When it comes to Tax Prep versus Tax Planning? Hands down, planning is king!

Host Josh Bretl, founder of FSR Wealth, is showing us the difference between putting together the info we need to file our taxes (always a short-term nuisance!) and positioning ourselves to minimize what we actually owe when April 15th rolls around (a long-term proposition).

As you’ll learn on this episode of Retirement Equals Freedom, whatever stage of life you’re in – from raising young kids to enjoying those golden years – there are important tax implications. It’s about creating a proactive (and tax efficient!) strategy for investing, drawing down and managing your assets all along the way.

Find out how IRAs, 529s, HSAs, RMDs, 401ks – the whole alphabet soup – are part of a holistic, tax-savvy vision for your abundant future!

The show wraps with a quick-fire round of – you asked for it! – “Get to know Josh and Dave” (with apologies to Dave’s mother and Bambi) as well as a DR2R that is more deep dish (pizza) than deep thoughts.

Speaking of deep thoughts, some of the subject matter we tackle can get pretty complex. If you’re wondering whether now is the time to consider hiring a professional, don’t miss our next episode! Josh will be running down the list of things to look for in a qualified financial planner.

Episode Extras

• Check out Jerry Palotta’s popular series of kids’ books, "Who Would Win?" 
• Interested in trying DIY tax prep? TurboTax and H&R Block are two of the biggies.
• Click here if you would like to learn more about the Schmidt family vacation spot: Door County, Wisconsin.
• R=F's new private Facebook group. Come hang out!

Did you know you’re just one click away from a pod link resource with all the latest and greatest about Retirement Equals Freedom? Click here.

If you haven’t already, please sign up for all the news you can use (+ lots of fun) at this link for the Retirement Equals Freedom podcast newsletter. You might also want to join the conversation at our private Facebook group, which you’ll find here.

Click here to explore the services that FSR Wealth Strategies offers and schedule a discovery call with Josh. When it comes to living your best life, it’s never too early to get started! 

Tax planning is a proactive approach to managing

taxes or the tax liability.

Instead of just waiting for tax season, you're taking

the bull by the horns.

It allows you to take steps throughout the year

to minimize your taxes that you know are coming.

And it may not be just for this year, but it could be

for the rest of your life.

And especially for retirees, now is a great time to do that.

Tax preparation is all you're doing is taking whatever

you did in the prior year and reporting it to the IRS.

When it comes to tax prep versus tax

planning, who will win?

Ah, simple hands down tax planning.

Your host Josh, is showing us a difference in collecting

all the information we need to file our taxes every year,

which is a short term nuisance, and positioning ourselves

to minimize what we actually owe come April 15th, which

is a long-term proposition.

As we've mentioned hundreds of times in this show, it

comes down to you creating a proactive strategy.

Specifically in this episode, we're talking about a

strategy around investing, drawing down, and managing

all of those assets.

Find out how IRAs, and 529s, and HSAs, and 401ks, and

the entire alphabet soup, are part of a holistic tax

savvy vision of your future.

We go pretty deep in this episode, and sometimes

things get a little complex, but don't worry.

As always, we end on a light and fluffy note.

This time you'll hear all about how my, uh, pizza

ordering skills can come in real handy at your next party.

This is The Retirement Equals Freedom Podcast.

Your host, Josh Bretl, is the owner of FSR Wealth Strategies.

And Josh for the last 20 plus years, has been helping

fine folks like you, gain the confidence to make retirement

the best part of your life.

And me.

Who the heck am I?

Ah, thanks for asking.

I'm Dave.

Josh's longtime friend, co-host of the show, and a huge fan

of the new Macadamia Nut Cream Cold Brew at Starbucks.

Oh man, it's delicious.

All right.

All right.

Yeah, I've been talking long enough.

I get it.

So now let me let you let me, end this introduction

so we can talk about tax prep versus tax planning.

FSR Wealth Management is a registered investment advisor

located in Elmhurst, Illinois.

Information and opinions contained in this audio

have been arrived at by FSR Wealth advisors.

All information herein is for informational purposes

and should not be construed as investment advice.

It does not constitute an offer, a solicitation or recommendation

to purchase any security.

FSR is not providing legal, tax, accounting, or financial

planning advice in this audio.

These views are as of the date of this publication

and are subject to change.

Rolling with the coffee.

When is the new Smartless...

not live, but-

The-

Documentary.

The documentary?

Yeah.

I think it's coming out soon.

