Episode Summary

Welcome to this week’s episode of Thyroid Strong where Kristin Weitzel is having us sit in ice baths for our minimum effective dose of cold. That could be 30 seconds, a minute, or even longer. With each ice bath we take, the list of health benefits gets longer. 

Key Takeaways

Cold immersion has huge benefits for our physical health but also for our emotional health. It will help us boost energy, lose weight, and reduce inflammation. It will also help us sleep better and manage stressful situations easier. Kristin Weitzel is giving us a lesson we all need to listen to and how to start that lesson today with a few DIY tips for making your own ice bath at home.

The Experience of a Cold Immersion and its Benefits

The most painful moment of the cold immersion is the expectation it is going to be cold before you immerse. Choose your coverage of clothing and begin your breathwork. Start small and over time increase the length of exposure. The goal when you get out of the ice bath or cold body of water is to have a shiver response. This experience is designed for your body to learn to manage high stress and to quickly adapt to its environment.

Using Cold Immersion in your Daily Routine to Help with Hashimoto’s

Cold immersion can help with Hashimoto’s two biggest struggles, fatigue and losing weight. In solving fatigue, plan your cold immersion around getting rest. The ice bath will down-regulate your system and allow it the opportunity to rest, so partake in an afternoon nap or do it right before dinner to go to sleep shortly after. Hashimoto’s other biggest struggle of losing weight is also remedied with every cold exposure. The ice bath boosts the production of our brown adipose tissue which then eats our white fat tissue, resulting in weight loss.

In This Episode

Experience of a cold immersion [1:49]

Reverse engineer the nervous system using your breath [4:24]

Mammalian dive response [5:00]

What happens when you get out of a cold immersion [7:25]

Minimum effective dose, what is yours? [8:30]

Cold immersion and Hashimoto’s [10:33]

Benefits of cold immersion [13:59]

Cold immersion and solving fatigue, when to do cold exposure [15:43]

Boosting brown adipose tissue to reduce weight [18:06]

Cold immersion versus cryotherapy and other options [21:12]

Breath work in getting into an ice bath [22:48]

How an ice bath teaches you to manage stress [25:00]

Joints and inflammation and cold immersion [30:46]

Ways you can DIY your ice bath [33:19]

Converting a chest freezer for an ice bath [35:25]

Trainings for cold immersion [42:25]

Quotes

“This mental component coupled with dopamine and adrenaline that's hitting your body and it is having you understand from a brain chemistry and a physical capacity that you are, okay, you're in control.” [5:59]

“The goal is to get out and have somewhat of a shiver response.”[9:45]

“Sleep is one of the biggest wins of cold exposure.” 12:58]

“The biggest health boosts that we can receive for our bodies when it comes to mitigating disease, come in immersion.” [21:12]

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Listen to the episode on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Stitcher, or on your favorite podcast platform. 

Topics Covered:

• Health benefits of cold exposure
• Breathwork and cold immersion can lead to managing stress in other difficult situations
• The optimal time in planning when to do cold immersion in your day
• How to figure out your minimum effective dose of time in the cold immersion
• How to create our own ice bath at home

Guest Info: Kristin Weitzel

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We don't get into the ice bath to get good at taking ice baths or to be the best at it or the longest or the coldest or whatever we get in the ice bath to get good at life

what's up lovely ladies Dr. Emily hybird. Here with thyroid strong podcast. I am a chiropractor, a mama to Elvis and Brooklyn and I have Hashimotos what is currently in remission. On this podcast I share simple actionable steps with a little bit of tough love on how to lose that stubborn weight. Get your energy, getting your life back and finally learn how to work out without burning out living with Hashimotos Kristin Weitzel Welcome to thyroid strong Podcast. I'm super excited to have you on because we've known each other for so long seen each other's evolution and so good.

It's so good. I was just recently telling someone the story about us and Patagonia and I'm always like, Damn, that was fun times. So the younger we were a little crazier.

Why didn't we do it a cold like a natural cold immersion there have no idea I think we're like cold most of the time or something. But we should have regrets I've had a few will have to go back to go back everyone behind and go back. I really want to go to Antarctica to Oh girls trip. We'll take we'll just have any go our guide take us there you go. It was only go. So your Instagram handle is warrior woman mode, you lead Sherpa breath and cold. I actually have not done a cold immersion for more than a minute. For someone who's never experienced it. They're like, Yeah, I've taken a cold shower, or maybe how would you describe the experience start to finish start to finish.

