Nikka Costa’s “So Have I For You” is a must-listen, with unique chord changes, powerful vocal delivery, and the emotional storytelling that defines her acclaimed album "Everybody Got Their Something." In this main segment, we break down the track’s genre-blending influences, discuss the subtle complexities of its lyrics, the arrangement, and instrumentation. Elaine interprets the lyrics as a reaction to a mother-daughter relationship and personal empowerment.

In the Mailbag section, we discuss new music discovery tips, sharing practical strategies for finding fresh tracks in today’s digital landscape. From the value of word-of-mouth recommendations, to the role of streaming algorithms, all the way to creative community ideas like record clubs and collaborative playlists, the segment wraps up with advice on leveraging local libraries for music exploration and encourages listeners to share their own discoveries, reinforcing the podcast’s mission to foster a vibrant, engaged community of musicians and fans.

This is the last episode of the first season, with plans to return in the fall.

Listen to the song

• YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S23mxRA4NdQ
• Spotify - https://open.spotify.com/track/7De0muwuDqAymX6taRwzIe
• Apple Music - https://music.apple.com/us/song/so-have-i-for-you/723699743
• Amazon - https://music.amazon.com/albums/B000THIK2O?marketplaceId=ATVPDKIKX0DER&musicTerritory=US&ref=dm_sh_4VX4PBRQ777wfnqnCWRzGtZI2&trackAsin=B000THBOTK

Other links

• Playlist of the songs we’ve reviewed
• YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL5bn23baJ4xQ1t0TMqukELY5W95HwuMoT
• Spotify - https://open.spotify.com/playlist/7gCOF5M0zYS1fBvXgT5ccI?si=7F3yVdEDRRWa_gAArK3AYg
• Apple Music - https://music.apple.com/us/playlist/songs-reviewed-on-the-musicians-loupe/pl.u-V9D7maah06JNo
• Amazon Music - https://music.amazon.com/user-playlists/3b47be4937b7490982f4a872db32ec8dsune?ref=dm_sh_AEFZY8KhvSsz1TGoRmasg6zHZ

About us

Trist Curless is a Los Angeles-based vocalist, educator, and sound engineer. As a performer, Trist has toured worldwide as a co-founder of the pop-jazz vocal group m-pact and a 10 year member of the Grammy-award winning The Manhattan Transfer. In addition to these two vocal powerhouse groups, he’s also performed with Take 6, Bobby McFerrin, New York Voices, Vox Audio, Naturally 7, and The Swingle Singers. His latest venture, The LHR Project, is a new vocal group collective celebrating legendary jazz vocal group Lambert, Hendricks, and Ross.

As an audio engineer, Trist has toured nationally with several vocal groups and bands in a large variety of venues, working for Grammy award winners Pentatonix and Take 6, as well as prominent a cappella vocal groups Straight No Chaser, VoicePlay, and Accent.

Elaine Chao, M.Ed is a San Francisco Bay Area-based vocalist, multi-instrumentalist, vocal percussionist, and songwriter whose career spans a cappella, contemporary worship, and classical music. She has leveraged her training in classical and choral music over the course of her contemporary performance, including in orchestras for musical theatre and in sacred spaces. In addition to music, she also is a martial artist and published author. She currently leads a product management team at a major software company dedicated to creative expression. All statements in this podcast are her own and do not reflect the opinions of her employer.

Elaine: Hey, Trist, what do we have this week?

Trist: What we have this week is the final episode of Season One.

Elaine: Woo!

Trist: That's what we have this week.

Trist: And in the process of making this for you folks, I grappled

Trist: at the beginning and throughout because so many of these songs

Trist: that we choose come from albums that I love.

Trist: Like I love the whole album.

Trist: So while we're not changing the

Trist: format to covering full albums,

Trist: if we did, this would be one of

Trist: them.

Trist: This is going to be from Nikka

Trist: Costa and the song is "So Have I

Trist: for You."

Trist: "Everybody Got Their Something"

Trist: is the name of the album that is

Trist: incredible.

Trist: And it's twenty five years old

Trist: this year, the year of our Lord

Trist: 2026.

Elaine: So before we take a break to listen to the song, can you

Elaine: remind us all how we're listening to music as a part of

Elaine: The Musician's Loupe community?

Trist: Oh, we're listening to this one loudly.

Trist: Okay, maybe not, but if you're

Trist: home by yourself, definitely

Trist: crank it.

Trist: This is so good.

Trist: Did I mention listen to the whole album?

Trist: So what we like to say here at

Trist: The Musician's Loupe is, first

Trist: of all, thank you for listening

Trist: at all.

Trist: So no matter what environment

Trist: you're in, we are thrilled to

Trist: have you.

Trist: That said, if you can, put it on

Trist: the better settings in your car,

Trist: put on the better headphones, go

Trist: to the better speakers, put on

Trist: the vinyl version that's really

Trist: nice that you spend a lot of

Trist: money on instead of just through

Trist: your earbuds.

Trist: We just like to encourage it.