It's getting released May 23rd.

It's the same day they're announcing it it's no longer

HBO Max, it's just Max.

And that's their first headlining show.

Well, that's kind of cool.

Yeah, I'm pumped.

Missy and I have gotten into

documentaries recently.

We don't watch much TV or anything really.

Yeah, right.

And you make fun of us.

Cooking shows.

We've watched cooking shows, a lot of them.

Competition cooking shows.

But documentaries are something we've gotten into.

We've watched some fun ones.

And I'm not an artsy person, as you know.

You were the artsy one in our relationship.

Rumor has it.

But we've enjoyed...

So we've watched Britney Spears, and we've

watched the Billy Eilish documentary's outstanding.

But the Lady Gaga documentary is out-of-this-world good.

Why?

What sets that apart?

I feel like it really gets into her

life in a very authentic way because I think she

has such an amazing voice.

Unlike you and I, who sound like we're dragging our

vocal cords through gravel-

this is where I say, "Speak for

yourself," but carry on.

But her voice is so incredible, but I feel

like she does such weird, awkward things at awards shows,

that meat dress and stuff.

But it really puts her in perspective.

It really opens you up into seeing her point of

view and her everything.

I really enjoyed it.

In fact, Missy and I have said that one of the things

on our bucket list is to see a live concert of hers.

We've yet to do it.

She's a gem.

I've always loved the Gags.

Did you learn her real name?

I'm sure I did, but I don't remember it.

What's her real name?

I don't know.

I was asking you.

But yeah, you guys are watching documentaries while

sipping on wine and having some cheese snacks and stuff.

Carla and I watch documentaries, I'm having a

bowl of cereal and whatever.

You had a big weekend.

Your wife left you for the weekend.

Yeah, she likes to abandon us.

And...

Well, if you listen to any of our episodes,

you kind of get why.

I'm kind of annoying.

But yeah, she headed down to Lake Ozarks with some

buddies, and so it was boys weekend for Landon and I.

You don't have that very often.

We don't, and it was awesome.

Now, you have three kids of your own, and I think you can

attest to this - parenting is just a lot simpler when

it's just dad and the kids.

Oh, my wife and I talk about this all the time.

You subtract one person from the equation, it doesn't

matter which one person, her or I, or even one of

the children, and all of a sudden you're like, "God, this

You kind of had a miserable weather weekend.

He's such an athlete, loves to be outside

and do all that stuff.

It was so miserable, you probably just wanted

to hang out inside.

We found time.

As soon as it cleared up on Saturday, him and I went out and

shot basketball for 30 minutes.

He smoked me in Pig twice 'cause he's legit good.

He played baseball through the hail on Sunday.

It was hail, and it was sunny and rain and windy; then sunny.

And he was up to bat right when he started hailing.

And we all looked at the umpire, who was a high school kid.

We're like, "Don't you dare cancel this."

And Landon got a hit through the hail.

It was so impressive.

He was not phased at all.

That's pretty cool.

It was cool.

Saturday here rained from 10:30 through one o'clock.

And it was a miserable, cold, 40 degree rain.

It was awful.

Oh, it's beautiful.

I was outside at soccer fields the entire time.

And from 12 to one I was coaching, so I couldn't have

an umbrella or anything.

And I'm running up and on the field.

It was the worst soccer experience.

In fact, if I can find the picture, one of our teammate's

moms took a picture of Alex and I in the frame together.

And we're on the field, and it looks like a dripping

wet Sasquatch, and Alex just looks miserable.

It was pretty wet and cold.

Dave Schmidt:

That's wet and cold.

Dave Schmidt:

You know what can also be wet and cold?

The snout of a golden retriever.

Yeah, that's actually true.

We have a goldendoodle, but I'll give you...

You've had golden retrievers growing up, so-

mm-hmm.

A podcast that is inspired by the

kids' books, Who Would Win?

or Who Will Win?

And Landon has about 30 of these on his bookshelves.

I think we have the same, in fact, last weekend I

did read Ultimate Bug Rumble.

Yes.

Who Would Win?

And for those of you that haven't been able to read

children's books in the last few years, these Who Would Win?

Series is hot.

And what they do is they take animals that are out

there, and they say, "If they fought, who would win?"

And they'd take a few of them.

So there's some in-depth ones.

They'd be like, "Tiger versus Lion."

And they would talk about the tiger, and they'd talk

about the lion, and the last few pages they'd make them

fight, and they'd come up with a hypothetical outcome.

