As I talked with Amanda Hofman, co-founder and CEO of Go To Market, a branded merchandise studio, we explored the idea of being stuck in a middle we know will end and downplaying our own pain. Amanda shared her love of fitness and competition, but also discussed her struggle with injuries and how they've affected her ability to participate in races and the impact it has had on her overall.

I appreciated Amanda’s candidness about her experience, but also the fact that this middle hasn’t ended and is still a struggle.

About Our Guest - Amanda Hofman

Amanda Hofman is the Co-Founder and CEO of Go To Market, a branded merchandise studio that focuses on sustainable, beautiful design. We create custom print-on-demand swag shops for companies and brands of all sizes.

She lives in NYC with her husband, two kids and rescue pup.

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My Happy Curves

Welcome to sharing the middle of where recovering

perfectionist overachievers.

And anyone in the middle of a Strava come together to learn, to

embrace the messy middles of life.

I am so excited for today's episode because I'm talking to Amanda Hoffman.

She is the co-founder and CEO of go to market, a branded merchandise studio.

That focuses on sustainable, beautiful design.

They create custom print on demand, swag shops for companies

and brands of all sizes.

She lives in New York city with her husband, two kids and rescue

pup I connected through, Hey mama with Amanda and basically

just became a huge fan of her.

And.

All about her.

I think we have a really wonderful conversation.

About this idea Pain Olympics.

I think it, I would call it.

Where we often downplay our own pain because we know somebody has it worse.

And the reality is we're all allowed to feel.

The pain and struggle that we feel.

I really appreciate that.

I also appreciate that Amanda was a little nervous because she's

usually talking about her business and today's episode is so personal.

Thank you to her for opening and sharing It's a really great conversation.

I think you'll think she's as cool as I do.

Let's get started.

Welcome Amanda.

I am so excited to talk to you for sharing the middle because you and I connected

a few months ago and you're someone that I'm like, oh, she's my friend, even though

we've really only talked that one time.

but I'm really excited to have you because one, I think your business is really cool

and we're really not gonna talk about your business, but I think it's really cool.

and two, I.

one, you and I just had a really nice long chat before even hitting record,

and I'm like, oh my gosh, I can't hear.

Wait to hear what you have to say of just thoughtful things.

So why don't you introduce yourself to our listeners?

hi, I'm Amanda.

I'm so excited to be here and I've been looking forward to this conversation.

I was telling Lacey that, I feel really good and confident and awesome

when I'm talking about my business and I'm not here to talk about

my business, and so I'm like, I.

I have like the, a little bit of the scaries, but they're the good scaries

where it's like, okay, we're gonna come to the other side of this and

it's gonna be really fun and exciting.

but by way of introduction, I live in New York City with my

husband and my dog and my two kids.

I have a branded merchandise company and we run things differently from

normal merchandise cuz we do things really sustainably and we try to make

beautiful items that people wanna keep in the long run that reflect a brand in

a really authentic and beautiful way.

so I'll leave that there.

I am curious, I don't know if we talked about this, what part

of New York City do you live in?

I'm in upper Manhattan.

One of my really good friends lived in Brooklyn and I fell in, in love

with New York when I would visit her.

And so just every time I'm just like, what part are you in?

Okay.

I can, picture it and all that stuff.

It's a fun place to live.

Very exciting, very busy.

Very loud.

Yeah.

and it's also funny cuz it's just such a world away.

Like I live in the Midwest and a very mid-sized town and in the suburbs,

so I feel like it's also good to see how even being farther away

and that kind of stuff, how much we have in common, I think is pretty

cool.

Yeah, it's amazing.

I love working.

I love meeting people from all over the country and finding all

the commonalities cuz we're all just people at the end of the day.

What did you think of when I, you first heard the concept of the middle

or what does the middle mean to you?

Because everybody has their own visceral, this is what it is for me.

To me, it's just like massive discomfort.

It's the place I don't wanna be.

I love this.

Just massive discomfort.

massive discomfort.

It's the position where like you don't.

you've gone in a certain amount and like you absolutely don't

know how it's gonna end up.

And it's just uncomfortable and scary.

And for somebody who likes to be in control, which is I think most people,

it's like doubly scary when you're not like a go with the flow person.

and there's no number of like lists or planning that is gonna fix it.