So getting in the least amount of clothing possible, not mandatory, some women will come and you know, men and women, all types of bodies and all types of lifestyle choices. I work with athletes, and I work with people who have like, never been in cold before. And I'm really nervous. And some people are like, I'm gonna stay in my fitness clothes, I just you know, there's something about like, I'll be a little bit warmer if I'm a little bit more covered up. But the object of the game is sort of, you know, what's the least amount of clothes, you can wear comfortably and getting into a cold water immersion. And that could mean an ice bath that's in your backyard and a plastic tub, it could mean a converted chest freezer, which sounds a little bit crazy. But it might be like one of those meat freezers that's top loading that's been converted and sealed, so you can put water in it. So it doesn't have ice cubes, but the water is quite cold. And it could be something like a fancy schmancy forage like I have in my backyard, which is self filtering and ozonated. And you know, you have to really be in love with a coal to purchase or save up and invest in one of those. And it could be the most beautiful way to do it in some ways is when you're also able to ground. And if you're lucky enough to live near some kind of cold ish body of water, or it's a winter by you, and there's like a stream or a river or something that you don't ever do that alone. So it's important to go with someone but it's really beautiful to do it in nature sometimes. And yeah, and that can range in temperature as well. So starting from where you're at and finding what is the easiest way for you I have some people I work with that are like I have a good Jacuzzi tub at home, let me go to the 99 cent store and buy some bags of ice and see what that will be like. So you can you can start where you're at and getting it cold enough that it feels like something you wouldn't naturally just ease yourself into. Most of the time I'm I'm leaning towards like a sub 40 degrees. But when you look at research, there's plenty of people doing a lot of research in that 50 to 56 degree tempo with athletes and with people who are training for things and there's an arc right, you can take a little bit longer and something that's a little bit when I say warmer, I don't really mean warm but warmer than super cold. And when you first stand next to the body of water or the towel that you're going to get into you will have the thing that is anticipation of the cold is worse than the cold itself. Right. And most of us are going from a air conditioned car to a house to this to that and a temperature controlled or maybe it's heated. And so we're just not used to being in the cold quite often. Please stand next to the bath and you think Holy shit, this feels like it might be cold. Just gonna do and I spend time with people typically like with Sherpa breath and cold or my instructor training or my community sessions or the one on one clients I have letting people know they can use their breath to reverse engineer the nervous system. And that's important because what do we think happens when we step into colds? Our nervous system is like, Oh, what am I doing? Thankfully, it's like that, right? Our bodies are beautifully designed to be like, hey, this doesn't feel like this would be good for a long time. So it's gonna give you a response that maybe your initial feeling is I'd like to get out and one of my colleagues up who's up in Canada who runs a company called unbounded calls the bliss point I call it the turnover. I will keep calling it the turnover because this is a beautiful thing that happens between the 32nd and 92nd mark of getting fully submerged in the cold so Am I fully submerged the very best thing you can do for yourself even though no one believes me until they really do it is step in step in without hesitation or expectation all the way up to your neck, arms, submerged arms and everything. And that's because it will activate sort of this mammalian dive response, slow your heart rate and just get your body all the way right in and it gets attenuated to it. Yeah, the turnover more quickly. And so in the first 30 to 90 seconds, you'll have this turnover, which is a combination of all of the blood being shunted to your core, it's protecting your organs, and your brain. And it's creating in the long term, it's creating a detox effect and like lymphatic movement, and at the same time, there is a parallel process happening, which is you getting in the cold and thinking to yourself, this is super cold. Why did I do this, oh, my God, there's a couple F bombs that come out. And then all of a sudden, you realize about 30 seconds plus, in I'm doing the hard thing, I'm doing the thing that I said, I'm in integrity, I'm holding myself accountable and being in this cold water, and you start to realize, like you're actually doing the thing. And so this sort of mental component coupled with dopamine and adrenaline that's hitting your body and it is having you understand from a brain chemistry and a physical capacity that you are, okay, you're in control. And that turnover vent happens where you see someone I physically see it now that I put like 2000 people in the water, maybe more, I don't know, you physically can see someone surrender. And by surrender, I don't mean give up, I just mean stop muscling through the Oh, my God, this is so darn cold, I don't know what to do, I have to get out. And that is a waiting game. And that is also a breath game, which is why the two are completely coupled, right? Breath and cold have to go together in some way. And even if I told you breathe out, you want your body's going to do something right? It might go Oh, or it might be like, whose idea was USMLE? And that staying in everyone says to me, How long do I stay in and you stay in the cold? As long as it is a minimum effective dose of stress for you right now. We don't need to do the Joe Rogan 22 minutes in the cold shivering response until we're like flailing and convulsing, that doesn't feel like a good place to go, especially for anyone who's dealing with autoimmune or hashy. ladies out there men, women, whatever. So what is the minimum effective dose of stress for you. And that's we have to make some autonomous choice. And that can be hard because it's cold, we want to get out and we're like, I think this is enough time, let me go, let me get out. And then when you get out, the most beautiful thing happens. So let's say like, first timers, I typically say let's go for two minutes, maybe three. And then when you get out, you have this cascade of bliss chemicals. So you have oxytocin and the dopamine response is hitting and your body basically says to itself, wow, we just survived this amazing thing. We're safe, we're happy, we're excited. Sometimes people are singing, sometimes people just get really chatty. And that response sort of kicks off the cascade of positive benefits of the cold. So we get in, and it's a sympathetic nervous system response, and we manage it with our breath, we get out and we have a parasympathetic rebound, which is like where are the Happy Places. So it's type two fun, it's fun after you're done, until you get used to it. And like, for me, I'm like, It's fun the whole time. Because, you know, I just want to tell people out there that like it is the anticipation of the cold that is worse than the cold itself, and especially with females, and we work with men too. But especially with women, the way that we have some negative self talk, let's just put it that way. Or we're not so great to ourselves in the mirror around our competence level sometimes, especially when we're not feeling great. And it really gives us an opportunity to understand our real true capacity, that one that we like showed up with in this world. And so I love that it's amazing.

How does someone know the minimum effective dose? Like are there certain signs? Or?

Yeah, it's a great question. The if you don't know where you're at, and you feel like let's just say there's, there are some contraindications, you have high blood pressure, or pacemaker or you have a really challenging heart condition, you know, that there was a case to be made that you should speak to your doctor and make sure it's okay for you. There's also a way to play a bit with it from a temperature standpoint, you know, maybe you start at 50 degrees, that's good. Maybe work yourself down to the high 30s or something when you want to get a little more badass and that way, but it doesn't define you like, oh, I went in a little warmer, people get competitive. I went is like 38, I was always 42 Or you soccer, you see that? A lot. You see are the men competing on like time and temperature. Mine was cold. At some point. They're like in a block of ice like mine is frozen. So knowing the time is like, if you don't know and you feel nervous, I think it's important to try to shoot for two minutes. It's really you against you. So if last time you went in, it was like 30 seconds and you do a minute. Awesome. That's a win, we do 31 seconds, it's a win, right? It's a little bit longer, it's a little bit more adapted to the cold. And you will find that initially in the early stages, you adapt pretty quickly. So just getting an understanding of what it feels like because the first time is always the scariest and then you're like, Okay, I know what to expect shooting for that two to three minute mark and then playing with the time the goal is to get out and have somewhat of a shiver response. And a shiver response is where a lot of the magic happens. People try to constantly like warm up and quell it or run or get in the sauna right away or all of that and what we want is the body to do the work because that's when nobody's like, oh, just like if we're doing sprint work by thinks, oh, we just got chased by a tiger faster and harder than ever before I better adapt. So next time the tiger chases me I'm better at this cellularly, our cardiovascularly and then the cold we get out and we're like, Oh, I better adapt to this cold, I better create some brown adipose tissue and get my thermogenesis in order so I can actually tolerate cold better next time. And so that's where the kind of magic happens is in the shiver. Huberman talks a lot about that, you know, he's been talking and really popularized besides Wim Hof. I think from a science standpoint, he's popularized so much around the cold. Yeah, it's kind of cool.