But then as they've advanced, they now have tournament

style where, "There'll be like four rounds of 16 animals

come in, who's going to win?"

And it was the final one was hornet versus...

I don't remember who it was, but hornet wins.

I know Hornet won the whole thing.

They're great.

And it's funny, because usually an animal or a bug

ends up dying at the end, but it's not gruesome.

And it's still teaching kids like, "Yeah, survival

of the fittest, man."

Yeah, and the kids freaking love it-

They do.

But they learn a lot about the bugs.

They'd be like, "Well, yeah, did you know that a bee will lose

its stinger in human skin, but a hornet will not because it

has a more flexible stinger."

It's just like now they're spouting this off of breakfast.

Oh, totally.

And there's one.

I can't remember which one it is.

I think it's scorpion versus tarantula.

And there's pictures of kids in Africa eating

buckets of fried scorpions.

And it grosses me out, and Landon knows this.

So I'll be randomly sitting there having snack, and

he'll run up and he'll shove the picture in my face.

And I'm like, "Man, you are just like me."

I would've so done that to my dad.

Totally.

So that being said, I am thrilled to see the title

of today's show, Josh.

And what are we doing here?

well, this one comes to us from Erin.

We finished tax season here in the office.

And we don't do tax returns for a lot of people anymore, but

we still do a few tax returns.

Hashtag tax nerd.

Yeah, 'cause taxes are important.

And so the whole season it kind of wrapped up, and

everyone's thinking about taxes.

And she says to me, and she goes, "You know what?

Your next podcast should do on the importance of tax

planning versus tax preparation.

What's more important?"

And I said, "Well, that sounds like a Who Would Win?

Book Scorpion versus Tarantula?

That's how it happened?

Yeah.

That's how it came about.

It was.

Tax planning versus tax preparation 'cause she has a

kid the same age as our kids.

But no, it was Erin's idea and the who would win concept of tax

planning versus tax preparation.

Everyone gets concerned about tax preparation.

Now, let me define what these two things are.

Tax preparation is what happens in February, March and April.

So in January and early February, you start

getting all your documents.

You get your W2s and your 1099s and your 1098s and

all the fun stuff that looks really official.

Your 403[b]s.

Well, no.

No, no, no.

I'm just-

No.

First number I could come up with.

Yeah, well, same thing.

It's a code.

But you get these, and you either do it on TurboTax, or

you bring it to your accountant or H&R Block or somewhere,

and you go through this process, this annual ritual

of preparing your tax return.

It's a giant pain in the butt.

And People think this is hard to do.

And it is.

It's not the easiest thing, the IRS makes it complicated.

But that's tax preparation.

And what you're doing is you're taking the

prior year's information.

So we're in 2023, and in tax preparation, we were taking

all of the 2022 information, and we're reconciling it.

So we're saying, "Okay, here's your income, here's your

deductions, here's how much taxes you've already paid."

And then we compare that to what you owe.

Do you owe more, or do you get a refund?

That's the whole concept of tax preparation.

And it is important.

I'm not saying it's not important.

It is important.

But tax planning, on the other side, is things that

you do throughout the year.

There's things that you do to get ready for tax preparation.

It's to put yourself in a better scenario.

What we hear a lot is clients or people who come in, they'll

get really hung up on tax prep.

And they all they care about is, " God, it's such

a pain in the butt," or "Am I getting a refund?

Am I doing this or that?"

But they don't think about all the stuff that goes into it.

And I think a lot of it there are times are unaware of it or

they have no idea how to do it.

But this goes into our own your retirement planning

process where this is something that you can control,

this is something that you want to take control off.

I don't want to steal your thunder, but I want

to be proactive, not reactive.

Ooh.

Yeah.

Now, yes, Erin wrote that in the notes, but

I did catch on to that.

That's a lot about taking control and ownership, is

that proactive versus reactive.

Let's go through some of the notes that she wrote here.

So I just flipped over the back of my

piece of paper, and it has all my DR2R notes, and Josh

is trying to sneak a peak.

So I got to keep that private for later.

It's top secret stuff.

Top secret DR2R.

Yes.

Well, let's start with proactive versus reactive.

Please, please.

This is something that Erin put together here.

And tax planning is a proactive approach to managing

taxes or the tax liability.

And instead of just waiting for tax season, you're

taking the bull by the horns.

And it allows you to take steps throughout the year

to minimize your taxes that you know are coming.

