Stephen is an exceptionally loving, wise, and compassionate human being who lives to serve. In this episode, he talks candidly about two spiritual experiences that helped him recover from addiction, alcoholism, and depression and get into law school, and graduate top of his class against all odds. Discover how he went from being a master of secret suffering to a master of living in integrity and commitment with a waiting list of people wanting to coach with him. 

About the Guest: 

Stephen Sainato Coaches World Changers. He stands for freedom, fulfillment, and impact. He operates from the possibility that he can change the world, one conversation at a time, starting with the one in his mind. He is deeply devoted to making the world a more loving, inspired, and empowered place. He loves working one-on-one with individuals committed to making a meaningful difference in the world while generating financial abundance for their families, communities, and philanthropic causes. 

Stephen’s clients are kind, brilliant, and powerful; they span around the world and across industries from social media influencers, Fortune 500 Company executives, and international athletic champions to coaches, doctors, lawyers, writers, students, and more. Stephen is also a lawyer and a tap dancer. 

His life story took a painful turn many years ago through the depths of addiction, alcoholism, and depression. He had a spiritual awakening in 2011 and was blessed to experience Grace. He got sober after then, went back to school, and graduated law school first in his class. He practiced corporate law at a big firm in New York City before transitioning to Coaching full-time in 2018. Discovering, connecting with, and being coached by Steve Hardison has contributed greatly to a profound shift in being and a spectacular expansion in his capacity to love, serve, and create.

https://www.stephensainato.com/

About the Host:

Philippe Bartu is a recovering people-pleasing hotelier that became a stressed out restaurant owner and survivor of a severe burnout in 2008. This led him to become a seeker of deeper meaning and purpose in life. In doing so he had a profound spiritual realisation. He saw that every human being is always ok and perfect. 

Over the last 8 years, he has led transformational international retreats and coaching programs that have helped hundreds of clients replace stress and anxiety with fun, ease and play. He is passionate about relationships and is on a mission to create a world with less drama and more fully expressed, authentic human beings.

By reading The Ultimate Coach, Philippe deeply saw how we create our future from a place of being limited or being unlimited. Today, he helps his clients transform their relationship with their own limitations and become powerful unlimited creators.

www.philippebartu.com 

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Welcome to The Ultimate Coach Podcast, Conversations from Being, inspired by the book, The Ultimate Coach written by Amy Hardison, and Alan Thompson. Join us each week with the intention of expanding your state of being, and your experience will be remarkable. Remember, this is a podcast about be, it is a podcast about you. To explore more deeply, visit TheUltimateCoachBook.com. Now, enjoy today's conversation from being.

So welcome back to the ultimate coach podcast. My name is Philip botou. And today, I have an extraordinary guest, someone who I have known for a little over two or three weeks, maybe even a month. And there every so often I'll meet someone in my life who I just feel lives in a space of absolute, just beauty and honesty. And one of the things on his website is the word extraordinary. He coaches, extraordinary leaders. And I just think that is such a perfect word to describe our guest today. His name is Stefan Schneider. And he is in my eyes truly extraordinary in the way he does everything, his commitment to being extraordinary as a coach and as a human being. And in just everything he does in life is such has been such an inspiration and an eye opener for me as to who I can be in the wild. And so I'm extremely excited and inspired to have this conversation with Stephen today. For the extraordinary being that he is Stephen, welcome.

Gosh, thank you for that, what a gift what a blessing to receive such heartfelt words of gratitude and acknowledgement. I'm already moved, already have tears in my eyes. It's just a warning for anyone listening, it may get mushy.

Oh, that's amazing. Well, I'll say also, thank you, this is actually the second time we are recording a conversation and we just felt like we wanted to, to explore more deeply. And from Yeah, just from a place of being so our intention today is is to not just talk about being but the to explore what it really means for for the both of us and, and particularly in the area of creation, and creating. And Stephan, someone who, from who was featured in the the ultimate coach book, and he's someone who went through a phase in his life where he really hit rock bottom. And I'd like you to share a little bit more about that stuff. And about a time in your life where you were going. You were an alcoholic and going through addiction and how you discovered or how you have the gift of being coached by Steve Hardison and what that's done for you. Just as a as a way to introduce yourself, Would you would you like to say share a little bit about that story and to bring a bit of context of who you are.

Yeah, sure. I would love to. My dear brother mine, Steven is the correct pronunciation. My first name and sharing about this may take me 15 to 20 minutes. Is that okay? I can offer an abridged version if that would be if that would better serve.