So someone who has an autoimmune condition like Hashimotos is listening in and thinking why would I do this other than the happy feeling afterwards? What are some things like what are some things some benefits, especially to the autoimmune population like I know there's improved sleep right. And the Hachi ladies are always like tired but wired at night, and they have insomnia,

for sure the sleeping is huge. I will say this, like anyone who's listening who has been diagnosed or you know, has some sort of autoimmune condition. And this includes other it's not autoimmune, it circulatory like red nodes, disease, there's a lot of people who they're working with a medical practitioner, because they want to get better. And that's perfectly normal and great, a lot of Western medicine, and I'm certainly not anti Western medicine, I think we have to have a lot of autonomy for our own bodies, I think much like the beautiful thing you always talk about, then you go with hashes to your medical professional, and they're like, don't lift heavy, more yoga, like that's still lives. And that's still wrong, and plenty of women that show up with autoimmune conditions. And we work a lot in that slow, steady, strong space, because it's not about rushing it. And it's also about Okay, so you did like three reps of a super heavyweight and great. So I think that there's most call it confusion, let's just talk about those differentiating opinions. And there's old literature new, and people continue to learn, and I'm certainly not a medical doctor. But what I see and what I witnessed time and time, again, is people who are autonomously saying, Okay, so I've been advised by my Western medical doctor who was advising you based on I will not advise you otherwise, if I haven't seen 20 years of actual peer reviewed double blind research, to not be in hyper cold or hyper heat, I am not Windows is the same. It's like circulation issue. So stay in a temperate climate. But what we're not doing is we're not creating this like resiliency or adaptation to anything when we do that. And so the more I've had people come and explore, and I talked to a lot of other like leaders in the space of cold exposure, the more we have people coming anecdotally in droves to say, I've tried all the things, nothing else is working for my notes for my horseshoes. For my autoimmune condition, we start with safety in mind. And they start with minimum effective dose, maybe even erring on the side of wild caution. And then there's change, I am never going to use the word cure. But I will say mitigating symptoms in a massive way is happening for people and sleep, which is the baseline frontier for people who want more energy and who want more, you know, we're only as fit as what we can recover from Sleep is one of the biggest wins of cold exposure. I found them beginning when I was doing it all the time. And I mean, I do it all the time. Now, I just don't suggest and this is an important point for females more than males. I don't suggest that women do it every day, especially autoimmune based or hormonal dysregulation. And that could mean perimenopause, or that could mean amenorrhea or that could mean anything that if you if you've taken bloodwork and your hormones are kind of all over the place, good to do two to three times a week. And by the way, like who else unless you have an ice bath in your backyard like I do, who wants to be like I'm at the store, I'm schlepping a workout of the day is like strong steady lifting and bags of ice and then I'm driving home and then I'm playing, you know, and so it's a lot of work, right, I used to walk up three flights of stairs with 150 pounds of ice before I would plunge clients and I was like, I'm getting my workout into my pre cold lunchtime. But you do that two or three times a week when it's already a win. But I just it's easy for you if you have a cold body of water in your backyard and you haven't been doing this your whole life Hello, Finland and Scandinavia and some people in Asia. But if you haven't been doing this, your whole life that it's like better play it safe than sorry, right two to three times a week is plenty, you're gonna get adaptation, you're not going to over adapt, you're gonna build resiliency, and you're gonna support your hormone profile and in curative way, or in a healthier way to mitigate symptoms, and circulatory all of that. But the point of what I'm trying to say is when I started I was like, Oh, I'm going to love it in the morning because I'm going to get in the coal that's going to boost me I'd be like yes, taking on the day. And what I found was I what I really loved is cold plunging at sunset because it's like around sunset time, I mean, the sun just gone down. It's like nice to do it at sunset because there's still light and it's a little warmth in the air, depending on where you are. I was in LA and I'd get out and I'd have like a little bit of time to kind of like sit unwind, shiver response, all of that then immediately or very shortly thereafter you get super hungry your metabolism is boosted like 300% for about the next like 20 to 36 hours depending and then you're like I'm super hungry perfect time to eat dinner. Right and then like still like early enough that you're a few hours before sleep and you like plunge you eat. Your parasympathetic rebound is on and winding you and you can like put your red lights on and just like wind down into the evening, turn off all the bright lights and then you just sleep like a rock. Looking at my aura ring, I typically get about an hour more deep sleep. And I fall asleep faster. My latency like you know, it sucks if your latency is under seven minutes, or whatever they say, but my latency is better, especially when I'm like tossing, turning ruminating in my mind about whatever tomorrow holds. Yeah, so that feels like a win for autoimmune for hashes, women, for people who are navigating those spaces, always sleep as you know it.

So the two biggest struggles that I hear from the hotshoe ladies are difficulty losing weight and extreme fatigue, how could this kind of cold plunging help with those symptoms,

for sure, it's hard to hold on to your extreme fatigue for the moments around. Because that doesn't mean that like there are times it will give you a big energy surge for about an hour or so. And that's something that's parasympathetic, rebound, like socialization, and all of that will kick in and bliss chemistry. But there are times that it's like, it's like great for someone who may be battling that to like, try it on a weekend first, because there's also there is a component of like the surf nap that can happen. Like if you're like feeling like you haven't been getting a lot of sleep and you have a parasympathetic rebound, it's down regulating your system and giving it the permission to get some rest. And let's say you just did it at noon, because that's the time at work for you. Maybe it would be a beautiful opportunity to take a bit of a nap in a way where your body's so relaxed. Now not not that so long, it's gonna ruin your sleep at night and all of that but maybe it just like the time that it really needs that refreshment right sitting and doing a meditation and getting a little dozy and, and all of that can be really great after and you know, just supporting that the energy component is a real thing, of course, right, you're gonna get a little boost of energy from it for a little bit after an hour or so after. And the body composition pieces of real, right, that's real, it's like so frustrating of females specifically that I work with that are on point with everything and they're just like, I can't move the needle on the I'm not a big believer in like a weight loss thing, because it's like so shitty for us in the way that we look at ourselves in the world. But like, of course, we do want to read composition the body and put more muscle on and more muscle will help us hopefully lose a little bit more white fat. But when you get in the cold or and when you get in the cold, you are boosting your mitochondrial function. And we have a couple of different types of fat on the body. The two that are talked about the most are white fat, typically this stuff, we need some, but we don't want it all usually. And we have brown fat. And we used to think brown fat, brown adipose tissue was something that we stopped making it like 20 years old. And really we just got in climate control. And so we find when like babies use brown fat, and that's why they have it to be able to create to to regulate temperature. And so we make more brown adipose tissue by being in extreme heat or extreme cold. So saunas to write but I think there's a very something that I feel like I prefer with a cold of people dealing with autoimmune versus like extreme heat. It's just not great for the system. Or it's not as good I think as cold and the cold is such a temporary exposure. And I think people sometimes we'll sit in the sauna for ever for a really long time. And then it becomes sort of like mimicking chronic cardio. So cold will boosts this mitochondrial lead dense tissue, this fat in the body, that's brown fat, this is the fat we want, right? We want visceral fat as a fat that's around our organs. Awesome. We love that we need that just a little bit to protect us, protect us the organs. And brown fat is really amazing because brown fat is more mitochondrially dense and helps us turn white fat into beige or brown. Meaning it helps us burn white fat, faster recomp positioning the body faster. When we have more brown brown fat tissue. We want mitochondrially dense energy source energy dense fat tissue on our body in order to keep us going strong. And typically it like sits around like the upper chest or like across your back. Like there's certain places that it's more dense than others. But the cold exposure will boost that that's in the research. That's what's happening to our fatty tissue. And that will give us more energy and also kick up cellular regulation and so better ourselves are talking to each other the better they can work to heal things that are going on in the body that are not in an easeful state,

