Ever feel lost in the alphabet soup of goal-setting frameworks?

Whether you're a leader, a coach, or a goal-setting enthusiast, navigating between SMART goals, KPIs, OKRs, and other frameworks can feel overwhelming.

In this episode, Sara Lobkovich – strategist, OKR coach, and nationally board-certified health and wellness coach (with “another life” in professional motorcycle road racing) – gives you the inside scoop on the most popular frameworks. Through easy-to-understand examples from the worlds of health and sports, Sara breaks down when and how to use each framework to drive success.

You'll leave with a clear understanding of what each framework truly means, how they differ, and which one to use to turbocharge your personal or professional goals.

Want to watch the full-length replay of the Live this episode is drawn from? It’s on YouTube!

Episode Highlights:

• Clear explanation of Key Performance Indicators (KPIs) and why they're indicators, not goals
• Deep dive into SMART goals and their practical applications
• How OKRs differ from other frameworks for handling uncertainty and innovation
• Understanding mandatory vs. stretch goals
• Real-world examples using health and sports metrics
• Introduction to additional frameworks like BSC (Balanced Scorecard) and ROB (Rhythm of Business)

Key Concepts Covered:

• Activity Goals vs. Outcome Goals
• KPIs as health indicators for your business
• The limitations of SMART goals
• When and how to use mandatory goals
• The power of OKRs for uncertain territory
• Building a holistic performance dashboard
• Creating effective rhythms of business

Episode Chapters

[00:00] Introduction to Thinkydoer Shorts

[00:43] Sara's Dual Life: Business and Racing

[01:12] Goal Fridays and Live Replays

[02:59] Decoding Goal-Setting Acronyms

[07:38] Activity Goals: The Basics

[09:02] KPIs: Key Performance Indicators (and KPIs vs. OKRs)

[11:32] SMART Goals: Specific and Measurable

[15:52] Mandatory Goals vs. Stretch Goals

[18:20] OKRs and Other Goal-Setting Frameworks

Notable Quotes:

"KPIs are indicators, not goals - it's right there in the name." 

"SMART goals are helpful because they are specific. They do give us something to aim for.   The challenge with SMART goals, and we're going to talk about mandatories in just a minute, is with SMART goals, It's a little too easy to set that goal and then have our all-or-nothing thinking take over with our behavior."

" And quantifying activity is great. It gives you that clarity when what's important is that you do something a certain number of times. But doing something a certain number of times won't necessarily yield the outcome you need."

"The Objective is like a tiny love letter from your idealistic 'you' to your future 'you' that's going to get frustrated and challenged."

"Your Rhythm of Business (ROB) is all of the things that make up the culture of performance in your work. [...]Your Rhythm of Business is really your culture. It's your meetings, yes, it's also your communication norms, your asynchronous communication norms, your habits. Your rhythms for learning and feedback, your ways of recognizing each other and what cadence that's on."

Resources Mentioned:

• Get the No-BS OKRs Workbook ($19): https://saralobkovich.com/no-bs-okrs-workbook-pdf
• Info about the upcoming print version of the No-BS OKRs Workbook & Sara's forthcoming book: "You Are a Strategist: Use No-BS Objectives and Key Results to Get Big Things Done" is available at https://youareastrategist.com 
• Other Free No-BS OKRs Resources: Access all free resources
• Thinkydoers (not-just-an OKR podcast) Home Page: https://saralobkovich.com/thinkydoers-pod

Connect with Sara:

• Newsletter: findrc.co/newsletter
• Contact: findrc.co/contact
• Email Sara at hello@redcurrantco.com
• Social Media: @saralobkovich most everywhere!

Welcome to Thinkydoer Shorts, where we embrace anti-perfection

and dive straight into the messy middle of strategy, leadership,

and personal and career growth.

I'm your host, Sara Lobkovich, creator of No-BS Objectives and Key Results,

host of the Thinkydoers podcast, and I'm a strategy coach, big-time goal nerd,

and board-certified and wellness coach with a focus on work-life well-being.

And in the next few minutes, we'll explore a current topic or insight to

spark your curiosity and provide you a pragmatic starting place to take action.

Hello, friends.

I said shorts were going to be low fidelity, so here we go.

I am in California right now.

I'm sitting outside a dyno shop.