I, Steven, I would like for you to just share whatever your heart wants to share right now.

Okay, I love that. That's all the way to heart. So we live in a culture that likes the party a little bit. And where I grew up, that was normal and fun. For a while, until it became the solution to my emotional pain. And there was a real turning point in me, for me in my life when I was a teenager, and I experienced the heartache of a breakup. And words were exchanged. judgments were believed. And I felt deep anxiety and shame and grief and sadness. And it was a level of emotional injury I had never experienced. So rather than talk about it, ask for support, ask for help. I chose to numb it. I chose to nominate, I went right into my parents liquor cabinet, poured a huge cup of vodka, sprinkled in a little bit of orange juice, and chugged it as fast as I possibly could. And I numbed my pain. And at that time, it seemed to me to work.

I felt better. And I went right back to being and doing what I wanted and could hang out with my friends and have fun and pretend basically, like it never had happened. And that was the moment when a very dangerous habit became a solution for pain. As I grew a little older, I discovered smoking marijuana. And that helped me to stop thinking the thoughts that produced the pain. So now I had a strong and dangerous solution to emotional pain that was ever evolving, eventually led me to harder drugs. And I don't know if you've seen the documentary recently on Hulu, I think called dope sick.

I haven't seen it. No.

It's about pharmaceutical companies and how they created and promoted a drug called Oxycontin, and how it led to an epidemic and many deaths, many, many deaths around the world and that was almost one of them. That's what really got me to. And gosh, I don't know if I've shared this much detail publicly before feeling a little vulnerable. In any event, you can imagine what that what that led to, I ended up creating a hell and I was in a really dark place. I just kept numbing and numbing, numbing and never really growing through anything ever opening up just keeping everything bottled inside, I was master of secret suffering. And pretending that I was okay smiling on the inside and crying or smiling on the outside and crime on the inside. And I really didn't want to wake up some some mornings I remember, I have this specific memory of holding an 80 milligram oxycontin in my hand. And at this point it was it was late at night and at this point in the debt already ingested so much was already whacked out of my mind. And I thought to myself, if I take this whole thing, there's a chance this could go really bad. And then the next second is taking it down. And thankfully I woke up. I remember my mom around that time saying something like really worried about you. And I remember her thinking I'm really worried about me too. To no way out the no way out to spiritual experiences led to the best path I could have ever asked for. One I was at my drug dealers home and we're waiting for a big shipment to come in and with a bunch of other people hooked on the same stuff. And if you know anything about opiates, if once you start and keep going. You can't stop without getting really sick. Really, really sick. The withdrawal is grueling and hellish. There was a chance that shipment may not come in. So we're all freaking out. And I had this moment that I share often where I swear it was like God lifted me up out of my body and showed me who I was be. He showed me who I was being. And I was stunned. And I had these thoughts like, holy shit, this isn't you. This isn't you, you got to get the hell out of here.

So I said, Give me my money back out. I'm done. Don't call me. I'm sorry for cursing. So I went home and doored hell of withdrawal. And I was able to stop those pills. But I still didn't recognize that I had a problem. So I kept chasing that feeling. And I kept numbing with alcohol and then weed and whatever else. And that led to another rock bottom, which was about seven or so months after that, and it was December 11 2012. I was bartending at that time, I was working a double shift and Sunday nights. in Morristown, New Jersey, where I'm from, from and where I was working. There was a what was called Latin Night at the dark horse of popular place at that time. And the guys in the kitchen, one that wanted to go and asked me if I wanted to go with them. And I said, Yeah, let's do it. And you know what, I'll drive I got a new car, and I'm not going to, I'm going to drink tonight. That's it, I really believed. I drank of course, quickly and rapidly and blacked out. Last thing I remember is ordering the rumble mins in a Corona on lights out to me. And on my way home, I don't remember much of this, I have a few blurred visions. But I remember, turn the radio on full blast punching the gas and flying like flying and attempted to make a turn no way and how I could make it smashed over the curb, slammed on the brakes and skin it and blasted my car straight into a huge tree completely annihilating my vehicle, completely annihilating it done. And I was still sort of out of it. And I'm like trying to move the cards. absolutely crushed. And this is about one two in the morning. And how cops came arrested. The whole thing how I woke up the next morning and just so much, so much emotional pain again. shame associated, I was so confused. I was 27 at this time. And now I just could get it you know, at one point in life I was so alive, so lit up. I love to live I love to dance, a tap dancer, I love to dance, I love to dream and imagine. And now here I am, in this darkness and so confused, so disoriented. Not sure what the heck to do. And and that's when God really came into my life on a deeper level. And he spoke to me through my brother who sat down with me right around that time. And said, he said, Steve, man, this is this is what's in the page 362 of the ultimate coach book. He said something like Steven, you gotta stop. Done. No more getting high. No more drinking. You got to make this the best damn thing that's ever happened to you in your life. That moment right there. I felt the possibility that inspired me. Now psych All right. I'm gonna do it. I'm gonna get sober. And I'm gonna make this the best thing that's ever happened to me. And I call a friend. I tag along with him to a 12 step meeting. And when I got there, I felt at home. I felt in my heart things that I thought only I thought. And I was lost by people who never knew me. They would care and call and it was amazing. It was amazing. In hindsight, I know because the 12 step is all about service. It's about service and it's more than just about doing good and feeling good and being loved being service.

