Today on Episode #33 Navigating End of Life Planning and Family Wellness w. Minnelle Williams , I talk with estate and legacy educator Minnelle Williams about how we can prepare ourselves to engage in conversations with our loved ones about end of life planning.

In this episode we discuss:

-how childhood experiences shape your preparation for end of life conversations

-the easiest way to start end of life discussions with aging parents

-how to get the best price on funeral arrangements

-how to manage your emotional wellness and the family's wellness when faced with end or nearing end of life situations

-4 different professionals you should talk to about estate transition planning

Guest info:

Minnelle Williams is an Estate and Legacy Educator, Speaker/ Host, Pre-Planning Funeral Director, Accredited End of Life Doula and Certified Executor Assistant.

Minnelle's Facebook page

@MinnelleWilliams on Instagram

Minnelle's Website

Minnelle on YouTube

Links:

This podcast is hosted by Captivate, try it yourself for free.

Disclaimer:

This podcast includes affiliate links that, when clicked and purchased, may generate revenue for me and the podcast. I only recommend things I truly love and stand behind.

Book free 15 min coaching strategy call

https://calendly.com/fromafullcup/call

Get in touch:

info@fromafullcup.com

Speaker Bookings + Coaching:

https://nataliemullin.com/

From a Full Cup is a mental wellness education podcast that teaches women to prioritize their wellness and put themselves first, because you can’t pour from an empty cup. 

I'm your host Natalie Mullin , Certified Wellness Educator, Speaker, Facilitator and Teacher. Every Thursday I release a new episode, teaching women how to dream big, take action and move the needle forward in life.

Past episodes

From a Full Cup website

Subscribe to the podcast

Listen to From a Full Cup

Copyright 2024 Natalie Mullin

[00:00:02] Natalie: Thank you so much for tuning in. Today I have with me Minnelle Williams. She is my dear friend and she's also an estate and legacy educator. She's a speaker and host, a pre-planning funeral director, accredited end of life doula, and certified executor assistant. Woo. That was a mouthful. Anything else you wanna add, Minnelle as I welcome you, welcome to the show.

[00:00:39] Natalie: Yeah. And you know, there's not a lot of people who would say that they like speaking about death, but it's important because it's a part of life, right?

[00:01:18] Minnelle: Absolutely. I think many times that's exactly what it is. We just don't want to talk about it. We don't wanna acknowledge the fact that this is a part of our life, that this is what we're working towards in essence, and so we avoid, avoid, avoid, and then your family is left with chaos. So what I really try to do is to teach people how to set things up so that your family isn't left with that, or you are not rushing trying to get everything together, when also dealing with many other things.

[00:02:03] Minnelle: Uh, many families are stressed to say the least, right?

[00:02:27] Minnelle: I say death. I will use the word because I wanna normalize these conversations, but even if nothing is imminent, just the reality of the fact that I'm coming to sit here, to sit with you and to talk about this topic brings about some fear, right? So a lot of families, it's, it's like I have to coach them in, you know, kind of ease them into what we're going to do, walk them through the process, and then when they leave, they're saying, Now, this was great.

[00:03:11] Natalie: Yeah, it's really funny how it can just be, you know, two different ways or, or even something in the middle.

[00:03:35] Natalie: So, and that's just the summer. And then it's like, okay, we'll see what winter brings, you know, I don't know why, but winter always brings more, it's very weird. But, um, you know, so I've just always, I've always experienced that. I've always, we've always talked about it, and I, I'm happy about that because, you know, it, for me, it helps me to a, remember that life is not here forever and for me to really treasure and value the time that I have with my loved ones, but also.

[00:04:20] Natalie: That's just something that brings me a lot of joy. But yeah, I, I think it's just so important to, even if it's baby steps, just start to have the conversations so that it becomes, Easier. And also if you are, I feel like the fear kind of is generational too. Like it passes down, like if you didn't kind of talk about death in your family growing up, then when you have your own family, it's kind of the same way.

[00:04:55] Minnelle: And it, it's interesting because my family wasn't like that. We didn't talk about funerals. I didn't attend funerals.

[00:05:16] Minnelle: And I think it's awesome now because she's come full circle. And because of me, you know, in my every day if you hang around me, you're gonna just get comfortable hearing about death. Yeah. So now she's comfortable on the other side and now we are breaking family or generational curses. Right. Because now I'm comfortable the next generation will be comfortable.

[00:05:52] Minnelle: Yeah. So just about culture is just about, um, getting accustomed to it and learning something new.

