Artwork for podcast Vinnie De Rosa AKA Cuzin Vinnie
MY LIFE 1950-1970 NEW YORK TO CRYSTAL RIVER FLORIDA
Episode 122 • 29th August 2026 • Vinnie De Rosa AKA Cuzin Vinnie • CuzinVinnieNetwork.com
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Speaker:

Hey, it's Vinnie.

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It's, uh, Friday, August 28th.

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And, uh

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Had a few days to, uh, think and reflect

on the passing of my friend, Frank Ricci

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I don't know where to start

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I know where it ends.

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We all have an end.

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We just don't know when it'd be

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I just think back on the last

five plus years of my life

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and what was accomplished, what

were high points, what were low

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points, or happy points, sad points

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I know you can probably hear

in the background, I've got "O

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Sole Mio" in the background.

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Just gives me some warmth

of, uh, days gone by, family

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I apologize for the hacking.

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I don't know what it is.

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I,

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I get in front of the mic lately

and this nervous tick comes in

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I have absolutely no clue.

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So if you're a psychologist

or psychiatrist and know

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what it is, drop me a note

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I don't know if it's anxiety, if it's,

uh, depression, if it's, uh, happiness

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or if it's sad or whatever it may

be, but it, it, it, um, it hits me.

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I think my biggest takeaway

again was Frank's death.

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And then before then, another

personal good friend of mine, Mike

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Cosner, uh, five years ago maybe.

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Last time I saw him was at my birthday,

and then a couple other times after

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that we had made plans to hit the

road once I could, uh, travel more.

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That didn't happen either.

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He was gone

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I don't wanna make it sound morbid, but,

you know, things happen for a reason.

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We don't always know what the reason is.

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Probably sometimes we'll

never know what the reason is.

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You know, people say com- you know,

people come into your life, go out of your

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life, stay in your life, cause you to, to

redirect, change the direction of where

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you were going in, have an impact on you

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Will I post this one?

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Probably, because I think I,

I, I owe it to myself not to be

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afraid to express myself,

um, as to how I'm feeling.

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I'm feeling cautiously optimistic.

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Um, I feel like I've accomplished a few

more things in, in my business life.

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Not as rewarding as I would hope it

would be, but it's getting better.

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Um, you know, it, it, it's one of

those things where you reexamine what

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you've been doing in the past in your

business life, not your personal,

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but mostly the business right now.

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That's what I wanna talk about,

is what, what was the purpose?

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Why did I do some of the things

I did in my professional life?

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And what, what are some of the

things I would maybe do over?

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I don't know.

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Um

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I mean, I was brought up,

uh, a son of immigrants.

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Parents both had great

worth e- work ethics.

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My mom was a seamstress in, in, in

New York, and my dad, you know, was

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an entrepreneur most of his life

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And I think that was the, um,

the base that I came from.

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I always didn't fit into the

normal mold of a, a kid growing up.

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Had health issues as a small child.

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Hernia, you know, one

of those things you had.

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I don't know wh- how I got it.

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And then my…

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Oh, a squirrel.

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Hmm.

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Um, my vision was an issue

since, since childbirth.

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Uh, having my right eye, which is

considered what's called a lazy eye

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And the cause that I've heard over

the years was that when we were

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born in the 1945, 1955 era, uh, kids

were put into oxygen after birth for

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some strange reason, oxygen tents or

whatever they had for us at the time

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And, um, I was laid on one side

and, uh, I don't know if the oxygen

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was coming from above or below.

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I, I don't…

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I, I tried to do some research as to

how the oxygen was pumped into the,

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into the, um, the little bed and

chamber that they had done for us.

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But whatever it was, that oxygen

hitting my right eye caused it

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to not develop adequately and

caused blindness in that eye.

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Not total blindness, but enough that

it didn't function like a normal eye,

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couldn't control it, and had, uh,

caused issues, you know, with sight

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from the very beginning of my life.

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But, you know, I didn't

ever think about it.

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Uh, my other eye worked fine, and I just

continued on as if nothing was wrong.

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Had surgery on it, um, uh, twice I

think they tried to, to correct it.

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I can remember, I think the second

surgery, maybe the first one.

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I don't know which one it

was, but it was one of them.

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They were gonna roll me into the ER.

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Maybe it was the second one,

and back then they used to use

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ether to put you to sleep, and

it had such a nasty, nasty odor.

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I can still, still envision this thing.

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And, uh, they were rolling me into

the ER, and I jumped off the table

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and ran down the hall from the ER.

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They came and grabbed me, put me

on the table, knocked me out with

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the ether, did the surgery, and

they had both of my eyes bandaged

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And it just frightened the shit out of me.

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I mean, I couldn't see.

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And my Aunt Rosalie happened to be

there when I came out of this, and

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she had one of my favorite pies.

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It was Boston cream pi-

Was it Boston cream?

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It was whatever what it

was with cream all over.

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Maybe it was the Boston cream

or one of the cream pies.

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But I just was so happy she was there.

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Got through the surgery.

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Then they didn't…

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You know, they took off the

bandages, nothing changed.

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So that was pretty much the end of

trying to correct, you know, the

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eye surgery or the eyes 'cause it

just wasn't gonna ever be fixed.

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And if there's anybody out there in

that era, 45 to 55, in those years that

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had the same experience, you know, I'd

love to hear from you or talk about it.

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But, you know, you learn to cope.

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You learn to cope.

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My other eye was fine.

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No issues, good vision

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Um, I think it was in either…

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I'm gonna back up a little bit.

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I think it was kindergarten.

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Yeah, kindergarten.

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I was in public school kindergarten

and, uh, had issues with, you know,

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a little bit of the, the, uh, not the

reading part, but, um, what was it?

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Uh, yeah, I was having reading issues

'cause my mom, you know, and dad both

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being Italian, trying to teach me to

read, had issues with the, you know, the,

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the vocabulary and being able to do…

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My mom could do pretty good, but

my dad was not really good with it.

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So I got in, you know, in kindergarten,

just had a hard time with it.

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Got into first grade, public school.

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I was in the public school at the time,

and had difficulty in, in first grade.

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I got left back in first grade.

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Uh, not of any fault of mine or my

parents, just that being from immigrants

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who didn't understand the culture

that much, um, I, I didn't sp- I spoke

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English well, but I spoke mostly Italian

because my first five, six, seven,

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eight years of my life, you know,

everyone around me was Italian, that

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spoke Italian when we lived in Brooklyn.

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The lady that took care of me, uh,

when mom went to work, she worked

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in the Garment District, and dad

went to work, uh, for my uncle Mike

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in his jewelry store at the time.

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You know, his English was terrible,

and as far as trying to teach

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anything, that was not gonna happen.

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So I got through, um, first grade and got

left back because I didn't do really well.

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So they decided to put me

in Catholic school at St.

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Mary's after leaving East

Islip Elementary School.

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So I got left back in the first grade

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and, uh, I f- I found

some of my report cards.

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Oh my gosh.

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Some of the comments some of the nuns made

was, you know, "Can't keep his mouth shut.

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Talks all the time.

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Poor attention."

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You know, whatever it is.

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Uh, terrible in math, terrible

in, in his handwriting.

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Terrible…

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You know, it was like

bad, bad, bad, bad, bad.

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Oof.

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Boy, did I catch it

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And at the time too, we had

our deli on Long Island.

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We moved from Brooklyn out to Long

Island, and I think in between

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there, my dad, uh, with somebody

else, put a luncheonette on f- or

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bought a luncheonette on Fire Island.

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It was, like, the early '50s, and

I, I didn't do the research on it.

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I should've done it, but there was a

hurricane that came through and wiped

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out most of Ocean Beach on Fire Island,

and his little luncheonette, poof, but

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prior to that, it was a popular place.

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Uh, you know, the, the, uh, actors

and actresses and singers from New

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York would go out to Fire Island after

their shows, you know, and, and, and

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hang out there and, and, and that

was kinda neat, but, you know, that

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only lasted for a period of time.

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It wasn't very long.

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So we moved in, into the,

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uh, um, uh, Islip Terrace, North Great

River part of, of New York, Long Island,

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to get out of the city 'cause my parents

just didn't wanna be in the city anymore

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because we tried, he-- My dad tried to do

a deli in Brooklyn area or something like

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that and was being strong-armed, and he

just wasn't gonna put up with that crap.

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He says, "I didn't put up with it

in Italy when Mussolini was there.

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I'm not gonna put up with it here."

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So we ended up out on Long Island

in a place called North Great

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River, and, uh, the only reason is

my grandparents lived out there.

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And, uh, we'd go out to visit, and where

they were in North Great River, it was

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the end of the Long Island Railroad.

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That was the last stop on the train

coming out from, from Brooklyn, so we

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weren't too far from the stains- train

station to my grandparents' house.

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And then next door, I think I've talked

about this in probably some other

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podcast, but next door to my grandparents,

two doors down, were the Barrassos.

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They owned a block plant.

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They made concrete blocks, and the

Barrasso sons were working for their dad.

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My dad worked there too part-time

and still was doing stuff with my

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Uncle Mike in Jamaica, and my mom

was going into the city, and I was

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take- my grandparents took care of me.

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And at some point, I think, uh,

my dad started working for Mr.

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Barrasso slinging blocks and

doing whatever he could around

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the, the block yard, and, uh

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The way the things go, if I

can remember correctly, um, Mr.

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Barrasso lived on Connetquot Avenue,

which was not too far from his plant.

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He had a house he had just built, and

my dad became one of his stepsons.

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And, uh, my dad said, "I'd

love to have a deli out here."

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Now, where we lived out there, yeah,

you know, in, in that part of the, the,

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the, the Flor- I mean, not Florida.

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Florida, yeah.

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Long Island.

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There was nothing there.

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And, uh, he built a, a deli.

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Mr.

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Barrasso provided him the

blocks to build a building.

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Uh, we had, I think, uh, four or

five acres that he had purchased.

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Built our house 75 feet from the

store And I was up there, gosh,

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seven years ago maybe, and, uh, came

around the corner, and it's a CVS or

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a Walgreens, one of those other two.

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What a shock.

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Our house was gone.

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The stores are still there.

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But my dad, you know, took on the deli,

opened it up, and was, you know, doing

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pretty much Italian stuff, uh, the things

that you, you know, you couldn't get on

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the island because it just didn't exist.

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And I can remember we were getting

Boar's Head back then, when Boar's Head

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was just starting, and Entenmann Cakes,

which was, I think, out of Bayshore or

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Brentwood or someplace in that area.

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So Entenmann Cakes were in that

area when they were just becoming

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the, the rage of that, of that area.

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And we had the little

deli that my dad opened.

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Had a little butcher shop in the

back, back part of the store.

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And, uh, my dad hired this

guy named Bobby, a young guy.

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I can't think of his last name right now.

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But Bobby lived in the neighborhood, came

to work for my dad, was with us for years.

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And, uh, I can remember before going

to school, stopping in the store and

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getting those little penny wrappers

of, of, of candy or gum or…

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Not gum.

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It was those little candy things or

whatever the Italian candies were at the

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time, and I'd stuff them in my pocket

and, uh, go to school with them in my

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pocket and hand them out to people.

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Growing up at, at that

point was pretty easy.

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Um, you know, as kids go back then, uh,

you went out, went outside and you stayed

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there until, you know, sun went down

or streetlights came up, like they say.

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You had adventures and

did all kinds of things.

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I didn't have many, many

friends from, from, uh, St.

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Mary's because we were so far away

from the school so that nobody

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was really in the neighborhood.

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Took the bus into school every day.

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So I was pretty much a loner.

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Had a few friends in the

neighborhood that came to the store.

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I can remember, I think I was probably

eight or nine, maybe 10 years old, uh,

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my task was to, uh, dump the bottle cart.

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Back then When you bought soda or

beer or whatever it was, there was

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deposits on those bottles, and you'd

bring them back to the store and the

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merchant would give you money for them.

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So we had a, um, a box, a wooden box on

wheels that was at the front door, and

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they'd, you know, check in the bottles and

they'd get their money, and I would take

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them out behind the back of the store.

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And we had a big, uh, field…

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Not a field.

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Uh, kind of a dock loading area, but it

wasn't that mu- not like, like a dock.

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It was just a fenced-in area where you

had cases and cases of bottles and returns

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and the, you know, the, the, the beer

driver or the, or the soda driver would

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come in and pick up and give them credit

for the, the ones we had stacked up.

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So my job was to wheel them

from the front of the store, put

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them in the back and sort them.

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And winter was not fun, especially

in the snowy times, having to

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deal with that crap out back.

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So that was one of my first jobs in the

store was to maintain that type of stuff.

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And then as time went on, I, I,

I got to the point where I was

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actually putting groceries on

the shelf in the grocery store.

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And, um, this, this is so funny.

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Back then we had a stamper, it was

called a rotator, and it had a pad on

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it where you'd put ink on it so that

it would imprint the, the numbers.

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And it co- I found one, I think

I have it in the box somewhere.

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It's called a rotator, if you

know what it is back then.

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It was basically kinda like the, the

guns they have now that they use to put

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stamps on, which they don't do anymore.

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They don't even put prices

on anything anymore.

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It's just by barcode.

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So that was our barcode system.

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And it was really funny 'cause we'd get

new inventory in and say the price went

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up, you know, five or six cents per item.

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My dad would have me take the old

stock off, and he had a solution

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that he could wipe off the number.

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I would take the number off and

then re-rotate it with the new price

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even though it was the old stuff.

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And I, I think back on that and go, "Wow."

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Well, but you know, um,

that's what you did.

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You know, uh, you had, you know, a

bottle of pasta sauce or whatever

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it might have been or whatever the

item was, you know, if it went up in

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price, well, that's what we're selling

it for, that current price level.

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And, uh, so that was one of

my jobs was stocking shelves.

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And I did it, you know, quite a few years.

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And the other one was, um, other

than doing the bottles, then

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I, I, I graduated up to working

behind the counter at the deli.