It's the team's third round, it's my second round, down at CVMA for

winter racing with the team — the CW Moto racing program that my

husband and I own and operate.

Folks who know me in my business life might not have seen this part of my life,

but in addition to being an OKR coach and career coach, I also have another life

in professional motorcycle road racing.

Sometimes those worlds happen at the same time.

So, we are putting together a couple of Thinkydoer Shorts episodes based on

my Goal Fridays lives from this fall.

Once a quarter or so, sometimes once every other quarter, I do a six- or eight-week

series of what we call Goal Fridays.

And it's an hour on Fridays that we spend.

Sometimes we do them structured, sometimes we do them unstructured, but

it's basically time to get an hour to focus in on what's really most important.

This fall, it was a structured series.

I did them on live via YouTube and LinkedIn.

We have the replays, so we're repurposing those for Thinkydoers Shorts.

Today's episode is if there was one question I get asked the most often,

it might be what's the difference between a Key Result and a KPI.

So today's episode is some excerpts from the live that I did talking

about SMART goals, KPIs, OKRs, and some other acronyms associated with

strategic planning and goal setting.

Some parts of this episode only make sense if you can see the screen.

So we have a video version, both of the original live unedited,

unscripted, and then we also have a video version that we've edited based

on that for this Thinkydoers episode.

And you can find that on our video podcast channels, including YouTube.

Enjoy today's episode.

I hope you can bear with us on the low fidelity for these, and Let me know

what questions this sparks for you.

The questions I am asked most often what's the difference

between acronym A and acronym B?

So today, we're going to separate out the alphabet soup of goal-setting

acronyms into its individual ingredients.

Just a little tiny bit of context, because I'm going to use some examples today that

aren't your typical business examples.

before we start building your decoder ring today, I guess I should introduce myself.

Yeah, I'm Sara Lobkovich.

And in addition to the work that you know me for in the strategy and OKR

space, I actually wear two other hats that you might not know about, but

they complement each other perfectly.

I'm a board-certified health and wellness coach, and I use that in my work with

people in their careers and workplaces with a focus on career well-being

and organizing for career impact.

And this is the one that catches people more off guard: I am also the

team principal for a professional motorcycle road racing team.

So, in addition to politics, sponsor support, and crew duties in my

professional motorcycle racing career, part of my role involves athlete

fitness and mental game preparation.

And naturally, I am the goal-setting person for the team.

So this combination with health and wellbeing coaching and my life

and professional sports has given me some pretty deep insights into

high-performance goal-setting, whether we're talking about your athletic

pursuits, or your work in the office, or your health and lifestyle metrics.

In addition to all of this, I've trained over 2, 000 Objectives

and Key Results coaches.

I lead Objectives and Key Results adoption in multi-thousand-person organizations

and Fortune 100 and 500 companies.

And I also do OKR work with small and solo businesses as well.

So, that combo of skills, it sounds weird when I try and talk about it together.

This is actually the first time I've tried to talk about all three together,

so it's a little bit of an experiment.

People who know me in one facet don't always know me in the

others, but what all three have in common is they're high stakes.

There are places where we have to get comfortable with change.

We have to be nimble.

We have to be creative because we're not in control of our sports

environment, we're not in control of our work environment, and

our bodies are always changing.

It sounds weird from the outside, but for me, it's just

high-performance, high-stakes stuff.

That requires goal setting and behavior change support.

So today, we're going to use some analogies from these other parts of

my life to build your decoder ring for acronyms of goal setting — that

alphabet soup of goal setting — and some of goal setting's key terms.

I only included a handful of acronyms, so if I missed any that you want to hear

about, even if I don't know today, I can follow up with, my thoughts on them.

Because every time I think I've learned the most relevant

acronyms, new ones pop up.

So here, we're going to talk about definitions of some of the key acronyms.

We'll talk about when you might use each of them.

I'm going to show you an example of each, but instead of using

business examples — which I actually think are sometimes really hard.

It's hard to tell the difference between the goal types when we use

business examples — I'm going to use health- and sport-based examples.

For me, I don't know, whenever I use the health and body and sport-based

examples, it just makes more sense to me.

It's easier to see the distinctions between the goal types.

Whether you are fine-tuning personal performance or leading some kind of

high-stakes team, you're going to leave here with a practical toolkit

for choosing and using the right goal-setting method for any situation.

