Are boutique photographers missing out on untapped income by avoiding volume work? In this episode, Pat Miller pulls back the curtain as Carl Caylor reveals how adding volume photography can elevate—not dilute—your luxury studio brand.

Episode Highlights 🎤💡:

(04:51) - Why volume photography doesn’t mean sacrificing quality

(12:38) - How to separate your volume and boutique brands

(20:01) - How volume work improves your photography skills

Connect with Pat Miller ⬇

LinkedIn | Website

Connect with Carl Caylor ⬇

Website | Facebook | Instagram | Portraiture Unplugged: Natural Light Photography

I'm Pat Miller, and this is The Professional Photographer Podcast. You're a boutique photographer and you love making beautiful artwork for your clients, but you're hearing the rumblings. Studios like yours are picking up volume work. Should I be picking up volume work? How would I even begin doing that? And how do I keep it interesting? I normally do high-end stuff, and what will others think if I do that? And should I use my studio name? And will this damage my main brand? But this work looks great. I really would love it. These are the questions that circle a boutique photographer when the word volume pops up. Carl Caylor is our guest today, and he has been doing boutique photography forever. And then, as a service to his kids' school, he started to dabble with volume. And he's continued to dabble and dabble and dabble and dabble with volume photography. And it's working great for him doing both. The volume side can feed the boutique side, and both of them can coexist together. So how do we get all of those questions answered? Well, I asked them. Carl is standing by. We'll talk to him next. Carl, great to see you. Welcome to the show. How are you today?

I'm doing great. Thanks, Pat. Appreciate it.

I'm glad you're here. We get to talk all about how boutique photographers are moving into volume and what can offer benefits to their studio when they do. But we got to get to know you a little bit. If someone hasn't met you yet, tell them who you are and what you do.

I'm Carl. That's about it. No, I'm Carl Caylor. I've been around this industry for a very long time. I've owned a studio since 1993 or 4, somewhere in there. I started off being a lab technician, so I have a lab background as well as a photography background in portrait, wedding, journalism, commercial, and so on and so forth. And I've owned and operated a high-end portrait studio, mostly dealing with seniors and families, for many, many years. And then, as I'm sure we'll get into stories, I moved into a little bit of volume, enough to be dangerous and enough to also understand get a little bit of a toe dip into all the different options that are out there for us today in this industry.

I'm really excited to dig into that because I think when people think volume, they may only think one or two different styles of volume. But before we get into that, You mentioned you've done boutique photography for a very long time, but now you have volume as a part of your photography studio. So how did that come to be?

Well, I swore I was never going to do any volume. I made that many, many years ago on multiple occasions. One day, we ended up having to make a decision. My kids' sports events when they were younger. There was a photographer that I, for many ethical reasons, did not want around our kids. We'll leave it at that. And so I opted to do that for free, and I did that. It was a donation, I should say. So all the money that would have been used from the parents for prints, beyond what it cost from the lab, we donated back towards wrestling mats and baseballs and bats and things like that, catcher's kits, just because I wanted to make sure our community was safe. That being said, I learned that it was a lucrative product line. My worry was that, is it going to affect my carriage trade or my boutique brand? And I'm sure we'll get into some of the little things that we did along the way to make sure that didn't happen and also myths that we came to know that were just myths about how the two combined. So, I'm sure we'll get into that here in the next few questions, but that's how I got into volume was by necessity as far as an ethics concern.

So you're midway through the first job, or you get through that first donation job. What are some of those things that you realized weren't true? That you had always told yourself, because, oh, I was never going to do volume. You swoop in to do something good for your kids. Now you've done a volume job. What hit you immediately as different than the boutique work?

Well, the first thing that I noticed was that just because it's volume doesn't mean that we can't operate with good quality light, with good backgrounds, with good posing. Just because we're doing it rapidly doesn't mean that we still can't keep track of details, making sure that clothing was right and expressions were good, and given some time to make the kids create an expression that was going to sell or that parents were going to be happy with. There was still time for that and it got me thinking, well, this isn't really any different. It's just that we can't do as much as we usually do with our custom portrait sessions, but it doesn't mean that our quality has to suffer that much either. So that was the first, first big eye-opener to me.

And let's flesh out the rest of your journey from there. So you do the first gig, you realize, oh, hey, this isn't bad. How far did you take it and how far have you taken it? How much of your studio now is volume work?