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Didn't do any, any meat cutting

or anything that cold cuts.

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I, I did, um, put some sandwiches

together and on, on Sundays

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It was the big Kaiser roll with butter.

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Now, I don't know where that started

or how it started or why it started,

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but we would get a shipload of Kaiser

buns with the poppy seeds on them.

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I'd slice them in half, and we would

s- slather them with butter, wrap

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them up, and then after church, people

would come in and buy these things.

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Now, I, I still to this day don't…

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I, I gotta do…

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Again, I gotta do some research

on it, but that was the tradition.

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And then they picked up a

copy of The New York Times.

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And back then, you gotta think

about it, everything was in print.

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There was nothing, you

know, nothing online.

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Uh, the newspaper came out once a week,

and The New York Times would come in

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sections, and we would get some sections

earlier in the week, and then on Sunday

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morning, the latest news would be the

front page stuff that we would stuff,

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and we'd stuff The New York Times

and the Daily News and, uh, the Long

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Island Times, I think it was called.

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And, and that my, my job was to,

you know, stack them together.

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And I would, I would, you know,

put the paper together, and they'd

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come and get their newspaper and

come and get their Kaiser rolls.

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Uh, and that was pretty

much a Sunday ritual there

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And then when I get ready to go

to school during the week, I would

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come in in the morning and either

Bobby, who was there, helped me make

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a sandwich or whatever I was gonna

do, take with me to take sandwiches.

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And then we had roasted chickpeas.

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They were roasted and

they were really tasty.

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They were tasty as hell.

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We had them in a barrel, and I'd stuff

them in my pockets, and I'd have these

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chickpeas in my pockets so that during

the day I could be chewing on them.

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And the nuns would go,

"What are you eating?"

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And I'd show them.

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They'd go, "Okay, that's all right."

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You know, I didn't have chewing

gum or anything, you know, nasty.

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It was just chickpeas in my pocket

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So that was another adventure.

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Again, you know, stocking shelves,

changing the prices, um, and then

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eventually I, I got to the point where

I could actually start using the slicer.

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I think I was probably 12, I think

was when Dad let me use the slicer.

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I, I don't think I was before that.

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You know, and I would, uh, take the meat

out and slice it the way they wanted

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and, uh, especially the prosciutto,

people wanted it really thin sliced.

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They wanted to be able to see through it.

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Not like you get now in the stores.

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People really have no clue what

they're getting in the stores.

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They're getting crap.

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So I would, you know, slice the

cold cuts, make sandwiches, and

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then my mom used to make sausage.

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So my dad would make the sausage

in the store with the, the pork

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that we got in, and I would help,

um, bone the pork butts out.

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Eh, I didn't do really

much of it at that point.

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I did more of it here in

Florida than I did in New York.

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But I would help stuff it into the

stuffer so that it could stuff into the

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s- the casing, and those casings were

made of, um, sheep, uh, intestines.

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They were in a, a bucket full

of salt, I remember that.

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And then having to pull them apart

and, and wash them so that we could

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run the, um, the pork stuffer into

sausage, and I learned how to twist

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them, and you knew that they had to

be one hand long and that's it, so

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that they fit well in the sandwich

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And it was one of the little

things that I learned how to

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do on the butcher side of it.

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Again, I didn't do much

in the butcher shop.

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I did mostly in the grocery store,

but I would help out once in a while,

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you know, doing clean out, or you'd

walk into the walk-in cooler and

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there'd be a, a hindquarter in the…

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I mean, literally the

hindquarter of a, of a cow.

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And my dad or the butcher would, you

know, take it down to, to the different

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components of, of the, the quarter.

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That was fascinating to watch.

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They don't do that anymore that I can

recall or hear about So that was part

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of that era of the grocery store.

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Uh, I grew up in it.

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Uh, it was definitely, um,

um, an interesting time.

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Then as time went on, Dad, uh, Dad,

uh, we went to Italy the summer of

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'65, and by that time, I think…

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Yeah, I had gotten left back again.

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So I got left back twice.

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I think it was first grade and

either third or fourth, maybe

357

:

fifth grade in Catholic school.

358

:

I got left back again.

359

:

Part-- The second time was I was

going through my other surgeries

360

:

again with my eyes and language issues

and, and I was not highly motivated.

361

:

I was, I was a, a, a little

troublemaker at times.

362

:

So, uh, gotten left back twice.

363

:

So I, I, I didn't graduate

in:

364

:

I graduated in 1970 instead.

365

:

So we were in New York, and Dad

decided to add onto the building.

366

:

So he added on two more stores.

367

:

One was a liquor store 'cause he wanted

to get a liquor license, and the l-

368

:

lottery was coming so he could get one.

369

:

And then next to that was gonna

be the bank, the local bank

370

:

that we'd been banking at, and

they would have a branch there.

371

:

So we, uh, opened the liquor store, and

he had a girl in there working, some lady

372

:

working in there or some other people

working in there, and my job there was to

373

:

stock the shelves, take the wine or the

booze and put it on the shelf and, and

374

:

use the rotator and put the prices on.

375

:

If the prices changed, scrape the

price off and put the new ones on.

376

:

So I did some of that, I

think when I was 13, 14.

377

:

Still working in the deli occasionally,

especially Sundays, and then whenever

378

:

we had, you know, we had to do sausage

or whatever the special things were.

379

:

And my mom would take the sausage and the

meatballs, and she would cook them at home

380

:

and make sausage and meatballs to sell in

the store for, you know, for lunchtime.

381

:

So I was helping with

some of that as a kid.

382

:

I didn't do the typical

kid stuff, I think.

383

:

Just thinking back on this,

yeah, I got to play and do stuff.

384

:

I was involved in, um, um, Little

League very short period of time.

385

:

I think I was, I don't know, nine,

10, whatever it was, and they had

386

:

tryouts and, uh, everyone was g- they

were trying to pick out positions

387

:

and where you were gonna play.

388

:

And so I, I get up to bat

and didn't do too good.

389

:

Then, uh, catching.

390

:

You know, what, what position?

391

:

First base, second, short, third, home.

392

:

You know, whatever it would've

been, catcher or pitcher.

393

:

So my pitching ability was okay

But the problem is my depth

394

:

perception wasn't the best.

395

:

So I would throw the ball and

I'd be, like, either in front

396

:

of the pitcher, I mean, the

mound, or a bit behind the mound.

397

:

So they said, "Well, you can't pitch

'cause you can't see the mound."

398

:

Yeah, I know I can't see the mound.

399

:

So we tried the infield.

400

:

That didn't help because I was blind on

one side, so I couldn't see the person

401

:

coming from the other side, so they stuck

me back in, um Left field or right field?

402

:

Uh, right field, because my right eye was

out, so they w- didn't wanna have anything

403

:

coming to my right side of my head.

404

:

So it might've been left field.

405

:

So they made sure that if the ball

was coming at me, I could see it.

406

:

And really couldn't see it either.

407

:

I mean, I was terrible.

408

:

Um, and I think I was there for,

you know, maybe four or five weeks

409

:

maybe, and basically told my parents,

"Uh, maybe this isn't for you."

410

:

So Little League was gone.

411

:

Was it a disappointment?

412

:

Nah, not really.

413

:

Um, I was not really a sports person.

414

:

And then I guess in junior high,

or at that point of junior high,

415

:

there was a, um, lady that used

to come in the store all the time.

416

:

She was part of a, a cadet organization,

Sea Scouts, and she asked my dad if I'd

417

:

be interested, so I said, "Yeah, I'll go."

418

:

So I, uh, went to a meeting, and it

was a naval-based type organization.

419

:

It was called the American Cadet Alliance.

420

:

I found some stuff on it the other day.

421

:

And, uh, so I went in and jumped into

it with both feet, really enjoyed it,

422

:

got really good at, um, tying knots and

military courtesies and military this

423

:

and learning about the ships and stuff

like that because the, the, the officers

424

:

actually that were in charge of this thing

were actually veterans themselves, and

425

:

some, one of them I think was active duty.

426

:

So I got into the Sea Scouts, and

we started doing, you know, the,

427

:

the manual of arms training with

the fake rifles, the M, fake M16s.

428

:

Y- yeah, was it?

429

:

No, the M1s.

430

:

And we had a, a drill group,

drill team, and got really turned

431

:

on by that, really did well.

432

:

And I ended up in charge of the

drill team and, uh, we were good.

433

:

I mean, we were really good.

434

:

We went to an event in, I think it

was Jamaica or Queens, someplace

435

:

like that, in an armory, and my aunt,

my Aunt Rosalie came to watch, and

436

:

our team came in first or second.

437

:

I know we, we placed up high

and it was a silent drill team.

438

:

It was all by command, and we were

just doing our counts and we would

439

:

do our thing, and it was kind of fun.

440

:

Really enjoyed it.

441

:

And on the way back on the bus, I w- I

think I was a midshipman at the time,

442

:

maybe a, maybe a chief petty officer.

443

:

I, I'm not sure if I had gone to from,

uh, non-commissioned to commissioned yet.

444

:

But, uh, anyway, I go into my pocket

and I find this little jewelry box,

445

:

and it's a bracelet with my name on it.

446

:

One of the girls gave it to

me and stuck it in my pocket.

447

:

I never found out who it was.

448

:

I still have it somewhere in a box.

449

:

I found it a couple months ago,

and it's in a box somewhere.

450

:

So I got into the Sea Scouts, got

really good into it, and, uh, stayed

451

:

into it till we moved in 1968.

452

:

I had made a…

453

:

I, I think I was an officer at the time.

454

:

Um, I think I made it to officer.

455

:

I can't think of…

456

:

Anyway

457

:

So we moved, and that was pretty

much the end in, in New York.

458

:

Oh, forgot about the other part, the

band that we started in high school.

459

:

Uh, my freshman year, after going to St.

460

:

Mary's, um, because I was two years

behind, I ended up going to a brand-new

461

:

diocesan Catholic high school.

462

:

And at the time, in, in that neighborhood

or in that part of Long Island, there

463

:

weren't really many Catholic high schools.

464

:

So the diocese decided to build

four of them around Long Island, and

465

:

the closest one to us was Jo- St.

466

:

John the Baptist in West Islip,

which was just outside of Bay

467

:

Shore, and I was the furthest out.

468

:

I got picked up by the bus for my freshman

year and sophomore year, and we were

469

:

brand-new first class of the school.

470

:

It was our school.

471

:

It was our brand-new school.

472

:

And, um, I can remember going to gym

the first day and, you know, they were

473

:

looking for basketball players and, and

football and, and, and this other stuff.

474

:

And I said, "Well, I'm not

really good at football.

475

:

I'm not really good at, at basketball

476

:

I'm not really, I'm not really great

at this basketball stuff and, uh

477

:

I, uh, said maybe I should pass.

478

:

So I became a photographer, so

I started taking pictures at

479

:

the games and gave up on that.

480

:

And then, uh, they had the track

tryouts, so I jumped into track,

481

:

and I was a long distance runner.

482

:

I could, you know, huff

along and do my run.

483

:

So I would do my runs and, uh, did okay.

484

:

It was fun.

485

:

It was exciting.

486

:

Here's the irony of it.

487

:

At the time, 'cause I was two years ahead

of everyone else, I was a sophomore.

488

:

Now this is a brand new high

school, so everyone there was just

489

:

about to get their licenses, so I

was two years ahead of everyone.

490

:

I had already had my driver's license.

491

:

So the sophomore year I was

the only sophomore that had

492

:

the parking lot to himself.

493

:

There was nobody else driving yet,

I think, or was it my freshman year?

494

:

Whatever year it was, I was the only

one that had the parking lot, and

495

:

Sister Maureen Peters, I can remember

her name to this day, saw me pull into

496

:

the dr- into the parking lot with, uh,

this car that my dad had gotten me.

497

:

She goes, "That's really nice.

498

:

Can I drive it?"

499

:

So I let her drive it

around the parking lot.

500

:

She just thought that was so cool.

501

:

So I, I was, um, there my, my

freshman and sophomore year.

502

:

Have tried over the

years to, uh, get there.

503

:

Let me see

504

:

So not everyone had the ability to,

to drive to school, 'cause again, I

505

:

was ahead of everyone by two years,

so I had my license before others.

506

:

And, uh, so funny, 'cause, you know, like

I said, Sister Maureen Peters came down

507

:

and she goes, "Can I drive your car?"

508

:

And I let her drive

around the parking lot.

509

:

That was kind of funny.

510

:

Uh, what else before we left New York?

511

:

Not much else.

512

:

Uh, I know that, um, in 1965, we

spent the entire summer in Italy.

513

:

My dad decided after he sold the deli…

514

:

No, he hadn't sold the deli yet.

515

:

Hadn't sold the deli yet.

516

:

We still had the deli.

517

:

Uh, left it to Bobby and the other girl,

um, Esther, to run it, and a couple other

518

:

people that were there to run the deli.

519

:

And so in June Or was it July?

520

:

Maybe it was the end of

Ju- June, 1st of July.

521

:

Yeah, 'cause the 1st of

July we were in, uh, um…

522

:

Where were we?

523

:

We were someplace in the Mediterranean.

524

:

We celebrated the 4th of July

on the ship before we went to

525

:

Naples, so it was probably July.

526

:

So we took off from New York on the

ship, uh, USS America, I think it is.

527

:

I found the banner.

528

:

I got it someplace here.

529

:

It's a banner the, from the ship.

530

:

And, uh, so Dad sent me, my mom,

my sister, and brother on the

531

:

ship to Italy in advance, and,

uh, we parked our car on the ship.

532

:

Now, how did they do that back then?

533

:

Well, they took the swimming pool

out and dropped it into the hull,

534

:

into the bottom of the boat, put

the pool back in, and went to Italy.

535

:

And, uh, we took our 1962

Cadillac Sedan Deville.

