Shownotes
The discourse presented in this episode centers on the evolving landscape of golf, particularly the nascent concept of indoor golf events, such as the TGL. I contend that while the technology underpinning these ventures is advancing, it has yet to attain the level of authenticity requisite to be considered genuine golf. The discussion further delves into the innovations emerging from Clarity Dot Golf, which specializes in simulator technology that seeks to replicate the true essence of the game through immersive experiences. I express my skepticism regarding the current state of indoor events, noting the challenges of latency and the disjointed nature of the experience. The conversation culminates in a broader contemplation of the golf industry's future, including the controversial topic of equipment regulation and the potential rollback of golf ball technology.
Links referenced in this episode:
- clarity.golf
- markavas.coach
- sevenfeatherscasino.com
- bbking.com
- tpc.com
- zenstage.com
- tgl.com
- cornferrytour.com
- pga.com
Companies mentioned in this episode:
- Clarity Dot Golf
- TGL
- Zen stage
- platform golf
- Callaway
- Titleist
- Srixon
- Korn Ferry
- Tom White's golf design
This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:
OP3 - https://op3.dev/privacy
Transcripts
Welcome to Grilling at the Green After Hours.
Speaker A:The conversation that took place after the show ended.
Speaker B:Welcome back to Grilling at the Green.
Speaker B:I'm JT and it is the famous after hours segment.
Speaker B:And today we've got Dave Busby Bisbee.
Speaker B:Excuse me from back on course.
Speaker B:It's funny because we, you have seven canyons, we have seven feathers up here, down the, down the freeway.
Speaker B:It's a casino resort and I think they built a golf course there too.
Speaker B:So I gave you a little warm up to after hours before the show.
Speaker B:Okay.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker B:And don't be nervous.
Speaker B:You look like you're, you're pensive there.
Speaker A:I'm just, I'm just a little, you know, it's a game I want to win.
Speaker B:Okay.
Speaker B:All right, we're keeping score and I'll give you an easy one because we just talked about it at the end of the regular show.
Speaker B:Is there a place for indoor events like TGL to be considered real golf?
Speaker B:This is about the toughest golf question, Dave.
Speaker A:Not, not yet, but it's coming.
Speaker A:I think.
Speaker A:One of the companies I'm working with, Clarity Dot Golf, is in the simulator business, but they're also in the associated technology end of that.
Speaker A:We just built a Sim 4 accessing house called the Markavas Coach in his Burbank studio.
Speaker A:And we call it a surround sim.
Speaker A:And it's literally the, the, you are in this, in the scene and it completely envelops you.
Speaker A:And then, and that, that gives you like if you were doing the 16th bullet at TPC Scottsdale during the Phoenix Open, it gives you the real feel of that.
Speaker A:And then all of the things that are happening now with like Zen stage and platform golf, where the lie changes, you know, you're not just always hitting off of a flat mat into a flat screen.
Speaker B:Sure.
Speaker A:And.
Speaker A:But tgl, boy, they've got a ways to go to get the technology where one, there's less latency.
Speaker A:Like now when they hit a shot, you know, you hit the shot, it hits the screen.
Speaker A:There's the delay of the ball coming up on there.
Speaker A:It, it just feels a little disjointed at all.
Speaker A:I think this second edition is better than the first go around.
Speaker B:I like their, I like their putting greens, though.
Speaker B:I mean that.
Speaker B:Because they calculate those greens and all that.
Speaker B:That's good stuff.
Speaker A:Yeah, I mean that's, that is really cool.
Speaker A:And that, that's part of what, what we're incorporating into these, the clarity sims, is that ecological, ecological dynamics.
Speaker A:It's the ability to create the actual, like you hit a drive on a hole that's rendered in the sim.
Speaker A:When you go to the next shot, the lie changes, the platform changes to fit the actual lie for that next shot on that hole.
Speaker A:And you.
Speaker A:You execute that shot, and then it changes again.
Speaker A:That.
Speaker A:That is some of the really cool stuff that is happening, but, God, I mean, building stages, you know, building those kinds of.
Speaker A:Of stadiums around.
Speaker A:I don't know that anybody's lining up for that yet.
Speaker A:It seems like everything's going to have to happen at that TGL site in Florida.
Speaker B:Sure, sure, sure.
Speaker B:You've traveled a lot, a lot.
Speaker B:And name one place when you're traveling like you just came from the PGA show.
Speaker B:What's one place in Orlando you always look forward to going when you're there?
Speaker B:And I don't mean the convention center.
Speaker A:Well, there is a place I like to go every year, but this year it was not there anymore.
Speaker A:And it's B.B.
Speaker A:king's House of Blues.
Speaker B:Oh, but something happened to it to get wiped down.
Speaker A:Nope.
Speaker A:Closed.
Speaker A:It's gone.