So you can get better faster without getting lost in the jargon.

From here, let's look at this universe of acronyms.

KPIs, SMART goals, Objectives and Key Results.

We're going to talk about mandatory goals, which isn't an acronym,

but it's an Important distinction.

We can't talk about goal setting without talking about activities or plans.

And we're also going to talk about how we work toward goal achievement.

So we're going to mention EOS, which I'm not an expert in, but it

is something that's coming up a lot in my conversations with people.

Which is the Entrepreneur Operating System.

We're also going to talk about rhythms of business (ROB).

the first one we're going to talk about is.

activity goals.

And that's because that's what most people do in terms of goal setting,

is they decide what they plan to do, and that's what their focus is on.

That's not bad.

There's nothing wrong with activity planning.

Ultimately, if we want to achieve something, we have to do things.

So activity goals are not bad.

— they're just incomplete on their own.

And I made this slide on purpose because it shows part of the problem.

I didn't count the number of items on that checklist.

It's like 15 things.

And I don't know about you — how many things do you have on your

to-do list at any given time?

I have so many that multiple pieces of software can't keep up with my to-do list.

So this is where most people start, and they think of these as goals, but

I think of these as well-laid plans.

So these are the plans that we make, just like any other plans, where if we wake

up on that day, then we might decide that we're not going to stick to our plan.

And so then, if this is the only kind of goal setting that we're doing is planning,

then there's not much to keep us on the rails when we wake up and have a rough

day and don't want to stick with our plan.

In addition to activity goals and planning, we can build on our skills here.

And we're going to add in the idea of KPIs.

And I went to KPIs first because KPIs are what I get asked

about absolutely the most.

So KPIs, or Key Performance Indicators, that is a term

that has no universal meaning.

Everyone who uses that term has a different definition of what a KPI is.

A lot of times, I see organizations using KPIs as goals.

I am a words girl.

It is all about semantics with me.

That's an insult that I used to get a lot, and it's actually completely true.

But the words of the word KPI — Key Performance Indicator, is indicator.

So when I started trying to kind of reconcile, how do OKRs fit in to

organizations' existing practices?

KPIs was the first ones that I looked at, and I'm like,

it's right there in the name.

They're indicators.

They're not goals.

KPIs, if we use a body-based example, they're the things that we keep an eye on

to make sure that we're staying healthy.

If our KPIs go sideways, then we know we might need to pay attention.

But they're not goals in and of themselves, they're

indicators of our health.

So it's things like blood pressure, or waist-hip ratio, or sleep

efficiency, or the number of social plans that we make per week.

The number of social plans we keep per week, resting heart rate, bone

density, those sorts of things.

Those are example KPIs, and KPIs are important.

We'll talk about our dashboard at the very end, but KPIs are

important because they're the metrics that we're going to watch.

They're the ones we're going to keep an eye on.

If we need to maintain a metric, we use a KPI.

If we need to watch a metric because we're concerned about it, or there might

be, some cause for concern, that's a KPI.

And so our KPIs aren't all of the metrics under the sun.

Our KPIs are the ones that we're going to watch to make sure

that we're staying healthy.

And I'm not going to say every time this applies to your business too, but

the body- and health- and sport-based examples, I think if you internalize

those, then it's really easy to see how this applies in the workplace.

All right.

So that's KPIs, Key Performance Indicators.

That's our KPIs.

All right.

So our next one is SMART goals.

And I put SMART goal s second because SMART goals is what I run

into second as frequently as KPIs.

The first questions about KPIs, and then we go, "What about SMART

goals?" because those two have been implemented in a lot of organizations.

And SMART is one of my personal nemesis.

Because, again, it's all semantics with me.

And I worked in environments that use SMART goal setting before I

started doing this for a living.

And every organization that used SMART, for one, had different meanings.

The words meant different, the " specific" and "measurable"

— those are always the same.

Some places use "achievable", some places use "attainable" for A. Some

places use "relevant", and some places use "realistic" for R. I worked

somewhere where they used "attainable" for A, and R for "realistic," and I

was like, " What is the difference?" And no one could explain it to me.

And then T is "time-bound".

So SMART goals came back into my world when I was doing my training as a

health and wellness coach and studying for my exams because SMART goals are

used a lot in health and wellness.