For us. It's about living like we had to give literally to live. That's what it came down to. And I'm so grateful for that now because I know the embodiment of unconditional service with no hook Just pure kidding. And I got to receive that freely with so many wonderful people who are still so much part of my life, my sponsor, and my friends, my spiritual advisors, mentors. And most importantly, I got to begin really developing a relationship with the God of my understanding. I began to pray, and I began to ask for help to open up to share what was really going on. They say there's a book called flourish by Martin Seligman who pioneered positive psychology. And in the book, he's he finds that if we have at least one person with whom we can be honest, really, really honest, vulnerable, open up, share what's going on in our lives, we live a longer, healthier and happier life. We literally add years to our lives by having a safe container. That's why I love coaching so much is we get to create that I got to experience that back then, and I got to heal. I got to grow, I got to learn to love to forgive.

And it was the beginning of a truly wonderful path that would ultimately lead me to coaching. Shortly after, I began working the steps. One of my previous college dreams had come back into my mind, which was to go to law school and become a lawyer. And I was excited by that possibility. Terrified as well, as a lot of reading. And I decided to study for the Law School Admission Test, take it, I did, okay, I applied to a couple of schools, I got into a couple the ones who I wanted to go to which was close to home with great tuition was Rutgers. And they put me on their waitlist and rejected me. So I said, Okay, so I'm gonna law school this year, I kept doing what I was doing at that time, which was a personal trainer, and I was still bartending even in sobriety. My sponsor friend told me that I'm in no more danger there than anywhere. So long as I'm spiritually fit. I'm safe. So I stayed spiritually fit. And I kept doing what I was doing. And the following year, I was encouraged to apply again, I follow that whisper, applied again. And within two weeks, I got in. I got in. And now Mike. I'm feeling proud of myself. I'm feeling good. And I'm also really scared. Because reading and writing were not my strengths. This was a huge commitment, huge commitment. And I wasn't sure whether it was for me. So I prayed about it. And two interactions really solidified my choice. One was with my friends last mentor slash second sponsor, slash brother named Kenny. And he said, Do you think God had anything to do with it? I said, Well, I've been praying for it.

He's Oh, there you go. I thought, Wow, that really edge me toward the toward Yes. And then I had another interaction with this guy, Larry, where I was a personal trainer. And we were having just just a conversation, just having fun at the gym. And he said, out of nowhere, he didn't know what I was going through, or the decision I was facing. He said, you know, Steve, every time I had an opportunity to educate myself on my mind, I took it. And I was like, Oh, my God, Larry, you have no idea. God just spoke right through you, I swear. And I went home that day, and I and I put my seat deposit in and I was, I was gone. And along along that time between accepting and actually starting, I had met judge, right, who I also mentioned, and the ultimate coach. We connected while I was bartending. He invited me to his chambers, talk about the law, and connect. So I took him up on it. And we really connected and he was sharing with me about service and giving back. And given how important that was for me. I again said, I don't know if you're a believer, but I swear to god talk, I'm right through you. And he's jumped off and said, I am I read Scripture before I sit in the bench every day. And then he invited me to his church where he shared his story of overcoming incredible odds to become the honorable Michael J. Right. And that lit off fire on me. I went home that day, and I wrote never give up on a piece of paper, scotch taped it to my wall and I would look at that every single day.