I still do a couple leagues a year, and still not a lot compared to other studios. But I'm at the point now where I actually go and try to get more leagues and more teams, or maybe even a school coming up, which I never thought I'd say out loud. But it is a good product line to keep money coming in, and parents in volume, for some strange reason, are still buying prints. And that was one of the big things that I wanted to always hold on to, is that we're selling prints, not just the digital files. And for some reason, in that product line, that is still happening. So that makes me happy too.

Well, I gotta have a photo of my kid in their baseball uniform on my desk. I mean, come on, we gotta have the little prints. Is that the type of stuff that they're buying, or are they buying a whole bunch of different stuff?

Well, you know, for the most part, 8x10s, 5x7s are number one products. Then it's magnets and buttons, about magnets and buttons are by far the biggest product lines in our volume sports. And from what I hear from talking to others, that's very similar. What I want to put out, because I still want that brand boutique carriage trade brand I still offer wall portraits in my volume packages. So I'll offer 20x30 metals, I'll offer gallery wrap, you know, canvas wraps, and acrylic blocks and things, high-end, high-price items. I just kind of tuck them down way towards the bottom so we don't scare the crap out of the people when they look at the first package. But I leave it there as an option because those that want it still can. And now because of how things work technology-wise, now if somebody does order one of those high-end, the products I would normally really push towards in my Carriage Trade or Boutique Studio, I can pull those files and spend a little more time with them if I feel I need to, to make sure that everything is right on the light and the detail and the presentation or preparation for printing as well.

You said that volume work kind of changed the way that you thought about it. You had some preconceived notions. In the big picture, I think people have preconceived notions of what volume work is. There's more than one kind of volume work. So, can you share some of the different styles of volume that people could take on?

Absolutely. You know, it started with me with sports leagues, and it was a good transition because I was there coaching the kids anyway, you know. So it worked out really well. But there's dance, and I photographed dance studios for years and years up in our area, and you know, there's the hockey leagues and baseball and soccer, and softball and dance and dance and dance. Then, but you know, there's the schools, daycares. Daycares are a huge volume product line right now for a lot of people throughout the country. Private schools are a huge, huge product line for a lot of studios across the country. And then there's underclass and senior portraits throughout school in general, the whole, you know, so, and then of course, there's church directories. You know, so it's not just the big corporations that are photographing church directories anymore. There's a lot of studios that are taking that on because now they have access to workflow situations that warrant their ability to do that. So I think that's the biggest key is that now, you know, it used to be that the corporations of our industry had a system that they owned and allowed them to create a good workflow for large, large, large volume jobs. But now we have those at our fingertips, all of us. So, if you're a boutique studio, or an art person in general, but you want to do volume, we have, you know, Photo Day and GutPhoto and Waldo and Captura and Event Rose. We have software at our fingertips to create a workflow that makes it seamless and easy.

And that software helps it not be overwhelming because going from focusing on one family or one high school senior to the entire senior class has to just be overwhelming on the face of it.

Exactly. And it can be. And that's the thing is that, you know, I hear both sides because I'm a lab person still and I'm still a photographer. And so I hear from people, "I don't want to give up X percent of my jobs to a software company." And in my mind I'm going, "Hmm, this sale, X amount of dollars, 10% of that wouldn't even be close to paying wages for what that is accomplishing." So for, you know, to hire somebody and to hire somebody just for a couple hours out of the year, it just doesn't happen. So I get it that there's times when I'd rather have, you know, the DIY system like an Event Rose. So most labs have Event Rose as an option to do volume work and create packages and sell that way. And there's ways you can drag and drop each individual student, and that's crazy, but it's possible. But there's also ways that you can incorporate like a CSV file or an Excel sheet directly into that, you know, do-it-yourselfreview Rose events and make things happen too without, you know, causing percentages from different software companies. That being said, I choose the software companies personally. Yeah. Once I load it up in the gallery, I don't want to deal with it anymore as far as volume is concerned. That's the difference between my brand as a carriage trader boutique portrait studio and volume. That's the separation, you know, and I wanna keep it that way. And I know we talked about another story of some friends of mine that work together between studio and location, and I'm sure we'll get into that too. But we do wanna keep that kind of thing separate in some situations.

Well, let's tell that story right now 'cause I think it's really smart. If someone is doing a boutique studio, but they're interested in taking on volume work, they're not sure about using their boutique name for the high school photos, for example. You talked about two of your friends that came up with an interesting solution. So share that story.