[00:06:10] Natalie: Or what is your suggestion to people? When should they talk

[00:06:31] Minnelle: Use this. So you're listening to this podcast right now, use this as a, Hey, you know what? I was listening to this. What do you think about X? You know, and you have to be aware of where people are, because I might be ready to say, oh my goodness, maybe so and so died. And now I just saw what the family went through and I'm like, oh my goodness, we have to do this.

[00:07:10] Minnelle: Like those things you're gonna start with. And then as they're comfortable, you keep going with the conversation. Some people are the kinds where you're like, okay, let's have a family meeting. And in that case, everybody comes, kids, everybody. We're gonna sit down and we're going to talk. Some people that's not the case.

[00:07:41] Minnelle: They might not be able to understand the full scope of it, but I promise you they see. Yeah, I promise you they see that mom is feeling different, dad's feeling different. They're not talking. Mom is crying. They're seeing all of these things and they might not know how to process them. There are a lot of great books now that are out there for kids that kind of explain what grief is, what kinda explain what loss is.

[00:08:20] Minnelle: Just do it earlier than later.

[00:08:39] Natalie: Yeah, like people preplan funerals. And I was like, wow. It can look different for some people. Maybe some people it's actual plans, some people's like finances and everything. You know, if you can just educate the listeners about this and then also what are the benefits of Prearranging funeral services.

[00:09:13] Minnelle: And one of the benefits is that 'cause you lock in the price, like you're gonna pay whatever, we now 20, 23 prices and hopefully you're passing many years down the road. So as the prices increase, you don't have to worry about that. So that's one, it's the financial aspect, but two, it's the burden. Now, I'll tell you from my experience, this is what I do.

[00:09:56] Minnelle: Is this bank account still valid? Is there anything in it? You have to call people. You've gotta do all of this extra searching while dealing with everything else. We talk. You talk about wellness, like, um, I'm sorry. I'm trying to care of myself while I'm dealing with the fact that my loved one is sick.

[00:10:31] Minnelle: It's a lot to go through. So as much as you can. Set things up and I'm talking funeral, I'm talking estate. Have your will done, have it reviewed so that it's still valid and you don't have an ex-spouse as the beneficiary. Have it clear so that your insurance beneficiary, well that one actually will kind of changes, but your beneficiaries, you wanna make sure you have an up-to-date beneficiary.

[00:11:11] Natalie: it again, listen one more time. Yeah.

[00:11:31] Minnelle: A lot of that could be cleared if you just talk about it first. Like, I hate to see someone pass and their passing causes a rift in the family that that's a divide that will now last forever. And it's all because you didn't say things. You weren't clear about what you wanted, and now you left everybody to try to do what they think is best, but what they think don't align.

[00:11:59] Natalie: Yeah, yeah. No, I have, seen within my own family and family members and, and to be honest, I remember from a young age being tri, quite traumatized seeing the fighting that was happening and being like, I never want any part in this. Mm-hmm. And, um, again, if you'll think you are really good with somebody or that the family's really close and just let someone die, and you just, I'm, it's it over, over and over again.

[00:12:46] Natalie: So it's actually, you're doing it out of care. You're doing it because you want them to be able to just strictly grieve and strictly mourn when you're gone. You don't want them to be on the phone calling this person, this person, trying to crack a code, find a hacker. Like it's a lot, try decipher what does the paper say because the, the ink faded.

[00:13:32] Natalie: So if your mind goes before your body goes, now you're not in a mental state that you can even take care of these things, right? So some people are like, oh,

[00:14:10] Minnelle: Yes. I think that the best way to do that is actually to do it yourself and involve your parents. So flip it, right? Mm-hmm. So now you're gonna tell them, Hey, I'm doing this. I'm gonna be the gate. I'm gonna be the tester. You know, like, I'm gonna go through this process, come with me and listen while I do it.

[00:14:47] Minnelle: Their parents worked one job, you know, they received a pension, you closed your estate. It's done. In this day and age, we have split families. We have, uh, digital assets. We have different kids from different, like there's just, so they're businesses, all these entrepreneurs with all of their different businesses.

[00:15:22] Minnelle: If you were to drop down and have a stroke today. Yeah. If that might happen. What is important to you? If you don't give me any instruction when the doctors look at me and say, okay, what do you wanna do? I have no answer. I'm terrified. I'm gonna make the wrong answer, but you can't tell me. And so anything I do is either right or anything I do is wrong depending on how I see it.

