Dave Connolly masterfully guides us through one of the most important parts of the bible - the raising of Lazarus by Jesus!

This is episode 8 of our Origin Livestream series journeying through the Gospel of John and the Book of Acts.

Learn more about CROWDChurch on our website www.crowdchurch.com

Welcome to this week's Crowd Church service.

We are a digital church on a quest to discover how Jesus helps

us live a more meaningful life.

We are a community, a space to explore the Christian faith and a place

where you can contribute and grow.

Our service, uh, will last about an hour and in a few seconds you'll

meet our hosts, uh, for our service, who will introduce today's talk.

After the talk, we will have a time of worship and reflection, after which we

head into Conversation Street, where we look at your stories and questions

that you've posted in the comments.

Now, we want to invite you to connect with us here at Crowd Church, and we've got a

few ways in which you can do just that.

Firstly, you can engage with Crowd from any device during our

livestream, and if you're up for it, why not invite a few friends over

and experience the service together?

See, church is all about connecting with God and connecting with others.

And one of the easiest ways for you to do that is join one of our

midweek groups where we meet online together to catch up and discover

more about the amazingness of Christ.

You can also subscribe to our fairly new podcast called What's the Story,

Uh, where we deep dive into stories of faith and courage from everyday people.

More information about all of these things can be found on our website,

www.crowd.church or you can reach out to us on social media at Crowd Church.

If you are new to Crowd or new to the Christian faith and would like to

know what your next steps to take are.

Well, why not head over to our website, www.crowd.church/next for more details.

And now the moment you've been waiting for is here.

Our Online Church Service starts right now.

Well, good evening and welcome to Crowd Online Church.

I'm here with the dashing and debonair Phil Watson.

Phil, how are we doing?

Yeah, I am concerned.

I am colorblind.

Do my clothes clash?

What color are my clothes?

This, this is orange.

I got this from an Oxfam shop in, uh, near Epsom, if anyone's from Epsom.

Hello.

Epsom is, uh, just outside London, home of the Epsom Darby.

Uh, this however, is a Fred Perry, which I bought firsthand.

There's the logo.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Look, what color is this?

Is it green or brown?

It's kind of like a greeny brown to be fair.

Can you, can you wear these two together?

Can anyone or can I Is a better question?

I think.

I think you could get away with it Phil.

I don't think I would.

Yeah.

Right.

I'll, we'll go with that.

Hello everybody.

It's nice to say hello to you.

Miriam's put here in the, in the comments here.

She says, I love your outfit Phil.

No, Miriam, you my top fan..

And you know what, you know what I, I can't mention names Matt, but I did a talk

at a real, you know, real live online.

No, not online.

At actual face-to-face in person.

Yeah.

An in person one.

That's what it's called.

Not real.

And um, some of the feedback I got was, Phil is as funny as he thinks he is.

I'll say that again.

Phil is as funny as he thinks he is is, and I'm like, I will.

This was teenagers and teenagers do not give, If you're a teenager and if

you ever were a teenager, you'll know teenagers don't give compliments easily.

So I was like, Oh yes.

I'm gonna put that, I'm putting it on my CV.

I'm gonna, Well

I've got, um, I think it was in my Father's Day card from Zoe.

She, thanks for being, you know, blah, blah, blah.

One day I want to be as funny as you think you are.

I, I think I've had that from all my children.

Yeah.

Yeah.

That's a great phrase, So you quite nice to make of that.

Yeah.

Thanks.

Appreciate that.

So we've established, we are men of a certain age with children.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Who are absolutely.

Teens, early twenties.

Oh dear.

Yeah.

Yeah.

What can I say?

Anyway.

Anyway, uh, for those of you who are joining in, welcome to Crowd Church.

We are an online church, believe it or not, Uh, as well as a fashion advice

service, how to do color and clothing.

Uh, we are an online church.

Uh, so it's great that you are with us, uh, this evening.

As you can see, it's Phil and myself.

We are hosting the service.

Uh, if you are live with us, if you're watching the livestream

live, uh, as opposed to watching the catch up on YouTube or Facebook.

Uh, then join in the comments like, uh, Miriam has, Sharon's in the comments.

Nicola, Hi Nicola, Matt Crew.

Uh, doing something behind a service station, texting on his phone.

That sounds a bit dodgy, doesn't it?

Uh, he's good evening from the service station on the M62 as well, he says, Yeah,

happy birthday to you, Matt, as well.

Um, and so, yeah, Nichola's, but oh my goodness, I thought, uh,

you were being medallion man.

Okay.

Not quite sure what that means, Phil, but let's go with that.

So, yeah, join in the comments, do so it'd be great to hear from you, especially if

you've never been to Crowd Church before.

A warm welcome to you.

Uh, it's just, uh, we, we, we like to find out about Jesus and

we like to have fun doing it.

Uh, and so that's kind of what we're gonna do today.

We have got the amazing Dave Connolly sharing the word of God

with us in just a few moments.

He's gonna be talking about Lazarus.

Uh, after that we're gonna have time of worship, as we said in the intro.

And then Phil and I are gonna be doing Conversation Street.

So make sure you get busy in the comments with your thoughts, with your

questions, uh, as we're gonna have a bit of fun with Conversation Street today.

Uh, so do join in with that.

Uh, and the whole thing's gonna last about an hour, so Quid's in right?

And of course, we will keep you up to date with the latest scores, which

I'm not, I'm obviously not watching.

Is it 2-0 still?

I have no idea actually.

I think it is.

I hope it is.

Uh, Matt says, Can you give a shout out to my beautiful

niece who got dedicated today?

Ava.

Ava, Big shout out to you.

This is not a radio show, Matt.

I just wanna point that out.

This is an online church service, but sure, why not?

Uh, big shout out to you over well done on your dedication.

