many ways to do it right, but a different way.

I think, and I may have just got off track a little bit.

The question is what, how does our mindset change as we age?

Yeah. You know, I think if we can be, and we should be, and we need to be, but be kinder to ourselves and just offer a little bit more forgiveness to ourselves. And that allows us to be a little more forgiving to other people. Again, I think we really, it's a great opportunity as we age to be kinder people, to be, you know, I think I see and I make an effort to see the similarities in people now more Yeah, every, the news always wants to show us the differences, but we're not that, we're not that different. And, um, even in our similarities, we're different. So let's focus on the similarities, you know, and let's focus on, yeah, on how can I, you know, I always, the question I'm always consciously asking myself now, and I'm not perfect. I'm not perfect. I make mistakes.

I have to forgive myself.. But I recognize, you know, as like a little kid learning to walk, I'm still learning to walk. Even at this age, I'm still learning, so to speak, in new areas. The little kid isn't afraid to make mistakes. They get up and they fall. They get up and they fall. They get— it's not— they're not a bad kid and they're not a bad— yeah. You know, they're just, they're, they get up and they fall, but then there's no shame, you know?

Well, how does mindset show up at an organizational or leadership level?

You know, I think for me, one of my focuses is recognize— being intentional, intentionality. So being intentional about what you're going to think about and how you're going to think, what you're going to do, how you're going to treat people. Um, so being very intentional. And then be— for, for me as an individual, I want to get crystal clear and or, you know, get clear again and continue to get clear again on, on what are my values? What's my core? Who am I? What will I do and what will I not do? Oftentimes you get into a situation and like, you feel like, well, the situation said I had to do that. No, that was backwards. You know who you are. You know, you let your values your integrity, your character, you let love, you let forgiveness, compassion, all these, these things are a part of who you are and that guides the decisions that you make. You, you know, the, um, so I think, I think that's really, really important for folks to, to be clear and then, and then be intentional to, to, to encourage that in other people, you know, and, and, and be blessing other people, be encouraging other people, being compassionate for what they need.

I bet that surprises a lot of executives and leaders that you introduce that to. Doesn't it?

Sometimes. Sometimes it does. You know, and then other times I'm like, you've got it. You know, I mean, you get it, you know, and, and I think, you know, having worked for 4 different chiefs of police over my 28 years. And then, you know, multiple captains and lieutenants and sergeants, and then I became one and all of that. Um, you begin to see leadership styles that you, that you resonate with and that you like and that make you want to do more work and harder work because you'll follow this person because they care. They treat you with respect. They treat you with compassion.

They treat you with love.

Well, have you seen leaders who come to you with more dictatorial styles change because of your consulting?

You say, do dictator-type leaders come to me to change?

Well, no, have you seen the change in them, in those that you've worked with who may have more of a dictatorial style? Style?

You know, the ones that— it's funny, you know, when you get up and you speak in front of a group and you, you, you know, they— the ones who— 5 of us could get up there to talk, and then afterwards we want to go— all of us want to go talk to one of them, and yet all of us want to go talk to a different one because a different one resonates with us. Somebody said something that resonated and I like that. And so I find that folks that come to me that I have an opportunity then to work with, I've said something that resonates with them. So, you know, uh, yeah, so it's.

Not, they're not running it up against the wall. They're not shocked.

Then let me ask you a different question. Um, what separates people who successfully change their thinking from those who struggle?

In, in, uh, what separates them in, in the change?

Yeah, leaders or non-leaders.

Yeah, I mean, the people who do recognize— I think if you— I think if a person, you know, we start out the, you know, the program really taking inventory, um, personal inventory. And we look at, um, where we're at, who we are, who we've been, who we want to be, you know, let's just get quiet for a minute and let's just get honest. You know, this is not going anywhere. It's just between, it's just between us, but really it's a bit, it's between you, it's between your head and your heart and the direction you want to go and, and your peace, because I love and value being led by peace. I rather than chaos, you know, it seems like there's, there's a peaceful way and there's a chaotic way and chaotic way never solves in the field. Yes. I'm responding to chaos as an officer or as a supervisor helping the officers, but the chaotic ways never built people up and made them feel better and solve the problem. You know, no, no, it doesn't mean you don't, you don't show up and you lay down the law that, you know, you now the cop shows up, maybe you're the boss, you know, this is my, my company.