536

:

'62, '63, maybe it was a '64 Cadillac

Seville, and we're cruising to Italy.

537

:

Again, Florida wasn't even

on the radar at that point.

538

:

Not even close.

539

:

So we, uh, cruised to Italy.

540

:

I think it was like a seven or nine-day

cruise and went through Gibraltar.

541

:

I can remember seeing my sister going

with the monkeys on Gibraltar, chasing

542

:

their ass around the, the damn island

when we were up, down the tour.

543

:

We went there, Morocco, Casablanca.

544

:

Where else did we go to?

545

:

It was someplace else in, in

France maybe, where we stopped,

546

:

and we had 4th of July on the ship.

547

:

They had fireworks and

stuff like that for us.

548

:

And then we docked in Naples, and

that was, that was an experience.

549

:

Um, we, um, dock i- in Naples, and I

got a picture someplace in the files

550

:

of our car in the air coming out of

the ship's hull, 'cause they had to

551

:

take the pool out to get the car out.

552

:

And we're in Naples, and they're

putting the car along the dockside,

553

:

and I said to my mom, I said, "Are

we gonna have problems with customs?"

554

:

She goes, "No, your uncles

will take care of that."

555

:

So my Uncle Luigi, who was

in the military, met the guys

556

:

when the car hit the ground.

557

:

No problem.

558

:

Got in the car, and we drove away.

559

:

Now, you gotta remember, this is 1965.

560

:

I'm 15.

561

:

Well, I'm gonna be 15,

so I couldn't drive.

562

:

My mom, who grew up there, is now driving

this big battle-ass Cadillac from Naples

563

:

to Benevento, and then to the hometown

where, you know, my parents came from

564

:

And if any of you have been

there, you know, along the coast,

565

:

Amalfi Coast and some other

places, you're right on the edge.

566

:

And I'm in this passenger seat

looking out the window going,

567

:

"Oh my God, we're going to die."

568

:

Now, we got there.

569

:

Oh, when we got, um, at the bo- at

the docks, I'm saying to my mom, I

570

:

go, "They're gonna inspect the car."

571

:

They pop the hood, and like I said,

my Uncle Luigi took care of it.

572

:

You know, paid whoever he

had to pay off, and they just

573

:

signed us off, and we took off.

574

:

So we, we get to Benevento, and then we

gotta still drive a little bit further

575

:

out to a place called San Leucio,

which is the town my dad was from.

576

:

Now, if you know what the size of

a Cadillac is back in the '60s,

577

:

and you know if you've been to

Europe, the roads there and how wide

578

:

they are, they're not very wide.

579

:

Here we are driving into this

town, and the door handles are

580

:

almost brushing against the

walls on either side of the car.

581

:

My mom says, "Where are

we gonna park this?"

582

:

So my grandmother, my dad's

mom, says, "Got a place for it."

583

:

We parked it up in the graveyard, the

church graveyard, top of the hill.

584

:

So that's where the car parked at

night, in the top of the graveyard, at

585

:

the top of the hill in the graveyard.

586

:

And then, um, that's when I got

to meet my cousins, my cousin.

587

:

I have a cousin Guido.

588

:

I know people are, "You

got a cousin Guido?"

589

:

Yeah, and I got a cousin

Vinnie and another Vinnie.

590

:

So I got Guidos and Vinnies

and Maries and, uh, Angelas and

591

:

Pepino and, oh my gosh, Filomena.

592

:

I mean, you know, there was, there was

the typical, you know, pack of Italians.

593

:

That was, um, a summer to never forget.

594

:

Um, my dad came in a couple of days later,

and we picked him up in, uh, in Rome.

595

:

My mother drove into Rome.

596

:

That was another feat, going

to the airport to pick him up.

597

:

So we spent the next, uh, July, August

until September in Italy, just going all

598

:

over the countryside in our Cadillac.

599

:

Um, got to see some

really fascinating places.

600

:

Haven't been back since.

601

:

Uh, that is on my got

to do before I go list.

602

:

Don't know when, but it's gonna be soon.

603

:

And hopefully, uh, I'll be

able to share the adventure

604

:

and the excitement with someone

605

:

So that was, um, an interesting summer.

606

:

I was gonna be 15 in August, and

like I said, we were on the beaches

607

:

of Rimini, and we did Naples and

Pompeii, and we went all the way south

608

:

to the far southern part of place.

609

:

We went to Milan, we went to

Florence, we went to Venice.

610

:

I can remember going to Venice.

611

:

Uh, what was it?

612

:

Milan or Ve- Yeah, it was Milan.

613

:

I think it's the, the, the

cathedral there where it's just all

614

:

those st- I mean, just gorgeous.

615

:

Gorgeous.

616

:

Now, you gotta be ready to

do a lot of walking because,

617

:

you know, that's what you do.

618

:

And you gotta think about the country,

as small as it is, it was vast.

619

:

There was a lot of things to do.

620

:

So we got to Milan.

621

:

Kinda interesting.

622

:

Uh, Florence, same thing.

623

:

You know, the, the, the, the culture,

the, the ama- Venice was probably the

624

:

one that stuck out in my head, other

than Pisa with the l- leaning tower.

625

:

But Venice, uh, stood out from

the point of the gondolas.

626

:

You know, we gotta go on a gondola.

627

:

So we did the gondola in the

canals, and it stunk to high heaven.

628

:

Because you gotta think about it,

they don't have trash containers

629

:

and they don't have trash trucks.

630

:

They throw their shit out the

window into a boat that comes by.

631

:

That's how they did it back then.

632

:

I don't remember if they

do it or not anymore.

633

:

But a boat would come by and, you

know, take their trash away 'cause

634

:

there was no other way to get it.

635

:

There's no trucks to

come pick up your trash.

636

:

It's not trash on Tuesdays, it's

just whenever the gondola comes

637

:

through with the trash pickups.

638

:

And it smelt.

639

:

Ugh.

640

:

Then we were in the palazzo in, in Venice.

641

:

It started raining and it started getting

flooded, just like it always does.

642

:

And, uh, we had some really

interesting meals there.

643

:

Then we hit a lot of the glassblowing

places, and my mother wanted

644

:

certain types of glass, and she

found these two that they wanted.

645

:

They put in some boxes with stuff,

and I ended up carrying these things

646

:

around Venice for the entire day.

647

:

Um, it wa- it was, it was a

day to remember in Venice.

648

:

Same with going to the Leaning

Tower, Pisa, uh, seeing that.

649

:

Um, um, the other cities, you know,

um, Florence, Milan, eh, okay.

650

:

Uh, you know, I was too young.

651

:

I was like…

652

:

I, I really didn't appreciate

what I was looking at at the time.

653

:

That's why I wanna go back, and I've

been wanting to go back for years, and

654

:

I just haven't pulled the trigger on it.

655

:

I think time to do it,

and not to do it alone.

656

:

Uh, so that, we got back to Rome.

657

:

It was around my birthday, August the

9th, in Rome, and my parents decided to

658

:

have a birthday party with all my cousins,

and we were staying at the hotel in Rome

659

:

And this is where it

gets really squirrely.

660

:

We're in Rome in 1965.

661

:

James Garner was there on a

pre-movie lookup or whatever.

662

:

He was gonna do a movie in Rome.

663

:

Um, not at that time,

but shortly thereafter.

664

:

But they were doing some site work

and kinda, you know, sensing out

665

:

what the, you know, where the, where

the movie was gonna be taking place.

666

:

And, um, we were in the hotel

that he was in, and, uh, I was

667

:

having my birthday with my cousin.

668

:

Now understand this, my cousins did not

know that I not, that I didn't speak

669

:

Italian or didn't understand Italian.

670

:

So the whole time, that whole summer,

they're talking about me, saying all

671

:

kinds of shit, and I just let it simmer.

672

:

I just kept my mouth shut, let them

talk, let them talk, let them talk.

673

:

And it was really funny because we're

in the hotel at my birthday table, and

674

:

all of a sudden I let loose in Italian.

675

:

And you should have seen their faces,

like, "Holy shit, he understood

676

:

what we've been saying about him."

677

:

And they all laughed.

678

:

Well, apparently the maitre d' or

somebody there said something to James

679

:

Garner that, "Hey, this kid's here

from America having his birthday."

680

:

And he just popped in his head

and says, you know, "Happy

681

:

birthday," and whatever it was.

682

:

I wish I'd had a picture

of it, but I didn't.

683

:

I didn't think about it.

684

:

I mean, jeez, you know?

685

:

I mean, I knew of him, but I didn't

know, you know, that much about him.

686

:

So he was there doing a site for a

movie called Grand Prix, which I'm gonna

687

:

talk about in a later, uh, episode of

podcast when I start doing the '90s

688

:

This started out with being

a:

689

:

For some reason, I had this in the back

of my mind for the last month and a half

690

:

that I was gonna do a series of podcasts,

and this is the:

691

:

So now we're at 1965 in Rome, my birthday.

692

:

Uh, we're getting ready to leave

Rome, and they had a downpour.

693

:

I mean, a frigging downpour.

694

:

And my dad and I were gonna fly

back first, and my mom, sister, and

695

:

brother were gonna fly back second.

696

:

We didn't fly together.

697

:

We just flew separately.

698

:

So my dad and I get on the plane,

and we're heading back to New York

699

:

And we got someplace between Rome and

Paris or something, and the plane got

700

:

hit by lightning or something, and it,

you know, poopooed something on the

701

:

plane, so they had to land in Paris.

702

:

Uh, we got into Paris.

703

:

They said it was gonna take,

you know, a little bit of time.

704

:

Stick by the airport.

705

:

And we didn't go anywhere.

706

:

We were there for about

four or five, six hours.

707

:

Didn't see any of Paris, just the

port- you know, just the airport.

708

:

Thank God, 'cause everything

I've ever seen of Paris just

709

:

doesn't excite me at all.

710

:

I mean, I, I could care less

about ever going back to Paris.

711

:

So we were in Paris, then

flew back to, to, to New York.

712

:

Now, our car had to be shipped earlier, so

that's why we didn't have a car in Rome.

713

:

We had to take our car to Naples so

that they could put it on the ship and

714

:

bring it back to New York, which is

when we picked it up again in New York.

715

:

Then my sister and brother came back

home the next day after we came home,

716

:

and the car came a couple of days

later, or maybe it was already there.

717

:

I'm not sure.

718

:

I don't remember now.

719

:

So we got back to New

York, and that was:

720

:

And, um, dad was about now ready

to, to open up the liquor store,

721

:

or is in the process of doing that.

722

:

And, um, he just, uh, got a

bug in his butt and said, "I'm

723

:

gonna go down to Florida."

724

:

That was '66 or s- yeah,

'66 with the Barrasso's.

725

:

Alessi's, not Barrasso, the Alessi's.

726

:

Another family that lived in the area.

727

:

And, um, they went to the East Coast,

to Fort Lauderdale, Miami area, and for

728

:

some reason, someone said to him about

Crystal River, you know, the West Coast.

729

:

So they came over to Tampa and

headed up the Crystal River.

730

:

Now this is 1966, maybe '67-ish.

731

:

'66 probably.

732

:

I, I, again, I, I've got this all

written down, but you know what?

733

:

This is coming from memory.

734

:

Don't hold me to it

735

:

So we get, uh, my dad goes to,

comes to Florida with the Alessees,

736

:

and, um, comes back and says, "I

just bought 80 acres of land."

737

:

My mother goes, "Really?

738

:

When are we moving?"

739

:

She was excited to get

the hell out of New York.

740

:

So he came back down, I think, a

couple months later to meet with

741

:

the surveyors and the engineers.

742

:

I got pictures of him on a tractor,

uh, on the first road that was

743

:

built in our subdivision, which

is called Great Riverview Estates,

744

:

which is on Highway 488, which

is called, uh, Dunellen Road now.

745

:

It was, uh, five or six miles

from Dunellen, seven or eight

746

:

miles from Crystal River.

747

:

It was basically in nowhere.

748

:

Uh, but from the height of the

hill where the house was, or

749

:

was g- wasn't gonna be first.

750

:

At first, the house was gonna be

on the north side of 488, and Mom

751

:

says, "No, I wanna be on a hill."

752

:

So he moved it to the

other side of the hill.

753

:

And at that time, where the house

was located, you could look out and

754

:

see the Withlacoochee River, the

backwaters from the, from the house.

755

:

You could actually see the river.

756

:

So Dad ended up building a brick house

757

:

In 1967, we still had our deli.

758

:

No, we didn't have the deli.

759

:

We had the deli sold.

760

:

We were in the liquor store.

761

:

And, um, so he would be selling the

land out of the liquor store and

762

:

the customers from the deli, and he

sold out that first subdivision and,

763

:

um, said, "I gotta go get more."

764

:

So he came back here and bought another,

oh, 40 acres, and we started developing

765

:

that one and started selling it.

766

:

And, uh

767

:

He said, "We're moving to Florida."

768

:

And that was the summer of 1968.

769

:

So between '67 and '68, he made a couple

of trips back and forth, uh, to, to

770

:

Florida, to New York to sell the land.

771

:

And it was kind of an interesting

thing 'cause people were buying it

772

:

sight unseen, and he had to have it

inspected so that we weren't selling

773

:

fake land, and the inspector would

come in and check it out and do all

774

:

that crap, and he would sell it.

775

:

It was, it was interesting to think

about an immigrant from Italy with

776

:

no educational background, built a…

777

:

You know, worked in a factory in New

York, little luncheonette on Fire

778

:

Island, opens up a deli, a liquor

store, comes to Florida, buys some

779

:

land, becomes a land developer.

780

:

And, uh, Mom just couldn't

wait to get moved here.

781

:

So the year of '67, um, he came down

a couple more times and the house

782

:

was being constructed, made some

modifications and changes, made it a

783

:

little bit look bigger and all that.

784

:

And, uh, the…

785

:

Let's see.

786

:

I think it was s- maybe it was '67.

787

:

Mom came down with him, I

think with the Barrassos.