why would someone do cold it's like a cold plunge versus like a cryo chamber when I was in LA I was like, why would you do a cryo chamber at $65 for three minutes? Well,

friends over with 65 pounds of ice I mean $65 worth of ice and be like just have at it and you get like all these people healthy. I know when I look at it, you know I spent a lot of time looking at the research around cold exposure and people who are sharing comes from like I like a lot of human humans work. There's a lot that's out there in the world. And it's you know, this is the first thing I say at my Sherpa breathin called instructor training is there's a ton of science out there all over the map. Right it's someone that's like training left leg only in cold that's running water or it's ice cubes or it's chilled or it's right arm or it's tennis players or it's think about it could be any temperature could be ice cubes. It could be running, it could be a stream it's clinical environment or non clinical environment. It's typically men more than females although you will Get menopausal studies and don't get me started on that soapbox of how women aren't in the research enough. And so the research is all over the place and surely we're going to discover more people like Rhonda Patrick do a great job of sort of summarizing a lot of the research human puts it out into the world like like gangbusters. Everyone seeing, you know, the world of Wim Hof has been really beautiful to rise, the understanding around how we can boost our immune system like we inoculate stress, and we boost our immune system. These are both really important pieces of the puzzle, especially when you're talking about stress as it correlates to glucose reaction in the body or downregulated bodies, meaning bodies that are in a state of calm or ease or socialisation rest are recovering and sympathetically driven bodies are not recovering. So for in high states of stress. So we want to de stress, we want to learn how to get better at managing stress when we are in any sort of state. Yeah, when you look at all this research, it's all over the place. It's like how do we know where we go from here. So I just think it's important to sort of put that out there and say, there's a wide variety. All of that being said, when you look at the research, just one thing that's clear and quite evident, even though there's not a lot of research around cryotherapy. And that is all of the long term benefits and the biggest health boosts that we can receive for our bodies when it comes to mitigating dis ease, come in immersion, deliberate cold exposure DCE or cold water immune emergency DWI, which just means getting our bodies submerged in water. And that's like most of our body, not just an elbow, a foot a toe, or cryotherapy, which I'm not knocking it if the only access you have and where you want to start is cryo awesome spend $65 or whatever it is on three minutes. It will help you sleep it will help you with delayed onset muscle soreness from your fabulous kettlebell workouts that you're doing Emily all of this, and that's great, you can start there to get attenuated to it. But much like a cold shower, cryo is great. And it can be fun and cold showers can be fun or scintillating, and a good way to start. But if I'm going to expose myself to like three minutes of cold or being pelted with cold or steamed with cold, like let me just get an ice bath and get 10 extra benefits across the board. So it's like sort of how I made my decisions. And also I just prefer an ice bath over those things. It sounds crazy to anyone who's never gotten cold before who's like not used to sitting in there. But the reality is that you get adapted and you also like I get Thank you get a little addicted to how it makes you feel like in a healthy way. Right and a healthy Yeah, it's exciting. It's an environment shift. And when your day is got highs and lows in it and big energy and low energy and just a really nice state change, you can create in a really short period of time.

Yeah. How does the how do you integrate the breath because you said it's almost like a non negotiable,

it is non negotiable. It's like critical. And when I interviewed Patrick McEwen, I have a podcast called willpower and I interviewed Patrick McEwen who is like a breath nerd. So he would say that too. And he works with a lot of athletes and he's quite as a person. He's quite introverted. And he said, you know, extroverted breathing is getting all the spotlight right now. And it does like it's sensational. It's fun on social and I look, I love Wim Hof has changed the game for people getting in cold and people experiencing and exploring it. But you know a lot of what you see on social This is certainly not his only direction around breath. A lot of what you see for anyone in the cold is doing a lot of this like super ventilated hyperventilating, breathing style, which is also not great for stress if women are highly, highly stressed, also not great for mitigating autoimmune, like we're trying to keep get people state calm. Well, I think it has its place for sure. And it can work. I like to down regulate people before they get in the cold. So they are meeting the cold with ease. They are inhaling easily, gracefully calmly as you can your first time you're gonna be like, I'm faking it, because mostly I'm in my head, but in through the nose for let's just say for and out through the nose for eight. So I'm working to get people to stand near the tub to breathe nasally now that was be like what Patrick would say is more introverted breathing. But what it's doing is it's like calming our nervous system state. And then if I do that for a minute or two, before I get in, I know what I'm going to mirror when I get in, or at least attempt to mirror because in the first moments you get in the cold, you're like, oh, as soon as you can, how do you regulate down to nasal breathing, like 2x breathing we say so in for a certain amount, and then double the exhale out of the nose. Yeah, and I find that that works sort of the best to get people to get in to stay in to understand this really important point. If you take nothing else away from this podcast that Emily and I are talking about right now. know this about cold. We don't get into the ice bath to get good at taking ice baths or to be the best at it or the longest or the coldest or whatever we get in the ice bath, to get good at life, to get healthier to understand how to manage stress better so that when the thing happens, that is not expected. The Breakup the trauma You get fired from your job. I always say like the baby's in the road and the trucks coming and you have to go see that, you know, the big stressor comes you can be like in health of the nose, exhale through the nose focus go and you have like you've understood how to manage stress and that situation, because then you can keep a wide perspective and you can act quickly. And you can get through it in a way that feels resilient versus being just like a nut head, right? Oh, ha, like, I don't know what I'm doing. Oh, my God, I'm freaking out and frozen. Yeah. And that's what we're doing this practice, right to get ourselves healthy and to attenuate ourselves to stress so we can be resilient beings. Yeah. And well, your women and most women are, we're like, we need 45 minutes more sleep at night. If you look at the research, and we're like, more susceptible to stress and anxiety and depression and like, Okay, keep slamming it at US research. But it's true, right, we need to be able to mitigate stress better than male bodies.