And it may not be just for this year, but it could be

for the rest of your life.

And especially for retirees, now is a great time to do that.

So let me give you some examples of what they may be.

Tax loss harvesting.

We did a whole thing on the importance of recognizing

gains and watching gains and capital gains inside

of taxable accounts.

That's something you don't wait till the end of the year,

you do it throughout the year.

What you're going to do with RMDs, charitable gifting,

what you're going to do with Roth conversions, where

money's going to come from.

All of those things you can be proactive with as opposed to

waiting for the 1099 to come out and be like, "Oh man, I

got to pay so much in taxes."

It's a thoughtful, proactive approach.

And it really allows you to focus on minimizing taxes.

With a tax planning strategy, it allows you to identify

opportunities that you may not have realized just by

putting things in a TurboTax.

With a good plan as you're looking out five, 10 years from

now, right now you may not have RMDs, you may not have social

security, you may just be living off of something, and you have

a really simple tax return.

But by focusing on the long-term approach and looking at where

you stand today versus five years from now, it allows

you to do some planning to be very, very proactive there.

Tax planning can allow you to pay less for Medicare

with those Irma surcharges.

Tax planning can allow your social security to be tax-free.

Tax planning can allow you to take money out of your

401ks and IRAs cheaper.

Tax planning can do a whole bunch of things.

Tax preparation is all you're doing is taking whatever

you did in the prior year and reporting it to the IRS.

Let's talk about tax preparation for a little bit.

Tax preparation is becoming easier and easier to do, and

it's becoming more and more onerous on tax professionals.

So if you want to hire a tax professional right now, if you

want to hire a CPA to do your tax returns, it's becoming

harder and harder to find one.

The CPA profession is...

Not going to say it's a dying profession, but it kind

of is a dying profession.

The young people are not coming into it.

They're not being able to replace the retirees in

any way, shape or form.

And where they are going into it is they're going into these

giant audit companies and these giant finance companies.

No one's coming into the individual small

practice anymore.

So what's happening is we refer clients out.

We are having a hard time trying to refer clients to CPAs unless

it's a really complex situation.

If you've got rental properties, and if you've got all sorts

of different things, and you're used to paying a

couple thousand dollars to have your taxes prepared,

we can find you somebody.

But if you're someone who paid $500 to your local CPA,

and all of a sudden he's 75, 80 years old, and they're not

doing it anymore, trying to find somebody else can become

really, really difficult.

That's where we're saying TurboTax is a great solution.

H&R Block, for most people, is a good solution.

But most people's situation is not complex enough where

you can't do it yourself.

And here's my prediction.

Do you have a prediction?

But-

Josh predicts the future.

Oh yeah.

Is that good or no?

Yeah.

Okay.

I like it.

All right.

That's a good one.

You really like to end things with, "Yeah."

I do.

Yeah, it's just me.

Yeah, man, that's the way I am.

I think with AI and the automated intelligence of

everything going on right now, that what will happen in the

near future, meaning within the next 10 years, you will just

get a letter from the IRS that says, "Here's your income we

see, here's your deductions we see, here's the taxes you owe.

There won't be tax preparation for 95% of America.

That'd be nice.

Yeah.

And it's there.

They almost have the technology already.

I think tax preparation will actually be going away.

Hashtag Josh tips.

Let's go AI.

Let's go AI.

That does let lead back to the tax planning portion of it.

When you're trying to hire a professional, a tax

professional, where are you going to find value?

And the value comes from somebody helping you reduce

the things that are taxable.

So to been able to find out different scenarios that you may

not be able to take advantage of if the year's already passed.

All right, so let's talk about some common tax planning tips

that people should look for.

The first thing you should look at is deductions.

Are you maximizing deductions?

So what does that mean?

If you're still working, do you have your HSA?

Are you maximizing contributions to your HSA?

If you're saving for college, 529, depending on the state

you're in, can be different.

For example, we're here in the state of Illinois.

Federally 529s are not deductible.

But in the state of Illinois, if you use the Illinois 529 plan,

you can deduct that on your Illinois return, which, hey,

that's a thousand bucks a year in your pocket that is better

off than somebody else's pocket.

That's a tax planning tip.

Where you contribute to.

So are you putting money in a Roth IRA or a

traditional IRA, your 401k?

Where you're saving is a tax planning strategy.

How you're getting money out is a tax planning strategy.

Where are you going to take money from this year?