And I was in I was ready. I was committed. Yet I still had this mindset of I just got a Like, I can do this, and I just got to make it through, I just got to survive this. And then I started listening to inspirational videos. And there's one by Les Brown that I shared about recently on our in our Facebook group called on the one on the one. And that video put the possibility in my mind that I could be number one, I could be number one to even think that thought was a breakthrough. And being and seeing the seeing of myself that is. And that's when I really stepped up. And I made an internal commitment like I had never made before in my life. And I showed up every day with that level of commitment. And when people were taking days off, and that was holidays, and it was birthdays, and it was weekends when people were partying, I knew I was going to turn it up and go even harder and study even harder. And I graduated number one in the class. And I remember just just crying through gratitude and thanking God and my car in the parking garage after the graduation ceremony. And went on to accept a awesome job with an awesome firm in New York City and got to do some really great work. Ultimately, I discovered, however, that it wasn't for me long term. So I went in. And I started to look around and see what really spoke to me, started to talk to God and started to really perform some deep introspection, and soul searching. And I discovered something called coaching. And once I really got a taste of what coaching was, I fell completely in love with it.

I thought, wow, I could use everything I've been through. I could use everything, I've developed all my skills, all my talents, all my gifts, everything I've got to make a meaningful difference in someone's life. That's it. That's home for me, ongoing after that. So I decided to make a move, and I left, I left the firm and it was it was unexpected. I had this plan, I was going to wait a certain amount of time, save up a certain amount of money. And then I was gonna go, I swear, I went in one day I'm so unhappy. I was I was in a real funk and I just got lifted up, I swear Spirit moved me. And I walked right down to the position, what I want to I want to the person's office, so I had to inform that I was gonna send in my two weeks. And it was a shock. And it was like what, why, huh? Well, you're doing so well. And everyone loves you and partners are are fighting for you. And the different groups are wanting you to be in their group and you're making so much money and all this and I said thank you. Thank you. I know, I know. And my priorities in life are just shifting right now. And fulfillment is number one for me. Fulfillment. I'm here to serve a purpose. And I'll be damned if I don't. So I went for it. And during that transition, oh, man, that was a heck of a journey. And that is where I I came to know Steve Hardison who I love and appreciate so much for the difference in the influence he has had in my life. It's scary, it was scary. I was living in Manhattan had a lot of bills to pay and went from making the handsome income to none. And I was often operating from a place of fear and doubt. And sometimes I would cry with fear. I just didn't know what to do, how to do it if I could do it.

And I remember hearing about Steve Hardison at a rich lit been intensive in 2018. And my friend Mike Harris sends you the audio TVO li ke NFL. And I hear it I'm walking down Lexington Avenue in Manhattan on my way to the mustard seed. It's called as the meeting calls that meeting in New York City. How apropos and it just hit me just like the judge's words hit me, just like Les Brown's words hit me. It just struck a chord deep within the depth of my soul. And I was I was committed. And I was going to make it and I was going to create my dreams. And that was the only option. That was it. And I declared shortly after that after seeing Steve's declaration after receiving a book from him, by Nadine the wonderful Nadine larder, where I got to see his clients declarations infused onto the masterpiece wall in his backyard. I just felt spirit writing through me and I declared I am I have a full coaching practice with him. waiting lists. And within a few months, I really did.

I couldn't, I couldn't believe it simultaneously, the power of commitment and the power of who we declare ourselves to be. And eventually, I got to spend time with Steve in his sacred coaching office in Arizona. And was that something was that something, I got to be with a possibility for love, for freedom, for service, for power, for kindness, for confidence, for humility, in a way I had never experienced. And by being with him, and by being with his sharing of him in his life, and how he serves, and how he loves, and how gives, I got to, I got to experience a possibility from my own life. And that grew me profoundly. And how I show up now for myself and my wife, for my clients, for strangers. I went to the post office a couple days ago, and had the most pleasant interaction, the woman was so nice. And at the end of our interactions, he says, Be well and stay safe. And she said, it was such a such a warmth and sincerity that I felt moved by it. And, you know, they give you like a three foot long receipts. And they circle some, they say, here's a survey. And most of the time, people don't fill that out. I couldn't wait to fill it out. I couldn't wait to go home and go online, and share about my interaction. Because that is the beauty of humanity that we need so badly in the world right now. And that's be in love. That's be in love.

And you mentioned extraordinary leadership. Yeah, we are all that. There's an awesome book called The leader who had no title. And it drives home the message that we're all leaders, we're all important, what we say matters, who we be matters, what we do matter. We all make a difference. Even if we're even if we're at home, loving ourselves and offering a prayer that makes a difference.