Speaker A:And they.
Speaker A:Their house band.
Speaker A:I'm a. I like blues.
Speaker A:Yeah, yeah, Their house.
Speaker A:Their house band.
Speaker A:I would, I'd.
Speaker A:I'd pick pay to go see a concert, by the way, but they've been really, really good.
Speaker A:And unfortunately, it's closed.
Speaker A:Oh, didn't.
Speaker B:Didn't.
Speaker B:Didn't know that.
Speaker B:Name one thing that you wish spectators at pro tournaments, men or women, would not do.
Speaker B:What's one thing that spec.
Speaker B:You wish spectators would not do?
Speaker A:I'm a little of a.
Speaker A:Of a traditionalist, but, you know, the, the babalooy or mashed potatoes they come out with and somebody hits a shot.
Speaker A:Yeah, I wish they wouldn't do that.
Speaker B:You know what we.
Speaker B:I think we could maybe cure that is if we saw, actually saw the guy in the crowd that usually yells mashed potatoes, go get a big bowl of mashed potatoes and gravy.
Speaker B:When he yells it, just dump it on his head.
Speaker A:Dump it on his head.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:I think you may be onto something there.
Speaker A:I'm gonna make some mashed potatoes and gravy and go to the Phoenix Open and see if I can't find that guy.
Speaker B:Yeah, if he can get in.
Speaker B:If he can get in the crowd with not getting mugged and somebody trying to eat it after 35 years.
Speaker B:Yeah, there you go.
Speaker B:Name a player, Dave, that you think is underrated.
Speaker B:Can be any tour, any, any, any place.
Speaker A:Underrated.
Speaker A:Carl Villips on the PG tour.
Speaker B:Okay, and why is that?
Speaker A:Has all the skills and is maturing into a really good player with just a couple of other little tweaks.
Speaker A:But when.
Speaker A:And when you think about the depth of the tour, the talent there.
Speaker A:Korn Ferry.
Speaker A:And it's amazing.
Speaker A:We had one of the guys that was a Corn Ferry graduate onto the PGA Tour last year.
Speaker A:We had him up at the club at seven canyons.
Speaker A:It's probably been about three months ago now.
Speaker A:Our course record forever has been 61, par 71.
Speaker A:Golf course.
Speaker A:This kid went around that golf course, and it's not an easy golf course.
Speaker A:And Tom White's golf design.
Speaker A:Tight, really challenging greens complexes and all that.
Speaker A:He shot 56.
Speaker B:56.
Speaker A:56.
Speaker A:Whoa.
Speaker A:And.
Speaker A:And then went out two weeks after that to play in one of his first or ferry event.
Speaker A:I missed the cut.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:I mean, they're just.
Speaker A:There are the.
Speaker A:There are so much talent and.
Speaker A:And, you know, the college players are.
Speaker A:Are.
Speaker A:They come right out.
Speaker A:They're ready to.
Speaker A:Ready to go.
Speaker B:Well, that high school kid last week.
Speaker A:Well, Blades Brown.
Speaker A:I mean, I would have said he's underrated, but he's not underrated because everybody had really high expectations, and he's getting a lot of.
Speaker A:But Carl Phillips, that's my.
Speaker A:That's my pick.
Speaker B:Okay.
Speaker B:All right.
Speaker B:Here's the tough one.
Speaker B:What's your favorite colored lightsaber?
Speaker A:Green.
Speaker B:Good man.
Speaker B:I love that.
Speaker A:Yep.
Speaker A:Green.
Speaker B:Hold on a second here.
Speaker B:Actually, I have a roll of lifesavers in my little drawer here.
Speaker B:I was going to hold it up, but.
Speaker B:Yeah, it's like that.
Speaker B:This kind of.
Speaker B:What's.
Speaker B:Well, we'll go with this one here.
Speaker B:What's the first thing you reach for, Dave, when you're done with a round of golf?
Speaker A:The first thing I reach for is my valuables, My little bag that I'm gonna dump everything in my pocket into and get the stuff out of it that I put in there before the round.
Speaker B:There you go.
Speaker B:What is.
Speaker B:Name a song that you want to hear on the radio first thing in the morning when you start your car.
Speaker A:Rural Revival.
Speaker A:Which is.
Speaker A:It's a.
Speaker A:It's a bit of a blues.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Thing.
Speaker A:But Eric Clapton and.
Speaker A:And the.
Speaker A:And the Crusaders.
Speaker A:Yep.
Speaker A:And the Crusaders.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:If Dave Bisby was declared supreme ruler of golf for a day, what would you decree as supreme ruler?
Speaker A:Stop this insanity about the golf ball rollback.
Speaker B:I'm with you.
Speaker A:I would.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Just don't do it.
Speaker A:And.
Speaker A:Yeah, it would not.