You just eventually, and as I'm getting older, realizing that the only

way out is to just make peace with the waiting as you get through it.

I feel so similarly like that is like, when I think of the

middle, that's what I think of that place where you're like, oh.

Here,

Yeah,

so

here and I don't have a plan, or I have a plan, but I know that there

is no real plan to get me outta here.

Now, do you see any positive aspects of the middle or.

the middle I'm gonna talk about is, I could say that I see

positive aspects, but it's a lie.

It depends which part of me you ask.

if you talk to like my, like inner.

Child, like base instinct.

It's just like all panic and everything else around that

is okay, we're gonna breathe.

that's my meditation.

Yoga self is okay, we're gonna breathe, we're gonna be patient,

we're gonna find our way through.

And it's you know the warring of those two sides?

In general, would you say that you're an impatient person?

Oh yeah.

Oh yeah.

My friends at one point used to call me Demanda.

So that gives you a picture.

very much want what I want.

And living in Manhattan all this time, you really don't learn patience cuz

everyone here wants what they want, when they want it, and they want it now.

if you've ever tried to order salad in Midtown, you know what I'm talking about.

It's like one of the most stressful experiences you can have because

if you don't know what, if you don't know exactly what you want.

The 50 people in line behind you and the people who are making your salads

stare at you like you're, naked on stage.

what are you doing?

Get at, get it going and get outta here.

we're all here for our salad and we're all in a rush.

Do you want blue cheese?

Yes or no?

Move on.

No, you tell them like what you want, you're just like super

clear and move your way through.

And if you do it right, you're just like in and out.

And if you don't do it right, like you're gonna feel the fire

of a thousand eyes on your back.

picture of Manhattan.

I actually love living here.

I really do.

I've made such a beautiful community and I can talk for hours about

why I love living here, but there are some stressful parts.

yesterday who's from New York.

She lives in the Bronx, and we were talking, and I said my husband

found his people in New York.

They're not mean.

They're not, they are actually rather kind people.

They just have a direction that they're going, that they're getting in.

and this can mean in a lot of different ways.

They're getting their salad.

They need to get their salad.

They have a purpose, they move with purpose, and they don't have time

interest to paddle you along the way.

They've got their

I think the people mistake New Yorkers for being really cold

when actually they're not that at all.

And if you.

fall on the street or drop something like 50 people will help you up

and, hand your wallet back and everyone's there to help you.

But because you're literally so close to everyone, you put on a

face of I'm gonna pretend that I'm not in your armpit right now.

I'm gonna pretend that like I can't smell you.

and that is like a cold face, but that's just like a.

Sort of necessary protection.

there's no, I think that when people come here, it's oh,

nobody's looking at each other.

Nobody's communicating.

And it's like we're all just taking some time to ourselves.

But if anybody needs anything, or when I used to be on the subway with

my, like when my kids were really young, everyone's like cooing at the

baby, like kissy faces at the baby.

Like it's actually quite friendly.

You just, it doesn't look at necessarily,

Yeah, I will never forget, we were walking somewhere and there was

one woman with a stroller and she was about to go upstairs and this

guy, you could tell, didn't know her.

He was like, do you want me to hold this side for you?

And she was like, sure.

And they just went up, he just

helped her.

And then he went along his way and she went

you don't, I don't really see people struggling.

I have offered obviously to help people up the stairs with strollers or bags or

whatever, but You just don't see like an older person go on the subway and

three people not get out of their seats.

It's just not, yeah, it's a misimpression.

I think that people have.

I also think it's interesting, and I know this isn't what we're

talking about, but that's fine because I think it also has to do with, Space.

So like New Yorkers have such a small space that is just their personal space.

So it makes sense to me that when you go out, a lot of the city

is still in your, what you would consider your personal space.

Whereas for me, in the Midwest, once you l you have enough space

that once you leave your house, you.

Put on a little bit more of a show because there's a much

bigger, separation between the two

than I think as well.

And so just the physicalness of it

Yeah.

And you're commuting in your car where you like have all

your space like we're commuting.

Commuting sometimes like.

my least favorite thing is when I feel someone's hair on my body like that.