Sure, yeah. So, you know, this is a small world industry. I mean, a lot of us know each other, and because of networking at like PPA events or your state events, you get to know people from outside of your area, and that comes in really handy sometimes. So in this case, Photographer A and Photographer B were on different sides of the state, and they both wanted to do volume, but they didn't want to risk the idea that their normal client for their boutique studios would think that, "Ooh, geez, they do volume, they must not be good at the artistic part of it." And so to separate completely, whenever Photographer A found volume jobs near his studio. Photographer B would come down and help them out, but they would use his name. So, it was brilliant because they both got to be separate entities and do boutique and do volume and not have either attached to their name where they wanted it. So it was a great system, great situation, and they did very well.

That's very clever. And I think folks that are running those high-end studios, an interview like today kind of opens their mind that a lot of high-end studios, or many at least, are doing volume work. Like, they wouldn't be the only one if they started picking up volume work. Can you talk to that person that knows they should be doing it, but they feel a little reserved about going down that path?

Yeah, all I have to do is look in the mirror. and I swore I was never going to do that. but like I said before, it is a place where parents are still ordering prints. And you know, if it's a lot of prints, a lot of people all in one place at one time versus spending 4, 5, 6, 7, 8 hours with one person and not doing what we used to do as far as orders are concerned, that's not a bad idea, you know? And like I said though, it is a different product line. It is different, a little bit different thought process. And it is something that it takes a little bit of getting used to, but it's not hard. And there's enough help out there that if you decide you wanna be the person to dive in, go ahead, dive in headfirst. If the water's too deep, you can always grab a snorkel, ask for help because there are people that will help you. And that's another beautiful part of our industry is that we do have that network and that support system that we can have each other's back. So whether it's a lab that is helping you out or a friend from across the country that's been in a similar situation, you don't have to do this alone.

Let's circle back to something you touched on before, that it doesn't have to be an assembly line. You still can make sure that you're doing quality work even though it's at volume. So how do you keep your artistic soul while doing 50 headshots or 50 shots in a day so it still feels like good work even though it's a high volume of work?

So two different ways, one of which, and this is why I kind of helped out PhotoDay when they first started. And I don't wanna single out anybody because they're all very good. But I was part of testing that out way back when. And the reason was because I had been doing it for many years prior to their existence. And what it was, was I thought, well, my website is an e-commerce site. So instead of doing paper and one image per kid, which is usually a volume thing, right? You know, so we got our piece of paper, and we did– the mom and dad already ordered an image or a package from an image that they haven't seen before. I thought, hmm, why don't we put that gallery up on my website, let them choose—heaven forbid, choose—an image, right? And then they can place their order and have the same price, the same packages, and all that kind of stuff. Well, what I found that happened is that it allowed me to be more of an artist, or to continue to be that artist, and do things with close-up, smiling, not smiling, full length, maybe an action thing or something, and throw them all up there on the gallery and allow them to make choices. And I found out a couple things happened. One, I was more excited about it. Once you light and you're back on your set, you can do a lot of different things really fast, right? And so we did. And one, it made them feel more important because it wasn't just, you know, stand there and smile. Okay, next. It was, okay, don't smile, look at me, look off in the distance, throw the ball up in the air. And they're doing multiple things which made them more engaged. I think that's important. And then the variety gave more engagement to the parents, which is very important. So that gave me the ability to still be the artist and do different things 'cause I wasn't just doing one thing, next, one thing, next. Assembly line, you know, and everybody got something a little bit different. Now, I also— the second thing I did, I started doing team posters. I was doing team posters with the inspiration from A League of Their Own. So if you ever watch the movie A League of Their Own, all the way to the end, and you see, you know, the credits going by and everything, and they were showing back to background photos from the movie and old photos from the original league and they'd have the girls, you know, the girls were up on the dugout and everything, but they were posed in casual yet game-faced type of posing. Well, I started doing that with the teams and it was a separate product. It was for a poster. It was specifically for an 11.25 x 17 poster and it was the only way they could get it. But at the time, we had to buy 25 at a time. Times have changed, right? So I had hundreds, thousands of these extra posters laying around because most of my teams are only, you know, 12 or 13 kids. But that was the fun thing for me is to do specialty products, specialty things that were different that the other photographers in town weren't doing for volume. And it also then made me, as my carriage trade, my boutique, stand out as well. If he can do this kind of different thing with his volume work, well, his senior stuff must be even more creative. That was kind of the spin on it. So it actually– the volume work and doing some silly things like that created the mindset in the people that I was working with that my other work was going to be more creative as well.