Speaker A:That would be pulled out of.
Speaker A:The things to think about for golf is we don't need to roll back the distance.
Speaker B:So I've got a cynical question for you then.
Speaker B:Do you think that there's been so much done about that and of course they've done all their testing and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
Speaker B:Here's my cynical opinion.
Speaker B:I think that the RNA and the pga, not the Tour, but the other side.
Speaker B:I kind of get this feeling that they're doing it to kind of stay relevant on some things, you know, and I'm not, I'm not being mean to them, I'm not slamming them, but if you look at that, it's such a small percentage of guys that can hit it, you know, 5,700 yards with a putter.
Speaker B:You know what I mean?
Speaker B:It's not.
Speaker B:Why monkey with an entire industry, amateurs and pros, for a thousand guys and gals, you know, why do that?
Speaker B:It's such a small percentage.
Speaker B:It's not.
Speaker A:Well, it's not even, it's not even a thousand.
Speaker A:Yeah, it's a, it's, it's a, it's a 10% of the 0.5% of the players that are the Tour type players.
Speaker B:Yeah, I, I just don't understand that.
Speaker B:And there's been a lot of time and a lot of money spent on it.
Speaker B:And, and it's, and from the business.
Speaker B:We've been talking a lot about golf business in today's shows.
Speaker B:Do you think Callaway and Titleist and Srixon and all those guys are going to recalibrate all their balls to do that?
Speaker B:I. I don't see that happening.
Speaker A:No, no, it.
Speaker A:Well, it's a big ask.
Speaker A:And when they first started talking about it, I was like, you know, this is a, this is a solution in search of a problem.
Speaker A:There, There just isn't a.
Speaker A:There's no reason to, to do that if they're much easier things to do.
Speaker A:Bring the rough lines in, throw the rough taller.
Speaker B:Yep.
Speaker A:Change the bunkering on those courses where bunkers are further away.
Speaker A:You can't vomit over those things.
Speaker A:There's so much more that can be done to.
Speaker A:And, and I think, again, for the usga, I think they're, they always want to preserve par as the.
Speaker B:You know, I'm sorry, I misspoke.
Speaker B:I said pga.
Speaker B:I meant us.
Speaker A:Yeah, us.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:I mean, they're, they're always, they always want to preserve par.
Speaker A:That, you know, their goal of at the US Open is par wins it.
Speaker A:And, and when you look at.
Speaker A:When they prep a golf course for the US Open.
Speaker A:Yeah, it's, yeah, it's, it's, it's a, it's A different test.
Speaker A:And it shows what.
Speaker A:What you could do just with the golf courses.
Speaker A:But I also.
Speaker A:I mean, it's like going to the Indianapolis 500 and.
Speaker A:And watching somebody drive 55 miles an hour and around.
Speaker A:It just takes.
Speaker A:Nobody wants to see that.
Speaker B:No.
Speaker B:You know, like you said.
Speaker B:I'll paraphrase it here.
Speaker B:There's a lot they could do with a shovel and some grass seed and not try to flub up an entire industry.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And, you know, I need all the distance I can get.
Speaker A:Sure.
Speaker B:You know, it just.
Speaker B:I. I do.
Speaker B:You know.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:And I.
Speaker B:There's times I need to hit with the low spin ball.
Speaker B:There's times I need to, depending on the time of year up here, my normal game.
Speaker B:But anyway, I digress.
Speaker B:One of the questions was, do you have a favorite golf book?
Speaker B:But you wrote one of the great golf books, so I'll pass on that.
Speaker B:If we put your skills to music, what would the music be?
Speaker B:Now, I know you love blues.
Speaker A:Mm.
Speaker B:What would the actual music be if.
Speaker B:If it was a soundtrack in the Dave Bisbee movie?
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Well, it.
Speaker A:It would be.
Speaker A:It wouldn't be a slow dance, for sure.
Speaker A:Yeah, it would be very upbeat.
Speaker A:And.
Speaker A:And if you looked at the playlist on my.
Speaker A:On my phone there, I don't know.
Speaker A:I don't think that there's one song on there that doesn't have a really solid backbeat rhythm thing to it.
Speaker A:It's.
Speaker A:It's all rhythm blues and blues.
Speaker B:Okay.
Speaker B:Yeah, I. I get it.
Speaker B:Who was the biggest influence on you personally in your life?
Speaker A:Oh, that's a good one.
Speaker A:Well, my mother is who started me playing grow.
Speaker A:Growing up.
Speaker A:My dad was out of the picture when I was 4.
Speaker A:Mother was a really good amateur player, and for her to be able to practice, she used to have to take me along.
Speaker A:And the.
Speaker A:The pro there cut down a club for me to distract me, to give me something to do so she could actually get some practice in.
Speaker A:That was it.
Speaker A:And then the second was.