That is the thing that I'm like, I'd rather I could tolerate an armpit.

I can take my face in someone's backpack, but if your hair is

touching me, oh my God, like I'll do anything to get away from that.

Again, I'm painting a bad picture, but I really do love it here.

I promise.

I've lived here for a long time.

I went to college here and I've been here ever since.

I also, going back to your middle stuff.

I know that.

You worked in event planning

previously, and I feel like event planners hate the middle because they

are in control in the beginning, right?

You can control all your prep, you can control all of that, and it's in the

middle where things go wrong, and that's.

that's interesting because like in my work, I've always felt very confident.

And I feel so, I felt so good about my event planning company that I, that

discomfort, if there was discomfort in the middle, it was a welcome discomfort.

It was pleasant even when things were going wrong.

It was like part of an exciting adventure.

And I feel that way in my business now that I'm definitely

in the middle with my business.

Like we're three years in, we're growing.

there's growing pains certainly, but I'm excited about it.

It's the middle I'm excited to be in, cuz I know that there's good stuff before,

there's good stuff now and there's good stuff coming and it just all feels good,

which is not, so when I guess when I'm saying that the middle is uncomfortable,

I'm talking about like specific middles.

Yeah.

yeah, and once you get into it, the middle becomes everything

and it's becomes a problem.

And then you're like me, where you can't escape it, and you

finally just make it your work.

So I totally understand.

so I guess there is like middles that you like fully embrace that you

feel good about, and I think those are ones that you feel confident in, right?

Like I'm confident about my work and I know that if there's something I don't

know how to do that I will figure it out.

And I know that I'll get there.

I don't know how I'll get there, but I know that I will get there.

and I really believe that.

And so I'm not uncomfortable.

I'm not emotionally uncomfortable.

I'm like uncomfortable in times when, we've been, we, we'll make some mistakes

sometimes, and that's uncomfortable.

It's uncomfortable to mess up.

but I can, I feel that I can come back from those.

Yeah, that makes sense.

So why don't you, tell us about your middle moment that

we're gonna talk through.

My middle moment is that I love fitness, like I.

Working hard and exercising are like a joy to me and have been for a while.

And I really love competition.

I love racing.

I love running, I love biking.

I just really love it all.

And it's interesting cuz for a while I thought that it was about like weight

loss and the way that my body looked.

And I realized that in, in the past, five years.

I'm like, it's actually not about that at all.

And even if I took that piece away entirely, like I would

still wanna do this every day.

, it makes me feel good mentally, emotionally, I think it makes me a better

parent, a better spouse, better person.

there's no part of my life that it doesn't uplift.

but I struggle quite a bit with injuries and I always have

because I, I push a bit too hard.

And I always have pushed a little bit too hard.

So like even in high school, I was on the cross country running team

and I would twist my ankle cuz I just would be I'd be pushing too hard.

and in recent years I, I started racing.

And when I say racing, I'm gonna not put it in air quotes,

but I'm not winning anything.

I'm not, I, I wouldn't say that I'm an exceptional runner or athlete.

So when I'm showing up for these races, it's like for the fun of

the competition, for showing up, for the excitement, for the energy.

Especially in New York City, the races can have 20,000 people in them.

And so when you put 20,000 people like on the same course, it's just like exciting

af I just, it's so like the high of it is like real, But I have been, so since

February of 2022, I got planter fascitis, which is like a really dumb injury.

It just feel, it's like one of these things that like comes on slowly and it

feels like a bruise at the bottom of your foot and it's not that bad, but it's.

Annoying, but like it persists and it like just doesn't go away.

And if you run on it, it makes it worse.

so I was training for a race I was really excited about, which was the New York

City half in 2022, which I had to miss.

And then I also had to miss the marathon in 2022.

I had only done one other marathon in, 2019 and it was like one of the

best days I've ever had, taking out.

The birth of my children and marriage, blah, blah, blah.

the big sense.

Let's get those out.

Like I, it was just a really just victorious celebratory awesome day.

I just wanna say, I told a story on TikTok the other day about how meeting

Chewbacca was one of those days for me.

So I feel like you can be very valid

in running your marathon

as

Thank you.

I just you have to say yeah, I like the birth of my children.