Uh, that's awesome.

Uh, and we hope it goes really, really well with your walk with Christ.

So, you know, uh, you've got a great uncle.

What can I say?

Uh, right.

So I'm gonna hit this button on here.

We are gonna jump straight into the talk with Dave Connolly.

Dave Connolly is one of the founding pastors of Frontline Church, which is

what Crowd Church is affiliated with.

Um, he has been a long time friend and mentor to both Phil

and I for many, many years.

The man is a legend full of wisdom, uh, and got amazing Scar's accent.

In fact, uh, he was on this week's What's the Story podcast

if you subscribe to that.

Uh, I talked to Dave about what it was like growing up in the sixties in Toxteth.

Uh, and we talked a lot actually about, um, the murder of his nephew,

Paul, and how he dealt with that.

It was quite a, you and I were there when that all happened.

I mean, not right there Phil, but we were obviously with Dave in the middle of this.

Yeah, I remember..

And so we get into all of that in this week's what's the story?

If you wanna know more about that podcast, uh, where we do dig into

people's stories of faith and courage, check out whatsthestorypodcast.com.

Um, or you can go to www.crowd.church.

Same thing.

It would take you to the same place.

And in fact, Phil, you've been on What's the story as well?

I have indeed.

Yeah.

They're always, I love other people's stories.

I love listening to, um, yeah, basically it's just a, it's a chat, isn't it?

About this is what has happened to me.

Uh, it's not theoretical, it's real, it's real life.

Yeah.

Always interesting.

Always interesting.

Yeah.

Brilliant.

So do check it out.

So anyway, that was a very long introduction to Dave's talk.

Yeah.

Uh, so here is Dave's talk, uh, and then Phil and I'll be back after the worship.

Uh, here we go.

Every time that button's stuck, I need to fix that button.

Let's try that again.

Today's story taken from scripture is centered around

the death of a man called Lazarus.

And we can read this story in John's gospel, chapter 11 and 12.

I wanna encourage you to take a few moments to read these scriptures at

your leisure, but let's make a start.

In verse one, we read up a situation that would touch each of our lives.

It all hinges around what can Jesus do about death?

Death is a reality.

Whether we want to talk about it or not, Death is intimidating.

It makes us feel vulnerable.

It causes us to think about our own mortality.

It raises many questions about ourself, about God, about life after death.

So let's take a look at what is happening in these verses.

In verses one to three, a man named Lazarus was sick.

By the way, Lazarus lived in a town called Bethany with his two sisters,

Mary and Martha, The two sisters send a message to Jesus saying,

Lord, the one you love is sick.

Also, you know, it's worth noting that Jesus stays with them every

time he appears to be in the region.

He obviously has a depth of relationship with this um, family.

We see in the story that Mary Martha somehow knew where to find Jesus, and

when Jesus was told in verse five, the one you love is sick, he didn't have

to guess who they were talking about.

He knew it was Lazarus.

We read in verses five to seven.

When Jesus heard about it, he said, Lazarus's sickness will not end in death.

No, it is for the glory of God.

I son of God, will receive glory from this.

See, although Jesus loved Martha and Mary and Lazarus, he stays

where he is for a further two days before he goes to be with them.

It says, after two days, he finally says to the, to the

disciples, Let's go to Judea again.

We find out later that Jesus already knew that Lazarus was dead even by

the time the messenger had arrived.

And by the time Jesus got to Bethany, Lazarus has been dead for four days.

Bethany was only a couple of miles away from where Jesus was.

And the disciples knew that if they returned to Bethany, they

were going to be in danger.

We read that the disciples say to Jesus and they say, Teacher, only

a few days ago, the Jewish leaders in Judea were trying to kill you.

Oh, you going there again?

And in verse 16, Thomas says, Let's go too and die with Jesus.

We read on, and when Jesus arrives in Bethany, Lazarus

has been dead for four days.

Some Jews believe that the soul hung around the body for

three days until decay set in.

Then it would abandon the body and there would be no hope of life.

Some may have believed that Lazarus could possibly have been raised during

those first three days, but nobody, nobody believed he could possibly be

raised from the dead on four days.

Jesus didn't enter that time because he knew that it would create a scene.

He waits outside for Martha to arrive, and when she did, she repeats

something to Jesus that had probably been said numerous times since the

death of Lazarus in verse 21 and 22.

Lord, if you had been here, my brother would not have died, but even now I know

that God will give you whatever you ask.

That sounds like a great faith statement.

But when I read Martha's statements again, you know, previously, I thought

she was expecting Lazarus to be raised from the dead, but possibly she wasn't.

Verse 24, Martha answered.

I know he will rise again in resurrection at the last day.

See, we find out later because she protests when Jesus asks

for the tomb to be opened.

She wasn't expecting a miracle anymore.

She was simply stating, Lord, if you'd have been here, things wouldn't

necessarily have been different.

But I still believe in you despite what has happened.

It hasn't shaken my view of who you are.

I mean, that sounds a great statement.

Yet Jesus challenges that.

It wasn't enough for her to acknowledge that she believed in him.

Even though Lazarus had died.

She had to believe that he had the power even now over death,

verse 23 and 24, Jesus told her, Your brother will rise again.

And Martha said, Yes.

When everyone else rises on Resurrection Day.

She believed in a resurrection day.

That was a teaching, um, that was pretty controversial in its day,

but Jesus wanted to clarify things.

It's not enough to say, Okay, he died.

That's the end of it.

But one day it'll be, it'll be okay.

It'll be made right.

In the meantime, I still believe in you Jesus.

It's not enough for some future event..

It's actually someone standing right in front of Martha

right there and right then.

Jesus.

Verse 25 and 27, Jesus says, I am the resurrection and the life.

Those who believe in me, even though they die like everyone else will live again.