Well, thank you for that incredible introduction of who you are. Steven, I'm so moved by by your story, I acknowledge you for the vulnerability and how you share it. I feel the heart, the passion, the resilience and, gosh, everything you've been through. But there's one thing I hear that recurs over and over and over again, throughout your story from the very beginning. Till today, the one thing I kept hearing was the word commitment. Like from the moment when you said, you were listening to your brother, you said you got to stop. You said I made a commitment to change my life. Then, also, when you heard Les Brown, you made a commitment to never give up. You made a commitment. You saw the possibility of being number one. You made a commitment law school, you made a commitment and this constant commitment that you make. It feels a commitment that is very internal and powerful. And for a long time, I didn't like the word commitment. Because I had a lot of it felt very just felt like I'd like a would constrain me. And for someone who loves freedom, I just I kind of shied away from the word commitment. And what I'm hearing from you and from reading the book is an embodied form of commitment from the level of your soul when you make that commitment to show up and be who you really want to be and create what you really want to create in the world. So I would love to hear like, what does commitment really mean to you, Steven?

That's a great question. I appreciate your loving listening. A lot. Thank you fill up. What does commitment mean to me? I'm not immediately sure how to articulate what commitment means for me. I think I think I've expressed what it means for me and the sharing of how it's lived me. And as another possibility it's being moved deeply and inspired by a possibility that speaks to our soul. And binding ourselves to that possibility.

Did you say binding? Binding? I love that word. Yeah. Yeah. Such a, it's such a legal word as well.

There's still legal eagle in me. Maybe a lot. Yes, it's, it's interesting, too, because it's like binding to possibility and giving myself permission to detach from the outcome, and operate in a way that's beyond.

In the context of your story, you mentioned how you started working with Steve Hardison, and you made this commitment to yourself that you're going to have a waiting list of clients. So there was you saw that as a possibility for you. And then you created from that possibility? Is that what I'm hearing you created from that possibility every day?

Yeah, how

that happened. From the moment you committed to having a waiting list of clients, to that actually happening in what you said, How many months? Like just a few, how many months? Have that happened?

Just a few months? Yeah.

Can you share a little about that story of how you created that? What you learned from it? And what was the role like war, or just whatever you want to share about that? I'd love to hear about that.

Sure. So when I wrote it down, I typed it out. And I made it the background of my laptop, so I could see it every day. And the commitment, lift me it literally lift me and it would be it was with me every day and I was showing up in the new way. And I was I was doing what I knew worked well for me. And what worked well, for me at that time was waking up and honoring my time with God, exercising. Going to 12 Step meeting and getting myself spiritually fit. That was the number one ingredient for me to staying spiritually fit in as one with God as I could possibly be. And from that place i i, I shared with people who I was and what I was up to, I opened up vulnerably in a way I hadn't before publicly and on social media, I started to share my story. At that time, I had around six years of sobriety, and I still felt some shame about it. And I started to open up more about it and start to share. And people could resonate. And again, it turns out that we're all so similar in so many ways. And that I also learned that when we're willing to be open and vulnerable and share from our hearts, that creates such a deep connection and trust. And one of the things I I love to do with anyone who expresses an interest to work with me is I love to spend a couple of hours together, just sharing. That's it just sharing that and when I'm talking about working together, or investment or anything, we're just sharing, or just sharing who I am or my life, they're live listening deeply being present with each other, and establishing that foundation that trust and love and integrity. And I have found that that creates a foundation for miraculous miraculous results. And so and it's so fun, and it's so fulfilling. Does that help answer the question.

Yeah, um, you know what, there's also something else that I'm hearing in connection to this and in your story. Here's how it looks like to me. Now. I'd love to hear if this this is true for you. It sounds like as you told your story, like the moment you committed. You started something shifted in your being and you were stunned. You're able to be open to hearing what you call the voice of God. speak through you speak through other people. It was almost like from that commitment, something in your being shifted for you to be open to hear things that you were not hearing before.

Yeah, it did. It opened up a channel of communication with the, with the God of my understanding for sure. And empowered my courage. I was always afraid of people's opinions. people pleasing, who've was a big part of part of my being for so long and still isn't times and are scared to share my innermost thoughts and my views and my beliefs. I was scared, I would think about what people who I went to freakin elementary school, what are they gonna think of me? I mean, just just wild fears that would stop me from sharing. And once I had more courage than fear, yeah, I could go, I could express myself.

Yeah. Yeah. Amazing. And it's like, commitment leads to courage. Yeah, leads to create him.

Yes, and the fulfillment of the deepest desires we hold in our hearts.