When are you going to start social security as

a tax planning strategy?

Your non-qualified accounts, how are you going to get

money out without paying capital gains taxes?

If you're going to invest in dividend-paying stocks or things

that produce income, where are you going to hold those assets?

Those are all common income tax planning strategies.

I've heard you talk about these a lot.

It sounds like you're...

In that list you just went over, there's a combination

of specific things for when you are retired and

when you're still working.

Am I right?

Am I mis-

No, you're-

Mishearing you?

You are dead right?

There's-

I know I am.

I love when you say that.

Say it again, Josh, slower.

You are dead, right-

Oh yeah.

Dave..

That's going to be the trailer.

As you go through life, you have to realize that

your life circumstances change, and the tax rules change.

So there are different tax planning strategies for

when A, you're young, have young children, B, as you

get older, as you're still working, trying to retire.

And B, when you're a retiree.

And even a late-stage retiree.

If you're not spending as much, and you're not as traveling

and doing all the crazy things, there's some other areas that

we have to be concerned about.

Healthcare.

All of a sudden, if you're coming up on some major

healthcare expenses.

So every stage of life you go through has different

tax planning strategies that come to play.

We talked about, a few episodes ago, your old

tagline slash mission statement, tax-focused retirement planning.

And of course that is at the core of what you do, but it

doesn't define you, Josh.

Doesn't define Josh and FSR Wealth Strategies.

Dave?

Yeah?

Someday, I always thought, probably

be fun to work with Dave.

Yeah, sure.

Everybody I've ever met said that.

You don't meet many people, but it's-

four.

Yeah.

But I always thought in my mind, no, he's too out there; he would

never be a part of our business.

But truly, you added something, when you came into our office,

that was exactly what we needed.

And a lot of it has to do with that, as you looked at

the bigger picture and as we changed that mission statement.

Because you are right.

I still believe that the tax-focused retirement planning

is what sets us apart, why we're different than other

people in the industry.

But it's not what we believe in.

It's not everything that we do.

And it's just a portion of that ability to own your retirement.

It's just a small bit.

I do appreciate you recognizing what I bring.

I bring to the office wrinkly clothes, occasional bad hygiene.

No, I'm just kidding.

Totally messing.

You never smell.

No, I don't 'cause I have my Bath and

Body Works lotion to cover up every possible odor.

Aw man, this is a good one.

It's a feel-good one.

It is.

And it's that who would win?

And by the way, this isn't even a competition.

Tax planning has beaten the snot out of tax preparation.

Now, tax preparation is something that

you got to deal with.

Tax preparation's like, "Ugh, I got to do it."

sure, sure.

But it's not nearly as important.

If you can figure out how to do the tax preparation, it

doesn't impact you as much as...

It's a pain in the butt.

It's not fun.

But if you can figure out how to do it, it's super easy.

The tax planning provides real value.

It provides a life-changing opportunity to your

financial picture.

Josh, I have a pretty good analogy too,

which I'm going to run this by Erin; maybe we

can rebrand this later on.

But this is essentially Dave versus Josh one-on-one

in the basketball court.

Dave is tax planning.

Josh is tax preparation.

Who would win?

If you listened to any of our other glory days

stories, you know that Dave would win in a landslide.

Somehow you made taxes about

high school basketball.

I can always tie it back to that.

Yeah.

Hey Mr.

Josh, let's take a break.

You've been talking for so long and my ears are sore.

Let's not make them snore.

Listening shouldn't be a chore.

So let's get to know Josh and Dave and watch our ratings soar!

So what I liked about that, it was one single "Mwah."

You've done a "Mwah, mwah" before.

This was a single "Mwah."

So congratulations.

It was a big bird.

It was a long big bird call.

I like that.

That's impressive.

You have not been using a Pod deck, I think, since episode 20.

So they're sitting there, they're pretty.

They were not free, by the way.

I paid for those without your credit card.

Well, that's when you thought you were

going to be doing a lot more podcasts with different people.

Yeah, that's true.

Then people actually heard me, and they're like,

"Yeah, we're not going to."

So what you got for me today, Josh?

Deep thoughts.

Should I pull a card out and read one?

I haven't let you pick the question-

No.

In a year, probably.

There's a little story behind this one for

me, so I'm going to read it.

It's not the most creative one.

It's also not inappropriate.

What's the strangest thing you've ever seen in

the middle of the road?

The strangest thing I've ever seen in

the middle of a road?