They are given eternal life for believing in me and will never perish.

Do you believe this, Martha?

Martha replies Yes, Lord.

She told him, I have always believed you are the Messiah, the son of God, the one

who was coming to the world from God.

It's not a belief or a dogma.

It's a person.

It's not even about a future resurrection.

It is about never dying, never perishing.

Even between the point of physical death and the resurrection.

The one who believes in Jesus still lives.

Jesus is about to show that he has power over death and that his followers

don't have to say, We will believe in you despite the reality of death.

We can say we believe in you because you are the one who gives life beyond death.

You are the resurrection and you are the life.

We'll see in the next few verses.

A similar scene unfold with the other sister Mary.

Jesus still stays outside the village and Mary says to him in verse 32.

Lord, If you'd been here, my brother would not have died.

This was obviously something Mary and Martha had spoken about.

Naturally, what happened next doesn't really come through in

our English translation very well.

In verse 33, when Jesus saw her weeping and he saw the other people wailing with

her, he was moved with indignation and was deeply troubled, moved with indignation.

It's difficult to translate.

It was used in the language of the day about like snorting, like horses.

It conveys an anger, a pain, a shuddering, a strong emotion.

Deeply troubled means to be agitated almost to a place of despair.

I've always pictured Jesus being upset and weeping, but

you know, it's so much deeper.

This is his friend, the one he loved.

Jesus was deeply moved with sorrow and grief.

Jesus was facing death face to face.

He was seeing the effects of sin.

Words weren't enough.

Just as when we face death, there's a sense that at times words can't

convey how terrible death is.

He broke down grieving and when he asked to go to the tomb, he's still grieving.

I wanna ask and suggest that every person needs to ask what

hope they have beyond the grave.

Some have decided that they don't need hope.

That hope is an illusion.

Jesus offers more.

He's not only crying and grieving at the sight of death.

He does something more.

Roll the stone aside.

Jesus told them, and yet Martha says Lord, by now the smell will be terrible

because he's been dead for four days.

And Jesus responds, Didn't I tell you that you will see God's glory if you believe?

So they rode the stone aside and Jesus looked up to heaven and prayed.

Father, thank you for hearing me.

You always hear me, but I said it aloud for the sake of all these people standing

here, so they will believe you sent me.

Then Jesus shouted.

Lazarus come out.

And Lazarus came out bounding grave clothes, his face wrapped in a headcloth.

Jesus told them, unwrap him and let him go.

Jesus said earlier that this was going to bring glory to the son

and give the disciples another opportunity to believe in him.

And you know what?

It did.

It gave the disciples the opportunity that Jesus wasn't just the one who

turned water into wine or who healed the sick and made the blind see.

He's also the one who conquered death.

He's God overall.

He's the resurrection and the life.

How can you not get excited about this?

It would be easy to think that this story is about Lazarus, but it isn't.

Lazarus would die again one day.

This is the story, the story that ultimately is about Jesus

and his power over death itself.

It's about his glory and what happens to those of us who put our trust in him.

We gain victory over death because we then enter into a relationship with the person

who is the resurrection and the life.

It's about Jesus because the events that unfold ultimately led to his own death.

Right after this story ends, the leaders plotted for Jesus' death,

which edl to our salvation.

Jesus could face his own death because he himself is the resurrection and the life.

For those of us who are bereaved at this time, my friends, there is hope.

There's hope because Jesus grieved for his dead friend.

Jesus met death and saw its pain and its ugliness, and he understands.

There's hope too because in verse 25 it says, Those who believe

in me, even though they die like everyone else, will live again.

There is life beyond the grave.

We would probably be smart to realize today that our lives are

going to be shorter than we think.

Life goes much faster than we would like.

We don't want to spend a lot of time thinking about death, but no Herbal

supplements, no exercise program, no diet will delay it indefinitely.

There are a few answers for death, but we know the one who conquered

death and promised eternal life.

Let me leave you with this thought, my friend.

Today you can know the one who died so that you might live.

God bless you.

There you go.

Love the king of my heart.

What a phenomenal track that is.

Uh, love that track.

You can rewind, you can play very loudly, especially if you're in the car.

You can also find that track on our YouTube playlist.

Uh, King of my Heart is what it's called.

So do sing along with that.

Phil, I see you're still in the same top.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I don't, I don't change for anybody.

Well, that's not, that's not true, but there's a sermon in there, surely.

Yeah, there is, isn't there?

Yeah, I've just move it a wire.

That's terrible, isn't it?

Okay.

Sorry if I just zoomed in to people's viewing.

Yeah,

yeah, yeah.

Absolutely.

Let's get into this then.

So what did you think to Dave talk?

If you've not done so already, leave your thoughts, comments,

uh, on YouTube, Facebook.

We'll get into that as we go along in Conversation Street with myself and Phil

talking about this very meaty passage.

I am the resurrection and the life.

This incredible story of Lazarus being raised from the dead.

Uh, and um, did you ever get that?

Oh wow.

Are you near railway station or is that fireworks?

That's fireworks just right outside the house.

And what's to slow?

Say, uh, if you are watching this outside of the UK, it is November the sixth,

which means yesterday was in fact November the fifth, which is Bonfire Night.

And Phil, I dunno what you did on bonfire night, but last

night we had some people around.

We had, um, some beautiful people from international countries as well as the

Sopwiths and the Beynons and a few others.

So we, we had a big international mix and they sat there, these

beautiful people, uh, and they said, what's the deal with Bonfire Night?

And did you say we celebrate a man who nearly blew up democracy?

Yeah.

Well, he, he failed, didn't he?

The Catholics failed in blowing up democracy.