Trist: I think I speak for myself, I

Trist: will even just lazily listen to

Trist: whatever is just at my

Trist: fingertips and not utilize the

Trist: nice gear I have all the time,

Trist: sometimes out of convenience,

Trist: but sometimes out of just pure

Trist: laziness.

Trist: So don't be lazy.

Trist: Listen on the good stuff.

Trist: If you can, take the time to do it.

Elaine: All right.

Elaine: So we are going to pause.

Elaine: We'll put the links into the show notes so that you can

Elaine: listen to the song.

Elaine: And we'll be right back.

Elaine: And we are back.

Elaine: Okay. I will say that this is one of my favorite songs from

Elaine: one of my favorite albums.

Elaine: And by the way, this is one of the first albums that you

Elaine: recommended to me when

Trist: Hey.

Elaine: we first started to do the album recommendation game.

Trist: How about that?

Elaine: There you go.

Elaine: So I have listened to this one a whole bunch of times.

Elaine: According to Apple Music, I've

Elaine: listened to this at least 120

Elaine: times.

Elaine: I think it is an undercount because

Trist: Oh. I'm sure.

Elaine: yeah, this is definitely one of my favorite songs here.

Elaine: And it is interesting because I had forgotten that it was from

Elaine: this particular genre, mostly because I initially heard this

Elaine: album long after it was released, so I had no anchor in

Elaine: time to when it was actually released to say, oh, this is

Elaine: from this particular genre.

Trist: Right.

Elaine: I was thinking about this album.

Elaine: There are songs on this album that don't sound dated at all.

Trist: Yeah.

Elaine: And yet this one, I felt sounded

Elaine: a little bit more dated from

Elaine: just the effects on her voice

Elaine: and such.

Elaine: So can you tell me a little bit

Elaine: about why you chose this song

Elaine: over the other ones on the

Elaine: album?

Trist: Oh, man.

Trist: Well, did we mention you should just listen to the whole album?

Trist: If not, definitely do that.

Trist: So, the thing that I like about this, this is in that category

Trist: of: the big hit, probably her biggest hit ever was from this

Trist: album, "Like a Feather."

Trist: Great.

Trist: still holds up, I think it's still a great, great track.

Trist: There's a reason it was a hit.

Trist: When you listen to the album the first time, it's definitely one

Trist: that stands out.

Trist: "So Have I for You" is one of those that is then stuck in your

Trist: head after the fifth listen.

Trist: The first time you hear it.

Trist: Oh yeah, that's really good.

Trist: Like you might like it just fine.

Trist: But in the first listen, there are several other songs that may

Trist: stick in your head.

Trist: There are a few songs where, after you've listened to the

Trist: album many times, on that fifth, sixth, those repeat listens.

Trist: "Oh, wow, I love this song."

Trist: Like we said, if you listen to this whole album, that'll happen

Trist: to you too.

Elaine: This is definitely either my

Elaine: second or third favorite song on

Elaine: the album.

Elaine: It made it to certain playlists that I had for focus, and just

Elaine: for the ones that I felt were a little bit more of a bop.

Trist: Well, even that fits what we usually do because we usually

Trist: don't pick the biggest hit song.

Trist: We usually pick like the second or third song, so it even fits

Trist: for you personally.

Elaine: Exactly.

Elaine: Well, that being said, for me, this one really stuck out

Elaine: because the chord changes are

Trist: Um

Elaine: a bit

Trist: hmm.

Elaine: unusual for rock.

Elaine: It's interesting because Apple

Elaine: Music classifies Nikka Costa as

Elaine: pop instead of rock, but it

Elaine: definitely has a huge rock

Elaine: influence on all of her music on

Elaine: this album.

Elaine: For this one, the chords are not

Elaine: something that you normally

Elaine: hear.

Elaine: It's not even your typical, jazz stuff that you have.

Elaine: There's definitely chord changes

Elaine: that are really just out there,

Elaine: but they really fit with the

Elaine: music.

Elaine: And so that's part of the reason I like this particular song.

Elaine: Can you tell me a little bit

Elaine: more about what you like about

Elaine: this song?

Trist: I like the changes.

Trist: I really love basically kind of the back half of the chorus, I

Trist: guess you could call it.

Trist: Some of these tunes like this,

Trist: it's hard to give good

Trist: descriptions, but it's the,

Trist: "That's all I need to free

Trist: myself."

Trist: So she says that line twice and

Trist: every time, the second time she

Trist: sings it.

Trist: The second "free," the chord is great.

Trist: It's probably like the tritone of the key.

Trist: So that's what makes it cool.

Trist: The fact that it's a tritone doesn't make it cool.

Trist: The sound is what makes it cool.

Trist: um,

Elaine: Yeah, it has a little bit of tension there,

Trist: yeah,

Elaine: right.

Elaine: Is what you're talking

Trist: yeah,

Elaine: about.

Trist: it's like because it repeats a

Trist: line and there's just one chord

Trist: different.

Trist: It's not a big reharmonization, just sings the line twice and

Trist: every time the second time is like I said, I'll just call it

Trist: the cool chord.