Is there a benefit here of being constricted in the amount of time that you have? You don't have all day and unlimited props and lights and smoke to find that print competition image. You have to try and be creative in short bursts when you're doing volume. Does that help a boutique photographer get sharper?

I'm laughing a little because you should know this, Pat. I mean, you know a lot of photographers, and I'm like all the rest of them. I'm Carl Caylor and I'm an overshooter. I feel like, you know, and we all do it because, you know, back when it was film, you know, we had 10 images on that roll and and make– gosh, you know, that was all, you know, cost coming out of our pocket. It was a waste. And then digital came along, and I felt like the Lone Ranger because, you know, you click, click, click, click, click. It was like he was using that six-shooter and he never had to reload. If you ever guys remember the Lone Ranger, you're old enough to do that. They never overloaded a 6-shooter. They just kept click, click, click, bang away. And that was digital to us, right? And so all of a sudden now we get too carried away. But this allowed– it actually, the volume work like this actually helped me in my normal senior sessions because it got me back thinking, okay, let's take this outfit like it's another team. All right? And so I'm like, okay, this team has to be in and out of here in 20 to 25 minutes, all 13 kids and the team. We got 20, 25 minutes, they're out because they got practice. We got the next team coming in, right? Because the leagues, you got to have the balance between doing really good things, detail work, a lot of variety, and yet time because they have other things to do. And so that's the balance. But it actually helped me become less of an overshooter for work because of it, because I kind of put that mentality in my head that, hey, this outfit is just like that team. Let's do a lot of things. Pay attention, fine-tune your eyes as far as what to look for fast, and move on to the next outfit. And so that's helped both directions.

I know as a boutique photographer, it's about capturing a great image, but it's also giving the client a terrific experience. So when you're working at volume with a large amount of people, what are some of the things that you find retains that great experience with the family or the subject that a boutique photographer may not think about as they just make the transition from boutique to volume?

Energy, plain and simple. Energy. Maybe you call it adrenaline, I guess, but you got to read your audience. And if you have a bunch of, for example, I thought it was always funny when I didn't care. I wanted– up here, we had our baseball leagues. They don't hire a photographer for the league. Each coach hires a photographer for their team, which is a major pain in the butt. And it is what it is, but that's what we have to deal with. Most of the time then, I was dealing with a team right before a game or right after a game. And I prefer to do it after the game because the light was better. And so the parents are like, "Oh, but their uniforms are dirty." And I'm like, perfect. It looks more like baseball kids. I mean, that's to me as a parent, it meant more when the knees are dirt and grass stains and their face was dirty and they had the paint that the kids had to have on their eyes just like the pros. You know? It was all dripping down. To me, that was more of the story. It was more of the styling to me. And so a few times when we had to do a session before a game started, the kids got to the point where they knew that if I was there showing up as their photographer, "Oh cool, this is the guy that has fun with us and this is the guy that doesn't care if we're dirty." Well, one time I pulled in and I was carrying my gear over and one of the kids is like, "Oh, it's Mr. Caylor. He doesn't care if we're dirty." This is before the game because the parents wanted them to be clean. And the kids all went to get like a whole team together. I think, I swear to God, they counted and ran hand to hand and dove into second base. And I'm like, no, no, no, no, wait. And the parents like, "Oh, let's reschedule." But that was the mindset. It got to the point where the kids were so excited that we were there because we had fun with them, too. And that's the mindset. You get to know your audience, and and and and work off their energy and make sure that they have fun with it. And if they're not having fun, you know, and there were always the kids also that knew that, "Oh, he doesn't care if we don't smile." I know I'm gonna get him to smile in at least 1 or 2 images 'cause grandma wants those. So does mom for some reason, I don't know. But I want some that are game-faced, you know, I want some that are more pondering and expressive in storytelling. And it's funny 'cause, you know, I always worried about, well, are we going to be producing things that are still artistic and worthy? So I actually entered some of my youth baseball and football images, my volume work, into IPC back in the day, and when it's still IPC, and many of them merited, a couple of them loaned. So can you do it? Yes, you can. Can you do it on a fast pace? Absolutely, you can. But I think the experience comes into it where you get the rapport with people just like you would if you're spending 6 hours with them.

The holy grail of doing volume for the boutique side is to have all of those new families become leads for the boutique side. So how do you work that turnover from the volume side to the boutique side?