Mm-hmm.

I don't know if it's in the middle of the road, but

I'm going to go with this answer anyways 'cause I can't think of

one for the middle of the road.

But our old house, our backyard, I was in early twenties, I'm

doing my own landscaping.

And they had these big, overgrown bushes in

the back of the house.

And I was like, "I'm going to rip these bushes out.

We're going to put some nice landscaping in."

And there's these giant green evergreen things.

I'm chopping them down.

And I'm dripping of sweat.

And I finally get the big overgrowth brought up.

And underneath these bushes are 10 concrete yard gnomes,

a yard squirrel, a concrete squirrel, and a microwave.

Stop it.

Wait, is this your house or your parents'?

This is my house, my old house.

What?

Yeah.

And we have saved this squirrel.

The gnomes didn't live much longer.

But the squirrel has come with us to the new house because

it's such a funny story.

And we're like-

oh.

This bushes, you could've found a dead body

under there, it would've fit.

But who puts a microwave under a bush?

Dave Schmidt:

Gosh, that's awful.

Dave Schmidt:

Okay, is this squirrel out in your yard now, so next time

Dave Schmidt:

I come over I can see him?

I think he's hidden in the backyard.

I think he's tucked away in the back corner there.

It's like the plastic Santa that we used

to pass around from house to house when we were younger.

Oh, that still goes out in my house.

Oh, I bet.

It sits in my backyard every winter.

And I-

I bet it does.

Send a picture to Phil and Joanne of it.

Mine is not super rare, but you know

how in my family, we love to ridicule our parents?

I think all kids, it's a rite of passage.

You just make fun of your parents.

And there's stories that we carry with us from

young childhood to today.

So every time we get together, we're going to Colorado in June-

Yeah.

We will tell a story.

But we were-

I love when your sisters sit around and-

oh yeah.

Tell a story.

Oh, it's the best.

I'm going to say I was probably late elementary

school, early middle school.

And we were in Door County, that was our annual

trip up to Door County.

We were driving on the road at night, and we came across

a deer that had just been hit.

Right.

Okay.

And so he was already deceased and everything.

And me and my sisters were just distraught 'cause we

had never seen this before.

We were just distraught.

And my mom, Becks, in true Becks fashion, goes, "Ugh,

they're overpopulated anyway" and just kept on driving.

You can imagine me and Julie cried the whole way

home, saying, "How dare you say something like that?"

And so to this day, we'll say something like, "Hey, ma.

Did you see a dead human on the road?

Are humans overpopulated now?

Do you have a heart now?"

So yes, while not super rare, it still has a very funny

memory from we were kids.

Yeah, that's good old Becks.

Does that surprise you at all?

No, but I am starting to realize, as a

parent, things come out of your mouth that you realize are going

to come back later to haunt you.

Totally.

So that may have been one of those for her.

Oh, without a doubt.

So-

yeah.

I feel like we're- yeah.

Dave relates to retirees, yeah.

Thank you for not talking over the end.

See the, yeah, at the end?

Yeah, it was very nice.

It was kind of like I knew it was coming.

Yeah, you did.

Now-

yeah, sure.

I've been running around the office this morning.

I had a client come in all of a sudden.

And every time I come in, you've been frantically

working on something, and I think this is it, so I'm dying

to hear what this DR2R is.

No, no, no.

Don't build it up that much 'cause it's not going to live

up up to your expectations.

This is not what I've been frantically doing.

I did this right before we started recording.

But dear retirees, soon to be retiree, as I always

say, I can relate to you on a deep level with this.

I look at this as reactive versus proactive.

Anybody, again, that knows me or has heard this podcast would

say I'm categorically reactive.

Would you agree?

I would say you're generally a reactive person.

But you do think proactively.

Well, in my work life, I'm more proactive.

In my personal life and responsibilities-

oh yeah.

Personal life, you are so reactive-

yeah.

Yeah.

I mean things such as Josh and my

buddies say, "Dave, hey, we're going out for dinner.

You got your wallet on you?"

"Oh, I didn't plan for my wallet."

Or...

If you are proactive in that, I'm

going to be really upset.

I know.

Or "Dave, hey, you need to register Landon

for school next year.

Have you guys done that?"

"Oh.

Oh, no, no.

We'll get to it," or "Dave, have you washed your

clothes lately and you're wearing fresh skivvies?"

"No, I didn't plan for that either."