788

:

No, not the Barrassos, the Alessis.

789

:

And, uh, she just fell in love with

it and says, "I gotta get here now."

790

:

So the, uh, the summer of '68, we

had sold the, um, liquor store.

791

:

We had still kept the building, so we were

getting lease payments on the building.

792

:

Came to, uh, Crystal River

the summer of:

793

:

And, uh, right after school

got out, we were in the car.

794

:

We had a station wagon.

795

:

I had my…

796

:

We had our German shepherd, King.

797

:

I rode with him and my friend,

Charlie Winbeck, came with us, and

798

:

we drove from New York to Florida

in:

799

:

station wagon, I think it was maybe.

800

:

And, uh, we got to Dunellen.

801

:

We got to Ocala.

802

:

I go, "Oh, not bad."

803

:

Got to Dunellen, I'm going, "All right."

804

:

Then we drove out to where the

house is, and I'm going, "Holy crap.

805

:

Where are we?"

806

:

We're in the middle of nowhere.

807

:

I mean, literally nothing in the area.

808

:

And for that week that I was there,

I never had gone into Crystal River.

809

:

I went into Dunellen, because

that's where we were staying.

810

:

I didn't know anything about

Crystal River at all, and I was

811

:

just totally and completely shocked.

812

:

And Dad says, "Well, we gotta find

school for you and your sister."

813

:

So we went to Crystal River High School.

814

:

And, uh, gotta remember, this is 1968.

815

:

I'm a kid that went to Catholic school.

816

:

I wore uniforms to school every day.

817

:

I had cut hair.

818

:

You know, clean cut haircut.

819

:

Um, nothing, nothing loud, nothing

obnoxious, just, you know, typical

820

:

New York kid from the 1970s.

821

:

'60s, sorry.

822

:

So we go to Crystal River High School.

823

:

I look around and there's

pick-em-up trucks with gun racks,

824

:

and everyone's wearing blue jeans.

825

:

I didn't have a pair of blue jeans.

826

:

Cowboy boots, cowboy hats.

827

:

Uh, the girls would dress

kind of funky, you know.

828

:

That was the era here in Crystal River.

829

:

I go, "This isn't gonna work."

830

:

She said, "Okay."

831

:

So we heard about a school in St.

832

:

Pete called Admiral Farragut.

833

:

I call it Admiral Faggots.

834

:

It was a military school.

835

:

He said, "Well, you got the

military training background.

836

:

You'll enjoy this."

837

:

So we went down there to St.

838

:

Pete, and I go, "No, I can't do this."

839

:

I just couldn't do it.

840

:

Just couldn't do it.

841

:

So we heard about another school in Ocala.

842

:

It was called Golden Hills Academy

843

:

So we go to visit the school.

844

:

We're driving from Crystal Ri- I mean,

from Dunellen to Ocala, which is about 30

845

:

miles, plus or minus, and we're driving

to this school, and it's not a high

846

:

school or, you know, typical school.

847

:

It was a private school.

848

:

My dad said, "Well, let's check it out."

849

:

We heard about the people who owned it.

850

:

It was the Castros from King Castro

Convertible Furniture, and if you're from

851

:

New York, you knew who the Castros were.

852

:

And, and, and Bernadette was the

little girl who used to pull out the

853

:

couch in the commercials, and then she

became a good friend over the years.

854

:

So we, uh, are driving

to Ocala, Highway 41…

855

:

No 40, Highway 40, and then a side road

to Golden Hills, then we get on, uh,

856

:

27 to go to Golden Hills, and all of

a sudden we come to this gate, barn.

857

:

There's a barn on one side.

858

:

There's another little building on

the other side, and it's got a, a long

859

:

pathway, road, two-lane with trees.

860

:

And we come around the clearing,

and on one side is a, um, a

861

:

building, looked like a dormitory.

862

:

Then next to the dormitory it

looked like there was a gymnasium

863

:

'cause there was a, a tennis court

and stuff like that was out there.

864

:

And then there was a swimming

pool on the right side.

865

:

Then we go directly in front

was the school building.

866

:

I go, "Wow, that looks pretty cool."

867

:

To the left of it was a chapel.

868

:

I go, "Okay, interesting."

869

:

And in the middle of the, the

center circle there, there was a

870

:

helicopter sitting on the grass.

871

:

I'm going, "Okay, this is really weird.

872

:

Why is there a helicopter here?"

873

:

So we go in and look at the school,

and as soon as I walked in the front

874

:

door I said to Dad, "I wanna go here."

875

:

And you gotta think about it.

876

:

This is 1968, private school, and I found

some of the, the documents on, on what it

877

:

cost them back then, and it wasn't a lot.

878

:

It was maybe five, $600 maybe a semester,

maybe less than that for both me and

879

:

my sister, 'cause she was in, in, in

seventh grade I think at the time.

880

:

No, she was in, she was in junior-

she wasn't in junior high yet.

881

:

And, uh, I was gonna be a sophomore.

882

:

I was gonna be a junior

there, 'cause I left St.

883

:

St- uh, St.

884

:

John's as a, as a sophomore.

885

:

And we walk in the school

and I go, "I want here.

886

:

I'm going here."

887

:

So I ended up going to Golden Hills

for my junior and senior year That was

888

:

an whole, whole nother episode and a

half, and I'm gonna try to condense it.

889

:

Basically, we were the poorest

kids in school, my sister and I.

890

:

Everyone else's family were, you know,

family well-to-dos, people from all

891

:

over the world, people from the Bahamas,

from, from Europe, from South America.

892

:

There was a guy from Venezuela there.

893

:

His family was into oil back then.

894

:

Um, I mean, there were a lot of rich kid-

We were the poor kids in the building.

895

:

And there was one other girl there from

Crystal River, her name was Lynn Gerrits,

896

:

uh, which I, I haven't seen her in

years, and, uh, but she went there, too.

897

:

And over the years, I've run

into some people in Crystal

898

:

River that went to school there.

899

:

So, you know, my junior, senior year

at, at, at, at, at Golden Hills was just

900

:

completely in contrast to being in St.

901

:

John's Catholic School.

902

:

Totally, completely different

903

:

Uh, classes were small.

904

:

I mean, there were classes where

there was five of us in a class.

905

:

I mean, literally five people.

906

:

You know, it wasn't a big thing.

907

:

And again, I was not the

sharpest tool in the shed.

908

:

My grades weren't the best

in my junior or senior year

909

:

So, uh, I took language class,

I took Spanish, I got pretty

910

:

good at it, and I took typing.

911

:

And we didn't have really, you know,

team sports because there wasn't a

912

:

team to, to bring out so, you know, I

learned to ride horses, which was kind

913

:

of a phobia with me because earlier on

in my life I was at a friend's house on

914

:

Long Island and he had a little pony,

and I got on its back to ride it in his,

915

:

his yard, and the thing bucked me off.

916

:

I got my foot caught in the stirrup,

and it drug me around the yard.

917

:

I mean, literally drug me across the yard.

918

:

So I get up, brush myself off, and

I brush my ears off, and I got blood

919

:

coming out of the back of my ear.

920

:

So I run, this is on Long Island,

went back to our grocery store.

921

:

My mom's in the store.

922

:

I don't know where my dad was.

923

:

Maybe my dad was in Florida at the time

looking at property or doing something.

924

:

And, uh,

925

:

I, uh…

926

:

She goes, "Okay, we'll

just take you to Dr.

927

:

Pop and we'll take care of it now."

928

:

Didn't go to the emergency room.

929

:

Didn't go, you know.

930

:

Went to the doctor's office, he had me

lay on the table face down, stitched

931

:

me up and said, "Okay, see ya."

932

:

And that was it.

933

:

That was it.

934

:

I mean, he, there was no, there

was no anesthesia, nothing.

935

:

He just stitch up my ear

and out the door we went.

936

:

So back to Florida.

937

:

I'm here riding horses, learning how…

938

:

I, I, I'd ridden…

939

:

We had choice of Western

or, or, or Eastern.

940

:

Uh, Eastern.

941

:

Um, can't think of what it's called now.

942

:

Dressage?

943

:

Whatever the English style riding.

944

:

Couple of kids did Western, but it was

pretty much the English style of riding.

945

:

They had jumps, they had, uh, all the

fancy stuff to do that, so I got to the

946

:

point where I was pretty good on a horse.

947

:

I was able to, you know, ride them

with, without reins, with just, uh,

948

:

their manes on a couple of the horses.

949

:

And, uh, it was, it was,

it was an interesting time.

950

:

Now remember this horse story,

'cause it's gonna pi- piggyback in

951

:

to another horse story in the 1970s.

952

:

I'll allude to a little

bit of it, but not much.

953

:

I'm gonna, I'm gonna…

954

:

Well, maybe I will, 'cause

it's all part of this era.

955

:

So I, uh, ended up my freshman year there.

956

:

I mean, my sophomore year.

957

:

No, junior year.

958

:

Jesus, Finn.

959

:

Junior year.

960

:

And so my dad says, "We

gotta get you a car."

961

:

"Okay, great.

962

:

Car, yeah."

963

:

Uh, we start looking.

964

:

I don't know if any of you are

familiar with the Opel Kadett

965

:

It was made, I think, in Germany.

966

:

It was probably the,

um, c- uh, I don't know.

967

:

I can't even describe it.

968

:

It was a piece of shit.

969

:

It was a stick, no air conditioning,

no radio, uh, two-door, powder blue.

970

:

I mean, it was terrible.

971

:

And we drove that, my sister

and I, every day to Ocala in the

972

:

heat, no air conditioning, no

radio, no nothing in the thing.

973

:

And, uh, oh man, that was a, a tough one.

974

:

That was a tough one.

975

:

Um, so we, uh, made our trek

back and forth to Ocala each and

976

:

every day for those two years

977

:

So the little Opel Kadett, oh my gosh.

978

:

Ugh.

979

:

We'd go to the drive-in in

Ocala, and the g- the guy to

980

:

girl ratio was like four to one.

981

:

So whenever we'd go to the drive-in,

I always had more than my share.

982

:

Um,

983

:

riding the horses was fun.

984

:

Classes were interesting.

985

:

Again, small classes, you know, talking

three, four, five people in a class.

986

:

The, um, food was made to order.

987

:

We had a, a chef.

988

:

We had a dining room.

989

:

Uh, it, it was, it was

990

:

I can't describe it.

991

:

It was not something normal that

most people would encounter.

992

:

Just fortunate enough that

my dad found out about it.

993

:

I was always, we-- I always

felt like I was the poorest kid

994

:

there, and, uh, it was, um, fun.

995

:

Bernard Castro, Mrs.

996

:

Castro's son, was, was, was kicked out of

every school in New York you could think

997

:

of, and she built it basically for him

so he could graduate from high school.

998

:

He was, like, four years before

me or three years before me.

999

:

And, um, I can remember going to

Bernard's, you know, some evenings on

:

00:57:47,999 --> 00:57:51,409

the weekend to his house to have a party.

:

00:57:52,210 --> 00:57:53,849

He was a crazy mother.

:

00:57:54,079 --> 00:57:56,429

I mean, just fucking batshit crazy.

:

00:57:56,899 --> 00:58:00,889

And, uh, we'd go to his house, which

was do- across-- down the road from the

:

00:58:00,889 --> 00:58:02,649

school, across from his mom and dad's.

:

00:58:03,139 --> 00:58:05,660

Beautiful home, with his wife, Julie.

:

00:58:05,839 --> 00:58:06,269

Julie?

:

00:58:06,319 --> 00:58:06,739

Julie?

:

00:58:07,269 --> 00:58:08,399

I think it was Julie or Julia.

:

00:58:09,760 --> 00:58:13,920

And we'd be there having a party, and

the rule was you didn't go upstairs.

:

00:58:14,300 --> 00:58:17,109

You stayed downstairs

or it's gonna be havoc.

:

00:58:17,459 --> 00:58:20,980

And some- somebody that was there

that wasn't a normal person there

:

00:58:20,980 --> 00:58:21,719

started going up the stairs.

:

00:58:21,719 --> 00:58:22,839

I said, "Don't do it, man.

:

00:58:23,139 --> 00:58:24,540

Bernard's gonna go nuts."

:

00:58:24,639 --> 00:58:25,890

This dude goes up the stairs.

:

00:58:25,890 --> 00:58:28,130

Bernard picks up a

shotgun and takes a shot.

:

00:58:28,840 --> 00:58:32,530

Not to kill him, but just

shoots this freaking shotgun.

:

00:58:33,919 --> 00:58:35,339

That was pretty much the

last time I went there.

:

00:58:36,590 --> 00:58:41,624

Find out that he had, uh- Either

died or passed away on his

:

00:58:41,774 --> 00:58:43,304

family boat in Fort Lauderdale.

:

00:58:43,314 --> 00:58:45,724

Don't know if Julie had anything

to do with it, but the son of

:

00:58:45,724 --> 00:58:47,884

a bitch, he was not a good kid.

:

00:58:48,094 --> 00:58:49,274

I feel sorry for his parents.

:

00:58:49,274 --> 00:58:51,534

They did all that for him,

and he was just a jerk.

:

00:58:52,043 --> 00:58:55,214

His sister, Bernadette, beautiful woman.

:

00:58:56,594 --> 00:58:57,353

Beautiful woman.

:

00:58:58,993 --> 00:59:05,163

Um, so, uh, you know, my senior year,

everyone's, you know, getting ready

:

00:59:05,163 --> 00:59:07,883

to do the LSATs to go to college.

:

00:59:08,374 --> 00:59:12,923

I take them and my, uh, counselor

goes, "Eh, you're not doing so hot."

:

00:59:12,924 --> 00:59:13,823

I go, "Yeah, I know."

:

00:59:15,133 --> 00:59:16,073

"So what are you gonna do?"

:

00:59:16,083 --> 00:59:18,064

I said, "I don't know

at this point in time.