I think it's interesting, because when I was introduced to it, it was the Wim Hof Method. And coming from someone who sees patients all day in this sympathetic state, and their ribs are flared, or the back is cranked into extension, which is this primitive reflex that we default into when we're in that sympathetic overdrive. I was like, why are we just amping this up even more? Why are we getting people to exhale twice as long as their inhale to put them in the parasympathetic through the learning process, my own personal learning process there was like as like, this doesn't make sense. And there was kind of a rebellion to it. Because from a mental perspective, like this doesn't make sense. Everyone's walking around in sympathetic overdrive anyway. But I love that it's like, bringing ease before the immersion piece. And I think it's important, you know, I tell all the women and that was strong, like we do the hard things to get better in those moments that are really hard, right, where you're like, oh, I have to move or there's a death or my kids acting like a crazy person. And that again, for the millionth time, and you know, my Avenue is picking up something heavy. And I love this alternate avenue of doing something hard, that also has that kind of blissful chemical feeling after,

yeah, for sure, both of those things, both lifting heavy weights, and getting in the cold, have such mood boosting effects, and can totally change your day. And that's also because you can change your nervous system tone, right as you because you come off, it's really good at the end of a workout, right to lay down and do some nasal breathing, just like that same 2x styles, your downregulating and setting yourself into recovery, then you can really feel the effects of your nervous system shift. And the emotional chemicals are still there from the boost. And then you're like, I'm calm and joyful. And you know, what if your nervous system is calm, and you're feeling a little joyful, your entire motional state, your entire energy profile can shift and you can feel really, really differently. I mean, it's why I got into this is because I feel like it shifted the state of being and the way that I manage stuff, are we going to wait around for these things to just like, hit us in the face? Are we going to practice, right? Because we're only going to be as good in the real circuit, we're only gonna be like half as good. And the real circumstance that just like comes out of nowhere versus when we're like practicing it. So we might as well get so good that half is good is better than most everybody else. Yeah. And then it's like, we're ready. We're like ready for action. 100%. And the lifting, I love what you do with the women and lifting and think there's something else about I gotta go to the gym for 60 minutes. And just like I don't know, like, it's, it's not that it can be that. But it also doesn't have to be that right? The context of having what you do with kettlebells. And in a home environment and on your back deck or with the baby on board or the kid on your leg or whatever. It's like if we could just weave that into our lives, right? skipping the gym for two weeks in a row because you don't have an hour to go and 15 like an hour to be there and 15 minutes to drive each way is not the answer our capacity shifts. When we're like, Hey, what's good enough, let's not make let perfect or whatever we think is perfect, or whatever the men are doing no offense, men love you males. But let's not let that be the marker of success only because we also learned this other thing as females and the women you're working with, which is many of us have either a reproductive cycle, you know, hormonally every month, or we have or and we have at some point in our lives, we have a life cycle. We're going through perimenopause, we're going through all this other stuff that starts to affect these organs in our bodies as well. It's like what's so beautiful about your programming, is there's no you know, I love bro culture as much as the next I couldn't I love to be alpha. And also we are equally sensitive as we are powerful. And that is the thing that has been ignored for far too long when it comes to specifically females, right? Men are like, Hey, we're sensitive, but mostly, we're powerful. And we're gonna teach everybody to be powerful. And the women and we've been suffering for it, and it's, it's a superpower to be sensitive. Like fuck what anyone says that it's not, it's weak or whatever. So your women get to like think and feel, hopefully intuitively plus, okay, I'm gonna do the work as Emily says, I need to do the work. They combo that to say, okay, great, what is my intuition and my body really need and that the more that they do that the more capacity grows and the more that our health and our bodies heal you

So cool. There really is a very bro culture around both lifting and cold immersion.

Their hands on trying to change that. It's interesting at my instructor training a lot of my sessions, I would say it's probably 60 70% females and especially the instructor trainings, men will call and say I said, are males allowed? Is it just a female thing? And I'm like, of course, men are allowed like this is I want it takes all kinds. I'll take every kind of body no matter what your hormone profile, whether it's exogenous, or it's yours born that way or not, I don't care. Like let's get in the cold. And let's understand how to manage stress in our Yeah, whatever physique we're dealing with. Yeah.

What is the literature state about? Because I know there's an element of reduction of inflammation, and obviously, with Hashimotos is an inflammatory component. Also joint pain, like what's the research around cold immersion? And those two issues?