Trist: I love that.

Elaine: One other thing that I really loved about this track was just

Elaine: her voice on it.

Elaine: And this was my first experience

Elaine: with Nikka Costa as an artist,

Elaine: and just the quality of her

Elaine: voice and the way that she was

Elaine: singing, and a lot of the

Elaine: harmonies sounded like her as

Elaine: well, just not like random

Elaine: background vocalists.

Elaine: And there was something about the quality of her voice that

Elaine: was just very passionate and at the same time, very focused.

Elaine: So there was this bell tone to

Elaine: her voice that I really, really

Elaine: loved.

Elaine: It rang.

Elaine: It wasn't super piercing, but it was piercing enough to get the

Elaine: sense of oomph to it, maybe even a little bit of a gospel oomph

Elaine: to it, even though she was apparently born in Tokyo and to

Elaine: American parents and so very international kind of

Elaine: upbringing, even though she's here in the United States now.

Trist: And yes, seeing that her father,

Trist: Don Costa, is very important

Trist: arranger.

Trist: Huge.

Trist: Like massively important arranger.

Trist: Did a lot of arranging, especially orchestral arranging

Trist: for Frank Sinatra.

Trist: He did a lot of producing and directing and arranging.

Trist: Matter of fact, on a later

Trist: album, she found an old score

Trist: that her dad had done for

Trist: Sinatra and had someone do a

Trist: reduction and it's on her

Trist: strings album that just a string

Trist: quartet did a version of one of

Trist: the songs.

Trist: But anyway, check that out.

Trist: Also, the last little tidbit I remember off my head is she was

Trist: basically a child star in Italy.

Elaine: Oh.

Trist: She had a big hit as a little kid,

Elaine: Interesting.

Trist: like '81 or something like this.

Trist: Every once in a while, you'll

Trist: see these albums of her just as

Trist: Nikka Costa, and there's this

Trist: cute little girl's face on the

Trist: front and I'm like, wait a

Trist: minute.

Elaine: Well, let's continue talking about the music here because

Elaine: there's so much to say.

Elaine: Now, one thing that I found

Elaine: really interesting, I tried to

Elaine: figure out the beats per minute

Elaine: because we have talked about

Elaine: this mid tempo song before,

Elaine: about how we tend to skew more

Elaine: towards really fast or really

Elaine: slow songs.

Elaine: And this one kind of hits right in the between.

Elaine: It's got that 76 beats per minute.

Elaine: It's not quite a ballad and it

Elaine: is at the same time, it still

Elaine: moves.

Elaine: And so can you talk a little bit about how this song fits into

Elaine: your general spectrum of tempo?

Trist: I think that's right.

Trist: It's not really necessarily a

Trist: ballad, but it's not a like

Trist: in-your-face, it's about the

Trist: chords.

Trist: It helps also more emphasis on the lyric now.

Trist: We've talked about this before

Trist: about how the setting of the

Trist: song really will serve a lyric,

Trist: something that's a lot faster or

Trist: more groove oriented might

Trist: distract from the really great

Trist: lyrics.

Trist: I'd love to hear from you about those actually.

Trist: What struck you as you were breaking down the lyrical

Trist: content of this one?

Trist: I'm fascinated to know.

Elaine: This one was very interesting for me because I realized after

Elaine: 120 plus listens, probably a couple hundred more than that, I

Elaine: really hadn't listened so closely to really understand the

Elaine: depth of this song.

Elaine: And so as I was analyzing this, I realized that this was

Elaine: actually a song about her mother or about this narrator talking

Elaine: about their mother figure.

Trist: Hm!

Elaine: And, before I was just like, oh

Elaine: yeah, it says Mama, but, you

Elaine: know, it could be any kind of

Elaine: woman that is in this adult

Elaine: mother figure.

Elaine: But this lyric really does talk about how the narrator is trying

Elaine: to reinvent herself and this almost chip on the shoulder

Elaine: feeling that she has, saying like, I got something to prove,

Elaine: and this is how I'm going to prove: I'm not going to use a

Elaine: gun, I'm actually going to use my voice in this melody.

Trist: Hm.

Elaine: And then you hear more about the

Elaine: relationship between the

Elaine: narrator and this mother figure

Elaine: and through the similes that it

Elaine: uses, right?

Elaine: There's like metaphors and similes, the thought of similes

Elaine: being something being "like" something else, and then that

Elaine: being "like" this person's experience with the other person

Elaine: in this toxic relationship.

Elaine: She does say at the very beginning, "I am a woman with a

Elaine: mission and a past to outdo."

Elaine: And so it talks a lot about, oh,

Elaine: there's something I need to

Elaine: overcome here.

Elaine: And then the different similes.

Elaine: I'm just going to read out the different ones.

Elaine: "Just like the earth has spent a thousand years making up for

Elaine: what we do."

Elaine: "Just like the heart that spent

Elaine: a lifetime forgiving what is

Elaine: cruel."

Elaine: And

Trist: MM.

Elaine: "just like the sea has spent

Elaine: eternity at the mercy of the

Elaine: moon."