:

00:59:18,644 --> 00:59:22,964

Um, I'm not sure if I wanna go

to college, go to trade school.

:

00:59:23,804 --> 00:59:24,283

I don't know."

:

00:59:25,014 --> 00:59:26,463

Well, it got answered for me.

:

00:59:28,483 --> 00:59:31,933

This was,:

:

00:59:31,973 --> 00:59:37,793

Oh,:

event that would have never happened.

:

00:59:38,063 --> 00:59:39,413

I was at Cape Kennedy.

:

00:59:39,464 --> 00:59:41,114

I've got pictures of this one, too.

:

00:59:41,194 --> 00:59:45,833

I think I got even some home movies

of it, of the Apollo 11 moon launch.

:

00:59:46,374 --> 00:59:48,273

I was there for the first moon launch.

:

00:59:48,813 --> 00:59:51,513

Not the first moon launch, but

the one that went to the moon,

:

00:59:52,103 --> 00:59:53,754

11, at the Cape with our class.

:

00:59:53,754 --> 00:59:57,443

We went on a field trip, and we were

there watching it, uh, across the,

:

00:59:58,033 --> 00:59:59,524

the way from it on the mainland.

:

00:59:59,944 --> 01:00:03,563

And I've been to a couple of shuttle

launches over the years, too, and, and

:

01:00:03,804 --> 01:00:09,404

I can still remember that launch in

Ap- in that, in that July of, of '69.

:

01:00:10,613 --> 01:00:15,723

The sound waves, you could actually

see stuff coming across the water,

:

01:00:15,874 --> 01:00:17,173

and then the sound hits you.

:

01:00:17,603 --> 01:00:20,063

And I remember that distinctly

when I was there for the shuttle

:

01:00:20,063 --> 01:00:22,894

launches, but it also happened when

we were there for the Apollo 11.

:

01:00:23,753 --> 01:00:25,063

And, uh, that was kinda neat.

:

01:00:25,083 --> 01:00:25,413

We got…

:

01:00:25,414 --> 01:00:28,173

Like I said, I got some home movies, I

think, of it, and some pictures of it

:

01:00:28,953 --> 01:00:30,973

from that, that, that trip to the Cape.

:

01:00:32,853 --> 01:00:35,234

So my junior year was not that eventful.

:

01:00:35,473 --> 01:00:37,633

Um, we had our junior-senior prom.

:

01:00:38,353 --> 01:00:40,323

I had three dates for my junior prom.

:

01:00:40,493 --> 01:00:42,533

I had four dates for my senior prom.

:

01:00:42,843 --> 01:00:45,103

Well, there weren't enough guys to

go around, and they didn't wanna

:

01:00:45,103 --> 01:00:46,923

allow us to import any for the girls.

:

01:00:47,253 --> 01:00:51,863

So it was kinda, kinda like,

"Oh, I got four dates tonight."

:

01:00:51,923 --> 01:00:53,444

Yeah, well, you don't

really have four dates.

:

01:00:53,453 --> 01:00:57,603

You're just chaperoning along, and

whatever they had you do, you did.

:

01:00:59,323 --> 01:01:05,233

So, uh, got through my,

um, you know, senior year.

:

01:01:05,464 --> 01:01:06,664

But I had a little hiccup in it

:

01:01:08,864 --> 01:01:14,984

At the time of my senior

year, I was, um, 19

:

01:01:17,946 --> 01:01:20,796

If you recall, I got left back two

years, so I should've been out of

:

01:01:20,796 --> 01:01:25,276

high school and in, in college or at

least, you know, at some college level.

:

01:01:25,286 --> 01:01:29,885

So I'm, I'm, uh, my birthday

was gonna be in August of:

:

01:01:29,926 --> 01:01:33,826

I'd have been 20 years

old, but I'm 19 now.

:

01:01:35,286 --> 01:01:40,156

And the, um, the lottery

for the draft came up.

:

01:01:41,066 --> 01:01:48,006

Now, all of us had to do it when we

turned 18, we all got our, our, um, draft

:

01:01:48,006 --> 01:01:50,266

cards, 'cause that was the thing to do.

:

01:01:51,705 --> 01:01:55,215

And I remember going to, um,

I think it was Brooksville.

:

01:01:56,245 --> 01:01:59,175

Yeah, 'cause I found it a

couple days ago in a file.

:

01:01:59,175 --> 01:02:02,365

I'm find- I'm finding stuff and it's

just like, "Wow, I still got this thing."

:

01:02:02,845 --> 01:02:11,465

And I, I went to, to, to Brooksville

to get my draft card issued, and then

:

01:02:13,885 --> 01:02:18,805

after that was done,

I, uh, just, you know-

:

01:02:23,982 --> 01:02:24,672

Forgot about it

:

01:02:27,118 --> 01:02:29,168

So, you know, I just got my draft card.

:

01:02:29,168 --> 01:02:30,768

I mean, I d- I didn't

think anything of it.

:

01:02:31,337 --> 01:02:31,878

So

:

01:02:39,066 --> 01:02:43,346

I, uh, did my thing, went

in, in there and, you know

:

01:02:51,606 --> 01:02:52,466

I'm just trying to look it up

:

01:02:57,838 --> 01:02:59,328

I'm looking for my lottery number.

:

01:02:59,328 --> 01:03:00,558

I can't remember it now.

:

01:03:00,638 --> 01:03:01,808

Let me see if I can find it

:

01:03:07,154 --> 01:03:07,933

Uh, let's see.

:

01:03:08,064 --> 01:03:10,263

Draft boards.

:

01:03:11,843 --> 01:03:13,163

Ah, draft lottery.

:

01:03:14,533 --> 01:03:16,133

:

:

01:03:19,688 --> 01:03:22,658

Anyway, I, um, I did

my, you know, my thing.

:

01:03:22,658 --> 01:03:23,627

I did the lottery.

:

01:03:23,688 --> 01:03:32,178

I mean, I got my draft card, went in for

my, um, pre-induction, uh, physical and,

:

01:03:32,178 --> 01:03:34,507

uh, you know, didn't think nothing of it.

:

01:03:34,598 --> 01:03:38,757

I mean, there was just

nothing to really think about.

:

01:03:39,597 --> 01:03:46,308

And so I, I, um, did my physical up in

Jacksonville and the doctor, I, I had

:

01:03:46,497 --> 01:03:55,127

gave them my, uh, my, uh, letters, you

know, for the, uh, the draft as to, um

:

01:03:58,454 --> 01:03:59,874

Um, what the hell was it?

:

01:04:00,924 --> 01:04:01,564

Oh, come on

:

01:04:06,542 --> 01:04:07,022

Found it.

:

01:04:07,592 --> 01:04:12,112

It was draft number 101 to 150.

:

01:04:13,221 --> 01:04:15,511

My birthday was one, August the 9th.

:

01:04:16,002 --> 01:04:18,182

My number was 106.

:

01:04:18,942 --> 01:04:23,491

So you knew that the first

150 were going to go.

:

01:04:23,531 --> 01:04:28,142

The final cutoff was 151 to 195.

:

01:04:28,601 --> 01:04:33,582

So anything under 195, um,

you were pretty much…

:

01:04:35,442 --> 01:04:39,591

No, it was 150, final cutoff right there.

:

01:04:39,661 --> 01:04:40,731

Let me see what it says.

:

01:04:41,332 --> 01:04:41,642

Yeah.

:

01:04:42,422 --> 01:04:43,122

Yeah.

:

01:04:44,511 --> 01:04:46,181

So 106.

:

01:04:47,022 --> 01:04:51,912

Uh, so I, I knew I was gonna

get a draft notice, and I did.

:

01:04:52,331 --> 01:04:56,071

Uh, I got it, and I was stunned.

:

01:04:56,671 --> 01:05:04,361

I go-- But I went in for my physical

in, uh, Jacksonville, and the doctor,

:

01:05:04,391 --> 01:05:07,862

you know, looked at me and looked at

my eyes and the letters I had, and he

:

01:05:07,862 --> 01:05:09,261

said, "Yeah, we're not gonna want you."

:

01:05:10,042 --> 01:05:11,421

So I didn't pay attention to it.

:

01:05:12,601 --> 01:05:13,741

So they did the lottery.

:

01:05:14,241 --> 01:05:16,312

Mine was 106, August the 9th

:

01:05:18,548 --> 01:05:27,248

And, uh, sometime in March or April,

someplace in there, I got a little

:

01:05:27,248 --> 01:05:30,848

letter from the President of the

United States congratulating me

:

01:05:31,228 --> 01:05:36,678

on being, you know, 106th in the

lottery, and, uh, "We want your ass."

:

01:05:39,214 --> 01:05:44,044

So I went to the headmaster,

who was military at one point,

:

01:05:44,044 --> 01:05:44,904

and said, "What do I do?"

:

01:05:44,913 --> 01:05:47,444

He said, "Well, we could try to get

you out because of your eyesight."

:

01:05:47,714 --> 01:05:48,874

I said, "That didn't work.

:

01:05:48,874 --> 01:05:50,044

I brought all my letters.

:

01:05:50,453 --> 01:05:53,094

I brought all the documentation

when I went in for my physical up

:

01:05:53,094 --> 01:05:55,004

in Jacksonville, and that's when

they said they didn't want me."

:

01:05:55,663 --> 01:05:59,154

And he looked at it, looked at it, he

says, "I don't think we can stop it."

:

01:05:59,784 --> 01:06:03,864

And he said, "The only thing you

can do is decide on what your MOS

:

01:06:03,874 --> 01:06:05,533

is gonna be, what you wanna do."

:

01:06:06,034 --> 01:06:10,393

And I said, "Okay, uh,

what choices do I have?"

:

01:06:12,910 --> 01:06:15,359

To be honest with you, I don't remember.

:

01:06:15,359 --> 01:06:18,680

I know that I was gonna be a

company clerk 'cause I could type

:

01:06:21,518 --> 01:06:24,818

So I ended up graduating June the 6th

:

01:06:27,392 --> 01:06:33,612

And a couple weeks later, July, I'm at, uh

:

01:06:37,134 --> 01:06:42,024

The AV station in Jacksonville,

getting on a bus, headed for

:

01:06:42,024 --> 01:06:43,604

Fort Jackson, South Carolina.

:

01:06:45,384 --> 01:06:46,814

The irony of that is

:

01:06:48,886 --> 01:06:53,096

Months before that, I was in a, a

little place called Beverly Hills,

:

01:06:53,116 --> 01:06:57,136

not California, but Beverly Hills,

Florida, out with some friends partying,

:

01:06:59,186 --> 01:07:04,785

knowing that I was, you know,

gonna be going to war possibly

:

01:07:07,198 --> 01:07:12,548

And, uh, met a guy by the name of John

Baker out there one night just hanging

:

01:07:12,548 --> 01:07:14,178

out there, just drinking and partying.

:

01:07:15,998 --> 01:07:21,438

I get on the bus in Jacksonville, turn

around, and there's Baker, John Baker.

:

01:07:23,468 --> 01:07:24,948

We were both headed for Fort Jackson.

:

01:07:24,958 --> 01:07:26,738

Neither one of us knew each

other from Crystal River.

:

01:07:26,738 --> 01:07:31,747

We just kinda met randomly at, at a

party one night, one of my, one of my,

:

01:07:31,817 --> 01:07:33,828

you know, leaving out of town parties.

:

01:07:35,407 --> 01:07:38,718

And here he is on the bus

headed for Fort Jackson.

:

01:07:39,757 --> 01:07:40,927

And you know the ritual.

:

01:07:40,938 --> 01:07:42,797

Most of you know what

happens when you get there.

:

01:07:42,877 --> 01:07:48,748

They get you there early in the morning,

harass the shit out of you, scare the crap

:

01:07:48,748 --> 01:07:50,758

out of you and all that other good stuff.

:

01:07:51,657 --> 01:07:55,378

And Baker and I kinda looked at each

other and go, "Oh, this is gonna be fun."

:

01:07:56,087 --> 01:08:01,927

So we get off the bus, they

line us all up, and, uh, he and

:

01:08:01,927 --> 01:08:06,567

I ended up going through basic

training together at Fort Jackson.

:

01:08:08,357 --> 01:08:09,937

Fort Jackson in:

:

01:08:12,950 --> 01:08:15,190

was probably the pit of the world.

:

01:08:15,279 --> 01:08:16,470

I mean, it was hot.

:

01:08:16,870 --> 01:08:18,880

Really, really hot.

:

01:08:19,880 --> 01:08:20,399

Um

:

01:08:23,054 --> 01:08:26,354

I'm gonna do it in this episode because I,

I don't wanna let, let it go over to the

:

01:08:26,354 --> 01:08:28,274

next one 'cause I got my mind going on it.

:

01:08:30,033 --> 01:08:32,434

So we get to, to Fort Jackson.

:

01:08:32,434 --> 01:08:33,702

They do this deliberately.

:

01:08:33,983 --> 01:08:37,004

You know, they bring you there in

early in the morning, have no sleep

:

01:08:37,004 --> 01:08:39,334

on the bus 'cause you couldn't

sleep 'cause you were, you know,

:

01:08:39,334 --> 01:08:40,804

preoccupied with all the other stuff.

:

01:08:40,804 --> 01:08:46,094

Oh, backing up, at the AAFES station in

Jacksonville, they swore us in, and then

:

01:08:46,094 --> 01:08:48,533

they said, "If any of you are thinking

about leaving, now's the time to do it."

:

01:08:48,544 --> 01:08:51,174

Well, they had already swore

you in, and if you go walking

:

01:08:51,174 --> 01:08:52,804

away now, you're going to jail.

:

01:08:53,103 --> 01:08:56,452

And I saw a couple of guys leave, and

I'm going, "Ooh, that's not a good idea."

:

01:08:57,894 --> 01:09:04,372

So we get to, like I said, to Fort

Jackson after our nice quiet ride,

:

01:09:05,073 --> 01:09:06,702

sergeants yelling at us the whole time.