So yeah, joints, we see things super positive effects from cold exposure, for sure. Mobility and whatnot, the inflammation thing is really, I don't want to say that it's controversial. It's not controversial, I think in the overall scheme of things, it can reduce inflammation, when you look at a lot of the studies that have been done in the instance, that you're doing it right, I think, and some women will come to me too, and be like, I'm inflamed or I'm bloated, which isn't always the real case. But like, I have my period. And it's I don't want to go in and went and I'm like, this is the time actually to go in. We can feel a lot better. We can feel a bit like tighter, leaner. And it's not about less weight. It's less inflamed when we get out because we are cold because our bodies are Veysel constricting. But the inflammation I think while it is a thing, it has been sort of overblown, it's a regular practice over time can decrease overall inflammation in the body, because you're up regulating yourself, Mike T. Nelson is a guy, I just love him. I've never met him in person, but we do a lot of DMing and emailing back and forth with research. Every time I see anyone POST Research, I'm like, can you send me that study? And I want to read it. And what else do you know? And what about women? And is it all men and probably annoying some people out there but Mike T Nelson is not ever annoyed by the hundreds of times that I write him and say, what about this? What about that? What about my left nostril on the cold like whatever. And he's always great about sharing that info. And he has a lot of great insight into this inflammation inflammatory markers piece, that it is helping over the long haul. But it is not like one ice bath isn't going to like change the game completely. That's like most people talk about inflammation reduction, it can happen. It's just not as prevalent as social media would let you believe. Do you have a favorite brand, let's say more like the budget friendly friend, right? For women who are like, I want to do it. And maybe it's like they just do it in the bathtub with some bags of ice delivered with Instacart. So they don't have to haul it in. Oh, good idea. That's great. Why couldn't you have called me like seven years ago. It's not even that long since LA. So five and a half years ago, you could have called me even, like, just get instant, although I did get ice delivered for when I would have big days where I'd be getting like 300 pounds of ice delivered. Yeah. And here's the thing, the delivery pays for it to my door, which is on the ground floor. And my ice bath is on the right. Yeah. And the guys would be like, that's, I'm not and I would have to always like either tip them a lot extra or they'd be like, literally there were guys that were like, Nah, have a good day.So make sure your Instacart or will like come up the stairs like when we live in the fifth floor walk up in New York City and you're like, Please mister grocery man deliver the groceries, grocery woman, whatever delivery person? Yeah, can you deliver the groceries? I'll tip you an extra five bucks per flight. No one wants to do that. No one's off the stairs. But yes, that's it. I think from a brand standpoint, there's a couple of ways to slice it. Let's just talk about like three tiers of budget that's like very self home made type deal. Yep. Maybe you only have a shower and maybe you have a bathtub. It's easy just to do ice in a bathtub and do the best you can. This a big question I get to which is like how much ice and so it's as much as you can kind of get and afford and whatever works in a budget. It's probably not what you have in your freezer. Although you can totally start with what you have in your freezer, you're gonna need at least 80 pounds of ice really to kind of tamp it down especially if you live in like Arizona in the summer and the water or the faucet is warm there is you know, use your bathtub or like I really think the easy fun thing to do is like even just once a week, Happy Hour Friday, Happy Hour ice and breath or something at your house. Get your friends to all bring a bag of ice or have some delivered Instacart or whatever and you can get in a Rubbermaid tub or metal trough. I say Rubbermaid tub because it's empty, it's more easy to move. A metal trough is like if you have a place you're gonna put it and keep it. Those will run you're under $200. And then you just have a big old tub and you can use it and drain it and all that pretty easily. And that's that's not so expensive, right? That's like a good way to be like, Okay, let's start and see and then if you're only using it like twice a month you don't feel guilty about spending money on it is a metal trough like from Walmart. It's like a Tractor Supply Company. No affiliation, I should have an affiliation. Like here's my link for Tractor Supply Company Lord knows they send me enough emails because I buy it all over the country. Tractor Supply Company is amazing. And there's so many of them. They also for an extra like 50 bucks will deliver the tub to your house so you can get from them either a Rubbermaid tub you want at least I would just say get 150 gallon tub, maybe 200 gallons. If you want to get crazy, anything bigger than that, you're going to start to put multiple people in your ice you'll have you'll have a lot ice you need a 50 gallon a 200 gallon tub 150 is kind of the sweet spot for starters, get that to deliver it or buy it there fit if you can fit it in your car. And then Rubbermaid makes a Black Tub, Amazon Prime doesn't do it. Sadly,

I've checked like the shipping cost more than the tub.

But you can do that with like couple of the other like any feed or supply if any, any farm equipment store typically has these are troughs that animals use to graze or drink water out of the great thing about them all as they typically have a drain valve on the bottom. So if you if you're out in your grass or something, you can just like pull the stopper and then the water will drain out. You don't have to worry about like siphoning it or getting it out in any other way. So that's like level I guess That's level one cost, affiliation. And then if you really start to fall in love with it, the next place most people go is to the chest freezer conversion. My friend John Richter, who actually is here in Austin, ironically, I'm like this is the way the universe brought me to Texas. It's like lots of ice people cold plunging people here. John Richter wrote a it's like a 15 or $20 ebook that is called I think it's chest freezer cold plunge.com. If you Google it or Google John Rector, you'll get him. It's the best $20 you'll ever spend if you're trying to convert a chest freezer because John has been through it. He's been doing this for five plus years, he's converted so many different freezers. And he made all the mistakes in the beginning all the way down from like, you have to seal this is a top opening meat freezer, like you'd imagine in a store that you can buy like, typically, like under $600, you find a lot of them that are like great condition on like Craigslist, whatever. But the one thing you have to do is you need to seal it, you need to seal the seams. And there are specific seals that work. And then there's specific ones that don't. So if you try to like caulk it with your shower stuff, like it's just some stuff doesn't last or work. So all of that's in his book, which is really amazing. And you can start stacking things into it like a nerd as much as you want filtration or ozone. Ozone is amazing to clean these things, because then you don't have to go crazy and coming off of COVID people will want to go hey, how do I keep it clean for a bunch of friends. All you have to do is put like a third of a cup, quarter of a cup, something like that in 150 gallons, only a little bit of food grade hydrogen peroxide, please be careful, it is convenient. It's not the hydrogen peroxide we use in the store and you put a little bit of that in and then dilution and everything will make it so just keeping it a little bit cleaner antibacterial. Anyway, some people will use a little vinegar, some people will use some Epsom salts, don't use the kind, you're using anything that's like a chest freezer or something you're going to have for a long time don't use the scented time you start to get like oils and slippery stinky stuff all over. And all of that can help typically you're draining those things. So it's not a massive deal, a chest freezer conversion, we probably have to drain like once a month unless you're using it a lot, change the water once a month and all those chest freezers have drain plugs on the bottom. So you can just drain it out easily under 1000 bucks. Unless you want to get like a huge fancy wanna know, you're like I gotta go to the restaurant supply store, you're like give me your best chest freezer. From there you go to a nice barrel, that's kind of the next $2,500 range saves a lot of space is barrel, but you can't lay in it you have to like squat in it. You climb up in a little ladder and you get in it and it's like super easy who wants to like relax and I'm always like, sit down have a pina colada, no one wants to relax in the ice barrel anyway. So it's great for space saving if you just have like a balcony or a small backyard or you're in a duplex or a complex that has like a balcony and no backyard or no, no space, right and you put it outdoors somewhere. And you can just use that with ice. It's about I think it's like 1200 bucks for an ice barrel. But we do a lot of my partner and I will do a lot of conversions on those where you like drill a little hole and you have an inline and you can filter the water and you can ozonated it and you can do all that under 2500 bucks so that it's like much more self sufficient and clean and organized and you don't have to mess around with ice ever right when you get a chiller and you run a chiller into anything. Or if you use a chest freezer, it's keeping it cold that's the hardest work here is getting the ice if you don't have like an ice machine, I mean an ice machine like oh nice pounds a day. Yeah, so there's all of those and then you start to get into like the gangbusters if you're like I love this practice. It's changing my life which by the way it can autoimmune conditions, weight issues, glucose issues, all of these things are really can be supported by cold exposure, like your chemistry of your body, the confidence level you walk into the room with it all can be your sleep. Your energy can all be affected by coal, but I always I'm like don't go out and spend 10 grand on something until you know that you like it enough to do it. Because if you don't do it, it becomes a really expensive clothes rack or whatever. Your kids pool toys are on it. You're like yeah, but then you get into like the high cost range, you know, you're easily spending five grand or more five to $20,000 on a unit that's going to be wonderfully like self filtering, self chilling, you change the water a couple times a year.