Trist: Ooh.

Elaine: And

Trist: That's

Elaine: each

Trist: my favorite

Elaine: one of

Trist: one.

Elaine: these things has a different sense to it, that the more I

Elaine: looked at it, the more I was like, oh man, this is so deep!

Elaine: And the first one thinking about "just like the earth has spent a

Elaine: thousand years making up for what we do."

Trist: MM.

Elaine: There's a sense of, oh, there is

Elaine: a healing that's going on that

Elaine: the earth out of its normal

Elaine: healing process.

Elaine: But it just takes time.

Elaine: So it could be this humans are destroying things and the earth

Elaine: recovers from it, but it always takes longer to recover than it

Elaine: does to destroy.

Elaine: And so she uses that as a simile to how she feels in this

Elaine: relationship with this other person, with this mother figure.

Elaine: And then you say like, "just

Elaine: like the heart that spent a

Elaine: lifetime forgiving what is

Elaine: cruel."

Elaine: You do find out with this as

Elaine: well as some of the other things

Elaine: that she says in the lyrics

Elaine: before.

Elaine: For instance, "your seeds of

Elaine: misery have sprouted, and they

Elaine: try to block my way, and you

Elaine: just try to disarm me with an

Elaine: embrace."

Elaine: Like you find out a little bit

Elaine: more about the manipulation that

Elaine: happens through this parental

Elaine: figure that she is trying to get

Elaine: away from.

Elaine: And so I guess it's like those things, and it is one of these

Elaine: push and pull type of things, because she does talk about how

Elaine: the sea is spent eternity at the mercy of the moon.

Elaine: There's this gravitational pull

Elaine: that she feels with this other

Elaine: person that is something that

Elaine: she feels like she has to

Elaine: overcome because,

Trist: Mhm.

Elaine: she does have a mission.

Elaine: She's a woman on a mission.

Elaine: She declares it twice because

Trist: Yeah.

Elaine: that first part of that first verse is repeated as the first

Elaine: part of the second verse.

Elaine: And as I've said before,

Elaine: repetition is a really deep

Elaine: indication of what really

Elaine: matters in a song and the fact

Elaine: that there is a full first half

Elaine: of a verse repeat in the second

Elaine: half of the verse tells me a

Elaine: little something about what she

Elaine: is trying to emphasize in this

Elaine: song.

Trist: And

Elaine: So.

Trist: on each of those lines, you said that she follows with a "so have

Trist: I for you."

Trist: Just

Elaine: Exactly.

Trist: like just like these things.

Trist: So have I for you.

Trist: She

Elaine: Mhm.

Trist: punctuates those, each with that.

Elaine: And even in the second half of

Elaine: the second verse, I have

Elaine: justified every wave in our

Elaine: ocean.

Elaine: So our ocean, meaning

Trist: Mhm.

Elaine: the relationship.

Elaine: I've covered every range of emotion.

Elaine: So the more that she's talking about this.

Elaine: The more it's like describing the complexity and the entirety

Elaine: of the emotions that she's felt over the course of this

Elaine: relationship, which I think she's probably still in.

Elaine: You know,

Trist: And that's it.

Elaine: and

Trist: And

Elaine: so.

Trist: that's a perfectly mother daughter thing, just

Elaine: Exactly.

Trist: like the sea has spent eternity at the mercy.

Trist: Like as a daughter, you're at the mercy of your mother.

Elaine: That's

Trist: And,

Elaine: right.

Trist: you know, there's lots of tumultuous mother-daughter

Trist: relationships like that that just go on and on forever.

Trist: Some are just like that as youth.

Trist: And then they grow together and everything is cool and some

Trist: don't ever get out of that.

Trist: But, I love where you're going with all this.

Trist: I never thought of this as a mother type relationship, but as

Trist: you're pointing all these out, especially that one, the "wave

Trist: of our ocean covered all the-" "just like the sea has spent

Trist: eternity at the mercy of the moon, so have I, for you."

Elaine: And

Trist: Did we

Elaine: it

Trist: mention

Elaine: was something.

Trist: this song is awesome, by the

Elaine: It

Trist: way?

Elaine: is. I had to go back multiple times and I was writing my

Elaine: thoughts down as I was doing the analysis of the lyrics.

Elaine: And I was like, is this a metaphorical mama?

Elaine: Like, what if it's just a literal mama?

Trist: And then even

Elaine: Oh.

Trist: the chorus, you know, there's that "You can choose the rain.

Trist: I choose the sun."

Elaine: Yeah.

Trist: That's.

Elaine: But there's this whole sense of

Elaine: like, that's all I need to free

Elaine: myself, right?

Trist: Yep.

Elaine: And so there's this freedom

Elaine: anthem that's happening here,

Elaine: but

Trist: Mhm.

Elaine: it's freedom anthem from this toxic relationship.

Elaine: And yeah, the more I stared at it, the more I was like, oh,

Elaine: wow, this song was not what I thought it was.

Trist: Wow.

Elaine: And I've

Trist: Me

Elaine: listened

Trist: either.