And an example of a SMART goal, they're specific, measurable,

achievable or attainable, relevant or realistic, and time-bound.

So an example of a SMART goal in the body-based examples might be

engage in cardiovascular exercise for 30 minutes, four times a week,

for the next three months, tracking progress with a fitness app.

So it's specific, very specific.

It's measurable in terms of you can quantify the activity and say, "Am

I doing the things that I said I plan to?" That might be achievable.

For some people it might not be achievable, for some people

it might be attainable, for some people it might not be.

It's relevant if this is your domain of concern, if improving cardiovascular

health is important to you.

Might be realistic, again, achievable, attainable, realistic.

Lots of confusion there.

And it's time-bound, so we're gonna do that 30 minutes, 4 times

a week for the next 3 months.

So SMART goal s can be really helpful.

Notice that goal is probably more helpful at getting you off the

couch than a vague plan or activity goal to work out more often.

So SMART goals are helpful because they are specific.

They do give us something to aim for.

The challenge with SMART goals, and we're going to talk about mandatories

in just a minute, is with SMART goals, It's a little too easy to set that

goal and then have our all-or-nothing thinking take over with our behavior.

So if we don't make a workout, then it's a little too easy to kind of fall off the

SMART goal wagon and think, "Well, you know, I'm going to miss this one, and then

I'm, going to take another day off," and then it's hard to get back on the wagon.

So SMART goals work.

They're good for some things.

And it's basically, if you're familiar with my work, this

is quantifying activity.

They use the term "measurable," and that's a reason I've moved away from using the

term measurable alone when we talk about Key Results, but they're measurable in

terms of "Did you do the thing?" "Have you done the thing?" There are ways to write

SMART goals that are actually Key Results.

Like, you could write a SMART goal that would be a Key Result per a

technical definition of a Key Result.

But because the definition is so broad, it's pretty rare that I actually

see metrics -based SMART goals.

A lot of times they're like quantifying activity.

And quantifying activity is great.

It gives you that clarity when what's important is that you do

something a certain number of times.

But doing something a certain number of times won't necessarily

yield the outcome you need.

So we need to think about, "Is what's most important that we do the thing a certain

number of times?" SMART goal "Is what's important that we achieve some sort of

outcome?" That's where OKRs are helpful.

All right.

And so before we get into OKRs though, let's talk about mandatory goals.

One of the biggest issues I see in organizations is that they don't

distinguish between mandatory goals or "must-achieves" and stretch

goals, where we are going into unknown territory and we can't really

forecast because it's the unknown.

And we still want to have a target, trying to forecast in speculative,

unknown stretch territories, just sets us up for disappointment.

So instead of treating our stretch goals as mandatory, or treating our

mandatories as stretch, a lot of organizations, they just conflate the

two and then no one ever knows whether something's mandatory or stretch.

And so we just presume everything is mandatory because that's

the only safe thing to do.

That can lead to underperformance.

So examples of things that might be mandatory goals in the health space: Get

at least six hours of sleep per night.

Drink eight glasses — that's probably a bridge too far.

I should have said, "Drink water every day." I know the recommendation

is eight glasses, but let's just go for drinking water every day.

Mandatory.

Take your prescribed medications as directed.

Our mandatories are the things that we have to do.

They're the things that if we don't do this, we're going to

experience negative consequences.

There might be poor outcomes.

And so in our business, we're We've got mandatory goals.

You have to pay your credit card bill.

You have to make payroll.

There are things where they're just must-achieves, they're mandatories.

I used to call these "commits," but that language became a challenge.

It's less precise than saying mandatory or must-achieve.

So I use mandatory, and then I've had one of my clients adopted "must

achieve," so I just include that for consistency since there might

be folks from there on here today.

Okay, so that's mandatory goals.

We want to use mandatory goal setting when something has to be achieved.

And then, when we set a mandatory goal, our target for that

is 100 percent achievement.

We're going to aim to get that done 100 percent of the time

because it's that important.

But then, that takes us into our speculative and unknown territory.

So we can set mandatory goals around the parts of our worker

life that are predictable or known.

Then we get into growth, and innovation, and change, and parts that are unknown.

And that's where OKRs become really important.