Yeah, that's so powerful. And I can I can really relate to, to what it's like to commit to something and declare it publicly. And it comes with a shame of what if I fail? And what if I, what if I don't make it and, but I've told people about it, and I, and for me, that has often held me back in, in making commitments because of the fear that I would have if I if I don't make it. And I got to see that. When I commit, internally, I commit to Who do I need to be to create whatever it is I want to create. And they fit? If and when you talk about this attachment to outcome. Like when we can let go of the outcome, we get to shift our being and raise to the occasion of who do we need to be to create in your case, a waiting list of of clients that want to work for you. There was like a shift in your being for you to create that.

Yes, deep shift, deep and profound shift.

And you were willing to do things that were uncomfortable, you were willing to be judged by others, you are willing to be misunderstood in some of the things that you say, in service of your commitment.

Yes. Yes. And doing the internal work to lose my concern for other people's opinions of me, right, was remarkably liberating. Yeah, and when when that happens, things on lock, yeah. We are free. Exactly. We are free to be express who we really are, what we really love, what we're really committed to, and we can serve how we're meant to serve.

So powerful, I can feel just the power in your voice. I can feel the power in your being, and just feel your commitment. And also, another thing that really struck me about you, Steven is like your level of intention. And everything you write, you know, one of the things I started noticing about you is just how he was so intentional with every word with its, you know, for people who have seen you on social media, and the way that you respond to comments, even the way that you respond to this question that I just asked you earlier on around what does commitment mean to you? The way you take the time, the place you go to, to find an answer, and how you're just that level of intention and how you're not. You're always committed to speaking from whatever is the deepest truth in the moment. And not just whatever occurs to you in your mind. And I want to acknowledge you for for just modeling that, for me and for all of us today. And the way that you showed up the possibility of, of slowing down of really honoring your commitment to speaking your deepest truth.

I just I feel that's so that's so beautiful. And I'm, I'm just so appreciative of you for, for how you're showing up in our conversation today. Wow.

Philip, thank you so much for acknowledging me and creating me the way you do, it means the absolute world to me, I have, I have put in a lot of hard and hard work to create who I am. And I have spent so much time and energy and effort in my communication, and creation and being loved. So to be seen, heard and recognized and acknowledged, means so much to me, you have just given me one of the greatest gifts I could possibly receive. Thank you. Thank you, thank you.

Thank you so much. I'm kind of lost for words right now. So I'm just going to just be with the beauty, the beauty of this moment with you.

There's something else that's kind of bubbling up for me. And in a conversation we recently had you, you spoke about integrity. And you gave the story of someone who showed up two minutes late for a call, and how you how you handle that. And that really, really struck me and I I thought about that for a long time. And I and I would love to hear that from your again. Do you remember what you said about integrity and what that means to you?

I believe so. Yeah. Integrity is one of the most empowering distinctions to in ways of being. For me, it is it is doing what we say as intended. And on time, it is living in alignment with our truth, the essence of our being, and, and beyond. So this this story, one of the stories and this has happened multiple times. Someone reached out right before our session time started. I do my sessions by by phone, I, I love that, like you saw before we started recording, I create my space, I've been the lights, I got candles, I got the sage going, I really create a sacred space. And I get a message saying hey, can we start 10 minutes late? I'm running late, we start 10 minutes late. And the people pleaser me wanted the view like Sure. And then the commitment came online. My commitment to him. And I said something to the effect of No, that won't be possible. If I say yes, then I'll be perpetuating a way of being that's not serving you. And that is not who I'm committed to being for you. And I would never do that to you.

And what are you telling me? Like what was that? What was the response to that?

Well, would the example I'm thinking of in my mind right now, I'm not sure if it's the same one we spoke with last time, but with the example I'm thinking of in my, in my mind, they heard it, they heard me, they heard my love, they heard my service, they felt it. And they were they appreciated that I was holding them to a standard of impeccable integrity. And that has been that was one of the most life changing moments for for this one person. They've told me that. Yeah. And what's what's great too, is I, it's an opportunity to, to be a stand for someone to truly be a stand for someone's integrity, for me has been one of the most challenging things. Because I never know how it's gone land sometimes doesn't go so well. Sometimes it can it can trigger the listener. And the conversation is a little different.