:

01:09:08,554 --> 01:09:10,053

Get off the bus at Fort Jackson.

:

01:09:10,523 --> 01:09:14,564

It's still dark out, and they're

yelling and screaming, "Run!

:

01:09:15,183 --> 01:09:15,363

Yeah, yeah."

:

01:09:15,363 --> 01:09:15,952

And all the…

:

01:09:15,952 --> 01:09:17,993

And you're just totally discombobulated.

:

01:09:18,702 --> 01:09:22,913

And they gave you about an hour to

sleep, woke your ass up, and they

:

01:09:22,913 --> 01:09:26,383

started the rigmarole, you know,

the indoctrination part of the last,

:

01:09:26,394 --> 01:09:28,484

next couple of weeks of, of just…

:

01:09:28,582 --> 01:09:34,613

It's kinda like hell week, except it goes

on for weeks to like, you know, get you

:

01:09:34,613 --> 01:09:44,103

into your, uh, into your, uh, battalion

or your platoon, your squad, your company.

:

01:09:45,484 --> 01:09:50,933

So after a sleepless night, get us

into the, into the, uh, yard there

:

01:09:50,933 --> 01:09:52,462

at the barracks at Fort Jackson.

:

01:09:53,042 --> 01:09:58,083

You got your, your civvies on, and

that's when they go through the ritual

:

01:09:58,083 --> 01:10:01,623

of taking your civvies away and basically

saying, "You don't wear these anymore."

:

01:10:02,484 --> 01:10:05,463

And all your clothes are

confiscated, put in a bag.

:

01:10:05,952 --> 01:10:09,513

You get all your new stuff, your

duffle bag, and out the door you go

:

01:10:09,513 --> 01:10:14,353

to the, the barracks, and they got

you up, you know, within two hours,

:

01:10:15,173 --> 01:10:18,473

running and screaming and hollering

and doing all kinds of crazy shit.

:

01:10:18,484 --> 01:10:20,933

Don't know where to go,

what to do, when to do it

:

01:10:26,571 --> 01:10:29,482

And a- again, i- it's part of

the, the breakdown and the buildup

:

01:10:33,700 --> 01:10:36,880

I, I looked at John and go,

"Boy, this is not gonna be good.

:

01:10:37,490 --> 01:10:38,630

It's gonna be hell."

:

01:10:38,770 --> 01:10:40,800

And that's pretty much what it

was, kinda like a hell week.

:

01:10:41,989 --> 01:10:42,590

But that was okay.

:

01:10:42,590 --> 01:10:43,240

I was ready for it

:

01:10:46,780 --> 01:10:52,090

Uh, Sergeant Stiltner was our

sergeant of our, our platoon

:

01:10:54,830 --> 01:10:57,500

D6-2 was our chant.

:

01:10:57,890 --> 01:11:01,380

D6-2, second to none,

first up and last up.

:

01:11:02,309 --> 01:11:07,890

And, uh, he was a, a Vietnam vet.

:

01:11:07,920 --> 01:11:13,068

He had been there twice, I think at

that time, maybe three times in country.

:

01:11:15,269 --> 01:11:20,380

We pretty much knew that we were all gonna

be destined to, to get orders for Vietnam.

:

01:11:20,709 --> 01:11:23,509

Now, also in our group were

some National Guards, NGs.

:

01:11:24,900 --> 01:11:25,649

There were three types.

:

01:11:25,650 --> 01:11:30,330

There was RA, regular army,

which I was, and I, I decided…

:

01:11:30,449 --> 01:11:35,259

I had been drafted, but my

counselor said to me, "Enlist.

:

01:11:35,510 --> 01:11:39,080

Don't be drafted, 'cause if you,

if you en- if you get drafted,

:

01:11:39,080 --> 01:11:40,559

you don't get to pick your MOS.

:

01:11:40,809 --> 01:11:43,989

If you enlist, you get to pick

your, your, your branch of your

:

01:11:43,990 --> 01:11:45,369

service based on your aptitude."

:

01:11:45,369 --> 01:11:46,399

So I took all these tests.

:

01:11:46,719 --> 01:11:48,669

I was c- I became a company clerk.

:

01:11:48,670 --> 01:11:51,409

I was, uh, kinda like a

miniature radar back then.

:

01:11:51,409 --> 01:11:53,939

I could type, and I could type

fast 'cause I took it in high

:

01:11:53,939 --> 01:11:55,899

school, so that saved my ass.

:

01:11:55,900 --> 01:11:57,070

I wasn't good at anything else.

:

01:11:57,070 --> 01:11:58,090

I'm not mechanical.

:

01:11:58,379 --> 01:11:59,439

I'm not physical.

:

01:11:59,849 --> 01:12:03,169

Uh, so I could type, and I could

read things and analyze things.

:

01:12:05,099 --> 01:12:14,649

So we're, um, first night

just, just mayhem, you know?

:

01:12:15,719 --> 01:12:18,300

But I knew that was part

of the military culture.

:

01:12:18,300 --> 01:12:21,119

I had been in the Sea Scouts,

so I understood mil- military

:

01:12:21,120 --> 01:12:22,389

protocol to some degree.

:

01:12:23,109 --> 01:12:26,890

So, you know, I made it known to

Sergeant Stiltner that I, you know,

:

01:12:26,900 --> 01:12:31,140

I, I stood out a little bit, and he

would, you know, kinda pick at me.

:

01:12:32,480 --> 01:12:35,568

I found a photo of my

guys in basic training.

:

01:12:35,568 --> 01:12:39,809

It was taken August the 6th, I think,

of, of:

:

01:12:39,809 --> 01:12:41,289

of me, and I, I've got it behind me

:

01:12:43,510 --> 01:12:45,980

And I'm on the front

row next to a Black guy.

:

01:12:46,650 --> 01:12:49,430

He's the only Black guy

in the entire company.

:

01:12:51,110 --> 01:12:55,900

And, uh, he and I became friends, and

same with, uh, my other friend there

:

01:12:58,798 --> 01:13:04,798

So we, we're in basic training

at Fort Jackson in July

:

01:13:07,438 --> 01:13:11,338

Hot as hell, sweating profusely.

:

01:13:12,478 --> 01:13:14,678

They take, "Well, take your

salt tablets and drink a lot of

:

01:13:14,678 --> 01:13:16,048

water," and did a lot of that.

:

01:13:16,928 --> 01:13:21,367

You know, went through, um, the

rigamaroles of, you know, breaking

:

01:13:21,367 --> 01:13:22,778

you down, then building you up.

:

01:13:23,388 --> 01:13:26,217

Go on these marches that go on forever.

:

01:13:26,897 --> 01:13:28,567

Didn't think you could last, you did.

:

01:13:29,797 --> 01:13:30,838

Food was terrible.

:

01:13:31,588 --> 01:13:34,327

Uh, you had to, you know, do

certain pull-ups before you

:

01:13:34,327 --> 01:13:35,397

could even eat breakfast.

:

01:13:35,397 --> 01:13:37,068

It, it, it was…

:

01:13:37,198 --> 01:13:39,137

You know, they had to

break you to build you.

:

01:13:40,298 --> 01:13:43,947

And, you know, at that time, you know,

we had a couple of guys in the platoon,

:

01:13:45,317 --> 01:13:49,147

or in the, in the, in the group,

that just were resisting everything.

:

01:13:49,147 --> 01:13:50,498

I said, "You need to give it up, man.

:

01:13:50,717 --> 01:13:51,557

Y- they're gonna win.

:

01:13:51,567 --> 01:13:53,117

You're not gonna beat them at their game.

:

01:13:53,357 --> 01:13:54,407

They know what they're doing."

:

01:13:55,888 --> 01:14:00,647

So, uh, Sergeant Stiltner saw that

I had some military background

:

01:14:00,647 --> 01:14:01,557

'cause of the Sea Scouts.

:

01:14:01,627 --> 01:14:03,937

I had, you know, worked through

the ranks from a seaman all the

:

01:14:03,947 --> 01:14:07,867

way to a midshipman to a petty

officer, so I understood protocol.

:

01:14:08,547 --> 01:14:12,778

So, you know, he, uh, said, "I'm

gonna put you in as a squad leader."

:

01:14:12,838 --> 01:14:13,577

I said, "Thank you.

:

01:14:14,408 --> 01:14:15,077

Uh, what do I do?"

:

01:14:15,077 --> 01:14:16,087

And he told me what to do.

:

01:14:17,317 --> 01:14:17,937

And then, um,

:

01:14:19,957 --> 01:14:21,638

we were doing something.

:

01:14:23,018 --> 01:14:26,877

Oh, I think we were getting on the

range, and I'm shooting left-handed.

:

01:14:27,647 --> 01:14:28,758

He goes, "What are you doing?"

:

01:14:28,957 --> 01:14:31,107

I said, "I can't shoot right-handed.

:

01:14:31,127 --> 01:14:32,737

I am blind in my right eye."

:

01:14:32,747 --> 01:14:35,517

He, he kinda looked at

me like, "What the fuck?

:

01:14:36,137 --> 01:14:37,387

You're blind in one eye?"

:

01:14:37,838 --> 01:14:38,327

"Yes, sir."

:

01:14:38,868 --> 01:14:40,768

You know, "Don't call me

sir," type of thing, you know.

:

01:14:41,787 --> 01:14:42,697

"Yes, Drill Sergeant."

:

01:14:44,798 --> 01:14:45,467

"You're blind?"

:

01:14:46,067 --> 01:14:46,477

"Yes."

:

01:14:47,567 --> 01:14:48,387

"In your right eye?"

:

01:14:48,588 --> 01:14:49,158

"Yes."

:

01:14:50,137 --> 01:14:52,297

"Okay, we're gonna teach you

how to shoot left-handed."

:

01:14:52,827 --> 01:14:53,357

Okay.

:

01:14:53,688 --> 01:14:58,568

Well, if any of you are familiar with the

M16, it discharges rounds out the side.

:

01:14:59,377 --> 01:15:01,707

I was getting hit with the

shell casings in my face.

:

01:15:02,997 --> 01:15:06,738

Found out there's a deflector for that,

so they got me a deflector for my M16 so

:

01:15:06,738 --> 01:15:10,287

that the rounds, the shells, would fire

out forward instead of into my face.

:

01:15:11,847 --> 01:15:15,467

And whenever we did any kind of maneuvers,

he would always put me on the left flank

:

01:15:15,467 --> 01:15:18,457

so that my right flank was covered, so

that if anything was on my right, it

:

01:15:18,458 --> 01:15:20,357

was a friendly, to the left was not.

:

01:15:21,057 --> 01:15:22,597

So he, he protected me there.

:

01:15:22,598 --> 01:15:23,908

So I ended up being squad leader.

:

01:15:24,647 --> 01:15:27,068

I did have the military background

from the Sea Scouts, so I

:

01:15:27,068 --> 01:15:31,268

understood protocol, marching,

how to handle a weapon, you know.

:

01:15:31,268 --> 01:15:32,357

So that was an advancement.

:

01:15:32,357 --> 01:15:34,677

And he said, "I'm gonna recommend

you for leadership training

:

01:15:34,677 --> 01:15:35,587

school," and I said, "Fine."

:

01:15:36,147 --> 01:15:38,777

So we got through basic, um, Baker and I.

:

01:15:40,477 --> 01:15:45,297

Looking at that picture the other day,

wondering how many of those guys did

:

01:15:45,298 --> 01:15:52,377

not come back after basic and AIT.

:

01:15:53,787 --> 01:15:58,947

I, I'm just wondering, you know,

how many of them didn't make it back

:

01:16:02,016 --> 01:16:04,936

Um, basic training at Fort Jackson.

:

01:16:05,036 --> 01:16:08,316

We were in the old, old

World War I type barrack.

:

01:16:08,366 --> 01:16:09,996

I mean, they were crappy barracks.

:

01:16:10,065 --> 01:16:11,886

I mean, really crappy barracks.

:

01:16:13,446 --> 01:16:15,336

Nothing that you could write home about.

:

01:16:16,555 --> 01:16:18,506

Well, you did, but

didn't make a difference.

:

01:16:20,376 --> 01:16:26,316

And, you know, you'd wake you up at some

ungodly hour and, you know, do your thing.

:

01:16:26,316 --> 01:16:33,585

And we were the first row of bunks

in the barracks downstairs, and

:

01:16:33,605 --> 01:16:37,096

my, uh, duty and responsibility

was the latrine, to keep it clean.

:

01:16:38,286 --> 01:16:43,915

Uh, that was really not a lot of fun,

but I jumped in and said, "Yes, sir.

:

01:16:44,056 --> 01:16:44,625

I'll do it."

:

01:16:45,565 --> 01:16:47,625

So we kept the bathrooms

clean as possible.

:

01:16:49,126 --> 01:16:51,835

I was in charge of fire watch on the

fi- first floor, 'cause we had two

:

01:16:51,835 --> 01:16:56,716

floors, and, uh, I would put people

on fire watch that were fuck-ups.

:

01:16:57,885 --> 01:17:03,045

And one night, one of them was gonna

cut my throat, as, as it was told

:

01:17:03,056 --> 01:17:07,856

to me, and because I was laying on

my other side, he thought my eye was

:

01:17:07,896 --> 01:17:14,555

open, and my bunk mate above saw him

coming for me, and he caught him.

:

01:17:15,576 --> 01:17:20,895

He ended up feeling it from the hierarchy

:

01:17:23,598 --> 01:17:27,488

Now, the first couple of days

you're in basic training, or

:

01:17:27,488 --> 01:17:30,968

before you even get into it, you're

basically a, a slave of the base.

:

01:17:31,378 --> 01:17:33,948

They have you doing all these

menial tasks around the post,

:

01:17:34,008 --> 01:17:35,227

just cleaning up the place.

:

01:17:35,228 --> 01:17:37,238

I mean, just, "You gotta

go do this, go do that."