We celebrate, we celebrate failure and even following the story and

we're meant to be talking about death and Lazarus, but it is a fascinating

story where one of the conspirators to blow up Parliament wrote a letter to

somebody saying, Don't go to Parliament tomorrow because there's gonna be a

big bang and this letter was found.

And then they, Cause they've got the real, the real version of it.

And it is a very good example of be careful what you send and

write down, careful what you text.

Yeah, absolutely.

Tweet.

Absolutely.

Anyway, yeah, A mad event.

Anyway.

It is a crazy event which we celebrate in England, which

explains why the fireworks are going off tonight because they're all the fireworks

that didn't get that off last night.

Uh, it's, it's, uh, there are a lot of fireworks.

I mean, basically for three hours.

Uh, Liverpool just is explosion city, isn't it?

And it's just going off everywhere.

So, um, so yes, that's why the fireworks going off outside.

So I would, if they go off again, I will try my best to get to the mute button

very quickly so they don't wreck your ears and Phil, You just have to fill the void.

I could do that, no doubt.

So, uh, that explains bonfire night, which is

not the reason, why we're here, but that's the interesting trivia.

So Lazarus's story, there we go fireworks.

What is the shortest verse in the Bible,

Phil?

Jesus wept.

Uh, and it's the first verse I ever learned.

Uh, and I, I think there's lots of talk about here, as there always

is, but there's so much there that Dave mentioned at the beginning.

It's the fact that Jesus seemed to have mates, um, Mary Martha and Lazarus.

He, and as Dave Conn said, when Jesus was in this area.

So basically, if you imagine.

The holy land as it's sometimes referred to, Jesus wanders around it with this

group of disciples, um, talking and getting mixed receptions from people.

Some areas they loved him, other areas couldn't stand him.

He did miracles in some places.

He told parables or stories with a meeting in other places, and he would,

I'm assuming he had a network of people.

And when he got to this village or this town, they'd go, Oh yeah, yeah, we

know you are, you're, we are friends.

Whatever, come and come and stay.

Cause there wasn't obviously travel lodges, Premier Inns or anything similar.

And I'm just, I'm, and I, I think that Mary and Martha and Lazarus were

part of a kind of network of people who, who gave hospitality to Jesus.

Yeah.

It's a lovely idea, isn't it?

That depth of friendship that Yeah.

I know that sometimes if, if you, if you are, you might have come across, I think

they're often called itinerant preachers.

So they travel around a country or the world and it's wonderful.

And the most famous one in my lifetime was probably Billy Graham.

Um, there've been numerous others, incredible impact, but actually there

are also some people that stay put.

Yeah.

Uh, like you, like you and me, Matt , who stay put in one,

in one town, one community.

And we go, this is where we will be anchored and this is the place

where we will have our influence.

And I love the idea and we've done that.

I know you have too Matt of hosting friends or people we don't necessarily

know, um, who stay in our houses.

And, and I never really thought about that actually until Dave mentioned that, that

these are, these are, these are friends.

And so when they, when uh, the message came through, the one you

love, and I dunno how that sounds very odd in English, isn't it?

The one you love as a guy.

Yeah.

Bit.

Yeah.

Our bestie our best friend and Jesus knew that's Lazarus.

He knew that that was Lazarus.

So there's an insight into Jesus bring very human there.

And the Jesus wept is also just a very, very important verse cuz it's easy to

think that Jesus was some superhuman.

And it's so hard to find the word superhuman, unlike you and me.

But actually he felt, we know, he felt sadness.

We know he felt grief.

And I think there's a big mental health message in those two lines.

I think there probably is.

Yeah, whatever your emotions are, you should be in tune with them if you can,

if you, if you're, if you, if there's grief in your family, if something bad

has happened, there is nothing good about having again, we're international, but

the classic British, stiff upper lip.

It all be fine.

It'll be great.

Grief will come out one way or the other.

And it's better to get it out through tears and, and however you wanna show

that than to pretend you are not upset.

I remember my grandmother saying to me, and I put it on a

Facebook post recently actually.

She said, Jesus wept and Jesus slept and he hung about with his friends.

If it was good enough for him, it's good enough for you.

And it's a really good summary, isn't it?

Because yeah, there is quite a few occasions when Jesus seemed to

fall asleep in the most inopportune moments, storms, boats, up mountains.

Um, and that is an important thing, getting rest.

Um, I'm going on a bit here, aren't I?

What'd you think about Jesus wept?

Well, exactly.

I knew it was the smallest verse in the Bible.

Like you was the first verse I ever, um, memorized.

Cause it was the easiest one to memorize when you're a kid at Sunday School.

Memorize Bible verse.

Jesus Wept.

There we go.

Done.

Yeah, I can do that one.

Yeah.

Um, but no, you're right.

I think it's.

I think it's really insightful.

I mean, Dave, we're talking about death and we're talking about resurrection.

Yes.

There's the power of that, and yes, there's an incredible story in there,

but fundamentally here was a man stood before the tomb of one of his best mates.

Yeah.

And it, and it, as it, as you would expect it rightly up, was upsetting.

Uh, and Jesus shows his humanity and weeps.

And like you say, there's a lot of good mental health messaging around that.

Um, but it's, um, sorry, these fireworks are still going, uh, ten to the dozen, uh,

. Um, but there's, there,

Isn't there something quite special about the fact that, like you

say, Jesus had his mates, he's and one of them has passed away.

And for the, It's interesting how I like how Dave put it.

He said that, um, when Martha was saying, if you'd have been

here, He would not have died.

It's like we know you are a miracle working God.

We know that you heal.

How many of us have prayed that Prayer?

God, if you'd have just answered my Prayer, this would not have happened.

Right?

And it's like, yes, we know you can do this.

We believe that God, you can heal.

We believe that God, you can do the miraculous.

And if you've been here, this would've not have happened.

If you'd have just shown up, this would've not have happened.