I'm wondering, you know, because this is this has also has been something that I have been showing up this way a lot more and also with France. So for example, I'll have F sometimes I have a friend who says he'll call me on a certain day and and then he doesn't and I don't hear from him who actually this is just something that happened recently. And and I remember just writing to him and saying hey, Who you being by saying, who you being by saying, you're going to call me, and then not call me. And it was so easy for me to just say that to a friend. Because usually I would say something like, Hey, what happened? You didn't call is everything. Okay? I would package in a way in a way that was like, Oh, I'm just checking in with you. And I'm curious, but this in a way, this was more edgy, because I felt like I was calling him out, right? Like, who are you being? saying, like, who you being and being out of integrity, right. And it was edgy for me to do that. It created such a possibility for a deeper connection. And hmm, and I, and it's a risk, because it can also backfire. And I can, you know, I can see that, you know, going going both ways. And it really depends on sort of what is what is the state of mine? Or what is the state of being of the person receiving that message? So I haven't I haven't figured out what's the like, what's the best way to do this, but I'm curious for you, like, if there's been some Yeah, like, outside of coaching? Like, what is it like for you? Are you do you take a stand for that level of integrity with your friends and family?

It depends. If I, if I think it will be in service, then yeah, like, if, if it might, yeah, just without overcomplicating it, I'll just say, I'll just say yeah, I do. In one example. I have one friend, and we would catch up every so often and connect and he tried to last minute dodge on me. And I'm like, nope. Like, can we sorry, someone's running late, like, not totally, like non emergency or anything, just just lay in? Can't? Can we do another time? Like at the very last minute? So no, apps? No, that won't work for me. It's either integrity, or integrity or nothing. And he heard it respected it. We got on we call it we got that we're good call Cattanach. That caught up, but, and I really heard from him much since. And he hasn't responded to many of my messages since. So whether that's the cause? I'm not sure. That's what happened in that situation. And so yeah, there that is, and I would really love to share something else if it's okay. It's related. It's it's related. It's not exactly on point with Yeah, go ahead. People outside of coaching. So this has to do with people inside the context of coaching. What I love about that opportunity is it gives me the space to share about restoring integrity, and how we can do that in a really powerful, beautiful way. And so it's a way to acknowledge what happened, we acknowledge the impact. And then we make a new commitment. So for example, if I was late with you, and this goes for me, to even implicit agreements, like if, for example, if I tell you, I'll call you back soon. That to me that I think about what you would expect. Yeah. And that's the agreement that's there for me, you soon doesn't mean a month later, I'm gonna call you soon means I'm gonna call you soon, probably within a few a few days, or that day, it depends really on the on the situation. So there it is. And so if we started, if I started late, I would say I might say something like, Philip, we have an agreement to start at this time. We're started at this time. And the impact is that we now now we have less time together. Now I don't have the full opportunity to seize the opportunity to seize the opportunity of our being together. And there's also an impact on you know, you might feel frustrated you you might feel disrespected. You might feel like I don't honor your time. And I want you to know from this point forward, I'm committed to to operating with impeccable integrity and showing up for our calls on the button. You can feel it, you can feel the entire restoration,

I can feel that I also want to share a story that I had with so rich rich habits as someone who I've been in touch with a lot, and especially since since reading this book, and he's someone who's very, very direct, and he's, he's a dear friend, but sometimes he can really trigger me. And there have been moments in our friendship where I've been wanting to, like, say, Go to hell, I never want to speak to you again, like, like, you know, that's what I would have wanted to say, right? Like, like, no joke like that, like, there have been moments where he probably felt the same way about me. So we, you know, we have been kind of loving each other hardly and challenging each other hardly, and at the same time, we never really create a container for that to be. And as coaches, sometimes it's a little slippery, because that we can go quickly from being a coach to being a friend, and the lines can be a little blurry. And, and, and so we created this container around, I, it's so the container is I have your back no matter what. And what that means is no matter how upset, I may be about something, or no matter how upset he is about something, we are not going to let that get in the way of our friendship, and our growth, and the opportunity to become powerful creators for each other. And that was really, you know, he he created that together with me as a as a possibility, not not just a possibility, but but as a as a commitment to our friendship, and our commitment to how we want to be with each other. So it gave us permission to get upset to get triggered, but it allowed for recovery. Not just allowed. But through this, we said we're going to, we're going to recover no matter what. So it doesn't matter how, how direct or how upset we are with what with what someone says. And I think like and also what I've noticed is since we've made that commitment to one another, we've been so much more gentle and loving to one another. Wow.

Wow, I love that creation commitment and container. You guys have both spoke into being so beautiful and so powerful and so loving.