I know that's important.

We can all accept that.

Yes.

Thank you.

anyway, I've done like 10,000 treatments for my foot and they finally got better,

and then I, the race that I missed last year, I was gonna do this year.

And I trained a little too fast for it because I was like cramming it in.

And in doing that I strained my hip, so then I'm not running again.

And I am, I really, I just, I.

it feels like I'm choking.

Like I just, like on one hand I think it's really, foolish and silly

because as I was talking to you about earlier, like I'm so grateful that

like my body is healthy, I am healthy.

we're talking about like a luxury activity that I have time to do.

Can I pause there

yes.

Thank you.

I disagree with what you just said about it being a luxury activity

because when you introduced it, it sounded like something that made your

life and being good and that has value.

That's not just luxury, that's self-care.

That is being at your best for your family.

That's just as important as the rest of your health.

So I.

I'm putting on my, don't talk to my friend that way.

I had of no, I I, think I just, I, when it becomes something that's part of your

day-to-day life that makes it better and that becomes a coping mechanism in

a positive way for the rest of your life and then you can't do that's a big deal in

my opinion, cuz that's a big change to your life.

Yeah.

Thank you.

it's a brain scrambler for me and I appreciate that too because they're,

for people who don't, Who are just like, not into fitness, which is fine.

I definitely don't need people to be into fitness, but it can

just be like, oh, poor you.

Like you can't go for a run.

It's like I hear that voice in my head and it's.

It's a hard one to quiet, especially when I look around, it's okay, I

don't have any like diseases or chronic injuries and all of that.

and then on the other hand, it's like really excruciating for me, like mentally,

emotionally to not be able to do this.

And my husband also races.

And, showing up for his races has been hard because, she can do the thing that

I wanna do, even though I'm so happy for him and I wanna be there for him.

it's just hard for me to show up in my fitness community and see the

runs that other people are doing and not feel like angry or jealous

or like frustrated or just shaking my fist at the sky sort of thing.

Yeah, I'm just like in this like injury chain and sometimes I feel okay about it.

Sometimes I'm like, it's okay.

I can be grateful about the other things.

I'm finding other ways to be fit.

There's all this other stuff that I can do.

and then other days I'm like, I'm never gonna run again.

I'm never gonna feel good again.

I'm never gonna race again.

And like it, I'm embarrassed.

I'm, it's like I find it.

cuz I see people and they're like, oh, are you running this?

Are you running that?

And I'm like, no.

I'm like injured again.

It's like I'm telling the story about myself, about being this injured person

and I don't wanna be telling that story both cuz I don't want it to be true

and because even if it is true, it's that's not the way to talk about it.

So I'm just

is that not the way to talk about it?

I'm curious.

I feel like there's nothing healthy about being

like, I am an injured person.

It's like,

Okay.

I just love the way that I'm just an injured person.

That's who I am.

Exactly though, because I feel like that mind body connection matters.

Yeah, it

And I don't know how much it matters in like a literal, I've been all

over the map with these, this past year and a half about I tried acupuncture and

that my acupuncturist talks about how.

I would be like this, and that hurts in my body.

and also I'm really stressed out.

He's like, well, we have to clear the stress because until we clear

the stress, there's no way you can heal the rest of your injuries.

And I'm like, crap

Yeah.

And then, but the way that I.

Really stress is to do this and

Yes, but also, like there's a lot of truth there, right?

Like if I am carrying not just the weight of the injury, but also the

weight of the story about my injury, Then that's double the weight, right?

Like I can put down one of them.

I hear two things.

One of the things that I talk about in with the middle is that I struggle

with this idea of moderation.

That there's like a just right amount.

And I often am the person that does too much.

I'm too loud, and so I, when you're talking about, I re-injured

myself by pushing myself too hard.

I'm like, oh, I totally get that.

And then there's becomes this track in your mind of this was my

fault if I just wouldn't have done

this, da, And then it becomes this story.

We tell ourselves that we're injured and then we beat ourself up for being injured.

And it just becomes a cycle.

Totally.

And I'm in that right now.

I am right there and on good days I can be like, Okay with it.

And on bad days I'm like, I so did this and I keep doing it and it's my fault.