Objectives and Key Results help us identify the targets we're aiming for

when it's too uncertain to forecast.

But we want to give ourselves a target to aim for that is, what might be

possible if everything went right.

So, if everything were to go amazingly well, what might be possible?

The formula for an Objective that I use is: what's important, why does it matter?

And so an example Objective, along with our health and body-based examples,

"become the healthiest version of myself with age and age

with grace." So, what's important?

Being the healthiest version of myself.

Why does it matter?

I want to age with grace.

That's my purpose.

That's how I want to feel about aging.

So, that's the Objective.

Our Objective gives us our idea of what direction we're heading

in, what's important, like what's the territory that we're focused

on, and why does it matter to us?

Because if we only ask the first question, "what's important," then

it's kind of like those activity plans we started with at the beginning.

It's just another thing on the checklist.

But when we add the "why," then it makes our Objective something

that means something to us.

It gives us an idea of its purpose.

And so, that helps us stay motivated when we're challenged.

It reminds us of why this goal, this Objective, and the Key Results

that support it are important when we start to get discouraged

or when we need a pick-me-up.

It's like a tiny love letter from the "you" that you are

when you're setting your goals.

You are your, like, New Year's resolution -best you.

You are the most optimistic, "I can do it", idealistic version of

yourself when you're goal setting.

And what matters is the "you" you are in 45 days when everything's gone sideways,

and you still have to keep at it.

So, the Objective is like a tiny love letter from your idealistic "you"

to your future "you" that's going to get frustrated and challenged.

Keeps you focused and inspired to keep working when things

get hard, and get creative and troubleshoot when things get hard.

Then, our Key Resultlts align to our Objectives.

And so our Key Results are our measures, but I'm going to say, not just measures.

Not just quantifiable, there are empirical, data

-based metrics or measures.

They are things that can be empirically measured and quantified.

And in that, I include data that we get from our systems.

But I also include things that we can reliably observe or notice.

If you don't have a bunch of instrumentation in your business,

there are things that happen that are important that you can count.

And that sounds like quantifying activity, but quantifying activity

is quantifying your own activity.

When I say, "we can write a KR about what you observe in your business or

what you notice in your business," that's talking about other people's activity.

I can't think of a body-based one right off the bat, but one of the

examples that I used early on in my business, I had a Key Result around

hearing clients say the word "ease" in their feedback about working with me.

So that's not an instrumented business metric.

That's something that, when we get our feedback surveys, we do a search for

the term "ease" and we see how many people mentioned "ease" or "easy." At

the end of a teaching day, I'd look at the chat window, and I'd look at

the transcript, and we'd say, "did we see the word 'ease' or 'easy?'"

And how many people were there?

That Key Result wasn't a business metric.

It wasn't instrumented, but it was something I could observe.

It was really important for me because when that number went up,

it meant my materials were getting better for my target and more useful.

When I say Key Result, don't stop listening just because you

might not have business metrics.

If you write one Key Result like that one of "I want to increase

the number of times I hear the word 'ease' in client feedback," you will

be shocked at what a difference a single Key Result like that can make

for how you work and in your results.

But back to our body-based examples.

So we have our Objective: become the healthiest version

of myself, to age with grace.

Now we've got our Key Results that we layer in.

And Key Results sometimes are KPIs turned into goals.

So that's what we have here.

Reduce my blood pressure from 140 over 70 to 130 over 80.

Reduce my A1c, which is a diabetes marker, from 5.

8 to 5.

6. Increase VO2 max, it's cardiovascular efficiency metric, from 35 to 40.

I actually didn't fact-check if that is a right number, so

don't quote me on that one.

But increase our VO2 max from our start value to our finish value.

I usually write them as, "increase," "decrease," or "improve" a metric by a

percent change from A to B, but I kept these a little simpler for this one.

So that's our OKRs.

Our OKRs are, we're going to set stretch goals for our uncertain territory,

we're going to recognize that they take us into uncertain territory.

We're going to be really curious about how we do on those.

We're not going to beat ourselves up about it.

We're going to get curious and see what we learn because our OKRs are about

experimentation and continuous learning.

All right, we're in the home stretch.

BSC is Balanced Scorecard.

And I haven't.

learn the fine points of Balance Scorecard, but I've worked with

clients who use Balance Scorecard.