Well, when I was working, when I first started, and I was having everybody, you know, I put the galleries on my website. That was the biggest advantage there. That was the big plus because they had to go to my website to see their gallery. That is the only negative on some of the software companies that work with now. It's their site, it's their system, and I'm missing that. So what I do now is, and every order goes out a card. So we'll print, have a card printed that goes in, you get stuffed. So that way, they know that, hey, we're here for families in the fall, or we have something coming up with spring photos or something like that. And then I also, of course, on my website information, 'cause we're always trying to drive through the website. Always trying to drive through the website. And everything that we put out, even on the flyers through PhotoDay or GotPhoto Captura, whoever you're working with, you're going to have my website on there in an easy, you know, it's there ready to go. A lot of times I'll do QR codes. So at events, I'll create a QR code because people don't like to type in their phones anymore to get to a website. So I'll keep it easy for them. And so I'll make some posters or banners and have those up there. So it gets them right to my website as well.

Any final thoughts? Anything that we haven't covered? I know there's a lot, but anything that comes to mind right now about a boutique photographer that's thinking about adding volume? Something maybe you learned the hard way or you'd do over again if you could?

I'll leave you with two different thoughts. One is I was very worried that, people were gonna complain or show concern that I wasn't putting all their images into folders anymore. I actually hand-foldered in museum-quality acid-free folders that went out to all the parents. And when I went to the software companies, I'm like, ooh, it's getting delivered right to their homes. We can't do that. And I sat there by the phone expecting it to ring, and it never did. And it's been what, 8 or 9 years now? I know, right? And not one person. That's the thing about missing those folders, which is, it's great, but at the same time, I'm kind of mad because all those years that I was using the folder, the folders cost more than the prints literally. So I saved like more than 50% of my overhead by not having these folders anymore. So don't worry about the little things. So that's the first thing I'm gonna tell you. Don't worry about the little things. The second thing I'm gonna tell you is get to know some of your options as far as the software companies. For example, Waldo is out there, and if you're doing action images like photographing football games or baseball games, things like that, and you're trying to sell those action images, Waldo is great because it's got number recognition. So beyond just seeing faces or things like that, you can say, "Okay, I'm looking for number 12," and it can help you find that, which is a really cool system. GotPhoto is great for schools and private schools, smaller schools, private daycares, things like that, because it's set up for single image type of products. And in a lot of those cases, you're just photographing the individual, you're not doing the class in general or the team and the individual. Where now, that's where PhotoDay shines. When you get into PhotoDay, they're set up for sports leagues, but they'll work for everything else as well. So if you're doing, you know, the team and individual and you want both in the same MemoryMate, it can do that really easy. Parents can put them together. It's great. Then there's Captura. If you are the kind of person that is in a big area, a big city, and has big schools, and you can land some of these schools with, you know, 1,000 kids or 2,000 kids or 5,000 kids, Captura is where you want to be heading. They are set up for volume, and they do it really well. So It's something to consider. If you're doing 18 here and there and you can do it yourself, then Event Rose is for you. But like I said, then it's gotta be small units of volume or medium size using some automation with that type of software as well. Last thing, just like anything else, charge for your work. Just because it's volume doesn't mean it has to be cheaper than dirt. You know, somebody told me a long time ago, I'll never— this was a restaurant friend of mine— I'll never sell a hamburger for what it costs for a can of dog food. Don't do that for a photograph either. So still charge what you're worth, even if it's volume. It's going to be less than what your boutique prices are, but still don't give away the world. Make some, make a living. You have to make a living doing this.

A great conversation, Carl. You made a bunch of people a bunch of money today. I really appreciate you coming on the show. Thanks so much.

You're absolutely welcome. Always like to help and share whenever I can.

Thanks for tuning in to this week's episode of The Professional Photographer Podcast. Now it's your turn. Click the comment section. Tell us what you liked about this week's episode. What did Carl say that made you go, oh, okay, I get it now? Or what would you like to see us cover more in depth? Your comments let us know if we're on the right track and what other types of shows we should be recording. Also, of course, for the algorithm gods, like and subscribe. That way, you can stay with the Professional Photographer Podcast. One other thing, if you're not yet a member of Professional Photographers of America, you're missing it. PPA offers incredible resources like equipment insurance, top-notch education, and a supportive community of photographers ready to help you succeed. It's perfect for photographers who are serious about growing their business in a sustainable and profitable way. At PPA, you belong here. Discover more about membership at ppa.com. That's ppa.com. I'm Pat Miller, founder of the Small Business Owners Community and the host of the show. Thanks for coming by. We'll see you right here next week. Take care.