Elaine: to it for over five years, you

Trist: Wow.

Elaine: know, like.

Trist: I never, ever, ever thought of

Trist: it from that perspective

Trist: whatsoever.

Elaine: So

Trist: I knew I liked

Elaine: yeah.

Trist: some of those lines by themselves in a vacuum, but.

Trist: Wow.

Trist: That's great.

Elaine: So anyway, that's what I got out of this after

Trist: Wow.

Elaine: staring at it for a little while.

Trist: That's really cool.

Trist: I didn't really ever listen to the whole thing in that context.

Trist: Like you said, it's part of the whole album.

Trist: I liked the song.

Trist: I liked the chords.

Trist: Some of those lines would stick out, and I didn't ever put

Trist: thought to the meaning behind all of those particular lyrics.

Trist: But wow, the way you are painting that now.

Trist: And yeah, you're right, the way that she sings and in this

Trist: style, "Mama, you can choose the rain," it doesn't come off like

Trist: she's talking about her mother when you just are passively

Trist: listening to it.

Trist: That's just like talking about anyone.

Trist: And at the beginning, like I'm a woman with a mission.

Trist: So it feels like some women's empowerment and

Elaine: Exactly.

Trist: "a past to outdo," oh, I've got

Trist: to be better than my female

Trist: counterparts were back in the

Trist: day.

Trist: So it feels like a woman's empowerment kind of song.

Elaine: Mhm.

Trist: But, just for those couple of lines

Elaine: That's right.

Trist: that

Elaine: Yeah.

Trist: I'm not

Elaine: And

Trist: paying

Elaine: I think

Trist: attention

Elaine: that's why

Trist: to.

Elaine: this was so fascinating for me to go through it.

Elaine: Now, even within this context, if we take this interpretation

Elaine: of the lyrics and we think about the outro, which I thought was

Elaine: really interesting repeats a couple of times.

Elaine: That's what I need to free myself.

Trist: Mhm.

Elaine: There is this amazing vocal.

Elaine: I don't even know whether it's

Elaine: like a freedom chant or whatever

Elaine: it is.

Elaine: Like it's all sorts of vocal craziness happening and it's

Elaine: pulled way, way back.

Elaine: And it's almost like her going off into freedom.

Elaine: Even just right now as we were talking about it, what does it

Elaine: mean that it sounds like this?

Elaine: After this I'm choosing freedom.

Elaine: And then to have this vocal playing that's happening on

Trist: Mhm.

Elaine: top of that.

Trist: So yeah, what we just said that

Trist: answers your first question when

Trist: you said, why did I choose this

Trist: one?

Trist: That's why.

Trist: Because

Elaine: Yeah.

Trist: there's just

Elaine: And

Trist: a lot

Elaine: this,

Trist: there.

Elaine: this outro, these two little lines.

Elaine: I'm just looking at the outro lyrics again.

Elaine: "This bird's gonna fly so high / Watch my sky come undone."

Elaine: And then

Trist: Mhm.

Elaine: she has all of this vocal wildness that happens.

Elaine: It's so amazing.

Elaine: I'm like, oh my goodness, I wish I could do that.

Trist: You can choose the rain, but I choose the sun.

Elaine: Yeah.

Trist: Like your darkness is not going to get me.

Elaine: Well, as we wrap this up, I

Elaine: would love to talk a little bit

Elaine: about the instrumentation

Elaine: because we haven't talked a ton

Elaine: about this.

Elaine: I think this is one of the

Elaine: purely rock songs that we've

Elaine: done here.

Elaine: We're thinking about really a lot of effects on the guitars.

Elaine: I don't think we've covered a

Elaine: lot of songs with these hard,

Elaine: almost crunchy guitar sounds

Elaine: that we have that really fill in

Elaine: a lot of the background space

Elaine: and power chords that are

Elaine: hitting these very unusual chord

Elaine: changes.

Elaine: And I'm wondering if there's

Elaine: something that you can tell us

Elaine: about that.

Trist: the guitar work I know, Mark

Trist: Ronson, a really amazing

Trist: producer.

Trist: Great DJ, authored a book,

Trist: married to Meryl Streep's

Trist: daughter.

Trist: Anyway, lots of things that make him in a reason you might know

Trist: who he is.

Trist: This was an earlier entry into his doing this kind of thing.

Trist: I know he plays guitar on this.

Trist: that's just obviously the vibe

Trist: they were going after and now

Trist: that we're digging through these

Trist: lyrics and the aggression, like,

Trist: I will not be pulled into your

Trist: funk.

Trist: Like I need to be strong, then all makes sense with the lyric,

Trist: that it would be this strong rock and roll sound.

Elaine: It definitely gives a sense of a lot more aggression, you

Trist: Mhm.

Elaine: know, because I think that this

Elaine: type of sound is often linked

Elaine: with voices of aggression or

Elaine: empowerment.

Elaine: To what you were saying before,

Elaine: like this very female

Elaine: empowerment.

Elaine: And also her voice is so strong, So it definitely has a sense of,

Elaine: oh, I am empowered as a woman.