I'm in charge. It's my head on the chopping block. If this doesn't go right, you know, this is the way I want us to go. And it can be that, and I want it to be respectful and in, in, in, in, Directional by love. What would love do in this situation? Doesn't mean you can't still be honest in evaluations. It doesn't still mean you can't be, it doesn't mean you can't fire people. I love what our organization is doing and you're outside of that and you're not, you're not, you're affecting negatively everybody else. So in love, I'm letting you go.

It doesn't mean, it doesn't mean you're wishy-washy. It just means that you're clear on very important values. And again, I, you know, the chiefs that had my back, that we knew, you know, it doesn't mean they were going to cover anything for us. No, we still had to do the right thing. We still were accountable. One of the chiefs in particular that I worked for, He held every, if there was a pursuit, every supervisor on duty was responsible and had to write a pursuit memo. We all had to be paying attention. We all had, had the responsibility to get on the radio and say, cancel the pursuit.

It's it's not, not safe anymore. It's not right. It's out of policy. It's whatever, you know, and then anytime there was a group of officers that did whatever, everybody had to write a, you know, everybody used to, you are your brother's keeper. You know, we are looking out for each other., but not, not to cover for each other, to protect each other, to, I mean, to protect the organization, the integrity of the organization, public trust, public trust, you know, so, and then he was, you know, what I loved is he was making us, he goes, the policy, you know, the, the, all of the law books, they're so, it's hard to know what all the laws are, you know, but if you do the right thing, if you, if you treat your neighbor as, you know, as you want to be treated, that you act lovingly. You're going to be within the law always. Um, he says our policy procedures manual is huge. It's, I don't, I don't expect everybody to know it all, but we do have a vision, mission, values.

I do expect you to know our values, department values, and I want you to recite them to me anytime I see you in the hall. We, I do want you to know our vision for our department and our, and our, um, mission statement because our whole policy is this is within those couple of paragraphs. So at least, you know, a guiding, a guiding principle and you can make your, you can make your stressful, never before made decisions in the field according to those, you know, and then, and then we can, we, you know, we can go through the policy manual later and make sure everything was, was right. But, you know, um, well, I know.

The answer to my next question is going to be yes, but It's my question is, have you seen mindset shifts lead to measurable outcomes? And I know you have. Maybe give us a little bit of like really where you saw the mindset lead to a measurable outcome, say in one of your corporations or something that happened big or little.

Yeah. The first, the very first word that comes to my mind is joy. You know, it's joy, clarity and joy. You know, we start off taking inventory. We, we get aware of stuff. We get a direction. What's the vision we're going? You know, what areas are we going to work on? So, you know, there was a guy thousands of years ago named Seneca and he said, you know, no wind is favorable to the, to the sailor who doesn't know to which port he or she sails. If you don't know where you're going, you know, it doesn't matter which way the winds are blowing, you know, they could be blowing you right to it.

But if you don't know you're going there, it doesn't do you any good. So we get clear on what's the direction we want to go. And then now we can use the quote unquote good and the quote unquote bad winds that blow our way. Everything's good. Everything's a lesson. Everything's a, we can, we can learn, we can gain wisdom from hard situations. And they're not bad because they're hard. Some of the best is hard, you know? So we get crystal clear, remember going, and then, you know, and then as you, as you now see yourself going in that direction and you, and you take inventory, you continue to take inventory along the way.

Well, look at the baby steps I've taken. Look at the baby steps. Look at the baby steps. Now you've got joy. Now you've got, now you've got, um, um, memory that you can do it. You can see that you can do it. I love creating memories of future events. And so that would be something I used to do a lot because so again, so much of my job as a street cop and a street cop supervisor and all of that stuff was survival and how am I going to survive this day and what's going to come my way, you know, and, and, and I'm going, the shots are being fired and everyone's running away, you know, myself and my team, we're all running towards it.

But what we, are we're not, we're not going to a suicide mission. We're going to., you know, solve, um, solve the problem best in best possible way. So I would rehearse if this happens, you know, if someone's going to throw a punch this way, you know, you do this, you rehearse it, you rehearse it. I've got, I'm not even being punched yet. I've never even been punched, but I know that I'm going to block it this way. I know I'm going to present my weapon this way. I know I'm going to make this, if, if I'm called this name, I've been called so many names, you know, you just can't take it personal. They don't know.

They're just, they see you as a cop. They see you as a uniform. They call you really bad names. Okay. You know, so, but I think about that ahead of time. So, so I prepare for it. Now I hear myself getting called those names. I hear my wife, I hear your wife is this, your kid is this, you know, all the things that people, well, you can't say that to me.