:

01:17:37,238 --> 01:17:37,427

You know?

:

01:17:37,428 --> 01:17:37,978

But you weren't…

:

01:17:38,228 --> 01:17:41,567

They were trying to get you broke

down so they could start building you.

:

01:17:42,838 --> 01:17:47,147

So we're in the yard and, um, they were

starting to put out assignments for the

:

01:17:47,147 --> 01:17:52,097

day, 'cause I think we had two weeks of

that stuff before we even got into basic.

:

01:17:53,678 --> 01:17:57,857

So they would ask, "All right, we're

looking for this type of job today.

:

01:17:58,017 --> 01:17:58,717

Who is interested?"

:

01:17:58,717 --> 01:17:59,678

And they'd go, "Truck drivers."

:

01:17:59,678 --> 01:18:00,487

People would raise their hand.

:

01:18:00,737 --> 01:18:01,568

"This thing, this thing."

:

01:18:01,568 --> 01:18:05,907

They raised their hands, and I'm looking

at these guys going, "I, I think I'm gonna

:

01:18:05,918 --> 01:18:09,527

hold until I hear something that I can

understand what they're talking about."

:

01:18:10,077 --> 01:18:11,457

And there was a couple other guys with me.

:

01:18:11,907 --> 01:18:15,317

And they're going on and on and on and,

and then someone says, "Here, anybody

:

01:18:15,508 --> 01:18:17,368

know how to, you know, muck out a stall?"

:

01:18:17,368 --> 01:18:19,567

And I raised my hand, 'cause I

was doing it at Golden Hills.

:

01:18:19,567 --> 01:18:21,108

We mucked out stalls for the horses.

:

01:18:21,157 --> 01:18:24,666

I raised my hand, and the other two

guys that were with me, we raised our

:

01:18:24,668 --> 01:18:26,257

hands and we go, "Okay, we can do that."

:

01:18:26,717 --> 01:18:33,377

So for the next two weeks we mucked

out stalls at the base's stables.

:

01:18:34,708 --> 01:18:38,618

We got there the first

morning and we did our thing.

:

01:18:38,618 --> 01:18:39,468

You know, we went the rounds.

:

01:18:39,468 --> 01:18:41,007

They showed us what the requirements are.

:

01:18:41,007 --> 01:18:44,698

You know, the hay and the feed and

the wash downs of the horses and

:

01:18:45,047 --> 01:18:46,467

the walkings and all that stuff.

:

01:18:46,467 --> 01:18:48,727

And I go, "This reminds me of

being back in high school."

:

01:18:48,727 --> 01:18:51,557

I did this for two years just recently.

:

01:18:52,297 --> 01:18:55,898

So I was able to, to catch on quick,

so they made me the squad leader

:

01:18:55,898 --> 01:18:59,817

of that, of that group to handle

the, the cleanups and the animals.

:

01:19:02,748 --> 01:19:05,968

So f- we're, we're, we're-

:

01:19:08,534 --> 01:19:12,744

We're sitting on the ground,

and we had already gotten the,

:

01:19:12,754 --> 01:19:15,704

the stalls mucked and, and the

animals fed and washed and cleaned.

:

01:19:15,983 --> 01:19:17,704

Sergeant came over and

says, "You guys are done?"

:

01:19:17,824 --> 01:19:18,933

I go, "Yeah.

:

01:19:19,843 --> 01:19:21,154

We, we got our jobs done."

:

01:19:21,204 --> 01:19:22,493

He goes, "Okay.

:

01:19:22,494 --> 01:19:23,494

Well, don't tell anybody.

:

01:19:23,494 --> 01:19:25,794

Just hang out, enjoy

yourself the rest of the day.

:

01:19:26,233 --> 01:19:28,174

Do your thing you gotta do in

the afternoon with the animals.

:

01:19:28,174 --> 01:19:28,723

Take them for their…"

:

01:19:28,754 --> 01:19:29,844

You know, whatever the job was.

:

01:19:29,873 --> 01:19:30,363

We got it.

:

01:19:30,994 --> 01:19:35,654

So for the next two weeks, that's all we

did, was just we'd get in the Jeep and

:

01:19:35,754 --> 01:19:38,483

ride there, and we'd muck out stalls.

:

01:19:39,093 --> 01:19:44,304

I think about the third or the fourth day,

there was a horse in the, in the ring, and

:

01:19:44,304 --> 01:19:45,813

one of the guys said, "Can you ride that?"

:

01:19:45,813 --> 01:19:47,473

And I go, "Yeah, I can

probably ride it bareback."

:

01:19:47,913 --> 01:19:48,543

"Bareback?"

:

01:19:48,674 --> 01:19:48,964

"Yeah."

:

01:19:49,223 --> 01:19:49,904

"No reins?"

:

01:19:50,674 --> 01:19:51,824

Which they didn't know what they were.

:

01:19:52,233 --> 01:19:52,794

"Or saddle?"

:

01:19:52,854 --> 01:19:53,643

"Yeah, I'll try."

:

01:19:53,643 --> 01:19:57,523

So I jumped up, and I

was reining him or her.

:

01:19:57,532 --> 01:19:58,713

It was either a he or she.

:

01:19:59,543 --> 01:20:00,393

Maybe it was a she.

:

01:20:00,793 --> 01:20:03,903

So I was using her reins, her,

her fur on the back of her

:

01:20:03,904 --> 01:20:05,452

neck, and I was holding it.

:

01:20:05,952 --> 01:20:09,344

And she was young, and I'd use my feet

to, you know, chuck along her sides,

:

01:20:09,344 --> 01:20:11,424

and she was responding pretty well.

:

01:20:12,773 --> 01:20:14,843

So I did that for about

a day or two, you know.

:

01:20:15,053 --> 01:20:15,893

So I'd ride.

:

01:20:16,013 --> 01:20:17,623

I, and I said, "Well, I

did this in high school.

:

01:20:17,623 --> 01:20:18,643

I mean, I rode horses.

:

01:20:19,163 --> 01:20:20,163

I can do it again now."

:

01:20:22,824 --> 01:20:28,563

So I'm riding this horse, and we had

done all our stuff and some girl comes

:

01:20:28,563 --> 01:20:31,894

up in a, a car or a Jeep or whatever

it was and sees me on the horse.

:

01:20:31,894 --> 01:20:34,563

She goes, "Wow, that's pretty interesting.

:

01:20:35,104 --> 01:20:36,943

You can ride without a saddle or reins?"

:

01:20:36,943 --> 01:20:37,782

I go, "Yeah."

:

01:20:38,244 --> 01:20:39,164

She goes, "That's my horse."

:

01:20:39,164 --> 01:20:40,702

I go, "Uh-oh.

:

01:20:41,823 --> 01:20:42,653

Your horse?"

:

01:20:43,683 --> 01:20:44,153

"Yep."

:

01:20:45,104 --> 01:20:46,364

Well, it was the colonel's daughter-

:

01:20:48,724 --> 01:20:50,854

I'm thinking, "I'm up the

shit creek here, man."

:

01:20:52,394 --> 01:20:52,704

Nope.

:

01:20:54,354 --> 01:21:01,693

I was assigned to ride with her and help

her with her English writing skills.

:

01:21:03,333 --> 01:21:10,253

You talk about luck or the whatever you

wanna call it, someone looking out for you

:

01:21:12,846 --> 01:21:14,585

So two weeks of that.

:

01:21:15,715 --> 01:21:17,306

Didn't get no hanky-panky with her.

:

01:21:17,306 --> 01:21:18,205

I wasn't that stupid.

:

01:21:18,205 --> 01:21:19,425

I mean, her dad's a colonel.

:

01:21:19,425 --> 01:21:22,396

He could have had me shipped to Vietnam

right then and there if he wanted to.

:

01:21:23,385 --> 01:21:25,446

So, uh, that was an interesting time.

:

01:21:26,065 --> 01:21:29,295

My dad, in between that, came

to visit with my cousin Pino.

:

01:21:29,555 --> 01:21:30,295

I have a cousin Pino.

:

01:21:31,536 --> 01:21:32,705

Pino's a tall dude.

:

01:21:33,165 --> 01:21:34,434

They came to see me at Fort Jackson.

:

01:21:34,436 --> 01:21:37,825

I got a picture I found of me and my

dad at Fort Jackson in the newspaper,

:

01:21:37,825 --> 01:21:40,025

you know, came to visit type thing.

:

01:21:41,755 --> 01:21:43,255

So we got through into basic.

:

01:21:45,026 --> 01:21:50,055

Started off, um, you know, the morning

rituals, you know, the, the ru- the

:

01:21:50,055 --> 01:21:55,265

march, the run before breakfast, and

then doing the bars, you know, the

:

01:21:55,265 --> 01:21:58,565

monkey bars before you go eat, and then

you go eat, and you eat real quick,

:

01:21:58,565 --> 01:21:59,785

and you go back, and you, you know.

:

01:22:00,706 --> 01:22:05,434

You do all that crap, and then you go

to classes, and then you do the, uh, the

:

01:22:05,436 --> 01:22:07,575

parade stuff around the, around the yard.

:

01:22:07,575 --> 01:22:12,545

And I can remember, uh, one morning

after breakfast or before breakfast,

:

01:22:13,245 --> 01:22:16,495

don't remember what it was, they had

us roll up our sleeves, both sleeves,

:

01:22:17,175 --> 01:22:18,795

and they were injecting us with shit.

:

01:22:19,155 --> 01:22:22,165

Still don't know to the day what

it was, and a bunch of us got sick.

:

01:22:22,175 --> 01:22:23,166

Most of us got sick.

:

01:22:23,166 --> 01:22:24,835

We don't know what we

were shot in both arms.

:

01:22:25,175 --> 01:22:29,565

Those guns that they had, they

just shot shit into us, and we

:

01:22:29,566 --> 01:22:31,585

all got really deathly sick.

:

01:22:31,746 --> 01:22:32,585

Happened twice.

:

01:22:34,526 --> 01:22:37,625

Um, I can remember we were

out in marches at bivouac.

:

01:22:37,625 --> 01:22:41,175

We were doing an overnight or, or

something like that, and we were in the

:

01:22:41,175 --> 01:22:46,595

woods someplace, and they had smoke trucks

coming through, so you had to get on

:

01:22:46,596 --> 01:22:48,395

your gas mask, you know, the whole bit.

:

01:22:48,405 --> 01:22:51,195

Just you're, you think you're about

to fall asleep, and then you're da,

:

01:22:51,195 --> 01:22:56,925

da, da, da, and then the, the smoke

comes in and just, just disgusting.

:

01:22:58,875 --> 01:23:03,235

There was another episode, um,

let me see, the injections.

:

01:23:03,295 --> 01:23:05,775

Yeah, the, they gave us those shots

that we don't know what they were.

:

01:23:05,776 --> 01:23:06,375

We got sick.

:

01:23:06,434 --> 01:23:09,215

Oh, the sm- the, the, the, um, gas chamber

:

01:23:11,736 --> 01:23:15,836

They told us that morning that

we wanted extra close shaves.

:

01:23:16,846 --> 01:23:19,856

"So don't shave just one direction,

shave both directions so that

:

01:23:19,856 --> 01:23:21,576

your mask will seal correctly."

:

01:23:21,986 --> 01:23:22,396

Okay.

:

01:23:22,755 --> 01:23:26,106

So you shave both ways, up and down,

so your face was nice and slick and

:

01:23:26,106 --> 01:23:27,934

smooth so you can get your gas mask on.

:

01:23:28,265 --> 01:23:29,345

So that was great.

:

01:23:29,855 --> 01:23:33,745

Got in there, you know, had

you walk in with the mask on.

:

01:23:33,746 --> 01:23:35,965

You're standing around, then they

throw the canister inside, and

:

01:23:35,965 --> 01:23:38,865

the smoke's coming out, and they

say, "Okay, remove your masks."

:

01:23:40,646 --> 01:23:45,665

Oh, oh, made everyone sick,

coming out of there gagging,

:

01:23:45,735 --> 01:23:48,326

puking, holding their stomachs.

:

01:23:48,766 --> 01:23:51,355

Again, part of the breakdown and buildup.

:

01:23:52,875 --> 01:23:54,856

You know, that this is

part of the exercise.

:

01:23:58,545 --> 01:23:59,515

I look back on it-

:

01:24:01,622 --> 01:24:05,372

Every once in a while and think, how

many of those guys didn't come back home?

:

01:24:07,566 --> 01:24:08,246

A lot of them.

:

01:24:10,206 --> 01:24:14,076

I've been to the, the wall in

DC a few times, and I looked at

:

01:24:14,076 --> 01:24:20,526

that year, the:

part of it, mid part of it.

:

01:24:21,575 --> 01:24:28,366

Probably November, 'cause we were gonna

be getting our final orders in November,

:

01:24:28,366 --> 01:24:29,526

and I'll get to that in a moment.

:

01:24:29,526 --> 01:24:31,925

But November, December of that year.

:

01:24:35,715 --> 01:24:38,005

Um, Basic taught me a lot of things.

:

01:24:39,365 --> 01:24:40,705

Who you can trust, who you can't.

:

01:24:42,025 --> 01:24:46,925

I can remember buying a, uh, record player

in the commissary, which I was surprised

:

01:24:46,925 --> 01:24:49,845

I was allowed to keep, but the drill

sergeant didn't say I couldn't have it.

:

01:24:50,675 --> 01:24:56,215

And there was an album that

came out, Simon & Garfunkel,

:

01:24:56,455 --> 01:24:57,855

"Bridge Over Troubled Water."

:

01:25:02,126 --> 01:25:04,236

It, it, it, it basically became…

:

01:25:05,076 --> 01:25:07,236

And then War was the other song.

:

01:25:08,076 --> 01:25:09,796

I can't think of the name

of the artist right now.