If you'd have answered my Prayer two days ago when I told you he was

sick, this would not have happened.

Um, and it's like, it's like God seems unfazed by that, but

he still feels the pain of it.

Do you know what I mean?

I find that fascinating.

Yeah.

What if, I'm gonna get all theologically technical, aren't I?

But if Jesus is omniscient, which means he knows everything,

if God is omniscient, what?

I dunno, it's too hard for me to get my head around.

But the good news is I don't have to because I'm not God.

And I have to keep coming back to that realization that I

will not understand everything.

I think there are some insights into this story as well.

Cause I know that, uh, within Jewish culture, you bury a

dead person within 24 hours.

Yeah.

It's not like the western culture that you and I are a part of, where we might

wait days or weeks or even longer.

And it's still the case today within Judaism, somebody dies,

you bury them within 24 hours.

Partly, I guess it's, it's a, it's a cultural thing because if you're

in the heat of, of Israel, you would wanna bury a, a body quickly.

And I've never thought of this before either, but I wonder if

Jesus' apparently casual approach.

You know, he waited four days.

This is gonna sound very macabre.

They weren't as medically developed as we are when we in, in the West, when

somebody's dead, we, we know they're dead.

We, you know, a medical doctor with training signs the death certificate.

You can't do it any other way in our culture.

And I dunno, I dunno.

Okay, so I'm just suggesting maybe Jesus knew what was gonna happen.

He, he had an emotional response, but four days in the grave,

Lazarus is definitely dead.

This is not a mistake.

He wasn't sleeping.

He wasn't, he hadn't passed out.

And I've often thought that maybe about Jesus being in the grave for three days.

This is not he, wasn't, pronounced dead by mistake or in error by

somebody who didn't know any better.

Um, cuz I've heard stories of people being assumed dead and then they

have, you know, I mean, years ago and then it turns out they weren't dead.

They were in some sort of coma or something like that.

So I wonder if, if Jesus's apparently casual approach was in a way to

show his power that when he said Lazarus come out of the grave.

There was no doubt that the man had been dead.

Yeah.

Um, and as typically with every Bible story, I've got so many questions I would

wanna know, Lazarus, where have you been?

What was it like?

You know, you, you hear of near death experiences where people are

pulled towards lights or whatever.

What, you know, where were you for those few days?

And, and the other sort of thing is, you know, what happened to Lazarus afterwards?

Was he, was he like, when I think Lazarus, cause I've never heard

of anyone else called Lazarus.

Like, oh, the bloke that was raised from the dead.

Did he become locally as you know, there's Lazarus, the guy

who was dead, who now isn't?

Did he, did he have some sort of, um, celebrity status and I'm

assuming, Well, I know it's true.

He did eventually die.

You know, he, he, he's not alive now, so he wasn't made immortal.

He was just given some additional time on earth.

I wonder how he used it.

And it's, that's a big question, right?

And well, it's an interesting question for anybody who's a Christian or not,

which is you dunno how long you've got, what are you gonna do with that time?

Um, and how much of it, you know, you have to sleep, you have to weep,

you have to eat, but what are you gonna do with the rest of your life?

But that, and that can come across as like a, oh my word, I need

to make the most of every day.

And we've all had that feeling when somebody has been

taken from us, a loved one.

Uh, you know, you know, you never, all sorts of good advice.

Like never end a relationship on an argument.

Cause you don't, you don't know what might happen.

You know, you don't know whether that could be the last time

you see them, but, um, yeah.

What, what happened next?

Because there is another bit in the Bible, isn't it?

In, in the gospel of John where he says, where John, the writer says,

I'm only telling you the main details.

Yeah.

Cause if I told you everything that.

I would, I'd be writing forever.

So, So John, if there, if there were to be a sequel, I would

like these questions answered.

So what happened?

So what happened next to this person?

Yeah, yeah.

It's, No, it's a fascinating, You're right.

I mean, in some respects it's quite, it's quite, um, uh, pictoral

isn't it, of the Christian life.

It's like we as Christians say, we were dead in our sins, and then

we were raised to life in Christ.

Yeah.

It's like we have done metaphorically and spiritually, I suppose,

what Lazarus did physically.

And so this whole idea of Lazarus, what did you do once you were raised from

the dead, I think is a great question.

And it's like, Christian, what are you doing since you have

been raised from the dead?

Yeah, yeah.

Do, you know what I mean?

How, how are you now, how has your life changed?

Um, how is your life being lived as a result of being raised in, you

know, spiritually from the dead?

And it's quite a fascinating concept, um, you know, with the power of God like that,

that actually he brings newness of life.

And that's the, that's the beauty of it, isn't it?

It's like, it's the whole, um, the way I was, the way I used to be.

That can be left in the grave or the bottom of the baptismal pool

if you do the whole baptism thing.

Do you know what I mean?

It's that kind of, it doesn't have to be that way anymore because actually

I have been raised to newness of life.

And that Paul talked about it.

He said, I have been crucified with Christ.

It's no longer I who live but Christ who lives in me and the life I now live in the

flesh, I live by faith in the son of God.

And I think what an incredible revelation that is when you get your head around it.

Yeah, Yeah.

Well, it, it's exactly that, isn't it?

And it's the, there's a, there was a story in the papers a few years ago in

the UK about a palliative nurse that had worked caring for dying people.

For their entire professional life.

And they sort of summarize what these folk taught her and some of

them regretted things they had done.

So they went, I wish I hadn't done that thing where I hurt somebody.

But more often on than not the people in the last stages of life, which most

focussed the brain was then it is a, it's a great part of being human is that whilst

we all know we are gonna die, actually we're able to get on with life anyway.

Um, you know, you can be overwhelmed with that sense of doom and catastrophe,

but most humans, most of the time go, I will live as if I won't.

