Climate is only one of the planetary boundaries we need to work on. And we also need to tackle a whole range of social issues.
That's why item four and our sustainability leadership manifesto is: "develop and deliver initiatives that offer multiple benefits for people and nature".
In this Roundtable event, our guests, sustainability leaders across a variety of sectors, reflect on their experience of trying to move the agenda beyond net zero in their work.
Listen for insights from the sharp end about how to help colleagues to see the bigger picture and start engaging with the rest of the sustainable development goals.
Don't miss new episodes or your invitation to our Leadership for Sustainability roundtables – including, only for email subscribers, our team's rich insights and carefully curated resources. Subscribe now…
Connect with Osbert Lancaster - drop me a message and let me know you listen to the podcast! – and follow Realise Earth.
In order to bring everyone along on this really crucial journey, I
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:think it really is about bringing it
back, taking it down to square one.
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:Malcolm: Instead of everything
seeming overwhelming and huge, that
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:actually it all becomes something
that is perfectly achievable?
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:Alejandra: How do you present and
make these things local and relatable?
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:This is Leadership for Sustainability,
the podcast for sustainability
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:directors, managers, and pioneers
who want their organization to make
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:greater progress on sustainability.
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:It's so good to have you with us.
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:I'm Osbert Lancaster.
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:I'm a long time sustainability
consultant, facilitator and director of
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:sustainability leadership specialists
Realise Earth where we focus on
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:the people side of sustainability.
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:It's great news that net zero is becoming
more and more widespread as a concept,
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:and that climate change is on the
agenda of more and more organizations.
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:But climate is only one of the
planetary boundaries we need to work on.
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:And we also need to tackle a
whole range of social issues.
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:That's why item four and our
sustainability leadership manifesto is
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:" develop and deliver initiatives that offer
multiple benefits for people and nature".
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:At our recent round table, we
discussed, how do you help your
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:organization to get beyond net zero?
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:To see the bigger picture and
start engaging with the rest of
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:the sustainable development goals?
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:Morag Watson, my co-founder here at
Realise Earth, hosted the round table
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:with me, and we were joined by some
great guests for an hour of discussion.
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:Most of the discussion happened
privately in small groups.
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:But in this episode, we share the
highlights from the plenary sessions.
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:I'll let our guests introduce
themselves and take it from there.
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:Mina: So I'm Mina Cole.
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:I'm an environmental manager
and I work for Regen Group.
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:Graham: Hello, my name is Graham Farrar.
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:I'm head of sustainability
for Kings Rose Mining.
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:Flo: My name is Florenca or Flo,
I'm a lead product designer, also
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:work with regenerative business
design for The C Collective.
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:Annie: Hi, my name's Annie,
short for Anne Marie.
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:I am the Sustainable Life Coach
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:Anna: I'm Anna, I'm an outdoor
facilitator mindfulness, for
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:my business Wander Women.
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:Gavin: My name is Gavin Allen,
I'm the group sustainability
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:operations lead for Robertson Group.
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:Malcolm: I'm Malcolm Curry.
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:I'm an independent consultant
specialising in dispute resolution.
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:Kemi: My name's Kemi Odafari, I'm a senior
finance business partner at UCL Partners,
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:which is focused on health innovation.
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:Alejandra: My name is Alejandra,
I'm an environmental engineer
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:and waste management consultant
at company based in Malta
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:.
Ellis: Ellis McKinnon, Environmental and Sustainability
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:Manager, currently freelance.
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:Morag: Wonderful.
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:Thank you very much and welcome, everyone.
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:It's delightful to have you all with us
here, and in a moment we're going to put
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:you into some discussion groups but to
prep us for going into that, what I'm
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:going to invite you to do is to think
about a time that you've helped your
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:colleagues or your organization to commit
to taking an action on sustainability
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:and an action that went beyond just being
a single issue like climate change or
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:recycling to a much more holistic view.
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:So think about that time you
did that, once you've chosen
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:it, what was the situation?
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:Who was involved?
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:How did the process start?
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:What happened next?
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:What was the result?
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:I'm going to give you a moments
silence just to have a think.
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:And once you've got that in your
head, the bit I would like you to focus
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:in is why did that approach succeed?
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:Okay, so hold on to those
thoughts and feelings.
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:You will go into breakout groups and
it's your opportunity to discuss exactly
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:what we've just been talking about,
how you went beyond that single issue
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:to a more holistic, what works, what
did you learn, what helped you succeed
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:and an opportunity to share with peers.
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:Osbert: Welcome back, everybody.
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:I hope you've had some interesting
discussions, insights and
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:ideas and inspirations from it.