:

01:25:10,296 --> 01:25:11,526

I can hear the song in my head

:

01:25:19,200 --> 01:25:21,190

I have for the last

:

01:25:24,410 --> 01:25:27,639

66 years, 56 years?

:

01:25:28,219 --> 01:25:32,950

56 years, carried guilt that

:

01:25:35,788 --> 01:25:37,918

I was spared going to Vietnam

:

01:25:40,314 --> 01:25:41,404

It occurred by a fluke.

:

01:25:42,424 --> 01:25:46,264

Um, I was in-- I had gotten

through basic training.

:

01:25:46,264 --> 01:25:47,644

My drill sergeant said, "You're here.

:

01:25:48,624 --> 01:25:50,054

You know, nothing we can do about it."

:

01:25:50,254 --> 01:25:52,204

So I ended up going to

leadership training school.

:

01:25:52,224 --> 01:25:54,844

So I did that for two or three

weeks, did leadership training

:

01:25:55,254 --> 01:25:56,374

'cause I had those qualities.

:

01:25:56,374 --> 01:26:00,904

So I got my advancement, became an

E2 or E1 or whatever the hell it was.

:

01:26:03,563 --> 01:26:07,563

So I had already gotten a promotion

and I was in my AIT, advanced infantry

:

01:26:07,563 --> 01:26:09,343

training for being a company clerk

:

01:26:11,914 --> 01:26:12,504

And, uh

:

01:26:14,830 --> 01:26:16,000

This was probably

:

01:26:19,382 --> 01:26:20,232

late October

:

01:26:23,566 --> 01:26:26,005

And I went to the eye doctor

and said, "Look, these glasses

:

01:26:26,005 --> 01:26:27,726

just are not focusing well.

:

01:26:27,726 --> 01:26:30,175

Can you just check my eyes

and see if I need to get a

:

01:26:30,175 --> 01:26:32,106

new prescription for reading?"

:

01:26:32,106 --> 01:26:35,936

'Cause I was doing a lot of

reading stuff, reports and stuff.

:

01:26:36,116 --> 01:26:36,646

He said, "Sure."

:

01:26:37,215 --> 01:26:38,536

So he gives me the eye test.

:

01:26:38,536 --> 01:26:39,495

He says, "Cover your eye."

:

01:26:39,566 --> 01:26:40,696

So I cover my left eye.

:

01:26:40,705 --> 01:26:42,236

He says, "Okay, what do you

see out of that right eye?"

:

01:26:42,246 --> 01:26:43,135

I go, "Nothing."

:

01:26:44,545 --> 01:26:44,876

"Huh?"

:

01:26:46,246 --> 01:26:46,666

"Nothing."

:

01:26:46,675 --> 01:26:48,846

He says, "Cover your right eye."

:

01:26:48,896 --> 01:26:49,295

"Okay."

:

01:26:50,045 --> 01:26:51,015

"What do you see with your left eye?"

:

01:26:51,105 --> 01:26:51,945

"I'm reading the board."

:

01:26:52,396 --> 01:26:52,776

"Perfect.

:

01:26:53,806 --> 01:26:55,135

No, no vision impairment."

:

01:26:56,075 --> 01:26:56,545

"Okay."

:

01:26:57,075 --> 01:26:57,665

"Cover your right…

:

01:26:57,715 --> 01:26:58,326

left eye.

:

01:26:58,785 --> 01:26:59,686

Read with your right eye."

:

01:26:59,934 --> 01:27:00,765

"Can't see shit."

:

01:27:01,985 --> 01:27:03,056

He says, "What are you doing here?"

:

01:27:03,056 --> 01:27:04,235

I said, "You drafted me."

:

01:27:05,746 --> 01:27:07,125

So I brought another doctor in.

:

01:27:08,715 --> 01:27:09,775

They both looked at me

:

01:27:12,010 --> 01:27:15,870

I said, "I'm sorry, but

I was born this way.

:

01:27:15,889 --> 01:27:19,650

Well, not born blind this way, but I was,

I was injured during bir- after birth."

:

01:27:20,420 --> 01:27:22,010

He goes, "How did you get here?"

:

01:27:22,210 --> 01:27:23,420

I said, "You drafted me.

:

01:27:23,970 --> 01:27:26,439

Not you particularly,

but the Army drafted me."

:

01:27:27,349 --> 01:27:28,030

"And you're blind.

:

01:27:28,229 --> 01:27:29,289

What about during basic?"

:

01:27:30,019 --> 01:27:31,700

"Drill sergeant said, 'Cope with it.'

:

01:27:31,989 --> 01:27:32,409

I did.

:

01:27:32,460 --> 01:27:33,699

Leadership, cope with it.

:

01:27:34,200 --> 01:27:34,800

Here I am."

:

01:27:35,829 --> 01:27:37,670

So the two doctors came back

:

01:27:40,693 --> 01:27:44,344

And in that interim, when I was working

as a company clerk and learning how to

:

01:27:44,344 --> 01:27:49,334

do my job, we were, you know, typing

orders for other guys to go to Vietnam.

:

01:27:49,334 --> 01:27:54,202

And I knew what it meant when

you saw RVN in a letter in red.

:

01:27:54,654 --> 01:27:56,103

It meant Republic of Vietnam

:

01:28:00,938 --> 01:28:05,857

I was getting back to the barracks after

the doctor says, "We're gonna get you

:

01:28:05,857 --> 01:28:08,478

a discharge, an honorable discharge."

:

01:28:08,498 --> 01:28:10,107

And I said, "Okay."

:

01:28:11,288 --> 01:28:14,288

And he gave me three choices, and I

go, "I'll take door number three."

:

01:28:15,307 --> 01:28:16,208

He says, "Good choice."

:

01:28:17,648 --> 01:28:22,758

And, uh, came back to the barracks that

day, and Baker and I walk in, and on

:

01:28:22,758 --> 01:28:25,538

the floor were my orders for Vietnam

:

01:28:33,710 --> 01:28:40,340

It's taken me 50 plus years to get

over the fact that I was spared

:

01:28:44,718 --> 01:28:51,028

I, I don't know what my life's

mission is yet, but God was

:

01:28:51,028 --> 01:28:52,118

looking out for me on that day

:

01:28:55,214 --> 01:28:57,264

Because a lot of those

guys did not come back.

:

01:28:58,254 --> 01:29:02,773

Baker ended up going to West Point

on his assignment because of his MOS.

:

01:29:03,534 --> 01:29:04,913

I had orders for Vietnam.

:

01:29:06,004 --> 01:29:11,143

I look at that picture behind

me and wonder how many of

:

01:29:11,143 --> 01:29:12,454

those guys didn't come back.

:

01:29:14,083 --> 01:29:19,984

And I got out because I'm blind

in one eye, which I shouldn't have

:

01:29:19,993 --> 01:29:24,923

been there in the first place, but

when I decided to sign up and join,

:

01:29:24,923 --> 01:29:27,023

enlist, I'm gonna make the best of it.

:

01:29:27,714 --> 01:29:30,163

I wasn't gonna cop out like

a couple of my friends did.

:

01:29:30,164 --> 01:29:32,714

I had one friend that just

took off and went to Canada.

:

01:29:34,133 --> 01:29:36,853

Just disappeared one day when

we got the lottery numbers.

:

01:29:36,853 --> 01:29:40,293

We were watching it on TV and he goes,

"I'm outta here," and he disappeared

:

01:29:43,501 --> 01:29:45,462

I didn't think anything of

it because of my eyesight.

:

01:29:47,411 --> 01:29:48,962

So you gotta wonder sometimes

:

01:29:51,416 --> 01:29:52,476

Really deeply wonder

:

01:29:57,407 --> 01:29:59,358

Why on that day

:

01:30:04,910 --> 01:30:06,290

Did I go and see this doctor?

:

01:30:09,878 --> 01:30:14,758

And he basically said to me, "We're

gonna give you those three choices."

:

01:30:16,088 --> 01:30:19,237

And if you know the military, choices

are not always really good sometimes

:

01:30:26,168 --> 01:30:33,088

And I think that moment in time, my

life cycle, my destiny, my trajectory in

:

01:30:33,088 --> 01:30:34,918

life was totally and completely changed

:

01:30:37,240 --> 01:30:39,240

Here I am, just turned 76

:

01:30:41,556 --> 01:30:45,715

I'm still wondering out, wondering

what I'm supposed to do in life.

:

01:30:46,596 --> 01:30:48,106

I've had, you know, careers.

:

01:30:48,106 --> 01:30:51,476

I've had ups, I've had downs, I've had

starts, I've had finishes, I've had

:

01:30:51,476 --> 01:30:56,816

failures, I've had successes in both

my personal life and my business life

:

01:31:01,946 --> 01:31:05,596

Where, where do you go to find this out?

:

01:31:07,693 --> 01:31:09,034

You may never find out why.

:

01:31:09,094 --> 01:31:14,773

I mean, I'll, I'll, I'll, I'll, I won't

know until after I'm gone and I see

:

01:31:14,773 --> 01:31:20,324

my final tab, tab on the table and God

says, "This is, this is why this happened

:

01:31:24,174 --> 01:31:25,714

This is what you were supposed to do

:

01:31:28,280 --> 01:31:33,260

When I started this, this recording

a while back ago, God, it's been

:

01:31:33,520 --> 01:31:34,800

almost an hour and a half ago

:

01:31:37,875 --> 01:31:40,045

I had no idea where I was going with this.

:

01:31:41,465 --> 01:31:42,925

I mean, I had a general idea.

:

01:31:44,646 --> 01:31:47,635

Nothing script, just what's

coming out of my head.

:

01:31:48,766 --> 01:31:53,375

Memories, moments, events

that have an impact

:

01:31:55,693 --> 01:31:58,824

They all contributed to where I am today

:

01:32:01,976 --> 01:32:05,506

Like they say, you have some people

come in your life, some people leave

:

01:32:05,506 --> 01:32:07,506

your life, some people stay in your life

:

01:32:10,414 --> 01:32:16,614

There were some people that I met

at Fort Jackson who never came back.

:

01:32:17,664 --> 01:32:22,103

Some went home, some

others just disappeared.

:

01:32:23,184 --> 01:32:24,184

They just went AWOL.

:

01:32:24,393 --> 01:32:26,793

Seriously went AWOL, which

:

01:32:30,348 --> 01:32:34,657

I don't know if it's, if it's character,

if it's fear, or if it's just…

:

01:32:35,998 --> 01:32:36,468

I don't know.

:

01:32:38,508 --> 01:32:41,477

I knew that I, I could

not not do what I was

:

01:32:44,206 --> 01:32:44,956

thinking of doing.

:

01:32:45,456 --> 01:32:48,606

I knew I had a commitment to

make, and I made my commitment.

:

01:32:49,456 --> 01:32:52,726

I knew that I was gonna serve,

and I was gonna serve the

:

01:32:52,726 --> 01:32:54,746

best I could for what I had

:

01:33:05,206 --> 01:33:07,446

I didn't think I was gonna end

on this, but I'm gonna have to

:

01:33:07,446 --> 01:33:09,766

because every time I think about it

:

01:33:12,014 --> 01:33:13,184

It doesn't depress me.

:

01:33:13,644 --> 01:33:14,234

It hurts.

:

01:33:15,193 --> 01:33:21,734

It hurts very bad that there are

families that were never formed, that

:

01:33:21,734 --> 01:33:26,763

the guy who had a sweetheart back home

died, didn't have the chance to have a

:

01:33:26,764 --> 01:33:29,793

family, family, kids, you know, a life.

:

01:33:31,143 --> 01:33:33,594

I've been blessed with a lot

of opportunities in my life.

:

01:33:34,164 --> 01:33:40,273

I've had failure, I've had success,

you know, and, and I, I look back

:

01:33:40,273 --> 01:33:44,863

on some of it and think, "What's

the real purpose I'm here?"

:

01:33:45,744 --> 01:33:49,823

I, I'm, I'm still ch- I'm still asking

that question now as I, as I'm doing this.

:

01:33:49,834 --> 01:33:51,463

Why am I still here?

:

01:33:52,854 --> 01:33:54,144

I'm 76 years old.

:

01:33:55,663 --> 01:33:57,063

I still got most of my marbles.

:

01:33:57,063 --> 01:33:58,464

I haven't lost any of them yet.

:

01:33:59,483 --> 01:34:04,133

I know that at some point in my, my

life, this stuff will be forgotten.

:

01:34:04,133 --> 01:34:07,133

I won't remember it,

most of it, if any of it.

:

01:34:07,514 --> 01:34:10,633

That's why I'm recording a lot

of this stuff, not for, not for

:

01:34:11,643 --> 01:34:14,324

posterity or for any ego thing.

:

01:34:15,153 --> 01:34:19,494

It gives me time to really, really

spend time thinking about what's

:

01:34:19,494 --> 01:34:21,073

most important to me right now

:

01:34:26,478 --> 01:34:31,818

I, I, I've made mistakes just like

everyone else has, and, and my goal is

:

01:34:31,818 --> 01:34:33,928

to, to atone for a lot of those mistakes.

:

01:34:34,318 --> 01:34:39,208

You can't, you can't undo, you know,

the things that you screwed up on.

:

01:34:39,918 --> 01:34:49,677

But what you can do is let people know

that you're there for them and that if

:

01:34:49,677 --> 01:34:56,218

you can make their lives a little bit

easier, um, that's one of my goals.

:

01:34:57,388 --> 01:35:02,967

Um, and I'll talk about that

part when I get into the:

:

01:35:03,437 --> 01:35:04,688

The next one's the '80s.

:

01:35:05,627 --> 01:35:14,897

This was the, uh, the '50s,

s, up to:

:

01:35:17,922 --> 01:35:18,742

56 years ago

:

01:35:23,563 --> 01:35:29,584

Well, thank you for, um,

listening and, um, I hope that

:

01:35:32,462 --> 01:35:33,712

You have a peaceful life.

:

01:35:35,012 --> 01:35:35,642

Peace be with you

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