Speaker A:Is Arnold Palmer.
Speaker A:So I'm from Hutchinson, Kansas, which is a little town that if.
Speaker A:If Prairie Dunes wasn't there, if that golf course wasn't there, it would be just a little town in Farmington in Kansas.
Speaker A:But we had Arnold Palmer and Jack Nicklaus play a exhibition, and it was wild.
Speaker A:Nicholas was still a amateur.
Speaker A:He.
Speaker A:He had played, I think, in a Trans Miss event there or something.
Speaker A:Arnold was Arnold.
Speaker A:He was the king.
Speaker A:So they played this exhibition.
Speaker A:I got to go and I got to go into the locker.
Speaker A:I thought Arnold Palmer was the Coolest human being on the planet.
Speaker A:Got to go in the locker room afterwards as a six year old kid and have him sign, he signed a ball and he signed a glove.
Speaker A:And he asked me, he said, son, are you a golfer?
Speaker A:And I said, yes, sir, I am.
Speaker A:And one day I'm going to be a golf professional.
Speaker A:And he said, good for you.
Speaker A:And he rubbed me on the head and said, keep after it.
Speaker A:And I went to, I went to school later that week and they had like, you know, one of those little pre career day things that you have in first grade or something like that and, and you could go sit with a doctor or a fireman or that.
Speaker A:And I didn't want to go do anything.
Speaker A:And they asked me, well, why, why don't you want to go to.
Speaker A:And I said, because I'm going to be a golf pro.
Speaker A:And they were like, well, we don't have one.
Speaker A:So they called my mother who called the pro at our local muni, Harold Hoffman.
Speaker A:And Harold came to the school and sat with me and I told him I wanted to be a golf pro.
Speaker A:I started working at that golf course when I was 12 and, and the rest is history.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Yeah, I love that.
Speaker B:I love that story.
Speaker B:Just a couple left here, Dave.
Speaker B:What's the dumbest thing you've ever seen done on a golf course?
Speaker B:I'm sure you've seen a lot at this point.
Speaker A:Yeah, I mean like, is this for adult audiences or is it anything.
Speaker B:First thing that comes to your mind is the dumbest thing you ever saw on a golf cart.
Speaker B:Golf course.
Speaker A:Excuse me?
Speaker A:Well, I, I would say that the, the dumbest thing I've, I've ever seen on a golf course was a, a couple who thought that, that they would go and make love on one of the greens at course, you know, like at midnight, not thinking or considering that there would be a night Waterman on the, on the course.
Speaker A:And as the night Waterman dragging hoses and everything, you know, it's dark and he gets the quick coupler, turns the sprinklers on and here's these people screaming and then they all, they ran away, left their clothes there and.
Speaker A:Which I don't even know if they ever came back and claimed their clothes.
Speaker A:But that, that is the stupidest thing I've ever, I've ever seen.
Speaker B:Oh my God.
Speaker B:You know, when you were telling that story, I had this picture of Bill Murray and caddy check.
Speaker B:Yeah, Dragon hose type thing.
Speaker A:Yeah, yeah, exactly.
Speaker B:Spangler going up there.
Speaker A:Charles Spangler.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Okay, last question, Dave.
Speaker B:If I gave you a box with everything you've lost in your life was in that box.
Speaker B:What would be the first thing you reached for?
Speaker A:Everything I've lost, I would say that it is a.
Speaker A:A watch that I got as a prize for winning a golf tournament.
Speaker A:And, and it was a really cool watch.
Speaker A:And I, after the tournament was over and everything was done, I, you know, went to the bar, had a few beers, got in my car, drove away.
Speaker A:Didn't really think about it until almost a week later.
Speaker A:It was like, where did that watch go and never to be seen again?
Speaker B:Oh, my.
Speaker A:The.
Speaker A:The guy at the bar.
Speaker A:No idea.
Speaker A:Well, yeah, not that he was wearing the watch when he said it, but yeah, it would be.
Speaker A:It would be that watch because it was one of the coolest prizes.
Speaker A:There you go.
Speaker A:I'd ever won.
Speaker B:There you go.
Speaker B:Dave Bisby, former director and general manager at seven Canyons in Sedona, co author of Back on the Course.
Speaker B:Recommend the book.
Speaker B:Recommend follow up with Dave.
Speaker B:I'm sure he'll reach out to you or respond to you if you have questions about utilizing golf for business and stuff.
Speaker B:Dave, thank you.
Speaker B:I really appreciate your time.
Speaker A:Yeah, my pleasure.
Speaker A:This was awesome.
Speaker B:No problem.
Speaker B:We'll be back next week with another edition of After Hours.
Speaker B:Until then, like I always say, go out, play some golf, have some fun.
Speaker B:But most of all, be kind.
Speaker B:Take care, everybody.