And if only I had listened to my body and taken my training

slower and blah, blah, blah.

Ugh, those what ifs kill me like I do.

I just think about I fall a lot.

that's just always been a thing in my, but I always think about that

moment where ugh, if I wouldn't have, just, for example, I have a scar on

one on my forehead somewhere that, it was like a day before Christmas

I pulled too hard and the door, a door like cut me right here.

And then in all of our Christmas sodas, I've got what I called my

holiday head wound, and I'm just like, if I would've just taken one second.

And move my head back and not been too fast to get in the car cuz my

husband was coming to pick, It was like raining and all this stuff and

you can almost feel yourself back in that moment where it's slowed down.

Be like, if that was it, that was my, if that would've changed type thing.

And I'm curious, since

yeah.

I have a story that reminds me of a story of success I had with that where.

Where I accepted instead of saying I wish that I had done this differently,

I accepted and it was around parenting, which is another middle

that I'm much more comfortable with, like parenting and business like.

I don't wanna say I've got it right because you can never

be a master of those things.

But I'm comfortable with the uncomfortable there.

And I was having a situation, this is another New York City story where like

my daughter was really stressed out, and she was like really agitated and

then like I was getting agitated, like trying to ease her fears and then a train

was coming and we were rushing onto it.

And, We were like clumsy because we were like agitated, right?

So like we went onto the train and then my daughter like changed course

in the middle, bummed into me.

My phone flew out of my hand and down into the tracks between

the train and the platform.

I don't have my cell phone anymore.

It is under the subway.

I was like, this is fine.

This is, I really went to a zen place of Okay.

We were all just really agitated and like it made my movements fumble and

I, we all made some bad choices and now my phone's at the bottom of the tracks,

but I also know that it's gonna be fine.

It's gonna be fine.

Like the data is somewhere else.

If this phone gets crushed, like it'll be an expensive lesson, but, That's that.

And I also knew like it wasn't gonna get stolen.

No one was jumping down on the tracks.

We actually went where we were going cuz I talked to the attendant

and they were like, yeah, somebody will get it for you in a few hours.

I'm like, you know what?

We are gonna move on.

So we went to the event that we were going to, I was there without my phone.

I like realized how bad my sense of direction is cuz I'm like, I

think lemme know where we're going.

and.

We like came back and I like super calmly, almost out of body

cuz it's not like me to be calm.

I was like, went to the conductor.

I'm like, I dropped my phone here earlier.

They found it, they gave it to me and I'm like, got my phone, see everything's fine.

And I'm like, if only I could be like this about anything else in my life.

That is.

I wish that you could bottle what

that feeling

So imagine if you hit yourself in the forehead and you were like,

huh, I was moving too quickly.

Yeah.

That's what happened.

I think it's funny cuz my defense tank in the Zoom is humor.

So you heard me, I called it my holiday head wound.

I

like

made it a thing, And, That's how I took control of the situation.

And I'm also a person who likes control.

So that when you said I like control and seeing it through that lens, I totally

get why this specific injury in this specific area feels so out of control.

Cuz it's not like you tripped and scraped your knee.

It's not like you did, It was an over the time now, was there a moment where

you were like, . I heard it again, or was it just a, it started to flare up more?

I'm just curious to understand.

It's been both, but this latest one with my hip was like a, it happened.

like I was doing too much distance and it ha like I got to mile

nine and it was like boom injury.

and then I've aggravated it since trying to, test it and

push it and things like that.

and it's like I can see clearly for these other things, like with the, with the

phone on the subway and, things in my business, I can just be chill about it.

Like it's uncomfortable, but I can be chill.

But with this injury, I have this like childlike panic of

am I ever gonna be okay again?

Is this ever gonna be okay?

Am I ever gonna get to the other side of this?

And also, it's been a long time, it's been like a year and a

half that I've been dealing, not able to run the way that I want.

And it's it's pretty miserable.

I also wanna be clear with people I asked you, you gave me some

different things that you might wanna talk about, and I asked you, Chuck,

about this because I feel like a lot of times people come onto the podcast and

they're like, I did this, and this, and then everything was beautiful and great,

and I really appreciated you being like, This sucks and I am still here and we're

not gonna, we're not gonna end this with

There's no happy ending.