Because I think one of the most important pieces we're not talking about which is even outside of all the techie stuff, which you and I really love is the training is sharper breath and cold is training, how to know when the turnover is know what the minimum effective dose is know how to regulate your breath, all those things. So do you have some local trainings coming up or stay right?

or once a quarter and that's it. And it's all amazing. And it costs quite a bit of money. So you know, I saved for mine, and I use it with clients and it made sense to get it. Yeah, there's a lot of brands out there. There's the plunge. I have a Marasco Forge. There's a Odin, which I really love, and they're out of Australia. Yeah, I mean, there's a lot of brands out there that are that are ever new, makes a great tough sell many, not just one. There's a lot now and I always people send them to me, or I talk to these companies all the time and know a lot of the owners and founders and builders and whatnot. If you're looking for a chiller, this is a good point for any nerds, and then I'll stop nerding out about all the technical stuff. But if you're looking for a chiller, there's really only one company with found on the market that really can cut it, because the chillers quite often are meant to be used for other things. So you want at least a half probably one horsepower chiller from Penguin, they really they get the they can make the making a cold again, like it works cycles, it keeps it cold. I'm in Austin, so my partner had to go through a few like chiller fails before we figured it out because it's hot in the summer, right? So how do you keep it at like 40 degrees when it's sitting out in the sun. So penguin chillers we really like again, like not a lot of affiliation, the penguin team now has a page it's like penguin.com forward slash, probably beautifully broken, like my partner's podcast or something that you could just look and it's a setup, it's like, buy the things and you get a kit and then you get your ice barrel or whatever you're doing. And you just haul that chiller into your into your future healthy self. Yeah, I've heard that ice barrels coming out with like ice barrel 2.0, where they're integrating a chiller. And, yes, that's what we are waiting for. They're integrating a chiller. And I think they're gonna make it insulated. And it's not insulated. Now, it will sweat. But the new one may be insulated. I can't get quite all the tea from them. I'm trying to you know, I'm trying to get all the dirt on these things. But they're working diligently on that. And then also, there's like a wild amount of companies doing inflatables for like events and races and whatever. And it's all portable, I have not yet found the company that has the thing that I want, which is a chiller that fits in an overhead compartment in an airplane. If you're out there and you work, can you please make one that fits in the overhead compartment. So I can literally carry everything on like a weirdo. I've been running trainings like once a month, it continues to grow by 2023. I'll have some other trainers that I work with. I bring on board like master trainers for this, I hate to call it a method, right this whatever it's like goes the Sherpa method. It's like, here's the thing, I saw a gap in the marketplace for a little bit for women. And a lot of it for it's this style and that style. And like great, I'm so happy for people to have a ton of breath styles and a ton of cold exposure, like styles that they lean towards. What I couldn't find was one number one one community session where I could get a bunch of people together. And we could talk about different ways to do it and play with different ways to do cold and to do breath. What about the element of play and fun that sounds like it would be important in life. And then also from an instructor standpoint with coaches and I have people like sauna company owners and cold exposure coaches from other methods and trauma therapists and massage therapists and so many different CrossFit coaches, so many different styles of coaches that want to layer this into their tool belt as an additional tool that can change lives and change perspective and get people to adhere to other things they're doing in life. And just like anything else we fall in love with the health space tends to be if we have another health tool that we fall in love with lots of other areas of our life start to get healthier. And that's kind of cool. But what I saw is a big gap is like, where's someone that's like, hey, I want to go because you know this about me, I was like traveling around the world training like cardio drumming and doing all this stuff, like with all these other things, and yoga assisting and adjusting. And what I saw a lot of times in breath and cold was where's the course that I can go to for a weekend, even if I'm a newbie and understand how to like, by the time I'm done with the course with a little bit of practice in prep, build a safe, fun and effective class. I know exactly how to do that, like the tactics to get that done. And also the class in that same weekend, right? We all short on time. And that same weekend be like what and how do I use breath work styles and nervous system understanding to build that so that I'm not just providing this like fun experience. And I don't know why scientifically, and I'm not just using one style like this is not the Kristin Weitzel method. Sherpa is a beautiful term that like the universe gave me people kept saying in the last year so since I moved to Austin, we Sherpa me through the ice. We shoved me through the coals and I finally was like, I've been doing this for six years. I better name this. It's like it has to have a name on business or whatever. But it's also an acronym right? So it's surrender history. Don't forget that we're not the first people to like breathe or getting cold that's been doing people doing it for 1000s of years. Exposure which is typically called exposure although I do do heat exposure, respiration. That's the breathing part performance because this is one thing We haven't talked about a lot and isn't as applicable to mitigating disease in some ways, but performance because I do use it with athletes UFC CrossFitters we're working on in the marathon circuit, etc. And then a the biggest thing besides surrender, in my mind is adaptation. We're doing all this to adapt to our circumstances. And so I wanted to be able to wrap that all up in a beautiful bundle in a weekend. People are like, well, I got Kristin for 16 hours over two days. I'm good for a while that people leave and they're like, Okay, I get it. I get breath. I get cold. I can do the thing that Kristin Weitzel I was never getting this in some in many of my trainings in life, which is what's the contacts who's my audience? How do I apply it to my audience? And is it just whoo or is it just science? Like are you giving me reasons you know, x p t was great for that. They were one of the earlier people that certified me and Patrick McEwen is a mentor of mine. And it's so many people but getting out and then using my one special gift which is like I have spent my life's work in whatever industry I am in taking the really like highfalutin protocols or thoughts or plans and translating them so that it can be applicable to human beings. Right. I did that in the liquor industry with marketing plans. I did that in health space. I did that in cleanses, I did a fitness. I'm doing that in breath and cold. And it's like, look at how popular breath and cold this we might as well all get really, really good baseline. And that's what that whole training is about for like men, women coaches, or newbies. It's a weekend filled with you're creating capacity that you can go change other people's lives. Because if I'm gonna get millions of people healthy, I can't do it alone. I mean, I need help love it.