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:I would like to invite the reporter from
each group to share your top insight.
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:So , Room 1, which was
Flo, Gavin, and Kemi.
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:Kemi: One of the things that we spoke
about was regulation and incentives, in
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:terms of getting organizations on board.
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:We certainly find that with bigger
organizations, they tend not to listen
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:unless there's a sort of financial
benefit to their bottom line.
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:So whilst it's necessary and correct
to focus on the sustainability
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:improvements, what maybe gets their
heads turn is actually to say that there
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:is financial benefit to this, which
does sort of bring its own sort of moral
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:implications in that organizations
should be doing this anyway, but if
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:you need to get that foot in the door,
sometimes that is an option to focus on.
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:Osbert: Brilliant.
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:Thank you so much.
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:Room two is Annie, Ellis, and Mina.
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:. Annie.
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:Annie: We understand that getting
people motivated through their own
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:personal values helps to create a good
mindset, which we've all experienced
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:in different ways, pluses and minuses.
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:However, to get beyond net zero,
it's almost about taking that
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:mindset and making it a no brainer.
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:So it isn't something that you actually
consciously think of, it's something that
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:you do without even thinking about it.
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:And that's where we need to get to in
terms of making it easy for everyone
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:to know what to do, how to do it, the
best way to deal with it, the same way
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:as you would do for health and safety,
or if you're driven by cost reduction,
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:cost return on investment, that this
is something that is second nature.
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:Osbert: Thank you so much.
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:And room three, Anna, Graham, and Malcolm.
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:Graham: I guess in, in my role,
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:one of the key focuses has been
on the double materiality survey.
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:So working through and, and trying to get
the business aligned, investors aligned
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:and external stakeholders aligned with
what we think we should be focusing on,
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:because that allows you to integrate
that concept into the business including,
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:who you employ, what consultancy
support you need, what funding you need.
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:And that also leads into how you
produce your sustainability report.
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:And it's not just one person's
idea, it's a formalized process,
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:under legislation in many places.
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:Osbert: Double materiality?
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:, Just remind us of the jargon.
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:Graham: So the first materiality is
, financial materiality and the second
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:materiality is impact to stakeholders.
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:Osbert: Thank you so much.
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:Okay.
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:Is there anything else that
came out of those discussions
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:that you would like to add?
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:Alejandra: I think one part that we were
mentioning is about how do you present
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:and make these things local and relatable?
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:You have to start small every time
you think about climate change,
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:it feels like so big for some of
these companies, especially when
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:you're looking at SMEs or startups.
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:So making that relatable, talking
about the local, you're part of it.
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:And then there is also another aspect
that we see it's about like almost
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:a contagion effect, which is your
neighbors, your, your other competitors
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:are doing, and it was this whole thing
of scope three is going to get to you.
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:So even though you can't, somehow we
need to find a way to do it because
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:otherwise you can't be in business.
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:And then somehow you also seeing that
your neighbors are transitioning, so you
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:just feel compelled to do it as well.
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:So there is a little bit of that
following the trend behavior.
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:Gavin: I think, it's very easy for
bigger organizations to be able to
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:fund their way to, net zero but there's
really a bit of a gap for SMEs.
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:I'm quite fortunate, we've got a
sustainability supply chain coordinator
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:that does quite a lot of work within
our supply chain, especially SMEs and
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:how to calculate their carbon, you
know, terminologies like scope one,
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:two, and three is probably fine to all
of us, but to an SME they're probably
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:saying "I don't know what that is".
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:And actually you break it and you
go "your fuel and your electricity".
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:Yes, that's pretty much it,
and then whoever you use as a
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:supplier, it's theirs and theirs.
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:It's that whole concept of
everyone's scope one and two
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:is someone else's scope three.
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:Ellis: We touched on momentum,
maintaining momentum and keeping
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:things relevant and kind of not getting
lost in the fog of everything else.
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:Trying to keep it interesting for people.
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:My own experience with the championships,
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:Osbert: (That's the 2023 UCI
cycling world championships)
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:Ellis: it was kind of like a drip drip
feed of communications, external and
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:internal, to try and maintain it, so that
people don't, switch off so it becomes
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:second nature to people to think about.
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:Malcolm: One reflection I've been having
on this, and it's following on from
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:what Graham was explaining about earlier
on, one of the things I took from the
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:conversation, was about the narrowing
down of the SDGs that he was looking at,
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:narrowing down the scope of the discussion
in order to make things into bite sized
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:chunks, so it starts to become achievable.