[00:16:07] Minnelle: Be it funeral professionals, insurance agents, financial advisors, lawyers, whomever you're talking to, make sure they're answering your questions because there's a lot to know when it comes to closing an estate and you wanna be comfortable with one, what you're dealing with now. Also the fact that what you're dealing with might change, right?

[00:16:45] Minnelle: Yeah.

[00:17:08] Natalie: Okay. Like, don't be sad for me. Like I'm, I'm good. And, um, let's, let's just celebrate life because that's what I'm all about. And it was actually because of you and just, you know, us being friends for so long that, you know, I got to start having these conversations with my parents and it, it took a little while.

[00:17:47] Natalie: Just, you know, I don't even care. So some people don't even care about what happens, put them in a box, like they're good. And then my dad, who was kind of like, ah, by the end of it, I mean, he has all the song titles, he has who the pallbearers are, but I feel so happy. We did this now because there are people, um, and I think I'll use the document from you actually, that helped me consider things I had truly, like, I think who is gonna be.

[00:18:32] Natalie: I was like, listen, I. Whenever your time comes, I want to just be grieving and then just reflecting. Celebrating your life. I do not want to be stressing about who I'm supposed to call, who's in your life, but when we, when we filled out the document, I mean, there was people I didn't even know. I was like, sorry, who's this person?

[00:19:08] Natalie: I don't know. Right. I'm like, I'm not going through this book to try to find these mysterious people. So now it's all planned. Both of them. My sister and I both have a copy, so you know, at least I just know that. God forbid anything happens. I have an idea of what is, what is to happen, right? So I really think, um, that is good if you can get to a place of having that conversation, even if it's not about the money, because I know some people's families are, are touchy with money and they might think, oh, you, you're trying to get my money from me or, or something.

[00:19:55] Natalie: Like even things like that, because I think you, I can just imagine how stressful it must be when someone goes and you're like, I just don't know what they would have wanted. And you can't ask them and then you feel this kind of guilt, like, did I honor their wishes and intentions, and that's such a horrible way to grieve, is doubting if you've made the right decision.

[00:20:35] Minnelle: Mm-hmm. I don't understand that because it's really important or some families who make their plans and only tell one, only tell one child, right? But I'm like, you don't what could happen with that one child? You know? You don't know what could happen with a lot. You wanna make sure. Whoever you have listed as your executors, whoever you have listed as those people who you wanna put in charge, that they know, one, that you made arrangements and two, where they are.

[00:21:14] Minnelle: Before you get to the cemetery, you still have to do your funeral. Someone's gonna have to pick up your loved one and take care of them, right? Yeah. So you've gotta do your funeral and your cemetery, but before that, you have your power of attorneys. Who is gonna make those end of life decisions? What are they gonna do?

[00:21:42] Minnelle: 'cause people forget about the fact that when someone passes taxes still have to be paid and they can be quite hefty, right? So you wanna make sure that you have funds to cover that. To cover the mortgage. If you wanna pass on a house, you don't wanna work so hard, and then leave your family in a situation where you're giving the government the money or where they're having to pay for themselves for everything because they don't have access to any funds.

[00:22:24] Minnelle: Whatever happens, it doesn't matter. Those people like, I love it because it's easier for your family, but kind of pull from them. Anything you can. Do anything you want. I used to hear that all the time. I've been doing presentations for a while. You know, you would do presentations, they'd say, just throw me in a garbage bag.

[00:22:53] Natalie: it's so true because then I remember saying, okay, so cremation it is, no, no, no, I don't wanna be cremated. And I was like, but you just said do whatever.

[00:23:18] Natalie: So I'm gonna have to have a family meeting and, uh, maybe with you because there's, I realize there's some gaps. There are some gaps that we still haven't talked about as a family and things that. I realize I don't actually know that I'm just listening to you and I'm like, oh, okay, let's go back and figure that out. Mm-hmm. So now lemme ask you, you know, because death can be really transformative and relationships are really important when you think about wellness, it's actually one of the 12 elements of wellness.

[00:24:02] Natalie: But at the same time, I have seen a lot of people actually find healing and transformation at the end. Like they're able to kind of come to a better place right at the end. And I'm wondering if you, have ever witnessed a situation like that?

[00:24:32] Minnelle: That gives you the moment to call out, reach out, reconnect, and try to heal some of those wounds, right? So if you are estranged, that's your chance. This is your moment to reconnect and I'll. Like every relationship is different, but you'll see especially families who aren't necessarily as connected or those who even are, when someone is passing, you either do a, like a magnet, you're pulled together or like the, what's the opposite?