It doesn't matter. They don't know you, but you practice how you're going to respond. So then when it happens, you have a memory that that's how I respond. You so I know, love, yeah.

So if, if, is that one of the ways people can change their self-talk? Do you have, can you give some other ways that you might give to our listeners? absolutely. Yes, On how to change your self-talk.

Yes. You know, and, and it sounds, you know, affirmations, you know, it's, can sound like such a soft word. Or, you know, not manly enough. You know, I'm, I'm a cop. I'm a man guy. You know, I'm a, I want good stuff. And yet the truth is we, we cannot outperform our self-image, our self-esteem. We can't.

We only can do, we can say we want to do whatever, but if we, if, but if the 95% below the neck part of us doesn't believe we deserve it, or we're smart enough, or we're educated enough, or we're lovable enough, or pretty enough, or whatever enough, we really don't believe it on the inside, then, um, you know, then we're not going to be able to do it. We're just going to talk a good game, but we're not going to play a good game. So, you know, it's really Now, let's just be honest and not judge ourselves, not judge. What is it that I want to do? And then, you know, who do I, and then who do I think I can be that person? You know, let's be honest. And then go, well, what would that person do? But how would that person feel? What would that person say? And you start getting really crystal clear on that. And then real, and then putting your, your I am in front of those things. And really what it takes is repetition. It really takes repetition.

The way I get stronger in the gym is the repetition. I can think about lifting weights all day. No, unless I lift repeatedly, lift them, you know, it's not going to happen. I can say I want to run a marathon, but unless I put the miles in the repetition, consistency, consistency, consistency. So the same thing with my, my belief system, we can change our beliefs. About who we think we are, who we feel we are. We can go back because we're already talking to ourselves all the time. Every single time we say we can't do that, we just talk to ourselves.

We just gave ourselves an affirmation. It just was a negative one. How about let's choose the affirmations we want to give ourselves? Let's choose the identity we, we, we deserve. Let's recognize if we can go back to ourselves as innocent as we were. Let's look at any baby. Just Go into public and find a baby and just sit there and look at them and go, how amazing, how much opportunity, you know, is there anything bad in that baby right now? No, we don't see anything bad in that baby. We want, we want the best for that baby. So take yourself back to being a baby, you know, and maybe about the lies that you, you know, and I.

Think it's all about noticing it when you do it. I was telling my neighbors that I was walking with, they were saying, well, how do you even know you're doing that? I said, the first step is to notice that you said that to yourself. Because we don't, we say it and we, it just goes right by and we just let it go and we shouldn't do that. We should like say, I don't need to phrase it that way.

Right. Right. So, so true. One of the little statements, you know, there's little, uh, these little statements in the, in the coaching or in the program that I, that I do is notice what you're noticing. Notice what you're noticing. My wife now, As I do this and she hears me, you know, whatever, talking to people or whatever, she goes, are you noticing what you're noticing? Or, you know, she'll either hit me up or she'll tell me, I'm noticing, I'm noticing what I'm noticing and I'm no longer want to do that anymore. I want to do this. And she goes, I switched today.

I started doing something different because I noticed what I was noticing.

So, well, give our listeners one small mindset shift that they can all do today?

Notice, I guess I would say, you know, what is it? What's the desire of your heart? What do you want to do? You know, what, what's your desire and what's your discontent? And notice that. I ended up switching. I was working in a job that was paying well. I had zero debt. Everything was paid off. Everything was good. And, but I wasn't happy. I wasn't happy.

There was discontent. It was not fulfilling. I had so much more to give, you know, so much more value to, you know, to give. Than what I was doing. And I made a shift and it was the best thing I could have done. So I would say notice your longing and your discontent and choose your longing. Follow your longing.

Choose your longing.

Yeah. Choose your longing. And one of the things I grew up in the church, I'm still a man of faith and I know this isn't about that. So I won't dive into it too deep, except, you know, I grew up in the church. And sometimes you hear truths or things, but you hear them as from a juvenile mindset, an undeveloped mindset. And sometimes I held beliefs, you know, I didn't used to think that what I wanted, maybe I thought maybe what I, maybe I interpreted it as a child that what I wanted was selfish. You know, it wasn't loving, it was selfish. You know, you, You know, you should be grateful for what you have and all this stuff, but I want more.