Elaine: And then

Trist: Yeah.

Elaine: you find out it is a different type of empowerment.

Elaine: Did you find out who wrote the song?

Trist: Oh, yeah.

Trist: No, it was her.

Elaine: Oh, okay.

Elaine: So I guess the question is, is

Elaine: it autobiographical or is it a

Elaine: song about some other type of

Elaine: character?

Elaine: We'll never know, but it is something for us to think about.

Trist: I was looking at the credits,

Trist: co-written by her and Justin

Trist: Stanley who plays guitar on this

Trist: and is a producer of the album

Trist: as well.

Trist: You're right, maybe autobiographical, maybe not.

Trist: Who knows?

Trist: If I were to guess, I would say

Trist: so because boy, those are pretty

Trist: strong lyrics.

Trist: Maybe she's writing about the relationship of a friend of hers

Trist: and her mom.

Trist: Who knows?

Trist: But

Elaine: Exactly.

Trist: seems like these lyrics are pointed to something.

Trist: They're not just willy nilly.

Trist: Now that we've dug into them, pretty strong.

Elaine: All right.

Elaine: Well, any last thoughts before we move on?

Trist: We probably didn't really mention it, but you should check

Trist: out the whole album.

Trist: That's what I would do if I were

Elaine: I

Trist: you.

Elaine: would

Trist: I would

Elaine: plus

Trist: listen,

Elaine: one that.

Trist: listen, Just listen to the whole album.

Elaine: And if you can figure out what my favorite song is, you can

Elaine: email us and let us know.

Trist: Okay. Yeah.

Elaine: So with that, let's move on to our next segment, which is.

Trist: The mailbag.

Elaine: That's right, the mailbag.

Elaine: And you can get a hold of us via

Elaine: email at themusiciansloupe,

Elaine: that's L-O-U-P-E at gmail dot

Elaine: com, or you can catch us on

Elaine: Instagram or Threads

Elaine: @themusiciansloupe.

Trist: And this is the last time this

Trist: season that you can email us

Trist: there and let us know about the

Trist: particular episode you just

Trist: listened to.

Trist: And, you can tell us what your

Trist: favorite song on the album is

Trist: because you listened to the

Trist: whole thing and maybe some other

Trist: ideas that you have for the pod

Trist: and maybe anything else that we

Trist: missed.

Elaine: All right, so with that, let's

Elaine: look at our last mailbag of the

Elaine: season.

Elaine: This mailbag entry is from

Elaine: Threads from @craig_70 from May

Elaine: of 2026.

Elaine: And he writes, "Desperately seeking new music selections.

Elaine: Open to any genre."

Elaine: And I am really interested in hearing how you discover new

Elaine: music in this day and age.

Trist: I think a lot of new music I discover accidentally, I

Trist: overhear, the apps, the Shazam on your phone, any of the music

Trist: recognition apps that you have when you're in a restaurant and

Trist: there's a song that's cool and you can just grab what it is and

Trist: then check it out.

Trist: People do ask me this a bit.

Trist: If you are talking about the algorithms and usually in a

Trist: negative connotation, but if you've been listening to a

Trist: particular platform often.

Trist: And if you have kind of eclectic

Trist: tastes, it shoots all over the

Trist: place.

Trist: The recommended things that it will find and spit back at you

Trist: quite often are pretty good in terms of like, it's recommending

Trist: this, I'll at least give a try.

Trist: Not always guaranteed that you're going to like those

Trist: things, but that's a good way.

Trist: And some of the apps, some of the streamers do a better job of

Trist: that, I think.

Trist: Probably depends on how deep the

Trist: engines are that work that for

Trist: them.

Trist: But really, happenstance and word of mouth are my favorites.

Trist: And being someone who's just

Trist: really into music and has a

Trist: podcast that talks about music,

Trist: I definitely have friends all

Trist: the time who are, hey, you might

Trist: like this.

Trist: Matter of fact, I think our very

Trist: first entry for Season 2 is

Trist: actually going to be a band that

Trist: a friend of mine text messaged

Trist: me about.

Trist: And so I heard cold out of nowhere.

Trist: That's not quite a cliffhanger.

Trist: Still, the word of mouth and your friends who really know you

Trist: and know what you might like.

Trist: I find I get a lot of great discovery that way.

Elaine: I think that you and I are both surrounded by a number of very

Elaine: talented musicians who understand talent and who will

Elaine: share talent, and I know that besides you, there's at least

Elaine: one other person who we both know who shares just what he

Elaine: finds interesting on his Instagram page, and I will

Elaine: occasionally look at his stories and be like, holy cows, this

Elaine: person has just blown my mind.

Elaine: I need

Trist: Mhm.

Elaine: to find more of this person.

Trist: Mhm.

Elaine: And I think that that sense of

Elaine: word of mouth and having other

Elaine: people share what they actively

Elaine: love, I think this is kind of

Elaine: where we're going into the

Elaine: personal recommendation.