I related it to my pregnancy experience of like, I.

Hated being pregnant.

I was sick all the time.

I lost weight in pregnancy.

I then got gestational diabetes and couldn't eat what I wanted to eat, which

is already hard when you can't eat cuz you're throwing up and then you have to

poke yourself so many different times and it's a really weird place to be in

of, I know that there's an end to this.

Like with pregnancy, I'm gonna give birth so this baby is gonna come out.

You know what I mean?

That's gonna happen no matter what.

I just have to get through this and that middle, I personally feel like

is one of the worst places to be because you feel so out of control.

You feel like you're being tortured.

Yeah.

But I do ha I do think there's some validity in what you were saying of.

Does this mean I won't be able to do this anymore?

No end date to this one.

There's no one thing that's actually helped me feel better and that

I've been trying to do is I'm looking at women who are older than

me and just like in their prime.

and I have two friends who are, one's five years older, one's 10 years

older, who are just crushing it.

They're just like running faster than ever.

They're like doing all the races and I'm like, okay.

it's not, I really try to ignore messages when people are like, oh, you get older

and your body starts to fail, and it's I think those memes aren't helping anyone.

I think it's fun to relate to, to be like, oh yeah, we can't drink like we used to.

ha.

But this idea of this, again, the story that we tell I think matters and I wanna

live in a world where like my husband and I are getting faster, stronger, better.

We're doing more races, like we're crushing it, like we're, We're go, we

went on a bike tour together last summer when our kids were in sleepaway camp.

We're doing it again this year and like I wanna be, 10, 15 years from

now, like longer trips, harder trips, take me on higher mountains

and I think that we can do that.

But if you believe the.

Memes and everything.

It's and it's funny, it's oh, what your forties look like,

what your fifties look like?

And it's oh, if you're not in pain, then I know that you're, 25.

And it's first of all, that's not true.

And second of all, who's that helping

It doesn't help people like me who are sick in their thirties and Like I,

there's a girl that I follow on TikTok, she's called Chronically Ill and Hot,

which I think is like the funniest thing.

But she, was in a, she tells a story about being in a grocery store and, something

happened where she very obviously was hurting and this old woman like

minimized her pain because she was young.

And I'm like, that's not cool either.

like, why?

I don't know.

We are also different.

Like my mom is in her sixties and is beautiful and thriving and all of these

things, and like she's the one that comes over and gets shit done at my house.

It's not the other way around.

Yeah,

this idea that

who she is.

this idea that age is linear with health is not true, especially mentally.

I think we can all agree that.

Mentally and emotionally, we tend to be better in our thirties

than in our twenties, right?

Like you know who you are, and that's been true in my case.

I'm in my early forties now and I feel like real, like I said, I

feel really strong in business.

I feel really strong in parenting.

I have a very good relationship with my husband.

And, I'm so grateful and that's because I've done a lot of work in the past 10

years plus to figure out, my emotional, personal weaknesses and address them.

And even though that's uncomfortable, that's another middle that I went through

that I was like, I feel okay about this.

It's just this, I wish this fitness one wasn't so hard for me.

But I get it.

I also understand how easy it is to downplay, cuz not, it's not the

same, but when I think about my stuff, I was actually talking to

a doctor this morning about how I.

what is going on with me may have psychological connections.

It doesn't mean that it doesn't, it's not real what's happening, but there

may be psychological connections.

and it's so hard for me to hear that

because it's so hard for me to hear that and not be like, oh, so it's in my

I could have stopped it.

I could have stopped it.

You know what I mean?

And no, it has nothing to do with any of that.

and so it's just.

It's all messy and

Yes.

So messy.

It's hard to not live in the what ifs.

This is what we were talking about before.

Hard to not live in the what ifs and not live in the regret.

and something we were talking about earlier, my mom passed

away when I was 27 and.

I'm a very different person now who I was then and if I was who I was now

then, which is like a dumb thing to say because you're never who you were then

If you know now what you knew then, all that stuff.

Yeah.

Yeah, it's like a, it's like a very unhelpful game to play of.

I would've done just like you're saying, oh, it's psychological.

yeah, I would've done a lot of things differently.

I wanna said things differently.