And I think that's probably how we have to live.

But one of the, the regrets that many of these people had in the

last days of their lives was, it's not the things I did that I regret.

It's actually the things I didn't do.

I regret, And this apparently, not that we are old men, Matt, but as you get

older and you realize that, Oh, actually that thing I will probably never do.

So it's taken me, you know, I haven't mentioned fostering

yet, but as an example.

As an example,

I mean, well done for making it 42 minutes, that's

gotta be some kind of record.

Record.

Yeah.

As an example, my family decided to foster and I talk about fostering a

lot with people, but it could be any, um, should we say altruistic act,

um, or even a non altruistic act.

And it's like, I'm glad we, we, I'm glad we did it when we did because otherwise

I'd never have known what would happen.

And there is a sense of, um, you, you.

As the times go by, go, I wish, I wish I'd done that.

And you go, You know what?

One you're still living, there is still time to, to make a

difference to how, how you live.

Yeah.

Um, and when you do die and we all do die, this is inevitable.

There's a couple of questions.

One is, is there an afterlife or not?

And if there is, and if you're a Christian, you believe there is

and you're going to it, um, um, what can you, we had this preach

in, in the church this morning, What can you take to the afterlife?

And it's a crazy question, isn't there?

I've never been to Egypt, but you see the pyramids and there was a sort

of belief that, oh, I'm the fair, I'm very wealthy, I'm gonna die.

And when I die, I want to be in the biggest tube with a ton of wealth.

And I believe that, you know, you'd have your slaves buried with

you, your wives buried with you.

And if you look at powerful people throughout the history of the world, they

have a similar system where I, my, you know, when we buried the queen, the pomp

and ceremony was amazing, unbelievable.

Uh, and I don't wanna sort of, you know, the queen's great.

Like, well, she's died the same as you and I are going to mm-hmm.

, she, her body will decay.

Um, and I, I, I was, yeah, this morning I had a great peach.

My lady called Jenny, who said, There's only two things you can take when you die.

Uh, and I thought, two, I thought there was nothing you could take when you die.

And she and, and her, and cuz she's cleverer than me, she went, You can

take your relationship with Jesus.

So when you die and you, you go to heaven, whatever this is, looks like

you've got your relationship with Jesus already and you've got it with you.

And the other thing you can take is the relationships that

you have with other Christians.

Mm-hmm..

And I thought, oh, and I've, I again, I dunno who's gonna get into heaven.

It's not, luckily it's not me that chooses and judges, um, I'm, I'm kind of looking

forward in some respects to meeting some people in heaven without everyone.

Mm-hmm.

. But I'm gonna be, as far as I'm concerned, I will be reconnected with

people, uh, who are also Christians.

And I'll be very surprised who's there.

I expect, I'll be surprised who isn't there.

Yeah.

But, um, that's a whole another debate.

That's a whole another livestream.

Are you in or are you out?

That's just,

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

But it's, it reminds me of, there's a joke by Milton Jones, who's a very.

Dry comedian.

He was a Christian actually.

And he's, What does he say?

Something like, I'm in a competition to be the oldest person in the world and

every day I go up the leaderboard and it's kind of macabre, but, but, but it's true.

Everybody is going in the direction Yeah.

Of, of death.

Yeah.

But what are you gonna do with your life?

And it always, I always come back to the stories of the Good Samaritan,

uh, the parable which Jesus told about, What good are you doing?

And then the story, it's known as the sheep and the goats, which is

basically like when you help someone else to summarize it, if they're

hungry, starving stranger or foreigner, if they're, if they're ill, whatever

their circumstance, whatever you do for another human being, this is good.

This is how Jesus wants us to live.

And you don't have to wait.

I'm, I'm quoting Anne Frank.

Now I'm on full on quotes, aren't I?

You don't have to wait.

You don't have to wait another day.

To start making the world a better place.

That's very true.

You, you, wherever you go to work, whoever you hang around with, whatever you do,

you can be a positive to other people.

You can make their day by being a positive person.

Um, I think I've got away from death there and start to talk more about life.

Yeah.

But never mind it's, it's all wrapped up together, isn't it?

It's is, isn't it?

You can't have one without the other.

Yeah.

I heard, um, a great quote.

I put it on Instagram the other day by Simon Sinek who said, You know

what, We have these bookshops that are full of self-help sections,

but in none of those bookshops is a section which says, Help others.

Yeah.

That's really interesting, isn't it?

And I thought that's very, very true.

And I, and you kind of think, well, yes, uh, life is in some respects

about helping others, but we don't really think about it like that, do we?

We don't really, And that's one of the things that struck me about what Jen

was talking about this morning, you know, that, um, We, we take with us,

uh, those sort of Christians that we've, that we've sort of brought into the

kingdom for want of a better expression.

Yes.

Do You know what I mean?

And, and Paul talks about this in his letters about his crown,

I think it was in Philippians.

Um, but he talked about his crown, um, being the people that sort of

were in the churches that he planted.

And he is like, I'm gonna get to see you in, in eternal life.

And that's the thing that drives me forward.

That's the thing that propels me.

And you are my joy.

That's, yeah.

Those, and that's brilliant.

That's the let's help other people section Do you know what I mean?

Let's help other people find it.

Yeah.

And I think, I think that's not a bad thing to give your life

for Do you know what I mean?

Yeah.

It's not a bad thing to sort of, to strive for is actually that because you, the

Bible does talk about a reward in heaven.

It does talk about a crown in heaven.

You know, It's like I can't earn my way there and I know I

can't earn my way into heaven.

And I know it's about grace, but there is a crown.

Yeah.

And the, the sheep and the goats would suggest that parable sheep

in, I mean, I, I'm not a farmer, I don't know, but sheep good, goat's not good.