Where can people find you? Where can people find the trainings, I want to go semi SharePoint.

I mean, anytime you're ready, I do them once a month. The next one who knows when this will launch but like, um, one is coming up in North Carolina excited week before Thanksgiving, then I'll see my mom and put her in cold she'll be so pissed off. She's always like what crazy health practice you bring in my way this time. And then I'm so thankful I mentioned this to you before we started that Maui in December. I feel so lucky I get to do this work in general. And then how lucky am I to be able to get a gift to be able to go to Maui do it at level up fitness was one of my most favorite places in the world Maui. And the next year more is coming. There's like Indonesia. It's like having him in Indonesia and Israel. This is like I'm giving all the eyes What's that book where she travels around to all the eye countries more than the US in Canada. I was up in Toronto. I'll go back to Toronto next year. That was super fun. Worked with other ships

from a logistical perspective. How do you get baths here are they shipped to the like I had the beauty of working on the other ship space and Toronto they already had like an incredible custom ice bath out there built in and when I'm in CrossFit gyms or I'm in yoga studios, or I just set it all up so that I'm Tractor Supply Company. Here we come to have it delivered or have a Rubbermaid tub set either ice delivered or like sometimes I'm up at the crack of dawn and I'm like at the grocery store load nice into my car or whatever and it's just stacked high watch it fly. And then it's there you know and like everyday we just I just did it up in Connecticut at this open sky yoga barn was so beautiful, such a great group of people and they're like we got it. They got 170 gallon tub like Rubbermaid setup. And I just got up every morning and went and got a little bit of coffee, a little bit of ice a lot a bit of ice. Yeah, it's always fun to watch the people who are in the grocery, like we'll have carton and I'm like I'm here to get like 250 pounds ice. What do you got in the back? And they're like, Do you need help with that? Ma'am? Always, they always ask me and I'm always like, No, this is amazing. I love to like schlep an ice bag. People in the parking lot are like, are you okay? Are you having a party like a party come over and put you in a tub ice so it's like you know, be a trendsetter and your neighborhood hockey is ladies. Where can people find you social avenues

warrior woman mode was my women's programs are called typically what warrior woman wrote on my instagram handle it we will never go away I think because I run into people all the time and conferences and stuff and they're like, are you woman mo they don't even know my name. They just like yell at my face. And I'm like high fiving them and it's so alpha and fun. It used to be hurricane like Hurricane I used to be hurricane but then people were like just a little bit tentative about getting to be my friend. They weren't all as adventurous as you. And then Sherpa breath and cold.com Totally built out which is super exciting. And I run this I run community sessions I run private sessions people are now hiring me I just went to Denison University was excellent and trained 80 of the swim team. They're on breath and how to work for breathing again, like what you said earlier that's so smart. If we're over sympathetically breathing ourselves, but we're a swimmer right context. Here it is, again, everything we calm our state, we have to learn how to be better at breath holding, right because the least amount of breaths we take under the water while we are soft and ease full in the water, the faster our time can be. And if I can get two seconds of my time I can win like and that's it A big deal. So universities now are saying, hey, come into us. And I went and I had this amazing opportunity with the incredible coaching staff there to sit for two and a half hours free, the coaching staff, whether they liked it or not, I was like everybody on the floor, and then to breathe with the men's and women's team. And it's just like, it's transformational. There are no two practices I've ever applied no two modalities that have ever applied in my life that are as transformational and as efficiently transformational as breath and cold exposure. And that doesn't mean anybody gets out of strength training. By the way, everyone still has to lift heavy shit. But it's just once you like, learn how your nervous system responds and how you can build mastery and breath work specifically and also cold. Everything changes. Amazing. And you have a podcast. I have a podcast, it's called willpower. Yeah, and I just interview a bunch of people and a lot of people in the biohacking space and a little known for like being the crazy biohacking female. And so I interview people all walks of life. I mean, I just I did an episode called biohacking. BDSM this year, we talked a lot about sex positive behavior, and Patrick McEwan who doesn't want to talk about anything related to sex at all. We breath and then yeah, people from from all over I just interviewed a guy who was writing music that everybody can use in the healing space to make more money with without getting you know in trouble by all of the copyright agencies and a lot a lot of women's health stuff too. But just across the board, anything that feels like good and interesting and ways to boost our brain chemistry. nootropics is like my hot topic now. Nice. Yeah, very cool. I love it. Didn't listen to it. We should have brought this up very first thing is like you and I met at a life coaching seminar that was all about keeping in integrity. And they were all about like promises and consequences. And I was like, I hate consequences when you say yes, but what a great come full circle that it's like being in integrity and doing the hard thing and getting out of this culturally soft place of like, oh, we can get an orange anytime of year and always around like 75 degrees and, you know, doing the hard things and staying in integrity from an action oriented perspective. I love it. Yeah, I was like coming over to you asking him for all of the supplementation advice. And now people are like, Kristin will not shut up about supplements. What's up glutamine? Glutamine. I'm like glutamine, lots more. So this day, I mean, it's a winner without glutamine.

Well, thank you so much for coming on. I think a I can't wait to go to a Sherpa breath and cold.

Anyone you want to come to you just write me an email and then all you have to do is fly there nothing else I will take care of all the other details for you. You are always welcome. Even if it's sold out. I'm making you fix.

And then hopefully the Hashi ladies will start to gradually maybe they get in their tub with some ice maybe they just like finish their day with a cold shower. Yeah, which is totally great if you enjoyed this episode, or even learned just one new piece of information to help you on your Hashimotos journey. Would you do me a huge favor, rate and review thyroid strong podcast on iTunes, Spotify or whatever platform you used to listen to this podcast and share what you liked. maybe learn something new. And if you didn't like it, well shoot me a DM on Instagram Dr. Emily hybird I read and respond to every single DM I truly believe all feedback is good feedback. Even the ugly comments if you're interested in joining the thyroid strong course a home workout program using kettlebells and weights where I teach you how to work out without the burnout. Go to Dr. Emily clyburn.com forward slash T s waitlist. You'll get all the most up to date information on when the course launches and goes live special deals and early access bonuses for myself and my functional medicine doctor friends again Dr. Emily khyber.com forward slash T s weightless hope to see you on the inside ladies