You should be grateful for what you have. You know, you're being selfish. You know, and really I've learned in my 60s, as I've gotten older, I think my desires come from God. You know, I think the desires that I have, those aren't, those aren't selfish. Those are, those are spirits. Those are, those are, those are part of my soul. Those are soul instructions. So I'm paying a lot more attention to my longing now.

What's, what is it? What, what is, what do I want to do? And relationship, I think relationship is so important. You know, we need, I mean, the farther and farther, you know, as technology develops, it seems like we have less contact with people. Boy, we really need to be making an effort. You know, we all grew up in an era where we didn't, you know, we, where we had relationship all around us. But I think if we can do things to bless people, to what would love do in this situation? What would compassion do? What would relationship do? What would kindness do? You know, what's the similarity between you and I, you know, as human beings, um, those and, and work on that. And then, you know, and then see where your longing goes. How can I, How can I make this even better?

You know, this is the perfect time for me to ask you what's next for Mindset Matters Consulting.

Thanks for asking. I love all your questions and the opportunity to answer. You know, I'm loving, I'm loving my coaching business. And I'm loving the positive responses I'm getting from my clients for the change, for the for the clarity and direction that they're, that they're going. Some of them are going in the same direction, but with more clarity. Some of them are going in different directions and they're so excited about it. So that part's great. I want to continue to build that.

And then I, I want to continue to do more, even more in the, the workplace, in the corporate workplace where I can actually come in and do more team building stuff. And mindset step for your employees. If your employees, you know, are, you know, we've got our health and wellbeing quadrant, you know, of our body. We've got our love and relationships quadrant. We've got our vocation, business and vocation that pays for stuff. And we've got our time and money freedom, you know, and we need to be balanced. And if our employees are out of balance, you know, it's like a tire that's flopping around. Your car is not going to run very well.

Your business, your your, your, your, your business is not going to run well if people are handicapped, you know, if they're, if they're, you know, what I mean? And can it, if they're not, um, if they're not in balance, if, if part of being isn't, isn't, isn't full. So if, if we can, it doesn't mean that somebody like me comes in and then encourages everybody to leave. That's not, that's not the thing. It's like helping people be happy where they're at. And helping the leadership support. I love, I love customer service, but I love, I love the backside. I love the internal customer service. What are the, what's the supervision and the administration doing to support, not, not just coddle, but just to be supportive of their employees? What training do they need to do the job well? What, you know, where do we need to put more money? You know, what equipment do they need to do the job well? Is there, is there, is there better technology that we could purchase as an organization to help our employees be more productive? What can we do to make them, to make their, make them like their job more? Because if I like my job and I like my boss and like my boss's boss and the people around me, I don't want to not go to work.

I want to go to work. I want to be. I want to be, you know, uh, effective in what I do. And when I've seen, you know, when I've had an administration or a chief that didn't support us and didn't provide the training and didn't put money where it needed to go to support us, we burned out. We didn't want to be there. We started looking other places where when we had bosses, when I had a chief that made to make sure we got the training we needed so that we didn't get sued, so that we didn't make mistakes. And he didn't put up with intentional mistake makers. You know, I mean, it's one thing to make mistakes.

Okay. We all make mistakes. We're all human. Do we learn from that? Do we, do we, were we, do we admit it? You know, he would always say, you lie, you die. You know, I make mistakes. You know, don't lie. If I, if, if it comes up, admit it so we can fix it. I'm not going to fire you for making a mistake, but if you had to lie about it, now I can't trust you.

So you're going to just come in and teach them this and everything, everything's going to smooth out.

You know, there's, there's a lot, there's steps, you know, there's, there's, there's steps to it and I've got it. It's organized and there's a structure. But if, if, if the bosses can like their employees more because they're doing better and the employees can like their bosses better, which makes them want to do better, you know, and really I'm probably only going to treat the public or treat the customers as well as I'm being treated by my boss, you know, and if my boss is treating me bad, he's setting, he or she's setting the example for me to treat the end user or the, you know, the, our client not well, you know, so it's only, it could only be a benefit to the whole organization and to the service the organization provides if, um, the leadership is aware and held accountable by the top leadership. You know, we're all, we're all, we're all serving somebody, you know, we have a all boss. Even the boss has a boss, you know, ultimately the boss has a boss.

Right. So we should tell people that they can find you at mindsetmattersconsulting.com.

Yes.

That's your website and it has your speaking. And if they need to have a great speaker, you're on there for that, coaching, all of that. And Michael, we thank you today for such an insightful conversation.

Absolutely. Your, your ins— your experiences really show how mindset changes every chapter and every moment of life.

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