And I've always wondered about the story with, I can understand the,

hey, be altruistic, do good things for other people where that actually

gets you when you get to heaven.

I don't know.

But it gives me the impression as you say, that there is some reward in heaven.

Um, but because in heaven there is no sin other, you actually celebrate

other people's rewards is what I've always imagined it to, to be like.

Um, but again, uh, philosophizing about what heaven's like is something

like, all I know is I want to go there.

And I'm, that, that's, I want to go there and, and I think it's gonna be great.

And whilst I think it's very human to grieve, of course it is.

And sometimes people can be a little bit unhelpful when they talk about

somebody dies and they mean, well, you know, they've gone through a better

place, or whatever they might say.

And I'm like, Do we know that?

Are we sure about that?

Um, there's, there's something very, um, helpful about helping other people

and about what you do while you are alive, how you're going to use your

years, how you're going to use your hours, your weeks, your minutes.

And we live in a very, I think all humans have, but there's a, we live

in a pressured environment that talks about the, the accumulation of wealth.

Um, the accumulation of status, the accumulation of, of status

symbols, whether that's your job title, whether that's your marriage

status, whether it's the car that you drive or the wealth that you have.

And that's been part of, I'd imagine that's part of every culture.

Yeah.

And has been since the beginning of time.

We, we sometimes say, Oh, it's worse now and I'm going Bet it's always been.

It's different.

Yeah.

It's just different.

Yeah.

You know, nobody said, Oh, I've got a Tesla and the brand new

iPhone a hundred years ago.

But they said they had, I dunno what it been, Ford Eight, some old car.

I know.

There's, there's, there's something that humans do isn't, it's, it's an interesting

thing cuz you kind of go, I want this to make myself somehow feel better.

I want this to make myself feel better than others.

Which is the opposite of what Jesus says, which is, Hey, look out for other people.

And it doesn't mean it's wrong to have wealth.

And you know, the Good Samaritan, he had money enough Yeah.

To pay for the care of another human being.

Do, you know what I mean?

It wasn't it, it's how he used it his wealth.

It's exactly, It's how he, it's how he used it.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

No, it's really interesting, this whole idea of how you

spend your life and, you know, the, in some respects, the core of the Christian

to lay down their desire for wealth, not necessarily lay down wealth, because

I think, I mean, the, the reality of it is even despite the cost of living

crisis, we still are some of the most prosperous people on the planet, right?

Oh yeah.

We have to, we have to be aware of that.

Um, and we have, I think we have to acknowledge that even if we

don't have a whole great deal by British standards, we have a whole

great deal by global standards.

I mean, let's be real.

Um, but that, that chasing of wealth, that chasing of accumulation for

stuff and laying that down and saying, God what do you want me to live for?

Why did Jesus write and that Paul talked about that.

He says, I forget those things which passed.

But the one thing that I do, I press on for the, the upward call of Christ.

I lay a hold of that for which Christ Jesus laid a hold of me, is this

language, isn't it in Thessalonians?

And it's like, Jesus, why did you save me?

Why did you go through that?

Why is the, why am I part of this whole resurrection thing?

Let me understand that because that's what I need to give my life for.

That's what I need to do, isn't it?

And so, um, it's very challenging and it's, it's very easy to say

. Phil Watson: Yeah.

Yeah.

But, and, and, and you're right.

You know, where if you, if you go back through time and you look around the

globe, if ever there was a time when you could choose to live, it would

be now with, with, with health, with social interaction, with social care,

Um, uh, and yet at the same time, Death is, death is, is there looming,

if you like, is that the wrong one?

That's a bit of ominous, but it's true.

Death looms for everyone and all the, you know, all the skincare products in

the world, all the, the Botox and what it, what we see this morning, there's a

facility in America full of frozen people.

Oh yeah.

Frozen people.

I don't suppose they're dead technically, but they're waiting.

Is it called cryogenically frozen?

Yeah.

Yeah.

So they're waiting for there to be a medical solution to whatever

health problem they've got so that they can then be cured of it.

And I'm just fairly sure that humans will never beat death.

It will always come for you eventually, regardless of, of your, of your wealth.

Yeah.

And regardless of your status.

Now there's a certain, there's an ease in how you live, isn't there?

The comfort that you have.

But again, we, we.

I think particularly maybe in the west is we tend to go, Oh, if only

I had this life would be easier.

I'm not sure.

My understanding is around the west of the globe where people are less, um, wealthy.

You know, if you're living in a, in a war zone, you know you are,

I'm sure that people there are thinking, I wish I had your problems.

You know, wish, I wish I only had to get up on a Monday and go to work in the rain.

You know?

Yeah.

You know, you've got a job, you've got a home to leave, and

you've got a home to go back to.

You know, it, it's, it's how you, how you look at that, isn't it?

It is.

Totally.

Yeah.

I can't decide if this is really, really inspiring or really miserable.

Uh, well, it's funny, isn't it?

I think actually it could be both and it all depends on

how you interpret it, right?

Yeah.

Um, and, and actually your outlook on life and, um, death is a funny thing, isn't it?

I, I think it's one of those things like, why do we die?

Why?

I can explain it with the Christian story, right?

Mm-hmm.

, I can, I can understand that, you know, and I can understand that.

I think my belief was that when Adam and Eve were created, there would, there

was, there was no death at that point that, you know, had they not have, um,

sinned, they would still be around.

Um, but they did.

And so death came, and I can understand then in the context of Christian circles,

but I can't understand it outside the context of Christian circles.

Yeah.

Like, why do we die?

Why do we, why are we, why is, if you take God out, why, why is death there?

It makes no sense to me, you know, for something sort of

come, explode and disappear.

It's like, why, why does it not perpetuate itself?

Surely that's the, the most sensible thing to do.

The, there's an argument isn't there, that the, the most rational

explanation is probably the true one.