Elaine: We're so used to this

Elaine: algorithmic recommendation,

Elaine: which I think you were just

Elaine: talking about, that in some

Elaine: ways, we're not really having as

Elaine: much conversation about music

Elaine: anymore.

Trist: Mhm.

Elaine: One thing that I find really

Elaine: interesting: at work, recently,

Elaine: someone decided to put on a

Elaine: whiteboard.

Elaine: Hey, put down what you would like on your summer playlist.

Elaine: Like recommend music for the rest of the team.

Elaine: And everyone's

Trist: Mhm.

Elaine: been writing a little bit of music and just like the name of

Elaine: the track and the artist, and they put together a playlist

Elaine: based off of this so that people could discover new music.

Trist: Oh. That's

Elaine: And

Trist: great.

Elaine: I think that's really clever.

Elaine: And I think that's something that we've been trying to do

Elaine: here as a part of this podcast, is put together a really

Elaine: interesting, diverse list of music for us be able to open up

Elaine: our horizons a little bit more.

Elaine: So I just thought that was an interesting little exercise, and

Elaine: I'd love to challenge our listeners to also do the same.

Elaine: How can you not only curate music and discover music through

Elaine: people like us?

Elaine: How can you share your music with other people in the broader

Elaine: community, whether it's talking about it with your friends or

Elaine: sharing something on social media for someone to discover

Elaine: some other artist.

Trist: We're coming up with other creative things to do.

Trist: Like instead of having a book club, you have a record club

Trist: where everybody listens to the same album, and every week you

Trist: talk about that album or every month you talk about that album

Trist: because you've experienced the same chapters, the same stories

Trist: on that album, just like you would a book.

Elaine: That's really interesting.

Elaine: And I encourage people also to

Elaine: do this in person, whether it's

Elaine: listening to something in

Elaine: person.

Elaine: I'm also a big proponent of snacks.

Elaine: And so if you, if you meet in person, you get to have snacks.

Trist: Exactly.

Elaine: And so it's like

Trist: And

Elaine: the

Trist: that's

Elaine: benefit

Trist: how you

Elaine: of community.

Trist: assure people show up is

Elaine: Exactly.

Trist: if you have snacks.

Elaine: So.

Trist: Matter of fact, I think I just came up with my plan for the

Trist: summer while we take our break from the pod.

Trist: I think I'm going to have instead of a book club, I think

Trist: I'm going to have a record club.

Elaine: Oh!

Trist: I just

Elaine: am I

Trist: decided,

Elaine: invited?

Elaine: I hope I'm invited.

Trist: well, it's going to be in person, so you're probably

Elaine: It's

Trist: going

Elaine: going

Trist: to

Elaine: to

Trist: miss

Elaine: be challenging.

Trist: most of them.

Trist: For those of you who don't know, Elaine and I do not live in the

Trist: same city, so that would not be an easy thing to do.

Elaine: That's

Trist: But you

Elaine: right.

Trist: never

Elaine: We live

Trist: know.

Elaine: about.

Elaine: Yeah, 350 miles.

Elaine: What can you say?

Trist: That's right.

Trist: Has to be a really good album.

Elaine: Exactly.

Elaine: Well, are there any other ways that you have discovered music,

Elaine: either by accident?

Elaine: I know that in last week's

Elaine: episode I had talked about just

Elaine: discovering things randomly at a

Elaine: record store.

Elaine: I was just paging through and found a random album that looked

Trist: Mhm.

Elaine: interesting, and I bought it,

Elaine: and it ended up being one of my

Elaine: favorite albums.

Elaine: Do you see random chance as

Elaine: being something that, I mean,

Elaine: maybe that's not a great way to

Elaine: discover music or to actually

Elaine: learn music.

Trist: I think it used to be a little more prevalent when that was the

Trist: way, when, of course, you couldn't just sample everything.

Trist: The older paradigms were: Yep.

Trist: There's that one song you kind of know, hopefully you'll like

Trist: the rest of the album.

Trist: And then when you go to the store, oh, look, the album

Trist: that's next to it has a picture of someone who's kind of cute.

Trist: Maybe I'll like that.

Trist: or it's right next to the one that I like.

Trist: Maybe it's good too.

Trist: Or down to, oh, at least it's on

Trist: the same label or made by the

Trist: same producer.

Trist: or something on the packaging that gets you to buy it.

Trist: Even though I got to hear a little bit when I was working at

Trist: music retail back in the day, the big famous Norah Jones album

Trist: that came out.

Trist: I was interested in it first

Trist: when it came into our store

Trist: because it was on Blue Note

Trist: Records.

Trist: I'm a jazz music fan and that's a big jazz music label.

Trist: And she did the standard "The Nearness of You."

Trist: So because I didn't know anything about her and this was

Trist: before the single was out or it had blown up for her.

Trist: It's such a massive hit.

Trist: I was thinking, okay, it's Blue

Trist: Note, it's a jazzy thing,

Trist: probably.

Trist: And then there's this standard songbook tune that jazz

Trist: musicians had played or sung.

Trist: So I thought, oh, okay.