I would've handled things differently.

I would, there's, I can make you a list, an infinity long list of things I would've

done differently, but like we have to go.

Through it there's no other way.

Right?

So one thing that, again, gives me hope in this fitness journey is eventually

I try to have hope that I'll be on the other side and I'll look back

and say, oh, that was because, I had to deal with the fact that I was

pushing myself too hard in everything.

I had to, I'm making something up, right?

that's probably it, but I don't understand it yet.

Or I had to understand that like I, this specific AB exercise is

something I need to do every day.

Let's hope.

Although I'm sure that's not it.

I think we can all be held by not telling these stories of injuries and

not telling these stories of us being like, chronic, chronically wrong, and

also not going back and being like, if I knew then what I know now, and

it's like, But you don't, so don't,

Yeah.

Maybe try to reframe that.

I'm gonna put my Sarah Kelly hat on cuz she always helps me with

this of, let me reframe that.

Maybe it's, now I know what I need to know for the future.

Maybe try to reframe that.

Yeah, totally.

And now I can go forward healthy.

And for me, having these role models of these women who are just like

older than me and crushing it, is, gives me hope that this is a middle

and that this isn't, This, there will be a time when I'm not here.

Yeah.

thank you for sharing your difficult middle and that you're still in it.

Like I said, I don't, we don't talk about that as much as I think we should, so

it's not pretty and it's

not, it's not like it's not tidy.

it's not, and it's also, and it's messy cuz.

Like people wanna care the story, right?

They want the beginning, middle, and end.

So how do you tell the story when you don't know the end?

This is why your podcast works, right?

Because we all need to know, like I, I think that a disease of our time

is that we look at Instagram and we're like, everyone's at their end.

Everyone's figured it out.

Look how pretty they are, or look how, I hate the people who are like,

Here's how I got 6,000 followers in six days, and it's shut up.

Ugh.

Like

If you follow this exact formula, you'll scale your

business to six figures, and it's

I made X hundred dollars in X days is just like an immediate unfollow.

don't show me these lies cuz that's not it.

So I think what you're doing is really valuable to, no in influencer

is I did this and it didn't work.

Or if they do, it's I did this and it didn't work and here's how it

turned around and I'm gonna teach you how to do this other thing.

I think the work you're doing is really valuable for all of us to.

Why, would your piece of advice be that either you need

to hear or that you've really lived by for your life thus far?

I think it's, you know what I was saying before about

like really not living in the, what if I had done this differently?

Cuz I think it's just this like self-flagellation

that you think is helpful.

It's like when you go in your brain and you run through a worst case

scenario of something, it really doesn't prepare you at all for the

thing that you're worried about.

It actually just exacerbates your worry.

So to go back and be like, if only I didn't push myself, if only I had

paid attention to this pain, if only I had done this or that is, it's just

It's a really damaging thing to do.

And so I'm telling that to myself now, cuz of course I do that ever.

I find myself in that every, I catch myself every now and then.

and I would love for all of us to just stop.

I agree.

where can people find you?

I wanna say that you are one of my favorite people to follow on social media

because I, we talk about merch and swag and.

Everything you say is so true.

I'll never forget the pen thing that you said, or was it

the, or the stress ball.

get really heated about pens.

Don't get me started on pens.

you're right about like sustainability.

Like why are we producing hundreds of these things that no one actually wants?

Just don't print hundreds of anything to be honest.

just don't do it.

People don't want it.

People want beautiful items that they get to choose and that's that.

Find me, on Instagram and go-to market Studio.

and you can find me on LinkedIn also go to Market Studio or go to

market, or you find me by my name.

Just note that Hoffman has one F.

It's a little gift from my husband.

Always say Hoffman with one F.

we got married, I'm like, can we, my maiden name is Goldfine and I was like,

can we just take the F from Goldfine and make it Hoffman with two US?

And that's didn't go over.

What else?

Yeah, that's how to reach me.

If you DM me at, at go to market studio, I will respond.

I am, I would love to talk to anybody who like has fitness injury stuff

and we can try to help each other through it or I can, I don't know

if there's any advice I can give.

I'm happy to talk to people.

Awesome.

thank you for joining me today.

I've really enjoyed our conversation.