[00:25:25] Minnelle: And sometimes when I've seen some families where it's been, listen, I have some families where it's, I choose not to heal. I choose to stay angry. They will come to the funeral angry. They will speak at the funeral angry, and they will stay in that state. Maybe like, I don't know, your life. It could be deserved, you know?

[00:26:06] Minnelle: Yeah. And I can see families or different family members who. I will give you referrals because you're going to need support after this. Yeah. Because the moment right now would determine well can affect how the rest of your life will continue. Right. So you like I can see that in some families. So you really, I wanna be, I wanna be aware of that.

[00:26:30] Natalie: And I think that community after the process is so important as people take care of their own wellness and wellbeing in what is a very emotionally charged and emotionally

[00:26:52] Natalie: Well, packing up their stuff and closing their home. And then what do you do with these things and throw them away. And then some people feel like they're throwing away the person, right? There's, there's so much emotions that go into that.

[00:27:23] Natalie: And I just wanna know, what role can the deaf doula play in supporting individuals and families during and even after, end of life transitions?

[00:27:43] Minnelle: And now a death doula is somebody who will advocate and be present for the family and for the dying person, right? So now their process, while the doctor and while the other professionals are looking after your health and kind of what needs to be done, the doula's job is to say, how can I hold space for you?

[00:28:19] Minnelle: Do I want to be at the at the hospital and actually have that full conversation? A lot of people just say, I wanna be home because that's comfortable, but is home actually gonna be the best place? If your number one care is, I don't wanna feel pain, maybe being at the hospital might be better or maybe mm-hmm.

[00:28:53] Minnelle: One is, uh, they had a family and everybody's passing through, right? The person is close to the end, right? So friends are coming, everybody's coming. Your dad's brown book of people, everybody's flying in and coming spend time, right? But the person is exhausted. You know, the body is shutting down. They don't necessarily have the energy to entertain or even to just deal with that many people coming through.

[00:29:41] Minnelle: As much as possible something that I would desire. Let me plan it. Mm-hmm. I know what kind of sense I wanna have. If I'm able to handle s sense, I know what kind of lights I wanna have. I wanna have candles all around. I wanna have plants in the room. Like I know because I've gone through this whole process.

[00:30:04] Natalie: love that. Yeah.

[00:30:14] Minnelle: You have a choice, right? Yeah. And then the second thing is on the planning side, um, the advanced care plans, that is you have your will and then you have what some might call a living will or an advanced care plan. So that now determines, okay, if you had a stroke today, what is important to you? They walk you through deciding and seeing different factors and different things that could happen.

[00:31:01] Minnelle: If I can't do those two things, no I can't. So now when the doctor says, Hey, do you want this surgery? Do you want to do this? Their easy question is, can he do these two things?

[00:31:14] Minnelle: Exactly. Exactly. And that's the easiest thing for them now. 'cause they know whatever decision they make, it's exactly what he would've wanted.

[00:31:33] Minnelle: Yeah. Yeah. No, this conversation has been so enlightening and it's on both sides because, you know, as people are starting to think about their parents and their parents getting older, I'm sure that they're listening and thinking about conversations that they might need to have with their parents.

[00:32:05] Minnelle: And I think a lot of people think, okay, if something happens to me, my, my kids are gonna go to this person. But then they forget about the whole, well, what happens with the estate? What happens with the hung home? What happens to the taxes, the bills, the insurance, all of that, right? So like this has just, um, really highlighted why it's so important to just talk to

[00:32:40] Minnelle: Yes, absolutely. And I'll say this one thing, I like to think of it as this is part of your estate planning. So when we're further away from it, it's easier to plan as we might assume. It's easier to plan from far away. It gets a little harder when now we're planning for something. Again, that air quotes here, that might seem closer.

[00:33:26] Minnelle: You'll have access to a guide, the same guide you were talking about there, and that's available through the funeral home. It's through New Haven Funeral Center, so you can get our guide there. You can go through creating your funeral plan there, but you can also contact me for a consultation. And in that case, I sit down with families and go over all of this.

[00:34:01] Minnelle: So that would be the best way to get in touch with me, www dot e ww wm ca.

[00:34:23] Natalie: . And how can we support everybody's wellness through what can be very difficult times. Continue to serve for yourself, your loved ones and your communities from a full cup.