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:I thought there's a real parallel there
between that and the question funnel
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:that, I regularly talk about in dispute
resolution and mediation, where you're
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:actually starting with a very wide
concept, and you funnel downwards and get
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:more and more specific as you go through,
which means you end up with something
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:that is realistic and is achievable.
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:Mina: Um, it kind of links a little
bit to what Gavin was saying really.
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:People of our expertise in this field
will kind of get used to terminology,
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:but then in order to bring everyone
along on this really crucial journey,
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:I think it really is about bringing
it back, taking it down to square one.
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:Not everybody has the same kind of
background or research that, certainly
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:people have done within this group.
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:So I think language and layman terms
and kind of bringing it down to
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:bare basics is extremely important
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:.
Morag: We're coming to the end of our time together so we want to make
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:sure that everyone has a chance to
contribute to this last session.
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:So we're going to ask you to keep
your input really, really tight here.
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:Take a moment to reflect on
what you've heard today and
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:what you've discussed today.
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:And to think, is there one thing
that you could take from this that
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:you'll apply to your own work?
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:One little thing that you might
do differently or that you just
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:need to bear in mind and remember?
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:We're going to invite you to
complete the sentence: " The one
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:thing I will try doing is..."
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:We'll go to Malcolm and then Mina.
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:So the one thing I'm
going to try is, Malcolm.
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:Malcolm: The one thing I'm going to
do is, to focus on that bite sized
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:chunk concept and really working
out what, what can be achieved.
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:Morag: Thank you, Malcolm.
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:Mina will come to you and then Ellis.
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:Mina: I think the one thing that
I'm going to continue to focus on
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:is show greater support to supply
chain and other companies that I
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:work closely to, um, to kind of
progress all together on that journey.
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:Morag: Wonderful.
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:Thank you,
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:Ellis.
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:Then Graham.
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:Ellis: The one thing I'm going to take
away is what Annie said with regards
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:to cultivating a healthy mindset
and frightening people to death.
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:Morag: Thank you, Ellis.
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:Graeme and then Anna.
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:Graham: The one thing I'm going to take
away is continue to speak to people
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:with diverse backgrounds and, and get
feedback and shape what I'm doing.
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:Morag: Thank you, Graeme.
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:Anna, then Annie.
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:Anna: One thing that I'm taking away from
today is, to talk more confidently about
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:the things that are already happening, but
also looking to constantly improve things
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:because there's things for all of us.
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:Morag: Thank you, Anna.
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:Annie, then Gavin.
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:Annie: The one thing I'm going to take
from today is just keeping things simple.
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:Morag: Thank you.
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:Gavin, then Kemi.
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:Gavin: The one thing I'll take away from
today is keeping it simple, but also
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:having that positive mindset and approach.
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:Morag: Well, thank you.
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:Kemi and then Flo.
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:Kemi: The one thing that I will try
doing is starting locally and visibly.
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:So be it work or sort of at home,
whether it's doing something
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:small, but has that visible impact.
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:Morag: And finally, Flo.
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:Flo: So for me, I think it's be
aware of other people's context
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:and try to make the solution or
the process approachable for them.
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:Morag: Thank you, everyone.
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:Osbert, back to you.
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:Osbert: This is the end
of our time together.
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:Thank you so much for sharing your
experience, your insights, and wish
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:you all the best with taking your
next step and look forward to hearing
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:how you're getting on with that.
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:If there's anything you'd like
to pick up from this discussion,
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:feel free to get in touch with me.
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:It's been great having you with us
and I hope we'll see you again soon.
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:Bye for now.
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:Lots of great insights and ideas there
based on the experience of our guests.
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:If I had to pull out just three themes
that I think are really important and
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:applicable in most organizations, these
are the three that I would choose.
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:First, when you're talking
about sustainability or any
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:particular aspect of it.
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:Avoid jargon and technical language.
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:Keep it simple and make it relevant
to the people you're talking with.
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:Two.
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:Although it's essential to get beyond
net zero and address other issues,
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:don't try to do everything, focus in
on the issues that are most material
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:and where you can have real impact.
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:And three, engaging people with
sustainability is an ongoing process.
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:So keep talking, keep people involved and
ultimately work towards shifting mindsets,
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:so sustainability becomes second nature.
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:And there you have it.
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:I hope you enjoyed our Leadership for
Sustainability round table, and that
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:you'll join us for a future session.
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:Leadership for Sustainability newsletter.
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:As well as invites to events,
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:videos, and other resources that
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:interesting for sustainability leaders,
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:along with insights from me and
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:to newsletter subscribers.
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:You'll find the link in the show notes.