And, uh, we're opening up another can of worms cause that's what we do.

But the, the most rational explanation for everything and

everyone being here is there's a God.

Mm.

And, and, and, and I'm not.

And I'm not him.

And I'm calling him a him because it's easier.

I'm not them.

Whatever you wanna, whichever pronoun you wanna call, God, I don't think they mind.

Yeah.

But the easiest explanation is there's a God Yeah.

To me.

And then everything else is if God is this transcendent ephemeral,

which are very long words, meaning you can't get your head around God.

Mm-hmm.

, they're God in the same way that you can't actually get your

head round eternity, you know?

I know.

Or infinity is another word.

You know, you can't get your head around that cuz you're only a human.

It, I find it really reassuring to go, there's a God, it's not me,

and this God is in charge and this God, for reasons that I don't fully

understand has chosen to create this and I live in it and I'm part of it.

Mm-hmm.

. I also believe, and I've never had a problem with this, that God

is interested in me individually.

Mm-hmm.

, um, and somebody might go, Where's your evidence?

And I go, Well, my life.

Yeah, my life And the stories and the, and the feelings and the times when

I'm sure that God has spoken to me and helped me and other times when he hasn't.

And I'd love to talk to him about that later.

And I'm assuming there's an entry interview when you get to heaven.

I go, Right God, now I've got you.

These are the things I really want an answer to.

When we were talking about this last night with Will me, and we'll

start with, we were talking about this is like we've all got this list of questions.

Got while I've got you number one.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Number one.

But, but you know, you're right about it.

I mean, I tend to see, I prefer to see the positive spin on

it cuz I quite like the idea.

No, I love the idea that it's not your wealth and it's not your status.

Because unless you are.

What is it Jeff Bezos or who's the other one?

Elon Musk.

Yeah.

If your purpose in life is to become wealthy, unless you

are one of them, you've lost.

Yeah.

You are not the winner.

Sorry.

Even if you are really rich, you are not the winner cuz they've

already won that at the moment.

So once you decide to take yourself out of that competition and go, it's

not about, it can't be about wealth and therefore status, it's much easier to go.

Brings me back to, um, how are you spending your life?

Well, if you're spending it on things that will never rust,

which is the Bible word, isn't it?

You know, like anything, any, even the most precious metals, gold, silver, I'm

guessing, will deteriorate over time, but something like helping other people

doing good, good deeds if you like.

They never rust, They never.

They, they never dissipate.

They never go grow old.

They never go moldy.

They're just good things.

Um, and that's easy actually.

That's easy for anyone can do that.

Do it.

You can do it with your family tonight or you've listened to

Crowd Church or wherever you are.

You can go, I'm gonna go and do something nice for somebody else.

And that's an eternal thing.

It is.

And I think it's interesting.

I mean, one of the things that I'm, we're gonna talk about this over the

coming weeks and I'm aware of time, so I'm gonna end with this point, that

if you are a Christian and you are listening to this, my challenge to you

in the current climate in which we face ourselves, certainly in the uk where

we have the cost of living crisis, we have the energy crisis, we've got the

food crisis, we've got the interest rate crisis, we've got inflation, we've even

got crazy politicians doing all kinds of crazy, weird, wonderful things, right?

It is just a very uncertain time.

But in that uncertainty, In that craziness.

The last thing we need to do is go inward and in slow.

Yeah.

And batten down the hatches.

It is totally the right time to open our doors.

Yep.

Inviting our neighbors and go, Come on in.

Our house is warm.

I've only got a slice of bread or whatever it is you've got on the table,

but we're gonna share it with you.

Right?

Yeah.

And I think we've never had such a good opportunity to bring

the gospel to our neighbors.

And so I'm, If you are a Christian watching this, I'm encouraging you.

Please do not batten down the hatches.

No.

Open your doors.

Yeah.

The word of the year apparently is perma crisis.

That if you saw that, it's one of them.

I dunno what purpose, like you know what God's in charge.

Perma crisis, whatever, you know?

And people, it's a really common mantra, isn't it?

Times are tough.

Well, they always have been.

They always will be.

They always will be.

How do you respond to it?

Yeah.

Yeah.

I can tell you now things are gonna get worse.

And some things will get better, but it's just, yeah, it's

just the way it's gonna be.

Right.

And so where's your faith?

Fundamentally, that's what Paul said.

He said, I live this life in the faith of Christ, so my faith is built

on him, not on things, not on stuff.

And so, you know, it is, It is the way it is.

Phil, wonderful.

On the hour, thank you so much for joining me.

Just to say everybody, uh, next week do come join us on the livestream.

We are carrying on our conversation through John's gospel.

We have Tony Uddin speaking.

Next week is also Remembrance Sunday.

Claire Glare will be hosting with me if the schedule is right that I

see on the screen in front of me, George will let me know if I'm wrong.

But yes, we have Claire coming to Host.

We've got Tony Uddin speaking and it is Remembrance Sunday.

So do come join us for that.

It'll be great to see you.

Uh, Matt's put in the comments, join us next week, 6:00 PM GMT

for our next livestream, complete with the odd tech issue as usual.

Shocking.

At least we're predictable.

Yeah.

There's a familiarity to, to that isn't there, Which is quite comforting, I feel.

Uh, so yes, do come join us next week.

So, uh, Phil, anything else from you, bud in closing?

No.

No.

Uh, find out about God's plan for your life.

He's got one.

He loves you and He, he wants to, he wants to be in a relationship with you.

Simple as that.

Very good.

Very.

I couldn't have put it better myself, mate.

I couldn't put it.

Phil, thank you so much for joining me.

All right my friend.

I was fun hosting with you.

Uh, God bless you everyone.

We will see you next week.

That's it from us.

Bye for now.