Yeah, and I want to acknowledge rich for that. Because it was it was something that he brought up in a conversation. And, you know, just as I share that with you, I really feel inspired to create that with, with other friends, other people, people that I really value in my life, and for us to create a container. Even friends, you know, like, just that. It just shows I care. I care about our friendship. And I want to make sure that our friendship is above and before our differences. And yeah, I'm just just appreciating the the inspiration I'm getting from from what I just shared, you know that oh, what else? I could do that? You know that? How I haven't? Yeah, I just love that.

Yeah, awesome. I love the possibilities being born right now. Let's go.

Yeah. And we do that, as coaches. You know, we were we were masterful at creating containers around around conversations. And, and that's Yeah, that's so that's so important. And I think it's that integrity as well. I was actually speaking to a friend just two days ago. And and, again, it was just just noticing that I wanted to help him with something than just slowing down and asking for permission. I said, well, would it be okay if if I coached you through this process? And he said, Well, yeah, sorry, I need to ask. And I said, Well, actually, I do need to ask, and I want your permission. Because I'm, I'm going to, I'm going to show up for you. And I'm going to show up fully and I'm not going to you know not going to be here as a friend like I'm really going to step it up and immediately he started to sit up on his chair immediately. Yeah, like his the kind of his that there was an excitement that was there and who he was being completely shifted from the moment. He said, Yes, I give you permission. And if I hadn't done that, and just spoken to him from that contract from from that place of I am your friend? No way? Would I have been able to help? No way they would have been. So there's so much resistance. So I had to, like, create that. And then it's like a allowing for that conversation to happen. And so for me what I'm, you know, what I'm hearing in this conversation is integrity is how I'm creating myself to be in service to whoever is in front of me.

Yes. Yes. Being who you say you are.

Yeah. Yeah. And how I can be out of integrity. By creating myself without creating the person I'm speaking to, they they need to create. I need to create myself, but I also need to create myself for the person I'm speaking to. Yes. Does that make sense?

Absolutely. Speak who you are into their listening. Right? Totally.

Right. Because only from there. Can I show up and integrity?

Yeah, I love that. That's pay. I

love that. I love the clarity I'm getting from this. It's something that I it's, it's like something that I've been doing. But I don't I feel like now, through this conversation. I'm just, I'm just getting much more clear. And I can be way more intentional about that. And I'm not I'm just less. Now I'm kind of less concerned about powerfully showing up for friends in this way, you know, creating a container stuff because they there have been there have been people in my life that I just love so much. And I just felt a little stuck around. How can I be in integrity and be with them and not feel like this is draining me. And now now that this is how it's through that container?

Yes, yeah.

Break. Yeah, now, I'm actually excited to speak to some of these friends that I've met. I've kind of like, I guess I've had some conversations. I've been procrastinating a little just because I, I wasn't, that wasn't clear around how to approach it. And now I'm like, oh, yeah, this is how I can approach it. And it's just asking for permission. Whether they say yes or no, is it's totally cool. But it's very empowering for them.

Yeah. So on the being in the being, maybe that's right, all in the Bing. I love who you are being

well, that's, that's what a gift. Steven, thank you so much. I can't believe it's, that's we're approaching. I think it's already been an hour or so that we are in this beautiful conversation. So we're just gonna slowly just bring it bring our time together to a close and I wanted to just ask you what else would you like to share? Before we complete our conversation today?

I'm feeling call to share one more thing, a practice that me and one of my clients recently created is bringing, bringing an extra awareness to every interaction, and recognizing that every single interaction is an opportunity to love and serve. Every single interaction, by example, I got a mass email sent to me by the the Pennsylvania's lawyers Assistance Program, they're putting together certain programs and I received the email. And with that extra awareness, I can see their commitment to serving in the way that they're serving and all the work they're doing and and that's just replied, and acknowledged their work and that it's making a meaningful difference. And I just wanted them to feel seen and appreciated. And it's that awareness that, that that helped that creation come into being. So that's the throne feeling called to share is that practice of bringing an extra awareness to every interact, every interaction, and realizing it's an opportunity to go out and serve and be who we are. And all more things coming through. Anyone who's listening, I love you. I believe in you. And I pray that the God or God of your understanding, blesses you abundantly and brings peace into your heart and let you know that you are safe and faith and that you are right You're supposed to be and you are going exactly where you're supposed to be going. Amen.

Amen. Thank you, Steven, for that message of hope for everyone. What an inspiration you are one of the beautiful being that you are. And I appreciate everything that you've brought into this conversation and beyond. I love you. I am beyond grateful for who you are. Thank you

receive love you. Thank you too.