But where I am proactive, friends, where I will never let

anybody down is when I am at a gathering or at a party, I am

always the go-to to order pizza.

People always come to me and say, "Dave, how many

pizzas should we order?"

And this has happened a dozen or more times throughout my life.

And while that may seem reactive on the face, when

I walk into a room, any room at any given moment, any time

in my life, I am planning for how much pizza I should order.

I walked into the office today, I said, "There's

eight of us here.

Okay, I'm going to need two large pizzas from Mama Maria's."

I always know.

So I am always proactively seeking what pizza to order.

got to order pizza, give me a call.

I wish you all could see what's

inside my brain right now.

Yeah.

I kind of want to know.

Well, I'm glad I built that one up.

Yeah.

So-

I was going to say.

I'm just saying, man.

Proactive pizza guy here.

Well, first off, you are right.

We do go to you for pizza decisions.

Always.

On the who would win category though, I don't

know if it really ties into tax planning versus tax preparation.

Oh no, I was going reactive versus proactive.

Is that what it was?

Yes, that's what I was saying.

The importance.

Yeah.

Okay, let me wrap a bow around this because that's a phrase you

struggled with last podcast was-

oh, a bow.

Tie a bow around it?

Yeah, tie a bow around.

Yeah, something like that.

You may be reactive in all other sorts of life, but when

it comes to your taxes and your money, be proactive, just

like I am with ordering pizza.

How about that?

I gotcha, didn't I?

You're emotional right now.

You are struggling for words, I can see it.

I think what you say makes sense.

But I think when we talk about the importance of

proactive versus reactive, being proactive is important.

And that would make sense where tax planning, being proactive,

is way more valuable than tax preparation, being reactive.

Sure.

But I will also say that I made a point to

say that tax preparation is really a pain in the butt, but

it's relatively easy to do.

And well, ordering pizza is a pain in the butt 'cause you

got to make a lot of people happy, and no one's ever

happy all the way through, and it's a pain in the butt.

But it's not that hard to pick up the phone and

say, "Hey Mama Maria, send me two large cheeses."

And-

we disagree.

where I actually think the importance would

play into getting your kid registered for school and

washing your underwear and things along those lines.

Some would argue that those animals in the wild would

be more dominating than the proactive needs to order pizza.

But-

We can agree to disagree.

We can.

Yeah.

We can.

But I hope everyone can agree that tax planning

provides way more value to retirees and soon-to-be

retirees than tax preparation.

Sure.

I'm going to give you this win here today, Josh.

This is all yours.

Who would win, Josh versus Dave-

Well-

The ultimate battle?

today, it was not very ultimate.

Josh kicked my butt.

This is good.

I like these who would win?

You know what?

I'm thinking I might actually write and illustrate a

book for our listeners about this episode.

I'll make our own Who Would Win book for tax

prep versus tax planning.

I'd like to see how tax planning is illustrated

versus tax preparation.

I'll have special guest, Alex Bretl, to explain

the differences in kid terms, and I'll illustrate it out.

That's awesome.

That's awesome.

We'll give them out at the client

events coming up here.

Alrighty Josh, what's in store here for next episode?

The next episode.

I wanted to talk a little bit more about some of the

things you should look for in hiring the right advisor.

If you're going to truly own your retirement, what should

you be looking for, what shouldn't you be looking for?

A little bit of a Who Would Win theory.

But we've talked about a lot of really in-depth topics

in the last couple months.

If you were looking for help, I wanted to put out there some

of the things that you should be asking, some of the things

that you should be looking for.

And I think our next topic will be a proactive, if you

will, approach to hiring the right person to help you,

if that's what you should choose to do in your life.

All right.

Who would win?

I thought we were going to wrap up at around 20 minutes,

and we clearly did not.

So-

We did not.

No.

I think that has to do with the random

stories at the end.

The random stories and the epic who DR2R.

Epic.

So yeah.

I did get a message from my dad really quick, and he said he

is disheartened that we have dropped the, "Bye,' even though

we kind of started doing it.

He said, "However, change is not always bad."

He's very prophetic, my dad, he's just a wise man.

So-

prophetic?

Prophetic.

Is he okay?

Doesn't that mean he's very profound, and-

I have no idea.

He speaks prophecies, and he's-

You know who's not prophetic?

Who?

This guy.

Yeah, that's true.

So until we figure out what to say, we're

going to just go with...

Bye.

That ended longer than I thought I was going to.

That's what happens when we have fun.