And so Balance Scorecard is when we have that holistic dashboard.

That's where we decide what are the KPIs that we need to see every day?

What are our Key Results that we need status on every day?

What are our most important things we need to have on that dashboard?

And so here, in our example, that might be something that includes our most

important physical health metrics, mental health metrics, social well-being

measures, and socioeconomic resource measures, because socioeconomics play

a huge part in health and well-being.

And so that's our dashboard, is our Balance Scorecard.

But it doesn't have everything on it, it has what's important on it.

And then our R. O. B., our Rhythm of Business , or as Jurriaan Kamer

says, Rhythm of Progress, is all of the things that make up the

culture of performance in your work.

So people think of Rhythm of Business, if they've heard that term before,

as these are the meetings that we're going to do on a cadence.

What are the meetings we're going to do weekly, monthly, quarterly, annually?

But I think bigger about your Rhythm of Business because your Rhythm of

Business is really your culture.

It's your meetings, yes, it's also your communication norms, your asynchronous

communication norms, your habits.

Your rhythms for learning and feedback, your ways of recognizing

each other and what cadence that's on.

So I think much more broadly about Rhythm of Business, but every business has one.

And so, you might think you don't, but even if you don't think you do.

There are elements of a Rhythm of Business in how you work.

I have a toolkit for this.

I don't have the link with me, but I'll share it in social media because

I have a Rhythm of Business toolkit that can help with identifying, and

then, improving your goal attainment focus in your Rhythm of Business.

So I'll share that out too.

So in our health routines, our Rhythm of Business might be that daily morning

stretch and evening walk, and then our weekly meal prep on Sundays, and then

our monthly check-in on our "What's our blood pressure trend been for the month?"

Cause blood pressure varies a lot by day.

So we look at trends.

We don't look at individual measures.

And then do I have my quarterly check with my rheumatologist and do I have my

annual check with my primary care doctor?

So those are our rhythms of business.

Or rhythms of physical health.

And then EOS is Entrepreneur Operating System.

Jessica Lee is someone who's come into my life fairly recently.

She's amazing.

She's an EOS consultant, which was just perfect timing because EOS is

something I get asked about a lot.

It's not a framework that I've become expert in because I got my hands full

with OKRs, but EOS is a framework that helps small and mid-sized

organizations organize around like a big picture system of vision and people

and data and issues and process and how to get traction and achievement.

So I'm not an EOS expert, but I wanted to mention it because that's one of

the acronyms that comes up a lot.

And in the kind of trying to make an analogy with health, I feel like EOS

is like our family health system.

So what are the families R&Rs for health?

Who plans meals, who organizes daily active time, who makes sure we get out

to the park when the weather's nice, who schedules the doctor's appointments

and what's the quarterly family rhythm.

What's the annual family rhythm.

Do we have an annual kind of vacation or getaway that we can spend to take

a little time to check in on our health and well being as a family.

But that would also include your healthcare providers.

It's like, what's the system?

So that's different.

Then Rhythm of Business, because Rhythm of Business is more about the mechanics,

and EOS is broader and includes the roles and responsibilities and more to it.

All right.

Homestretch, team.

So that's it.

That's all the acronyms I'm going to throw at you.

It's a lot, but I hope that helps break them down so you can see when you might

use which ones in your business or work.

if you have any questions, I would love to hear them.

Like, there might be something where you're wrestling with

which goal type you might use or you might have another acronym.

Jeffrey shared, "FAST, frequently discussed, ambitious, specific, and

transparent." Oh, that's a good one.

I like that.

That could be like OKRs and FAST, like, people try and put OKRs and

SMART goals together, but OKRs actually align really, really nicely to that

FAST acronym, Frequently Discussed, Ambitious, Specific, and Transparent.

Because when we're doing OKRs well, that's what they are.

that's a great one, I'll add that into my toolkit.

But that's our alphabet soup of goal setting for today.

And then if anything I've said today is helpful to you or you

want to learn more, join the prelaunch list for my print books.

I have the No BS OKR workbook is already available for download in PDF form for

$19 on my website, saralobkovich.com The print version of the workbook

and my full length business book.

You Are A Strategist: Use No BS OKRs To Get Big Things Done.

So you can join the pre launch list at youareastrategist.com.

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All right, friends, That's it for today.

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