Trist: these other songs that don't

Trist: look familiar, maybe these are

Trist: original compositions and this

Trist: will be a cool jazz singer to

Trist: listen to.

Trist: And while she definitely has those elements, it's not the

Trist: kind of standards jazz singer album that I thought it was.

Trist: But it was enough that I would have purchased it, if we didn't

Trist: have the demo in the store that I listened to.

Trist: But that's the kind of thing that would make me buy an album

Trist: back in the day.

Trist: And now you don't need to spend all that.

Trist: because you can just sample and listen to it.

Elaine: One of the other things that has really come to mind and what you

Elaine: just said triggered it, is buying the entire album.

Elaine: And we've talked about this before, but if you hear

Elaine: something on the radio or you hear something out there and you

Elaine: think, oh, this artist seems kind of cool, or this track

Elaine: seems kind of cool.

Elaine: So one of the things that I do

Elaine: is I ride the Peloton bike and a

Elaine: lot of those are set to music

Elaine: and

Trist: Mhm.

Elaine: they have the playlist there.

Elaine: You can actually save songs from

Elaine: the playlist for you to listen

Elaine: to later.

Elaine: So as I'm discovering new genres, let's say like a

Elaine: Bollywood or some K-pop artist, I can go ahead and save the ones

Elaine: that I really like and then look at them later and maybe I want

Elaine: to buy that entire album to discover more music.

Elaine: And so that's something that you've mentioned before,

Trist: Yeah.

Elaine: and that's part of the reason why you and I, when we talk,

Elaine: most of the time it's about entire albums, not just songs.

Trist: Did we mention you should listen to the whole Nikka Costa album?

Trist: I highly recommend it.

Trist: If we didn't say so, you should definitely check that out.

Elaine: Well, let me add one more thing,

Elaine: which is don't sleep on the

Elaine: library.

Elaine: Like if you live in an area with a really good library, you can

Elaine: go and check out music and hopefully you still have a way

Elaine: of playing physical media, but it is this thing where a lot of

Elaine: us have access to these free resources in our community.

Elaine: Also, call out to support your local library.

Elaine: But these are things that you can do.

Elaine: Can you talk a little bit about your relationship with the local

Trist: Oh,

Elaine: library?

Trist: man, we have an amazing library where I live.

Trist: I live in Glendale, California.

Trist: And up on the hill there's the

Trist: Brand Library, the Brand Music &

Trist: Art Library.

Trist: I don't think they do this

Trist: anymore, but when I moved here,

Trist: I think you could actually check

Trist: out artwork.

Trist: Like you could check out like

Trist: amazing artwork and just have it

Trist: in your home for like a month or

Trist: something crazy.

Trist: Anyway, so there are art and

Trist: music students from the major

Trist: universities in Los Angeles that

Trist: don't even go to their own

Trist: library.

Trist: They go to this library instead.

Trist: And yes, I've gotten a lot of music and that's a great place

Trist: to sample some things.

Trist: A huge music library.

Trist: They do have some vinyl that you

Trist: have to sort through a catalog

Trist: and request.

Trist: but thousands and thousands and

Trist: thousands of CDs of all types of

Trist: classical and jazz and pop and

Trist: world music.

Trist: And then a lot of writings and

Trist: actual scores, sheet music as

Trist: well.

Trist: Big box sets of composers and different artists.

Trist: It's a wonderful place.

Trist: I think they now limit you.

Trist: I think you can only check out a hundred CDs at a time.

Trist: speaking of the summer listening, take the time to go

Trist: to the local library, even if they have a smaller collection,

Trist: maybe there's an artist there that you've heard the name of.

Trist: You just didn't take time to listen to.

Trist: it's another resource, as Elaine said.

Elaine: All right.

Elaine: So any last thoughts on this before we close out our season?

Trist: Oh, just so grateful to all of

Trist: you who have listened, who have

Trist: sent messages and notes about

Trist: thoughts on what we should be

Trist: doing, what you'd like to hear

Trist: from us.

Trist: Please, please, please, let the

Trist: sessions that are out there

Trist: already do their work and keep

Trist: recommending episodes to your

Trist: friends and family and share the

Trist: playlist.

Trist: Speaking of sharing the

Trist: playlist, we will update it with

Trist: everything from Season 1, so

Trist: they'll all be complete soon, if

Trist: not already by the time you hear

Trist: this.

Trist: And then that way, if they just

Trist: get into the songs, that's

Trist: great.

Trist: But if any of them strikes their fancy, they can listen.

Trist: And you can all wait with bated

Trist: breath to see what we do for

Trist: Season 2.

Trist: Any ideas, even structurally about how we put it together.

Trist: This is the time that we will make those changes is going into

Trist: another season and that'll be coming up in the fall.

Trist: Glad to have you.

Elaine: Well, we hope you have a great summer and we will see you again

Elaine: in the fall.

Trist: Bye!

Elaine: I was gonna say something and I forgot what it was.

Trist: And I'm super unprepared because

Trist: that's just off the top of my

Trist: head.

Elaine: Still no butter update.

Elaine: When did you recommend this to me?

Trist: Actually that's funny.